Concerns regarding the new core systems

Concerns regarding the new core systems

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Posted by: puffintoast.6501

puffintoast.6501

First a brief disclaimer and introduction of sorts: I have played GW since the day of it’s release here in Australia oh so long ago, totally immersed in the game’s systems and lore. I spent many years, like alot of people when GW2 was announced, following every nuance of it’s evolution, waiting with quiet agony for the first beta weekends, etc. I love this franchise like no other in the PC domain, and have a seemingly bottomless capacity for any and all developments in the game, both the good and the bad.
I have also followed this forum, and the developer frequented Reddit, for quite some time, and I am very aware of the perceptions of the functions and approaches in relation to both realms.
It is not remotely my intent to pointlessly stir up malcontent, but simply to enquire, particularly in light of the most recent alterations to the game in the form of the ‘NPE’, and especially the reworking of the trait system to it’s current state, as to the apparent lack of concern being voiced by the community since the revelations recently that Nexon’s monetisation manager was in the lead developmental position now for the new core gameplay features.
Before the commercial release of GW2, when it was announced that Nexon had purchased their way into the game, many of us, after the dire saga that was Maple Story and it’s ilk, were horrified at what would become of the game once Nexon had a foothold in design decisions in relation to GW2.
Monetisation in terms of gameplay intrusion is a monumental matter, and of concern to many, and it’s effects have been both felt and endlessly debated in a multitude of ways, from core system changes (such as dyes) once Nexon had their employees in developmental positions in ArenaNet, to the post-release loot open-world loot reduction fiasco (some of you might remember the storms here on the official forums around this topic, and ArenaNet’s response), through to issues like the scrapping of the initial trait system in favour of this current version.
It is with a particularly suspicious and cynical (in light of the nature of the company now involved in the development of the game) eye that I view this latest evolution of the game.
The reworking of the trait system to it’s current (widely abhorred) state could be seen to be as something of a trial run for future development, as a means to gauge both existing player acceptance of the gem store having a role in accessibility of core game features, and to test the degree to which new players in particular would willingly convert currency to in-game gold to simply purchase in-game features that they could no longer reaslistically acquire through their own, more limited in-game means.
Due to the oft-stated awkwardness of the trait accomplishments and unlocks, is it simply a coincidence that these seemingly deliberately difficult changes were offset by the introduction of a simple (highly priced) monetary purchase to alleviate the difficulty for new players?
To sum up: does it seem to anyone else that the current trait system was a testing ground for a monetary exchange for previous core gameplay features, being slanted in particular to new players? Does it then follow that the designers of such a system would then step up their efforts (and internal positions), to further refine and implement a new, more far-reaching system? Are we in for another iteration of the current trait system, albeit a retooled and redressed implementation? What will become of the current trait system, now that it has served it’s experimental purpose?
Regardless of the origin of the current trait system, the revelation that Nexon’s monetisation manager has spearheaded one of the most widely advertised features of the expansion to come, indeed a system that is touted as the basis for all future development of the game, has me, once again, deeply troubled.
The necessity of funding in development and the drive of profit has been debated to death in the past by myself and many, many others on the official forums, yet it’s role in the core systems of the game has never been more relevant.
The original game that many of us cherish so dearly still starkly stands against what GW2 has become in a multitude of ways, but in relation to this topic, the financial model that ArenaNet employed to both thrive, and continue the development of the game, has been circumvented by an investor, and quite unquestionably one with an origin that could not be in more stark opposition to the core tenets that set GW apart from the crowd.
I would very much like to hear other opinions on this recent announcement in regards to Nexon’s employees new degrees of control over the development of GW2.

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Posted by: naiasonod.9265

naiasonod.9265

Argh…paragraph breaks, man. Paragraph breaks are your friend.

One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.

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Posted by: Randulf.7614

Randulf.7614

I think they put in a trait system which had some connections to how skill points worked in GW1. It backfired, largely because they had an easier and more fluid system in place. If the new trait system was from launch, no one would have batted an eyelid since they wouldn’t have experienced the better version we already have.

Was it an experiment? No. Was a sign of gem store unlocks for core system? pretty confident no again. Is this guided by Nexon and greed? No idea, but I’m pretty certain we chalk the whole matter up to a complete miscalculation. Same with the NPE and that was based on actual research with (i believe the stated figure was over 10k test players).

They made well intentioned changes to areas that perhaps weren’t in need of them. Simple as that as far as I could see.

(apologies if I missed the crux of your post, but I had to skim read since you broke the golden rule of forum posts – never write an unbroken wall of text – many can’t read clearly off PC screens)

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Posted by: Linken.6345

Linken.6345


Regardless of the origin of the current trait system, the revelation that Nexon’s monetisation manager has spearheaded one of the most widely advertised features of the expansion to come, indeed a system that is touted as the basis for all future development of the game, has me, once again, deeply troubled.*

So what is this new core system you talk about all i read was npe/new trait system….. the trait system aint new anymore.
Then if they wanted people to spend money to buy gems maybe they should talk away the gold to gem conversion aswell if they are as greedy as you seem to think they are.
Edit
If your talking about mastery system then that has taken its inspiration from WvWvW leveling system and you cant buy those levels so i cant see how nexon would have anything to do with that.

(edited by Linken.6345)

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Posted by: Vert.5041

Vert.5041

Argh…paragraph breaks, man. Paragraph breaks are your friend.

I’d like to re echo this. If you hope to get more people to read that wall of text I’d strongly suggest you organize your post more and add a small TL:DR section.

As far as the nexon manager is concerned, it’s irrelevant. Every business side of a game ever will do the minimum required in terms of appeasing the community while squeezing the most money out of them.

The difference is that maplestory is primarily a pve game, and the gear treadmill is virtually endless with the RnG on gear stats, this allowed them to make it so P2W. In the more pvp/wvw oriented GW2 literally the only thing that evil nexon exec can charge you for is some convenience items and skins. Right now through average casual play time you can have your character max level and geared to exotics in a month. If you can get to endgame within a month what can they possibly cage you for?

About the trait system, it’s unclear to me how charging a measly 3g is in anyway leading to a more P2W GW2…more so when you consider the traits can be achieved by doing events anyway.

(edited by Vert.5041)

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Posted by: darkace.8925

darkace.8925

Regardless of the origin of the current trait system, the revelation that Nexon’s monetisation manager has spearheaded one of the most widely advertised features of the expansion to come, indeed a system that is touted as the basis for all future development of the game, has me, once again, deeply troubled.

Wait, what? Where did this come from? If she (I won’t use her name, as I don’t want to give the appearance that I’m “calling out” an ArenaNet employee) has her hand on the Masteries system (that’s what I presume you’re talking about) then I am very much concerned for the future of the game. I’m talking “DEFCON 1” concerned.

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Posted by: zenleto.6179

zenleto.6179

Regardless of the origin of the current trait system, the revelation that Nexon’s monetisation manager has spearheaded one of the most widely advertised features of the expansion to come, indeed a system that is touted as the basis for all future development of the game, has me, once again, deeply troubled.

Wait, what? Where did this come from? If she (I won’t use her name, as I don’t want to give the appearance that I’m “calling out” an ArenaNet employee) has her hand on the Masteries system (that’s what I presume you’re talking about) then I am very much concerned for the future of the game. I’m talking “DEFCON 1” concerned.

Its not a secret, even I’ve heard this. I thought it might have been in the IGN interview but I was able to have a quick look (I’m at work) and it wasn’t in that.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say we won’t be required to pay real money (or gem convert) for the Masteries.

edit: it is in the IGN interview.

Fire up the Hyperbowl ma, we’re going to town!

Would you like some hard cheeze with your sad whine?

(edited by zenleto.6179)

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Posted by: Sube Dai.8496

Sube Dai.8496

Suggesting that anet changed the trait system to drive gem store revenue is ridiculous…

Not only are the traits free from events, they are rediculously cheap as well.

John Snowman [GLTY]
Space Marine Z [GLTY]

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Posted by: naiasonod.9265

naiasonod.9265

Suggesting that anet changed the trait system to drive gem store revenue is ridiculous…

Not only are the traits free from events, they are rediculously cheap as well.

Do you perhaps suppose businesses do not do things for the purpose of making money? From my point of view, its a rather cunning way to encourage people to buy just $10 worth of gems and convert them to gold. One little hit. Its so cheap its practically free – see how easy it is? Here, have this little nudge to need more gold than you’re likely going to have when new to the game and leveling.

Nobody’s pointing at gem to gold conversion, but ‘lo, the magical light at the end of a tunnel of breaks! For just $10 you can buy some gems and instantly convert them to gold! More gold than you’ll ever need to unlock traits!

And may the become! The crowd goes wild, cheering all around!

Or, y’know, you can go do all this stuff. S’ok. No pressure bro, no pressure. No guarantees that you’ll be able to…y’know…actually do it all. But hey, its out there, go get it. No biggie. But it’ll take way more than $10 of your time. Just sayin’ homeslice, 800 gems, ten measly dollars, badabing, badaboom, you’re in the magic.

It’ll be here any time you want a hit, bro. You might be cool doing all that stuff on one character, and hey, that’s great. We want you to have some fun. What’s life without a little fun, right bro?

But y’know…come character three…or four… …or five…you might start reconsidering.

Still, no pressure, my man. $10, 800 gems, boom – yours right here, right now.

See you soon.

One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.

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Posted by: XgoroX.6920

XgoroX.6920

After reading you post, you have clear arguments of whats going on. I would agree with you fully other then this. the game does need money going in to survive. that part is all well and good.

But for the fact of the trait system and the major story line up dates. I am 100% agreed with you that they had a AMAZING system in place…. so why then did they change it? they changed it so that people couldn’t abuse the systems any more. such as BLC key farming. and the trait system, i think is not to bad the way it is. The way it is now for more personal growth in your character. That part is great.

What they did do is, rush into the changes. Missing a good amount of details. Such as the order of the story lines, and missing the missions that changed due to your personal choices at prior missions or Story line junctures. Those issues are really what is wrong. And they need to be addressed, and mended. Because lose of the story within a MMO, or any type of game, will kill it faster then a P2W kind of system.

As for Nexon’s involvement of the game, it might be good for the future of the game. giving the players something if they choose to put a little more money in, that’s there choice. The fact that putting money into the game doesn’t effect the core system as in, leveling, stats on gear, and the power of your character. Makes GW2 a non-P2W kind of game. The only thing it does do is, make getting the gear a little easier. That’s all.

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Posted by: Cyanchiv.2583

Cyanchiv.2583

Just to add on to what other people have stated….

I recall a post made by a dev stating one of the reasons for the change in the trait system was that many players were confused by it. The dev explained having seen players in scenarios like constantly putting 4 points in one slot, 3 in another, and finally 2 in the last one, and not actually receive major traits, just several stat boosts.

I guess the teams that made the decision to change the trait system decided a new system would be preferable to finding ways for players to figure it out.

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Posted by: Linken.6345

Linken.6345

but you can still bl key farm they made it faster to level up to 15 they give you new lvl 20 scrolls every year and 1lvl up tomes every now and then for just login in + more if you do dailys.
You can even save up tier 1 mats and luck to craft up some exp on your key farmers aswell

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Posted by: naiasonod.9265

naiasonod.9265

Just to add on to what other people have stated….

I recall a post made by a dev stating one of the reasons for the change in the trait system was that many players were confused by it. The dev explained having seen players in scenarios like constantly putting 4 points in one slot, 3 in another, and finally 2 in the last one, and not actually receive major traits, just several stat boosts.

I guess the teams that made the decision to change the trait system decided a new system would be preferable to finding ways for players to figure it out.

I don’t mind the reduction of total trait points overall. That seemed a smart move to me, making each point a definitive and purposeful expenditure rather than an increment towards something. Condensing it all by the factor of 5 that they went for was a good move.

I’ll give them that.

One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

I really don’t get people. When Crystin Cox left Nexon, she left Nexon. She was no longer working for Nexon. Nexon doesn’t have a hold, or input into this game, or at least there is zero evidence that is the case.

People go from company to company all the time. I’m not sure why someone going from one company to another means that that company has input. Hell, Guild Wars 1 was found by people who came from Blizzard. Does Blizzard have input in Guild Wars 1?

The only fact we have to deal with is that Nexon purchased 15% of NcSoft. It means they have some influence on who ends up on the board of directors as part of a block of votes. That’s ALL the influence they have.

We don’t know how much influence NcSoft has over Arenanet even. It’s true they own Arenanet, but that doesn’t mean they automatically choose to exert influence.

So we don’t know that NcSoft is that influential in Guild Wars 2’s design and Nexon, only owning 15% of NCSoft’s stock probably has no say at all.

/conspiracy theory

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Posted by: Inculpatus cedo.9234

Inculpatus cedo.9234

I have to wonder at this conspiracy theory about former employees (years before) being moles or spies or whatever in the companies they later work for. Sounds a bit far-fetched to me.

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Posted by: Yargesh.4965

Yargesh.4965

I have to wonder at this conspiracy theory about former employees (years before) being moles or spies or whatever in the companies they later work for. Sounds a bit far-fetched to me.

Yes