Guild Wars 2

This is such a great post, I agree.

@Loumy
Thank you

Couldn’t agree more. I think ANet has a lot of work to do on their communication – this whole ascended gear thing just highlights it. I think they could have prevented a lot of PR damage by being more clear and explaining the system in depth in their first post they made about it. They tend to be very minimalistic when it comes to the information they give out and I think it ends up really hurting them. It feels like everything is coated in a thick layer of PR slime which sort of confounds the message they’re trying to get across.

greg.3792:

Maybe you can communicate the problem with power creep.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

The problem is, that we do not know what the final product will be. There is no way to really for sure tell us what the stats will be, so all we are doing is guessing. We have no idea what the ascended armor will do, or what they can change in these days.

They did communicate. You have a problem reading between the lines.

This game is now a carrot chase, they only worded it in such a way as an attempt to appease the ppl who are not interested in a vertical gear grind.

No thanks, if I wanted a vertical gear grind I would play WOW. They are no WOW, and never will be. They will never be able to compete against them, and all this will do is drive off more players.

I agree, it’s time for Area Net to be totally transparent as to where their taking the game and reaffirm the “WHY” they made Guild Wars 2.

This was the game to escape things like gear progression and grind and make these things optional pursuits for epic skins.

The endgame was supposed to be the game itself that would usher in a new era of cooperative MMO game play. With dynamic events that spontaneously brought players together in an open world that players would push their influence on and the world would push back.

Combined with a removal of barriers that prevented players from grouping with friends, removing the things in MMO’s that stood in the way of this like the trinity and adding mechanics to make zones you leveled past rewarding and challenging as well as fixing age old MMO social problems of kill stilling and node jacking.

Was all this not enough? Has there been a paradigm shift in the core ideology behind the game?

How does this NEW gear model for end game fit with the “WHY” this game was made that we were sold on. Does the game need a carrot chasing endgame? Has Arena Net given up on the ideology of a barrier free MMO that allows all players to play together regardless of gear or level?

So if the “WHY” hasn’t changed in the eyes of Arena Net then I would really like to know the bits that are missing because it’s just not adding up.

I think the fact that I was sold on the ideology (on the WHY) of this game and this new endgame seems to flip off the core ideology of the game is the reason I’m so pissed off about it.

So I’d really like to get some feedback from Arean Net just how far astray they plan to go before I invest any more time in a game that I adopted as the MMO that was going to carve its own path and allow it’s players to play the game any way they like and still be able to find a path to the greatest achievements the game has to offer.

I feel they’re handling this uproar quite clumsy. Instead of being honest and transparent, all critique is moved to a “trash can” sorry merged thread, and official statements are very vague without any details or thoughts of the consequences for game play.
<shrugs>

+1 OP: This is an amazing post. It is very well thought-out, formatted and delivered. I like the test server idea. I actually agree with most of your points. Even if I didn’t agree with your views, I could still tell that you put a lot of work into supporting them.

^^^^What? Your eyes can’t see, you didn’t see the stats on the new gear. You did not understand the implications of the new gear on how it would become an exclusionary wall to game content for ppl who don’t have it?

They reason they are silent is because they want to see if they made a big mistake and are trying to access the situation. They are like bad swimmers trying to keep up with big brother crossing the lake and are becoming exhausted before the half way point.

Its simple, will they lose more if they do or if they don’t. IMO, they will lose far more if they do. Why? WOW is a better pve game, no debate there. Its probably a better pvp game atm IMO because scs are better that GW2s WVW. Why? Because in WOW you are not instagibbed by any class in pvp.

Behave accordingly and vote with your wallet.

Godorn.2931:

^^^^What? Your eyes can’t see, you didn’t see the stats on the new gear. You did not understand the implications of the new gear on how it would become an exclusionary wall to game content for ppl who don’t have it?

They reason they are silent is because they want to see if they made a big mistake and are trying to access the situation. They are like bad swimmers trying to keep up with big brother crossing the lake and are becoming exhausted before the half way point.

Its simple, will they lose more if they do or if they don’t. IMO, they will lose far more if they do. Why? WOW is a better pve game, no debate there. Its probably a better pvp game atm IMO because scs are better that GW2s WVW. Why? Because in WOW you are not instagibbed by any class in pvp.

Behave accordingly and vote with your wallet.

Thanks for the tip, just bought 50$ in gems

Godorn.2931:

^^^^What? Your eyes can’t see, you didn’t see the stats on the new gear. You did not understand the implications of the new gear on how it would become an exclusionary wall to game content for ppl who don’t have it?

They reason they are silent is because they want to see if they made a big mistake and are trying to access the situation. They are like bad swimmers trying to keep up with big brother crossing the lake and are becoming exhausted before the half way point.

Its simple, will they lose more if they do or if they don’t. IMO, they will lose far more if they do. Why? WOW is a better pve game, no debate there. Its probably a better pvp game atm IMO because scs are better that GW2s WVW. Why? Because in WOW you are not instagibbed by any class in pvp.

Behave accordingly and vote with your wallet.

You cannot really vote with your wallet if you already bought the game. Also “better” is subjective, its not fact. I personally do not like WoW at all, so the pve cant be the best for everyone right? Also I did open my eyes, I see that descended is better, but I need actual data, as in I need to see how it does live. Is it super rare? Is it actually worth it? Is there a limit to how much you can get? Do the stats matter that much? Yes its better but how much does that count? I need to experience the in game before I can make a judgement. Right now I don’t like the idea, but maybe my view will change when I see it live? Don’t make statements when it doesn’t exist live yet.

Anet can learn a thing or two (or a lot, actually) from Riot in terms of dev communication with their player base.

“You cannot really vote with your wallet if you already bought the game. "

Sure you can. Don’t buy gems. This entire exercise is because we don’t have to pay a sub. It would not surprise me after this entire fiasco of them lying about no vertical gear progression, that whenever it suited them they would make any change no matter how radical if it benefited their bottom line.

Well done to the OP for a great post, I only hope the powers that be read, understand, and act upon it.
Arena Net would do well to learn from this and similar mistake that CCP made with its player base. CCP turned it around, so can Arena Net.

I strongly agree with OP. It’s both insulting and disappointing that ArenaNet was so transparent and open when they were developing the game, communicating with their fans even before official forums existed, and all of that changed the moment the game launched.

Nowadays, patch notes go up sometimes hours after a new build (or, in this latest case, they haven’t even bothered at all and merely tweeted that they “fixed some bugs”), and usually ArenaNet employees indulge in casual, inconsequential conversation, rather than openly discussing hotly debated issues with their community. Martin Kerstein’s affinity for patronising posts and tweets should also be put to a stop.

I do appreciate the occasional well-written posts (Chris Whiteside’s post on Ascended gear allayed some of my fears, none of which were addressed in the blog post), but they’re few and far between. One week into the game’s launch, we were promised a clean and informative method of relaying patch notes; it made sense back then, what with the pressure of launch, but it’s been two and a half months.

Any other qualms I have with ArenaNet’s policies have already been mentioned in the first post. I sincerely hope ArenaNet considers changing their etiquette, rather than dismissing this critique with a, “oh, those silly entitled MMO gamers!”

I agree with OP too. We definitely need more communication between Anet and the player base.

I’ve played other games that used a Test Server model to perform pre-release testing on proposed changes (usually paired with special threads in the official forums) and, almost universally, noticed a dramatic decrease in after-the-fact nerfing as well as an overall increase in quality of the final changes. By actually publishing the release candidates for use in a closed environment by actual players, then inviting feedback, it seems that many of the “unintended consequences” experienced in the test phase are eliminated. As an example, I’ve been following some pretty extensive Dev discussions between people working on Starcraft, and the level of player fine-tuning they do is AMAZING, which leads to the final code being pretty much bulletproof (and balanced, for you folks fretting over PvP issues) on actual release day. Plus, this method avoids the losing game of “announce planned changes in a low-information, teaser-style Red post → watch forums go bat-kitten crazy as users speculate wildly about what the vague statements really MEAN → threads spiral out of control as speculation mounts on top of speculation, leading to wildly uninformed expectations → reap the whirlwind of ranting, angry posts on release day as users begin to discover flaws, cracks, and unintended mechanics and exploits → leading to a downward spiral of satisfaction for those players who may have actually been somewhat satisfied with the pre-change systems.”

Just my $.02 after almost 3 decades of game and software product development…

This is my dearest with for GW2, because hey, it’s already free lol.

A public test server would be fantastic.

I really, really wish posters on this forums would stop posting threads that include something along with the lines of “most people hold the same viewpoint as me…”

Ursan.7846:

I really, really wish posters on this forums would stop posting threads that include something along with the lines of “most people hold the same viewpoint as me…”

Never! All will follow my supreme rule as overlord of all! Submit to my ideals or be incinerated!

I think a public test server would be a great idea. More communication – or just any communication for some things would be a great idea.

I’ve got to say that there are a few specific ANet employees who go above and beyond – one of the developers, Jeff, and Gaile in the Account issues forums have been amazing. The others, not so much.

arrownin.3128:

“Communicate unto the other person that which you would want him to communicate unto you if your positions were reversed.”
— Aaron Goldman

This is a strong quote that rings sound within the Guild Wars 2 player base. Not the forums, not the PvPers, not the PvEers, not the hard-cores, not the casuals, but all. Communication between developers and players is needed in any game that takes dedication, time, and effort; in other words we need to know what is going on so we do not feel like we are in the dark whilst spending hundreds of hours in game. The secrecy and SURPRISE! feel that patches give are not examples of good communication.

• I feel most of us would prefer to know the specifics before the patch goes live.
• I feel most of us would probably like stats and technical information on patches.
• I defiantly feel most of us wouldn’t mind spoiling a bit of content by having test servers to ensure content is not buggy.
• I know ArenaNet wants to develop the best mmorpg of all time. I’m sure all of us wouldn’t mind if that happened.
• I feel the ascended gear update is an example of miscommunication, combined with fear of retracting on their promises of no gear treadmills.
• I feel most of us would like content to be enriched rather than expanded.

I really like these points above.
Timely information on patches, with technical details (patch notes).
I also wish devs would show us in more detail their thoughts on future content. Like a developer diary or manifesto (here on the forums) – which players can discuss and give feedback to.
So we don’t get another “surprise” situation with a lot pf players feeling confused.

IB4L but I agree

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/19873-level-cap-increase-in-expansions/

Additional information that needs to also be communicated. Does this 2011 information still hold true? If it does why then was it never communicated before the release of the game and contradictory information provided? What is the projected time frame for these expansions? Will Legendaries continue to be bumped up as BiS if the level cap increases and with it gear increase? How then will Anet combat their current stance of “Our goal is not to create a gear treadmill.” if the level ceiling will increase, i.e. how is Anet going to make it so that we don’t feel that gear treadmill?

All of this is currently very important to know. It’s a shame that this information only appeared recently instead of in the months before release to prevent this forum’s explosion.

You guys think things are bad now? What until they release the patch notes.

There must be A LOT of pressure coming from the higher ups for all these changes to be made so soon.

Well said, OP. AN have really dropped the ball on communicating to the player, especially since launch.

The very idea flies in the face of their own design tenants, especially the “Respect the player” claim. Then again, there seems to be a lot of that going around AN lately…

Also an idea would be for developers to have an Question and Answers post maybe every month or something . Where they address popular questions by the community.
Also it gives a sense of authenticity to see the people behind the game a bit more.

Godorn.2931:

^^^^What? Your eyes can’t see, you didn’t see the stats on the new gear. You did not understand the implications of the new gear on how it would become an exclusionary wall to game content for ppl who don’t have it?

They reason they are silent is because they want to see if they made a big mistake and are trying to access the situation. They are like bad swimmers trying to keep up with big brother crossing the lake and are becoming exhausted before the half way point.

Its simple, will they lose more if they do or if they don’t. IMO, they will lose far more if they do. Why? WOW is a better pve game, no debate there. Its probably a better pvp game atm IMO because scs are better that GW2s WVW. Why? Because in WOW you are not instagibbed by any class in pvp.

Behave accordingly and vote with your wallet.

Same with SWtoR. Anet really dropped the ball on balance. Seriously. Go into any pug and 75% of the players are instagibb speced thieves.