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Posted by: ophidic.1279

ophidic.1279

Seriously I’m going to have to stop here before I get myself infracted or something… not to mention I still have to do my dailies if I want that laurel and coin.

Elyl Jrend

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Posted by: TooBz.3065

TooBz.3065

Seriously I’m going to have to stop here before I get myself infracted or something… not to mention I still have to do my dailies if I want that laurel and coin.

You just made me laugh out loud. Excellent.

Anyway, I see daily’s like getting my chores done before I can go play. I often do not enjoy them. I do it to get my laurel. I do enjoy the rest of the game (esp. WvW).

I can also realize that daily’s are a form of manipulation. So I think that if there is a way to get the good aspects of daily’s (such as time gating to slow the inevitable gear grind) while limiting the downsides (some people feel left out.) the player community should be behind it.

For the record, ArenaNet has done a great job with the new daily system. They are much less onerous than they were previously.

Anything I post is just the opinion of a very vocal minority of 1.

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Posted by: Heijincks.9267

Heijincks.9267

Seriously I’m going to have to stop here before I get myself infracted or something… not to mention I still have to do my dailies if I want that laurel and coin.

You just made me laugh out loud. Excellent.

Anyway, I see daily’s like getting my chores done before I can go play. I often do not enjoy them. I do it to get my laurel. I do enjoy the rest of the game (esp. WvW).

I don’t get it. Why not do the daily as you play? For example, if you WvW, you should passively get that one achievement. It easily stacks up upon many others as well.

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Posted by: ophidic.1279

ophidic.1279

Seriously I’m going to have to stop here before I get myself infracted or something… not to mention I still have to do my dailies if I want that laurel and coin.

You just made me laugh out loud. Excellent.

Anyway, I see daily’s like getting my chores done before I can go play. I often do not enjoy them. I do it to get my laurel. I do enjoy the rest of the game (esp. WvW).

I can also realize that daily’s are a form of manipulation. So I think that if there is a way to get the good aspects of daily’s (such as time gating to slow the inevitable gear grind) while limiting the downsides (some people feel left out.) the player community should be behind it.

For the record, ArenaNet has done a great job with the new daily system. They are much less onerous than they were previously.

People are going to feel left out no matter what though. I remember my first mmo and when I realized the sheer amount of time it would take to get the thing I wanted. (non default clothes.) This was RAN online though, and that was a free korean game with a MONSTER sized grind.

I suppose if you want to look at it as a chore, you can, but then it will for sure feel like one.

Elyl Jrend

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Posted by: TooBz.3065

TooBz.3065

Seriously I’m going to have to stop here before I get myself infracted or something… not to mention I still have to do my dailies if I want that laurel and coin.

You just made me laugh out loud. Excellent.

Anyway, I see daily’s like getting my chores done before I can go play. I often do not enjoy them. I do it to get my laurel. I do enjoy the rest of the game (esp. WvW).

I don’t get it. Why not do the daily as you play? For example, if you WvW, you should passively get that one achievement. It easily stacks up upon many others as well.

I can and sometimes do. Although usually I don’t know how much time I have to play so I rush through them. However, the point is that the OP cannot. And as such another system, such as bigger monthlies with greater rewards would be better and still provide the same time gate.

Anything I post is just the opinion of a very vocal minority of 1.

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Posted by: Gasoline.2570

Gasoline.2570

Since they got no actual overall content to bring you back with, they gate the very little content you might, or probably do, want.

It’s brilliant.

The balance team is chained to SPVP, and the PVE team is all about producing carnivals

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Posted by: IndigoSundown.5419

IndigoSundown.5419

I suppose they could make a weekly instead of a daily, but then the outcry against a kill count of 350 or gatherer of 140 would crop up. Also, a weekly would not help the OP, who plays 1 week a month. A monthly, well we have one of those. Put all the objectives in the monthly, give choice and put all the rewards there? I can hear the outcry against grindy monthlies. Eliminate time gating and ANet is back where it was in late October — with players racing to acquisition and complaining there is nothing to do. What other options are there which solve both the OP’s and ANet’s problems?

Kif, we have a conundrum!

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Posted by: Jabronee.9465

Jabronee.9465

The only Solution is, each and every player should be able to do the dailies that they had missed throughout the month.
But they could not repeat the dailies that they had already done within that month.
Meaning, developer should put a time stamp on the days they had completed their dailies.
So the total monthly Laurels should be only 30 for example.
Simple.

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Posted by: DarcShriek.5829

DarcShriek.5829

I think the best solution to this problem is to give all players the daily and monthly reward without making them log in. Why should I have to log in everyday to receive a laurel and some karma juice. Anet should give me my rewards automatically whether I log in or not.

Also, anet should go back to the first day that each of these rewards were given and give everyone all these rewards even if they did not have an account at the time.

All new accounts should be given all these rewards instantly once they log in for the first time.

Finally, all players should be instantly risen to lvl 80 and given all appropriate gear. It’s only fair.

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Posted by: Gestankfaust.4216

Gestankfaust.4216

Dailies and (not even valid…weeklies) is the main headline.

Like to join the topic kitten?

Wait..no…casue dailies are so easy it’s stupid. But you can’t do stupid stuff.

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Posted by: sostronk.8167

sostronk.8167

Dailies and (not even valid…weeklies) is the main headline.

Like to join the topic kitten?

Wait..no…casue dailies are so easy it’s stupid. But you can’t do stupid stuff.

I like to spend most of my time doing “stupid stuff”.

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Posted by: Rifter.6591

Rifter.6591

The issue with this game in general is they are trying more and more to tell people how to play their game instead of letting people play how they want.

This thread is a great example of that.

I dont think anyone will disagree that if player 1 and player 2 both put in 30 hours a month that they should be rewarded the same amount, that however is not the case as outlined in the OP. Player 1 who plays a hour a day will end up with 40 laurels at the end of the month assuming he does his monthly which he probably will just doing his dailies every day, and player 2 who plays 30 hours but only during one week will get 17 laurels only. This is a issue that needs to be adressed.

Not only that but with DR in effect after 60 min in the same map zone that player who logs in only a day or two a week but players for 10 hours a day when he does log in is punished by DR if he farms the same zone(which is common if looking for a specific ingridient).

So basically what we have now is Anet trying to force us into only playing a hour or two a day and giving those people full rewards, and if you chose to play in larger chunks of time but less often you get punished by DR and not earning as many laurels as players who play how Anet wants them to.

IMO the devs should let us play how we want as we can, not try and force us into a specific play pattern.

Note how im not saying dailies/laurels should be handed to players or automatically given just that equal playtime should see equal rewards.

P.S. To OP on a personal note i totally get where you are coming from, while i dont work out of town i do work 12 hour shifts, and if any overtime or delays in my commute occur i dont have time to log in and do my dailes so i often miss out on them. Even though i play for 20-30 hours each weekend(i have a 4 day weekend). So i can play 30 hours a week and sometimes only get 4 laurels, doesnt really seem fair considering the guy who logs in just 5-7 hours a week but once a day can get 7.

(edited by Rifter.6591)

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Posted by: Creeper.9360

Creeper.9360

The introduction and continuation of ascended gear (and the associations that goes with that, ie guild missions and such) has really turned this game into a typical wowish mmo. Certainly a big departure from the original guild wars. I enjoy the game still, especially the combat and the visuals, but I really don’t like the current direction of the game.

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Posted by: ophidic.1279

ophidic.1279

The introduction and continuation of ascended gear (and the associations that goes with that, ie guild missions and such) has really turned this game into a typical wowish mmo. Certainly a big departure from the original guild wars. I enjoy the game still, especially the combat and the visuals, but I really don’t like the current direction of the game.

I love how a bit of gear makes the game like wow.

God, saving up for a car and a house must be the most unfair thing in the world.

Elyl Jrend

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Posted by: Shimond.2478

Shimond.2478

Not every single part of the game is going to be fully available to every single player.

That’s not really the game’s fault. It’s impossible to ‘fix’ this ‘problem’

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Posted by: Vick.6805

Vick.6805

Regardless of the OP’s particular situation, if ANet truly wants GW2 to cater to as many player types as possible, they could easily break out of the “daily” mindset entirely and make it a more flexible process:

Take the new daily categories and add them as options to the Monthly achievements. Increase the each objective’s requirements to an amount that is reasonable for a month. Take the rewards for a month’s dailies and add them to the Monthly achievement. Rewards are given for a certain number of categories being completed, the same way the dailies are now, with additional achievement points given for additional completions.

In that situation, each player can play as he/she pleases and everyone gets rewarded. They even have similar time gates in place on the rewards, since that seems to be inevitable in MMOs these days.

(edited by Vick.6805)

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Posted by: ophidic.1279

ophidic.1279

Not every single part of the game is going to be fully available to every single player.

That’s not really the game’s fault. It’s impossible to ‘fix’ this ‘problem’

It’s not even a problem that needs to be fixed!

Correction… It’s not even a problem!

Elyl Jrend

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Posted by: Hellkaiser.6025

Hellkaiser.6025

Not every single part of the game is going to be fully available to every single player.

That’s not really the game’s fault. It’s impossible to ‘fix’ this ‘problem’

That’s a terribly bleak way of looking at it, but I expect no less from this forum.

Irony…. xD

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Posted by: Eurhetemec.9052

Eurhetemec.9052

Not every single part of the game is going to be fully available to every single player.

That’s not really the game’s fault. It’s impossible to ‘fix’ this ‘problem’

It’s not even a problem that needs to be fixed!

Correction… It’s not even a problem!

The design of dailies/monthlies IS however this game’s fault, is a problem, and can and should be improved. I’d suggest allowing people to go back and do dailies/monthlies that they missed out on in some way – not forever, maybe back 30 days or something though.

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Posted by: phys.7689

phys.7689

this time gated content is too heavy handed, and generally bad long term, as time starts to go by, it will seem more unattainable for newbs with more time building up. 5 months from now, a new player will be looking at like 5 months between getting ascended acessories no matter how hard, or how well they play. Now of course they may make it easier later, but that will make reg players feel like the classic treadmill is in place, only longer.
(get items, items become easier, new hard to get items come out etc)
break the chain now.

not only that but they are starting to time gate content as well as rewards, guild missions, even aside from the influence has fairly sever time gates, that have you essentially only doing the content once a week. This is bad design, if people enjoy content, let them play said content.

the idea of a longer term best gear spec isnt guaranteed to be horrible, if it feels like its attainable through effort, in a reasonable time frame. But, as is, ascended is looking like a 8 month endeavor per stat set, and most likely it will be trivialized or made obsolete in the future. By making this ascended take so long to get, they must realize they are marrying the concept of no higher tiers of gear. Getting exotics again is manageable if they increase level cap, getting ascended again is a no go.

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Posted by: Shimond.2478

Shimond.2478

Not every single part of the game is going to be fully available to every single player.

That’s not really the game’s fault. It’s impossible to ‘fix’ this ‘problem’

That’s a terribly bleak way of looking at it, but I expect no less from this forum.

Really? What do fractals or dungeons have to offer the person who can’t stand grouping with others? Should that person be on here demanding single player dungeons?

I’m sure some do, but really, should Anet be listening to them? The fact is every kind of player will not be able to play/enjoy every part of the game. It’s impossible.

For a person like the OP who only gets to play one week a month, doing a daily every day is completely off the table. What’s the fix? Just require 7 a month? Is that enough for the OP? Why should it even be changed when plenty of people DO play the game every single day?

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Posted by: Hellkaiser.6025

Hellkaiser.6025

Not every single part of the game is going to be fully available to every single player.

That’s not really the game’s fault. It’s impossible to ‘fix’ this ‘problem’

That’s a terribly bleak way of looking at it, but I expect no less from this forum.

Really? What do fractals or dungeons have to offer the person who can’t stand grouping with others? Should that person be on here demanding single player dungeons?

I’m sure some do, but really, should Anet be listening to them? The fact is every kind of player will not be able to play/enjoy every part of the game. It’s impossible.

For a person like the OP who only gets to play one week a month, doing a daily every day is completely off the table. What’s the fix? Just require 7 a month? Is that enough for the OP? Why should it even be changed when plenty of people DO play the game every single day?

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game:

Does that answer your question? the clue is even in the name of the genre of game, if you want a single player game, look for one, buy it, install it. When on earth did this simple and honestly with no offence intended “asinine” point become an issue?

But clearly you’re just taking the straw man route and making up ridiculous scenario’s where my statement is moot, that’s fine, I don’t expect anything less from here.

Fact is, time gating is one answer that to many, feels lazy and incredibly short sighted, but come on… what were you expecting?

making daily’s so inherently key to obtaining BIS gear, was a stupid move, nothing more to add to that, it was just stupid. Making them a huge time gate, was even more stupid, I left WoW for many reasons and one was the dictating of how often I could participate in certain content in a week, time gating isn’t fun and I ran from it to here, and now it’s yet another reason why I don’t recommend this game to anyone. but that’s just my opinion.

Irony…. xD

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Posted by: Vorch.2985

Vorch.2985

I don’t have a problem with time gating.

I have a problem with statistical advantages behind time gates.

Here’s what people thought of GW1 when it first came out: http://tinyurl.com/bntcvyc
“A release is 7 days or less away or has just happened within the last 7 days…
These are the only two states you’ll find the world of Tyria.”

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Posted by: Hellkaiser.6025

Hellkaiser.6025

I don’t have a problem with time gating.

I have a problem with statistical advantages behind time gates.

It’s a time gate, with a side of grind… which excludes some guilds apparently… nothing about any of it seems well thought out.

Irony…. xD

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Posted by: Shimond.2478

Shimond.2478

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game:

Does that answer your question? the clue is even in the name of the genre of game, if you want a single player game, look for one, buy it, install it. When on earth did this simple and honestly with no offence intended “asinine” point become an issue?

But clearly you’re just taking the straw man route and making up ridiculous scenario’s where my statement is moot, that’s fine, I don’t expect anything less from here.

Fact is, time gating is one answer that to many, feels lazy and incredibly short sighted, but come on… what were you expecting?

making daily’s so inherently key to obtaining BIS gear, was a stupid move, nothing more to add to that, it was just stupid. Making them a huge time gate, was even more stupid, I left WoW for many reasons and one was the dictating of how often I could participate in certain content in a week, time gating isn’t fun and I ran from it to here, and now it’s yet another reason why I don’t recommend this game to anyone. but that’s just my opinion.

Fair enough, lets put this back in the context of the OP.

Let’s say that there was no daily system. I don’t see how the OP would be doing regular fractal runs or progressing through the levels there for it to even matter what their AR is (where all this “BIS gear” even matters in this game). This is not someone that plays casually, this is someone that barely plays. And they’re complaining about things in the game they likely wouldn’t be accessing regardless. They might as well whine about legendary acquisition next.

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Posted by: Hellkaiser.6025

Hellkaiser.6025

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game:

Does that answer your question? the clue is even in the name of the genre of game, if you want a single player game, look for one, buy it, install it. When on earth did this simple and honestly with no offence intended “asinine” point become an issue?

But clearly you’re just taking the straw man route and making up ridiculous scenario’s where my statement is moot, that’s fine, I don’t expect anything less from here.

Fact is, time gating is one answer that to many, feels lazy and incredibly short sighted, but come on… what were you expecting?

making daily’s so inherently key to obtaining BIS gear, was a stupid move, nothing more to add to that, it was just stupid. Making them a huge time gate, was even more stupid, I left WoW for many reasons and one was the dictating of how often I could participate in certain content in a week, time gating isn’t fun and I ran from it to here, and now it’s yet another reason why I don’t recommend this game to anyone. but that’s just my opinion.

Fair enough, lets put this back in the context of the OP.

Let’s say that there was no daily system. I don’t see how the OP would be doing regular fractal runs or progressing through the levels there for it to even matter what their AR is (where all this “BIS gear” even matters in this game). This is not someone that plays casually, this is someone that barely plays. And they’re complaining about things in the game they likely wouldn’t be accessing regardless. They might as well whine about legendary acquisition next.

What’s wrong… with adding ascended gear into the game as if it WAS exotic and AS a new tier, why jump through all these hoops? why funnel players to certain areas or exclude certain guilds

I know it’s hard to understand for some, but there’s no reason why someone with less time, shouldn’t be given every helping hand towards gearing up, because it adds to the feeling of completion of said character, they’ve already moved the goalposts with ascended and done a ham fisted job of implementing them…

Nothing needs to take months, nothing needs to exclude or be highly anti-alt and nothing needs to be done save for to work on the repeatable lower level content and make it more stimulating, something that’s not exactly easy, but a better option than the wasted resources that have gone into this new direction and systems. They’re taking the short-cuts, and it will bite them on the rear sooner or later because the same issues still remain for those players that are affected, only now they’re behind time gates… these new daily’s only seem to tell me how I should spend my time, instead of me deciding it, and I don’t appreciate that, while I’m working on gear I want variety and options, not a new currency grind.

Irony…. xD

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Posted by: ophidic.1279

ophidic.1279

You people are incredible.

Anyway, I’m a few laurels away from enjoying my ascended gear.

See you in game. :P

Elyl Jrend

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Posted by: CassieGold.7460

CassieGold.7460

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game:

Does that answer your question? the clue is even in the name of the genre of game, if you want a single player game, look for one, buy it, install it. When on earth did this simple and honestly with no offence intended “asinine” point become an issue?

But clearly you’re just taking the straw man route and making up ridiculous scenario’s where my statement is moot, that’s fine, I don’t expect anything less from here.

Fact is, time gating is one answer that to many, feels lazy and incredibly short sighted, but come on… what were you expecting?

making daily’s so inherently key to obtaining BIS gear, was a stupid move, nothing more to add to that, it was just stupid. Making them a huge time gate, was even more stupid, I left WoW for many reasons and one was the dictating of how often I could participate in certain content in a week, time gating isn’t fun and I ran from it to here, and now it’s yet another reason why I don’t recommend this game to anyone. but that’s just my opinion.

Fair enough, lets put this back in the context of the OP.

Let’s say that there was no daily system. I don’t see how the OP would be doing regular fractal runs or progressing through the levels there for it to even matter what their AR is (where all this “BIS gear” even matters in this game). This is not someone that plays casually, this is someone that barely plays. And they’re complaining about things in the game they likely wouldn’t be accessing regardless. They might as well whine about legendary acquisition next.

To bring this back in the context of the OP: If you removed the time gates, the OP could put in a mind bleeding Fractal Bender, chaining difficulty levels to go as deep as their skill allowed them…. and hopefully getting the needed gear along the way.

Add time gating, and the OP, despite a willingness to put in a mind bleeding bender of a session, cannot get the same rewards as a person playing daily.

In a less extreme example, I tend to play a lot more on weekends, and I have a hard time getting enough time for a daily lvl 10 fractal every evening I play…. I would love to run a few ‘extra’ lvl 10s on the weekend for pristine relics, but…. time gating says no.

No one is asking to get more rewards for playing less…. what people are looking for is the ability to play for rewards without having to do it on someone else’s time table.

Kind of like the game played at launch you know? When the daily was an amount of silver + a tradeable mystic coin. The mistic coin is a time shiftable currancy…. if you miss the opportunity to earn one via a daily, you could trade for one by putting in extra time to earn coin…… so the player who can put in a weekend bender session can ‘catch up’…. not so with Laurels.

LVL 80’s: Thief / Warrior / Guardian / Mesmer

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Posted by: Mackdose.6504

Mackdose.6504

The new daily system and the new guild mission system is gated. I use this term because there is a hard limit to the number of laurels and guild commendations you can receive for any day/week/month.

Not everyone can earn 40 laurels a month, or X commendations a week. And those of us who cannot have no way to make up for that loss. The people I’m talking about are people like me, the workers in the resource industry.

I am severely punished by the game for this style of play.

Anet if you want to support players who don’t have the time to grind out high level gear, why are you gating ascended gear in a way that punishes those of us who spend time doing necessary jobs in remote areas where game play every day simply isn’t possible?

The forum topic is misleading. The rewards are gated, certainly, but outside of high-level fractals you’re not gated from content at all.

Rewards != Content.

If you can play the content in whatever gear you may have, you’re not being punished. Having the gear doesn’t unlock some hidden zone that is only for elite 10 hours a day types.

“I didn’t buy into GW2 being the second coming of christ.
I just wanted a AAA MMO with no sub made by ArenaNet. And it’s awesome.”

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Posted by: phys.7689

phys.7689

The new daily system and the new guild mission system is gated. I use this term because there is a hard limit to the number of laurels and guild commendations you can receive for any day/week/month.

Not everyone can earn 40 laurels a month, or X commendations a week. And those of us who cannot have no way to make up for that loss. The people I’m talking about are people like me, the workers in the resource industry.

I am severely punished by the game for this style of play.

Anet if you want to support players who don’t have the time to grind out high level gear, why are you gating ascended gear in a way that punishes those of us who spend time doing necessary jobs in remote areas where game play every day simply isn’t possible?

The forum topic is misleading. The rewards are gated, certainly, but outside of high-level fractals you’re not gated from content at all.

Rewards != Content.

If you can play the content in whatever gear you may have, you’re not being punished. Having the gear doesn’t unlock some hidden zone that is only for elite 10 hours a day types.

you are incorrect, guild missions are time gated, and influence gated. you have to earn X influence, which is pretty hard for smaller guilds, but even then you have to earn merits, how many merits you can earn per week is limited per mission type, this basically means
at least 2 weeks to get guild trek
at least 2-3 weeks to get guild rush (depending on if you had merits left over from getting guild trek
3 weeks for guild challenge
3 more for guild puzzle unlock

so yeah the trend they have is to time gate content.

also ascended necklace is completely a laurel gate, which is a time gate.

honestly this is a bad trend and very against their initial design philosophy. Time gates should be minimum limits, like worst case secenario if you participate over time you get X, much like pristine relics. there should be other ways to obtain and experience content that arent limited by X amount of time passed.

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Posted by: Mackdose.6504

Mackdose.6504

The new daily system and the new guild mission system is gated. I use this term because there is a hard limit to the number of laurels and guild commendations you can receive for any day/week/month.

Not everyone can earn 40 laurels a month, or X commendations a week. And those of us who cannot have no way to make up for that loss. The people I’m talking about are people like me, the workers in the resource industry.

I am severely punished by the game for this style of play.

Anet if you want to support players who don’t have the time to grind out high level gear, why are you gating ascended gear in a way that punishes those of us who spend time doing necessary jobs in remote areas where game play every day simply isn’t possible?

The forum topic is misleading. The rewards are gated, certainly, but outside of high-level fractals you’re not gated from content at all.

Rewards != Content.

If you can play the content in whatever gear you may have, you’re not being punished. Having the gear doesn’t unlock some hidden zone that is only for elite 10 hours a day types.

you are incorrect, guild missions are time gated, and influence gated. you have to earn X influence, which is pretty hard for smaller guilds, but even then you have to earn merits, how many merits you can earn per week is limited per mission type, this basically means
at least 2 weeks to get guild trek
at least 2-3 weeks to get guild rush (depending on if you had merits left over from getting guild trek
3 weeks for guild challenge
3 more for guild puzzle unlock

so yeah the trend they have is to time gate content.

also ascended necklace is completely a laurel gate, which is a time gate.

honestly this is a bad trend and very against their initial design philosophy. Time gates should be minimum limits, like worst case secenario if you participate over time you get X, much like pristine relics. there should be other ways to obtain and experience content that arent limited by X amount of time passed.

You’re still focusing on rewards. The game’s been out for 6 months, most guilds with over 50 members had the base upgrades already, and once your guild has the new content unlocked, then what?

We’re back to rewards being gated, rather than content.

Edit: Another point, time-gates are a punishment for big guilds. Time gates do not punish small guilds, the high amounts of influence required does.

“I didn’t buy into GW2 being the second coming of christ.
I just wanted a AAA MMO with no sub made by ArenaNet. And it’s awesome.”

(edited by Mackdose.6504)

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Posted by: Ridley.3691

Ridley.3691

I’m sorry but anything ANet add into the game is going to exclude somebody. I understand how unfair it is but the only other alternatives are to have laurels purchasable (making the game pay-to-win), being able to farm them (excluding people with less time on anyway), or scrapping them completely. I suppose you could put in some sort of cap so you’d only be buying laurels that you missed earning, but I can see that being abused.

When you make the choice to work in one of these kinds of jobs, you do so knowing full well it means you wont be able to do as much things as someone who does a job with normal hours, and I know it sucks in this one instance (It’s the -only- time-gated thing currently in GW2 I believe), but you chose such a job.

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Posted by: critickitten.1498

critickitten.1498

Er, what?

Rewards are content. They’re a different type of content, that much I’ll agree with. Rewards are a type of content meant to fulfill a different role in the game: the event motivator rather than the event itself. But to argue that when you add rewards to a game that you’re not also adding “content”….that’s absurd.

“Content” is not strictly defined as the events that are present in the game and nothing else. “Content” is a very loosely defined term that represents either tangible or intangible assets presented in the game with one of two intentions: to give you something to do, or to give you a reason to do something.

So it is 100% accurate to claim that the time gating system is gating content.

Remember when our developers talked about “strengthening the core game”?
How’d that work out for us so far?
Now let’s try some ideas that will really work.

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Posted by: Katai.6240

Katai.6240

I feel like this whole argument is based on this premise:

“Those who play a little bit every day are rewarded the same as people who play a lot every day”.

That’s true when it comes to dailies, sure. But then there’s EVERYTHING ELSE. Because I have 30-60 minutes a day to play, and others have 12-hour regular gaming blocks, I’m already outmatched when it comes to the amount of gold in my bank, the number of armor sets earned, and the number of Ascended rings in my storage. Seriously, people are complaining that they don’t have enough room in their bank for all the ascended rings they don’t want.

So I’m already at a disadvantage. A huge one in fact, starting from about 24 hours after launch because people already hit maxed level and earned precursors before I hit level 15.

Then comes this thing, engineered specifically so people like me can keep up with the rest of you, and of course you want it gone.

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Posted by: critickitten.1498

critickitten.1498

I feel like this whole argument is based on this premise:

“Those who play a little bit every day are rewarded the same as people who play a lot every day”.

That’s true when it comes to dailies, sure.

No, you have it backwards.

Those who play a little bit every day (under the laurel system) are disproportionally rewarded far more for their time than those who only have large dedicated blocks of time once per week/month.

A player who plays an hour per day under the daily system receives seven times the rewards of someone who plays a single 7-hour block per week. That’s grossly unfair to those without time to dedicate to the game every day.

Remember when our developers talked about “strengthening the core game”?
How’d that work out for us so far?
Now let’s try some ideas that will really work.

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Posted by: Mackdose.6504

Mackdose.6504

Er, what?

Rewards are content. They’re a different type of content, that much I’ll agree with. Rewards are a type of content meant to fulfill a different role in the game: the event motivator rather than the event itself. But to argue that when you add rewards to a game that you’re not also adding “content”….that’s absurd.

“Content” is not strictly defined as the events that are present in the game and nothing else. “Content” is a very loosely defined term that represents either tangible or intangible assets presented in the game with one of two intentions: to give you something to do, or to give you a reason to do something.

So it is 100% accurate to claim that the time gating system is gating content.

Semantics. Specifically, “equivocation.”

In MMO parlance, content relates directly to existing or future gameplay. “Content Patches,” “Progression content,” etc.

You’re essentially saying that the journey (content) and destination (reward) are the same thing.

Your argument is fallacious.

“I didn’t buy into GW2 being the second coming of christ.
I just wanted a AAA MMO with no sub made by ArenaNet. And it’s awesome.”

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Posted by: Minion of Vey.4398

Minion of Vey.4398

I wouldn’t sweat the laurels too much. It seems to be more of a baseline way to get stuff if all else fails. I would figure we’ll see new ways to get various ascended gear over time.

There’s already alternate methods for the rings and accessories, I expect to see more of that. (probably more ways even for the rings and accessories too).

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Posted by: critickitten.1498

critickitten.1498

Semantics. Specifically, “equivocation.”

In MMO parlance, content relates directly to existing or future gameplay. “Content Patches,” “Progression content,” etc.

You’re essentially saying that the journey (content) and destination (reward) are the same thing.

Your argument is fallacious.

No, it’s not, and no, I’m not.

I’m saying that anything introduced into the game for any reason is “content”.

Trying to pretend that tangible rewards in the form of armor, weapons, or accessories aren’t “content” is the fallacious argument.

Remember when our developers talked about “strengthening the core game”?
How’d that work out for us so far?
Now let’s try some ideas that will really work.

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Posted by: thisolderhead.5127

thisolderhead.5127

I wouldn’t sweat the laurels too much. It seems to be more of a baseline way to get stuff if all else fails. I would figure we’ll see new ways to get various ascended gear over time.

I tend to think this has merit.

It could be what we are seeing is the “welfare” pathing being introduced before the “content” pathing.

Odd as that may be I can see encounters dropping nice loots in the future, and cries up here because those who did the laurel grind feel cheated by those who run encounters and get their loots there.

All optimism aside we should probably prepare for “dungeon welfare loots” threads now.

Feeling bad due to my response does not mean it was a personal attack.
It may just be that your original statement was wrong.
Please try again.

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Posted by: Mackdose.6504

Mackdose.6504

Semantics. Specifically, “equivocation.”

In MMO parlance, content relates directly to existing or future gameplay. “Content Patches,” “Progression content,” etc.

You’re essentially saying that the journey (content) and destination (reward) are the same thing.

Your argument is fallacious.

No, it’s not, and no, I’m not.

I’m saying that anything introduced into the game for any reason is “content”.

Trying to pretend that tangible rewards in the form of armor, weapons, or accessories aren’t “content” is the fallacious argument.

You’re using “content” in its literal form, I’m using content in the context of an MMO. MMO content is by and large used to describe gameplay:

In this period of post-expansion raid progression and looking ahead to the new Hard Mode raids coming in RIFT 2.2, many raiding guilds out there are pushing their raiders to better their characters in any way possible. Let’s take a look at those Conquest trinkets. For most callings and souls, they’re best-in-slot by more than a slight margin for any type of PvP or PvE content. They also feature Endurance, which should be very handy for pushing Hard Mode content.

Source: http://rift.junkiesnation.com/2013/02/18/crossing-the-pve-and-pvp-content-divide/

To purchase these new sets players will need tokens earned by battling it out in the Border Kingdoms. These tokens will be earned through the new Shrines of Bori PvP content, as well as in new quests for existing PvP mini games. Not content with simply dropping more loot, we’ve also raised the PvP level cap from 5 to 10. By tweaking the leveling curve so that the amount of PvP experience points scales with PvP level differences between the combatants we have created a much more dynamic and exciting experience.

Source: http://www.ageofconan.com/news/sharpen_your_sword_on_exclusive_new_pvp_content

Equivocation. QED.

“I didn’t buy into GW2 being the second coming of christ.
I just wanted a AAA MMO with no sub made by ArenaNet. And it’s awesome.”

(edited by Mackdose.6504)

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Posted by: critickitten.1498

critickitten.1498

-snip-

The word already has an established meaning in the context of video games, to refer to any asset released in the game. This includes events (such as maps and campaigns) as well as rewards (such as weapons, armor, and other unlockables).

This is where the term “downloadable content” gets its name from. It is “content” (which includes items and rewards) that is downloaded at a later date.

Downloadable content (DLC) is additional content for a video game distributed through the internet by the game’s official publisher. Downloadable content can be of several types, ranging from aesthetic outfit changes to an entirely new, extensive storyline, similar to an expansion pack. As such, DLC may add new game modes, objects, levels, challenges or other features to a complete and already released game.

Simply put, you are wrong. The term has a meaning in the context of video games, and your attempts to twist it into meaning something else are not going to work.

Ascended items are content. Content that is locked behind a time gating system. That is content effectively denied to players unable to dedicate time on a daily basis, which is not an appropriate way to gate content. If you want to gate content behind X number of hours invested, fine, but don’t gate content behind something as poorly thought out as days, because that inherently slaps people with irregular schedules with a significant disadvantage.

I’ve developed for an indie game company before, I know what the term is used for, and we always referred to both events and rewards as content because that’s what it is. They are different forms of content and fulfill different purposes, but they are both content.

Remember when our developers talked about “strengthening the core game”?
How’d that work out for us so far?
Now let’s try some ideas that will really work.

(edited by critickitten.1498)

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Posted by: thisolderhead.5127

thisolderhead.5127

Assuming every asset/object is literally content…

Dropping more item assets doesn’t equate to content as many people are crying out for it, nor does slapping a reward system on top of exising content and suggesting it is a new thing.

Feeling bad due to my response does not mean it was a personal attack.
It may just be that your original statement was wrong.
Please try again.

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Posted by: ZudetGambeous.9573

ZudetGambeous.9573

I’ve seen this topic pop up on a number of different MMO forums and it always comes down to the same thing. You will NEVER please everyone. The daily/monthly is the system that almost all MMO’s adapt simply because it makes the largest number of people happy.

If you made a backlog where you could do all the dailies for the week in 1 day then there would be people on here complaining that they can only play every other week. If you made it so that you could buy laurels then poor people would be excluded. Someone will always be left out, it is just a fact of life.

Daily and monthly rewards fit the schedules of the greatest number of people, those with standard day jobs and those in school. This is the most appealing system and is unlikely to ever change unless the social ideal of what a “standard” job also changes.

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Posted by: Sinoran.9140

Sinoran.9140

guys. Small stat increases = content now, and you are severely punished by this time gate. I mean come on, now i can’t do dungeons since i don’t have all of the ascended!!! why am i punished when this gear is required to play content in this game!

Warrior/Ranger/Guardian/Engineer
Dragonbrand

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Posted by: critickitten.1498

critickitten.1498

Assuming every asset/object is literally content…

Dropping more item assets doesn’t equate to content as many people are crying out for it, nor does slapping a reward system on top of exising content and suggesting it is a new thing.

So you’re saying that if ANet released one whole set of Ascended armor tomorrow, that’s not a “content update”?

I sure hope I’m not considered crazy for saying that yes, that would absolutely be a “content update”, because those items are content.

Content serves a variety of needs. Some content is designed to serve a need for more story (campaigns or maps), other content is simply to provide more ways to play (new modes or skills), and a third form of content seeks to help players feel as through they’ve achieved something and to reward their efforts (either with tangibles like equipment, or intangibles such as achievement systems).

That is why you’ll see some developers use the term to refer specifically to events, while others will use it to refer to new rewards and rewards systems. And this is also why the blanket term “downloadable content” is used to refer to any form of downloadable patching to the game, including aesthetics, gear, and rewards.

And the fact that we actually have to sit here and explain the varied usages of the term “content” so that people will stop whining about another person’s correct usage of the term in a different context….that’s just unfortunate, to say the least.

Remember when our developers talked about “strengthening the core game”?
How’d that work out for us so far?
Now let’s try some ideas that will really work.

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Posted by: Mackdose.6504

Mackdose.6504

@critickitten

Again, you’re using a general category (Video games) against a demonstrated meaning specific to MMOs. You refuse to even look at the meat of my posts instead choosing to attack me with a semantics argument.

On topic:

The point is, rewards are akin to the destination. The destination in this case isn’t game play, it’s numbers and an icon. The entire game is open to the player, but they must have the numbers so bad that they feel punished if they can’t get them as fast as other players.

I haven’t played the game more than once a week for almost a month now, thanks to other obligations. Yet here I am, not caring at all that there’s gameplay in front of pink text and numbers. Rewards only work when it feels like you’ve earned them. If I could get these things in 3 days of two hour-long sessions, I’d be bored.

Differing levels of effort to attain different levels of rewards (items in this case) sets short term (exotics) Mid term (ascended gear) and long term goals (legendary). These goals are important to the game because they motivate the player to play and keep coming back.

The time gates on ascended fulfill a purpose, they set the pace of the power progression curve to be gradual, but not too slow. Instead of encouraging marathon runs, it instead caters to the short-mid play sessions. However, the marathon play session is still rewarding. The longer you play, the more horizontal the rewards get. Different dungeon runs get you differing stats and new skins, farming rares for ecto gets you closer to legendary, etc. Hardcore gamers get to expand horizontally with their excess game time.

Hybridization, compromise.

To quote critickitten:

Imagine that….attempted compromise between two styles of play, who would ever dare to think such a ridiculous thought?

“I didn’t buy into GW2 being the second coming of christ.
I just wanted a AAA MMO with no sub made by ArenaNet. And it’s awesome.”

(edited by Mackdose.6504)

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Posted by: thisolderhead.5127

thisolderhead.5127

Assuming every asset/object is literally content…

Dropping more item assets doesn’t equate to content as many people are crying out for it, nor does slapping a reward system on top of exising content and suggesting it is a new thing.

So you’re saying that if ANet released one whole set of Ascended armor tomorrow, that’s not a “content update”?

I sure hope I’m not considered crazy for saying that yes, that would absolutely be a “content update”, because those items are content.

Content serves a variety of needs. Some content is designed to serve a need for more story (campaigns or maps), other content is simply to provide more ways to play (new modes or skills), and a third form of content seeks to help players feel as through they’ve achieved something and to reward their efforts (either with tangibles like equipment, or intangibles such as achievement systems).

That is why you’ll see some developers use the term to refer specifically to events, while others will use it to refer to new rewards and rewards systems. And this is also why the blanket term “downloadable content” is used to refer to any form of downloadable patching to the game, including aesthetics, gear, and rewards.

And the fact that we actually have to sit here and explain the varied usages of the term “content” so that people will stop whining about another person’s correct usage of the term in a different context….that’s just unfortunate, to say the least.

Actually I stated that I do assume that is “content” in line one, all assets and objects, etc.

Many people are misusing the term “content” in place of what they really want but are having trouble describing – new (to GW2) gameplay and encounters – due to straw splitting over jargon (which I approve of).

Slapping a system of reward (dailies) into the game does in the most literal programmers jargon make “content” but to the average joe, and from what I’ve seen most vocal critics, not offer enough meaningful gameplay.

Dailies aren’t meaningful gameplay, that is not what they are meant for either.

Feeling bad due to my response does not mean it was a personal attack.
It may just be that your original statement was wrong.
Please try again.

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Posted by: zuraith.6104

zuraith.6104

I LOVE the “gate”.

I have an extremely busy life, so being able to progress toward a goal in 2 hours, making just as much progress as my friends who sink 8 hours a night into the game, is a wonderful feeling. Without it, I’d eventually be driven away.

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Posted by: StormageddonBK.9842

StormageddonBK.9842

You’re using “content” in its literal form, I’m using content in the context of an MMO. MMO content is by and large used to describe gameplay:

So if ANet deleted all ‘non-game-play’ stuff they are not in fact deleting content? Seems like a silly definition of content to me as you would end up with boring shell of a game. Content is everything in the game including game-play, art, sounds, shinies, other players, and yes, even laurels are content.

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Posted by: kenshinakh.3672

kenshinakh.3672

Snipped with some kitten claws

The idea of getting ascended through more ways is good, and I do think Anet intends to make more ways of getting that gear, but I really think the current purpose of these time gates and limitations to ways of obtaining the ascended gear is to prevent people from getting ascended too quickly before new content is out.

Noticed how Laurels offered another way to get Ascended Rings, and also it gives the option of getting ascended necklaces? Ascended Rings have been out since FoTM, but ascended necklaces weren’t. Right now, only Laurels can get necklaces I think, but by the next content patch, I get the feeling that they’re going to offer more ways to get ascended necklaces (maybe through FoTM).

To me, it looks like they’re trying to prevent people from getting Ascended through past content so that people don’t just get it quickly with things they stockpiled up from the past. It’s meant to be a new tier of content for you to progress through and play through over time, not some gear to just get because you happened to stocked up on a certain amount of items.
And that makes sense. Why make new content when everyone who happens to have a lot of old stocked up things can suddenly get the newest item? If you’ve played in WoW, you know that they solved the issue of people getting the newest items with old currency by replacing the old currency or obsoleting it completely. It makes sense if you’re trying to keep an imbalance of gear power since it gives everyone the same chance at getting the gear.