Guild Wars 2

Just wanted to let people know that i remade this thread in the suggestion forums. I’d prefer if people would post in the new thread rather than this one.

If I was to pick one thing that truly bothers me most about this game, it would have to be the way the camera feels and behaves. Currently, the camera is one of GW2’s weakest features, and unlike many other problems/bugs that need to be fixed, the camera is a persistent problem that exists for all players, at all times, from the moment they first log in until they log out. This persistent element alone makes fixing/altering the camera priority number-one for the majority of players. I personally feel that fixing the camera-related issues is the most important change Arena Net could possibly make at this time to ensure future success of this game. Making movement, and specifically the way the camera behaves, as natural as possible is the key to making the entire game feel right while making it an enjoyable experience for everyone.

Camera-Related Issues (in order of importance relative to implementation difficulty):

• Remove the camera acceleration and camera snap (make camera movement 100% linear with mouse movement). This should be priority number one; players don’t like playing games with non-responsive/laggy feeling cameras.
• Make the camera’s turn speed independent of the game’s FPS. Currently low FPS makes the camera turn extremely slowly.
• Increase the Field of Vision or add a FOV slider.
• Change the angle and orientation of the camera so the player isn’t always looking down at the ground
• Improve the camera collision detection so the camera isn’t constantly zooming in and out (especially during jump puzzles or in areas with low-clearance such as low-trees or cave ceilings).
• Allow players to zoom the camera out more
• Increase the speed that the A and D keys turn the character/camera and remove the acceleration (make the A/D keys turn at full speed as soon as they’re pressed rather than getting progressively faster as they are held down).
• Allow the camera to be zoomed out while the right-mouse-button is held down
• Make the downed-state camera not reset back to an overhead-center position after ~5 seconds of no camera movement
• Add an option to ‘lock’ the camera to the mouse (like it is when the RMB is held down) at all times and have a modifier key (like shift) bring up the free-moving cursor in-order to interact with the game world.

• Fix the ‘camera glitch’ that causes the camera to suddenly jerk and then reset the cursor to the middle of the screen. Update: I believe this has been fixed, can anyone else confirm?

For more details on each bullet point, please keep reading.

There needs to be an option to turn off camera collisions with trees, sheds, etc. Any sort of combat that involves moving in and around trees, for example, quickly becomes a rapid-fire see sawing of extreme closeups of the back of my character’s head and the whole battlefield.

It should be possible to have a set camera distance and simply make anything that is between the character and the camera become transparent.

With all of the jumping, rolling, etc. I think a ‘padlock’ camera view is in order. For those of you not familiar, padlocking always shows your character in front and your currently selected target in the background. So, if you are facing away from the target, you would see your character’s front and the target behind you, etc.

This would help tremendously when in combats where I am very mobile against targets that are equally mobile.

Camera acceleration, also known as camera smoothing, is when the movement of the camera is exponential (i.e., it scales with mouse speed) rather than linear (i.e., mouse movement is transferred perfectly to camera movement). The purpose behind it is to make the camera feel like it has weight or momentum behind it but all it really does is make the camera feel sluggish, non-responsive, inaccurate, and ‘heavy’.

To make the above explanation easier to understand, here’s an example of camera acceleration: If you hold the right mouse button and move your mouse 1 inch at an extremely slow speed, the camera will turn about 45 degrees in-game; If you move your mouse 1 inch (the same distance as before) at an extremely fast speed, the camera will turn about 360 degrees. It’s scaling, or accelerating, the camera rotation based on mouse movement speed. In a linear movement system (one without camera acceleration), the camera would turn the same amount in that 1 inch, independent and unaffected by mouse movement speed.

Current Accelerated Camera:
1 inch of mouse movement at 2meters/second = 45 degree camera rotation
1 inch of mouse movement at 4 meters/second = 360 degree of camera rotation (when it should still be 45 degrees)

Proposed Linear Camera:
1 inch of mouse movement at 2meters/second = 45 degree camera rotation
1 inch of mouse movement at 4 meters/second = 45 degree camera rotation

The majority of gamers strongly dislike camera acceleration, in fact, if you search the web, you will see most competitive gamers will actually go out of their way to turn it off or remove it if possible (via console commands or game-file modification). Camera acceleration makes precise camera movement nearly impossible, especially at faster mouse speeds, which is a big deal because fast mouse speeds are required in fast-paced competitive PvP. It also makes the camera feel sluggish and unresponsive at slower mouse speeds.

Camera snap is the exaggerated camera rotation that happens when the game senses the mouse turning the camera at a very fast speed, it’s closely related to camera acceleration. When the game picks up on this aggressive mouse movement, it will try to predict camera movement and then suddenly ‘snap’ the camera ~60 degrees to where it thinks you’re trying to turn it to. This makes camera movement extremely unpredictable.

Solution: Keep camera acceleration and camera snapping on by default but add an option to disable it. This way, the very small minority of casual gamers that like this feature (because either they dislike having to move their mouse hand as much or they just don’t notice) will have it on when they start the game up. The more advanced majority of players can then go into the options to disable these post-processing features if they so desire.

Currently the turn speed of the camera is tied to the in-game FPS. Whenever the game is running at ~60 FPS or more the camera turns at its normal full speed, however at anything below 60 fps, the camera becomes progressively slower. For example, at 10-25 fps (extremely likely to happen in large 50v50 battles in WvW) the camera’s sensitivity markedly decreases such that it feels like it turns at one-third to one-half its normal speed.

Solution: Untie the camera’s sensitivity from the game’s FPS so the camera turns at the same speed no matter if the FPS is at 1 or 100.

Field of Vision is the extent of the observable game world that is seen on the display at any given moment. Currently GW2 has a very narrow FOV that can’t be changed. The problem with a narrow and unrealistic FoV is that it induces a feeling of tunnel vision. This can lead to headaches, eye-strain, nausea, and other symptoms of motion sickness. Not only does increasing the FoV alleviate these symptoms, it also makes the game look more natural and increases the level of immersion. To get an idea of big a deal a FoV change can make, I suggest you watch this video demonstrating a 60 FoV vs a 100 FoV in Tera.

Solution: Add a Field of Vision slider in options with a numerical read-out in degrees so players can pick a FoV that doesn’t make them feel sick and also makes the game world look more natural. Even if increasing the FoV causes graphical issues i feel it should still be implemented. Most players that do suffer from motion sickness at narrow FoV’s would probably prefer looking at the graphical anomalies than feel sick while playing.

The angle and orientation of the camera is currently set so the player is constantly looking down at the ground. Very little of the game world is actually visible when the camera is positioned at its normal resting spot. This not only makes it hard to see what is happening around the player but it also completely destroys immersion and makes the game feel cramped and claustrophobic.

Solution: Angle the camera up slightly and make the bottom of the camera closer to the feet of the player’s character so less of the ground behind the player is visible and more is visible in foreground in front of the player specifically so there’s more horizontal vision.

Currently the camera collision detection is extremely sensitive and/or buggy. Every single object in the game will ‘collide’ with the camera causing the camera to zoom in so it’s in front of that object. In most other third-person games the camera is allowed to pass through most objects so the camera isn’t constantly zooming in and out. This makes running around extremely disorientating and players have to constantly fight the camera to try to prevent the constant zooming in and out. Even spinning the camera on perfectly flat terrain with no objects around will make the camera zoom in for whatever reason.
Solution: Enhance the intelligence of the camera collision detection so it doesn’t constantly zoom in and out. Only walls and very large objects (i.e., giant boulders) should cause the camera to zoom in. When the camera collides with the ground the camera also shouldn’t zoom in.

Camera zoom is the maximum distance away from the character that the camera can be set to. Ideal camera distance really just comes down to personal preference. However, most players coming from an MMO background would prefer to be able to zoom the camera out significantly more than is currently allowed. Having the camera so close to the character can actually cause physical motion sickness in some players.

Solution: Add a ‘camera distance’ slider in the options menu so players can pick their preferred max camera distance. This is the ideal method of increasing the max camera distance instead of just allowing players to zoom the camera out more by default. I think increasing the max camera distance by 33% would be a good starting point, further would be ideal so players can pick what they like, but i can see how having it set too far can give some players an unfair advantage or cause frame rate problems or graphical problems (specifically with height collision).

The A and D keys currently turn the player and camera at a very slow rate for whatever reason. This turn rate is completely unrealistic and uncomfortable to play with. The current turn speed makes the A and D keys completely worthless for both combat and navigation. There’s also a great deal of acceleration with both the A and D keys. When first pressed it takes 2-3 seconds until they turn the character at the maximum speed.

Solution: Simply increase the turn rate for the A and D keys to about double what they’re currently set at. The turn rate should be fast enough for the player to run in a tight circle (so a diameter of about one body length) while holding both W+A.

Locked Camera
In some third-person games (especially third-person shooter games), the camera is by default ‘locked’ to the mouse such that the right-mouse-button doesn’t have to be constantly held down to turn the camera (and by extension the character). This makes moving the camera seem a lot more natural, especially in a fast-paced RPGs like GW2 where movement and positioning is so important. It can also eliminate hand fatigue as well as the potential of developing carpal tunnel by not requiring the player to constantly hold the right-mouse-button at all times.

Solution:
Consider adding an option to lock the camera to the mouse. When this mode is enabled, it would also enable a secondary keybind (for example, ‘shift’ by default), when held down, this key would temporarily unlock the camera from the mouse and bring up a cursor that would allow players to still interact with the world when needed. Also, whenever a menu is open that requires the cursor (such as the Trading Post, the inventory, the loot window, dialogue/NPC interaction, etc) the mouse would automatically become temporarily unlocked and would automatically become locked again when the menu is closed.

The Camera Glitch causes the camera to suddenly jerk with very little actual user input and then resets the cursor to the middle of the screen. This issue is difficult to describe so I’ll just post these two videos to demonstrate:
Guild Wars 2 camera glitch – BWE2
Guild Wars 2 camera glitch – BWE1
It appears like this is being caused by the acceleration/snap function of the camera. It senses quick movement and then jerks the camera despite the user barely moving the mouse at all.

Solution: Unfortunately there isn’t an easy solution for this problem. It will require extensive bug checking and/or some recoding of the camera algorithm.

Update: I believe this has been fixed. I personally can’t reproduce it anymore; however, there is one comment in the youtube videos posted below claiming that they still have the issues as of 9/2/12. Can anyone confirm/deny if it’s still happening to them?

Please Arena-net, I want this game to succeed as i think it has the best foundation of any MMO I’ve ever played. However, i feel that the current camera system will turn a lot of players away, especially the more “skilled” or experienced player-base that are picky with game feel and responsiveness.

If anyone has anything else to add related to the camera (or player-control related to the camera) or if you agree with any of the above and desperately want to see the camera improved, I encourage you to please feel free to post here.

Thank you

Reserved for links to other camera-related threads.

Cant say iv had any camera related woes yet……..

While I’ve learned to live with the camera we have now I do feel there are strong points and arguments as for the changes. If anything I feel the acceleration speed of both turning and the camera itself could just go away, as well as touching up the camera’s collision for sure.

Locked camera was something I was musing about with my guild not even 3 nights ago, and I feel it would be a great addition. After having played games like Dungeons and Dragons Online and TERA with locked cameras I feel that the option goes a long way to making the game more enjoyable because I don’t spend 6+ hours holding down right click.

The Camera needs to not collide with objects in the environment. The constant collision and moving in back and forth during the Troll’s End jumping puzzle literally gave me a migraine. In general it is disorienting and can cause eye strain.

Have it just clip through the environment and make things translucent so the camera can stay a fixed distance from the character. I seem to remember this being the way it worked in GW1.

SeanPoez.8407:

• Make the downed-state camera not reset back to an overhead-center position after ~5 seconds of no camera movement
• Add an option to ‘lock’ the camera to the mouse (like it is when the RMB is held down) at all times and have a modifier key (like shift) bring up the free-moving cursor in-order to interact with the game world.

These are the two biggest problems for me. I just swapped the key mappings of A with Q and D with E, and am holding down the right mouse button 90% of the time when playing- I’m only not when in conversation or browsing the trading post.

Another camera annoyance is since a midnight patch several nights ago, the downed camera is forced to zoom in on you so closely that I can no longer zoom out far enough to see what’s going on. It’s virtually impossible to use my Asura thief’s Shadow Escape skill to teleport in any direction except ahead. Struggling with the camera is not something that you have time to do when you’re struggling to survive.

For all the complaints, let’s talk about something Anet got very right: Underwater camera!

• When you are on the surface, the camera is above the surface and never goes under or cuts between.

• When you’re underwater the camera is fully submerged and doesn’t breach the surface.

The camera is absolutely perfect when swimming and submerged. I feel that Anet really nailed this, and it’s been a gripe for me in several games now, with cameras getting stuck above the surface, or half under half out, and not providing a decent view when swimming.

So while I do have problems with the camera (particularly when doing Vistas it can go crazy in tight quarters), Anet really got right one camera issue that nearly every other MMO has gotten terribly wrong.

I also want to add that an option so that you don’t have to have the right mouse button pressed to move the camera would be nice.

Like using the ctrl button to toggle the mouse from camera view mode/click mode.

I agree with all these complaints, and think it’s perfectly reasonable to at least provide the option for players to change them in settings (except perhaps FoV, as this could confer an advantage). I for one can’t stand the camera accelleration and smoothing present in the game – in fact I would go so far as to say that this camera is the most unwieldy and least responsive that I have ever encountered in a game. The actual game itself, however, is brilliant – so I would love to see these gripes addressed.

Completely agree with this thread. Please implement a better camera system. I’ve have been close to rage quitting this game a couple times now because of it. I would like to say that pretty much every other aspect in the game is amazing, the only problem i have is the camera. You’re doing an amazing job arena-net. Keep at it and listen to the players in this thread, because me and other fellow players agree that this topic should be the very next thing on the list to focus on. Keep doing what you’re doing.

We also need a first person view or some way to hide our own avatars for taking screenshots and making movies.

We need
Camera smoothing ON/OFF option
RIGHT NOW!!!!

noxious.3701:

We also need a first person view or some way to hide our own avatars for taking screenshots and making movies.

That would definitely be a nice feature. The main reason i didn’t include it in the original list of ideas is because i feel that it’s more of a design choice rather than a fix to the already implemented system. It would take a lot of work to make a first person camera system work in this game (especially because of wonky camera collision).

I received a PM from a moderating stating this thread was being moved to the suggestion forums however it seems to still be in the general discussion section. Could a moderator please move it to the suggestion forums now that they’re up?

Edit: I just went ahead and reposted this thread in the suggestion section of the forums. Feel free to lock/delete this thread.

Hey, please add my topic into the list:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Camera-control-issues-a-documented-list/

And thanks for linking my BWE vids

I’m already halfway to quit playing just because of the issues with camera

Movement controls (WASD) are a pita too. the character didn’t react in a linear way
to key presses which makes control movement just a pain. often times there is
no reaction at all and I have to press the key again to get my toon moving. I guess it’s
because some kind of animation-lock-out or something. sometimes my character
doesn’t move at all and I have to release key and press again to get it to move.
so annoying.

Jumping puzzles and vistas are a pain. I didn’t bother with them anymore.

Overall moving & fighting feels very sluggish, slow and often time unresponsive.
It’s just plain annoying and no fun at all.

This already had poisoned my gameplay and I just login occasionally to test if there
were changes made in that regard.
In the current state, the game is unplayable for me.

Because of a plethora of more pressing issues, I have not much hope left,
that this will get fixed.

so sad.

I would like to be able to zoom the camera out twice as much as what it’s currently limited at.

It’s a terrible camera system, and it ruins any sort of pleasure I may have had while playing the game. During what point in time was I having fun when I was screaming at the computer screen due to the camera going haywire at trees and objects? This happens multiple times every time I log in to play. I almost broke another mouse in a fit of rage.

Many games of the past have failed due to terrible cameras. Don’t let Guild Wars 2 fail, Anet!

Just wanted to let people know that i remade this thread in the suggestion forums. I’d prefer if people would post in the new thread rather than this one.

Just wanter to add that I agree with all the camera problems. Doing any quests in tight spaces or places with lots of trees is just bad and annoying.

Remove the camera acceleration and camera snap (make camera movement 100% linear with mouse movement). This should be priority number one; players don’t like playing games with non-responsive/laggy feeling cameras.

This, a thousand times this.

I’ve opened a support ticket for that, and after much avoiding they finally suggested to post it on the forums, as it’s a “feature” of the game. What imbecilic moron came up with that crap to screw up the camera controls.

Signed. Please fix the camera!

It’s an issue ArenaNet knows of since BWE1

So how are our changes to get this fixed??

Good thread. I notice the camera isn’t very smooth, or a little delayed. Once you move it and stop moving it will still move a little bit, like it has momentum

Id really like it if most of these “changes” could occur sooner then later.

SeanPoez.8407:

• Allow players to zoom the camera out more

I want to bump this thread because i think it’s worth discussing. Has there been any official statement on why the camera distance is limited?
The camera distance is way to short and i think alot of people agree with me.

Take a look at this video.

Forget all the camera rotation calculations. Just make a VERY WIDE range of adjustment for the user. If people think the camera is sluggish, they must have very slow computers. I have the rotation speed turned all the way to minimum and the camera rotates so fast I can hardly control it. 1/4 inch is more than180degrees of rotation, and I have the mouse acceleration set very low in Windows. This annoys me more than ANY other feature of the game. . . I’m constantly fighting with the mouse!

And while your by chance thinking about fixing the shoddy camera system, you might wanna also go for a double whammy and redo the targeting system as well… both these aspects are by far the worst I have ever come across in a modern day MMO.

Hi everyone,

This thread is a duplicate of this one as mentioned in SeanPoez’s post, it is therefore closed.

Thanks for your understanding.