Conditions!
1) Blocks: Blocks also block incoming condition dmg (unless the specific skill is listed as un-blockable), it do however (naturally) not stop already aplyed conditiones on you from doing dmg. Just like a block dont heal you from a direct dmg hit you got before you started blocking, it will not revome dmg from conditions you where hit by before you started blocking.
2) Invulns: same as blocks
3) In the same way as direct dmg is affected by thoughness and protection. Crits are affected by weakness and condition dmg is affected by condition duration reduction and resistance.
4) Chill: Because thats what slow do. chill is a mix between slow and cripple.
All in all you sound like you are having truple with conditions, may I recommend looking your build over and learning where and how to counter conditions.
1) Blocks: Blocks also block incoming condition dmg (unless the specific skill is listed as un-blockable), it do however (naturally) not stop already aplyed conditiones on you from doing dmg. Just like a block dont heal you from a direct dmg hit you got before you started blocking, it will not revome dmg from conditions you where hit by before you started blocking.
2) Invulns: same as blocks
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
From MOBAs to FPS games If you get in a bad spot and turn on your invulnerability skill, it makes you invulnerable for the duration. It’s what we are used to.
In GW2 the reason you used your defensive skill was because you got condi bombed, and so you still die because conditions work in ways players that are new (to GW2 PvP) are not prepared for. I feel it’s one of the major reasons behind the condition backlash of late.
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
If you played GW1, you might realize that this is how conditions have always worked in the series. They ignored most evasion/block skills and persisted through invuln skills. Just look up 55 monk if you’re bored some time. I don’t even have to Google to point out that not all MMOs work the way you insist.
To other points though: conditions are designed (at least in theory) to be a ramp-up style of damage. It would be kind of pointless if you could wipe them perfectly clean with an invuln skill, because ramping up takes much more time and effort than direct skills. As it stands, there are plenty of tools to deal with conditions in PvP, and you need to learn how to use them.
The great god Lagki demands sacrifice.
1) Blocks: Blocks also block incoming condition dmg (unless the specific skill is listed as un-blockable), it do however (naturally) not stop already aplyed conditiones on you from doing dmg. Just like a block dont heal you from a direct dmg hit you got before you started blocking, it will not revome dmg from conditions you where hit by before you started blocking.
2) Invulns: same as blocks
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
From MOBAs to FPS games If you get in a bad spot and turn on your invulnerability skill, it makes you invulnerable for the duration. It’s what we are used to.
In GW2 the reason you used your defensive skill was because you got condi bombed, and so you still die because conditions work in ways players that are new (to GW2 PvP) are not prepared for. I feel it’s one of the major reasons behind the condition backlash of late.
Most of the skills that apply invulnerability say that conditions still affect the character right in the tool tip. If that’s a major reason people are complaining about conditions, they need to learn to look at tool tips.
You have Resistance to counter conditions… resistance is a buff whcih makes you temorary invulnerable to condition ticks…. however… most builds will apply long enough durations to only make you not gain added dmg duraing those ticks, and will tick on when the resistance ends
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Resistance
weakness will nullify the chances of applying conditions on crit, so it will protect via that route (conditions on crit being sigils and trait based) AND will reduce the (small) dmg from condition applying attacks further…
dodges and invulnearbility will make sure you will not get new conditins applied during the period of the attacks while you are dodging or invulnarable.
Oh and condi cleanses , light fields and finishers, condition removal traits and so on.
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
“Invulnerability is an effect that prevents the target from taking damage, receiving conditions, or being affected by control effects. It does not prevent fall damage, or environmental traps. "
Conditions cant be casted in invunerability targets, but stacks aplyed before will continue to tick.
on wiki says it avoid CC… wich is totally lie since ive been interrupted and even KD quite some times while in midle of Renewed focus… wonder if some skills are bugging in some circunstances.
1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.
on wiki says it avoid CC… wich is totally lie since ive been interrupted and even KD quite some times while in midle of Renewed focus… wonder if some skills are bugging in some circunstances.
Likely a lag problem. If a person CC’ed you (on their screen) before you activated renewed focus (on their screen), it’s possible for you to get CC’ed when you think you’re safe.
The great god Lagki demands sacrifice.
Some effects seeming like and being (partial) Invulnerability can be passed by things like signet of might which provide unblockable effects:
Signet of Might:
- Passive: Improves power.
- Active: Your attacks are unblockable.
- Signet of Might: 180 Power
- Unblockable (6s): Your attacks are unblockable
- Duration: 6 seconds
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Might
Unblockable:
Unblockable is a property of attack skills which prevents the attack from being blocked, and in case of ranged attacks, reflected or otherwise destroyed by effects of skills. Unblockable is also an effect, currently only available from Signet of Might, “Nothing Can Save You!”, and Phase Traversal, making attacks for the duration unblockable. Skills that block will be ignored and effects that trigger on blocking will not trigger against unblockable attacks.
Unblockable skills can be evaded by dodging or other effects, aside from the ones that cannot be evaded by any means.
Most skills that only apply conditions or control effects (and are not projectiles) are unblockable.
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
(edited by PaxTheGreatOne.9472)
4) Chill: Because thats what slow do. chill is a mix between slow and cripple.
Chill was in the game for years before slow was even introduced.
Why do conditions do damage through blocks?
Why do conditions do damage through invulnerables?
Why isn’t condition damage affected by weakness?
Why does chill has to be both -66% skill recharge rate and -66% movement rate? when cripple and immobilize already exist.. why can’t chill just be -66% skill recharge rate?
Because anet made this game toxic. And it’s only toxic players that enjoy playing this game.
Forever Against Stacked Servers
Virual [VRUS] Alien Lunatics [StFu] Nocturnal Sxaddx [Nuts] Ft. Aspenwood
That which is dead may eternally lie, but with great aeons even death may die.
Virual [VRUS] Alien Lunatics [StFu] Nocturnal Sxaddx [Nuts] Ft. Aspenwood
That which is dead may eternally lie, but with great aeons even death may die.
You can’t block conditions that are already on you, because they already hit you. I don’t know why people keep bringing that up like it’s some kind of gotcha.
Why do conditions do damage through blocks?
Why do conditions do damage through invulnerables?
Why isn’t condition damage affected by weakness?
Why does chill has to be both -66% skill recharge rate and -66% movement rate? when cripple and immobilize already exist.. why can’t chill just be -66% skill recharge rate?
Condition application is blockable, except in cases of some traited attacks / abilities and some special skills. Pretty much the same as power damage. Its mostly blockable except when traited and some special attacks / circumstances. Now if you are asking why you can’t block some of the actual ticks, my answer would be for same reasons you can’t block half of white damage after it has been applied to you.
Condition damage is affected by weakness, fumble mechanics will make you miss your target. However, there are no “grazing hits” with condi. It either hits and goes off or doesn’t. I suspect this is a technical limitation on A-Nets part, but can’t confirm unless one of the devs jumps in and answers.
Chill has drastically reduced duration over the ones you mentioned. In some cases it may seem like it doesn’t, but it does. It is therefor stronger. Chill is the counter to alacrity and superspeed. Alacrity uptimes can get quite rediculous, in a decnet team comp it is not uncommon to have 66%+ alacrity uptimes, chill is stronger to counter that with its lower duration but stronger effect. The movement reduction is to counter swiftness and superspeed, again via stronger but shorter lasting application. For example if you are traited and build for chill, you’ll have some ability or 2 that will pump out 5 or 6 seconds of it, whereas your swiftness buff will last 15-45 seconds, or in some cases indefinetly until canceled (such as rev herald).
I like the way they did the alacrity balancing on it, but the movement thing could have been done better, though I do understand its difficult due to how easily available swiftness is.
Heavy Deedz – COSA – SF
Why do conditions do damage through blocks?
Why do conditions do damage through invulnerables?
Why isn’t condition damage affected by weakness?
Why does chill has to be both -66% skill recharge rate and -66% movement rate? when cripple and immobilize already exist.. why can’t chill just be -66% skill recharge rate?Because anet made this game toxic. And it’s only toxic players that enjoy playing this game.
You are wrong:
This game just bleeds poison. And the confusion it causes sets the community on fire, But I guess it’s just the weakness of our builds that causes this vulnerability. And I am stunned by the immobilisation of the builds which does give me the chills… You all cripple and torment yourself. Instead of building up some resistance in this game and clean your own game. That could whirl some light into these posts.
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Why do conditions do damage through blocks?
Why do conditions do damage through invulnerables?
For the first one, their don’t. I actually got to try that this morning, you can perfectly clock condition application and the damage is prevented. No condition is ever applied.
Second thing, same. Untested, but if you are invulnerably, the attack is blocked and no condition is ever applied.
I think I know what you mean, and let me ask you this:
If you are hit by a direct damage attack and take 3000 damage, and half a second later you press block, do you expect the damage to be retroactively blocked and re-healed?
You don’t, do you?
Why should it work for conditions then?
You block the attack, preventing all damage. Same as for a direct damage attack, in fact. You don’t block the ongoing damage after the fact much as you don’t block direct damage after it has already been dealt.
The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.
on wiki says it avoid CC… wich is totally lie since ive been interrupted and even KD quite some times while in midle of Renewed focus… wonder if some skills are bugging in some circunstances.
Likely a lag problem. If a person CC’ed you (on their screen) before you activated renewed focus (on their screen), it’s possible for you to get CC’ed when you think you’re safe.
yeah its strange, but it didnt felt like lag, i think theres some mechanics that gets borked up, since it didnt happened just one or two times, there must be some skill that is “overpassing” in some circunstances.
Just like sometimes we could clone ourselves with Wall of refflection as copy guardians, when mesmers used i think it was with a specter skill atackign our WoR.
1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.
on wiki says it avoid CC… wich is totally lie since ive been interrupted and even KD quite some times while in midle of Renewed focus… wonder if some skills are bugging in some circunstances.
Likely a lag problem. If a person CC’ed you (on their screen) before you activated renewed focus (on their screen), it’s possible for you to get CC’ed when you think you’re safe.
yeah its strange, but it didnt felt like lag, i think theres some mechanics that gets borked up, since it didnt happened just one or two times, there must be some skill that is “overpassing” in some circunstances.
Just like sometimes we could clone ourselves with Wall of refflection as copy guardians, when mesmers used i think it was with a specter skill atackign our WoR.
Issues like this can be caused from simple latency differences too. A player with a lower latency than you has the upper hand in most circumstances. Even if you both hit your keys at the exact same instant IRL, their lower latency will cause their action to hit the server and be processed first. This results in some maesive desyncrinization on both ends as well. On your end you may not see their attack until after you defended, but on their end your defense didnt happen until after their attack went all the way through. Unfortunately these situations always work out better for those with lower latency… coincidentally, the same desync issue can benefit high latency players in PvE… atleast as long as they arn’t to high..
Please stop assuming I’m a guy… I am female.
This game just bleeds poison. And the confusion it causes sets the community on fire, But I guess it’s just the weakness of our builds that causes this vulnerability. And I am stunned by the immobilisation of the builds which does give me the chills… You all cripple and torment yourself. Instead of building up some resistance in this game and clean your own game. That could whirl some light into these posts.
Pax wins this one, hands down. Well done. +1
Elrik Noj (Norn Guardian, Kaineng [SIN][Owls])
“Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth.”
“The objective is to win. The goal is to have fun.”
“Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth.”
“The objective is to win. The goal is to have fun.”
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
If you played GW1, you might realize that this is how conditions have always worked in the series. They ignored most evasion/block skills and persisted through invuln skills. Just look up 55 monk if you’re bored some time. I don’t even have to Google to point out that not all MMOs work the way you insist.
To other points though: conditions are designed (at least in theory) to be a ramp-up style of damage. It would be kind of pointless if you could wipe them perfectly clean with an invuln skill, because ramping up takes much more time and effort than direct skills. As it stands, there are plenty of tools to deal with conditions in PvP, and you need to learn how to use them.
I wasn’t saying there was no way to deal with conditions. Simply pointing out that the way conditions work in the guild wars series is not intuitive at all. I honestly cannot think of any other major MMO, or any other game that handles status effects in the same way as GW2.
Its completely understandable why it would be confusing to use an invulnerability skill then die while “invulnerable” for anyone who hasn’t played the guild wars series.
It’s just not something most players are used to. Saying “Git Gud” doesn’t help at all.
(edited by Lokki.1092)
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
If you played GW1, you might realize that this is how conditions have always worked in the series. They ignored most evasion/block skills and persisted through invuln skills. Just look up 55 monk if you’re bored some time. I don’t even have to Google to point out that not all MMOs work the way you insist.
To other points though: conditions are designed (at least in theory) to be a ramp-up style of damage. It would be kind of pointless if you could wipe them perfectly clean with an invuln skill, because ramping up takes much more time and effort than direct skills. As it stands, there are plenty of tools to deal with conditions in PvP, and you need to learn how to use them.
I wasn’t saying there was no way to deal with conditions. Simply pointing out that the way conditions work in the guild wars series is not intuitive at all. I honestly cannot think of any other major MMO, or any other game that handles status effects in the same way as GW2.
Its completely understandable why it would be confusing to use an invulnerability skill then die while “invulnerable” for anyone who hasn’t played the guild wars series.
It’s just not something most players are used to. Saying “Git Gud” doesn’t help at all.
And thats good why be like everyone else?
A wake up call to read up on how it works then I guess.
Invulnerability not working against existing condition, I can agree that’s a bit unintuitive, but it’s clearly written.
Being able to Block existing conditions (as is possible in some other games) feels really strange. Once you’re bleeding, your shield isn’t going to stop it.
What game mode were we talking about?
Because cleansing or dealing with condis is really easy with any profession on every game mode with the exception of WvW
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
If you played GW1, you might realize that this is how conditions have always worked in the series. They ignored most evasion/block skills and persisted through invuln skills. Just look up 55 monk if you’re bored some time. I don’t even have to Google to point out that not all MMOs work the way you insist.
To other points though: conditions are designed (at least in theory) to be a ramp-up style of damage. It would be kind of pointless if you could wipe them perfectly clean with an invuln skill, because ramping up takes much more time and effort than direct skills. As it stands, there are plenty of tools to deal with conditions in PvP, and you need to learn how to use them.
I wasn’t saying there was no way to deal with conditions. Simply pointing out that the way conditions work in the guild wars series is not intuitive at all. I honestly cannot think of any other major MMO, or any other game that handles status effects in the same way as GW2.
Its completely understandable why it would be confusing to use an invulnerability skill then die while “invulnerable” for anyone who hasn’t played the guild wars series.
It’s just not something most players are used to. Saying “Git Gud” doesn’t help at all.
And thats good why be like everyone else?
A wake up call to read up on how it works then I guess.
There are good reasons to play like familiar games, and good reasons to be original. That is a different conversation entirely.
But here is an example of what I’m taking about.
Renewed focus says: “Meditation. Focus, making yourself invulnerable and recharging your virtues.”
Mistform says: “Cantrip. Morph into an invulnerable, vaporous mist for a brief time.”
The word invulnerable already has a meaning in English so most people wouldn’t look up what it means, but even if you do look it up the official wiki says this.
“Invulnerability is an effect that prevents the target from taking damage, receiving conditions, or being affected by control effects. It does not prevent fall damage, or environmental traps.”
Which flat out does not address previous conditions at all. In fact it reads like previous conditions would deal no damage, and have no control over the character during the invulnerability. Which is what one would expect from a skill claiming to give invulnerability. Of course if we dig deeper it is possible to find the information, obviously many of us already know it but a simple tool tip in game, or renaming the effect to “heroism” or something, would go a long way to removing the confusion to new(er) players. Especially in WvW where condition spam is very common.
I believe things like this are why people feel condition damage is so OP. “They damage you if you move, they damage you if you stand still, they damage you when you attack, They damage you when you are invulnerable.” They sound insane on paper, and falling into the current WvW meta a player may be overwhelmed. A few in game tips could help that along a lot.
No it clearly says your preventing new conditions to hit you not retractivly countering condtions already on you.
As someone stated above do you expect the invulnerability to negate the hit you took just before pressing said button?
Edit
Yes I agree game should do a better jobb explaining that hey condition removal skills are usefull they are actualy here for a reason and use combo finishers in light fields.
Anet should put this info in the game somewhere. Because this is just plain not how conditions work in every other MMO. It runs counter to what most people assume coming from any other game.
If you played GW1, you might realize that this is how conditions have always worked in the series. They ignored most evasion/block skills and persisted through invuln skills. Just look up 55 monk if you’re bored some time. I don’t even have to Google to point out that not all MMOs work the way you insist.
To other points though: conditions are designed (at least in theory) to be a ramp-up style of damage. It would be kind of pointless if you could wipe them perfectly clean with an invuln skill, because ramping up takes much more time and effort than direct skills. As it stands, there are plenty of tools to deal with conditions in PvP, and you need to learn how to use them.
I wasn’t saying there was no way to deal with conditions. Simply pointing out that the way conditions work in the guild wars series is not intuitive at all. I honestly cannot think of any other major MMO, or any other game that handles status effects in the same way as GW2.
Most other MMOs don’t have downed-state either. You hit 0 health and you’re dead, generally. So, if you were bad at defending/healing yourself, you still have a chance to come back into the fight.
The thing is, the conditions were already on you when you hit the invuln skill. I’m not sure why this seems unintuitive. If I’m bleeding from a bullet wound and I put on a bulletproof vest, it’s not like the bleeding will just go away (as amazing as that might be).
Its completely understandable why it would be confusing to use an invulnerability skill then die while “invulnerable” for anyone who hasn’t played the guild wars series.
It’s just not something most players are used to. Saying “Git Gud” doesn’t help at all.
I have this thing I call “learning.” The first time I went down while using Renewed Focus, I realized it was conditions that did it. I didn’t make the same mistake again. If you’re telling me that it is hard to learn… well, I’m not sure what to say.
The great god Lagki demands sacrifice.
The thing is, the conditions were already on you when you hit the invuln skill. I’m not sure why this seems unintuitive. If I’m bleeding from a bullet wound and I put on a bulletproof vest, it’s not like the bleeding will just go away (as amazing as that might be).
Simple. When you are bleeding from a bullet wound and turn into mist, how are you still bleeding? Does mist have blood? How does it make sense that mist is on fire?
All I can say is this. Invulnerability is not only clearly defined outside of the game…
Merriam Webster
1: incapable of being wounded, injured, or harmed.
2: immune to or proof against attack.
Dictionary.com
1. incapable of being wounded, hurt, or damaged.
2. proof against or immune to attack.
Cambridge Dictionary
impossible to damage or hurt in any way.
Macmillan Dictionary
impossible to defeat, harm, or damage
Vocabulary.com
Something that’s invulnerable is impossible to damage or injure.
But it’s also defined in the game…
GW2 Official Wiki
Invulnerability is an effect that prevents the target from taking damage, receiving conditions, or being affected by control effects. It does not prevent fall damage, or environmental traps.
Cannot take damage except the 2 mentioned types of damage, cannot have conditions applied, and cannot be controlled by any effects. This is flat out not how invulnerability actually works in this game.
How it actually works in game is
Invulnerability is an effect that prevents the target from taking damage, receiving conditions, or being affected by new control effects. It does not prevent condition damage, fall damage, environmental traps, remove conditions, or free the target from existing control effects.
It’s not only unintuitive it’s actually wrong. Again, there is nothing wrong with it as a concept. The problem is if you are going to completely change the way invulnerability works in your game. I feel it should be explained (correctly).
Gw2 wiki is written and edited by players, not Anet and you are free to edit it to make it clearer.
70 ‘mains’ and waiting for more slots
| 61 Asura | 5 Charr | 2 Norn | 1 Human | 1 Sylvari |
| 61 Asura | 5 Charr | 2 Norn | 1 Human | 1 Sylvari |
Oops, I did the thing.