Guild Wars 2

I love the new firefly mining flute. I would buy it in a heartbeat, except… I can’t give up the raw utility of the watchwork mining pick. A utility which ANet has already admitted was a mistake in retrospect.

ANet please fix this once and for all so I can be freed from the tyranny of the watchwork pick!

I have a simple suggested fix. Add a new laurel store utility infusion alongside the +magic find, +karma, and +xp ones that goes in the utility amulets. Have it provide the chance to get sprockets on mining bonus. Then remove this bonus from the watchwork pick and give everyone who owns one a copy of the new utility infusion without having to spend laurels.

I SO want to buy that mining flute!

No. I love my watchwork pick and don’t want it to be changed. Not for a skin that abuses the name of one of the best SF tv series, without even coming close to the atmosphere of that series lol!

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

This is a huge departure from how the gem store works. It’s supposed to be a place to get convenience and aesthetic upgrades, not a place to buy actual permanent economic power you can’t get any other way. Even boosters are available without gems now.

PopeUrban.2578:

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

This is a huge departure from how the gem store works. It’s supposed to be a place to get convenience and aesthetic upgrades, not a place to buy actual permanent economic power you can’t get any other way. Even boosters are available without gems now.

well, considering the amount sprockets are used in recipes, and the number of people with watchwork pick bringing all the sprockets in, it’s also a good thing… It’s an investment of gold… you put 200 gold in, you get it back in a couple months of running ore gathering routes.

Xbon.9086:

PopeUrban.2578:

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

This is a huge departure from how the gem store works. It’s supposed to be a place to get convenience and aesthetic upgrades, not a place to buy actual permanent economic power you can’t get any other way. Even boosters are available without gems now.

well, considering the amount sprockets are used in recipes, and the number of people with watchwork pick bringing all the sprockets in, it’s also a good thing… It’s an investment of gold… you put 200 gold in, you get it back in a couple months of running ore gathering routes.

Right, the point is that it is functionally “the best pick” and it can only be acquired through the gem store. That’s a problem. it would be like if ascended could only be bought from the gem store, there was no way to reskin it, and all the ingame methods could only get you exotics.

Infinite picks in general are fine. They do the same thing as normal picks, and really just save you the hassly of buying picks. Watchwork is an anomaly because it does something other picks can’t rather than just being more convenient.

PopeUrban.2578:

Xbon.9086:

PopeUrban.2578:

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

This is a huge departure from how the gem store works. It’s supposed to be a place to get convenience and aesthetic upgrades, not a place to buy actual permanent economic power you can’t get any other way. Even boosters are available without gems now.

well, considering the amount sprockets are used in recipes, and the number of people with watchwork pick bringing all the sprockets in, it’s also a good thing… It’s an investment of gold… you put 200 gold in, you get it back in a couple months of running ore gathering routes.

Right, the point is that it is functionally “the best pick” and it can only be acquired through the gem store. That’s a problem. it would be like if ascended could only be bought from the gem store, there was no way to reskin it, and all the ingame methods could only get you exotics.

Infinite picks in general are fine. They do the same thing as normal picks, and really just save you the hassly of buying picks. Watchwork is an anomaly because it does something other picks can’t rather than just being more convenient.

they admitted their mistake, and won’t do it again. however, they won’t strip away the function for the people who paid real money for this item FOR the sprocket generation, nor will they give other picks any extra generation since that’d be going against what they said… it’s fine the way it is, some people enjoy skins, some people enjoy utility, I use watchwork pick and won’t use any other infinite gathering tool; it’s the only one that’s proved its worth to me so far.

Xbon.9086:

PopeUrban.2578:

Xbon.9086:

PopeUrban.2578:

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

This is a huge departure from how the gem store works. It’s supposed to be a place to get convenience and aesthetic upgrades, not a place to buy actual permanent economic power you can’t get any other way. Even boosters are available without gems now.

well, considering the amount sprockets are used in recipes, and the number of people with watchwork pick bringing all the sprockets in, it’s also a good thing… It’s an investment of gold… you put 200 gold in, you get it back in a couple months of running ore gathering routes.

Right, the point is that it is functionally “the best pick” and it can only be acquired through the gem store. That’s a problem. it would be like if ascended could only be bought from the gem store, there was no way to reskin it, and all the ingame methods could only get you exotics.

Infinite picks in general are fine. They do the same thing as normal picks, and really just save you the hassly of buying picks. Watchwork is an anomaly because it does something other picks can’t rather than just being more convenient.

they admitted their mistake, and won’t do it again. however, they won’t strip away the function for the people who paid real money for this item FOR the sprocket generation, nor will they give other picks any extra generation since that’d be going against what they said… it’s fine the way it is, some people enjoy skins, some people enjoy utility, I use watchwork pick and won’t use any other infinite gathering tool; it’s the only one that’s proved its worth to me so far.

Well of course you use it. It does not change the fact, however, that it is literally a pay to win item, and the only pay to win item in the entire game. If that doesn’t merit a fix, either by making sprockets more avaliable without changing the pick, or by changing the pick and offering its holders a gem refund, I don’t know what does.

Considering you can just buy sprockets with gold, I wouldn’t call the Watchwork pick “pay to win.” If you want the advantage provided by the pick (more sprockets/gold,) you can get it by doing basically anything else in game, just…more of it. We already have a mechanism (converting gems to gold) by which people can just buy gold, so free sprockets are just an unusually good deal, (since they can pay for themselves over time,) but not an obnoxiously unfair one. (Unless you have a problem with the gems→gold exchange, but if that’s the case, you have bigger problems with the game than just the watchwork pick.)

That said, the Watchwork Pick was still a mistake because it makes buyers choose between the pick they prefer aesthetically and the one that offers the most economic value. The transmutation system exists precisely so people wouldn’t have to make that kind of decision with weapons/armor, so you can see where pushing everyone into the Watchwork Pick doesn’t fit. Not to mention trying to sell new picks to people like the OP.

As an owner of a watchwork pick, I would support nerfing or removing the bonus, or make it so that all infinite picks grant something special.

Redenaz.8631:

Considering you can just buy sprockets with gold, I wouldn’t call the Watchwork pick “pay to win.” If you want the advantage provided by the pick (more sprockets/gold,) you can get it by doing basically anything else in game, just…more of it. We already have a mechanism (converting gems to gold) by which people can just buy gold, so free sprockets are just an unusually good deal, (since they can pay for themselves over time,) but not an obnoxiously unfair one. (Unless you have a problem with the gems->gold exchange, but if that’s the case, you have bigger problems with the game than just the watchwork pick.)

That said, the Watchwork Pick was still a mistake because it makes buyers choose between the pick they prefer aesthetically and the one that offers the most economic value. The transmutation system exists precisely so people wouldn’t have to make that kind of decision with weapons/armor, so you can see where pushing everyone into the Watchwork Pick doesn’t fit. Not to mention trying to sell new picks to people like the OP.

I think it’s a little different than the gems to gold exchange. The exchange is a transaction between players. Players are spending a fixed amount of gems in terun for a fixed amount of gold. The same is true if, say, you get an infinit contract or black lion skin and sell it. You’re exchanging a fixed value of gem store expense for a fixed value of gold.

The pick, however, generates an infinite and superior amount of wealth for a single fixed gem purchase. This isn’t a mere QoL upgrade like the salvager or contracts, or a cost offset like the other infinite tools (which don’t actually increase your earning power but rather frontload the cost of a large number of future tools, and if you do the math are unlikely to actually pay for themselves compared to the ingame alternatives)

The moment you acquire the pick, you are gaining superior income for doing the same action as players who do not have it. It’s the same effect as a booster, but boosters arent problematic in this way as the earnings increase they provide does not ever actually outstrip their cost. In terms of gold value, you lose money on boosters even though they increase your earnings potential temporarily.

As it is now, the watchwork pick is out of line with the rest of the game. No other gem store only item actually increases raw earning power. The rest of them simply offset cost or increase convenience. The watchwork pick is an instant purchasable earnings advantage.

What if they made those new materials you mine for the legendaries also be used to craft said sprockets? I don’t really have a plan on how this would all math out or anything, just an idea.

Edit: Bauxite Ore and what not. (I’ll admit I’m an ameture crafter so I’m not sure if these are brand new or if they are used else where already. I just haven’t seen them till I began incinerator vol. 1.)

PopeUrban.2578:

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

If you could only obtain gems from spending real world cash then I would agree with you – However you can obtain gems by converting in-game currency which is exactly how I obtained my watchwork pick during a gem store sale.
In other words I played not paid to obtain mine – unless you are going to suggest that obtaining items via gameplay is wrong?

Xbon.9086:

well, considering the amount sprockets are used in recipes, and the number of people with watchwork pick bringing all the sprockets in, it’s also a good thing… It’s an investment of gold… you put 200 gold in, you get it back in a couple months of running ore gathering routes.

Exactly, and considering the last time it showed up was a month ago at half price, everyone who owns one has had plenty of time to take advantage of it.

That means now is a great time to fix the original problem by moving the sprocket gathering bonus to a neck utility infusion available to anyone with laurels and removing it from the pick entirely.

Xbon.9086:

some people enjoy skins, some people enjoy utility

And some people enjoy BOTH and are really frustrated with being forced to pick one or the other in a game that emphasizes cosmetic choices above all.

I like the idea of a utility infusion for laurels that give bonus materials while gathering. Could do all sorts with that too, like Azurite orbs for mining as well as watchwork. Accountbound unID dyes from harvesting. Dunno about logging tho.

I’d still ask for a gem refund for the Watchwork pick. I like the mining animation, the extra mats is a bonus. But I wouldn’t mind this change.

I’d be okay with the removal of sprocket pickups. My pick has earned back the investment.

Sprocket nodes should be added, and there are plenty of spots for ‘em — techy-type JPs, Jinx Isle in Malchor’s Leap, around CoE and the other Inquest areas, maybe Rata Novus — to give EVERYONE a fair shake at gathering sprockets at a decent rate.

I don’t think infinite mining tools should confer additional benefits; not having to constantly buy tools is nice enough, the rest should be purely aesthetic.

I think it would be a nice gesture to allow a one-time turn-ins of ANY infinite gathering tools in exchange for a free one of the same type (including sickles and axes). It would be a nice “do-over” of sorts to let everyone pick up a tool they like aesthetically.

I completely agree with this feeling; I really like some of the other mining options but can’t justify losing out on the utility of gathering sprockets with the intention of making some extra gold. :<

I’ve passed the point of caring about the functionality. Mostly.

Yes I have a watchwork pick. I also have a fused, a miner-tron and the firefly flute. While I agree that I will always use the watchwork if i’m going to do a mining run, I prefer the thematic sets on my main characters.

Xbon.9086:

I use watchwork pick and won’t use any other infinite gathering tool; it’s the only one that’s proved its worth to me so far.

Classic P2W I guess.

All infinite gathering tools should give something extra.
For the people that don’t want to convert gold into gems to obtain them, in-game vendors or MF should offer a new tier of tools with more uses and the same benefit. Something like “deldrimor tools” that have 250 uses and give you some kind of extra mat.

Just allow skinning of the watchwork pick to look/sound like one of the other ones.
Boom, problem solved.

Ardid.7203:

All infinite gathering tools should give something extra.
For the people that don’t want to convert gold into gems to obtain them, in-game vendors or MF should offer a new tier of tools with more uses and the same benefit. Something like “deldrimor tools” that have 250 uses and give you some kind of extra mat.

This is exactly why the Silver-fed salvage-tron failed, too little benefit to justify the gem cost. Introducing such new salvage tools would absolutely kill the gemstore tools.

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

These are the first gathering tools I’m tempted to get, but 1000 gems a piece is a bit steep if I have to manually transfer them to whatever character I’m playing. For a convenience item, that’s kinda inconvenient. :P If they were selectable like outfits however…

nezroy.8492:

I love the new firefly mining flute. I would buy it in a heartbeat, except… I can’t give up the raw utility of the watchwork mining pick. A utility which ANet has already admitted was a mistake in retrospect.

ANet please fix this once and for all so I can be freed from the tyranny of the watchwork pick!

I have a simple suggested fix. Add a new laurel store utility infusion alongside the +magic find, +karma, and +xp ones that goes in the utility amulets. Have it provide the chance to get sprockets on mining bonus. Then remove this bonus from the watchwork pick and give everyone who owns one a copy of the new utility infusion without having to spend laurels.

I SO want to buy that mining flute!

You are demanding that ArenaNet destroy the functionality for everybody else just so you don’t feel bad about buying a different harvesting skin?? No. Just no. I picked up a couple on the last sale and love this pick for what it is. If you don’t like it, don’t use it. If you are enslaved to the “tyranny” of the watchword pick that is your own problem, but don’t make it everybody else’ problem.

The pick is unique, sort of, in that it gives you additional materials, but so do the winters day harvesting pick/axe/sickle. I think the concept of getting additional materials when harvesting is appealing and would like to see more of those kinds of options, either gem store or with in game currency, rather than nerfing after the fact a product that most bought for the specific functionality it has.

Neither would I have any objection to ArenaNet making watchwork sprockets more available through other means. Certainly the facility is there now with the new harvesting synthesizers.

Either of these options would be infinitely preferable to destroying the one worthwhile infinite harvesting tool available.

I own the watchwork pick. Have to admit that I only use it when I don’t already have an infinite on the character I’m playing and bank access is readily available. I suppose I wouldn’t have an issue removing the bonus, although that’s sort of why I bought it (I’m still working on ascended spinal blade back pieces, so the sprockets are nice). It doesn’t go with any of my character themes. shrug

Personally, I’d like to see all of the infinite picks get some type of (valuable) unique perk. Of course, just giving them all sprocket generation would be fine too.

The way I see that could be attempted to fix the watchwork pick issue would be to change how unlimited gathering tools work.

Make it so all currently owned gathering tools are changed to no animation unlimited tools visually identical to the tools bought from merchants and also make this the default unlimited tool bought in the gemshop for around 600 gems.

Then they sell gathering tool skins which would be things like the the watchwork animation and the O-Tron robots each of which would be 400 gems or so.
Of course owners of the item before the change would get the skin unlocked for free.
These skins would be able to be changed at will for no charge like switching an outfit.

They could then sell something in the gemshop that adds “infusions” to tools you could switch like selecting the skin allowing them a small chance to gather a material on use. Watchwork pick owners would receive a watchwork infusion unlock for free.
Example materials could be Watchwork sprockets, Geodes, Candy corn and maybe even items like slivers of the different types Charged, Destroyer and such.

Personally I much like the OP would love to use different tools but have a hard time giving up the possible 3 silver on each rock I mine. I know I would buy alot more of the skins I like the look of if I didn’t feel like I would lose potential money with every swing.

Sadly I know this would be alot of work so im not hopeful but I would like it.

Watchwork Pick was a misstep they decided not to repeat but they didn’t want to take it away from players who had bought them and it would be unfair if they simply stopped selling it, this means players need to choose cosmetic/theme over income.

I made 22.5 gold in the last 30 days from sprockets, after TP fees and taxes. It’s not a lot and I haven’t been strip mining zones as frequently as I once did but every little bit counts.

As much as I love my watchwork pick, it certainly hasn’t made me rich over night, as some like to imply. At most I’ll get an extra sprocket per node. Sometimes not even that. Even if it was a mistake, I agree with Anet in not removing that bit from it. However, perhaps if they introduced a infinite gathering tool add on in the gem store that allowed an existing infinite gathering tool the same chance to add another material, that might placate people.

Have a molten pick? for 200 gems you can get a pick addon that allows you a chance at additional [insert special type of crafting mat here]. Or even perhaps an Axe addon that does the same thing. However, it shouldn’t be a type of mat that can already be harvest normally (i.e. jewels, ore, etc.)

ArchonWing.9480:

As an owner of a watchwork pick, I would support nerfing or removing the bonus, or make it so that all infinite picks grant something special.

If the Sprocket bonus would be nerfed or removed, then I want my 1k Gems back.

Gonna be honest – I bought it for the ‘extra’ looting for making my backpack, (which still isn’t done months later btw) and because it eventually pays for itself as a result (approx 7k sprockets assuming current gold to gem and sprocket prices).

Due to the expense per tool outside of sales, there being 3 of them, and you have to swap them between characters rather than being in some kind of ‘account wide unlimited tool pool’ – I would not have bought this without it paying itself back over the long term, as for something convenient they’re oddly inconvenient if you dare to have alts.

The ONLY way I would consider agreeing to this change is if we got the ability to have an account bound slot for infinite tools, that would allow you to choose between any you’ve bought on any characters at any time. Except then you have people who’ve bought multiple of the same tool for their alts. So either they’d have to refund the clockwork picks from people who bought them for their pure functionality over other ones with nicer aesthetics in your scenario, or refund people who bought multiple of the same tool AND probably offer a rechoice of pickaxe skin to everyone with the clockwork in mine – in both cases ANet would lose money, or certainly not gain enough for the backlash and ill will such a change would generate.

I would also be iffy about using utility slot necklaces for the same functionality for laurels – a) ANet would most definitely NOT have those available for laurels, they’d be gemstore items and you know it, therefore becoming again ‘pay2win’ and b) what happens when the extra material you choose suddenly tanks in value as everyone ELSE went for that as the currently highest value mat? plus c) you lose out on using the current ones as these material ones would be strictly better.

Hannelore.8153:

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

Sounds interesting. Source?

I thank the Gods the people that complain about stupid kitten like this is a small fraction of the entire community.

Tao.1234:

ArchonWing.9480:

As an owner of a watchwork pick, I would support nerfing or removing the bonus, or make it so that all infinite picks grant something special.

If the Sprocket bonus would be nerfed or removed, then I want my 1k Gems back.

1k ? Haha how sweet .. for me it would be 14k

And no .. as an owner of 14 sprocket picks i would not support a nerf.

And also .. has this not already been discussed to dead years ago ?

ArchonWing.9480:

Hannelore.8153:

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

Sounds interesting. Source?

Its easy enough to test yourself with several characters, a list of rich iron nodes, and a watchwork and normal orichalcum pick. Tests showed that whenever the pick would get a sprocket from the node, the bonus ore was lost.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1wfp5r/watchwork_pick_looking_for_data/

I quote from the thread:
Just tracked 120 swings of the watchwork pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 69
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket: 37
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket + Jewel Shard: 6
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Just tracked 120 swings of the Orichalcum Mining Pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 112
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Even for such a small test sample… 69 vs 112 speaks for itself. So this pick offers very little profit on valuable nodes like iron (currently 2.7s/ore on TP).

Hannelore.8153:

ArchonWing.9480:

Hannelore.8153:

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

Sounds interesting. Source?

Its easy enough to test yourself with several characters, a list of rich iron nodes, and a watchwork and normal orichalcum pick. Tests showed that whenever the pick would get a sprocket from the node, the bonus ore was lost.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1wfp5r/watchwork_pick_looking_for_data/

I quote from the thread:
Just tracked 120 swings of the watchwork pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 69
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket: 37
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket + Jewel Shard: 6
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Just tracked 120 swings of the Orichalcum Mining Pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 112
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Even for such a small test sample… 69 vs 112 speaks for itself. So this pick offers very little profit on valuable nodes like iron (currently 2.7s/ore on TP).

I guess I’m just dense, but I’m not seeing the issue here. You didn’t get any bonus ore in either of these tests. You did get the same standard amount of ore, but you also got not only more jewels, but an additional 43 ‘extras’ from the watchwork.

I know you can get the double ore and a sprocket (or at least you used to be able to) from a rich node, it was something I tested as well during the last huge thread on this issue. I don’t think I still have the screen shot, but I’ll check when I get home.

Hannelore.8153:

ArchonWing.9480:

Hannelore.8153:

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

Sounds interesting. Source?

Its easy enough to test yourself with several characters, a list of rich iron nodes, and a watchwork and normal orichalcum pick. Tests showed that whenever the pick would get a sprocket from the node, the bonus ore was lost.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1wfp5r/watchwork_pick_looking_for_data/

I quote from the thread:
Just tracked 120 swings of the watchwork pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 69
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket: 37
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket + Jewel Shard: 6
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Just tracked 120 swings of the Orichalcum Mining Pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 112
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Even for such a small test sample… 69 vs 112 speaks for itself. So this pick offers very little profit on valuable nodes like iron (currently 2.7s/ore on TP).

So it trades the bonus ore for a sprocket. That not trading ore for sprockets. That’s trading the chance for an extra piece of ore for a chance at a sprocket. You still get the standard 3 pieces regardless.

Hannelore.8153:

ArchonWing.9480:

Hannelore.8153:

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

Sounds interesting. Source?

Its easy enough to test yourself with several characters, a list of rich iron nodes, and a watchwork and normal orichalcum pick. Tests showed that whenever the pick would get a sprocket from the node, the bonus ore was lost.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1wfp5r/watchwork_pick_looking_for_data/

I quote from the thread:
Just tracked 120 swings of the watchwork pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 69
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket: 37
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket + Jewel Shard: 6
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Just tracked 120 swings of the Orichalcum Mining Pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 112
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Even for such a small test sample… 69 vs 112 speaks for itself. So this pick offers very little profit on valuable nodes like iron (currently 2.7s/ore on TP).

Not sure if I’m reading this right, but the watchwork pick acquired 120 plat, 8 jewel shards, and 37 sprockets.

Platinum Ore: 69
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket: 37
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket + Jewel Shard: 6

It did not mine only 69 plat ore. It mined only plat ore 69 times. 51 times, it mined plat ore and something else. I think I would have noticed if I was mining and was only getting around 1/2 the materials.

The Orich pick acquired 120 plat and 14 jewel shards. So the WW pick got more of shards and plat, and more sprockets. If anything, this shows the WW pick is plain better than the standard one because even if the sprocket doesn’t allow the possibility of an extra piece because that possibility and only relevant for mining ori.

Also, the thread was made a while back when sprockets were easier to get thanks to living story. At the bottom it says sprockets were worth 40 copper; they’re worth more than 7 times as much now.

Rich node gives you 1 or 2 ores per swing + bonus swings.

Same with normal nodes.

It’s random.

And Sprocket is a bonus just like Jewels.

Tao.1234:

Rich node gives you 1 or 2 ores per swing + bonus swings.

Same with normal nodes.

It’s random.

And Sprocket is a bonus just like Jewels.

But doesn’t replace jewels as some players have suggested over the years.

Hannelore.8153:

ArchonWing.9480:

Hannelore.8153:

Lots of people in this thread who didn’t do their reseach. There’s test data out there that shows the watchwork pick offers little to no monetary gain because it sacrifices ore pieces in order to harvest sprockets from the node…

Its only good on Mithril, Silver, and Gold Ore.

Sounds interesting. Source?

Its easy enough to test yourself with several characters, a list of rich iron nodes, and a watchwork and normal orichalcum pick. Tests showed that whenever the pick would get a sprocket from the node, the bonus ore was lost.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1wfp5r/watchwork_pick_looking_for_data/

I quote from the thread:
Just tracked 120 swings of the watchwork pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 69
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket: 37
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Watchwork Sprocket + Jewel Shard: 6
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Just tracked 120 swings of the Orichalcum Mining Pick on plat ore nodes.
Platinum Ore: 112
Platinum Ore + Jewel Shard: 8
Platinum Ore + Platinum Ore: 0

Even for such a small test sample… 69 vs 112 speaks for itself. So this pick offers very little profit on valuable nodes like iron (currently 2.7s/ore on TP).

So with, 120 ore, 14 jewel shards, 43 sprockets vs 120 ore, 8 jewel shards.

Hmmm, I know what I want to use.

Nidome.1365:

PopeUrban.2578:

The watchwork pick was a massive mistake. Its functionality should honestly be rolled out to all L80 picks avaliable in and out of game, or a decent amount of sprocket nodes should be added to the world to make its ability a strictly QoL advantage rather than a literal pay-to-win one. It is a gem store only item that is superior in function

If you could only obtain gems from spending real world cash then I would agree with you – However you can obtain gems by converting in-game currency which is exactly how I obtained my watchwork pick during a gem store sale.
In other words I played not paid to obtain mine – unless you are going to suggest that obtaining items via gameplay is wrong?

Gems are only obtained by spending real world cash. The fact that you can buy gems from other players with gold doesn’t change the fact that these picks only enter the game when someone spends real money to make it happen.

The fact you can trade gems for gold makes it no less of an anomaly of actual efficiency increase in an otherwise completely cosmetic/convenience cash shop. It is literally the only gem store item capable of paying for itself and then generating profit.

If the store contained more such items, fine, whatever, but the fact that it is literally the only one, and that the other harvesting tools are completely cosmetic makes it an outlier that doesn’t conform to the rest of how the interactions between the gem store and the rest of the game work.

Just bring it back in line with the other tools, and offer players the option to refund it for gems. Those that like the aesthetic can keep it. Those that got it just for the sprocket ability can get back the gems they spent and get something else. Now all tools are created equal, and the cash shop doesn’t have an item that plays a significant role as the primary producer of a core crafting component.

Behellagh.1468:

Tao.1234:

Rich node gives you 1 or 2 ores per swing + bonus swings.

Same with normal nodes.

It’s random.

And Sprocket is a bonus just like Jewels.

But doesn’t replace jewels as some players have suggested over the years.

I didn’t say it does replace, I only said it’s a bonus like Jewels are.

Just like from trees you can get Hidden stash and Walnut at the same time.

ArchonWing.9480:

As an owner of a watchwork pick, I would support nerfing or removing the bonus, or make it so that all infinite picks grant something special.

I’d prefer the latter, honestly. Azurite still doesn’t show up, and Molten picks would be good for that.

Granted, it’s not the best use of design space, either, since every cosmetic pick would have to provide some kind of bonus. (And it’s still kinda pay-to-win.)

And then, “what about the other gathering tools?” …well, crap.

Tao.1234:

Rich node gives you 1 or 2 ores per swing + bonus swings.

Same with normal nodes.

It’s random.

And Sprocket is a bonus just like Jewels.

Wrong ..
- Platimum, Gold and Silver rich nodes only give one per swing,
- Iron, Mithril and i guess also copper and Ori rich can give the bonus ore
- normal nodes never give more than one per swing
- all nodes can be harvested 3-6 time. 3 is normal, more is from WvW bonus
- WOOD only can have 1-2 on normal nodes.

And yes .. the sprockets are a bonus and you don’t get less Iron with the pick.

How about adding an upgrade slot to all unlimited tools and have upgrades available from the gem store (or crafting?) that enhance the tool. For example: change the watchwork pick so it (†by default) comes with a “% chance to mine sprockets” upgrade (†by default: this is to keep the existing owners of the ww pick happy). Other mining upgrades might be “% chance to mine candy corn”, “% chance to increase resource yield”, etc. There would also be upgrades available for the unlimited logging axes and gathering tools.

BruinsFan.7231:

How about adding an upgrade slot to all unlimited tools and have upgrades available from the gem store (or crafting?) that enhance the tool. For example: change the watchwork pick so it (†by default) comes with a “% chance to mine sprockets” upgrade (†by default: this is to keep the existing owners of the ww pick happy). Other mining upgrades might be “% chance to mine candy corn”, “% chance to increase resource yield”, etc. There would also be upgrades available for the unlimited logging axes and gathering tools.

That would give more outcry than leave them as they are, since Candy Corn is
worth less than sprockets and people would only complain about that.

Oh .. and where i personally would also complain is getting snowflakes that
you must destroy all the time .. lol.

So in the end the only “fair” solution is add sprockets to all types of gemstore picks.

Tao.1234:

Behellagh.1468:

Tao.1234:

Rich node gives you 1 or 2 ores per swing + bonus swings.

Same with normal nodes.

It’s random.

And Sprocket is a bonus just like Jewels.

But doesn’t replace jewels as some players have suggested over the years.

I didn’t say it does replace, I only said it’s a bonus like Jewels are.

Just like from trees you can get Hidden stash and Walnut at the same time.

I know you didn’t, I was simply stating that this test shows that rumor wasn’t true.

Beldin.5498:

BruinsFan.7231:

How about adding an upgrade slot to all unlimited tools and have upgrades available from the gem store (or crafting?) that enhance the tool. For example: change the watchwork pick so it (†by default) comes with a “% chance to mine sprockets” upgrade (†by default: this is to keep the existing owners of the ww pick happy). Other mining upgrades might be “% chance to mine candy corn”, “% chance to increase resource yield”, etc. There would also be upgrades available for the unlimited logging axes and gathering tools.

That would give more outcry than leave them as they are, since Candy Corn is
worth less than sprockets and people would only complain about that.

Oh .. and where i personally would also complain is getting snowflakes that
you must destroy all the time .. lol.

So in the end the only “fair” solution is add sprockets to all types of gemstore picks.

He said make it an option that you the player can choose. So one player might want a candy corn one because he is working towards something. Others may want one that gets sprockets. Any of them could be used and slotted into any of the different harvesting tools. But the WW one would have the sprocket one slotted by default. I get what you are saying about sprockets being worth more right now so why put anything else in them, but that may not always be the case. Plus just having the option to make any of the other infinite tools able to get special mats would be pretty awesome.

Klaugh.7415:

I’d be okay with the removal of sprocket pickups. My pick has earned back the investment.

Sprocket nodes should be added, and there are plenty of spots for ‘em — techy-type JPs, Jinx Isle in Malchor’s Leap, around CoE and the other Inquest areas, maybe Rata Novus — to give EVERYONE a fair shake at gathering sprockets at a decent rate.

I’d turn all of the wrecked probes Scarlet left around into sprocket nodes. It would make sense, right?

Honestly don’t even know why they are releasing or working on any other picks. The gain from the watchwork pick is too great to ever consider buying any other pick from the gemstore. Even for aesthetic reasons I can’t fathom why any player would choose any other pick for their characters.