no, then arena net will lose money because people who bought the game 6 months ago like me will have to pay less for the expansion instead of paying for the entire game again. i wish i joined this game when it became f2p.
no, then arena net will lose money because people who bought the game 6 months ago like me will have to pay less for the expansion instead of paying for the entire game again. i wish i joined this game when it became f2p.
Kinda of topic but…
If I joined the game when it went f2p, this is what I have now that I wouldn’t have if I did join when it went f2p.
- 16k AP.
- Enjoyed GW2 for over 3 years.
- Enjoyed Season 1 and maxed out all Achievement on them and the rewards (Skins and minipets) that I got from them.
- Full ascended gear for almost 3 chatacters.
- Alot of friends from the guilds I have joined.
- Experiens for 3 years of playing GW2 and know what I am doing in PvP.
- I have unlocked the whole season 2 without spending a single Gem.
- Played the TA path that is now gone.
- Played the PvP map that is now gone.
Well, I am so ever happy that I bought GW2 when it was released. It is well spent money.
Yes, this is the one I just bought. GMG are a good shop. They are not shady or whatever. I have got games from them for a long time now. Very reasonable.
Just out of interest did your account have restrictions? I have found that mine has some of the restrictions, but not all. Like I am only level 11 so far (guardian) but can go to lions arch. Even though the rules say level 35. However the trade shop is blocked of some items and it says wait 4 days (that’s fine). But it also says upgrade to heart of thorns. We will still be able to do normal account stuff yes, after the 4 days? Just not play the new area and things? That’s ok too, but bag space is a pain – I had to keep throwing away items as I could not sell them. I’m not too worried on waiting a bit. Thier is plenty to explore.
The TP and gold/item mail restrictions are lifted after 5 days, all other restrictions should already be gone when you redeemed the full version code.
You should already have all 5 character slots and all 5 bag slots, no travel restrictons, /map chat, etc.
That window saying you still need to upgrade to HoT is erroneous, obviously they did not take into account new players still buying the core game. Or else its a deliberate attempt to make another HoT sale when its not really necessary. I informed them of that wrong message weeks ago and its still there so obviously not a priority to fix it.
(edited by Angus.5961)
If they are still paying $50 then maybe they could first save up $10 and then $40 and buy the expansion.
I’m not saying that they have to buy the expansion you are totally missing the point of what I’m saying. The $10 is to upgrade to core. If they enjoy the game enough to want the expansion they then can pay $40 MORE to upgrade. Or forget the discount altogether. Just offer the Core game for $10 so that people who want to lift the restrictions of F2P can.
I seriously do not understand your logic in this response.
The whole point of the free to play model that Anet has implemented is so that players get to try the game before purchasing the full amount. There is no sense in paying a small amount of money to lift the limitations placed on a Free account.
After learning that GW2 went F2P, I went to the website downloaded the game and played for about a week. I was very annoyed by the limitations I had personally revolving around the trading market, but the game as a whole I found to be fun. I then purchased the expansion to release the limitations and enjoy the game fully.
At a certain point in time your friend either likes the game or does not. The F2P model in GW2 gives the possible customer enough experience to determine if deems worthy of purchase.
imo the answer is that ANet doesn’t want people as core only. The f2p players are expected to either upgrade to expansionplus or stop playing. The people who are core and not upgraded are expected to upgrade at some point or stop playing. If so, the reason they don’t offer the core separately is to keep the ones who are paid and core to the absolute minimum. This way they keep the division among players at a minimum.
Or you can play the core game forever. Thier is plenty to do. Or you could wait till the next xpac and buy that instead. They can’t force you to buy hot, but th probably won’t take away stuff – in fact even core players are getting more free stuff anyway. Given they’ve structured it this way, we are going to have a situation where thier is a hodgepodge different versions. Some will have some pics but not others, some will never upgrade, or skip xpacs and upgrade later. This is on top of the fact you can still buy the base game at various retailers.
I feel like people scrolled past it without reading or joined the thread after i’d posted it.
I had a thought that it would be cool if any P4F account got an automatic upgrade to the full (base) game if they bought gems. In that the gemstore items don’t cost Anet any money, it can only give them added revenue, and could incentivise the buying of gems by the new players.
It really would address a lot of complaints.
I feel like people scrolled past it without reading or joined the thread after i’d posted it.
I had a thought that it would be cool if any P4F account got an automatic upgrade to the full (base) game if they bought gems. In that the gemstore items don’t cost Anet any money, it can only give them added revenue, and could incentivise the buying of gems by the new players.
It really would address a lot of complaints.
So they get more for their gems than I did? My gem purchase went towards a couple bank slots and maybe a bag slot for my main. Someone else could get a couple bank slots and maybe a bag slot AND get the base game?
Gem store items DO cost ANet money. Bank slots and bag slots not that much. But it costs money to create outfits. The time spent on designing and meshing and creating the textures. The mini’s cost money. The finishers cost money.
Just because you can’t go to the local Walmart and pick up “Wedding Dress outfit” doesn’t mean that it didn’t cost ANet money to create the Wedding Dress outfit.
I feel like people scrolled past it without reading or joined the thread after i’d posted it.
I had a thought that it would be cool if any P4F account got an automatic upgrade to the full (base) game if they bought gems. In that the gemstore items don’t cost Anet any money, it can only give them added revenue, and could incentivise the buying of gems by the new players.
It really would address a lot of complaints.
So they get more for their gems than I did? My gem purchase went towards a couple bank slots and maybe a bag slot for my main. Someone else could get a couple bank slots and maybe a bag slot AND get the base game?
It’s less that they get more value so much as their account is recognised as ‘valid’.
If you must think of it that way, though, they’re getting something you already have, and which you have presumably had for some time. Have you gotten your money’s worth in that time? this is mostly just the argument against going f2p in general.
Gem store items DO cost ANet money. Bank slots and bag slots not that much. But it costs money to create outfits. The time spent on designing and meshing and creating the textures. The mini’s cost money. The finishers cost money.
Just because you can’t go to the local Walmart and pick up “Wedding Dress outfit” doesn’t mean that it didn’t cost ANet money to create the Wedding Dress outfit.
You’re right. I hadn’t thought of the development cost that goes into going into these items. However, that’s only an upfront cost – There’s no cost associated with manufacturing each individual instance, only the template from which the item is created.
If even one player buys gems for the purpose of lifting their p4f restrictions, ANet will have profited.
But the cost of the primary development is paid for buy the “box” price. Hence Buy to Play. They game is still Buy to Play. Every expansion will be Buy to Play.
The Play for Free is an unlimited trial version of the game with restrictions to hamper RMT and bots. That’s why there is no Gold to Gems in the P4F trial. The game is still Buy to Play.
If HoT is in the Gem store then ANET still gets the box price. Because the money spent to buy the gems is still money that goes into ANET’s pockets.
As for restrictions that hamper RMT, one way to fight it is to lower the price they can charge for their gold. Since buying from a gold seller risks a ban, the gold sellers have to offer gold cheaper than the gem store does. I’ve seen that referred to as a Hazard Discount. The lower the price for gold is on the currency exchange, the worse things are for the grey market gold sellers.
Players wanting to trade gems for gold are providing the demand for gold. The more of them there are, the higher the price of gold is. Players wanting to buy gems with gold are providing the supply of gold. The more of them there are, the lower the price of gold is.
In other words, the direction that increases the gold price and helps the grey market gold sellers is the only direction ANET allows F2P accounts to trade in. The direction that hurts them is the direction that is forbidden for F2P accounts.
The when they were paid matters on the quaterly reports.
Do you have any proof showing that it really matters ?
Are there really players with a large stash of old gems ?
What I’m expecting to happen if my suggestion is implemented is that F2P accounts surge forth to buy gems with their gold. This increase in supply of gold causes the price of gold to go down significantly. Now other players see this drop in the price of gold and decide that it’s time for them to spend cash buy gold via gems. Sending the price of gold back up and a surge of cash into ANET’s pockets.
So I’m not sure how many old gems will be used compared to the number of new gems.
ANET can’t lower the gem→gold conversion price only the exchange fee they don’t have a direct control over it.
I feel like people scrolled past it without reading or joined the thread after i’d posted it.
I had a thought that it would be cool if any P4F account got an automatic upgrade to the full (base) game if they bought gems. In that the gemstore items don’t cost Anet any money, it can only give them added revenue, and could incentivise the buying of gems by the new players.
It really would address a lot of complaints.
So they get more for their gems than I did? My gem purchase went towards a couple bank slots and maybe a bag slot for my main. Someone else could get a couple bank slots and maybe a bag slot AND get the base game?
It’s less that they get more value so much as their account is recognised as ‘valid’.
If you must think of it that way, though, they’re getting something you already have, and which you have presumably had for some time. Have you gotten your money’s worth in that time? this is mostly just the argument against going f2p in general.Gem store items DO cost ANet money. Bank slots and bag slots not that much. But it costs money to create outfits. The time spent on designing and meshing and creating the textures. The mini’s cost money. The finishers cost money.
Just because you can’t go to the local Walmart and pick up “Wedding Dress outfit” doesn’t mean that it didn’t cost ANet money to create the Wedding Dress outfit.
You’re right. I hadn’t thought of the development cost that goes into going into these items. However, that’s only an upfront cost – There’s no cost associated with manufacturing each individual instance, only the template from which the item is created.
If even one player buys gems for the purpose of lifting their p4f restrictions, ANet will have profited.
The game hasn’t really gone F2P though. I still have to pay to get HoT. If it was F2P, I wouldn’t have had to pay. All ANet’s added is an unlimited free trial of the base game.
The cheapest gem package is $10. The cheapest ANet’s sold the game for is $10. They get $20 value for $10. That means they get more for their money than anyone who bought the base game. When ANet does not want to create more base game only players. They want to create players who have everything. Because that doesn’t split the player base.
Whether or not I’ve gotten my money’s worth out of it has absolutely no bearing on what I consider a fair price for the base game without limitations. I do not consider 50% of a the cheapest gem package to be a fair price to remove the restrictions.
And most outfits are 800 gems. Cheapest gem package gives 1600 gems I believe. That’s 2 outfits. One outfit likely takes several HOURS to make. Remember they have to make the outfit up to 10 times. Once for each race and once for each gender. 8 times if you consider that most outfits have Asura and Charr looking the same no matter the gender. It’s why the wedding dress was more than the typical outfit as they did make unique outfits for each race and each gender. Minimum wage in the US is $7.25. 1 person buying gems solely to buy an outfit will not make the outfit make a profit. It would take several players buying gems to do so.
The game hasn’t really gone F2P though. I still have to pay to get HoT. If it was F2P, I wouldn’t have had to pay. All ANet’s added is an unlimited free trial of the base game.
It’s hardly ‘unlimited’. In fact i’d say it’s less an unlimited trial and more a limited full game. I’m not suggesting they get access to any content they can’t already play; just that they have their restrictions lifted (restrictions which are only in place in the first place to curb gold sellers – by buying gems, and thus contributing to ANets profit, they are in essence proving that’s not their intent)
And most outfits are 800 gems. Cheapest gem package gives 1600 gems I believe. That’s 2 outfits. One outfit likely takes several HOURS to make. Remember they have to make the outfit up to 10 times. Once for each race and once for each gender. 8 times if you consider that most outfits have Asura and Charr looking the same no matter the gender. It’s why the wedding dress was more than the typical outfit as they did make unique outfits for each race and each gender. Minimum wage in the US is $7.25. 1 person buying gems solely to buy an outfit will not make the outfit make a profit. It would take several players buying gems to do so.
But in general, this can only increase profit. Say X% of people buy gems now, and Y% would buy if they knew their f2p restrictions would be lifted. X + Y cannot be less than X alone, and it has cost ANet nothing.
Whether or not I’ve gotten my money’s worth out of it has absolutely no bearing on what I consider a fair price for the base game without limitations. I do not consider 50% of a the cheapest gem package to be a fair price to remove the restrictions.
Alright, so what DO you consider a fair price? because prior to HoT being made available for prepurchase, i believe it had fallen to $10, which is the smallest amount of gems you can buy. Now, of course, you can’t buy the base game at all, and HoT comes bundled with it.
Anyone who ‘unlocks’ their F2P edition this way is still gonna have to pay full price for HoT. Some definitely will, some definitely won’t, but either way, the company that runs the game winds up with more money than they would have had otherwise, and i just can’t see that being a bad thing.
It depends on whether the number of people who would buy the core game for $10 is more then 5 times the number who would buy the expansion only if they could not get the core game for $10.
This is why Anet is doing everything in their power to make it look like HoT is the only option.
There is an option for $16 which is currently available at a legit online retailer, so its not impossible to get the core game cheaply if you look around.
(edited by Angus.5961)
The game hasn’t really gone F2P though. I still have to pay to get HoT. If it was F2P, I wouldn’t have had to pay. All ANet’s added is an unlimited free trial of the base game.
It’s hardly ‘unlimited’. In fact i’d say it’s less an unlimited trial and more a limited full game. I’m not suggesting they get access to any content they can’t already play; just that they have their restrictions lifted (restrictions which are only in place in the first place to curb gold sellers – by buying gems, and thus contributing to ANets profit, they are in essence proving that’s not their intent)
And most outfits are 800 gems. Cheapest gem package gives 1600 gems I believe. That’s 2 outfits. One outfit likely takes several HOURS to make. Remember they have to make the outfit up to 10 times. Once for each race and once for each gender. 8 times if you consider that most outfits have Asura and Charr looking the same no matter the gender. It’s why the wedding dress was more than the typical outfit as they did make unique outfits for each race and each gender. Minimum wage in the US is $7.25. 1 person buying gems solely to buy an outfit will not make the outfit make a profit. It would take several players buying gems to do so.
But in general, this can only increase profit. Say X% of people buy gems now, and Y% would buy if they knew their f2p restrictions would be lifted. X + Y cannot be less than X alone, and it has cost ANet nothing.
Whether or not I’ve gotten my money’s worth out of it has absolutely no bearing on what I consider a fair price for the base game without limitations. I do not consider 50% of a the cheapest gem package to be a fair price to remove the restrictions.
Alright, so what DO you consider a fair price? because prior to HoT being made available for prepurchase, i believe it had fallen to $10, which is the smallest amount of gems you can buy. Now, of course, you can’t buy the base game at all, and HoT comes bundled with it.
Anyone who ‘unlocks’ their F2P edition this way is still gonna have to pay full price for HoT. Some definitely will, some definitely won’t, but either way, the company that runs the game winds up with more money than they would have had otherwise, and i just can’t see that being a bad thing.
$50 and pay for HoT or whatever expansion pack is out at that point. There is no gem price for it. Or I want the ability to pay for future expansion packs with gems obtained through any method including gold to gem conversion and get to keep the gems in the process. And seeing as how that won’t happen, no price is a fair price.
Not to mention I do not see ANet doing this. ANet does not want the player base split more than absolutely required. They don’t want to force players to buy the expansion pack or not be able to play so there will always be players who continue to play but do not buy any future expansion pack. But the majority of active players will be the ones who have purchased the expansion packs. Therefore, it does not make any sense whatsoever to sell both the base game and the expansion pack when they give away the base game with the expansion pack. Because that would split the player base more than absolutely required.
It depends on whether the number of people who would buy the core game for $10 is more then 5 times the number who would buy the expansion only if they could not get the core game for $10.
This is why Anet is doing everything in their power to make it look like HoT is the only option.
There is an option for $16 which is currently available at a legit online retailer, so its not impossible to get the core game cheaply if you look around.
Why would ANet want to split the player base? When this model of buy the latest EP and get everything is counter to splitting the player base.
ANet could have deactivated all base game only codes and made it so players couldn’t buy just the core game. But they didn’t. But they also shouldn’t advertise that they’re out there. That’s just bad business when you’re gearing up to sell an expansion pack. It’s telling the player base that ANet doesn’t think the expansion pack is worth $50.
I feel like people scrolled past it without reading or joined the thread after i’d posted it.
I had a thought that it would be cool if any P4F account got an automatic upgrade to the full (base) game if they bought gems. In that the gemstore items don’t cost Anet any money, it can only give them added revenue, and could incentivise the buying of gems by the new players.
It really would address a lot of complaints.
It would address one of the complaints. However, it wouldn’t generate the same income for ANet. People already buy gems; ANet also wants them to spend on the game and in particular, to buy HoT (so everyone is playing mostly the same game).
I feel like people scrolled past it without reading or joined the thread after i’d posted it.
I had a thought that it would be cool if any P4F account got an automatic upgrade to the full (base) game if they bought gems. In that the gemstore items don’t cost Anet any money, it can only give them added revenue, and could incentivise the buying of gems by the new players.
It really would address a lot of complaints.
It would address one of the complaints. However, it wouldn’t generate the same income for ANet. People already buy gems; ANet also wants them to spend on the game and in particular, to buy HoT (so everyone is playing mostly the same game).
Some people will quit without buying because of the restrictions, though. More, i imagine, will pay to lift the restrictions but wouldn’t buy HoT in either case. Some will certainly pay to lift the restrictions and then buy HoT, when they might well have otherwise never gotten into the game through just the F2P version.
Overall i feel like having some way to buy the core game alone can only be a positive move, and by attaching it as a ‘free’ bonus to another purchase, they create a measure of good-will in the people who do unlock their f2p game this way.
Just one more thing to add.
I love how ALL of you guys are speaking on behalf of ANet, it’s giving the devs a break from having to say anything…
In all seriousness, we don’t know what they want, how they view this idea or if they have even considered this. Until a dev responds and says what they have to say all arguments are pointless. The only thing you can say is I support this idea, I don’t support this idea, or I would support something like this idea. Not, “Anet doesn’t want this model.” That isn’t for you to decide for them.
Just one more thing to add.
I love how ALL of you guys are speaking on behalf of ANet, it’s giving the devs a break from having to say anything…
In all seriousness, we don’t know what they want, how they view this idea or if they have even considered this. Until a dev responds and says what they have to say all arguments are pointless. The only thing you can say is I support this idea, I don’t support this idea, or I would support something like this idea. Not, “Anet doesn’t want this model.” That isn’t for you to decide for them.
We can infer from ANet’s past statements what they will think of this proposal.
And none of my inferences were stated as fact.
We can come up with ideas of our own, as we have, and discuss their merits and problems, like we have been. Perhaps Gaile or one of the other devs who read the forum will see an idea that they like, and which suits a majority of the community, and which can/will then be implemented.
When the core game was offered for $10, each time there was a surge of bots and gold-sellers. Now, those were taken care of within a reasonable time-frame, but if the game was continuously on offer for $10 (the idea that a Gem purchase would remove restrictions), we would forever be plagued with said bots and gold-sellers, not to mention spam and other undesirable collateral effects.
Keeping the game healthy is just as important to the Devs, I believe, as keeping the population as undivided as possible.
I’m betting HoT will be on sale within 10 days of launch, just be patient.
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