Guild Wars 2

Heya,
I have to believe this has been mentioned before and if so, maybe I can shed some light on it again.

I often find myself wanting to dodge (I play a mesmer mainly and use it to make extra clones) but when I do I end up falling off a cliff to an even worse doom than if I had just taken the hit (or gone without the extra clone). To that end and some others I will mention. I think it would be very beneficial if there was an option to:

\o/ Dodge roll in place!!! \o/ (<—-cheering people to either side … at least in my head ^.^)

Another reason I would like to mention is that several traits give an effect at the end of a dodge roll. One for warrior, that does damage, and one for elementalist, that does an attunment based effect … there may be more I do not know of or cannot recall at the moment. I believe it would be more useful to on occasion dodge roll in place to have these effects trigger where you are at, instead of where you are rolling too. It would give them a great deal more control and usefulness.

A further reason … and why I intitally though of this to begin with is that of tanking. I know that the game does not have hard Tank/Heal/Dps roles, and I love that about the game (being a veteran of 8 years of World of Warcraft). However sometimes it is fun to try and focus more towards one of those bents. I was thinking that “Tanking” in this game would be much easier if you could dodge roll in place and not risk losing aggro on a boss because it chose a new target, at a closer proximity to it, now that you have dodged across the room. Though tanking is not really a part of this game, I believe that players who choose to try it on as something new (or fondly remembered on occasion from previous digital lives) would have a better go at it.

… And of course the whole dodge rolling off a cliff thing I mentioned at the top and would be grateful to never encounter again (except of course by and errant keystroke, that seems ever to be the bane of my existence :P)

I’m sure there are other reasons as well (which hopefully others can shed light on in this post) but I’ll stop there and give my thoughts on how maybe to achieve this.

My first thought (and favorite, might I add) is to make it a keyable option so that you would have the normal dodge roll key (“V” by default) and the dodge roll in place key (“C” or the like … not sure if “C” does something else already … it would be changeable anyway, none the less)

A second option I was thinking of is maybe making it a toggle with the normal dodge roll, so out of combat you could switch your dodge roll to dodge roll in place for certain times when it would be more useful cough jumping puzzles cough. This option would be less versatile I think, but adding restrictions is sometimes a fun challenge and it would be better than not being able to dodge roll at all (for fear of falling to one’s death)

A third option may be to add it to Trait lines (maybe specifically the ones that have effects that happen at the end of a dodge roll or are more “Tanky” in nature). Thus giving the player the choice whether or not they feel it is beneficial enough to add to their build. (Though again I would prefer the first option … this is way better than nothing)

Hopefully this will be useful food for thought … or a happy reminder of old thoughts, with perhaps a chance of adding some additional useful function to the game I am coming to know and love.

Thanks, and Cheers, and Well Wishes!
~A~

Would a ‘dodge roll in place’ just equal a manually triggered block? I’d like that but it might invalidate shield skills for example ( http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block ).

Dodge rolling in place and avoiding attacks would make even less sense than what we have now.

Not a fan of this idea.
Although I try to imagine how this would look and I laugh. I can already see my sylvari doing some matrix moves to evade rangers Rapid Fire while in place.

I don’t think it would help much. Then again, I don’t have much difficulty dodging in the directions I mean to, so the op’s stated reason for desiring this has no meaning to me.

Urosh Uchiha.9732:

Not a fan of this idea.
Although I try to imagine how this would look and I laugh. I can already see my sylvari doing some matrix moves to evade rangers Rapid Fire while in place.

Your comment are on a role today. Kitten, been laughing too kitten much…

As for your idea, while it SOUNDS good, you really should just dodge a bit better. :P

I think part of playing the game is learning to be aware of the direction you’re dodging in, and the consequences of doing so, no?

I think you can dodge/roll now if you’re backed up against something can’t you?

This is pretty much why everyone tries stacking in corners and on walls right? So we can roll in place (against the wall) and maintain DPS. Dodge rolling in place is pretty much already being accomplished wherever possible (and of course already looks ridiculous). With the exception of champions and bosses that are out in the open.

That said, I really wouldn’t care if this changed to OP’s idea or not, since we are in essence already doing it whenever possible.

Flatley.1620:

I think you can dodge/roll now if you’re backed up against something can’t you?

Yes, that is a common “trick” against bosses in dungeons.
If you are against a wall and you dodge towards that, you’ll dodge in place.

I would welcome the addition of a stationary evade toggle option to this game by just tapping the evade key without any directional keys being held. It’s an option I would certainly use, but it’s probably considered a balance issue for PvP so we get screwed over by no PvE/PvP split yet again.

When I’m doing CoF p1 in particular I find myself wishing I had this option so I don’t have to re-engage the effigy boss after his AoE attacks. It’s a slight loss of DPS to have to walk back into melee range after every evade.

SKATE.1394:

When I’m doing CoF p1 in particular I find myself wishing I had this option so I don’t have to re-engage the effigy boss after his AoE attacks. It’s a slight loss of DPS to have to walk back into melee range after every evade.

Dodge through him and turn around. I think that gives more or less the same result.

You have to be holding forward to dodge through a target, and since there are generally falling crystals that might require two quick, successive dodges or strafing to avoid both a crystal and then the effigy AoE, this maneuver wouldn’t always be helpful. Dodging in place, however, would always give you the desired result no matter what’s occurring on screen. Plus turning still takes time, even if you have an about-face hotkeyed.

dlonie.6547:

I think part of playing the game is learning to be aware of the direction you’re dodging in, and the consequences of doing so, no?

This. If you can dodge in place, it just becomes a get out of taking damage button.

I’m going to have to go with “no” on this one. The ability to stand in one spot and fight an entire battle without moving kills the “active” part of combat.

SKATE.1394:

You have to be holding forward to dodge through a target, and since there are generally falling crystals that might require two quick, successive dodges or strafing to avoid both a crystal and then the effigy AoE, this maneuver wouldn’t always be helpful. Dodging in place, however, would always give you the desired result no matter what’s occurring on screen. Plus turning still takes time, even if you have an about-face hotkeyed.

I agree it would make it easier, but I don’t think that’s a good reason to modify the (already overpowered) dodge functionality to be even more OP. Part of playing the game is being aware of things like where the crystals are falling and what’s going on around you. As for the time loss, again, I think that’s just part of the fight.

Managing defiant stacks and interrupting the big PBAoE attacks is the alternative that we have, and will let you avoid having to dodge/about-face :-)

Neural.1824:

I’m going to have to go with “no” on this one. The ability to stand in one spot and fight an entire battle without moving kills the “active” part of combat.

I disagree, the engaging part of combat isn’t always about moving unless your playstyle is kiting. Knowing the enemy’s tells and reacting properly and on time is what makes combat “active” in my opinion.

There are already stationary evades in the game which defeat this argument, blurred frenzy for the mesmer, distortion, pistol whip for the thief, aegis and counter attacks can loosely fit into this category as well.

All this would add is more personal control over your character, it’s just matter of whether they consider this ability to be advantageous in PvP or not. For PvE, a toggle option to enable this action would mean you wouldn’t have to use it if you don’t want to, and people that would like to do so can.

dlonie.6547:

I agree it would make it easier, but I don’t think that’s a good reason to modify the (already overpowered) dodge functionality to be even more OP. Part of playing the game is being aware of things like where the crystals are falling and what’s going on around you. As for the time loss, again, I think that’s just part of the fight.

As I noted above, I don’t think it does anything to make a fight trivial, as much as provide you with more character control. I don’t agree with the sentiment that a stationary dodge would be “overpowered”, given there are already abilities in the game that produce the same effect which I’ve listed, this just opens them up to all classes instead of a few. The DPS gains would realistically be single digit percentages at best, it’s more a quality of life change if you ask me.

It’s not like the game would suddenly be broken and nobody would ever directional dodge again if this were implemented, it’d be a situational tool.

You used to be able to dodge and immediately cancel into a skill to get the dodge effect/endurance burn without actually wasting time or positioning actually rolling. It made guardians and mesmers way too good though so Anet nerfed it. I doubt they’ll revert it two years later.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

You used to be able to dodge and immediately cancel into a skill to get the dodge effect/endurance burn without actually wasting time or positioning actually rolling. It made guardians and mesmers way too good though so Anet nerfed it. I doubt they’ll revert it two years later.

I wasn’t playing when this was an option, but that sounds like a design issue. You can still implement the same length of animation delay with a stationary dodge that only nullifies the positional change, and doesn’t offer any roman-cancel type ability to do a quick spell counter.

It can be done

Karizee.8076:

It can be done

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InZiEBaTrnU

lol that’s just another odd latency glitch from too many actions happening at once and requires a weapon swap, so not really useful as some sort of advanced tactic. It’s no different from the occasional dodge-in-place that already happens once in a blue moon, or quickly swapping to grenade kit after firing main-hand with an engi and having the grenades rocket out without having to ground target.

what your suggesting is essentially the “Evade” stat most eastern mmo’s use, and i’m entirely against that. its easy enough to dodge 90% of attacks in the game already, to add any kind of evade functionality would just make it all too easy.

the simple solution to your problem is to pay just the tiniest bit of attention, and don’t put your back to a kitten cliff. also, if you hold a direction key while dodging, you dodge in that direction, so even if you are backed to a cliff, you can still evade without falling down it.

Just evade towards another direction, you don’t need to evade backwards…

A block would be a nice effect something that cut dmg down but eats your energy for each hit. As for dodging in place its a bit too much like the RNG dodging system from non action mmorpgs stand there get hit in the faces but you some how avoided it its realty silly when you sit down and think about it.

@OP, roll against a static object, building, wall etc.

I may be wrong, but I think the only profession that doesnt have a stationary evade or block right now is the necromancer (which has access to an ultra deep HP pool through DS instead).

Aeolus.3615:

@OP, roll against a static object, building, wall etc.

this is good.

“Ducking” could be an interesting mechanic. It could be done in place, but the downside is that it wouldn’t avoid everything that a full dodge roll does.

SKATE.1394:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

You used to be able to dodge and immediately cancel into a skill to get the dodge effect/endurance burn without actually wasting time or positioning actually rolling. It made guardians and mesmers way too good though so Anet nerfed it. I doubt they’ll revert it two years later.

I wasn’t playing when this was an option, but that sounds like a design issue. You can still implement the same length of animation delay with a stationary dodge that only nullifies the positional change, and doesn’t offer any roman-cancel type ability to do a quick spell counter.

Well I’m already spamming Anet asing them to implement YRC and FADC so let’s see how that goes.

Despite how visually odd dodge rolling on the spot would look, dodging is supposed to be a tactical decision and require some skill to use effectively. While dodging in place would retain part of the tactical decision, it would lose part of it, and part of the skill involved too.

The tactical decision isn’t just whether to attack or dodge, its also whether to stay in one spot attacking or move in a specified direction and dodge. And as to the element of skill, its not just timing the dodge, its being aware of your surroundings and dodge rolling in the right direction.

I personally prefer the higher skill requirement of the moving dodge, so would not be keen on a stationary version, especially when we already have blinds and blocks which can be used without moving and have similar defensive capabilities.

I have dodge rolled to death a couple of times. You just learn to be more careful of your environment each time.