Guild Wars 2

Dungeon grinding for better gear is the future of MMOs. GW2 was supposed to be the utopia for those of us who wanted a reprieve from that. You see how we’ll that worked out. If even GW2 is forced to fall back on the dated and archaic practice of RNG stat gear grinding in dungeons then it practically proves that’s the future MMoRPGs.

E Tan.7385:

Maybe they should care about the CORE gameplay instead of adding new maps and basicly useless stuff who wont make the game more interesting if the core gameplay totaly fail.

Yes. This.
Sadly, they followed the WoW model and have built a simplistic game, tossing aside most the virtues of GW1 in favor of flashy shiny new content that shuttles you along to the next thing. All so you forget how bored you are with the same inflexible profession build and every fight being practically the same thing, save for the occasional unique encounter or boss fight.

At this point I feel they have both expressed and demonstrated no intent to make this a better game at the core. All their focus is on adding content, the GW2 business model is built on the modern gamer’s short attention span.

Always Reddit.

Do one of 4chan… lol

With current spin on the patch i anticipate the AMA will magically have no time for gear concerns and manifesto u-turns, but question on spvp or bugs or old dungeons or new fractals will readily be answered ie all the stuff they want to promote. I doubt there will even be an sincere apology for event fiasco if that gets raised.

Sorry to sound so cynical but the recent update and subsequent managment has eroded optimism, enjoyment and trust in this product considerably.

Martin Kerstein.3071:

Two things from me:
- We will talk in more detail about the things Chris outlined when we get closer to releasing them.
- If this thread becomes another one where people bicker back and forth about Ascended gear, I will close it down. Please continue discussion about Ascended gear in the existing threads on that topic and do not derail every thread that pops up.

Thank you.

We had a thread for that. It was closed. Maybe you should consider addressing Ascended gear a bit more before mentioning the completely irrelevant eSport information. Maybe you should consider that a lot of your customers are angry and require some attention beyond simple blog posts. So go ahead close it down. Doing so will only make your company look worse.

Cheers.

Shaileya.7063:

I was never more glad that my friends did not have the time to take advantage of those free trials. I would have been embaressed to show them the game at it’s absolute worst. To try to PR spin this around like it never happened is really distasteful..

This. Right here. I love(d) this game, and I was too disgusted with the whole weekend to log on since the Ancient Karka went down. I check these forums in hopes of good news but all I’ve seen from A-net is totally insufficient apologies and avoidance.

Whatever will be on the 26th, the damage is done, the No No of mmorpgs has happened: Never, never split your community.

Any decision that follows will most likely make one side rage again.

I love this game still and hate the community and how they behave… Or at-least the community on the forum.
It reminds me all too much of what I see in other games, players not actually reading what developers write, thinking about how changes actually impact them or responding in sensible manners.

But then again you are all the 90% right, whatever your idea is EVERYONE holds the same idea.

I find it funny that people talk about grind in ascended gear, the rings drop and fairly easily with one guarenteed and if you cannot afford a black slot after doing over EIGHTY fractal dungeons I have to ask… How bad are you at this game… I mean seriously I get what 60silver roughly per three dungeons at LOW LEVEL DIFFICULTY in those dungeons… You get through 80 dungeons + to the level you are required to actually use the back slot item and you get a ring AND can afford a backslot item… It is that simple.

The stats on the item make a 1%-2% difference to your OVERALL character strength which is NOTHING and a lesser difference than rare to exotics. And makes no difference in world vs world, especially if we cannot select runes and have rune effects in play (and people who use runes for their stats only and don’t work with the effects are just bad players, like the glass cannon only groups, lacking in intelligence)

There is still no gear grind in the game that isn’t optional, none that effects the gameplay in a meaningful way and ascended isn’t even a grind atm due to how they implemented it.

All I see is a bunch of people having a kneejerk reaction without actually having a closer look at how it will effect them and the way the game is played.

80 Dungeons? Are you serious? Against that WoW is a joke in getting the dungeon gear.

And the real problem ain’t the stats on the item, more the infusion which comes in the flavor blue and later green, yellow, orange

unknowable.8470:

I love this game still and hate the community and how they behave… Or at-least the community on the forum.
It reminds me all too much of what I see in other games, players not actually reading what developers write, thinking about how changes actually impact them or responding in sensible manners.

But then again you are all the 90% right, whatever your idea is EVERYONE holds the same idea.

I find it funny that people talk about grind in ascended gear, the rings drop and fairly easily with one guarenteed and if you cannot afford a black slot after doing over EIGHTY fractal dungeons I have to ask… How bad are you at this game… I mean seriously I get what 60silver roughly per three dungeons at LOW LEVEL DIFFICULTY in those dungeons… You get through 80 dungeons + to the level you are required to actually use the back slot item and you get a ring AND can afford a backslot item… It is that simple.

The stats on the item make a 1%-2% difference to your OVERALL character strength which is NOTHING and a lesser difference than rare to exotics. And makes no difference in world vs world, especially if we cannot select runes and have rune effects in play (and people who use runes for their stats only and don’t work with the effects are just bad players, like the glass cannon only groups, lacking in intelligence)

There is still no gear grind in the game that isn’t optional, none that effects the gameplay in a meaningful way and ascended isn’t even a grind atm due to how they implemented it.

All I see is a bunch of people having a kneejerk reaction without actually having a closer look at how it will effect them and the way the game is played.

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

Columba.9730:

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

What would you like in the game? Would you like the rings mailed to you? Would you like the mats you need to craft ascended gear for free?

And where did you get the 20% better? Did you read that somewhere, or did you calculate it on your own?

What you need to do is decide for yourself what feels like a grind and what doesn’t, and you’ll feel better about how you play the game. The people here are not a sample of the majority. Progression in all of its forms are as much a part of this game as it is a part of life. If you choose not to progress here, you go somewhere else and progress elsewhere. But make no mistake. Fundamental design requires character progression and reward. Anet has provided additional ways to progress, that’s all. It doesn’t violate the ToS, it doesn’t violate some vague promise they made 7 years ago. It’s the natural order of the development cycle, and it only helps to improve your enjoyment of gameplay. So, don’t listent to the masses, don’t jump on the bandwagon until you listen to yourself first. What do you feel you want to accomplish in this game? That’s more important than what anyone else tells you.

slazzy.7309:

Columba.9730:

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

What would you like in the game? Would you like the rings mailed to you? Would you like the mats you need to craft ascended gear for free?

And where did you get the 20% better? Did you read that somewhere, or did you calculate it on your own?

What you need to do is decide for yourself what feels like a grind and what doesn’t, and you’ll feel better about how you play the game. The people here are not a sample of the majority. Progression in all of its forms are as much a part of this game as it is a part of life. If you choose not to progress here, you go somewhere else and progress elsewhere. But make no mistake. Fundamental design requires character progression and reward. Anet has provided additional ways to progress, that’s all. It doesn’t violate the ToS, it doesn’t violate some vague promise they made 7 years ago. It’s the natural order of the development cycle, and it only helps to improve your enjoyment of gameplay. So, don’t listent to the masses, don’t jump on the bandwagon until you listen to yourself first. What do you feel you want to accomplish in this game? That’s more important than what anyone else tells you.

So in a game with vertical item progression, say WoW, when new a new content patch is added, you would ppl advice to choose if they want to aquire the new introduced item level armor and weapons and participate in the content, or decide against it and being excluded from the content? Yes, that makes sense, thanks.

Kiviar.7063:

The Grind has also been scaling up slowly since launch. I could sort of accept it from the cultural tier armours and karma gear, but the grind to get ascended gear is too much for me. 12g in ecto alone for a back item? GW1 did have its grind I know, It was one of the reasons I quit it and played WoW for so long. Yes, it had a horrible RNG grind as well, but it was different grinding with 39 other people in MC than in GW1.
"

I guess you missed a VERY important thing about the GW1 grind.
The GW1 grind was ONLY for cosmetic armor. But NEVER for something mandatory like the ascended gear , because of the boosted stat AND the agony crap.

In GW1 it was only to get a better looking armor, but you could get a armor with the best stat in the game for VERY cheap ( lets say it would have been like using 80silver for a complet end game set )

So you could totaly enjoy whatever content you wanted in GW1 without grind a single second.

Who is not anymore the case with GW2, since doing 55times and more the same dungeon for a exotic set, for me its grind.
Doing 1000000 time the fractal for the ascended ring drop, its grind
Farming weeks material to craft the ascended back stuff, its grind.

Also, exotic karma armor merchant, DIDNT even allow to buy the stat you want. IT make totaly no sense at all. It mean you HAVE to farm dungeon or farm material to get the exotic set you want..

That’s clearly stupid… and they look to didnt even think a single second to fix that…

lenpup.3765:

E Tan.7385:

Maybe they should care about the CORE gameplay instead of adding new maps and basicly useless stuff who wont make the game more interesting if the core gameplay totaly fail.

Yes. This.
Sadly, they followed the WoW model and have built a simplistic game, tossing aside most the virtues of GW1 in favor of flashy shiny new content that shuttles you along to the next thing. All so you forget how bored you are with the same inflexible profession build and every fight being practically the same thing, save for the occasional unique encounter or boss fight.

At this point I feel they have both expressed and demonstrated no intent to make this a better game at the core. All their focus is on adding content, the GW2 business model is built on the modern gamer’s short attention span.

Happy to finaly read someone who understand how important is the core gameplay….
( and how boring are all GW2 fights )

@Dozer, no I advise people that they should think for themselves and not listen to the lies about the non-existent gear grind that people are screaming about.

When you actually grind for gear, come talk to me. When you only have speculation about what’s yet to come, you have no basis to argue.

Questions?

All the stuff they’re working towards sounds good. I hope that will be combined with a behind-the-scenes revamp of the QA process for future one-time events, because wow did this one need more testing.

slazzy.7309:

Columba.9730:

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

What would you like in the game? Would you like the rings mailed to you? Would you like the mats you need to craft ascended gear for free?

And where did you get the 20% better? Did you read that somewhere, or did you calculate it on your own?

What you need to do is decide for yourself what feels like a grind and what doesn’t, and you’ll feel better about how you play the game. The people here are not a sample of the majority. Progression in all of its forms are as much a part of this game as it is a part of life. If you choose not to progress here, you go somewhere else and progress elsewhere. But make no mistake. Fundamental design requires character progression and reward. Anet has provided additional ways to progress, that’s all. It doesn’t violate the ToS, it doesn’t violate some vague promise they made 7 years ago. It’s the natural order of the development cycle, and it only helps to improve your enjoyment of gameplay. So, don’t listent to the masses, don’t jump on the bandwagon until you listen to yourself first. What do you feel you want to accomplish in this game? That’s more important than what anyone else tells you.

It’t not a vague promise made 7 years ago. They were still saying a few months ago (very close to release) that items (item progression) beyond exotics were to be cosmetic. Max-stat gear was supposed to be rather easy to obtain. Exotics were the accessible “max” and Legendary weapons, named exotics, and dungeon armors were the cosmetic-only progression beyond them. Now we are looking at a new tier that takes many times more time/effort to get than exotics and have around 8% better base stats (the rings), and an even larger difference (12%+) when infusions are added. I can get an entire set of exotic gear (likely more) for the amount of effort put into a single piece of Ascended gear with an infusion. Max-stat gear just got a whole lot more difficult to obtain.

In addition to being much more costly themselves, Ascended items use some of the same materials required for exotics and are increasing the crafting cost those as well.

For those of us without a huge time sink, this is a gear grind. Going from 5 Ectos to 50 ectos per piece of gear creates a gear grind. This is not including the other materials. This issue is not necessarily the gear, but the casual disregard for casual players. Or, I can spend all my time trying to run FotM to get drops. I do not feel this is a very fun time sink. I have over 400+ hours in the game and have 50+ ectos right now. I was saving them to create all my exotic gear at once for one toon. Why don’t I have more? Because I like to play alts too, many times with my fiance who likes to play alts as well. When I hit 80 do I want to have top gear on all my alts? YES! Will I be able to? No. Why should I continue to play my alts? Most of my time would be spent to gather the items for the gear or I can spend real money to buy them. I would rather spend real money on things that are not deemed necessary. I would rather spend money on dye packs to be honest. This is the gear grind.

Mods, please do not delete this post. I feel it contributes to the overall understanding of this conversation and one side that is being misunderstood by some.

slazzy.7309:

But make no mistake. Fundamental design requires character progression and reward.

No, no it doesn’t. All I want, is to kill people. Killing people with skill, as opposed to gear, is all the reward I need. I haven’t been brainwashed by WoW, thanks.

Nothing was said about the compensation they promised to people whk disconnected from the lost shores ancient karka event.

Swept under the rug yet again. Thank you.

Vinny.6924:

Nothing was said about the compensation they promised to people whk disconnected from the lost shores ancient karka event.

Swept under the rug yet again. Thank you.

They had already stated that a fix was coming, and that it would take time to implement. I would assume they want to be sure that no one gets excluded without giving extra rewards to those that were able to open the end chest. As far as that issue goes, there was really nothing more for him to say, aside from repeating the same statement made a few days ago.

Not much discussion about the time zone problems….. I am still very disappointed ArenaNet.

Most people that don’t understand the situation…

The event was on at 9 AM on a Monday in New Zealand (3-6am for Asians) which means those of us with work or school simply had no choice, we couldn’t participate.

The only way oceanic players were able to join this event was to

A) pull a sickie
B) unemployed
C) not enrolled in any educational system
D) had the day off…

See my point?

It was terribly executed and I really hope they do better next time.

Im looking to the WvW changes, its got quite stale and boring

So really am amazed that anet goes on holidays and won’t address our complains from an Oceanic perspective this is just disrespectful

You promised that No player would ever be treated the way you have because of where they live, If I can find the Quote where one of your head guys said this I will post it up, And you have even had the hide to admit that you knew in advance that ppl not in the IT time Zone would be unhappy with you all.

MatthewMedina
Content Designer
“We know that this is a topic that’s going to be heavily discussed, and we definitely want as much of your feedback as possible, both positive and negative (so long as it remains constructive and within the guidelines of the rules of conduct). However I would just like to point out that this:
“…fact that it’s the highest concurrence time…”
is contradictory to this:
“why not choose a time where there’s a higher chance for people to choose to attend?”
The reason we chose the times that we did, when concurrency is at its peak, is precisely because it offers us the highest chance for the largest number of people to attend. By definition though, because concurrency rises and falls, that means it’s impossible for us to choose a time that offers us a chance for everyone to attend.
Offering events like this at multiple times for different time zones is certainly worth considering, but given our team’s goals and the timeline we had to operate in (we fielded our team immediately after shipping the Live game), it just wasn’t feasible for us to consider such an option for this particular event.
Having said that, this decision is something that we realized would not make everyone happy. Keep in mind that there is a tremendous lineup of content to choose from during the weekend and after, with both the island and the Fractals dungeon remaining active, and we will continue to listen to both criticisms and compliments about these special events in order to continually improve your playing experience. "

so the events where bugged and we couldn’;t play them in our time zone cause you didn’t fix them in time then deleted them while we slept and yeah its all ready been said on main event fiasco and the total bs that was given out to a select few including it seams all of Anets staff that played , thats buy your own admission of enjoying playing with ppl

So we would like some answers and some respect and some answers on our complaints.

Enjoy your hoilday but we will all still be here when you get back and probablely even more upset cause it has taken too long to answer us all

phabby.8945:

So really am amazed that anet goes on holidays and won’t address our complains from an Oceanic perspective this is just disrespectful

Ok if this is the level we’ve fallen to on the forums then, wow, quite frankly.

But to address the rest of your post, there will be an AMA meeting next Monday that will hopefully answer these questions that you might have.

But honestly, you need to chill out and let them have a holiday without some forum-based guilt, else you come off as a little bit insane. They are not the forum’s personal slaves, they are people who work hard and make mistakes like we all do.

slazzy.7309:

When you actually grind for gear, come talk to me. When you only have speculation about what’s yet to come, you have no basis to argue.

Questions?

I’m guessing you haven’t played any of the new content or educated yourself on it. Two items were introduced in this new tier of gear that is bridging an invisible gap in gear that was recently discovered by the design team. The Ascended Rings are gotten from the Fractals of the Mist dungeon as a RNG drop once you have gotten to Lvl 10+ in the Fractal System. The Back Items are a new Mystic Forge recipe using existing T6/SP items and RNG drops from FOTM. This is just the start of the grind and as new pieces are added it’ll continue this way as far as we know.

Ascended Ring – Currently the only way to get one of these rings is via running the new FOTM dungeon. You also must achieve Dungeon Lvl 10 or higher (Same time Agony appears on bosses) before they start to drop. What that means is you have to run 30 Fractals aka 10 Fractal Cycles (3 Fractals Completed without Repairing) in order to get to Level 10. Now that you have gotten this far which ranges from 7.5hrs to 22.5hrs (Depending on group and Experience on average.) of running the fractals over and over you finally have a chance to run them more for a chance at the Ring you need dropping for you. You could be lucky and get this your next run or you could run it a 1000 times and never see it. Welcome to RNG fun!

Note: If you get to FOTM Dungeon Lvl 20+ you have a chance for the Infused Ascended rings dropping, so you get to start a whole different set of runs and fight RNG for the rings that you really want. So much fun I can barely contain myself.

Ascended Back Item – This is a fairly brutal unless you just happen to have an extra 50g-75g or so lying around. 250 T6 Fine Mats + 50 Ecto + 1 Vial of Condensed Mists Essence + 1 Gift of Ascension. T6 Mats… Either grind a ton of mobs for days on end or buy them off the TP for premium prices. Ecto… Still grinding mobs or dungeons then blowing up Lvl 70+ Rares/Exotics for a chance at them or spending a premium at the TP. Vial… Welcome back to the Fractals for a RNG chance at an essence drop. Gift… Costs 500 Fractal Relics from the FOTM NPC. So, that means you’re grinding the heck out of FOTM. Just grinding up to Dungeon Lvl 10 only got you 355 Fractal Relics… So, once again we are having tons of fun.

Note: I want my Ascended Back to be the Infused version! Well, put your Book/Quiver in the MF along with 250 Ecto, 1 Gift of Ascension, and 1 Glob of Coagulated Mist Essence. The back item you already made. The gift of Ascension you’ve made one that only took 8hrs or more, but since you’re high level in the dungeons now it’ll only take you another 4hrs or so to get. 250 Ecto… You must be swimming in exotics by now just waiting to be blown up. Coagulated… This only takes 5 Vial of Condensed Mists Essence (Remember that annoying RNG thing you ground out earlier… Now you just need 5 more) plus 1 Mystic Coin, 1 Ecto, and 1 Fractal Relic in the MF to make. I’m bouncing around like Tigger just full of fun now.

Infusions – Now that you have the fancy Ascended gear you have to fill in that pesky Infusion slot. For 75 Fractal Relics you get a Simple Infusion and for 225 Fractal Relics you get a Versatile Infusion. These are the Agony Resistance only and are sold by the FOTM vendor. If you want Infusions with additional Stats (which we know we all want), then for Simple you need 1 Eldritch Scroll, 20 Mystic Coin, 250 Karka Shells or Passion Fruit (Depends on Off or Def Infusion), and 100 T6 Fine Item. First two Items are cake. Karka Shells have a terrible drop rate (but I suppose you could buy the chest from the gem shop for some help). Passion Fruit are just a long gathering process. I think both would be about 5g on the TP or so. 100 T6… Well, we’re back to the annoying grind unless you’re willing to pay the TP Premium.

Note: Versatile Infusions – Having the simple ones is just ghetto. We need the best! The basic recipe is 2 Eldritch Scroll, 50 Mystic Coins, 100-250 T6 Mats, and 100-250 Passion Fruit/Passion Flower/Karka Shells/etc… The last two components are varied depending on stats and off/def/omni wanted. More and more grind or preimum TP again.

Now if in the making of the 2 new items you don’t see a serious commitment of time and cash that is a very insane grind, then I firmly believe you are in a state of denial, trolling, or just blind.

slazzy.7309:

Columba.9730:

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

What would you like in the game? Would you like the rings mailed to you? Would you like the mats you need to craft ascended gear for free?

And where did you get the 20% better? Did you read that somewhere, or did you calculate it on your own?

What you need to do is decide for yourself what feels like a grind and what doesn’t, and you’ll feel better about how you play the game. The people here are not a sample of the majority. Progression in all of its forms are as much a part of this game as it is a part of life. If you choose not to progress here, you go somewhere else and progress elsewhere. But make no mistake. Fundamental design requires character progression and reward. Anet has provided additional ways to progress, that’s all. It doesn’t violate the ToS, it doesn’t violate some vague promise they made 7 years ago. It’s the natural order of the development cycle, and it only helps to improve your enjoyment of gameplay. So, don’t listent to the masses, don’t jump on the bandwagon until you listen to yourself first. What do you feel you want to accomplish in this game? That’s more important than what anyone else tells you.

I want the ability to earn these new items on my own, doing what I enjoy. Dungeon grinds don’t cut it. I enjoy wvwvw. I was happy before this patch. I never asked for it.

Go add up the back pack stats and tell me they don’t total 20% more than the best exotic one.

Yes, Chris, great article. Everything you said sounds great.

But unless you guys come forward with some proper feedback on the communities other fears and complaints on Monday I’m afraid you will enjoy all the fantastic new content with a lot less players, come xmas.

Just saying. :-)

IonicBlaze.7948:

Funny thing just happened: This was deleted because of colmplaining:

" Raf.1078:

I doubt the controversy over the new gear extends much past these forums. Most people simply don’t care what happens here.

My answer:
Thats right, my guild of 35 mates just quitted playing without leaving a single word here because of the new treadmill."

I didnt complain at all, I just answered to another post. Is this the the new policy to keep poeple silent?

Apparently, yes. I made quite a long a post that was addressing the article, and today i find it missing. There was no infraction, no message about post removal – it’s just gone. Seems to me that Anet does not want any sensible discussion and prefers to have only bashing and flaming. That allows them to just ignore the threads about things they don’t want to discuss and pretend nothing important is being said there.

Personally, I thought the entire write-up was a brush-off and a major marketing spin.
I would like to see some quantification of “a lot of players” enjoyed the event. Alot can mean 45% of the player base or even 30% of the player base.

“Players have already spent an incredible amount of time in the new Fractals dungeon, and their reaction to it has been phenomenal.”
Phenomenally good or phenomenally bad?
“Having said that, we’re also aware that there were certain aspects of the event that could have worked better than they did, and thanks to your excellent feedback we’ll be working toward strengthening this type of content moving forward.”
Certain aspects? Bugged events, small new zone, unreasonable timings (at least for “alot of us”). Strengthening this type of content how? Making it available only on the 29th of Feb 2013, for 5mins at 12noon PST?

Seriously the more I read the article the more frustrated I get. Regarding the serious gloss over. SWTOR anyone?

MilkInBags.5136:

Columba.9730:

More dungeons. I hate dungeons. It would have nice to acknowledge the near universal disgust at the gear grind.

You don’t have to run dungeons for the gear. You can run it for you know, actually see all the content

I’m looking forward for the changes in WvW as it got pretty boring lately.

Edit: What’s the “Ascended gear fiasco”? Anyone care to explain?

i agree with the statement that dungeons can be fun, which is why the dungeons shouldn’t need a gear prerequisite. that’s when they become just gear grinds. hence the massive backlash on this one.

having gear prerequisites makes for wow-style ruthlessness in the social aspect of the game. in that everyone gets called noobs again, and gearscores become the norm.

i think everyone who loves the game can admit the best thing about it is that moment when you find yourself in an event with a bunch of complete strangers, and you’re fighting together, not against each other. when you don’t care in the slightest that the gamer fighting next to you isn’t kitted out in the uber gear of today. all you care about is you’re both having fun and even when you die, it’s still cool because someone’s rezzing you anyway.

with the gear treadmill, every dungeon’s played against a stopwatch. every fight is a boring rote-fest.

just.

bring back gw2, please, anet. bring back the desire for a more positive social experience.

I would have preferred a more direct and honest summary. I know it’s partly about PR, and PR people always think euphemisms and allusions work best, but I’d be feeling a whole lot more positive about Anet as a development house right now if they had took it on the chin and said “it was a massive debacle, we are sorry and have learnt this, that and the other lesson.”

Regarding the future, I am disappointed to see an increasing focus on dungeons/fractals. Anet has been innovative in so many ways, I had raised hopes about them finding some other end game for PvE than a WoW-style repeat-these-dungeons-hundreds-of-times-for-a-reward model.

All these promised content sound great.

Except it will take a year to realize them all, 2 years to make all of them bug free.

Considering how a simple event like the Lost Shores can have so many bugs, I’m really not looking forward to anything mentioned in the article.

I do have to agree with one thing in this blog post, most of my friends do like the FotM dungeons. I’m not talking about the agony/infusion mechanics, the ascened gear, or the gating/grind issues they bring. I’m talking about the actual dungeons and nothing more. They are fun, interesting, and look amazing. I would like to see more dungeons like this, not just more of the same 9 at higher difficulty.

As fun as they are, I have no desire to do them over and over and over to get a single piece of gear that requires token rewards (these are fine), lucky/RNG drops (not fine for non-cosmetic gear), and a truckload of other rare materials(not even kittening close to fine) to craft. I will continue doing Catacombs so I can get armor for my thief. I prefer to spend my time knowing that I will get everything I need (just tokens) to get a full set of armor instead of spending 10 hours to maybe get lucky and get an ascended ring or the items to make a quiver/book.

GOSU.9574:

Did anyone miss this on the WvW portion?

“new reward progression”

That’s right, new reward PROGRESSION in WvW. More tread mill please.

Also changing up PvP, I bet with MORE Progression. Can’t get enough tread mill in this non-tediouis, no tread mill game.

Will they ever face the fact no matter how much they try, how much pressure is put on them to do so, they will NEVER take WoW gear tread mill enthuasiasts away from WoW?

If you have been watching the WvW forums over the last few months you will have seen a huge number of posts asking for DAOC style progression for WvW. Nothing to do with WoW or gear treadmills.

Anyway, looking forward to new fractals!

I suspect the scaling also refers to how downscaling is not yet “perfect”. You don’t actually feel like a lower level char, making some of the lower zones (30 or lower, basically) feel far too easy when explored later on.

replicant.3620:

slazzy.7309:

When you actually grind for gear, come talk to me. When you only have speculation about what’s yet to come, you have no basis to argue.

Questions?

I’m guessing you haven’t played any of the new content or educated yourself on it. Two items were introduced in this new tier of gear that is bridging an invisible gap in gear that was recently discovered by the design team. The Ascended Rings are gotten from the Fractals of the Mist dungeon as a RNG drop once you have gotten to Lvl 10+ in the Fractal System. The Back Items are a new Mystic Forge recipe using existing T6/SP items and RNG drops from FOTM. This is just the start of the grind and as new pieces are added it’ll continue this way as far as we know.

Ascended Ring – Currently the only way to get one of these rings is via running the new FOTM dungeon. You also must achieve Dungeon Lvl 10 or higher (Same time Agony appears on bosses) before they start to drop. What that means is you have to run 30 Fractals aka 10 Fractal Cycles (3 Fractals Completed without Repairing) in order to get to Level 10. Now that you have gotten this far which ranges from 7.5hrs to 22.5hrs (Depending on group and Experience on average.) of running the fractals over and over you finally have a chance to run them more for a chance at the Ring you need dropping for you. You could be lucky and get this your next run or you could run it a 1000 times and never see it. Welcome to RNG fun!

Note: If you get to FOTM Dungeon Lvl 20+ you have a chance for the Infused Ascended rings dropping, so you get to start a whole different set of runs and fight RNG for the rings that you really want. So much fun I can barely contain myself.

Ascended Back Item – This is a fairly brutal unless you just happen to have an extra 50g-75g or so lying around. 250 T6 Fine Mats + 50 Ecto + 1 Vial of Condensed Mists Essence + 1 Gift of Ascension. T6 Mats… Either grind a ton of mobs for days on end or buy them off the TP for premium prices. Ecto… Still grinding mobs or dungeons then blowing up Lvl 70+ Rares/Exotics for a chance at them or spending a premium at the TP. Vial… Welcome back to the Fractals for a RNG chance at an essence drop. Gift… Costs 500 Fractal Relics from the FOTM NPC. So, that means you’re grinding the heck out of FOTM. Just grinding up to Dungeon Lvl 10 only got you 355 Fractal Relics… So, once again we are having tons of fun.

Note: I want my Ascended Back to be the Infused version! Well, put your Book/Quiver in the MF along with 250 Ecto, 1 Gift of Ascension, and 1 Glob of Coagulated Mist Essence. The back item you already made. The gift of Ascension you’ve made one that only took 8hrs or more, but since you’re high level in the dungeons now it’ll only take you another 4hrs or so to get. 250 Ecto… You must be swimming in exotics by now just waiting to be blown up. Coagulated… This only takes 5 Vial of Condensed Mists Essence (Remember that annoying RNG thing you ground out earlier… Now you just need 5 more) plus 1 Mystic Coin, 1 Ecto, and 1 Fractal Relic in the MF to make. I’m bouncing around like Tigger just full of fun now.

Infusions – Now that you have the fancy Ascended gear you have to fill in that pesky Infusion slot. For 75 Fractal Relics you get a Simple Infusion and for 225 Fractal Relics you get a Versatile Infusion. These are the Agony Resistance only and are sold by the FOTM vendor. If you want Infusions with additional Stats (which we know we all want), then for Simple you need 1 Eldritch Scroll, 20 Mystic Coin, 250 Karka Shells or Passion Fruit (Depends on Off or Def Infusion), and 100 T6 Fine Item. First two Items are cake. Karka Shells have a terrible drop rate (but I suppose you could buy the chest from the gem shop for some help). Passion Fruit are just a long gathering process. I think both would be about 5g on the TP or so. 100 T6… Well, we’re back to the annoying grind unless you’re willing to pay the TP Premium.

Note: Versatile Infusions – Having the simple ones is just ghetto. We need the best! The basic recipe is 2 Eldritch Scroll, 50 Mystic Coins, 100-250 T6 Mats, and 100-250 Passion Fruit/Passion Flower/Karka Shells/etc… The last two components are varied depending on stats and off/def/omni wanted. More and more grind or preimum TP again.

Now if in the making of the 2 new items you don’t see a serious commitment of time and cash that is a very insane grind, then I firmly believe you are in a state of denial, trolling, or just blind.

Anyone defending this insane grind – and upcoming grind for additional pieces – should read this carefully and understand both the immediate and long-term implications.

Maz.8604:

Chris Whiteside.6102:

Hi All,

Thanks for your feedback we really appreciate it. I would like to take the opportunity to answer your questions in an AMA on Reddit on Monday 26th (12pm PST- More details to follow) to talk about recent updates to the game and our philosophy for Guild Wars 2 moving forward.

Please keep in mind that there we are about to begin the Thanksgiving holiday in the US and are out of the office (and likely in game) until Monday. Happy Holidays everyone!

Chris

Hopefully this is weighted with the proper respect that the lack thereof caused the original to be deleted.

With all due respect, but this format is only really good for people who are anonymous. Such as IAMA doctor AMA and in a general discussion forum about medicine. Doctoring, engineering, etc, rarely has enough fans. It is all about imparting information, not public relation spin.

Holding an AMA in the GW2 subreddit will just increase the noise to signal ratio as the hive-mind asks irrelevant questions that have little do with the reasons you have to do the AMA. To smooth over all the issues the November 15th update caused.

The softest ball that passes over that particular plate will be struck, and the hive-mind will consider it a home run and call it caring. This a PR move. And any dissent will be down-voted by the hive-mind mentality that happens on /r/guildwars2, no matter how relevant and poignant the points made.

I have a feeling you’re about to be pleasantly surprised about how strongly the hive mind feels about breaking manifesto promises about gear grind.

I for one will be there on the 26th, guns blazing.

@Chris Whiteside: Hello Mr. Whiteside, I have important question from my guild.

Will you work shortly on Guild vs Guild system? Can we expect that ?
Poeple basicly discuss on this matter much, but none mentioned that Guild Wars 1 was build on PvP play, and when most of my friends saw no GvG, they left to GW1. So if you could be so kind and make an official statement about GvG and plans on future group pvp features.. It would be nice.

The thing that surprised me most about the way ANet handled the running of the one-off event, was that for a company that pretty much set the standard for using instances with GW1, they didn’t use instances to manage the timezone/lag/culling issues that were bound to occur in an open world, fixed-time event.

ANet could have used all the scavenger hunt and new dynamic events prior to the ultimate boss fight to allow players to acquire tickets to an ultimate boss fight instance, that players could enter once, at a time convenient to them.

Using an instance would also control the number of players and thereby improve graphic performance.

Having this unique instance available as a one-off with a 2-3 day window to use your entrance ticket might have been a better way to deal with managing the event. While the concept of overflow servers is a good one, it clearly was not the right option in this case.

Just my 2c.

Nothing about crafting or adding Infusion or Ascended gear rewards to all types of gameplay, including crafting and/or just ingredients needed that only drops in Dungeons/instances etc, that should be added to drop in all game-styles or they force us to grind instnces/dungeons to get them.

Nothing to adress how to scale other open PvE content now that the player-base has been divided into Elite dungeon grinders and non dungeon grinders. Orr for example is almost unplayable if want to find random pug group and many areas abandoned.

Only choice now is to be on when most are on in guild and do guild runs for Orr and World bosses. No more open world feeling with random players and pug groups doing stuff all over.

please…… slow down on churning out new content whilst the fundamentals of the game have still got problems (some since day 1), mainly referring to class balance/bugs here.

Each profession sub-forum has long lists of bugs in regards to skills/traits/mechanics that are not working as intended, i know that it is nigh on impossible to fix every last bug in one go, but i would rather have a whole game update dedicated to profession bug fixing, than a new map/seasonal event (as great as they are).

“Our sincere thanks for all your feedback and for being part of the journey as we continue to build upon the world of Guild Wars 2.”

The man said it himself.

Columba.9730:

unknowable.8470:

I love this game still and hate the community and how they behave… Or at-least the community on the forum.
It reminds me all too much of what I see in other games, players not actually reading what developers write, thinking about how changes actually impact them or responding in sensible manners.

But then again you are all the 90% right, whatever your idea is EVERYONE holds the same idea.

I find it funny that people talk about grind in ascended gear, the rings drop and fairly easily with one guarenteed and if you cannot afford a black slot after doing over EIGHTY fractal dungeons I have to ask… How bad are you at this game… I mean seriously I get what 60silver roughly per three dungeons at LOW LEVEL DIFFICULTY in those dungeons… You get through 80 dungeons + to the level you are required to actually use the back slot item and you get a ring AND can afford a backslot item… It is that simple.

The stats on the item make a 1%-2% difference to your OVERALL character strength which is NOTHING and a lesser difference than rare to exotics. And makes no difference in world vs world, especially if we cannot select runes and have rune effects in play (and people who use runes for their stats only and don’t work with the effects are just bad players, like the glass cannon only groups, lacking in intelligence)

There is still no gear grind in the game that isn’t optional, none that effects the gameplay in a meaningful way and ascended isn’t even a grind atm due to how they implemented it.

All I see is a bunch of people having a kneejerk reaction without actually having a closer look at how it will effect them and the way the game is played.

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

Buutttt you don’t need them, the stats are 8% better than an exotic and you don’t need them outside of fractals and even then only after level 11…
That 8% stat bonus is a 1-2% character power bonus at best and even less as you cannot get a full set yet.

I’m very happy with fractals and I hope the same system will be extended to old dungeons as well.

I never played old dungeons after 4/4 because they’re the same, there is no challenge/reward increase.
It would be awesome if all dungeons had difficulties and consecutive paths to unlock them.

Keep up the great work Anet.

fellyn.5083:

Do you realize the people posting on the forums represent not even 10% of the people who are playing the game?

fellyn.5083:

Anet pre-sold well over 2 million copies of GW2 (that doesn’t count all the copies they’ve sold since then). Assuming exactly 2 million pre sales if only 1 out of 20 players still play that’s 100000 people still playing the game.

You’re good at making up numbers. ANet said that way more than 10% of all players are using the forums, can’t find the post now but maybe somebody else can help.
And at least 300000 people have been online during the one time event afair, there has also been an info on that.

I’m interested to see what “revamping dungeons” will bring.
The current track record is pretty poor in my eyes; so I am wondering if they will bring the token grind back to BWE levels AND add in RNG exotics/ascended/unique drops to bosses and chests (thus making old dungeons worth the time and effort).
Will the up the difficulty or bring it down?
Will they add some unique abilities to bosses vs overly inflated health bars and silly one shot mechanics?

just personally, the next major update is going to be the break it or make it for me

unknowable.8470:

Columba.9730:

unknowable.8470:

I love this game still and hate the community and how they behave… Or at-least the community on the forum.
It reminds me all too much of what I see in other games, players not actually reading what developers write, thinking about how changes actually impact them or responding in sensible manners.

But then again you are all the 90% right, whatever your idea is EVERYONE holds the same idea.

I find it funny that people talk about grind in ascended gear, the rings drop and fairly easily with one guarenteed and if you cannot afford a black slot after doing over EIGHTY fractal dungeons I have to ask… How bad are you at this game… I mean seriously I get what 60silver roughly per three dungeons at LOW LEVEL DIFFICULTY in those dungeons… You get through 80 dungeons + to the level you are required to actually use the back slot item and you get a ring AND can afford a backslot item… It is that simple.

The stats on the item make a 1%-2% difference to your OVERALL character strength which is NOTHING and a lesser difference than rare to exotics. And makes no difference in world vs world, especially if we cannot select runes and have rune effects in play (and people who use runes for their stats only and don’t work with the effects are just bad players, like the glass cannon only groups, lacking in intelligence)

There is still no gear grind in the game that isn’t optional, none that effects the gameplay in a meaningful way and ascended isn’t even a grind atm due to how they implemented it.

All I see is a bunch of people having a kneejerk reaction without actually having a closer look at how it will effect them and the way the game is played.

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

Buutttt you don’t need them, the stats are 8% better than an exotic and you don’t need them outside of fractals and even then only after level 11…
That 8% stat bonus is a 1-2% character power bonus at best and even less as you cannot get a full set yet.

Multiple analyses have shown its at least 20%, lol. This is only the beginning.

Seriously, I don’t have much faith or trust left in ANet after this whole ordeal.

Too I don’t think you and I will get much of an indepth explanation from then at the Q&A et al, but rather a brush off and a around the bush, IF they’re going to accept any questions about the introduction of the vertical gear treadmill/Ascendend gear. I’ll be willing to give them the benefit of teh doubt, but personally, that is as far as I’m willing to go….not one hair on the leg of a fly closer than that.

Columba.9730:

unknowable.8470:

Columba.9730:

unknowable.8470:

I love this game still and hate the community and how they behave… Or at-least the community on the forum.
It reminds me all too much of what I see in other games, players not actually reading what developers write, thinking about how changes actually impact them or responding in sensible manners.

But then again you are all the 90% right, whatever your idea is EVERYONE holds the same idea.

I find it funny that people talk about grind in ascended gear, the rings drop and fairly easily with one guarenteed and if you cannot afford a black slot after doing over EIGHTY fractal dungeons I have to ask… How bad are you at this game… I mean seriously I get what 60silver roughly per three dungeons at LOW LEVEL DIFFICULTY in those dungeons… You get through 80 dungeons + to the level you are required to actually use the back slot item and you get a ring AND can afford a backslot item… It is that simple.

The stats on the item make a 1%-2% difference to your OVERALL character strength which is NOTHING and a lesser difference than rare to exotics. And makes no difference in world vs world, especially if we cannot select runes and have rune effects in play (and people who use runes for their stats only and don’t work with the effects are just bad players, like the glass cannon only groups, lacking in intelligence)

There is still no gear grind in the game that isn’t optional, none that effects the gameplay in a meaningful way and ascended isn’t even a grind atm due to how they implemented it.

All I see is a bunch of people having a kneejerk reaction without actually having a closer look at how it will effect them and the way the game is played.

lol i have looked closely. it’s hours and hours of a grind in content some of us hate. How difficult is that to understand. the rings don’t always drop. How can you say what is a grind for some of us? It’s not optional. stop saying that. the stats are at least 20% better than exotics. not optional.

Buutttt you don’t need them, the stats are 8% better than an exotic and you don’t need them outside of fractals and even then only after level 11…
That 8% stat bonus is a 1-2% character power bonus at best and even less as you cannot get a full set yet.

Multiple analyses have shown its at least 20%, lol. This is only the beginning.

You have the basis stats, then you get to use the various degrees of infusions on top of that….so yes, the endning stats are going to be higher than “just” the 8% that you’re trying to pass off. So, Columba is right.

If you want I can pull the math for you from Reddit on this….