(edited by Fifth.8169)
Daily Achievement Point Rewards and Cap.
The cap was introduced in March 2014. I doubt any players were near the caps when they were put in place.
4 years playing an MMO to cap out on the easiest achievement points is reasonable (I’ve been playing 4+years and I’ve not reached the daily AP cap yet, I think I’m 3-4k off it). There’s many other achievements to obtain to boost your number.
Daily AP/gold reward is not the be all, it’s just a little bonus for playing each day.
Kitten.
Daily used to be set at 10k and was boosted up to 15k recently. Previously you could earn significantly more AP per day due to monthlies and separate daily rewards.
The daily system used to work as you want it to – You had tasks and each task gave AP. The more tasks you do the more AP you gain per day. However, Anet noted that this was very grindy and so they overhauled the system so that players need only complete 3 achievements to receive 10 AP. This means everyone receives the same amount of AP per day for doing dailies.
The idea behind the cap is so that players that have been playing since headstart do not get too far ahead (in terms of AP) of players just starting out. A difference will always be there, but a new player can’t expect to quickly catch up to a veteran.
Daily used to be set at 10k and was boosted up to 15k recently. Previously you could earn significantly more AP per day due to monthlies and separate daily rewards.
The daily system used to work as you want it to – You had tasks and each task gave AP. The more tasks you do the more AP you gain per day. However, Anet noted that this was very grindy and so they overhauled the system so that players need only complete 3 achievements to receive 10 AP. This means everyone receives the same amount of AP per day for doing dailies.
The idea behind the cap is so that players that have been playing since headstart do not get too far ahead (in terms of AP) of players just starting out. A difference will always be there, but a new player can’t expect to quickly catch up to a veteran.
Well as for getting too far ahead, ive seen several players above 25k AP. If the cap is just going to continue rising, its counter-intuitive to the plan ? 15K is alot of points pushed into a single category and only being able to receive 10 points per day is a bit nuts in my opinion.
We already are unable to acquire several historical achievements . I dont like the idea of being locked out of acquiring achievements based on the notion they dont want newer players to catch up/ or keeping achievements exclusive to players that log in on a daily basis. This excludes a very large portion of players and I find it quite discouraging.
Daily used to be set at 10k and was boosted up to 15k recently. Previously you could earn significantly more AP per day due to monthlies and separate daily rewards.
The daily system used to work as you want it to – You had tasks and each task gave AP. The more tasks you do the more AP you gain per day. However, Anet noted that this was very grindy and so they overhauled the system so that players need only complete 3 achievements to receive 10 AP. This means everyone receives the same amount of AP per day for doing dailies.
The idea behind the cap is so that players that have been playing since headstart do not get too far ahead (in terms of AP) of players just starting out. A difference will always be there, but a new player can’t expect to quickly catch up to a veteran.
This isn’t quite how I recall it. I believe the cap has always been a cumulative 15,000 cap between dailies and monthlies. It hasn’t been changed since it’s been introduced.
(edited by Vayne.8563)
Daily used to be set at 10k and was boosted up to 15k recently. Previously you could earn significantly more AP per day due to monthlies and separate daily rewards.
Daily AP and Monthly AP were both capped at 10k and 5k respectively. They were just merged. I’m all for decoupling monthlies and reinstating them without a cap but with a reasonable reward (40AP/mth and a chest of mystic coins.) This would encourage and reward regular play without the neccessity of logging in everyday, which was probably the reasoning behind the daily cap.
The daily laurel rewards were reworked into the daily login rewards.
Kitten.
Daily used to be set at 10k and was boosted up to 15k recently. Previously you could earn significantly more AP per day due to monthlies and separate daily rewards.
The daily system used to work as you want it to – You had tasks and each task gave AP. The more tasks you do the more AP you gain per day. However, Anet noted that this was very grindy and so they overhauled the system so that players need only complete 3 achievements to receive 10 AP. This means everyone receives the same amount of AP per day for doing dailies.
The idea behind the cap is so that players that have been playing since headstart do not get too far ahead (in terms of AP) of players just starting out. A difference will always be there, but a new player can’t expect to quickly catch up to a veteran.
Well as for getting too far ahead, ive seen several players above 25k AP. If the cap is just going to continue rising, its counter-intuitive to the plan ? 15K is alot of points pushed into a single category and only being able to receive 10 points per day is a bit nuts in my opinion.
We already are unable to acquire several historical achievements . I dont like the idea of being locked out of acquiring achievements based on the notion they dont want newer players to catch up/ or keeping achievements exclusive to players that log in on a daily basis. This excludes a very large portion of players and I find it quite discouraging.
The idea is that the players that have maxed out don’t continue getting AP. If I’ve got 15k AP from dailies then all dailies moving forward reward me with nothing – on the other hand, newer players are still getting rewards which closes the gap between new and veteran on a daily basis.
According to posts above the 10k cap was merged with 5k cap from monthlies which have been removed so seems like the cap was always the same.
This means that a new player joining today will eventually be able to catch up to a veteran to within 1.3k AP (IIRC)
The 1.3k refers to the retired achievements you have pointed out. I agree it sucks that there are a lot of achievements we will never be able to attain but unfortunately that’s how the situation is right now. They might remove this gap like they did when they brought back the retired pvp achievement of Revenge of the Capricorn map. So there is a possibility but it is unlikely especially with Living World Season 1 content.
So there is a possibility but it is unlikely especially with Living World Season 1 content.
Unless they bring back LS1 in the future. It might happen, who knows.
So there is a possibility but it is unlikely especially with Living World Season 1 content.
Unless they bring back LS1 in the future. It might happen, who knows.
One can dream
Also there is a total of 191 Achievement Points that are no longer available AND cannot be added even if LS1 is re-included in the game. The PVP achievements shouldn’t be re-introduced, they were an extra incentive to play during their respective seasons.
So that leaves us with Miniature Collection (120 AP), Hint Completion (10 AP), Skillful (25 AP), Garnet Sanctum (10 AP), Troll’s End (10 AP) for a total of 175 AP.
If I recall, new players start with some amount of AP and not 0, a few of the above are “included” in fresh accounts, but the others need to be made available again. It’s the first (small) step
The cap was introduced in March 2014. I doubt any players were near the caps when they were put in place.
The highest AP player in the game was a month or so away from reaching the cap then, if i remember correctly.
According to posts above the 10k cap was merged with 5k cap from monthlies which have been removed so seems like the cap was always the same.
Not quite. There was originally no cap at all.
This means that a new player joining today will eventually be able to catch up to a veteran to within 1.3k AP (IIRC)
With each year this gap bwtween veterans and new players will only increase, due to holiday events. And remember, that “eventually” will quite often mean “never”. The old players have not only advantage in that they have started earing their AP earlier, but also because it was much easier to earn them then. It took 2 years for the first players to reach the AP daily cap. It will take at least 4 years for anyone starting today. So, new players to catch up will need to work much harder than veterans… and that’s even if the veterans will stop playing.
No, the cap actually favours the veterans, as they no longer need to work hard in order to stay ahead.
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
No, the cap actually favours the veterans, as they no longer need to work hard in order to stay ahead.
…it takes less than 10 minutes to finish the daily now. While it took considerably more time to finish them (and get 10 AP) with any of the old systems. You can’t call spending 10 minutes to earn 10 AP “hard work”
but also because it was much easier to earn them then
To get 10 AP with the previous system to the one we have now it took considerably longer than now.
No, the cap actually favours the veterans, as they no longer need to work hard in order to stay ahead.
…it takes less than 10 minutes to finish the daily now. While it took considerably more time to finish them (and get 10 AP) with any of the old systems. You can’t call spending 10 minutes to earn 10 AP “hard work”
but also because it was much easier to earn them then
To get 10 AP with the previous system to the one we have now it took considerably longer than now.
This is absolutely true. In the old days to get 10 achievement points, you had to do ten dailies. Now you can do 3 easy dailies for 10 achievement points. There were easier dailies back then, but doing ten of them meant not only doing PvE achievements but also PvP or WvW achievements.
No, the cap actually favours the veterans, as they no longer need to work hard in order to stay ahead.
…it takes less than 10 minutes to finish the daily now. While it took considerably more time to finish them (and get 10 AP) with any of the old systems. You can’t call spending 10 minutes to earn 10 AP “hard work”
but also because it was much easier to earn them then
To get 10 AP with the previous system to the one we have now it took considerably longer than now.
Do you perhaps remember the times when you could get 25 AP per day from dailies, in addition to monthlies, for doing pretty much the same things you do now, but not limited to specific zone?
No, the cap actually favours the veterans, as they no longer need to work hard in order to stay ahead.
…it takes less than 10 minutes to finish the daily now.
You, at the very least, need to keep logging every day. Many veterans just simply do not want to do that anymore, and yet they want to keep their AP advantage.
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
(edited by Astralporing.1957)
I used to go for those 10 point dailies some days. I took a good hour to get 10 points, sometimes more. Now it takes ten minutes.
I think things are equitable the way they are. If the cap wasn’t in place, new people could never catch up on daily experience. But making it even easier, that wouldn’t sit well with me. New players get plenty veterans didn’t get. I mean I wasn’t getting 2 gold a day for doing 3 dailies.
Do you perhaps remember the times when you could get 25 AP per day from dailies, in addition to monthlies, for doing pretty much the same things you do now, but not limited to specific zone?
That period you are talking about lasted until February 2013, so about 6 months since the game was released, then they changed that system multiple times since then.
With the February 2013 update you had to do more complex things, limited to specific zones just like now, only got 9 AP total per day, it included running fractals and doing wvw achievements as well. And since then it’s been going up in effort and time required to finish the daily.
So you are talking about those awesome days of easy AP from dailies which lasted the first 6 months of the game’s life. Only those who were playing back then have any kind of advantage in terms of AP compared to newer players and it only lasted 6 months.
One needs to consider what the POINT of AP is, before one can decide if the system in place now is good or bad.
Personally, I think that the cap exists because they decided that daily AP was a bad idea but couldn’t just remove it so they put a lid on it.
Server: Devona’s Rest
To the OP.
The “point(s) per task” system was changed to the “points for completing a set amount (currently 3)” system because achievement hunters were complaining that they had to spend too much time getting the max allowed per day. One of your requests is to reinstate a points-per-task mechanic with even more points involved. I don’t see Anet reacting positively to that request because not only would it anger those the change from such a system served, it would also hasten the day when large numbers of players hit the cap, and get angry.
You seem to be in a hurry to reach the cap. Why? Reaching the cap means only that you will no longer gain AP from dailies.
If it’s because you want to gain more AP or want more to do, perhaps you could look in the Achievements Tab on your Hero Panel in game and focus on the non-daily tasks that reward AP. There are plenty of things to do if you haven’t already done them.
If it’s because you feel a desire to get things over with, then perhaps you should consider the nature of the MMO genre of games. The MMO business model is based on keeping players coming back. This means that MMO developers need to put long-term goals into the game. MMO developers have little motivation to remove long term goals as long as they also provide shorter-term gratification to keep players happy.
However, daily tasks were never meant as a long-term goal. They were (and remain) an enticement to players to log in more frequently. What’s long term about them is the AP, and ANet has little reason to hasten the day when players reach their personal AP cap (I say personal because there are historical AP that newer players can never recoup).
This isn’t the first (nor the last thread) this year on the topic (never mind all the threads from 2014-2016). The discussion is always the same and goes round and round with the same arguments.
The short of it is that ANet hasn’t really ever responded to any of the feedback: we don’t know if they like the cap still or exactly how they think it benefits the community in the current era. We can speculate about ANet’s motivations, the actual impact, and whether it discourages veterans and/or encourages newbies.
In other words, in answer to the OP: we don’t know.
(My personal feeling: I’ve never wanted the cap; I just don’t think it’s an urgent or particularly important issue. I hope that they spend their energy rethinking loyalty rewards instead of micromanaging daily caps and AP.)
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
I don’t see Anet reacting positively to that request because not only would it anger those the change from such a system served, it would also hasten the day when large numbers of players hit the cap, and get angry.
There are several things in your post I want to address:
(1) Achievement Point are just that, they are not and should never been tied to the notion that they are loyalty points. * If that is the case, these amassed points should be moved into a seperate category rather than being lumped in as a total sum* Hence, when I highlight over a players name in the party, guild, etc these 15K points should be in a separate category.
(2) Regarding my personal AP, spending 4.11 years to catch up to an Ap block of 15,000 points is quite ridiculous and this should have never been the case. All players should be allowed to max out their achievement points should they want to do so. Personally, Its the same as world completion for the icon, or reaching the max mastery point level.
(3) Regarding the daily incentive to log in and play, There is a daily login reward and daily missions that rewards 2 gold and varying chest contents based on the task.
(edited by Fifth.8169)
I don’t see Anet reacting positively to that request because not only would it anger those the change from such a system served, it would also hasten the day when large numbers of players hit the cap, and get angry.
There are several things in your post I want to address:
(1) Achievement Point are just that, they are not and should never been tied to the notion that they are loyalty points. * If that is the case, these amassed points should be moved into a seperate category rather than being lumped in as a total sum* Hence, when I highlight over a players name in the party, guild, etc these 15K points should be in a separate category.
So, you’d favor removing AP from daily tasks and allowing players to accumulate the 15K needed to reach the 15k cap on whatever new currency the daily tasks would award much faster. What rewards do you propose? How much dev time would Anet need to spend to set up yet another system? What would be the point, other than allowing you (as afaik, you — and only you — have expressed such a desire) to get to whatever this new goal would be faster?
(2) Regarding my personal AP, spending 4.11 years to catch up to an Ap block of 15,000 points is quite ridiculous and this should have never been the case. All players should be allowed to max out their achievement points should they want to do so. Personally, Its the same as world completion for the icon, or reaching the max mastery point level.
You can max out your daily AP in the same fashion as everyone else did. However, it requires you to spend similar amounts of time as the players who have already done so. How do you propose compensating them for having spent the time you’re unwilling to spend?
(3) Regarding the daily incentive to log in and play, There is a daily login reward and daily missions that rewards 2 gold and varying chest contents based on the task.
Yes, there are several incentives to play regularly. There are enough complaints about the very existence of the daily AP cap to suggest that some players value getting daily AP using the system as is. Other than your personal desire to catch up without spending similar amounts of time as people “ahead” of you, what value resides in your proposal?
Please see responses in italics.
Gee, it took me 4+ years of Daily logging in (almost without exception) to reach the cap. Should it take less time now? Why would anyone want to stop receiving Daily Achievement Points? I guess a few do, as they feel obligated to log in, but I’ve surely read more people lamenting the loss of Daily Achievement Points than those who would rather not receive them.
I don’t see Anet reacting positively to that request because not only would it anger those the change from such a system served, it would also hasten the day when large numbers of players hit the cap, and get angry.
There are several things in your post I want to address:
(1) Achievement Point are just that, they are not and should never been tied to the notion that they are loyalty points. * If that is the case, these amassed points should be moved into a seperate category rather than being lumped in as a total sum* Hence, when I highlight over a players name in the party, guild, etc these 15K points should be in a separate category.
So, you’d favor removing AP from daily tasks and allowing players to accumulate the 15K needed to reach the 15k cap on whatever new currency the daily tasks would award much faster. What rewards do you propose? How much dev time would Anet need to spend to set up yet another system? What would be the point, other than allowing you (as afaik, you — and only you — have expressed such a desire) to get to whatever this new goal would be faster?
(2) Regarding my personal AP, spending 4.11 years to catch up to an Ap block of 15,000 points is quite ridiculous and this should have never been the case. All players should be allowed to max out their achievement points should they want to do so. Personally, Its the same as world completion for the icon, or reaching the max mastery point level.
You can max out your daily AP in the same fashion as everyone else did. However, it requires you to spend similar amounts of time as the players who have already done so. How do you propose compensating them for having spent the time you’re unwilling to spend?
(3) Regarding the daily incentive to log in and play, There is a daily login reward and daily missions that rewards 2 gold and varying chest contents based on the task.
Yes, there are several incentives to play regularly. There are enough complaints about the very existence of the daily AP cap to suggest that some players value getting daily AP using the system as is. Other than your personal desire to catch up without spending similar amounts of time as people “ahead” of you, what value resides in your proposal?
Please see responses in italics.
====
Logging in daily is not an achievement. It should not be lumped in together with killing a dragon or exploring the game world. 15000 points amassed for simply logging in ? This is wrong on so many levels. I repeat this is not an achievement. and stop hinting and considering achievement points as loyalty points. That is not the definition of what achievement points are nor should be.
I don’t see Anet reacting positively to that request because not only would it anger those the change from such a system served, it would also hasten the day when large numbers of players hit the cap, and get angry.
There are several things in your post I want to address:
(1) Achievement Point are just that, they are not and should never been tied to the notion that they are loyalty points. * If that is the case, these amassed points should be moved into a seperate category rather than being lumped in as a total sum* Hence, when I highlight over a players name in the party, guild, etc these 15K points should be in a separate category.
So, you’d favor removing AP from daily tasks and allowing players to accumulate the 15K needed to reach the 15k cap on whatever new currency the daily tasks would award much faster. What rewards do you propose? How much dev time would Anet need to spend to set up yet another system? What would be the point, other than allowing you (as afaik, you — and only you — have expressed such a desire) to get to whatever this new goal would be faster?
(2) Regarding my personal AP, spending 4.11 years to catch up to an Ap block of 15,000 points is quite ridiculous and this should have never been the case. All players should be allowed to max out their achievement points should they want to do so. Personally, Its the same as world completion for the icon, or reaching the max mastery point level.
You can max out your daily AP in the same fashion as everyone else did. However, it requires you to spend similar amounts of time as the players who have already done so. How do you propose compensating them for having spent the time you’re unwilling to spend?
(3) Regarding the daily incentive to log in and play, There is a daily login reward and daily missions that rewards 2 gold and varying chest contents based on the task.
Yes, there are several incentives to play regularly. There are enough complaints about the very existence of the daily AP cap to suggest that some players value getting daily AP using the system as is. Other than your personal desire to catch up without spending similar amounts of time as people “ahead” of you, what value resides in your proposal?
Please see responses in italics.
====
Logging in daily is not an achievement. It should not be lumped in together with killing a dragon or exploring the game world. 15000 points amassed for simply logging in ? This is wrong on so many levels. I repeat this is not an achievement. and stop hinting and considering achievement points as loyalty points. That is not the definition of what achievement points are nor should be.
You don’t get AP for logging in daily. You get AP for doing things like killing a dragon or doing a dungeon or doing events on a map. You get AP for killing guards in WvW, killing players in sPvP, winning matches in sPvP and many other ways of playing the game. You’re confusing getting AP from doing things on a daily list of ways to play the game with the daily login rewards, which are a different system.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
ANet may give it to you.
(edited by Just a flesh wound.3589)
So missed another 10 points today… and now these daily points are locked away forever unattainable. This sucks.
These 15k Achievement points should not be locked like this. and the cap is only going to get larger and larger…
Can we please be allowed to acquire more daily points ? its really bothering me…..
Well, no, you didn’t miss anything bc you can just get those points tomorrow, precisely bc there is a cap. That’s actually why the cap was introduced, it was at the request of veteran players who felt forced to do dailies to ‘keep up’. I’ve never understood that perspective bc I think of AP more like a reward track than a measure for comparing players, but folks are different . . .
I’ve always been opposed to the cap, but I’m still years away from reaching it so it’s not very high on my list of concerns . . .
How is the cap getting larger and larger? its 15k and continue to be 15k
I stopped getting the 10 daily AP some time back. I handled it by stopping caring about getting AP. AP is meaningless to me now with the chests are so far away with needing 500 points and only getting a few new AP available every 2 or 3 months.
/shrug.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
ANet may give it to you.
I’m with Fleshie; I don’t really feel motivated to try for Achievement Points anymore. It will probably take me a year or two to get to the next chest. I think the Devs should reconsider the whole Achievement reward system, now that so many have maxed out (on the cap).
I’m with Fleshie; I don’t really feel motivated to try for Achievement Points anymore. It will probably take me a year or two to get to the next chest. I think the Devs should reconsider the whole Achievement reward system, now that so many have maxed out (on the cap).
I agree.
When i play i’m very seldom chasing dailies (save for maybe fractals, but i’d do fractals anyway normally).
Ultimately i’d like to see the now what 5 different daily categories merged with no options removed that way everyone can just play what they will and be rewarded.
I do PvP dailies to advance my reward track, not for the AP. While the occasional reward IS nice, it’s not worth loosing sleep over.
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