Guild Wars 2

Hello everyone,

I’ve joined all the beta events, and been playing the game since the 25th of august. Played all the 6 professions out of 8.

So, you have to play with the same 5 skills, from lv1 to the rest of the game, and there is nothing you can do to strengthen your character, skills-wise. Traits don’t make a difference, since they are not skills, so please don’t tell me about it.

I’ll try to be positive, because I believe ArenaNet will be updating the game and changing stuff. I’ll just add things I dislike about the skills sytem, so please “Change with wisdom, but change.”

#You have to use the same 5 skills for the rest of the game, and you can’t even “level” them up. (And think of an Engineer that can only use two type of weapons)

#GW2 can be the only game that an end-game player uses the same skills as a lv1 player. I know you guys wanted to be unique, but this much of difference makes the game un-playable, and boring.

#It is ridiculous that a Ranger has to use greatswords, or a Mesmer “needs” to use dual-swords, or even a Guardian with a Staff, or an Elementalist with dual daggers, seriously? I’d be a Thief if I was going to use daggers to be effective in the game. Why would a Ranger use greatswords to be effective in PvE? Why do longbows suck so much?

Again, I know you guys wanted the game to be unique, but this is too much. And it is not wise to force a player to use an unreal weapon for their profession to be effective at what they do in the game.

Finally, I do not like the skills system, so does many others. Even if not as a player but a custumer, I hope you’ll look into this sometime soon. Because nobody is going to keep on playing the game even for a year. The game gets boring.

Thank you.

Your points are a bit lacking.

Ive read arguments against the skill system a lot more elaborated and they actually made sense.

Complaining about mesmers and rangers using greatswords? Not so much.

Edit : (rest of the post got eaten).

Using a “bad” analogy, would you keep using a longbow against an opponent right in front of you?( Legolas excluded).

Would a mesmer pass up the opportunity to magically use a greatsword?

All the weapons complement each other, all have strenghts and weaknesses.

You have lots of skills to use, more than in gw1 for a start. Stop limiting yourself to a playstyle and explore other concepts

1. You don’t have the same 5 skills. you have about 6 set of skills, you can even change between 2 of them in battle.

2. Engineers have fewer sets because their skills are like new weapons, with whole new sets.

3. You ask for new levels of the same skills. Well, your skills will do more damage as you level and gear up, so it’s the same.

4. Whats the problem about a ranger or a mesmer using swords? just the stereotype you have in your head. A ranger is just a class. You can play him as a ranged class or as a melee class, or both togeather. And it works.

First you ask for more skill options, and then you complain about more playstyle options…

OP, you realize that you complained about a “lack” of abilities (which I would disagree with since different weapon combos give different skills sets, and the “`” key adds in a chance to switch those on the go) and then complain about the abilities for some classes to use non-traditional weapons?

So you want there to be more options, but you want them to get rid of options?

so you are complaining that fantasy game cliches do not apply here. Congratulations.

Duh

I’m a first-pve-then-pvp kind of player. And okay, 6 skills.
It’s not going to keep you ingame for the rest of the time with the same animations and whatever.

Secondly, you guys missed my point about a profession needing to use ‘’non-traditional’’ weapons. A ranger does better with a greatsword than with a longbow. An elementalist does better with dual-daggers than a staff or something.

This way you could give a staff to a Thief and it would be perfect. Not really.

Vakirauta.6397:

Duh

I’m a first-pve-then-pvp kind of player. And okay, 6 skills.
It’s not going to keep you ingame for the rest of the time with the same animations and whatever.

Secondly, you guys missed my point about a profession needing to use ‘’non-traditional’’ weapons. A ranger does better with a greatsword than with a longbow. An elementalist does better with dual-daggers than a staff or something.

This way you could give a staff to a Thief and it would be perfect. Not really.

You dont have 6 skills. You have at least 14 unique skills per combat engagement. 18 overall.

If your an elementalist or engy it only goes up accordingly to play style.

As for the second #, your the one missing the point i think.

No weapon is superior to other, theyre all situational. If you feel longbow is a little weak, thats fine. But dont go turning only that small point into something else that just isnt there

yes the majority of your skills is very limited, it works ok for pvp, but for pve its complete garbage

you do the same thing at 80 that you do at lvl 7, weapon swap in general pve does almost nothing for you but give you another set of cooldowns to rotate, your heal skill and elite skill are pretty much limited so you have 3(!) actual skills to sorta change how you play. you can kitten around with your weapon sets, but the fact is every one of them play the same throughout the game. traits offer nice boosts but also dont change how you fundamentally play

and you know, its not completely the combat and skill system’s fault, as in spvp the skill and trait setups really work to define a character and playstyle, just pve in general doesnt offer consistent challenge or require you to use your skills to the fullest (dungeon mobs are another story – overtuned for your skills). ex. ranger shortbow #3 has a back jump which also acts as an evade, 98% of the time in pve theres no reason at all to save this for any sort of timing maneuver, however in pvp it can be used to many things such as retreating or as a free evade

in short, the limited skill system fails for long term pve because it was designed for balanced match-type “builds” between similar opponents, dragged out to 100+ hours it gets really stale, and pve enemies in general dont test the skill system to its limits

jiverooster.7134:

yes the majority of your skills is very limited, it works ok for pvp, but for pve its complete garbage

you do the same thing at 80 that you do at lvl 7, weapon swap in general pve does almost nothing for you but give you another set of cooldowns to rotate, your heal skill and elite skill are pretty much limited so you have 3(!) actual skills to sorta change how you play. you can kitten around with your weapon sets, but the fact is every one of them play the same throughout the game. traits offer nice boosts but also dont change how you fundamentally play

and you know, its not completely the combat and skill system’s fault, as in spvp the skill and trait setups really work to define a character and playstyle, just pve in general doesnt offer consistent challenge or require you to use your skills to the fullest (dungeon mobs are another story – overtuned for your skills). ex. ranger shortbow #3 has a back jump which also acts as an evade, 98% of the time in pve theres no reason at all to save this for any sort of timing maneuver, however in pvp it can be used to many things such as retreating or as a free evade

in short, the limited skill system fails for long term pve because it was designed for balanced match-type “builds” between similar opponents, dragged out to 100+ hours it gets really stale, and pve enemies in general dont test the skill system to its limits

Or, you can reserve a bag to hold the weapons your class is able to use?

Im a mesmer, i normally use staff+greatsword, but i always carry around a torch, a focus, a pistol and two swords.

Why ? Because i can adapt that way and try different things.
Thats 21 skills only with weapons ( if im not mistaken). Plus 3 swappable skills and a swappable elite.
Plus 4 shatter skills.

Yeah. I dont understand why people fail to see that and only want to limit themselves and blame the game

jiverooster.7134:

Or, you can reserve a bag to hold the weapons your class is able to use?

I thought everybody did this… From level 1, on each class, I always keep all weapon combinations on my bag. I thought everybody would do the same…

i am a ranger and i find this offensive …i frikin love greatswords

..i think the diversity is in others ..you are never meant to play alone and even if you use the same 1 skill among others will seem pretty unique by they’r perspective

A “ranger” was made into a longbow wielding dude by years of fantasy cliches, he is originally someone who is in charge of keeping order in a set district of land and combines judical and executional power. Daggers are traditionally crafts of “real life” magicians. And now? And a ranger in GW2 does not better with a greatsword, obviously you have not understood yet that the game does not encourage you to stick with one role, but to use your whole arsenal according to situation. You are complaining this is not lord of the rings with some effeminate elf roaming melee battles with a longbow… well, yes, you are right about that.

If there are any skill tree fans out there, let’s be realistic now. When there is a skill tree, you just go on google and type “best <class name> build”

Valkyrie.2678:

If there are any skill tree fans out there, let’s be realistic now. When there is a skill tree, you just go on google and type “best <class name> build”

Any person who types that in is already riddled with failure. There is no “best” there’s “best for situation A, B, C, D, ETC” This game is as complex or as simple as YOU the player want to make it. Can I run around with a Greatsword as a Ranger 1-80? I sure can! may not be optimal, but I can. However, if I really want to utilize my profession and my abilities to their full potential I swap out, I’ll read my abilities, my traits and my skills.

So, if the game seems too simple to you. If it seems like there’s just not enough meat to it, you have only yourself to blame.

Damion.7584:

Any person who types that in is already riddled with failure. There is no “best” there’s “best for situation A, B, C, D, ETC” This game is as complex or as simple as YOU the player want to make it. Can I run around with a Greatsword as a Ranger 1-80? I sure can! may not be optimal, but I can. However, if I really want to utilize my profession and my abilities to their full potential I swap out, I’ll read my abilities, my traits and my skills.

So, if the game seems too simple to you. If it seems like there’s just not enough meat to it, you have only yourself to blame.

I don’t understand why you’re flaming but I’ve done enough spec crafting on Diablo 2. Path of Exile has a huge skill tree like an ocean, you might quit GW2 and play PoE if you wish.

You know what I was saying is right. When there is skill tree, everyone asks Google for the best build. There is never variety of builds in a game that has skill tree. If you claim that there is, you’re just wrong and not realistic, either you’ve never played a game that has skill tree.

Valkyrie.2678:

If there are any skill tree fans out there, let’s be realistic now. When there is a skill tree, you just go on google and type “best <class name> build”

The fun in skill trees is coming up with a build for yourself that is both effective AND mechanically interesting. The same can be said for skill trees as far as “google the best build.” The system doesn’t matter, there will always be players who are too lazy to come up with anything on their own. Whether it’s traits or skill trees it doesn’t matter.

jiverooster.7134:

yes the majority of your skills is very limited, it works ok for pvp, but for pve its complete garbage

you do the same thing at 80 that you do at lvl 7, weapon swap in general pve does almost nothing for you but give you another set of cooldowns to rotate, your heal skill and elite skill are pretty much limited so you have 3(!) actual skills to sorta change how you play. you can kitten around with your weapon sets, but the fact is every one of them play the same throughout the game. traits offer nice boosts but also dont change how you fundamentally play

and you know, its not completely the combat and skill system’s fault, as in spvp the skill and trait setups really work to define a character and playstyle, just pve in general doesnt offer consistent challenge or require you to use your skills to the fullest (dungeon mobs are another story – overtuned for your skills). ex. ranger shortbow #3 has a back jump which also acts as an evade, 98% of the time in pve theres no reason at all to save this for any sort of timing maneuver, however in pvp it can be used to many things such as retreating or as a free evade

in short, the limited skill system fails for long term pve because it was designed for balanced match-type “builds” between similar opponents, dragged out to 100+ hours it gets really stale, and pve enemies in general dont test the skill system to its limits

I would absolutely disagree. Maybe you are just a better pve player than I am, or you play another class, but I absolutely have to use my skills and time them properly in pve. I have to switch between weapon sets and use all my skills (and dodge) in combat.

I would also disagree that the playstyle is very limited. I am playing a Mesmer and since I turned 60, a lot of new playstyles opened up for me simply because of the trait system. There is so many different ways in which you can trait the mesmer, and all needs different weapons and tactics in combat and is suitable for different situations.

Draehl.2681:

The fun in skill trees is coming up with a build for yourself that is both effective AND mechanically interesting. The same can be said for skill trees as far as “google the best build.” The system doesn’t matter, there will always be players who are too lazy to come up with anything on their own. Whether it’s traits or skill trees it doesn’t matter.

You can still have a build of your own, thanks to slot skills and trait system. Now tell me you didn’t search for GW2 builds on the net.

In addition, runes and sigils are creating differences between builds a lot. While there are features like traits, slot skills, sigils and runes, if you’re complaining about lack of ability to make a build of your own, it is just your problem. (that you is not personally you, I’m talking in general)

I admit that it’s not really helpful to compare this game to other games, but as a prot warrior in WoW, I was pretty much mashing the same 5 buttons from 1-70 in that too. There’s nothing new about GW2’s system beyond being a bit more transparent. You’ll also note that there’s a total lack of any skills that are just ‘do damage’, every skill either has some special effect or is in an AoE.

I certainly wouldn’t call what I do with my skills ‘managing cooldowns’. For example, with ranger shortbow:
Pressing 2 for poison all the time is a given, I’ll grant you that.
Pressing 3 is useless if I just spam it whenever available. It’s much more useful if I use it to evade an enemy, especially a tough melee enemy.
I can press 4 just for the extra pet bleeds, but I can also use it to cripple incoming (or fleeing) enemies instead of just wasting it for the damage (especially important in dungeons and PvP).
I press 5 when I need to interrupt an enemy, pressing it every time it’s off cooldown is pointless because then it’s wasted.

Yes, I might be using those 5 skills throughout the game (if I really love shortbow) but I’m using them intelligently, instead of rolling my face along the keyboard because the right time to use all my skills is as soon as they’re off cooldown. I’m not saying that WoW involves no skill, I’m just saying that GW2 requires you to be at least as involved in your skill timing, if not more so.

Valkyrie.2678:

You can still have a build of your own, thanks to slot skills and trait system. Now tell me you didn’t search for GW2 builds on the net.

In addition, runes and sigils are creating differences between builds a lot. While there are features like traits, slot skills, sigils and runes, if you’re complaining about lack of ability to make a build of your own, it is just your problem. (that you is not personally you, I’m talking in general)

I didn’t search for GW2 builds on the net. People who do this are missing the whole point of a customizable skill system. And I think you are overestimating the number of people who feel the need to do this. There is a definite creative element to coming up with a build that is fun and works well for you. Sure, there’s plenty of kids who have little interest in the gameplay mechanics and just want to win for a pathetic ego boost, but again I think you overestimate them as a proportion of the population.

I’d wager there are more completely clueless players with terrible builds than there are those who Googled builds to steal from other players.

I used to think like OP on this subject. I did try the first beta and that’s when I said : this game is not for me, so I didn’t even bother about the other beta’s..

I did give the game a shot during the pre-launch and made myself learn all my skillsets on all different combo’s and that’s when I noticed how wrong I was with my pre-conceived ideas.

It is true, however that you will be using mostly the same skills / weapons when you’re leveling, but if you’re a bit creative, you’ll find better combo’s for different situations..

My 2 cents

Valkyrie.2678:

If there are any skill tree fans out there, let’s be realistic now. When there is a skill tree, you just go on google and type “best <class name> build”

I don’t do that, but thanks for speaking for me.
That seems to be a running theme on these forums.

- You can not be more wrong about Traits, Mixing Utility skills with Traits is the most important thing if you want to be good in PVP, WvWvW and PVE.

- Engineers only being able to use 2 different weapon types is indeed an issue.

- Saying something is unplayable and boring is a matter of opinion, not fact.

-Professions have the ability to use whatever kind of weapon they want to so when you face a Warrior i battle, you never know what type of a weapon he will be coming with, you just have to be prepared, giving options to gamers is important, they are giving it here, if you dislike it, thats on you, dont blame Arenanet.

-Longbows suck? How is that relevant to anything you just said? Saying a weapon “sucks” first of all shows that youre about 10 years of age and have never played an MMORPG before and “hate” on weapons without really trying to understand how it works. Saying anything “sucks” is childish and uncalled for.

PS. I have a Human Ranger, Main weapon Longbow, If it sucks so much why cant a thief beat me in a 1v1 in pvp? Why am I solid at killing every mob I find without it even scratching me, If Traits dont matter, why do my Spirits follow me?

I do feel that a valid point can be made that there is less specialization of builds in GW2, and therefore less variety. For example a trap ranger. If you wanted to trap in GW1, you could fill your whole bar with skills that all synergized with trapping. However since no weapon has any trap skills, you’re limited to only 3 utility slots (until they make a trap elite). It kind of locks you into weapon combat, which could be good or bad depending on how you look at it.

I think there will be less creative builds because of this because you can’t really focus your entire bar on one goal.

ErkiB.8375:

-Saying a weapon “sucks” first of all shows that youre about 10 years of age and have never played an MMORPG before and “hate” on weapons without really trying to understand how it works. Saying anything “sucks” is childish and uncalled for.

Out of the topic; I’ll answer to that since I see this kind of posts everywhere on this site

I’m twenty-one years old and even my grandpa uses that word and he’s the best person I’ve ever knew about. And please, I just said that weapon was almost nerfed and useless, there’s no hate message in my first post, mind you. You know, as long as you don’t go raging like ’’OMFGFAKDISGAMEFAKDISFAKDAT’’ it’s just rude of you to talk about somebody else’s age. It’s not your business my friend, it’s not like our little friends are not allowed to live or something, haha. gg

These kinds of posts are always amusing.

1. You have way more than 5 skills. Learn to use your weapon swapping and mix up different weapons for different situations

2. Engineers only have 2 weapons because they have several kits which give them an entire new set of skills (just like having multiple weapons does for other classes)

3. Learn to customize with your Utility skills and create multiple combos. Dont just look at the base stats / effects of the skills itself. Consider its secondary effects like creating fields for performing combos. Combining these effects properly can make a weapon you thought sucked become much more useful when you learn how to combo properly.

4. Traits make a massive difference in your build & customization without the need to do things like “level up your skills”. For example as a Warrior I can spec into a high crit & rifle build which gives me things like: piercing rifle shots, 20% faster cooldowns on rifle skills, adding bleed to crits, 10% increased damage to bleeders, 50% longer bleeds, immobilize on cripple (which with rifle is every 10 seconds), and various other bonuses.