Guild Wars 2

What i want is not what they will make, but i since you ask me, here it is MORE INTERESTING BOSSES:

– FIRST OF ALL, i don’t want challenging content to be ONLY dungeon(sure they can make them more and i would love to see new dungeons for people that enjoy dungeons, but my personally challenging content would be something else), i want open world challenging content, dungeons can be challenging on its own, so i desire for long an open world where you could have some fun killing a mob, and actually think about it how to defeat it, and not just 11111.
– I want bosses to be hard, in every step and part
– i want them to be dominant, they should be hostile and protect their teoritory, who ever gets to close from unwanted side, should be punished ( example beetle mechanics hitting from back 0 dmg) i would reflect that damage, to make people think.
– they need to make combat fighting a mob interesting! How? Force us to move a lot faster
– mobs need 30% faster attack animations, and they should hit faster, because every single thing that they cast, they do for ages, and it’s boring since i can just step a side to avoid damage, (dont even need to dodge)
– make events unique, make people use spells to secure objectives to get big monster down
– make enemy bosses DROP LESS AND BETTER STUFF WHEN THEY DO (i rather get nothing,null,zero,0.. then junk, there should be always 1 drop of unique weapon per event with unique skins)
– make fights interesting, and force people to move around, the only way you should be able to survive event is if you move 80% of the time, if not, you should be dead!
– don’t make bosses static, let them move in area of 2000 range from pivot point. Let them guard that area hard!
– DON’T give bosses a lot of life, but give them some type of protection that would force people to team work to create damage
– combo fields should do a lot more damage then regular 1111
– let us fail sometimes? Yes?
– Don’t make bosses time based, but let the reward be time based!
– PREVENT STACKING SYSTEM
– PREVENT AFK BOSS FARMING
– REWARD TEAMWORK
– REWARD REVIVING

That’s what i want from content, i want to feel achieved, AND I WANT TO PLAY GUILD WARS 2, BECAUSE I KNOW FROM GW1 THAT THEY CAN DO THIS ON VERY HIGH FUN & INTERESTING WAY. THIS IS MY IDEA OF CHALLENGING CONTENT.

EDIT: formatting.

If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game. Anything challenging Anet would try to add in, especially open world, would get nerfed due to player complaints. Fractals is where really challenging content should be added into, but Anet doesn’t even seem creative or willing enough to do so.

This game is based around casuals and instant gratification, content difficulty is based around that.

I can agree with many things, but not on these two:

- make enemy bosses DROP LESS AND BETTER STUFF WHEN THEY DO (i rather get nothing,null,zero,0.. then junk, there should be always 1 drop of unique weapon per event with unique skins)
…
– Don’t make bosses time based, but let the reward be time based!

First, RNG is hated by 90% of players; I think bosses (expecially the big ones) should drop with a fair chance a mix of tradeable and not tradeable items that will be used to craft something good, no extremely rare items for few lucky people, just A LOT of work.

Second, time based bosses and rewards just means “only zerk/meta/specific classes”, this can be ok for a few ones, but I would like to see other things as “if you die you get less rewards”, “if you kill it in a specific place you get better rewards”, “if you fight it in a particular way or you do something during the fight you get a specific item”, etc.

BrooksP.4318:

If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game. Anything challenging Anet would try to add in, especially open world, would get nerfed due to player complaints. Fractals is where really challenging content should be added into, but Anet doesn’t even seem creative or willing enough to do so.

This game is based around casuals and instant gratification, content difficulty is based around that.

Is that all you got? " If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game."

That’s basically because people like you instantly lose hope. I know anet had this kind of content before, and they will one day implement this kind of open world. Because simply GW2 is capable, and anet is capable of doing this kind of content.

And this game is no longer based around casual so stop stating that out, it’s poor excuse, and anet is clearly making challenging content, where Revenant is a prove of crazy good mechanics. Knock that out of your head, casual era is over, get ready to get beaten a bit, because that’s GW1 style like, and sooner or later we will shift to that kind of style, where casual people will have to shift up.

We stacked all the time in GW1. Nothing wrong with it.

Firelysm.4967:

I know anet had this kind of content before, and they will one day implement this kind of open world. Because simply GW2 is capable, and anet is capable of doing this kind of content.

Anet is perfectly capable of making extremely challenging open-world content where every player has to be at their peak. Of course they are. It would just never be completed outside of guild runs which makes it kind of pointless being open world; you just add a bunch of inconvenience and potential interference for that players that actually are capable of doing it.

Open world content has to be balanced around the large percentage of PvE players that refuse to wear the right gear, use the right skills or learn the right tactics. If it’s balanced around those players then it’s trivial for anybody with half a brain (and the rest get carried anyway) and if it’s not then those players would whine relentlessly about it being impossible until that content gets nerfed.

Open world content also has the problem that you, as an individual, have almost no bearing on whether a run succeeds or fails; there are a hundred other players doing the same stuff. And if Anet did make it so individuals could, through some special mechanic, be responsible for a run succeeding or failing? It would be griefed relentlessly.

Also, there is a fine line between a fun challenge and one that’s just frustrating.

So you’d want boss(es) like TT and Tequatl or do you want ’m more difficult?
If so do you want ascended drops like TT and tequatl?

Or do you think a boss where you need to keep running with all kind of points for failing really appeals to the majority?

Or do you want 1337 content in this casual game? With only .5 % of the people able to do finish it, something like LIADRI only as world boss? Do you think there will be a platform of players to carry it?

Personally I do not think so, So we’ll end up with leechers and event guilds tying to cap it losing the openess of the world and a lost part of content (see southsun cove) for all others, which will probably be nerfed and the “special” skins/ drops will automatically lose their prestige.

I do hope to see a couple of decent dungeons or small map based raid like content, or
some nice complicaterd WB’s. But it should be accesssible. I just want to see the expansion at this time. Challeging content is something different then the jungle wurm or the shadow behhemoth, but to make all bosses like Triple Trouble or Tequatl would be very boring indeed. There are moments I’d like to casual as well.

I never got a box at Tequatl I didn’t get a box at the Triple Wurm either. Still want them, still visit them, though I really want ALL skins, not just 1. with the present drop rater It will take me forever to get those skins.

I’ll always be against challenging open world content because of performance issues. Those of us running mid-range or lower PCs with regular internet connections often experience horrible decreases in fps and performance during zergy content. World bosses are perfectly do-able at the moment, but making the event mechanics significantly more complex could put everyone at a real disadvantage. Pre-patch Tequatl is probably the limit to what is feasible in the open world.

Anf for the record, I think this stuff is far better suited to dungeons and fractals. Maybe even a raid.

Difficult content and Open world could not exist in the same sentance.It is really hard to balance it and it’s not easy to move all your raid to the same map.

bramblefeet.4385:

Firelysm.4967:

I know anet had this kind of content before, and they will one day implement this kind of open world. Because simply GW2 is capable, and anet is capable of doing this kind of content.

Anet is perfectly capable of making extremely challenging open-world content where every player has to be at their peak. Of course they are. It would just never be completed outside of guild runs which makes it kind of pointless being open world; you just add a bunch of inconvenience and potential interference for that players that actually are capable of doing it.

Open world content has to be balanced around the large percentage of PvE players that refuse to wear the right gear, use the right skills or learn the right tactics. If it’s balanced around those players then it’s trivial for anybody with half a brain (and the rest get carried anyway) and if it’s not then those players would whine relentlessly about it being impossible until that content gets nerfed.

Open world content also has the problem that you, as an individual, have almost no bearing on whether a run succeeds or fails; there are a hundred other players doing the same stuff. And if Anet did make it so individuals could, through some special mechanic, be responsible for a run succeeding or failing? It would be griefed relentlessly.

How hard is Colocal Queen, but yet people do it, and it’s 10x harder then Tequatle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlssxLKJsmg
U got my point? It includes every single point except reward that i’ve stated.
This is just lazy excuse.
Amen.

Look at all the people that threw a kitten fit when teq got buffed, it went from being push 1111111 to actually having to do something beside smash your face into your keyboard. And it was still laughable easy if you used your brain. That is why you cant have good open world content.

Firelysm.4967:

BrooksP.4318:

If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game. Anything challenging Anet would try to add in, especially open world, would get nerfed due to player complaints. Fractals is where really challenging content should be added into, but Anet doesn’t even seem creative or willing enough to do so.

This game is based around casuals and instant gratification, content difficulty is based around that.

Is that all you got? " If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game."

That’s basically because people like you instantly lose hope. I know anet had this kind of content before, and they will one day implement this kind of open world. Because simply GW2 is capable, and anet is capable of doing this kind of content.

And this game is no longer based around casual so stop stating that out, it’s poor excuse, and anet is clearly making challenging content, where Revenant is a prove of crazy good mechanics. Knock that out of your head, casual era is over, get ready to get beaten a bit, because that’s GW1 style like, and sooner or later we will shift to that kind of style, where casual people will have to shift up.

what makes you think gw2 players aren’t casual pugs?

liadri when first released was difficult, casuals complained which later got her nerfed to disgustingly faceroll

tequatl from the major patch update prior to the discovery of the guard bug was a good bit of fun, what happened then? players complained and now we are right back where we were prepatch killing it before 10 min mark snooze fest. makes updating world bosses pointless if it ends up going to the same spot that you wanted to get away from

have no fear!! if hot releases challenging stuff outside an instanced dungeon the casuals will be here throwing a temper tantrum (like they do at the store with their moms unless she buys them that piece of candy) until they nerf it so that you may finally complete it and say you put in work.

echo.2053:

Firelysm.4967:

BrooksP.4318:

If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game. Anything challenging Anet would try to add in, especially open world, would get nerfed due to player complaints. Fractals is where really challenging content should be added into, but Anet doesn’t even seem creative or willing enough to do so.

This game is based around casuals and instant gratification, content difficulty is based around that.

Is that all you got? " If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game."

That’s basically because people like you instantly lose hope. I know anet had this kind of content before, and they will one day implement this kind of open world. Because simply GW2 is capable, and anet is capable of doing this kind of content.

And this game is no longer based around casual so stop stating that out, it’s poor excuse, and anet is clearly making challenging content, where Revenant is a prove of crazy good mechanics. Knock that out of your head, casual era is over, get ready to get beaten a bit, because that’s GW1 style like, and sooner or later we will shift to that kind of style, where casual people will have to shift up.

what makes you think gw2 players aren’t casual pugs?

liadri when first released was difficult, casuals complained which later got her nerfed to disgustingly faceroll

tequatl from the major patch update prior to the discovery of the guard bug was a good bit of fun, what happened then? players complained and now we are right back where we were prepatch killing it before 10 min mark snooze fest. makes updating world bosses pointless if it ends up going to the same spot that you wanted to get away from

have no fear!! if hot releases challenging stuff outside an instanced dungeon the casuals will be here throwing a temper tantrum (like they do at the store with their moms unless she buys them that piece of candy) until they nerf it so that you may finally complete it and say you put in work.

I never buy candy when kids kitten about it, i buy it when they earn it. That’s how players should be treated in PvE. That’s why tons of PvE players that just started, stated in reddit, where is PVE in GW2, there is nothing fun after they hit lvl 80.

Problem with GW2 is that there is no challenge, what you do at lvl 1 you do at lvl 80 in PvE.. and it’s sad. Don’t worry about casuals b****ing about something, because if you state, that’s how it’s going to be, and nothing else, you pretty much get them to adapt. They always adapt.

your good suggestions are lost to narrow minded kitten trolls that live on the forums, cure? forums are a joke very seldom does a developer take intrests in good suggestion and listen to every comment. Everything ends in dead end arguments defending the post.

echo.2053:

what makes you think gw2 players aren’t casual pugs?

liadri when first released was difficult, casuals complained which later got her nerfed to disgustingly faceroll

Disgustingly Faceroll.
Disgustingly Faceroll.
Disgustingly Faceroll.

Wow. I need that face of yours, my fingers needed more than 30 trys to defeat her and I got shaky every time I almost made it. Changing builds/armor/buff food all the time included.
Or better: Give at least 70% of the players your face.

Liadri… a faceroll…. wow just… wow.

ShelBlackblood.7826:

Liadri… a faceroll…. wow just… wow.

I guess they’re talking about the lifesteal method since she wasn’t really significantly changed beyond that (and that was eventually fixed). Either that or that the new arena didn’t mess with your camera as badly. Neither of those are really a “nerf” though.

Firelysm.4967:

Problem with GW2 is that there is no challenge, what you do at lvl 1 you do at lvl 80 in PvE.. and it’s sad. Don’t worry about casuals b****ing about something, because if you state, that’s how it’s going to be, and nothing else, you pretty much get them to adapt. They always adapt.

Naw, the problem with PvE is just rewards. MMO content is meant to be be repeatable, if the challenge is high enough then the incentive to play it will decline very quickly unless the rewards are crazy good. I think the threshold for what players are willing to adapt to is actually pretty low. It’s like dungeons – we used to get our kittens handed to us before we figured out how to beat ‘em. Now they’re mostly just farm fodder. Any PvE content that is consistently difficult will be ignored by the vast majority.

ShelBlackblood.7826:

echo.2053:

what makes you think gw2 players aren’t casual pugs?

liadri when first released was difficult, casuals complained which later got her nerfed to disgustingly faceroll

Disgustingly Faceroll.
Disgustingly Faceroll.
Disgustingly Faceroll.

Wow. I need that face of yours, my fingers needed more than 30 trys to defeat her and I got shaky every time I almost made it. Changing builds/armor/buff food all the time included.
Or better: Give at least 70% of the players your face.

Liadri… a faceroll…. wow just… wow.

mmm sounds like a second release attempt :/.

perhaps i should, might make the game more interesting. I don’t mind multiple attempts raging. Id much rather have that then what we have now, questioning why everyone else is just dead

bramblefeet.4385:

ShelBlackblood.7826:

Liadri… a faceroll…. wow just… wow.

I guess they’re talking about the lifesteal method since she wasn’t really significantly changed beyond that (and that was eventually fixed). Either that or that the new arena didn’t mess with your camera as badly. Neither of those are really a “nerf” though.

Also there was at least one huge issue with Liadri they never fixed, her attacks insta-killed ranger pets (and presumably all summons as well) since they couldn’t dodge at all.

no i mean the visual update

1st release – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XA4hOrGSVE

2nd release – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKchYkDMpbY

in green gear, could of prolly pushed for kill in blue or white gear.

bramblefeet.4385:

Firelysm.4967:

I know anet had this kind of content before, and they will one day implement this kind of open world. Because simply GW2 is capable, and anet is capable of doing this kind of content.

Anet is perfectly capable of making extremely challenging open-world content where every player has to be at their peak. Of course they are. It would just never be completed outside of guild runs which makes it kind of pointless being open world; you just add a bunch of inconvenience and potential interference for that players that actually are capable of doing it.

Open world content has to be balanced around the large percentage of PvE players that refuse to wear the right gear, use the right skills or learn the right tactics. If it’s balanced around those players then it’s trivial for anybody with half a brain (and the rest get carried anyway) and if it’s not then those players would whine relentlessly about it being impossible until that content gets nerfed.

Open world content also has the problem that you, as an individual, have almost no bearing on whether a run succeeds or fails; there are a hundred other players doing the same stuff. And if Anet did make it so individuals could, through some special mechanic, be responsible for a run succeeding or failing? It would be griefed relentlessly.

Theres a number of things going on in the design that puts the game’s difficulty curve at odds with itself. World exploration was one of the big ones.

They wanted to make as much of the world as accessible as possible; But in doing so they watered down some of the difficulty scaling with travel. There are a lot of Stub areas of the map that could be better used for more difficult content (like the mini-dungeons mentioned in NPE materials). Right now these are only used for Personal story….. but the rest of the time they are simply Negative exploration space.

Theres a lot of Lore stuff going on that never shown outside of Personal story chapters. The Wizard’s Fief, ghostly champions of Ascalon, the various Norn hunters and hermits of shiverpeaks, the Kodan’s plight. The Maguuma region is also sparse…. I don’t know if this is because Asuran Krewe’s are spread out, and that the Sylvari don’t have much history. Surprisingly they did a decent job of this in Orr, despite the constant undead roaming around.

Imagine building more Meta events involving more of these unnoticed elements.

Challenging content with a game that only focuses on one facet of the holy trinity just isn’t possible. Enemies need to attack more than you can dodge and do more damage than your one utility skill can handle in addition cancel out or redirect damage incoming damage as well as move faster across ground as well.

GW1 had these things but while tanks couldn’t taunt they had dedicated healers in GW1 so places like Underworld and other higher level areas existed. This game is just a zerg fest whether a 5man zerg in dungeons or many more in WvW. Gw1 also didn’t force a healing slot on you and it was up to choice about whether or not to bring a heal or rez.

Until we start moving in the direction of a trinity this game will be as easy mode as ever. Whether your for such a thing or against it people seem to fall into too camps those who desire raids and more difficult content and the more casuals who simple don’t want to be pigeonheld waiting for a specific role to do content.

Fractals are already locked away from casuals so both are completely possibly and the revenant proves it. A minor implementation would fit the needs of everyone and making the heal slot optional would just further help to move it along. A person who wants to tank and run lowbies through content of someone who just wants to heal during Teq doesn’t break anything except exand the methods of play people have to choose from also allowing raids and other difficult content to exist like Fractals. Fractals are locked behind Agony so a Raid deal can be locked behind monsters that hit like trucks with OP spells that require a high level of teamwork to stay alive.

Will people every learn to understand the game?

GW2 doesn’t have any of the elements of a trinity, yes we don’t have “dps” we simply have players. There is a strong focus on DPS just like there is in any game. But, we have elements of support/control to make that damage possible. Even an Ele with the highest damage output the proverbial glass cannon has a strong set of support and control skills. In fact the main reason people like them so much in our current content is a control skill Deep Freeze. But, it doesn’t end at their Control or Damage, no they have support too.

You can trait aura share and grant party wide reflects. You can drop a water field traited to melt away conditions and then you can blast that field to heal up. You can drop a sandstorm which is one of the better support skills in it’s amazing blind capabilities without blocking combo fields. You can pull out a focus and swirling winds.

The reason Ele is so prevalent isn’t just because they can sit there and drop lava fonts and meteors with an Ice and lightning storm now and then. No, it’s because they’re versatile.

There doesn’t exist any profession that is just doing damage outside of maybe necro, but even they have some pretty neat skills thanks to this last patch (still would like them to do a bit more with them though). They’re like Bounty now, the quicker picker upper, Transfusion, ritual of life and maybe even grabbing signet of undeath. Also some trace amounts of sustain support through siphoning, regen and some group healing from Well of Blood.

But this is off topic, but ugh I hate seeing people ignorant to GW2’s systems make silly claims.

There very much can be difficult content in this game requiring full use of it’s combat system. Trinity is not required for hard content. In other games you even see people deviating from the trinity at the high end creating hybrids to eek out every little bit of potential they have where healers and tanks are dpsing and DPS are tanking or maybe even healing. True challenging content demands everything from everyone, where no one can sit there and just do “their job” but instead have to push in every aspect they can.

Jerus.4350:

Will people every learn to understand the game?

GW2 doesn’t have any of the elements of a trinity, yes we don’t have “dps” we simply have players. There is a strong focus on DPS just like there is in any game. But, we have elements of support/control to make that damage possible. Even an Ele with the highest damage output the proverbial glass cannon has a strong set of support and control skills. In fact the main reason people like them so much in our current content is a control skill Deep Freeze. But, it doesn’t end at their Control or Damage, no they have support too.

You can trait aura share and grant party wide reflects. You can drop a water field traited to melt away conditions and then you can blast that field to heal up. You can drop a sandstorm which is one of the better support skills in it’s amazing blind capabilities without blocking combo fields. You can pull out a focus and swirling winds.

The reason Ele is so prevalent isn’t just because they can sit there and drop lava fonts and meteors with an Ice and lightning storm now and then. No, it’s because they’re versatile.

There doesn’t exist any profession that is just doing damage outside of maybe necro, but even they have some pretty neat skills thanks to this last patch (still would like them to do a bit more with them though). They’re like Bounty now, the quicker picker upper, Transfusion, ritual of life and maybe even grabbing signet of undeath. Also some trace amounts of sustain support through siphoning, regen and some group healing from Well of Blood.

But this is off topic, but ugh I hate seeing people ignorant to GW2’s systems make silly claims.

There very much can be difficult content in this game requiring full use of it’s combat system. Trinity is not required for hard content. In other games you even see people deviating from the trinity at the high end creating hybrids to eek out every little bit of potential they have where healers and tanks are dpsing and DPS are tanking or maybe even healing. True challenging content demands everything from everyone, where no one can sit there and just do “their job” but instead have to push in every aspect they can.

Not entirely true…… According to Dev interview, which I imagine was purposely ambiguous (or at least conversationally unimportant at the time), they were breaking away from the forced role structure, but not necessarily breaking the trinity concept. We assumed this was the case for 3 years because the facets they used (DPS, Support and Control) were completely broken in PvE, making DPS the only aspect that scaled effectively across that game mode. It also didn’t help that they reinforced this by using only Pwr/HP scaling as the main method of difficulty scaling.

This changed with how the Mordrem were designed, but instead of enhance game play and increase difficulty, it only served to emphasize all the mistakes they’ve been making with Mob design since the start of the game. Mordrem are Control countered enemies…. but the player classes lack both the power and frequency of control skills to combat them effectively. So again, the best way to be them was through sheer DPS.

The Dev’s talks about “challenging content” with HOT is raising questions about their understanding of the current system, what they believe is broken, and how HOT aims to fix it…… but the utter lack of explanation or discussion about a proposed solution only deepens people’s fears that HOT’s “Challenging content” is simply going to be more of the same mistakes that exist with the Mordrem, and that the Devs are going to force specific functional counters to new Mordrem (like mandatory reflects, mandatory melee combat, mandatory environmental tools), rather then accomplishing “Force Multiplication” that the build system tends to encourage.

Flatley.1620:

Also, there is a fine line between a fun challenge and one that’s just frustrating.

Developers in general seem bad at finding this balance. Too often challenging just means grindy due to some really bad mechanic or other.

starlinvf.1358:

<snip snip I wrote too much>

Nope, Support is strait Overpowered in this game. A Wall of Reflection -> Shield of the Avenger -> Wall of reflection rotation preventing any projectiles from getting through for 44s! Mesmer Warden -> Warden -> Feedback -> Wardens rotating again -> Curtain(or second feedback now with mimic) -> Wardens going again and slip in a third warden for full coverage, yup perma projectile defense unless a warden goes down.

Heard of Blind fields? Condi cleanse comes in abundance as a team. Stability used to be pretty insane but they nerfed it… still pretty nice. Chills delaying the onslaught, now slows doing just that slowing attacks. Aegis is sweet. We have some bits of healing including water fields which a coordinated team can blast back to full health in or just use a clerics mace guard and tick tick tick welp full health again.

Then CC, Deep Freeze need I say more? Well I will, we have pulls/pushes/launches. We have immobilizes. Cripples and chills for kiting. Much to my disliking Deep Freeze chaining is Meta, I’m not a fan because it’s just too good. CC may not be what many imagined it to be with timing interrupts or locking things down for your team, but as a team it’s very powerful and trivializes many encounters even to the point of questioning if they’re exploits (immob locking Fimbul/Subject 6 or Sanctuary abuse on some bosses like Melandru in arah4 or a few CoE encounters).

As for Mordrem, I find positioning to be the crucial element here. Dipping in and out on Leechers to avoid their vines at range and puke at melee, Ranging and avoiding the trail on Thrashers, being on the move with Trolls. Blinds still work amazingly well against non champ levels but I really only find the one type of Terragriff to be troublesome (the one that shoots those things).

Husks are normal things with an immob, wolves pretty typical of all wolves with a leap and bite. The charging terragriffs just keep cripple/chill/immob on them and they’re harmless.

The only ones I think I’d agree with your assertion about a CC focus would be the Thrashers and the projectile Terragriffs both of which are a bit annoying in that only a strait interrupt stops them, but then only for a couple seconds and they’re right back at it. It’s why I consider them the worst designed of the lot, and the others to be pretty great with solid counters and tactics that if executed make them childs play. Thrashers are still pretty easy if you’re ok with ranging, it’s just those pesky Terragriffs that I feel like just rushing and bursting them down asap but hey, maybe that’s “their thing?”

Either way, the tools are present, the content is still in it’s infants stage as it didn’t really grow since the beginning of the game until recently. It just didn’t seem as if it was a focus of ANet’s.

I have no desire to return to needing a healer or any hard role. But I do want content challenging enough to make me want it for ease of play. Even now though a heavy support build in a group can make things much easier, it’s just that it’s simply not needed. There’s a reason people grab guards for easy fractals and why the people I know who do daily fractal 50 trios even use more defensive oriented builds (one has a full clerics guard other 2 zerk, the other uses 2 tankier Knights AH guards and I believe a thief)

BrooksP.4318:

If you expect challenging content as you have posted, you might want to seek another game. Anything challenging Anet would try to add in, especially open world, would get nerfed due to player complaints. Fractals is where really challenging content should be added into, but Anet doesn’t even seem creative or willing enough to do so.

This game is based around casuals and instant gratification, content difficulty is based around that.

This ^.

Because bosses are open world bosses they pretty much have to balance them around a good 50% of the people doing them being horrible otherwise the leechers, AFK’ers and bads would ruin the boss fights for everyone else.

If they were ever going to make a hard boss fight it would need to be instanced.

If they did many people myself included would love to see some hard instanced fights designed for guilds & or tight knit groups of friends.

Sadly it’s doubtful they will ever do this.

Jerus.4350:

starlinvf.1358:

<snip snip I wrote too much>

(snip snip for same reason)

I left out the second half of the original post detailing an Ele build designed to counter Modrem mechanics. I wasn’t sure if it was prudent to bring up, but I’m guessing now that it might. This was the only class I use that I could get this work effectively. Granted its squishy, but even my defensive/support guard couldn’t even be half as effective against any single mob as this Ele could across the board.

It exploits the massive skill table of the Ele using Scepter/Dagger and Earth Shield (of all things), in order to field every semi-reliable counter that actually works against the Mordrem. Its not the Strength of the individual CCs that enable this…. but the ability to continuously apply them for uptime that makes it work. But what I find really irritating is that this mechanics focused build is still less then 80% as effective as a straight Damage Ele build.

The only weak spot to my DD build (which lead me to build experiment in the first place) not being able to drop menders fast enough on my standard rotation, and loosing too much DPS to interrupt their healing skills. But really this was because I wasn’t built for solo might stacking, due to some trouble of getting the rotation right.

So…. yeah. Even using a DD build I’m bad at, it was still more effective overall then a dedicated control build.

*I’m disregarding the part about the strength of controls, as you’re clearly referring to PvP, but I’m only talking about PvE design in that post. I find that the game is reasonably functional when fights operate like how they do in PvP/WvW… but utterly fail in PvE because it doesn’t function on the same principles. *

I will open this next part by saying that for PvE design “Avoidance is NOT a counter”. Avoidance is the default strategy for when nothing else works well enough. It also lends into wide spread hate of Kiting in some circles, as its not very engaging; Unless its freeing you to focus on an different, more engaging mechanic.

So if I were center my whole build to counter one specific Mordrem (except Husks), the effectiveness of that role would be questionably effective in 6 out of 8 classes. Husks don’t really fight back in SW…. they’re more like siege weapons; which makes them hard to properly discuss in relation to the rest of the discussion. TT husks on the other hand are a huge threat, and I find does leverage the toughness design approach will.

ketchup.2783:

It would be neat, for those hard core players, to maybe make an open world ‘challenging’ boss in an arena of sorts so that people could not enter the battle after the fight started, but peeps could watch. Each death would be like musical chairs so when you are downed, you couldn’t come back in. It wouldn’t need a timer and the health of the boss wouldn’t have to be so high. His attacks could be brutal, but at least somewhat predictable, telegraphed, in a set pattern, etc.

Thats the basis of the Vinewrath event. However, in an general PvE situation, one thing GW2 wanted to avoid was “Competition” for event credit. Its a problem common in most MMOs, where a farming team would camp a mob spawn for some kind of drop… but by doing so, prevent other players from possibly getting kill credit. This leads to stiff competition to control the area, often resorting to open PvP if available, harassment, etc, in order to monopolize the drops.

Vinewrath avoided this simply by making the win condition bound to 3 sub-events, and building enough leeway to let a strong lane pick up the slack if a weak lane fails. The size of the event also allowed enough room for people to show up late, and still get a chance for credit. The 3 lane concept also had the subtle impact of encouraging players to spread out willingly to help the event. Compare that to the Ulgoth fight, where people would greedily rush the Champ beasts to get tags for all 3 champ bags.

Whoa, don’t disregard the CC portion, it was clearly PVE oriented with my mention of Deep Freeze. The current PVE dungeon meta for a general fight is start out by Deep Freezing the boss, then unleash the burst damage and weave in 5 more CCs to drop defiance and follow it up with a second deep freeze giving you 10s before you really ever have a chance to be hit.

CC is strong.

Again I mention bosses where we have CC strats that could easily be called exploits. If you Immobilize Subject 6 before he can eat the Asura then you can freely kill Subject 6 without him attacking back. Likewise if you LoS pull Bjarl in CoE1 to a corner and drop a sanctuary from guard he’ll continually knock himself down as that Sanctuary doesn’t apply defiance, you do that till sanctuary falls then Deep Freeze and hopefully finish him off, if not unleash interrupts to prevent his buffing.

CC isn’t what many players want, but it is a powerful tool if applied correctly.

As for kiting, the mordrem don’t need to be kited, just sometimes ranging is preferred. Leachers will either attack you from range or from melee depending on where you stand, so you can run out and bait a vine atack then back in and melee for a while. It’s using positioning, not kiting. Likewise Trolls you could range, but you’re not kitin the troll just his swarms if you get targetted, the troll is pretty stationary when you’re at range, he’ll jump back when you melee though.

The Thrasher is the only one you could maybe call kiting, but it’s more like a matador than running in circles. You blast him up, then avoid his charge/trail, and continue ranging.

Personally I have no problem dealing with most of SW. The only time I really have a problem is if I get like 5+ mordrem in combination such that I can’t treat them as a single entity. Like get a projectile terragriff, a leacher, a charging terragriff and 2 menders, well kitten , I’m not sure how to handle that flawlessly yet, so I panic and just burst damage and pray

ShelBlackblood.7826:

echo.2053:

what makes you think gw2 players aren’t casual pugs?

liadri when first released was difficult, casuals complained which later got her nerfed to disgustingly faceroll

Disgustingly Faceroll.
Disgustingly Faceroll.
Disgustingly Faceroll.

Wow. I need that face of yours, my fingers needed more than 30 trys to defeat her and I got shaky every time I almost made it. Changing builds/armor/buff food all the time included.
Or better: Give at least 70% of the players your face.

Liadri… a faceroll…. wow just… wow.

errr

liadri wasn’t even hard

i beat her like, idk, second attempt?