Ppl in WvW run -60% condition duration since the first months in… (-40% conditition duration on self and -20 from hoelbrak or melandru or antitoxin or whatever more)
I do not think much will change at least not for PvE and WvW. I cannt judge PvE, It’s my guess condittions will have grown stronger there
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
plenty of classes have condition cures, I think there’s a field/finisher combo or two which can do the trick, and try building vitality instead of toughness.
Just most are not used to it. Go out in Zerker without much condi clean… Fight a condi build and cry. I had such fights and players seemd to ignore the bleeding stacking, till they realized their life is low .. Then its to late and the are bolted down. Not by condi ….
plenty of classes have condition cures, I think there’s a field/finisher combo or two which can do the trick, and try building vitality instead of toughness.
simple tricks to help survive conditions.
I totally agree with you mate.
People should adapt instead of complaining all the day on the forums regarding conditions.
Meta = Oh no! We have a challenge that’s not a power build wat do!?
Condi = sup?
Meta = Can’t….cleanse….CONDI kitten!
Condi = why you no survival stuff?
Meta = NERF THIS SHIET
Condi = or you could like…learn how to survive with not 100% zerker/assassin stuff iunno.
I play both power (ranger) and condition (engineer, necromancer) builds, and I am really, really pumped for the condi changes. As for all of the power folks complaining… the patch gave me access to so much condi-cleanse on my ranger I could hardly believe it.
Server — Fort Aspenwood
Mains — Mathias of the Wood [Ranger]; Collaborator Bluatt [Engineer]
Alts — Necromancer, Warrior, Elementalist
Well condition do not need a massive nerf for sure but it’s quite obvious that condi like burning must be toned down. A good example of this are elementalist, guards and engineers from my point of view it doesn’t have any sense to give them the possibility to stack so much burning that in few sec you can be kill too much easily.
I’ve tried personally engi guard and ele and their burning damage is too much it’s no sense having tick of burning for 5-6k with 3 ticks any character is basically dead.
On the other hand bleed for example need to be buff a little bit compared with burning.
I hope that Anet will do a better job at balancing direct damage and condition, probably the best way to do it it’s make toughness reducing condi damage…
I like PvE for the most part, an so don’t mind having overpowered builds ^^
That said, I feel that either a common point is getting overlooked or is being misrepresented.
5-6K burning is high – especially if you have 3 stacks of it. How long does it take people to get up to those 3 stacks though? Just want to check – as 3 stacks is a fairly small looking number.
I remember people used to claim that power builds could do up to 12k dps. Thats still lower then the claimed 15-18 per tick burning, but only if there isn’t prep time involved in putting up those dots. So how many seconds does it take to stack 3 5-6K burnings – so one can work out how many seconds pass before the total dot damage would overtake the straight damage?
I wonder how necros feel about this change since they were supposed to be the greatest condi class in the game.
I think you’re mistaking necros for engies. They were always superior and only losing a direct confrontation because of their inherent weakness against condies users and necros ability to transfer everything back to poor engies.
So how many seconds does it take to stack 5-6K burnings – so one can work out how many seconds pass before the total dot damage would overtake the straight damage?
For Eng/Ele/Guard, typically just over 3 seconds right now with the proper rotation/cooldowns up/target not evading/blocking/etc.
IMO, if 3s Resistance Boon was added into Utilities the same way as Stun Break was added to every utility skill type, then this wouldn’t be an issue in PvP/WvW. There would be counter-play.
So, what I am getting from this forum about condition damage is mostly this:
Pve condi damage is still mostly underwhelming (unless it’s burning, man that’s cray)
PVP/wvw condi damage is over the top strong
All the mobs in PVE die too fast due to increase in power to all players
My idea is to increase the vit stat of all mobs by a percentage (trial and error), so they die more slowly. But ALSO increase the toughness stat for all the mobs by a percentage (they can do that, look at the husks).
This way you can balance how fast they die (vit) and how condi damage is scaling to power(toughness). Maybe they can even apply that to players as well! (separate sliders then mobs) or have a separate formule for the effect of vit and toughness for mobs and players. and adjust those formulas. Maybe do this for other stats as well and increase power for some mobs so they require more tanky builds.
This way they can just focus fully on PVP/WVW balance and when they notice pve has an imbalance or meta that CLEARLY favors condi or power builds, adjust those sliders a little. I don’t know how hard it is to implement though
Discussions and more ideas are very welcome. I hated to see players at eachothers throats because someone was playing another gamemode.
Is condition damage working as intended currently? Becase numbers are very strange.
I’m making something and condition damage looked very od so decided to check whats going on.
This is the result in short. http://i.imgur.com/VKnCUEW.png
I would also add that ingame tooltips don’t even show proper amount of damage conditions deal.
For example if my condition will tick for x seconds+1/2 or 1/4, it will only show damage for first x seconds and leave out 1/2,1/3,1/4…etc (tootlip only so not like it matters.)
I just saw that the bleeding damage formula was changed to
2+(0.025 * Level)+(0.06*Condition Damage)
… keep in mind that pre-patch announcement was → 2+(0.03*Level)+(0.075*Condi Damage)
So, now we are at a state that Bleeding is weaker that it used to be before patch. In particular, pre-patch you need 1200 condi to deal 100dmg per bleed stack. Now, with the same amount of 1200 condi damage you deal 94.
For warrior this change is just bad since bleed duration trait was nerfed (form +50% to +33%) which leads to less overall damage.
Just most are not used to it. Go out in Zerker without much condi clean… Fight a condi build and cry. I had such fights and players seemd to ignore the bleeding stacking, till they realized their life is low .. Then its to late and the are bolted down. Not by condi ….
That’s the issue though. With the changes they have just brought about another imbalance. I am not advocating that condi’s should be nerfed into obscurity, but clearly they need to be adjusted (Anet has already acknowledged that they are overpowered: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Things-we-know/first).
What a kitten meta, the advice so far:
- Pack plenty of condi clear.
– Use condi. reducing food
– Use runes of melandru
So much variety.
Do I even need to care about toughness anymore?
The argument that “well zerker’s dominated previously” is not an argument at all. It’s just petty.
What is best is if all classes are equally viable. The goal should be balance.
Not only for warrior, but for all other builds that use bleed as main condition.
I mentioned Warrior in particular as its not only bleeding dmg reduction that affected this profession but further nerfs in the relevant trait line (Arms).
Post patch the warrior’s ability to apply long lasting bleeds is reduced while damage against bleeding foes was slightly reduced as well.
While the Warrior’s traits(Arms line) and weapon skills(sword & longbow) that has to do with bleeding are either nerfed or strayed the same, the bleeding damage is reduced (something that affects all bleeding condition using professions). If you put all of these in calculation the damage outcome is reduced compared post-patch.
!?