Does toughness increase your agro threat?

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Ryou.2398

Ryou.2398

I heard this somewhere and was thinking of buying the condi rabids for now in orr for my rev just for fracs and stuff until I can get my hands on some vipers.

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

New Main- 80 Thief – P/P- Vault Spam Pro

221 hours over 1,581 days of bank space/hot pve/lion’s arch afk and some wvw.

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Khisanth.2948

Khisanth.2948

True for raids.
In general PvE it depends on the specific mob.

Some fractal bosses have their own fixation mechanic that is independent of it.

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

All foes have their own aggro mechanic, not just bosses. Sometimes toughness matters most, sometimes it’s who’s causing the most pain or the weakest etc.

Rabid or even Dire is fine while you are saving up for Viper’s. Sinister is better if you have access to that from old living story or whatever.

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Cyninja.2954

Cyninja.2954

Short answer: Yes.

Long answer: Yes but there are multiple factors which play a role. If toughness has any effect is also dependant on where in the game (open world, fractals, raids, etc.) and against which enemy you are fighting.

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Paulytnz.7619

Paulytnz.7619

Let me tell you what I have noticed with toughness gear from my experience.

In the very old days when I did bother with dungeons just for the completion of those achievements I would notice that every single mob would focus me no matter what. That one dungeon where you have literally millions of devourers running around was no fun.

Out in the open field: About a week ago I completed the new map/story with my Ele who was still in toughness gear. Now I was not even attacking anything, just moving from story point to story point and gathering as I went. It wasn’t long before I was attacked by some annoying creature as I was gathering from a node simply because another player who had aggroed it bought it too close to me. Now you may think but that happens all the time as that player just left the attack range of the mob. Not true however as the other player stopped running to also gather from the same node I was. So I became the target simply because I was wearing the toughness gear even when I had not attacked the creature or any other creature anywhere and was not in a combat stance/status.

This continued through my whole experience of doing this map.

Toughness has it’s places in the game still but I think you have to know when, where and which classes to use it on. It is VERY important to understand that toughness alone wont keep you alive/standing and invincible. In fact it can become the complete opposite if you are not prepared for it because as I have said above you may become the target of all attacks. You need other things to help keep you alive. Such as food HP regen possibly, VIT stat, traits/skills from your class that bring extra healing. There are also runes that can help.

There has also been many debates on these forums over which is better to use, Zerk or Toughness based gear. You can also add in the Condi option now as a second sort of “Zerk”.

Now the Zerk side will argue it is better because you will wipe enemies faster and before they have too much time to damage you and wear you down. This is especially true for bosses.

On the other hand the toughness crowd will argue “but if I am in toughness gear and alive longer then I can help to res you and draw aggro while you are doing the damage”. Now this could sort of be true too.

What I think both sides fail to address is that it totally depends on the group as a whole and the comp. So lets look at a 5 man party in a dungeon setting. 4 going Zerk and 1 toughness would not be ideal (as I have experienced in my old days lol). Simply because that 1 Toughness guy may be still getting wiped simply because every mob is attacking him and the bosses may hit him with their 1 shot mechanics which he may not be prepared for or understand how to avoid.

The way I think it goes is like this:

Zerk works if everyone (or the majority if 1 random toughness or whatever else slips in without being noticed) is using it. Simply because they are doing a lot of damage and even if they are downed they get up quicker because they are still doing more damage when they are downed (helps to get a kill for an instant back to your feet). Also their allies are killing faster so again they can help to get that player back up.

Since when did this business of being a hero become being a business?

(edited by Paulytnz.7619)

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Paulytnz.7619

Paulytnz.7619

Now here’s something people may not be prepared for imo:

Toughness CAN work, and again if EVERYONE is using it or the majority of them are. Huh but what!? How so, you are killing slower!? Think about it why does zerk work? It’s not only because they kill faster. Even some bosses still take ages to kill if everyone is in zerk gear after all. So what is the other factor then? Well, simply put, everyone spreads the damage taken around them. What I mean is because they are all in a similar “toughness” range they are all targeted from time to time from various mobs and the bosses depending on the combat situation and the mechanics/aggro conditions assigned to those creatures (as mentioned above they are different for all mobs/bosses).

You may be up close hitting the boss in the face alongside your other members but then take a hit too much so retreat a bit to heal. Doing this may then cause the boss/mob to hit the nearest “threat”. Thus you are spreading the damage around due to similar “toughness” and the battle situation, pulling back to heal and range a bit while they damage and take the damage.

Now back to the toughness. The same thing happens here. The only difference is you may be able to take an extra hit or 2 before having to retreat and you may not get downed at all, EVER depending on what other survival you have built into your build (hp regens, healing skills traits etc). But again this is if ALL or the majority of the party has toughness gear as well. Because again the party is spreading the damage around, pulling back when needed and have similar toughness to allow that sharing of damage around.

Does it take longer to kill the boss/mobs tho? Maybe, it might be slightly longer it still depends on build etc tho. My Engi main tho (and possibly Ele in toughness) I swear can still be just as effective and do very similar damage amounts with the right build.

Okay I have written too much for a simple question lol but it has been something I have meant to post for some time now in the “toughness vs Zerk” argument that I think people have not looked at.

TLDR:

So, is Toughness gear worth having? Short answer it depends. If you are fighting world bosses all day long why not? You will stay alive longer and help res allies and such. The kills will still go fast due to the zerg.

In PvP? Not really possible anymore. WvW? Yes use it here but take what you can to deal with condis. Fractals/Dungeons? If you know your class and are pugging – no. If you are running with a group of friends or guildies who are experiencing it all for the first time then maybe yes. But make sure you understand the group comp before hand and maybe make a group decision as to what the group will use as a whole.

Okay now I will shut up lmao.

Since when did this business of being a hero become being a business?

(edited by Paulytnz.7619)

Does toughness increase your agro threat?

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Posted by: Ryou.2398

Ryou.2398

Wow thanks for the explanation pauly!