Guild Wars 2

So, it’s confirmed that the Feature Pack will be out on the 15th April.

The first blog post shows the changes they’re making to Traits.

TL:DR

• Players will no longer require a manual to unlock trait tiers; they’ll be unlocked automatically at the appropriate level.
• New characters will now unlock Adept at 30, Master at 60 and Grandmaster at 80.
• They’re reducing the amount of points from 70 to 14, but each point will be worth 5 points.
• Players start earning points at 30, at a rate of one point every 6 levels until level 66, where this is increased to 2 points.

• Players can now reset their traits in the world providing they’re not in combat.
• Resetting traits is free!
• A minus button has been added, so you don’t have to reset if you mess up.

• All major traits will be locked on new characters.
• Players now have to hunt for Major Traits in the world (a la Skill Hunting in GW1).
• Players also have theoption of buying these traits from a guide.

• All professions will be getting new Grandmaster Traits for each line.

I for one welcome the changes to how Traits are aquired, as well as the ease in how they’ll be reset.

What does this mean, I’m confused about the language?

All major traits will be locked on new characters.

Anyway, I thought the new traits they talked about were interesting. Weird that a lot of them had to do with healing or vitality though.

So they are bringing the prerelease system back for acquiring traits. Finding them in the world by exploring and finishing specific challenges to get traits instead of the current system. I must say I approve 100%

There is only one little detail, the new system will make pre-80 characters weaker which can cause serious problems with dungeons and upscaled content (WvW and LS)
But other than that I LOVE the changes

As for the new traits, is it me, or all professions are getting something useful good except for Rangers? Really? Faster Longbow arrows is what they could think off?

Lilith Ajit.6173:

What does this mean, I’m confused about the language?

All major traits will be locked on new characters.

Anyway, I thought the new traits they talked about were interesting. Weird that a lot of them had to do with healing or vitality though.

It means you won’t be able to use any major traits until you unlock them, just like Skills. And you unlock the traits by finishing specific content

Lilith Ajit.6173:

What does this mean, I’m confused about the language?

All major traits will be locked on new characters.

Anyway, I thought the new traits they talked about were interesting. Weird that a lot of them had to do with healing or vitality though.

You know Major Traits (the big ones you can change)?

At the moment, as soon as you put 10 / 20 / 30 points in, you can choose any of the Major Traits for that tier? Well, in the update, they’ll be locking them on new characters, and players will have to unlock them. Kind of like GW1 skill hunting.

It means that new characters will have to earn the ability to unlock major traits through levelling and more specifically Grandmaster traits will have to be found/earnt throughout the game (or bought from trainers).

I for one would just like to voice how great these changes sound. I really think Anet has made an improvement here. Especially with the ability to alter your traits as you venture, I know thats been in demand for a long time. These changes should really help with build versatility and I hope it means we see some new builds across Tyria. As a Guardian, I really like the Force Of Will trait, Its always nice to have the option to expand the health pool. can’t wait to see what else they have in store. Kudos Anet

maddoctor.2738:

Lilith Ajit.6173:

What does this mean, I’m confused about the language?

All major traits will be locked on new characters.

Anyway, I thought the new traits they talked about were interesting. Weird that a lot of them had to do with healing or vitality though.

It means you won’t be able to use any major traits until you unlock them, just like Skills. And you unlock the traits by finishing specific content

Thanks for the clarification.

For some reason the language made me think that the major trait choices on new characters would be permanent, which is why I asked, lol.

I also like the sound of most changes, but I think what I’m most happy about is the upcoming blogs. I’m especially excited for the color one (dyes?) and the account bound one.

i don’t suppose they’ll be refunding the booklets bought prior to this change?
Anyway the changes are welcome

Those grandmaster traits, geezus bookah

And those aren’t even all of them! Imagine the choices!!!

DragonXRose.8534:

i don’t suppose they’ll be refunding the booklets bought prior to this change?
Anyway the changes are welcome

Right? And they also better refund those instant trait consumables I don’t get to use. But no wonder they took them from the TP and only have them as drops in BLCs.

some of this looks promising such as

Refunding traits is now free across the game: refund your traits any time you’re not in combat or in a competitive PvP match!

but then we have bits such as the new guardian trait

Force of Will, a trait that grants three hundred extra vitality when slotted (which amounts to three thousand health at level 80 from this trait alone).

that looks mandatory for pvp to me or

we’ve included the option for you to buy trait guides from profession trainers! The cost of current traits varies based on the tier of that trait. Newly added traits to the game will be set at a higher price point.

given that or face ridiculous unlock requirements such as

RNG trait book drop from arah p4 end boss 0.0002% chance

or 100g from trainer i know what most people will go for

given many of these will be significantly better than currently avainlable traits for certain builds there is the concern that they are pricing new players out of competitive builds

I love the idea of unlocking traits by doing things in the world. I can see these traits indirectly boosting population in many areas, since there’ll always be someone looking to unlock a new one.

That said, being able to skip those challenges and simply buy them outright…that is a slight concern.

Hopefully the cost will be high, so as to encourage players to actually play the game. A gold or two (plus maybe a laurel) for each might be enough.

Speaking of new players… no traits at all until level 30? Sounds like early levelling just got worse.

Shadow Blade.1324:

some of this looks promising such as

Refunding traits is now free across the game: refund your traits any time you’re not in combat or in a competitive PvP match!

but then we have bits such as the new guardian trait

Force of Will, a trait that grants three hundred extra vitality when slotted (which amounts to three thousand health at level 80 from this trait alone).

that looks mandatory for pvp to me or

we’ve included the option for you to buy trait guides from profession trainers! The cost of current traits varies based on the tier of that trait. Newly added traits to the game will be set at a higher price point.

given that or face ridiculous unlock requirements such as

RNG trait book drop from arah p4 end boss 0.0002% chance

or 100g from trainer i know what most people will go for

given many of these will be significantly better than currently avainlable traits for certain builds there is the concern that they are pricing new players out of competitive builds

As I said on the other thread, check the PICTURE on the trait unlocks. It says “Defeat the Risen High Wizard” there is no drop chance. You either do the event associated with the trait or pay money to the trainer.

Do we know if the trait books are going be RNG drops or a guaranteed drop from dungeons events and the like.

If it’s RNG based, and you can just go buy the books for gold. Being a devils advocate for the moment, is this not ‘pay to win’ as one can simply buy gold and get the trait?

Olvendred.3027:

Speaking of new players… no traits at all until level 30? Sounds like early levelling just got worse.

Yeah .. i’m happy about the free trait reset that we get, but i’m happy that i don’t want to level new characters in the next future.

Ooh, after over a year of turning GW2 away from all what GW1 was, Anet may implements a major GW1 mechanic.

Sounds cool, would have loved that from the beginning ofc….and I bet most of those GW vets who have already left too.

Maybe Anet starts to realize that chatacter customization is currently non-existant in GW2.

Maybe there is a real game designer left in some dark corner in Anets cellar (probably next to that missing story writer^^).

We’ll see…

maddoctor.2738:

As I said on the other thread, check the PICTURE on the trait unlocks. It says “Defeat the Risen High Wizard” there is no drop chance. You either do the event associated with the trait or pay money to the trainer.

thats the requirement for one trait,

Major traits will now be unlocked via traits guides, a new in-game item. Double-clicking on a trait guide will unlock its associated trait. You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world

the fact that its an item means there will be a drop rate

Shanaeri Rynale.6897:

Do we know if the trait books are going be RNG drops or a guaranteed drop from dungeons events and the like.

If it’s RNG based, and you can just go buy the books for gold. Being a devils advocate for the moment, is this not ‘pay to win’ as one can simply buy gold and get the trait?

From the picture, the trait appears to just unlock from a guaranteed drop, once you complete the event associated with it.

Hopefully that’s the case with all of them.

Source: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/traits-unleashed-forty-new-traits-and-more/

As part of this approach to making traits more approachable, we’ve pushed back the level at which the different trait tiers unlock for new characters in order to better pace the early game experience and to add more meaningful character progression from levels 30 to 80. Starting with this feature pack, new characters will unlock the adept tier at level 30, the master tier at level 60, and the grandmaster tier at level 80.

TLDR at bottom. I don’t do a TLDR very often, so count yourself lucky if you’re the kind of person who looks for them :p

Most of what I write here, will concern new players, and people new to a class, not people who have 1 of every class at level 80. It focuses on the LEVELLING aspect, and how they are removing player engagement, customization, and fun.

So instead of unlocking your trait access at level 11, it is being pushed back to 30?

Instead of getting the second tier of traits at level 40, new characters will now get access at level 60?

Instead of playing with and testing the Grandmaster traits at level 60, access is being withheld until level 80?

I’m sorry to say, but this damages your game. So do not do it.

It does not impact me, I have 9 characters, 7 are level 80, 2 more (that I never play anyway since launch) are almost there, and will be before this debacle.

Here are my reasons for why this proposed change is bad. Not that it matters, you’ll still charge ahead like a bull and release this monstrosity anyway.

Experimentation

A new player in the current system, can experiment with builds, in a minor way, once s/he hits level 11.

In the proposed system, a new player/character CANNOT even begin to experiment with builds, until level 30.

The core of this game revolves around what your trait build is.

If you TRIPLE this from level 11 to level 30, new players/characters are taking LONGER to learn the core part of the game. This is a bad thing. You want them to start learning the game as early as possible, not as late as possible.

At level 80, a characters first (sometimes only) build is finalized.

Currently, a player that reaches level 60 can experiment with different trait lines and find a play style or build that suits them. Once they get to level 80 they then gear up and trait up based on their favoured way of playing the class.

By pushing Grandmaster traits back to level 80 instead of 60, you stop people from learning the game, and deciding on how they want to play their character at level 80, until well after level 80.

This is bad, and you do not want this. So do not make this change to traits.

Boredom

A new player/character now has less to do, for much longer.

When I was levelling up different classes, I always hating having to wait until level 11 to start playing with traits, which define a class and the players play style. This was just level 2-11, technically not very long, and I was always bored waiting for it.

Now the only thing a new player/character has from level 2-30 is… unlock weapon swap… unlock 2 utility slots.

Ok, that’s incredibly boring.

You are locking a new player/character out from learning about, and engaging with, the class, until level 30, that’s a freaking long time.

You want people to customize and engage with their character, not bore them to death.

The best part of starting a new RPG, or a new character in an RPG, is character and class customization. What you are doing is punishing your player for even playing your game. You are locking them out of the most engaging part of RPG’s, for literally no logical reason.

Again, this is a bad change, listen to these words of wisdom, you do not want to do this.

Unlocking traits

As for unlocking skills by doing various in game feats? I’m all for it. Sounds fun, and it is a great part of any classic RPG.

Last but not least,

TLDR;

Raising the level at which players can customization their character, engage with the game/class, learn about the game/class, is a terrible change, you DO NOT want to go ahead with this. You WILL bore the player, and make them learn slower.

Between levels 2-30, the player is going to have less to do. LESS than current. LESS character engagement. LESS game engagement. While also being significantly weaker due to loss of stat points during this entire 2-30 phase.

sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet

Shadow Blade.1324:

given that or face ridiculous unlock requirements such as

RNG trait book drop from arah p4 end boss 0.0002% chance

or 100g from trainer i know what most people will go for

To be fair it does sound like it won’t be drops as such but rather something gained for doing a specific thing. Not a chance to gain something for doing something specific.

I remember in Aion, there were highly desirable skill signets that were a rare drop in the world. I wouldn’t mind having some really nice skills that have a low drop chance and worth 400g on the TP.

but that’s just me.

/agree

I’m really happy that i don’t plan to level any new character at the moment, since that all doesn’t really sounds funny but more like boredom.

Olvendred.3027:

Speaking of new players… no traits at all until level 30? Sounds like early levelling just got worse.

Yeah, I feel bad for anyone leveling under this system. Some professions are really lacking till you get into the master traits, which are now backed off till level 60. And having zero access to traits, and the extra attribute points they bring, up till level 30 might actually be worse.

Shadow Blade.1324:

maddoctor.2738:

As I said on the other thread, check the PICTURE on the trait unlocks. It says “Defeat the Risen High Wizard” there is no drop chance. You either do the event associated with the trait or pay money to the trainer.

thats the requirement for one trait,

Major traits will now be unlocked via traits guides, a new in-game item. Double-clicking on a trait guide will unlock its associated trait. You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world

the fact that its an item means there will be a drop rate

It says “You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world” there is no indication that it is a drop.

As in, complete the content and get it

I’m sure it’s coming, but not seeing any mention of save-able trait builds was a little disappointing.

I was thinking about this too, that raising the trait line to level 30 will give new players less to do for a longer time.

I did not like this with World of Warcraft either. Even if their old talent system were just a 1 point for a ‘’increase hit chance and damage by 1% per talent point’’ it gave the illusion of progress.

Now with their new talent tree, you gain like, 1 point every 15 level for 1 new ability or passive, and it’s boring as hell.

DragonXRose.8534:

i don’t suppose they’ll be refunding the booklets bought prior to this change?
Anyway the changes are welcome

I’ll gladly give them twice as much gold I’ve paid on all my characters for the change to make major traits unlockable by doing challenges in the open world… hunting elite skills was one of my favorite parts of GW1..

Vol.7601:

I remember in Aion, there were highly desirable skill signets that were a rare drop in the world. I wouldn’t mind having some really nice skills that have a low drop chance and worth 400g on the TP.

but that’s just me.

Never.

The day they gate new skills with RNG or Gem Store purchases is when I leave this game forever.

/disagree

This will not make any noticeable difference for new players, considering that effectiveness for new players is largely hindered by their lack of proper gearing rather than traiting.

Do you honestly think missing out on +10 points in one trait line is going to outweigh a lvl 30 war running around in lvl 20 clerics gear?

These changes are great and exactly what people wanted when they asked for horizontal progression.

So the major traits will only be locked on new characters but not on my existing 80s right? I really dont want to spend tons of money on getting all the traits for my characters

Agree with the OP.

And it’s not just the early levels. At least from level 30-80 you’ve got something rto do each level (assign a trait point) that actually makes it feel like you’ve gained something by levelling. Now, it will be rather more boring.

Not really looking forward to that thief trait. They’re a already enough of a pain in the kitten as it is. Now they’re just going to be even more annoying and able to kill more people.
Engineer trait looks interesting though. Though that depends on if turrets get some more love than just a reflect bubble for 4 seconds.

I am kinda happy with the new way of getting traits though. Really looking forward to being able to go do something specific to unlock a trait (even though I’d have to create a 13th character to get to do some of the tasks to unlock the current traits, since all my current won’t get to be able to).

Farzo.8410:

Now with their new talent tree, you gain like, 1 point every 15 level for 1 new ability or passive, and it’s boring as hell.

Maybe they should then also just reduce max level from 80 to 20 .. so starting with 6 we get at least 1 point every level.

And yes, i also like to see at least a little progress with a level up .. thats normally the reason for levelling.

Shadow Blade.1324:

maddoctor.2738:

As I said on the other thread, check the PICTURE on the trait unlocks. It says “Defeat the Risen High Wizard” there is no drop chance. You either do the event associated with the trait or pay money to the trainer.

thats the requirement for one trait,

Major traits will now be unlocked via traits guides, a new in-game item. Double-clicking on a trait guide will unlock its associated trait. You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world

the fact that its an item means there will be a drop rate

No, the fact that it’s an item means they can easily attach it to splash rewards (see the UI splash for stomping scarlet, or the bonus award for killing Assault Knights.)

Vol.7601:

These changes are great and exactly what people wanted when they asked for horizontal progression.

Levelling is, pretty much by definition, vertical progression.

I dislike this change. It feels like they’re trying to make the game far more grindy.
1. Why to increase the level a which you unlock traits? That makes the player weaker at the start and servers no other function besides slowing down their leveling.
2. I don’t think I like the fact that you can buy grandmaster traits. Depends on the price. If every single grandmaster trait book will cost you 10 gold, then I’m sorry, but that kind of grind added to the game is undesirable.
3. Why not to add specific challenge arena? At the moment how the trait unlocks will be handled makes me really dissatisfied. For example traits that unlock after running dungeons or doing WvW. That’s not making it like hunting traits like it was in GW1, that’s desperately trying to get people to grind old content just to unlock what they previously had.

The only concern I have with the new system is how it’s going to impact Dungeons and upscaled content (WvW and LS) since new players will become slightly weaker than how they are now.

Other than this I don’t see any of the issues the OP is posting.

1) New system will make you rely more on Dodges rather then Powering your builds.
2) New players won’t know what was prior so they won’t care, plus they’ll learn better 1)
3) Old players who still haven’t learned 1) will be forced to do this now
4) Don’t complain before you try it.
5) Forum people wanted players to up-their game and skill, you got it.
6) Relax. It’s not the end of the world nor does it damage this game. It’s time for the devs to focus on stuff like this so that people finally learn their professions and make Events like Wurms a lot more organized and easier.

skullmount.1758:

Not really looking forward to that thief trait. They’re a already enough of a pain in the kitten as it is. Now they’re just going to be even more annoying and able to kill more people.
Engineer trait looks interesting though. Though that depends on if turrets get some more love than just a reflect bubble for 4 seconds.

I am kinda happy with the new way of getting traits though. Really looking forward to being able to go do something specific to unlock a trait (even though I’d have to create a 13th character to get to do some of the tasks to unlock the current traits, since all my current won’t get to be able to).

Dude, turret bunkers are viable now! Smart engis will chain the bubbles of their turrets. I could have up to 9 seconds of reflect, and still have a spare utility slot for a kit! (Healing turret, Net Turret, Thumper Turret, Bomb Kit)

A level 29 currently has 19 trait points available. If you were to remove those, that would also mean the loss of 380 attribute points, which is quite a lot, actually too much compared to what gear at that level offers.

Some key traits will also be lost, which varies by class, that can greatly help leveling. But did it make leveling too easy? I always play severely undergeared (only equip what I find) with a main focus on damage gear, so I wouldn’t know.

Nabuko Darayon.9645:

1) New system will make you rely more on Dodges rather then Powering your builds.
2) New players won’t know what was prior so they won’t care, plus they’ll learn better 1)
3) Old players who still haven’t learned 1) will be forced to do this now
4) Don’t complain before you try it.
5) Forum people wanted players to up-their game and skill, you got it.
6) Relax. It’s not the end of the world nor does it damage this game. It’s time for the devs to focus on stuff like this so that people finally learn their professions and make Events like Wurms a lot more organized and easier.

Well yes, the new system is better to learn your class not worse.

Olvendred.3027:

Vol.7601:

These changes are great and exactly what people wanted when they asked for horizontal progression.

Levelling is, pretty much by definition, vertical progression.

The changes are about traits though not leveling. And traits are a mix of vertical (on which level they are unlocked) and horizontal (when/how to unlock them)

On the whole I look forward to the changes.

Yes, leveling will be a little tougher, but this game could probably use an injection of challenge.

maddoctor.2738:

Shadow Blade.1324:

maddoctor.2738:

As I said on the other thread, check the PICTURE on the trait unlocks. It says “Defeat the Risen High Wizard” there is no drop chance. You either do the event associated with the trait or pay money to the trainer.

thats the requirement for one trait,

Major traits will now be unlocked via traits guides, a new in-game item. Double-clicking on a trait guide will unlock its associated trait. You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world

the fact that its an item means there will be a drop rate

It says “You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world” there is no indication that it is a drop.

As in, complete the content and get it

read back to the top where it says

traits guides, a new in-game item

if its an automatic unlock why the item?
they could just give you points to allocate how you please, or automatically unlock it once you have met the requerements, no need at all for an item.
the fact that they are specifying its an item indicates there will be a drop rate, on some encounters for some guides that may well be 100%, but i doubt it will be for all of them anet uses rng too frequently for me to believe it wont be present here.

in regards to splash rewards, you also get laurels and exp on those, so why an item and not a currency etc

Minus button… finally i do not need to reset after reset because I decide I didn’t want that last 5 points to go into power but into toughness.

To OP, these changes are for the best, when I was a new play I did the scenario of 11 and 14 in another. This way makes much more sense.

/disagree

I think this is fine for new players, but will bore experienced players leveling an alt. Which will discourage creating and leveling.

To me this is a good change.

Malchior.5042:

skullmount.1758:

Not really looking forward to that thief trait. They’re a already enough of a pain in the kitten as it is. Now they’re just going to be even more annoying and able to kill more people.
Engineer trait looks interesting though. Though that depends on if turrets get some more love than just a reflect bubble for 4 seconds.

I am kinda happy with the new way of getting traits though. Really looking forward to being able to go do something specific to unlock a trait (even though I’d have to create a 13th character to get to do some of the tasks to unlock the current traits, since all my current won’t get to be able to).

Dude, turret bunkers are viable now! Smart engis will chain the bubbles of their turrets. I could have up to 9 seconds of reflect, and still have a spare utility slot for a kit! (Healing turret, Net Turret, Thumper Turret, Bomb Kit)

Except that I’m pretty sure they can still be killed by ground targeted abilities (ie ele staff fire skill #2, can’t remember its name). So yes they are slightly more durable, but unless they increase the turrets armor/health they’ll still die too fast.

Shadow Blade.1324:

maddoctor.2738:

Shadow Blade.1324:

maddoctor.2738:

As I said on the other thread, check the PICTURE on the trait unlocks. It says “Defeat the Risen High Wizard” there is no drop chance. You either do the event associated with the trait or pay money to the trainer.

thats the requirement for one trait,

Major traits will now be unlocked via traits guides, a new in-game item. Double-clicking on a trait guide will unlock its associated trait. You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world

the fact that its an item means there will be a drop rate

It says “You can find trait guides by completing specific content in the world” there is no indication that it is a drop.

As in, complete the content and get it

read back to the top where it says

traits guides, a new in-game item

if its an automatic unlock why the item?
they could just give you points to allocate how you please, or automatically unlock it once you have met the requerements, no need at all for an item.
the fact that they are specifying its an item indicates there will be a drop rate, on some encounters for some guides that may well be 100%, but i doubt it will be for all of them anet uses rng too frequently for me to believe it wont be present here.

There is also the item, so that people who don’t want to (or don’t have the time) do the specific task can still unlock it. They just go buy the item and it gives them it.

I can’t say I like the “unlocking” mechanism at all.

I thought it was inane and stupid in GW1, and I don’t see how it’s going to be any better in GW2, especially if they start adding a bunch of traits. I hated having to hunt down a specific boss to find an elite I HAD to have if I was going to be accepted into GW1’s group play. I’m going to loathe it if it starts becoming prevalent in GW2 as well.