Guild Wars 2

I’ve played Guild Wars since GW 1 was in beta. Over many years I have come to love the world of Tyria, and the entire world of Guildwars.

As a GW1 veteran, I can’t help but feel that a lot of what made that game so great was simply lost in GW2. There is no pressing need to form parties or be social at all. In fact outside of dungeons, I have played more or less solo throughout the whole of the game.

The feeling of triumph we had when we got our entire party to Lion’s Arch, or through the Crystal Desert is totally missing. The shared moments of triumph, or defeat that defined the world of Tyria is just not epic anymore.

However, it can be fixed. All the game mechanics are already in place. This is an excellent opportuity to bring back what was so great about GW 1, while simultaneously giving us end game content.

Create scripted missions that start at the front gate of one of the main cities and end at specific towns or waypoints. Then design those missions so it requires teamwork and cooperation, like the old shiverpeaks missions where we had to save the dwarves from invasion. Then set it for level 80 difficulty. Not pointlessly overpowered monsters as we see in the dungeons, but monsters our level. You guys were able to do it in GW1 and make challenging missions without having to artificially increase he stats of monsters.

Once the layers made their party, start a separate instance. That way level 80 characters could play without clogging up the gameworld for low level toons who are trying to level up.

There’s politics in Tyria, this’ll give you an opportunity to explore those. Scripted battles between rival guilds, or political intrigue that takes players on a multiplayer adventure together.

Most importantly, allow people to fully get rewards for playing in someone else’s campaign. Right now, story missions penalize players for playing together. There are no rewards for helping, difficulties don’t scale, and the missions are just plain boring and easy.

Right now Tyria doesn’t feel compelling. It feels like a cartoon with hostile monsters everywhere that I just run by because I don’t have time to fight them. There isn’t any motivation to experience the world. But add in a lvl 80 campaign mode for all the maps and design each as a 5 player cooperative mission, then add in the GW 1, mission completion requirement to move to the next area, and it’ll turn Tyria into something really great again.

Love the idea, doubt it will ever be implemented, but I dig it, and the thought behind it. I wouldn’t mind seeing instanced vanquishes come back either.

They could even make it so these missions start in the Guild Hall, and would be full on guild campaigns. You ever wonder why a game called Guild Wars, only uses guilds as a cosmetic chat room effect and doesn’t have it tied into the core gameplay? I always did.

Good post.

Well thought out, well written. I hope it gets the attention it deserves.

Derenek.8931:

There is no pressing need to form parties or be social at all.

There was no need to form parties or be social in GW1 either. You could easily play through most of the game with only henchmen; elite areas being the exception. When full hero teams were finally allowed, even the elite areas could be completed by yourself.

I like the idea, but like Healix said you could as easily complete GW1 without a party. In fact a lot of people in my guild did exactly that and even complained that they couldn’t do the same with GW2. Some of them want to get heroes to complete dungeons and other stuff like that alone.

Your idea could be cool, but I doudt that Anet will implement something like that. The group challenging content they are talking about for the expansion seem to fill about the same void, but in instance and my bet is that Anet will leave it at that.

Unfortunately too many people play MMOs as single player games, OP. No idea why.

Vayne.8563:

Unfortunately too many people play MMOs as single player games, OP. No idea why.

Because everyone is different, has a different definition of fun, and a game like GW2 is a great platform to provide a gaming experience that caters to all types whether they prefer solo, small group, or large group content.

I find it much easier to find people to play with and reasons for them to play with me in GW2.

In GW1 almost every time I asked for someone to help me do a mission I’d get a mix of 3 responses:
1) You can do it with henchmen/heroes.
2) Sorry I’ve already done that one. But I’ll do the hard mode version with you when it’s the Zaishen mission.
3) You can do it solo, you just need to switch to a completely different profession.

Whereas in GW2 there’s decent incentives even for people who have done everything once to do it again (except maybe playing through someone else’s personal story) and it’s much easier to meet people who are doing the same things you are because you can actually run into them out in the world instead of hoping to catch someone using the same outpost when they’re just about to start.

I love GW1 but this is one aspect I absolutely don’t miss.

Danikat.8537:

I find it much easier to find people to play with and reasons for them to play with me in GW2.

In GW1 almost every time I asked for someone to help me do a mission I’d get a mix of 3 responses:
1) You can do it with henchmen/heroes.
2) Sorry I’ve already done that one. But I’ll do the hard mode version with you when it’s the Zaishen mission.
3) You can do it solo, you just need to switch to a completely different profession.

Whereas in GW2 there’s decent incentives even for people who have done everything once to do it again (except maybe playing through someone else’s personal story) and it’s much easier to meet people who are doing the same things you are because you can actually run into them out in the world instead of hoping to catch someone using the same outpost when they’re just about to start.

I love GW1 but this is one aspect I absolutely don’t miss.

He’s talking about a version of GW1 you never got to play. Back when there were no Heroes, and Henchmen were truly kittened last resorts for the desperate. People teamed up because once you got out of the most basic areas of the game you had to if you wanted to progress. Later on the rebalanced henchmen so they actually had 8 skills and one of them was a decent elite, and you could actually use them for most of the game as you mentioned, but it didn’t start out that way.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Game_updates/20091022

found, it, the henchmen balance pass 3 years after launch.

A.Net said there would be no end game since it is a ‘living world’ (that is debatable in another thread ).

Orion Templar.4589:

Vayne.8563:

Unfortunately too many people play MMOs as single player games, OP. No idea why.

Because everyone is different, has a different definition of fun, and a game like GW2 is a great platform to provide a gaming experience that caters to all types whether they prefer solo, small group, or large group content.

I’ve never found MMOs to be brilliant at anything that a single player game can’t do better….except doing stuff with people. MMO never have the best stories, never have the best combat, never have the best customization, but that’s the price you have for being able to play with hundreds of people.

Danikat.8537:

I find it much easier to find people to play with and reasons for them to play with me in GW2.

In GW1 almost every time I asked for someone to help me do a mission I’d get a mix of 3 responses:
1) You can do it with henchmen/heroes.
2) Sorry I’ve already done that one. But I’ll do the hard mode version with you when it’s the Zaishen mission.
3) You can do it solo, you just need to switch to a completely different profession.

Whereas in GW2 there’s decent incentives even for people who have done everything once to do it again (except maybe playing through someone else’s personal story) and it’s much easier to meet people who are doing the same things you are because you can actually run into them out in the world instead of hoping to catch someone using the same outpost when they’re just about to start.

I love GW1 but this is one aspect I absolutely don’t miss.

My suggestion wasn’t for the entirety of the game. It was only for Level 80 characters for End Game content and running dungeons. Right now you are right, there is t any end game content that’s challenging for any player. The dungeons are difficult to beat because the monster’s stats are artificially raised, little attention was paid to the AI or Mission design. (This is clear to see be because how players complete dungeons, they find a corner to trap the monster in, then exploit or take advantage of flaws in the game design, such as lack of collision detection and poor monster AI to spam AOE and point damage simultaneously all at one spot until the mob dies. Had that mob been a player it would have moved immediately to avoid any location with five players all stacked up with twenty AOE rings surrounding them.)

But, every PUG is a group trying to run the dungeon As fast as possible, everything is “Exp level 80 Berserkers only”…. It really sucks the fun out of playing if your intent isn’t gold farming. 2 dedicated players with three AI henchmen. Because Anet AI is notoriously horrible, it would be a great challenge to make it through and keep your henchmen alive.

Open world currently is a joke. At level 80, all it is really, is an impediment for getting to dungeons and world bosses. Most players run by at maximum speed ignoring everything around them. Every monster is bypassed, most stories completely ignored. It is completely non-immersive.

I suggested in another thread, that lol 80 characters be placed in their own servers with “Hard Mode” Campaign missions between cities. So instead of running for five minutes past things you don’t care about, players would have to join a full party of 5 or a Raid group of 3 or more parties, and complete a campaign mission to get to the next zone.

That’s what challenging end game content should be about, not this solo crap Anet has posted hints about. If I wanted to play solo, I’d play dragon age or the Witcher. They are superior games as far as the single player experience is concerned. GW is an MMO. Make some multiplayer requirements.

I am not sure of the best way technically track it (maybe combo actions since they measure them already with some other metric) but somehow record doing things in teams. With perhaps some sort of recognition. As simple as a title would work as an encouragement.

Derenek.8931:

Open world currently is a joke. At level 80, all it is really, is an impediment for getting to dungeons and world bosses. Most players run by at maximum speed ignoring everything around them. Every monster is bypassed, most stories completely ignored. It is completely non-immersive.

This is way too true, and I agree on all points. A separate “Level 80” world map would be great, and there’s so much potential. A separate Cursed Shore anyone? I remember Trahearne telling me some lie about how Orr was going to be remade in one of those final story episodes and I remember being mad excited, and then there was no change. I think it would be amazing for maps in the world to be altered for you and other players that have completed personal stories/reached level 80. It would actually make me want to do my personal story and finally add something somewhat “end-game” for level 80s.

True, the campaign rewards were pretty worthless. The only memorable thing about tem was my frustration in not being able to salvage them.

Vayne.8563:

Unfortunately too many people play MMOs as single player games, OP. No idea why.

Many people are unable to understand that competition and cooperation can coexist.
The exception is WVW players and look how much attention being given them and their preferred game mode.

You could see that be in a team was required to play the Zaithen dungeon, and that didn’t work at all.
The problem with forcing players to group is that foments a toxic community, like you see in dungeons and fractals, wher if you like playing a necro or ranger you get no chance to be accepted in an group “lf exp warrior, ele, thief for fractals”

If it would be my choice i’d get rid of all dungeons/fractals altogether. they are the definition of repetitive and boring to the point it’s only run by farmers in a speed runs.

My choice would be to make a real living world, linking the events to enemies instead a locations so the enemy can move around shaping the world. Right now how the events are handled with a lot of players just waiting at the spawn spot just for farming is just bad.
The AI engine been able to send champs with the hordes to another city just to wipe it out would be cool. You’d be forced to talk to the NPCs to gather information of the whereabouts and direction of that champion and asks for help in the mapchat when you get to their location.
It would give new experiences like helping to break a siege or siege another city stronghold with some sense of continuity and that the players actions matter . Something like The Silverwastes without all that rinse and repeat that is embedded right now in the spawn system.

I like to play the game but the spawn system is so outdated.

This is similar to what I suggested. However, I don’t believe being in a party is toxic to a multiplayer game.

In GW1 in the Cantha expansion there were numerous missions that involved multiple parties working together. By combining it with your suggestion of an actual Living World, you could have a Raid group of 3 parties, which need to split up and simultaneously complete objectives to move to the next story zone.

I.e. Players from Rata Sum and Divinity’s reach would have to fight their way to a point in the Brisbane wildlands, while escorting supplies. At the same time a third party, would hold the meeting encampment against attackers. Once all three parties meet up, that phase of the mission is over.

Players who fought their way to Brisbane would then be wired up for defend. While players who have already done the defense phase can join a Raid group to Assaukt the Sylvari Capital in order to retake it from rebel Sylvari.

This gives the opportunity for numerous massive battles. As well as creating a high level campaign without having to make any new maps.

If Guilds are allowed to choose a faction, then it would be an great guild type adventure series. Guilds could then be tasked with escort missions, Assaukt, and even stealth type spy missions.

For smaller group missions, take a five man party and split it up into two groups. Each group leads a platoon of 15 NPC creatures. One of the NPC’s is a high value asset. A guild on the other side is tasked with assassinating that NPC, and escaping without a party wipe.

Every map could have any number of specific instanced missions.

The living story was all single player mainly. There needs to be an actual multiplayer instanced component. So people who want to farm can do dungeons and fractals. People who want to solo can do living story quests. Then the epic high level group challenge scenarios would fill that final gap of multiplayer campaign that is challenging, but not repetitive, as different towns would be under different faction control, and different units can be assigned for each mission.

By adding in this randomness factor Anet can stop the elitist mentality in current dungeons. Since you’ll never know what forces the party will be facing, nobody can force people to play only a specific class of character. Roaming patrols can make it far more difficult for people to run memorized routes. (Especially if the patrol sends a messenger to their allies and brings back reinforcements. This allows for strategic stealth gameplay also)
At the end of every day cycle, the faction with the low score is queue up for defensive missions the next day. High scorers will have offensive type missions. At the end of the week winners can be announced and guilds rewarded.

lol, maybe the devs actually do read the posts. I just looked up this old post and the new pvp and raid designs are awfully similar to what I wrote. :-)

Derenek.8931:

lol, maybe the devs actually do read the posts. I just looked up this old post and the new pvp and raid designs are awfully similar to what I wrote. :-)

Right….
They stole your idea and implemented them in about a week.
Way cool.

Yargesh.4965:

Derenek.8931:

lol, maybe the devs actually do read the posts. I just looked up this old post and the new pvp and raid designs are awfully similar to what I wrote. :-)

Right….
They stole your idea and implemented them in about a week.
Way cool.

…and here I was being happy thinking that he devs read my post… and now you killed it… So mean.. lmao

Yargesh.4965:

Derenek.8931:

lol, maybe the devs actually do read the posts. I just looked up this old post and the new pvp and raid designs are awfully similar to what I wrote. :-)

Right….
They stole your idea and implemented them in about a week.
Way cool.

Them devs. They be fast workers, yo.