Guild Wars 2

Page error fix.

It’s a game. Not a job. I studied for my work. Why should anyone study to have fun in their down time? I’m not saying people shouldn’t try to help. But really, I see this so often on the forums. BE AWESOME OR GET OUT. If other players make you that upset, you should play a single player game maybe.

It’s an MMO. No one HAS to bring an A-game. Some may not care. Some may not know. Some may not speak your language. Some may be 8 yrs old, some may be 78. That’s just the way it’s going to be.

ETA: a good leader/commander can get the job done by leading, inspiring, and passing on knowledge. By saying someone is “lazy” for following a commander is basically saying a huge part of this game is meaningless.

Ashen.2907:

I suppose one could counter with:

Why didnt people take a couple of minutes to explain what was about to happen before the encounter began ?

Kind of goes both ways. If you want or expect people to be informed while playing olen world content with you it seems like common sense to contribute to informing them.

Because players come and go from the zone at all times and you can’t be expected to realistically explain in /shout for each new person that zones in every minute. So no it doesn’t go both ways. I’ve seen plenty of instances of where someone did explain in detail in /shout to people only to have a new person zoning in 2 minutes later ask in /shout the exact same question or not asking at all and messing up anyway.

ozmaniandevil.6805:

It’s a game. Not a job. I studied for my work. Why should anyone study to have fun in their down time? I’m not saying people shouldn’t try to help. But really, I see this so often on the forums. BE AWESOME OR GET OUT. If other players make you that upset, you should play a single player game maybe.

It’s an MMO. No one HAS to bring an A-game. Some may not care. Some may not know. Some may not speak your language. Some may be 8 yrs old, some may be 78. That’s just the way it’s going to be.

And if that’s the case, no one should complain when said event fails. And they certainly should not be screaming, “You should’ve told us what to do!” However, we know that’s also not going to happen given previous evidence and experience.

Which is the point the OP is making.

It’s not ‘be awesome’. It’s at least ‘be prepared’. And I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

ozmaniandevil.6805:

It’s a game. Not a job. I studied for my work. Why should anyone study to have fun in their down time? I’m not saying people shouldn’t try to help. But really, I see this so often on the forums. BE AWESOME OR GET OUT. If other players make you that upset, you should play a single player game maybe.

It’s an MMO. No one HAS to bring an A-game. Some may not care. Some may not know. Some may not speak your language. Some may be 8 yrs old, some may be 78. That’s just the way it’s going to be.

And if that’s the case, no one should complain when said event fails. However, we know that’s also not going to happen given previous evidence and experience.

Which is the point the OP is making.

Ignore in-game whiners/complainers. No need to point to a large part of the player base and blame them for a few … unsavory/lame people.

You misunderstand.

Those people want those of us, with experience and knowledge, to carry them through the event. Because they couldn’t bother to take a moment to learn or even ask the question. At this point, most players presume the majority understand how the Vine-boss works . . . given it’s been around a month now.

When it failed, chaos ensued according to the OP.

Ignoring them isn’t the issue. No one is blaming the player base. Or think them lame or unsavory.

It’s a question of common sense. Which is again the OP’s point: all they had to do was ask if they didn’t understand how the event worked.

Others would’ve told them.

ideally everybody should have the complete knowledge about the content they are playing before they play it. i expect perfection from every other player without my interference or help. i think that’s something you can and should ask for from a decent human being. 99% of players tend to be a disappointment, though.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Point. But why wouldn’t a player bring their A-game? Wouldn’t it behoove a player to at least look? Heck, there are videos that show how to do such things, step-by-step, with annotations.

I’m not the greatest player in the world, but even I know to look before I leap.

No, really. It wouldnt’ behoove a player to look, if they don’t know there’s something to look FOR.

You know, so to you it’s obvious. I had a guy in my guild who never knew and one day I said to him, did you watch one of the videos or read Dulfy. He was like, ummm there are videos?

He just didn’t know TO look.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Am I the only one finding it ironic that certain players expect someone else to do the research to lead them to success?

“Tell us what to do!”

Um . . . so you want us to do the research, learn the mechanics of the fight, and then type all this out before said fight, and during, because those players cannot be bother to learn the correct methods themselves?

. . .

I’m pretty casual too, but that’s downright lazy. Sorry. Even I look to see how best to benefit the raid before specific fights.

Again, bringing this back to topic, that’s just common sense if you want success.

You are missing the point.

You know the mechanics of a Boss, fine.
You want to succeed or not?

If you want to succeed, tell people what to do.

Yes they should do the research and whatnot, but they didnt, you can troll them for that later.
But now its your call, are you willing to do what it takes to succeed?
If not, you don’t have to cry about others being lazy.

What part of ‘Ask’ did you miss?

Edit (OP):

Which leads me to my gripe with this: why can’t players take 5 minutes to read the wiki or ask other players before an event starts about the tactics involved?

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Then, with all due respect to your friend, he lacked common sense. Not to be obnoxious, but the Internet is for more than games and kitten.

He should look into that.

With all due respect to you, you should be more tolerant of people who didn’t grow up on the net and don’t think in those terms.

Um . . . Vayne. He’s playing an MMO on the Internet. That excuse isn’t going to fly.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Um . . . Vayne. He’s playing a MMO on the Internet. That excuse isn’t going to fly.

Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing. SOme people still reach for a phone book because they don’t realize you can get the white pages. He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet. He didn’t have to open a browser to play this game which he likely bought in a brick and mortar store.

Intolerance is intolerance, no matter how you slice it.

DeathPanel.8362:

Ashen.2907:

I suppose one could counter with:

Why didnt people take a couple of minutes to explain what was about to happen before the encounter began ?

Kind of goes both ways. If you want or expect people to be informed while playing olen world content with you it seems like common sense to contribute to informing them.

Because players come and go from the zone at all times and you can’t be expected to realistically explain in /shout for each new person that zones in every minute. So no it doesn’t go both ways. I’ve seen plenty of instances of where someone did explain in detail in /shout to people only to have a new person zoning in 2 minutes later ask in /shout the exact same question or not asking at all and messing up anyway.

It seems highly unlikely that a player joining at the last minute is going to cause an event full of fully informed and on top of things players to fail.

Beyond people joining after an event briefing, if you want someone to do something you probably should tell them so. If you choose to not tell someone that you want them to do X, then you really dont have a lot of room to complain when they do Y instead.

Vayne.8563:

Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing. SOme people still reach for a phone book because they don’t realize you can get the white pages. He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet. He didn’t have to open a browser to play this game which he likely bought in a brick and mortar store.

Intolerance is intolerance, no matter how you slice it.

Are you serious? I mean . . . really? Are you?

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Vayne.8563:

Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing. SOme people still reach for a phone book because they don’t realize you can get the white pages. He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet. He didn’t have to open a browser to play this game which he likely bought in a brick and mortar store.

Intolerance is intolerance, no matter how you slice it.

Are you serious? I mean . . . really? Are you?

Yes 100% serious. You need to look outside your experience.

A 60 year old gets a game from his family. Might even be his first computer game. They think he might like it. The installs it. He doesn’t surf the web in his spare time. It’s a gift. So he installs the disc and the disc automatically installs the game. The only time you have to open a browser is to register the game, and that could have been done by the kids setting it up for him.

Do you know how many people in my guild know next to nothing about computers in general? Housewives raising kids who don’t have time. Retired people, people who work in non computer related fields like construction and don’t use a computer regularly.

I’m different because I worked in the industry. During that time I’ve dealt with thousands of computer problems some of which you wouldn’t believe. People who grew up with computers get it. My sister is brilliant, but computers confuse and scare the hell out of her. It’s all in her mind. She is easily intelligent enough to do anything on a computer. But she’s computer phobic. Lots of people are. She does play online games though.

Playing an online game isn’t anywhere near the same as using the Internet, or a search engine, or researching something.1

VaLee.5102:

Did this game turn that casual and brainless that everyone is expecting to be carried for free loot?

Well, VaLee, I don’t think I could’ve provided a better answer or example to your question if I tried.

Moving on.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

VaLee.5102:

Did this game turn that casual and brainless that everyone is expecting to be carried for free loot?

Well, VaLee, I don’t think I could’ve provided a better answer or example to your question if I tried.

Moving on.

I bet you you’ll find them same in just about any MMO. Except that in most, the hard stuff is squirreled away in instances most people ignore. It’s hard to randomly join a raid in other games. Here you can just wander into stuff.

I think it’s a missing element of the GW2 world if a player is, in essence, required to go to a wiki or other site in order to find out what to do at an event. I want a completely immersed world to explore — all the relevant info should be provided in-game.

It’s not being lazy or a desire to be spoon-fed. Think about it: If you were really an Asuran mesmer running across the Silverwastes to the event, are you going to be able to check Dulfy’s website?

How about having some NPCs at the events that can be queried for the event mechanics, or even call out the relevant stages and what to prioritize on? If the info is generally available outside the game, why isn’t it inside as well?

Azaghal.6940:

I think it’s a missing element of the GW2 world if a player is, in essence, required to go to a wiki or other site in order to find out what to do at an event. I want a completely immersed world to explore — all the relevant info should be provided in-game.

It’s not being lazy or a desire to be spoon-fed. Think about it: If you were really an Asuran mesmer running across the Silverwastes to the event, are you going to be able to check Dulfy’s website?

How about having some NPCs at the events that can be queried for the event mechanics, or even call out the relevant stages and what to prioritize on? If the info is generally available outside the game, why isn’t it inside as well?

See this makes more sense to me than people insisting everyone should leave the game to look stuff up.

Agreed with Azaghal. I’ve always been pointing out how much this game lacks tooltip and in-game information about things.

On topic: My first times doing new events, I read the chat but that’s all. I want it to be something new and don’t want to spoil it by looking information about it. Do I die, mess up or ruin the event because of it? No, I’ve been playing this game for too long to know where to look at. It simply means that I missed the achievements on the first try. After I am done with the event, I search up and hunt the achievement.

I’ve commanded SW breach and Vinewrath and one thing I always think about and take it as personal responsibility is to be a real commander when I tag up and give proper explanation, hints, encouragements, shout for help, or ask a few players to leave if too crowded under my pin but somewhere else is not. If one is tagged up, isn’t to display the tag colors, it is to lead, command, but leave the rudeness, sarcasm and snarky remarks for yourself only.

It is a cooperative event, if one wants to succeed, take the matter on your hand and help simply by providing fight mechanics and feedback. The expectation that everyone knows what to do is a gamble that not always works in ones favor. It can be tiring? Yes no doubt. However, want to be tagged up for hours running events? Then shake it off and work towards the victory.

Now if players decided to disable say or map chat, to not read, to not focus or to not follow your lead and yet have no clue what to do, then it is hopeless. Can’t expect much out of it.

Off topic:

Let me make an analogy. You go in a dugeon that you did a thousand times before. At one boss ,4 of you stack on a point while the 5th doesn’t, and because of him you all wipe instead of getting an easy kill. Who’s fault was it?

I’d say the fault is of the 4 that was stacked for the boss and yet wiped. Four players who knows what to do, shouldn’t wipe because of one single player unless it is high level fractals or some boss that spits AoE everywhere (CoE). :P

The issue isn’t really that people don’t look at videos. You shouldn’t need to look at them, its simply the average player don’t seem to pose the capability to adapt or learn the encounter by themselves, most people have to be told what to do like sheeps.

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

Well GW2 tactics are quite basic

TACTICS: in sequence:

1 STAY OUT OF THE RED CIRCLES/ AVOID ATTACKS (=stay alive)

… except the thrashers mess with this -_-
Their big aoe poison attack hit outside of the red circle.

So I’m a little confused here. You’ve got a group of players who have taken the time to learn the fight and “bring their A game”. They’re aware that it’s a group event, and that the only way it’s going to succeed is with teamwork. Yet somehow, bringing your ‘A’ game and being knowledgeable about the fight does not include ensuring that the other people participating are informed as well? Which is it. You want to succeed, or you want an excuse when the event fails? You want to succeed, then make sure everyone’s on the same page.

I also think the comments about lazy players wanting to be carried through the event and then complaining after it failed are forgetting that the complaints the OP mentioned immediately followed those very players being blamed for the failure. There’s a difference between whining and defending yourself.

You want to talk common sense? Fine. First of all, there’s nothing common about common sense. No two people have the same definition of it, so stop trying to hide behind it. Secondly, you can’t find the time to explain mechanics in a fight, yet you expect other players to magically find the time to look up the fight tactics themselves? I’m confused. Have you discovered some magical way of making time flow differently for yourself? Thirdly, how’s this for “common sense”. If this is the first time I’ve taken part in the event and I haven’t had to look up tactics for events in the past, why would I expect I should need to now? Especially if no one has mentioned that I should be aware of the tactics in the first place. I wouldn’t get much game time in if I stopped at every event and checked the wiki.

I generally hate to agree with people shouting over map chat, but belittling new or inexperienced players is a pretty solid way of legitimizing the claim that there’s a bad community.

Vayne.8563:

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Um . . . Vayne. He’s playing a MMO on the Internet. That excuse isn’t going to fly.

Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing. SOme people still reach for a phone book because they don’t realize you can get the white pages. He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet. He didn’t have to open a browser to play this game which he likely bought in a brick and mortar store.

Intolerance is intolerance, no matter how you slice it.

A bit off topic.

I think you are confusing the internet with the world wide web(www).
Mmos are 100% played on the internet. Unless there is an mmo played on a wan, lan etc, you are playing a game using the internet.
Takes you online sounds like another way to say connects you to the internet.
You don’t have to open up an internet browser to be connected to the internet.

If breach fails I generally won’t stay for vinewrath…its not a good sign.

I find a lot of people refuse to listen frankly. I’m usually the only one popping bubbles at husk. I’m usually one of the few people protecting ammo in vw, building siege, or using said siege.

Even tho I type instructions the entire time.

Ew this whole thread.

I only look at the wikki when I don’t want to spend time on trial and error.
1) Blaming others for an event fail is silly. You could have played better, brought/made a good guild, or spammed advice before the fight.
2) Don’t expect explanations
3) Don’t expect people to dropped everything they are doing to res you. It is always a gift.
4) Don’t expect people to wp.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

You misunderstand.

Those people want those of us, with experience and knowledge, to carry them through the event..

I think you misunderstand players that just do not want to play the way you want.

Greetings.

Fernling.1729:

Vayne.8563:

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Um . . . Vayne. He’s playing a MMO on the Internet. That excuse isn’t going to fly.

Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing. SOme people still reach for a phone book because they don’t realize you can get the white pages. He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet. He didn’t have to open a browser to play this game which he likely bought in a brick and mortar store.

Intolerance is intolerance, no matter how you slice it.

A bit off topic.

I think you are confusing the internet with the world wide web(www).
Mmos are 100% played on the internet. Unless there is an mmo played on a wan, lan etc, you are playing a game using the internet.
Takes you online sounds like another way to say connects you to the internet.
You don’t have to open up an internet browser to be connected to the internet.

I’m not really confusing anything, thanks. I’m talking about this from the point of view of someone who just installs the game and never opens a web browser. What I’m saying is quite simple.

It doesn’t matter if one is called the web and one is called the Internet. To the person INVOLVED, they’re just playing a game. They don’t realize they’re on the net or not on the net.

And it’s not off topic when you look at the original point of reference. This thread is about the common sense of the matter, but what’s common sense to each individual is formed from their personal experience. Someone who is more familiar with the web or the internet or both might well think I should look this up.

People who grew up not doing that can still play computer games. But it doesn’t mean they’re even aware that sites are dedicated to those games, or that people should be reading them.

It’s dead on topic.

I meant my post was going off topic.

“Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing.”
“He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet.”
Is what I’m mostly referring to. You are literally using the internet to connect to the game and to continue playing the game. I completely agree with all of your other points though. I just wanted to point out that these parts are 100% false.
I have a history of Cisco networking, so just being nitpicky.

Fernling.1729:

I meant my post was going off topic.

“Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing.”
“He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet.”
Is what I’m mostly referring to. You are literally using the internet to connect to the game and to continue playing the game. I completely agree with all of your other points though. I just wanted to point out that these parts are 100% false.
I have a history of Cisco networking, so just being nitpicky.

You’re still missing the point. I’m not saying he’s not in the Internet, I’m saying from his point of view, he’s just playing a game. The Internet doesn’t enter his mind. That should be inferred from the rest of what I wrote.

My sister plays Facebook games and has no idea she’s playing a game on the Internet. She goes nowhere but Facebook. As far as she knows, Facebook is a separate thing. I had a conversation with her where I explained that Facebook was a single site on the Internet and there were tons of other sites out there, and tons of other games.

Her response was that she heard she could get a virus if she went on the net, which is why she only uses Facebook.

It’s scary but there’s more people around like that than you think.

Some of those people play Guild Wars 2. What would THEIR common sense be? Common sense is all about points of reference. It varies from generation to generation and from location to location.

Vayne.8563:

Fernling.1729:

I meant my post was going off topic.

“Playing an MMO takes you online. Using the Internet isn’t the same thing.”
“He’s not even playing an MMO on the Internet. He’s playing an MMO online which isn’t quite the internet.”
Is what I’m mostly referring to. You are literally using the internet to connect to the game and to continue playing the game. I completely agree with all of your other points though. I just wanted to point out that these parts are 100% false.
I have a history of Cisco networking, so just being nitpicky.

You’re still missing the point. I’m not saying he’s not in the Internet, I’m saying from his point of view, he’s just playing a game. The Internet doesn’t enter his mind. That should be inferred from the rest of what I wrote.

My sister plays Facebook games and has no idea she’s playing a game on the Internet. She goes nowhere but Facebook. As far as she knows, Facebook is a separate thing. I had a conversation with her where I explained that Facebook was a single site on the Internet and there were tons of other sites out there, and tons of other games.

Her response was that she heard she could get a virus if she went on the net, which is why she only uses Facebook.

It’s scary but there’s more people around like that than you think.

Some of those people play Guild Wars 2. What would THEIR common sense be? Common sense is all about points of reference. It varies from generation to generation and from location to location.

I understand what you’re saying and agree with everything you said. Im just typing on my phone and leaving out a lot of information.
I agree with everything you were saying about players and the internet when it comes to games. I don’t agree at all with the poster you were replying to.
You can play an mmo or any other online game without having any knowledge of the internet.

I just felt the need to point out that people are using the internet whether they known it or not. I read it as you thought the internet is different from what is being used to connect us to the game etc.
The main reason I was saying I was off topic.

Vayne.8563:

Playing an online game isn’t anywhere near the same as using the Internet, or a search engine, or researching something.1

Very true .. it always baffles me how many people simply are not able to use google
and ask again and again some simply questions and i have to play google for them.

And some people really sit before a computer and ask you how late it is .. no joke.

Zok.4956:

I think you misunderstand players that just do not want to play the way you want.

Keep in mind, the players in the OP’s example screamed, “Why didn’t you tell us?!” after the event failed.

May I ask this question?

Where to you think the players who knew what to do originally learned? Yes, through experience and research.

It doesn’t strike anyone as a tad hypocritical for those players to scream what they did, but demand others look up, learn, and lead them into success? Because they couldn’t or wouldn’t be bothered to do the same for themselves?

Please think about what you guys are saying.

For me the biggest problem with the whole everyone needs to “look it up on Dulfy” thing is that 99% of the content doesn’t require that. Even the new living story with added mechanics walks you through what you’re supposed to do by introducing those mechanics in stages. In almost every case except for a few places, looking up guides on Dulfy or the Wiki would actually take more time and be less productive then just jumping into the content and figuring it out quickly.

Dungeon speed runs were once all that were in the game that needed a guide. Now there are a few more, like Teq, Worm and now Vinewraith, but even with those the vast majority of old and new content is pretty easily understood, especially if what is required is a good knowledge of your own profession and skills. Quite honestly I enjoy encounters much more that rely on my knowledge of my profession rather than encounters relying on my knowledge of where to stand at certain moments.

I think its also important to remember that most players aren’t camped out in the Silverwastes. I know players who spend every waking moment farming that territory and know every encounter like the back of their hand, but there are a lot of players, I’m guessing a majority of players, who only stop into the Silverwastes occasionally when they’re looking for something to do. That’s my experience, I’ve done vinewraith maybe a handful of times. I get bored by repetition easily, which is why I’m a terrible gold farmer. Fortunately when I’ve gone I’ve had a few good commanders who made the event easy, but I can see how bewildering it could be to someone expecting a few more typical visual cues and instructions during an event. I doubt a majority of the game population is even aware of Dulfy.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Zok.4956:

I think you misunderstand players that just do not want to play the way you want.

Keep in mind, the players in the OP’s example screamed, “Why didn’t you tell us?!” after the event failed.

May I ask this question?

Where to you think the players who knew what to do originally learned? Yes, through experience and research.

It doesn’t strike anyone as a tad hypocritical for those players to scream what they did, but demand others look up, learn, and lead them into success? Because they couldn’t or wouldn’t be bothered to do the same for themselves?

Please think about what you guys are saying.

First of all, the OP has an agenda. Maybe one guy said that. It wasn’t the unwashed masses who did. Secondly maybe they said that in reaction to people badmouthing them.

I’ve seen it more than once. Something fails and someone in chat starts talking about noobs and bads. In the end, we have the OP’s biased account of what happened, which you’re taking at face value.

I’ve very rarely seen casuals who don’t know any better going into an event and failing it and then saying why didn’t you tell us. There’s no reason to even say that if someone doesn’t accuse you of something. It makes very little sense.

Frankly, I’m not buying it.

It’s not a question of requirement, but ease. For example, watching a video or guide that tells you exactly where those gold coins are is much easier than randomly searching everywhere.

Granted, if you’d rather randomly search, that’s up to the player.

The issue this thread asks is: why didn’t you look it up or ask the players around you?

No one expects anyone to be the Gyro Gearloose of the Internet. And saying someone is unaware of how the Internet works, while playing an MMO, is just not going to cut it in this day and age. No matter how colorful, or sympathetic, you paint it.

The problem is that group of people didn’t even bother to ASK the question.

They expected to be lead, as another poster put it ‘like sheep’, by everyone else in the know. And then pointed fingers when that didn’t happen.

Again, all they had to do was ask. If even that’s too much of a requirement these days, then there’s the OP’s answer right there.

Colorful stories about someone’s ignorance on how the Internet works, again while playing games on it, is a moot and nonsense point.

Ask the question before the event. You’ll get the answer.

Edit:

I’ve very rarely seen casuals who don’t know any better going into an event and failing it and then saying why didn’t you tell us. There’s no reason to even say that if someone doesn’t accuse you of something. It makes very little sense.

Frankly, I’m not buying it.

I’ve seen it. Not recently, mind. About two or three weeks ago, I think. No, it didn’t make sense, as I’ve alluded to with these posts, but it certainly happened.

Failure to get that loot brings out the monster in many.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

It’s not a question of requirement, but ease. For example, watching a video or guide that tells you exactly where those gold coins are is much easier than randomly searching everywhere.

Granted, if you’d rather randomly search, that’s up to the player.

The issue this thread asks is: why didn’t you look it up or ask the players around you?

No one expects anyone to be the Gyro Gearloose of the Internet. And saying someone is unaware of how the Internet works, while playing an MMO, is just not going to cut it in this day and age. No matter how colorful, or sympathetic, you paint it.

The problem is that group of people didn’t even bother to ASK the question.

They expected to be lead, as another poster put it ‘like sheep’, by everyone else in the know. And then pointed fingers when that didn’t happen.

Again, all they had to do was ask. If even that’s too much of a requirement these days, then there’s the OP’s answer right there.

Colorful stories about someone’s ignorance on how the Internet works, again while playing games on it, is a moot and nonsense point.

Ask the question before the event. You’ll get the answer.

Edit:

I’ve very rarely seen casuals who don’t know any better going into an event and failing it and then saying why didn’t you tell us. There’s no reason to even say that if someone doesn’t accuse you of something. It makes very little sense.

Frankly, I’m not buying it.

I’ve seen it. Not recently, mind. About two or three weeks ago, I think. No, it didn’t make sense, as I’ve alluded to with these posts, but it certainly happened.

Failure to get that loot brings out the monster in many.

The OP is talking about common sense. I think there’s definitely a lack of common sense here.

Do you know how many people in my guild are over 40 and just didn’t grow up with the net? Do you know how many people in my guild have never played a computer game at all before this?

You just can’t make these sweeping generalations. And it’s not just what I’ve said so far. There are TONS of reasons why people don’t speak up, or even look things up.

Again, the biggest one, though, is that people don’t expect to have to. In all my years of playing playstation games, I never looked anything up. Not once. And a lot of people play console games.

You make this broad based assumption that looking things up is the rule. Based on what? What makes people think they have to do it? Even if some kitten in the zone is yelling at them and telling them to, what makes you think that person’s opinion means ANYTHING. Because it’s just some kid yelling at them in map chat.

And you know, I’ve seen that side of it too. Trying to explain stuff back at the marionette, commanding one of the lanes and if something didn’t go well, a bunch of people would start blaming noobs, rangers, necros, or anything else. No attempt to explain. No attempt to do anything but blame. And then, one of those people says you should go look up the fight on the internet and watch some videos. Well the guy was just busying yelling, why should anyone be open to his suggestions.

Some people play a couple of hours a week. That’s what they have time for. And you think those people are going to go and start researching the game on the computer like it’s some kind of second job? What about people who don’t speak or read English well?

You ask about why not ask in chat. Maybe some people have social phobias. It’s common. Much more common than you think it is, particularly with the tendency of someone in map chat to insult anyone asking questions. I know people who have map chat switched off completely because they feel safer doing so.

You see only your limited perspective but there’s no room in your vision for where anyone else is coming from. You keep talking about in this day and age. Not everyone was brought up in this day and age.

Anet could implement IQ Test upon entering Silverwastes.

Problem solved.

/Flood Control: Please wait 900 seconds between posts!
- It was 300 seconds earlier and now is 900? kitten?

(laugh) I like you Tao.

Oh come on, Vayne. Now they have social phobias? In an MMO? And they’re too afraid to ask in chat? They weren’t afraid to show some lip when the event failed.

Even you have to know you’re stretching now.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

(laugh) I like you Tao.

Oh come on, Vayne. Now they have social phobias? In an MMO? And they’re too afraid to ask in chat? They weren’t afraid to show some lip when the event failed.

Even you have to know you’re stretching now.

At least 3 people in my guild have social phobias. Fact.

I’m going to leave this conversation now, because anything I say at this point would likely get me infracted.

Edit: If you want to look it up yourself, try doing a websearch on social phobia and MMOs at the same time and see what you get. You don’t have to ask here, you can look it up for yourself.

There’s no need to get hot under the collar because we disagree on a topic. Especially on an MMO forum. It’s not personal, just opinion.

That said, keep in mind, we’re not talking about your guild or its members. We’re talking about people who only needed to ask the question and would’ve got their answers.

That’s all.

I still respect you as a poster on these forums. I just disagree with your opinion on this matter. My apologies if you feel I’m taking some personal dig at you and yours.

Honestly, we don’t know each other. So why would I take it personal? You shouldn’t either.

But, all this noted, I’ll grant you that a player not having the desire to look something up, whether unwilling, incapable, or unaware is one thing . . . but to not even have the ability to ask a question, whether in private or chat, is just self-defeating in an event where knowledge and communication is key.

So they don’t know to look up the information, are too afraid to ask, and are shocked it failed?

Again, my apologies, but those people can’t complain then.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Point. But why wouldn’t a player bring their A-game? Wouldn’t it behoove a player to at least look? Heck, there are videos that show how to do such things, step-by-step, with annotations.

I’m not the greatest player in the world, but even I know to look before I leap.

and ruin the chance to learn by experience? Why should some be privileged by playing trough new content themselves and others have to watch spoilers before they do the content?

Thank goodness that a lot of content is instanced or less toxic than silverwastes. For example yesterday me and 4 others from our guild finished aetherblade path in Twilight Arbour for the first time. We didn’t once look up the mechanics. Because it was fun to figure it out.

The first time I ever entered Silverwastes and Dry Top I treated it like an adventure. Like I’m playing for the first time. Heck I still haven’t explored those zones to full or gotten every achievement. But it’s fun. It’s fun because I don’t know the content.

That’s not the issue, Mirta. The issue is that players complained the event failed because someone didn’t tell them how to do it. And those players didn’t ask.

I’m not saying go into every zone with full knowledge of how it works. Hardly. But I am saying, if you participate in a raid that has a specific mechanic, it behooves you to know what you’re doing.

I don’t think that’s too much to ask if you want success.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

There’s no need to get hot under the collar because we disagree on a topic. Especially on an MMO forum. It’s not personal, just opinion.

That said, keep in mind, we’re not talking about your guild or its members. We’re talking about people who only needed to ask the question and would’ve got their answers.

That’s all.

I still respect you as a poster on these forums. I just disagree with your opinion on this matter. My apologies if you feel I’m taking some personal dig at you and yours.

Honestly, we don’t know each other. So why would I take it personal? You shouldn’t either.

But, all this noted, I’ll grant you that a player not having the desire to look something up, whether unwilling, incapable, or unaware is one thing . . . but to not even have the ability to ask a question, whether in private or chat, is just self-defeating in an event where knowledge and communication is key.

So they don’t know to look up the information, are too afraid to ask, and are shocked it failed?

Again, my apologies, but those people can’t complain then.

I can guarantee you the people who complain the most are the people who think they know the fight, not the people who don’t know. I’ve seen too much evidence of it to believe anything else.

Also you can get annoyed at something without taking it personally, just as people get annoyed when they fail events due to people not knowing what to do. It’s obviously not personal. No one didn’t look it up on line with the intention of inconveniencing you personally or probably anyone.

People get annoyed by all sorts of things that aren’t personal.

But I think you’d be surprised by the number of people who play MMOs that have social issues in general. I can guarantee you the percentage is higher than you think.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

That’s not the issue, Mirta. The issue is that players complained the event failed because someone didn’t tell them how to do it. And those players didn’t ask.

I’m not saying go into every zone with full knowledge of how it works. Hardly. But I am saying, if you participate in a raid that has a specific mechanic, it behooves you to know what you’re doing.

I don’t think that’s too much to ask if you want success.

from the first post it seems like knowledgeable players attacked first and others retaliated.

For someone who keeps saying stop making sweeping generalizations, you sure do that a lot yourself.

This:

I’m going to leave this conversation now, because anything I say at this point would likely get me infracted.

tells me you’re taking it way too personal.

Your recent postings tell me as much as well. Like you feel the need to defend your guild. As if I pointed out those members or something.

Again, I don’t know you or them.

Now, please, let us return to the topic at hand.

Mirta.5029:

from the first post it seems like knowledgeable players attacked first and others retaliated.

And this was the response:

“why didn’t you explain us what to do! oh you’re so pro! this is a bad community!”, and things degenerated from there.

Therein lies the topic’s question.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Therein lies the topic’s question.

when the sentence thrown at you is ““omfg we lost cause no one was killing the ads and we all got pushed!”, what do you think people will respond with except with “we didn’t know and you haven’t explained it to us”?

I’ve seen similar behavior in Brisban recently. Lots of low levels were trying to do the spider queen and one guy kept on swearing at them in the map chat, I told people to block the guy, arrived there, explained how we should prioritize cocoons and we did it.

These kind of guys are always in events and while they’re 1 in 1000 normally boy do they ruin my mood. Is it really that hard for people to be adult about such things?

Oh I’m not excusing that behavior. I find it despicable. But to use the excuse that was used after is kind of telling too.

That’s all.

Page post fix again.