Guild Wars 2

I really enjoy the combat system of GW2. It’s not always about raw damage stats but actually player skills and tactics. At least 1 vs 1 or 2-3. Facing a large group of invaders means death no matter what (outnumbered). Also I like that different professions contribute with unique skills.

For most of the attacks and skills, there exist appropriate counter-attacks or counter-skills. This is what makes the battle interesting and challenging.

However counter-stealth is non-existing in the game! And, honestly I can’t think of any better suited profession than the Ranger to have this skill.

There are many ways this could be achieved:

• it could be a as default for all pets

• it could be by introducing a new pet with “stealth sensing” F2. (Bat with Sonar Ping?)

• it could be by traiting in BM.

• it could be a new ranger skill (“sense of nature” / “feel the disturbance” we are one with nature after all, arent’ we?

The result could be one of many:

• Show stealthed foe like some kind of hologram viewable for all allies.
  Now the revealed foe could be both targetable and hitable (be damaged) or it could only be viewable but not be damaged. So the squishy thieves could have a chance to not be killed, but be traceable.

• Show stealthed foe as a red dot on mini map for all allies in the area.

Either way, I really think stealth needs some kind of counter, and Ranger would be the most appropriate profession.

I think this is a great idea! Tho it should only affect the ranger himself. Otherwise thieves would become total sandbags in wvw and pvp. Introducing a new pet who could reveal stealthed enemies (like skelks and Irukandji) wouldn’t be too unrealistic. The effect could be party-wide in pve and pve only. Also it should only work for 1-2s or like a pulse that lasts for a blink of an eye. It would give the general direction where the thief is and not completely ruin their gameplay. The only problem is the targeting. Would the rangers be able to target and attack thieves when they are in stealth with other than AOE skills?

stealth do need a tweak:

- receiving damage must uncloack whatever is hidden
- at least one class in the game must have a self-buff to see invisible things

I think every class needs a skill to “detect” stealth units. It’s only fair to have stealth and detection.

Agreed, all professions should have something. Maybe one single skill/combined effect* on a long cooldown, but still something. But giving that only to the Ranger would be unfair IMO.
*Like, Rangers using F2, Necros having a chance of breaking stealth when inflicting bleeding, Engies with burning, something like that maybe?
To tie the stealth-breaking feature to a single weapon/utility skill would force players to bring that one permanently in wvw/pvp to counter stealth even if that skill on its own doesn’t add benefit to their build. Also, any damage = uncloak would be a bit excessive, probably, especially if that includes every condition tick.

If all classes had stealth counter, thieves would be kittenting bricks. Also it would give rangers some real meaning. Giving it to necros or engineers is not a bad idea eighter.

I like the idea of a “soft” counter to stealth… I think engineer would be another good candidate. They could have some nifty gadget to accomplish the task… such as the goggles we already have that cause vulnerability.

As far as spreading the ability to see stealthed enemies to the rest of the party… that might be a bit OP.

I don’t have considerable problems with stealth. I have considerable problems with what happens after someone LEAVES stealth

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter? Thats sounds fair. How about we give everybody banish skill that can remove rangers pet for awhile? Or we give every class adrenaline drain ability? I could go on with this…

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter? Thats sounds fair. How about we give everybody banish skill that can remove rangers pet for awhile? Or we give every class adrenaline drain ability? I could go on with this…

You’re describing Guild Wars 1.

- Anti-minion spells for Necromancers.
- Anti-spirit spells for Rangers and Ritualists
- Anti-Adrenaline Hexes for Warriors and later Dervishes.
- Silence skill for Paragons and Warriors.
- Energy-drain spells for . . . just about everyone, really, but mostly Elementalists and Monks.
- Enchantment disruption for Monks.
- Blind for any class relying on hitting in melee.

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter?

What? What “unique abilities” are in this game which aren’t countered by DPS, except for stealth? Even the Mesmer needs stealth to effect escapes while his decoy clones distract enemies.

Stealth is the only “unique ability” in the game.

First, such skills would basically only be usefull on WvW. Or are skelks worth all that traiting/util slots?

Second, as said above, it would be great umbalanced to have all clases able to counter one class “unique mechanic” (yea, engis and mes can also stealth, but you got the point)

With that in mind maybe a option is more in the Wv mechanics and the march update…
Maybe set mortars/catas to shoot gliter dust, an aoe that applies the revealed debuff to everything in the area (a bit like poison from trebs)
Set scout npcs to have a detection radius where they can attack (but not just reveal) stealthed players

Ansultares.1567:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter?

What? What “unique abilities” are in this game which aren’t countered by DPS, except for stealth? Even the Mesmer needs stealth to effect escapes while his decoy clones distract enemies.

Stealth is the only “unique ability” in the game.

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter? Thats sounds fair. How about we give everybody banish skill that can remove rangers pet for awhile? Or we give every class adrenaline drain ability? I could go on with this…

You’re describing Guild Wars 1.

- Anti-minion spells for Necromancers.
- Anti-spirit spells for Rangers and Ritualists
- Anti-Adrenaline Hexes for Warriors and later Dervishes.
- Silence skill for Paragons and Warriors.
- Energy-drain spells for . . . just about everyone, really, but mostly Elementalists and Monks.
- Enchantment disruption for Monks.
- Blind for any class relying on hitting in melee.

Yes and this is gw2. Difference is obvious.

kRiza krimos.1637:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter? Thats sounds fair. How about we give everybody banish skill that can remove rangers pet for awhile? Or we give every class adrenaline drain ability? I could go on with this…

You’re describing Guild Wars 1.

- Anti-minion spells for Necromancers.
- Anti-spirit spells for Rangers and Ritualists
- Anti-Adrenaline Hexes for Warriors and later Dervishes.
- Silence skill for Paragons and Warriors.
- Energy-drain spells for . . . just about everyone, really, but mostly Elementalists and Monks.
- Enchantment disruption for Monks.
- Blind for any class relying on hitting in melee.

Yes and this is gw2. Difference is obvious.

I’ll also note a lot of those skills were highly conditional in use, as in, you really only tapped into most of them for certain outings. And there was the obvious problem with taking one or more of these skills/spells; that the skill wasn’t useful if you happened not to be facing what it countered.

GW2, however, you can change skills so long as you’re not tagged for combat, while GW1 you can only change before you leave town. A bit more flexibility means a skill to counter Stealth even if it did that alone can be slotted in with short notice as opposed to before you go out.

If there was a bundle item? Maybe. A fixed-location revelation weapon? Possibly. Skill? I’d say that’d be overkill.

kRiza krimos.1637:

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Anyone who plays a thief knows AoE is not a counter. When I WvW on my thief, the chance of one guy hitting me enough times with AoE attacks is very small, even if I am crippled or chilled. The only counter to stealth in this game is hard CC (stun/immoblize) followed by immediate burst damage (assuming shadowstep is on cooldown or not equipped), however as a counter it is weak and unbalanced, many builds lack the burst damage, many lack even hard CC or those that do have it, have it on longish cooldowns and it can be broken by shadowstep or dodged (often easily , things like engy netshot)

The thief stealth design in this game is the worst peice of OP garbage I have ever seen (in regard to WvW):

- You can’t be knocked out of stealth by damage.
- You are not prevented from stealthing by damage.
- You have multiple in-combat stealths, in most games you get 1 on a long cooldwon 2/3 mins.
- No class has stealth detection.

When you combine that with how the game plays thief for you, e.g – teleports to target, teleports you out of danger, so even if a player is constantly moving it is very easy for the theif to get right next to them, you have possibly the worst class design ever.

kRiza krimos.1637:

Ansultares.1567:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter?

What? What “unique abilities” are in this game which aren’t countered by DPS, except for stealth? Even the Mesmer needs stealth to effect escapes while his decoy clones distract enemies.

Stealth is the only “unique ability” in the game.

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Actually “steal” is the thiefs unique mechanics… stealth is just a skill he is very heavy in and many of his attacks complement it.

This is an idea many have already suggested and anet just never listens to ranger ideas because im guessing half of them have a theif they all love.

Except when the whole forum complains ofcourse like about shortbows being faster and running faster. Only 2 good updates since release for ranger sadly.

Sylosi.6503:

kRiza krimos.1637:

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Anyone who plays a thief knows AoE is not a counter. When I WvW on my thief, the chance of one guy hitting me enough times with AoE attacks is very small, even if I am crippled or chilled. The only counter to stealth in this game is hard CC (stun/immoblize) and immediate burst damage (assuming shadowstep is on cooldown or not equipped), however as a counter it is weak and unbalanced, many builds lack the burst damage, many lack even hard CC or those that do have it, have it on longish cooldowns and it can be broken by shadowstep or dodged (often easily , things like engy netshot)

The thief stealth design in this game is the worst peice of OP garbage I have ever seen (in regard to WvW):

- You can’t be knocked out of stealth by damage.
- You are not prevented from stealthing by damage.
- You have multiple in-combat stealths, in most games you get 1 on a long cooldwon 2/3 mins.
- No class has stealth detection.

When you combine that with how the game plays thief for you, e.g – teleports to target, teleports you out of danger, so even if a player is constantly moving it is very easy for the theif to get right next to them, you have possibly the worst class design ever.

You are also 1 shot with 12k hp and non-existant damage mitigation.
Stealth lasts for 3 seconds. And it has break that prevents you to re-stealth same second you damage some1 from stealth.
I can think of at least 3 games where you can stealth for minutes or even longer which can be abused in alot worse ways than 3 seconds stealth. Also, take away stealth and what does thief got left?

bluewanders.5297:

kRiza krimos.1637:

Ansultares.1567:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter?

What? What “unique abilities” are in this game which aren’t countered by DPS, except for stealth? Even the Mesmer needs stealth to effect escapes while his decoy clones distract enemies.

Stealth is the only “unique ability” in the game.

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Actually “steal” is the thiefs unique mechanics… stealth is just a skill he is very heavy in and many of his attacks complement it.

Steal, dual skill and stealth are thief class mechanics afaik.

Yes, stealth is OP in many cases, but Anet’s way of dealing with issues is not going for the overkill method, at least they do not want to. As it is now, rangers and rifle warriors are the best counter because of their channeled skills, volley, kill shot and whatever the longbow skill is called. When I play on my thief I hate dueling rangers because they tend to shoot my health down by alot even tho I am stealthed. When playing as a rifle warrior I time my kill shot to instagib them while stealthed. Then after a few seconds they may or may not appear downed somewhere :P

My point is, breaking stealth upon received damage is too much. Stealthing during combat would be quite pointless, unless you had some distance from your target(many times incoming attacks land just after you stealth. This tend to always happen when facing rangers). I play a condition damage thief myself(pistol/dagger), and even with might stacking I find it hard to kill some people, it always take a darn long time. If stealth was nerfed, I would have to reconsider my build and I would fall under the known category of thieves: BS zerker thief.

Instead of nerfing stealth, they could do something with the backstab builds, even tho they already tried to nerf it. As a thief, I have no real counter against them, they kill me before I can even do anything, I can barely damage them. Also, culling is a huge issue here, do not forget that. I must admit I use stealth alot, but without it, I could rather go elementalist and steamroll.

Sylosi.6503:

Anyone who plays a thief knows AoE is not a counter. When I WvW on my thief, the chance of one guy hitting me enough times with AoE attacks is very small, even if I am crippled or chilled. The only counter to stealth in this game is hard CC (stun/immoblize) followed by immediate burst damage (assuming shadowstep is on cooldown or not equipped), however as a counter it is weak and unbalanced, many builds lack the burst damage, many lack even hard CC or those that do have it, have it on longish cooldowns and it can be broken by shadowstep or dodged (often easily , things like engy netshot)

The thief stealth design in this game is the worst peice of OP garbage I have ever seen (in regard to WvW):

- You can’t be knocked out of stealth by damage.
- You are not prevented from stealthing by damage.
- You have multiple in-combat stealths, in most games you get 1 on a long cooldwon 2/3 mins.
- No class has stealth detection.

When you combine that with how the game plays thief for you, e.g – teleports to target, teleports you out of danger, so even if a player is constantly moving it is very easy for the theif to get right next to them, you have possibly the worst class design ever.

Yeah, except Stealth breaks when you attack and you don’t avoid damage when Stealthed so someone who is aware of how to fight a Stealthed opponent (especially a Thief) can still fight back.

Seriously, this comes up quite often about how the Thief is broken due to Stealth and immense spikes of damage but there’s a lot of help out there describing how to take care of this. You can ask Reddit and they’ll provide, and there possibly can be people on this forum who know how if you ask on the “Players helping Players” subforum. You may have to be patient for an answer and sift through the chaff but you can find help.

In WvW I handle someone trying to kill me out of Stealth by trying to avoid the damage as much as I can and looking for somewhere . . . anywhere . . . I can get away. It’s really only a major problem if you’re running alone. You shouldn’t be alone in WvW. Unless you’re a stealthy backstabbing Badge-grubbing lil thief asura.

kRiza krimos.1637:

bluewanders.5297:

kRiza krimos.1637:

Ansultares.1567:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter?

What? What “unique abilities” are in this game which aren’t countered by DPS, except for stealth? Even the Mesmer needs stealth to effect escapes while his decoy clones distract enemies.

Stealth is the only “unique ability” in the game.

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Actually “steal” is the thiefs unique mechanics… stealth is just a skill he is very heavy in and many of his attacks complement it.

Steal, dual skill and stealth are thief class mechanics afaik.

No… stealth isn’t a unique mechanic because other classes have access to it… the steal plus initiative stuff… along with the dual strikes with each weapon set.

bluewanders.5297:

kRiza krimos.1637:

bluewanders.5297:

kRiza krimos.1637:

Ansultares.1567:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter?

What? What “unique abilities” are in this game which aren’t countered by DPS, except for stealth? Even the Mesmer needs stealth to effect escapes while his decoy clones distract enemies.

Stealth is the only “unique ability” in the game.

Yea, and ranger can also stealth, but its thiefs unique mechanic just like attunments are for elementalist. By your words, how stealth isnt countered by DPS if thief can be damaged while in stealth? If that is your logic, then there is already counter to stealth, its called AoE. Channeled skills also continue to damage stealthed enemy…

Actually “steal” is the thiefs unique mechanics… stealth is just a skill he is very heavy in and many of his attacks complement it.

Steal, dual skill and stealth are thief class mechanics afaik.

No… stealth isn’t a unique mechanic because other classes have access to it… the steal plus initiative stuff… along with the dual strikes with each weapon set.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/thief/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/mesmer/

Thats how thief is described and advertized. I didnt included ranger to this since his stealth trait is very situational. Mesmer even tho beeing able to enter stealth, doesnt mean its his class thing.

kRiza krimos.1637:

You are also 1 shot with 12k hp and non-existant damage mitigation.
Stealth lasts for 3 seconds. And it has break that prevents you to re-stealth same second you damage some1 from stealth.
I can think of at least 3 games where you can stealth for minutes or even longer which can be abused in alot worse ways than 3 seconds stealth.

Stealth is not 3 seconds:

- Shadow Refuge gives 10 secs of stealth.
- You get an extra second for 15 pts in shadow arts.
- You can chain stelath skills.
- You can permastealth by hitting enemy structures.
- And then there is culling…

Those games where you stealth for mintues, the stealth mechanic is less OP than in GW2, because you can be broken out of stealth or even prevented from going into stealth by damage, you will get only one in-combat stealth on a long cooldown, in many games there are classes that have either stealth detection (Loremaster in LOTRO) or have consumerables that give stealth detection (Rift).

Which in an open PvP situation like WvW means the GW2 thief can actually escape combat easier than “permastealth” classes in most other games. The only way permastealth is more OP is it makes hanging around to gank people easier, but overall GW2 thieves have the most OP design in any game I’ve played.

In regard to being 1 shot with 12k health, it is irrelevent, the reason so many theives can go total glass cannon is precisely because stealth (with mobility) gives more survivability (and scales better gainst multiple opponents) than any amount of HP/toughness/etc in WvW. (also newsflash a lot of classes/builds can’t one shot for 12k damage and classes with 17k HP can still be instagibbed by the damage theives do, it takes a long time for my condi necro or engy to put out the same damage as my thief does in 2 secs…)

kRiza krimos.1637:

Also, take away stealth and what does thief got left?

I didn’t suggest they take away stealth, the class needs a re-think the way stealth works (in WvW at least) is simply too powerful / skilless / without risk, if they need to imrove other areas of the thief to compensate that is fine, but as I said I wouldn’t worry too much this game is underresourced, so I’ll doubt anything as large as a class redesign will happen anytime soon.

how about a trait that shows a stealthed enemy to all within 600 range radius (or lower) of me or something, so instead of being completely invisible they show up like stealthed allies do (see through but you can see them) but with no name above them? would still be stealthy while giving us a bit of a counter.

Flubble.8093:

how about a trait that shows a stealthed enemy to all within 600 range radius (or lower) of me or something, so instead of being completely invisible they show up like stealthed allies do (see through but you can see them) but with no name above them? would still be stealthy while giving us a bit of a counter.

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if they introduce largos as a race in the future, this could be a trait for them

A trait would be another good choice, I think, if such a thing is added? The question is where should the range be? Most thieves within 600 are already closing for the kill so you might not get a lot of time to react. And then, of course, you might not see them even with the transparent model.

You’d probably only catch the really bad thieves with this. The good thieves will still get people.

Sylosi.6503:

kRiza krimos.1637:

You are also 1 shot with 12k hp and non-existant damage mitigation.
Stealth lasts for 3 seconds. And it has break that prevents you to re-stealth same second you damage some1 from stealth.
I can think of at least 3 games where you can stealth for minutes or even longer which can be abused in alot worse ways than 3 seconds stealth.

Stealth is not 3 seconds:

- Shadow Refuge gives 10 secs of stealth.
- You get an extra second for 15 pts in shadow arts.
- You can chain stelath skills.
- You can permastealth by hitting enemy structures.
- And then there is culling…

Those games where you stealth for mintues, the stealth mechanic is less OP than in GW2, because you can be broken out of stealth or even prevented from going into stealth by damage, you will get only one in-combat stealth on a long cooldown, in many games there are classes that have either stealth detection (Loremaster in LOTRO) or have consumerables that give stealth detection (Rift).

Which in an open PvP situation like WvW means the GW2 thief can actually escape combat easier than “permastealth” classes in most other games. The only way permastealth is more OP is it makes hanging around to gank people easier, but overall GW2 thieves have the most OP design in any game I’ve played.

In regard to being 1 shot with 12k health, it is irrelevent, the reason so many theives can go total glass cannon is precisely because stealth (with mobility) gives more survivability (and scales better gainst multiple opponents) than any anything else in WvW. (also newsflash a lot of classes/builds can’t one shot for 12k damage and classes with 17k HP can still be instagibbed by the damage theives do, it takes a long time for my condi necro or engy to put out the same damage as my thief does in 2 secs…)

kRiza krimos.1637:

Also, take away stealth and what does thief got left?

I didn’t suggest they take away stealth, the class needs a re-think the way stealth works (in WvW at least) is simply too powerful / skilless / without risk, if they need to imrove other areas of the theif to compensate that is fine, but as I said I wouldn’t worry too much this game is underresourced, so I’ll doubt anythign as large as a class redesign will happen anytime soon.

Even if you could chain stealth for an hour, you are not threat while stealthed and doing nothing. Also, isnt thief supposed to be slipery class that is able to get out of hairy situations easier than any other class?
Yes you can get 1 second longer stealth, or 10 seconds stealth but your out of it if you attacks no matter how long you can be stealthed. So in combat 1 hour of stealth means nothing. You also cant go right back in stealth if you attack, another thing making chain stealth usless in combat.
Every1 is buzzing about thief OP stealth, why doesnt nobody mention VERY limited acsess to any kind of boons thief has, and even those he can put up are harshly conditioned and on huge cooldowns…

Flubble.8093:

how about a trait that shows a stealthed enemy to all within 600 range radius (or lower) of me or something, so instead of being completely invisible they show up like stealthed allies do (see through but you can see them) but with no name above them? would still be stealthy while giving us a bit of a counter.

Show Spoiler

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if they introduce largos as a race in the future, this could be a trait or racial skill for them

That would be way way way OP… way OP…

Stealth detection of that sort is way too hard a counter. Hard counters are bad.

It needs to have limitations… first off, permanent passive stealth reveal would by WAY op. It needs to be an actuated skill or consumable…

Permanent passive stealth reveal that gives it to everyone around you would be even more ridiculously op.

So a utility skill for one or more of the utility professions would be great… you slot it in favor of some other tool… you activate it when you need it, it lasts for a limited time and then goes on cooldown.

Or you provide a consumable all classes can purchase… make it soul bound… and have limitations of it’s own… such as an internal cooldown that prevents it from being chained..

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Seriously, this comes up quite often about how the Thief is broken due to Stealth and immense spikes of damage but there’s a lot of help out there describing how to take care of this. You can ask Reddit and they’ll provide, and there possibly can be people on this forum who know how if you ask on the “Players helping Players” subforum. You may have to be patient for an answer and sift through the chaff but you can find help.

In WvW I handle someone trying to kill me out of Stealth by trying to avoid the damage as much as I can and looking for somewhere . . . anywhere . . . I can get away. It’s really only a major problem if you’re running alone. You shouldn’t be alone in WvW. Unless you’re a stealthy backstabbing Badge-grubbing lil thief asura.

It comes up because it is ridiculously OP and breaks a fundamental principle of PvP – risk vs reward, there is far too little risk (at least in WvW) with the way thief class / stealth works.

I know how to handle theives, I have a lvl 80 thief, it is also how I know how OP they are in WvW and that AOE is not a counter (note a group of people AOEing against 1 thief does not consitute a balanced counter), though Ele gives it a run for its money, fo rthe same reason lack of risk vs reward, just a different mechanic, – supreme mobility, can make a bad decision / get outplayed and still get away most of the time without being punished for it.

WoW did this, it lasted all of five minutes.

Some pets should be predisposed to knowing where a stealthed enemy is however the player shouldn’t see it. What they did in some games is a ranger with a pet could turn on aggressive and the pet could attack the area and then the player could do an AOE focused on the pet.

kRiza krimos.1637:

Even if you could chain stealth for an hour, you are not threat while stealthed and doing nothing. Also, isnt thief supposed to be slipery class that is able to get out of hairy situations easier than any other class?
Yes you can get 1 second longer stealth, or 10 seconds stealth but your out of it if you attacks no matter how long you can be stealthed. So in combat 1 hour of stealth means nothing. You also cant go right back in stealth if you attack, another thing making chain stealth usless in combat.
Every1 is buzzing about thief OP stealth, why doesnt nobody mention VERY limited acsess to any kind of boons thief has, and even those he can put up are harshly conditioned and on huge cooldowns…

The permastealth does not mean nothing, because it makes finding a thief in a large keep / garrision absolutely ridiculous and allows them to rez dead mesmers, perhaps Anet intend for their game to include such “fun” gameplay as staring at a dead mesmer until they decide to respawn in case a thief rezzes them, or perhaps the permastealth is just yet another exploit that has failed to of been fixed.

As for the ‘doing nothing’, not at all when I stealth on my thief (depending on the build) I am having conditions cleared, healing up, repositioning to put the other player at a disavantage or escaping (much too easily) or resetting the fight, because I know the poor sod I have targetted has just burnt their 30 sec cooldown and won’t have them up again in 10 secs.

Every1 “is buzzing” about thief OP stealth, becasue it is well very OP (at least in WvW), so I’m not sure why that is a surprise…

Sylosi.6503:

It comes up because it is ridiculously OP and breaks a fundamental principle of PvP – risk vs reward, there is far too little risk (at least in WvW) with the way thief class / stealth works.

I know how to handle theives, I have a lvl 80 thief, it is also how I know how OP they are in WvW and that AOE is not a counter (note a group of people AOEing against 1 thief does not consitute a balanced counter), though Ele gives it a run for its money, fo rthe same reason lack of risk vs reward, just a different mechanic, – supreme mobility, can make a bad decision / get outplayed and still get away most of the time without being punished for it.

Yeah, it comes up a lot and there are a people who play as thieves and who have come up with ways to counter thieves who have actually offered good ideas for how to counter it without changing the game.

I’m going to let them chime in though, I don’t know anything more on the topic and my experience with stealthed thieves has been covered already; I tend to eat the initial damage, dodge/block/evade the rest, and just keep moving because I don’t do 1v1 in WvW. Too often there’s more people around than the one person I can see. (NOT talking about culling, talking about that bursting thief being the one running ahead of a zerg.)

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter? Thats sounds fair. How about we give everybody banish skill that can remove rangers pet for awhile? Or we give every class adrenaline drain ability? I could go on with this…

Guardians have wards. That’s their unique ability. Guess what: Stability.
Oh and let’s not forget blinks and mist forms among other means to escape.
Also not even one of our protecting wards is able to block AOE -field attacks.

Also “banish for ranger pets”? They keep banishing themselves all the time and run after enemies that are so far away that the ranger can’t even see them.

Hicci.8761:

kRiza krimos.1637:

So thief should be only class who’s unique ability should have counter? Thats sounds fair. How about we give everybody banish skill that can remove rangers pet for awhile? Or we give every class adrenaline drain ability? I could go on with this…

Guardians have wards. That’s their unique ability. Guess what: Stability.
Oh and let’s not forget blinks and mist forms among other means to escape.

Also not even one of our protecting wards is able to block AOE -field attacks.

Im not sure what you are trying to say? Stealth is able to block AoE, or not receive dmg while in it?

My point is that other classes have unique abilities that have major weaknesses. Thieves have stealth where your only counter measure is to run around, blast aoe and hope you hit something.

Hicci.8761:

My point is that other classes have unique abilities that have major weaknesses. Thieves have stealth where your only counter measure is to run around, blast aoe and hope you hit something.

Eh, my countermeasure is to drop a spike trap at my feet and then get a head start moving away.

Hicci.8761:

My point is that other classes have unique abilities that have major weaknesses. Thieves have stealth where your only counter measure is to run around, blast aoe and hope you hit something.

Ok so what is major weakness of switching attunments? Or haveing full adrenaline bar and AoE stun every 9 seconds? In fact, i would like to hear all major weaknesses of other class unique abilitys.

CC-ing the thief a good method. Thieves have several stunbreakers, but no good source of stability expect Daggerstorm. But DS isnt a stunbreaker so you can keep him down as long as he has no stunbreakers ready.

Why don’t we have the same mechanic as tf2… when thieves get hit with a condition like burning or poison, u see their silhouette… this way everyone can thief check without making new skills for this…and thieves still keep their stealth mechanic

As a Thief I’m ok with trained beasts “smelling” a stealthed person but it would require a trait (minor or major alike) to be realistic.

It would be both a great balance for stealth skills and a great increase to the usefulness of the Ranger for them to have some trait that could detect stealth with pet, or maybe a skill to detect stealth.

As a thief myself, I’m okay with the OPs suggestion. A ranger’s pet being able to sniff out a stealthed target makes sense, you’d need to trait for it of course.

Every other suggestion after that is plain overkill and would destroy the thief profession. Too many people want stealth to be absolutely useless, which the thief relies on heavily for both offense and defense.

The main issue we all need fixed is culling.