Guild Wars 2

If people don’t enjoy the game, they don’t enjoy the game. If the makers failed to engage a field of the market they were aiming at, then so be it. It doesn’t matter a kitten if its misunderstood. Blaming players for not enjoying the game especially when they use reasoning and have legitimate gripes is kitten /p>

omg lol my first experience with kittening censoring, u cant even saykittend e rrp

flyinpoons.6481:

What this game really is, whether the defenders of GW2 want to admit it or not, is a home for those that dislike other MMO’s because they frankly were bad at them, and never got to see the endgame because of it.

If anyone remembers the Rudolph the red nose reindeer Christmas special, this is the Island of misfit toys. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SH1j1luFOw

There is no real endgame because it would fracture their tiny ego’s knowing that once again nobody wants to play with them because they are sub par.

You can thank the “trophies for everyone” “no keeping scores” mentality that starts in school these days for the new breed of gamers who hate to see someone get shinies they cannot get because they are bad, and would actually have to work to get better.

So let them feel superior by saying “you don’t get it” and move on, misfit toys need homes too.

^This guy measures his success in life by how many shiny pixel things he has collected in games. Games he now no longer plays. Yeah we’ll listen to you, you obviously know what you’re doing =)

flyinpoons.6481:

What this game really is, whether the defenders of GW2 want to admit it or not, is a home for those that dislike other MMO’s because they frankly were bad at them, and never got to see the endgame because of it.

If anyone remembers the Rudolph the red nose reindeer Christmas special, this is the Island of misfit toys. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SH1j1luFOw

There is no real endgame because it would fracture their tiny ego’s knowing that once again nobody wants to play with them because they are sub par.

You can thank the “trophies for everyone” “no keeping scores” mentality that starts in school these days for the new breed of gamers who hate to see someone get shinies they cannot get because they are bad, and would actually have to work to get better.

So let them feel superior by “saying you don’t get it” and move on, misfit toys need homes too.

While I don’t agree with the tone of your post ~ I can’t argue with some of your points. ~ People that like GW2 seem to have forgotten what “fun” is really about (IE: Challenge) ~ not having everything handed to you.

I ran into the same problem with TSW ~ in that, if you ever tried to critique the game or offer a suggestion, the community there would thrash about and tell you that TSW is the smart mans MMO.

IE: “If you don’t like TSW, it’s not the games fault ~ it’s because you’re not smart enough to appreciate it’s complexities”

I see the same thing popping up here for GW2 ~ where people are under the delusion that as long as they enjoy the game, than there’s nothing wrong with it ~ so you should bugger off back to the land of pandas.

It’s quite insulting tbh ~ especially considering I’ve never played WoW

Anywho a video you might enjoy ~
http://youtu.be/_lfxYhtf8o4

lollie.5816:

flyinpoons.6481:

What this game really is, whether the defenders of GW2 want to admit it or not, is a home for those that dislike other MMO’s because they frankly were bad at them, and never got to see the endgame because of it.

If anyone remembers the Rudolph the red nose reindeer Christmas special, this is the Island of misfit toys. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SH1j1luFOw

There is no real endgame because it would fracture their tiny ego’s knowing that once again nobody wants to play with them because they are sub par.

You can thank the “trophies for everyone” “no keeping scores” mentality that starts in school these days for the new breed of gamers who hate to see someone get shinies they cannot get because they are bad, and would actually have to work to get better.

So let them feel superior by saying “you don’t get it” and move on, misfit toys need homes too.

^This guy measures his success in life by how many shiny pixel things he has collected in games. Games he now no longer plays. Yeah we’ll listen to you, you obviously know what you’re doing =)

In game or in real life I actually want to succeed based on my abilities, and if working harder is what it takes, then I work harder, but it’s ok, you always have GW2 and in real life the welfare state, they don’t care that you have no desire to work at anything, and wont judge you.

flyinpoons.6481:

In game or in real life I actually want to succeed based on my abilities, and if working harder is what it takes, then I work harder, but it’s ok, you always have GW2 and in real life the welfare state, they don’t care that you have no desire to work at anything, and wont judge you.

You’re seriously going to say that people who like GW2 want to be on welfare? How distorted is your perception of life? You can tell the difference between games and reality right? You think because you would rather play some other game, you’re more succesful in real life than other posters?

You’re here arguing on the forums of a game that you don’t even like. I guess that allows me to make assumptions about you, like apparently you’re completely incapable of letting things go. That’s not a healthy attitude.

flyinpoons.6481:

What this game really is, whether the defenders of GW2 want to admit it or not, is a home for those that dislike other MMO’s because they frankly were bad at them, and never got to see the endgame because of it.

If anyone remembers the Rudolph the red nose reindeer Christmas special, this is the Island of misfit toys. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SH1j1luFOw

There is no real endgame because it would fracture their tiny ego’s knowing that once again nobody wants to play with them because they are sub par.

You can thank the “trophies for everyone” “no keeping scores” mentality that starts in school these days for the new breed of gamers who hate to see someone get shinies they cannot get because they are bad, and would actually have to work to get better.

So let them feel superior by saying “you don’t get it” and move on, misfit toys need homes too.

I wouldn’t brush off all people who like the game as challenge-haters and “bads”. That’s as unfair as saying all people who are negative about this game are plain haters.
I used to raid since early days in WoW when there was actually only one high-end dungeon and it took us a long while to get there. I even rerolled in order to be a better benefit for the guild class-wise until they buffed my home class again. I did stop quite early in 2010 though because I simply couldn’t fit in work schedule with the stringent demands of raiding anymore unless I wanted to do PUG raiding which I frankly didn’t. It was below my level to group with people who want to be carried while commenting negatively on my job of carrying them.

Now that’s out of the way I wish that PVE challenges would be much harder as well. I just came off another dragon fight and they are nothing short of boring considering I’ve really fought dragons for years. They are loot pinatas. Not quality loot but considering the scale of the encounter they should be harder and reward better. A 75% chance of failing if you zerg should be okay.

The only way I see to achieve this is: Better scaling of spawns. Less announcements of what the dragon is about to do. The art of looking at its animations is lost. Side tasks which would mitigate group damage should have a much bigger impact. If we don’t have roles then the emphasis on tasks should be much more important.
Of course it doesn’t help with the current camera and FOV issues but that’s a different story.

Fun =/= challenge. Fun is different for every person. You may find an incredibly difficult challenge that requires hours of effort and planning to be fun. Not everyone does. You may find an incredibly fast pace game requiring super quick reflexes to be fun. Not everyone does. For me, I love the theorycrafting and numbercrunching, the building of ‘builds’/‘compositions’ in MMOs like Ragnarok Online or Champions Online amd even in more single-player games like Titan Quest or Neverwinter Nights 2. The math and creative parts of building/planning characters is usually more enjoyable for me than the actual slaying of centaurs or supervillains are ghosts or whatever. I find it fun. But, again, not everyone does.

A lot of people on these forums need to get over the idea that “the way I play the game is the true definition of ‘fun’ and anyone playing differently doesn’t know what ‘fun’ is”. Listening to music is fun for a lot of people. Watching movies is fun for a lot of people. They may not face incredible challenges and overcome them while listening/watching, but are you honestly going to go up to them and say “Yeah, that music you’re listening to? Its not challenging. You’re not having real fun!!1” ? How absurd.

If GW2, or any game, is not fun for someone, then that’s it. Its not fun for them. They should accept it and move on, and so should you. The idea of “I like something therefore it is good and everyone has to like it or they’re wrong” is incredibly juvenile. Please get out of high school. If someone isn’t enthralled with GW2, and they choose to move on, let them. They aren’t wrong, they’re just different. And if GW2 is supposed to have this amazing community that I always hear GW players go on about, it better start accepting the different.

arjeidi.2690:

A lot of people on these forums need to get over the idea that "the way I play the game is the true definition of ‘fun’

Yep.

But what I dislike more is hearing things like “DEs are just zergs” from people who have no clue about DEs.
Because if they did they would know the huge depth DEs have, the dozen of different possibilites and the hundreds of consequences they cause.

This is why I say misunderstood.
People don’t go deep into things and then gets the game wrong.
It’s like looking at the surface of sea and say that submarine environment sucks.

I would be really mad if I was a dev and make a DE chain with 300 consequences, and then hear someone say DEs suck and are just zergs.

Arsenal.2601:

Disclaimer 2: I find long, autobiographical essays on why someone quit playing a video game – written with all the gravity and self importance of a world leader resigning from office – to be tiresome.

Lol yea. At one point someone created a ragequit generator, but for the life of me (ok, after a few minutes in Google), the closest I could find was Goodbye post generator

But on your point about not leaving, that’s always been the problem with oboards, and why I was really hoping Anet just wouldn’t bother with them. They start all optimistic, decend into annoyed gamers angry with their pet problems, and if the game survives the attrition of the early departed, then they become a place where veteran fans start set the community pace. Hopefully by Christmas…

Ah well. It’s as much a part of the genre as the expected entitlement to have direct feedback with devs.

poiuy.3907:

CCP might have pulled it off by making DUST a kind of FPS MMO like the old pen and paper Travelers game; but some crazy CCP dev got it into their head that they must only tap the console players. They even made DUST a PS3 exclusive! If only CCP made DUST for PC like planet side 2….(I cry every night because of their crazy decision)

I know right?! I imagined at the time Sony may have floated some incentive to CCP to make it that way, while CCP was interested enough to extend the Eve brand off of PC exclusivity to accept the narrower terms. My hope is that with the long term plans they have for Dust, it’ll come home to PC. I love Eve, even if I don’t have the lifestyle to play it the way I want to anymore.

And that is my manifesto on why I love GW2.

• I’m not here to min/max with military-style precision alongside 40+ fellow virtual soldiers.
• I don’t care what other people think of how my character looks.
• I’ll take advice if I agree with it, but happily set my own pace and learn my own way if not.
• I don’t need to value analyse a monthly fee versus time investment.
• I don’t need to calculate time investment to next set of achievements.
• I’ll stick with fellow casual players or dutifully follow orders from an established leader, as long as the latter doesn’t require exclusive commitments in 3 hour blocks. I simply avoid those events.
• I accept that MMOs are a hodge podge of often buggy bugs game mechanics each done better in some other game genre, but generally just one such game mechanic done better. No other genre can combine so many things in one place, because only one has the persistent world public space.
• I quit when I’m bored.
• I come back when I’m interested.
  But of course, that wasn’t always the case. I wonder if everyone whose ever spent time in this genre goes through the same new game/optimistic-for-next-game/wtf-is-this-stuff/acceptance seven steps of grief

There’s enough game here for everyone. And when there’s not, time to leave.

Yep.

But what I dislike more is hearing things like “DEs are just zergs” from people who have no clue about DEs.
Because if they did they would know the huge depth DEs have, the dozen of different possibilites and the hundreds of consequences they cause.

This is why I say misunderstood.
People don’t go deep into things and then gets the game wrong.
It’s like looking at the surface of sea and say that submarine environment sucks.

I would be really mad if I was a dev and make a DE chain with 300 consequences, and then hear someone say DEs suck and are just zergs.

Guess ANet should’ve designed them better then?

IE: With our “zerg” we’ll never lose ~ save for the pheonix/balthazar.
and even then, the events aren’t complex as the pheonix also relies on his zerg to combat yours and balthazar is nothing but a HP/DMG bruiser.

So ya..

If GW2’s Dynamic Events weren’t so shotty, perhaps people would care?

As is, they rely on a broken combat system that doesn’t support tactics or thought out mechanics ~ thus come off as boring zerg fests.

~ Just my 2 cents ~

My own fix::
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Combat-Dynamic-Events-what-s-the-point-if-they-re-easy-mode/page/1

Red Falcon, you spend too much time theorizing on the forum instead of playing, kid.

The game is FAR, FAR from revolutionary. If anything, it is a step back on MMOs development because it does not give ANYTHING new, it just remodels old things on a new package and tells you its something awesome. Weak minded players like you believe it, others with more brain do not.

DEs? Rift done better. The rest of the game is just copy/paste of other MMOs really, but with great art.

Go play the game and you will realize GW2 is nothing but incredibly hype of a not incredible game.

From 1 to 80 the game is fine for what it is, a single player co-op game that pretends to be an MMO. The first time to 80 is pretty fun if you realize that is what it is. After that it gets rather stale quickly, but as a co-op game it is fine.

As an MMO it fails miserably after max level, but if you like doing the same thing again you can roll another class.

Red Falcon.8257:

Yep.

But what I dislike more is hearing things like “DEs are just zergs” from people who have no clue about DEs.
Because if they did they would know the huge depth DEs have, the dozen of different possibilites and the hundreds of consequences they cause.

How much time do you have to invest before the mists clear and the grand DE revelation reveals itself? I’ve played on and off since the 3 days before this game went on general sale and have never felt like a DE was anything other than a timed zerg event which, certainly compared to other games, was incredibly inconsequential.

The world isn’t dynamic in the way you seem to think it is. At best it rotates every hour or so and when you’re fighting off the Centaur horde (for it is always Centaurs in GW2) it loses all weight as no matter the outcome it’s going to revert in a trivial amount of time. Compare that to something like WAR where zones spanned several areas but, depending on the amount of control exerted by each faction, only some of those were accessible at once, or Tabula Rasa where towns could completely change. Even WoW has a more dynamic world with phasing because the world actually changes. GW2 runs like clockwork and doesn’t change – ever.

You can argue that the DEs have consequences beyond win/lose but if that’s true then they’re so minor they might as well not exist.

GW2 isn’t misunderstood in my opinions, it’s just a colourful mishmash of ideas that other MMO’s have done better thrown into a theme park melting pot where the entire population of Hobbiton descends to clobber one beleaguered Centaur.

All I see and all I hear from the negative nancies that just want another WoW clone is.

“Time is money friend!” Thats all the WoW generation gamers care about because its all they’ve seen/experienced, not only in WoW but in post-WoW games too.

GW2 takes a step back through time, before WoW and bringing new ideas with them to make a Neoclassic original MMO.

If you want a WoW style MMO there are many out there to chose from, either fantasy or sci-fi. No need to nag on GW2 since most of us who bought it were very aware that it was nothing like WoW or the post-WoWpocalyptic clones.

Plutoe.4859:

The world isn’t dynamic in the way you seem to think it is. At best it rotates every hour or so and when you’re fighting off the Centaur horde (for it is always Centaurs in GW2)s

I think the “changes 300 things” quotes are gettin’ a bit hyperbolic, but they’re certainly more than jus’ stand alone zerg fodder, too. (and it’s only “always the Centaurs” in the human lands – each racial area has it’s own few bad guys groups)

Thing is, if ya do a DE, then listen to the dialogue an’ follow it on, you’ll be seein’ the whole thing play out across many events, and maybe the whole zone … so sure it starts over for someone else an hour later, but for the people following it, they’ve got a story to follow and have fun with.

And there are tons of events, from great to small, all over the game – so there’s always somethin’ ta see and follow and get involved with if ya look and talk to the NPCs.

I think it isn’t that people are misunderstanding the game. It’s that the game isn’t as great or as unique as some people think it is. Conceptually, it isn’t that different from Rift except that there is a chain event tied to GW2’s DE; and even then, it’s not all DE, only some. Many of them are one off events and even if they aren’t the game does very poorly at linking these things together.

The issue is that Anet dislikes questing and quest structure. In fact, even their own DE descriptors are so brief, you end up not really caring or knowing what’s happeining.

Look at WarHammers Public Quests (which is the precursor of DE btw) and you see that Mythic was able to weave structure and story into the DE; you could jump in at any time and figure out what was going on – not so for GW2. It’s all unlinked and inconsequential.

The decision to do away with trational questing and story text is lazy at best and catastrophic at worst – to their own DE chains. Even Warhammer was able to weave questing into their event structures – heck, even Rift’s “dynamic events” had a little more cohension than GW2’s DE – and they still managed questing and story structure as well.

Describing the Dynamic Events as a huge leap forward is ignorant at best. It’s a feature that by relying completely on it as the “structure” of the game, ended up feeling and looking lazy. It doesn’t at all let you know what’s going on in the zone or even at the event itself. Even if you randomly talk to NPC, you still won’t know.

At the moment, Anet has a very nice land mass (zone designs) that are begging to be filled out properly. It’s unfinished at this point; and until they go back to every event to try and tie these together more coherently, it will remain unfinished.

Also, OP, see Rift. See Warhammer Online. -I would say, Warhammer Online’s public quests were superior to Dynamic events in execution. They acted much more like mini raids than DE and had interesting loot – also, their contribution system, while not perfect by any means, was more fleshed out and requried more participation than just “tag a mob” earn bronze, or tag 2 mobs earn silver, or tag 3 mobs, earn gold. You do that in WH and you’d earn nothing.

The biggest issue I see is that players think Guild Wars 2 is a objective game, as opposed to a subjective game.

Knuckledust.5621:

SneakyErvin.3056:

All I see and all I hear from the negative nancies that just want another WoW clone is.

“Time is money friend!” Thats all the WoW generation gamers care about because its all they’ve seen/experienced, not only in WoW but in post-WoW games too.

GW2 takes a step back through time, before WoW and bringing new ideas with them to make a Neoclassic original MMO.

If you want a WoW style MMO there are many out there to chose from, either fantasy or sci-fi. No need to nag on GW2 since most of us who bought it were very aware that it was nothing like WoW or the post-WoWpocalyptic clones.

This type of fanboy post is exactly what makes me laugh!

Kid, what we really wanted was that GW2 would be DIFFERENT from WoW. we criticize the game because it turned out to be ANOTHER WOW CLONE. Not the other way around.

Fanboys are sad.

Can you stop calling other posters kids, it really shows your own maturity level.

BTW GW2 is nothing like WoW. But you keep on spouting your opinions like their fact.

The problem is the economy, people lose hope when they see things out of reach, they have pretty much put the carrot in another universe.

Why is the best way to get gold in this game farming like a bot in curse shore? why are the bots selling gold at $1 for 2g when buying gems would only get you $1 for 32 silver.
That is proof they are winning by a mile and proof they have the best means to get gold.

Why do dragons, bosses and dungeons give next to nothing? The best rewards and gold gaining in this game should come from playing the game the way it’s meant to be played. Every dragon kill should give exotic rewards, every dungeon complete should give 1-3. Anything that can’t be botted or teleport hacked should give the best rewards.

Well I get more gold running dungeons than farming Orr. I only visit Orr if I need ori, ancient wood or omniberries. The amount of people/bots that farm the crap outta that zone has turned me off to be honest. It’s just a really boring area now for me at least.

Whoa whoa whoa…hold the presses. Some people actually think this game is grindy?

Like…seriously?

In this game you can CRAFT from 1 to 80 if you have the materials. It takes less than a week of doing events to get a character to max level through map completion alone.

I’d hate to see what would happen if these people ever played a real grinder, like Ragnarok online.

I’m not sure that the game is misunderstood, in fact I don’t care if it is. I actually had a cool little rant to put here filled with fun numbers and stuff, but in the end I decided it really doesn’t matter just like those that don’t like the game, have gripes, misunderstand and what not, cause at the end of the day, I enjoy this game, I think it is fun and the rest of the world can do as they do.

LOCO.1785:

Well I get more gold running dungeons than farming Orr. I only visit Orr if I need ori, ancient wood or omniberries. The amount of people/bots that farm the crap outta that zone has turned me off to be honest. It’s just a really boring area now for me at least.

which dungeon gets you 2-3g per hour?

Lifelike.5862:

Whoa whoa whoa…hold the presses. Some people actually think this game is grindy?

Like…seriously?

In this game you can CRAFT from 1 to 80 if you have the materials. It takes less than a week of doing events to get a character to max level through map completion alone.

I’d hate to see what would happen if these people ever played a real grinder, like Ragnarok online.

They’re referring to the grind that sets in once you reach level 80, not while you’re still levelling. Once you get there, the miniscule drop rate coupled with DR makes doing anything take forever.

Or, you could buy gems from Anet. But not any other RMT company, those are forbidden.

Why do I care how the unexploded shells got there? I’m still running around (just like I would in WoW) picking up the shells. Boring gameplay is boring gameplay, regardless of what triggers it.

In some ways I love dynamic events because they do make the world feel a little more alive, stories and chains can be told a lot better in the same location using them. They add a certain amount of depth and immersion to the world. On the other hand, regular quests are content on demand. I don’t have situations where I’m desperately scouring the continent pleading the game for an event to spawn. One thing I get sick of really quickly is playing for large periods of times on many maps without seeing any events. It has a big impact on your game experience when you are unlucky with event spawns. Dynamic events need a lot of balance of polish before they can move beyond the significant flaws holding them back.

Ultimately, if you are killing 12 bandits, collecting 10 mushrooms, destroying eight crates you are doing the same things you did in every other MMO. The package was different but the contents were the same. In that sense, I think GW2 is misunderstood by some of it’s fans – people don’t see that many of the displeased people weren’t fooled by the repackaging of the same content. The core of the gameplay, the primary experience players are having with the game is the same as everything that came before it and that’s where GW2 is misunderstood and that’s why it’s not as revolutionary as many make it out to be.

This isn’t a leap in the MMO genre, it’s an imperfect twisted variation of what came before it. Some of it worked, some of it didn’t, a lot of it (beyond the bugs) needs a lot more work. I thin GW2 is well understood.

Indeed, Red Falcon, it’s a misunderstood game. I understood it’s gonna be awesome, so I bought it, but it turned out to be just plain awful.

flyinpoon

In game or in real life I actually want to succeed based on my abilities, and if working harder is what it takes, then I work harder, but it’s ok, you always have GW2 and in real life the welfare state, they don’t care that you have no desire to work at anything, and wont judge you.

Except you run into a contradiction in terminus here. In no other MMO is it possible to be successful ingame and irl at the same time. Between work, girlfriend and triathlon I have little time to actually run evening long raids every other night. With GW2 I can have an hour of quick MMO fun and then log off. No other MMO I played previously allowed me to have a real life like this. Because of that I never became “successful” in other MMOs because my RL takes first place over pixels.

Maybe I was bad in other MMOs, but if I have to compete with 16 years olds and welfare people, while I actually have a pretty successful life… with all due respect, it’s not possible for me to be “good”. I don’t see that as a bad thing though, and I just want an MMO to lose myself in for a few hours now and then. GW2 is the first MMO that respects my limited time. Even gaining a legendary looks possible in the long run.

The DEs feel much more complex and organic than RIFT’s – more fun too. Back when I played RIFT the events were just rifts popping up, needing to get closed within a time frame, and a few Mob waves making their ways through the zone, with one boss mob. In GW2, things actually change, seraphs taking over centaur camps, and vice versa. Failed defenses leading to missions to rescue prisoners. Much more attention to detail was given here.

I also love the dialogues we hear in game. The little glimpses of NPCs. Help one researcher find treasure, which turns out to be a famous brew of ale, which renders her assistants too drunk to defend her from raiders in the next step, sleeping through the whole fight. Children playing Edge of Destiny in the street.

Collecting, fetching and killcounting is a staple of the MMO genre, and gaming in general. You can’t very well expect any self-respecting MMO to not have these conventions. Somehow, you have to do work in order to gain your levels, not everything is going to be handed to you on a silver platter, or there wouldn’t be much game to play, would there?

“I want to go kill things in order to gain my experience and rack up my points” Well ok, you can go kill things, providing a more dynamic gameplay experience, but then you’re going to complain about the game being a grind. What else would you be doing? Oh, of course, events and raids. That’s just killing things in a specific way, probably collecting important item X for whatever it’s needed for, and making your character more shiny.

Or, you can do jobs for NPCS. Just like real life jobs, that’s going to involve getting something that NPC wants, getting something you want, getting something other players want, killing something the NPC’s want dead, etc etc. Would you rather gain exp by chatting to the npcs? No, that’s going to be boring for most players, because Americans hate lore. Maybe you should be getting EXP for putting banners on the field and inspiring troop morale…nope ,that’s just going from point A to point B and pressing buttons, but with a different package! Omg, like every other game out there! 9_9

MMOs are by design based on a sense of progression in a social environment. Loosely simulating real life conventions and processes in a way that makes them seem fantastical and fun. You play MMO’s to collect things, to explore, to fight monsters and collect more things, make those collected things into things, and slowly progress from a mewling newbie into a kitten with a +10 Legendary BFF sword. Take that away, and you no longer have an MMO. You may as well go play 2D fighters since the only grinding involved for PVP is practicing mad skillz in training mode (and even then people complain about that, still).

Ugh, gamers these days have no idea what they want.

1-80 in 260 hours+, thats not including ALOT of the games content, WvW, sPvP, Dungeons, Crafting for £30? I think thats a very reasonable price / content ratio. Aslong as content is added to keep the world fresh – as in an MMO is meant to be a “living world” and expansions are created in a decent timeframe with content / price ratio as good as the original game i’d say its all good.

GW2 was not missold at all, it plays very much like the impression I got it would play from trailers/interviews/sneak peaks etc.

“Indeed, Red Falcon, it’s a misunderstood game. I understood it’s gonna be awesome, so I bought it, but it turned out to be just plain awful.”

This is the only way in which the game was misunderstood. We all believed we would be seeing the next big step in the genre after WoW, but in truth it’s just another grindfest designed to encourage real money purchases. I was afraid this might happen, knowing NcSoft, but I made myself believe the lie that they would give ArenaNet independence on the matter.

One year or so ago, I would’ve countered anyone badmouthing Guild Wars 2. I would tell any friend and acquaintance that was interested in gaming about it. Now that I’ve played the game, not only do I not feel like recommending it to anyone, but I’d also advise against buying it.

Sure, the game might be successful. People who have no clue about the promise this game showed these past years probably won’t be bothered by its failure to deliver. People may even keep spending hundreds of dollars on virtual items, virtual storage space and so forth. NcSoft may make their huge profits off the game. Despite all that, to me, Guild Wars 2 is just another failure. In fact, I’m even more disappointed with Guild Wars 2 than with other MMOs.

I bought Rift expecting it to be a WoW-like MMO with a better class system and a dynamic world. It was. I played it for a while, got bored of it, put it down but without any negative feelings.

I bought SWTOR expecting it to be a WoW-like MMO with a Bioware-style personal story. Again, played it for a while until I got bored, put it down without hard feelings.

I bought Guild Wars 2 expecting it to be a game that “…takes everything you love about Guild Wars 1 and puts it into a persistent world…”. More than that, I was expecting a game in which “We don’t want players to grind…”. The truth is they don’t want you to grind, that’s why they’ve made it a pain in the kitten they want you to buy gems with real money.

I’m putting Guild Wars 2 down as well, but with a bitter taste in my mouth, which means it’s unlikely I’ll ever be a customer of ArenaNet or NcSoft again.

AlexanderFaust.4518:

While I don’t agree with the tone of your post ~ I can’t argue with some of your points. ~ People that like GW2 seem to have forgotten what “fun” is really about (IE: Challenge) ~ not having everything handed to you.

You simply fail to understand that fun is not a fixed concept but something that is different to different people.

You say challenge and not getting everything handed to you is fun. This is not an exact statement, because what is a challenge to you? And at which point do you feel like they’re handing things out to you?

There simple is not a single reply to those questions.

Karma gear and legendary’s are not handed out as it is. But GW1 wasn’t about what you want.

The OP is right that this game is largely misunderstood. You apparently don’t get that the definition of fun is different for different people.

People who want more of a challenge can handicap themselves by using less than optimal gear.

People who want less of a challenge can’t do that. If a game gets too hard – more precisely, too time consuming, since MMOGs mostl require time, not skill – they need to find another game.

If a game is too easy for someone, and he can’t be bothered to challenge himself – I loathe to think how they would act in a fitness studio if they are unwilling to change weights for themselves, instead demanding that the whole studio is tuned to his level.

About the thread title, it’s not complete…

Guild Wars 2 is misunderstood by some players. But those are the players that want their reward now, preferably yesterday. They’re constantly in a hurry, to go to a location ASAP, get as much money ASAP, complain on the forums about lack of content ASAP.

Fenes.6013:

People who want more of a challenge can handicap themselves by using less than optimal gear.

People who want less of a challenge can’t do that. If a game gets too hard – more precisely, too time consuming, since MMOGs mostl require time, not skill – they need to find another game.

If a game is too easy for someone, and he can’t be bothered to challenge himself – I loathe to think how they would act in a fitness studio if they are unwilling to change weights for themselves, instead demanding that the whole studio is tuned to his level.

GW2 is a gym where you are only allowed to use those tiny, padded 2 pound weights. Sure some people might be able to convince themselves they are getting a workout, but you can’t blame the people who look around, shake their heads and leave.

@ Gohlar:

So you can’t wear weaker or no armor, and use weaker weapons to challenge yourself? Your game must be bugged then, I can easily scale up the challegne by using weaker gear, or – while leveling – try on harder stuff.

I see alot of people calling it a grindfest. What grinding is actually needed to get anywhere?

Leveling? Nope, dynamic events, hearts, dungeons, WvW, crafting etc. It’s all up to the player.

At 80? Nope, not really, unless you really want that shiny gear, otherwise all you need to do is spend 3 hours and have full exotic gear and do what you feel like.

In sPvP? Nope, not really, you play it because its fun, just like people used to play or still play CS, BF142, 2142, BF3, Vietnam, SC1, SC2 and so on. We PvP cos we like it.

In WvW? Nope not really, you WvW cos you think its fun, you already have the gear you need when you hit 80 pretty much.

There is nothing in this game that forces you to grind for anything. It doesnt matter if you stop playing for a long period, you are still at the same footing as others. The game is about having fun, not chasing carrots.

People also claim its hard to make gold in this game or buy gems with gold. Its not, its very simple. Only gems I’ve bought with real money was the gems to expand my character slots. Rest has been upgraded through gems bought for gold. Including spending several gold on transmutation stones to keep my looks.

Mining, herbing and cutting down trees is quick and easy gold and doesnt rob much of your gametime.

Fenes.6013:

@ Gohlar:

So you can’t wear weaker or no armor, and use weaker weapons to challenge yourself? Your game must be bugged then, I can easily scale up the challegne by using weaker gear, or – while leveling – try on harder stuff.

That suggestion shows a pretty massive problem with the game don’t you think?

I could play Super Mario bros with my feet and it’s like a whole new game! lol no.

@Gohlar …but what if GW2 isn’t a gym but a cafe where you can have a laugh, a couple of beers and fun with some friends. And in that bar you can throw darts, shoot some pool etc etc.

It’s all about perception. What you might want to consider is that when you create a MMO you want to actually get a return on investment. This means that you need to aim for a larger audience. Per definition you cannot then focus this game towards a small part of this audience.

You represent a part of the audience but not the majority of players. If they make the game more challenging, Anet will lose a lot of players accordingly. Less income therefore. They make their cash off the initial box sale and basically fluff, convenience items in the gemstore….look at the gemstore and tell me whether you think it’s geared towards more casual or hardcore players. I think you might agree that it’s more about casuals. Hardcore players don’t need costumes and mini pets.

So a lot of the continuous sales come via the casual community. Making the game harder just chases those people away.

I’ve seen this in many MMOs but not to be funny but if you want hardcore, go play lineage or something. Here in the west the MMOs are more casual or they have a very small population. And well, small populations are not good for big projects that cost a lot of money to make.

It’s like going to McDonald’s and wondering why they don’t sell Beef Wellington. If you want the hardcore stuff and lots of challenge, a big game won’t offer that to you, because there’s not enough players that like that to make it worth investing many millions into.

Gotta love how many people post here like it’s their personal blog and their opinion is something relevant. No matter how well a game is developed these days, it will never be rid of the constant whining and entitlement that this generation of gamers brings to the community.

Gohlar.3671:

Fenes.6013:

@ Gohlar:

So you can’t wear weaker or no armor, and use weaker weapons to challenge yourself? Your game must be bugged then, I can easily scale up the challegne by using weaker gear, or – while leveling – try on harder stuff.

That suggestion shows a pretty massive problem with the game don’t you think?

I could play Super Mario bros with my feet and it’s like a whole new game! lol no.

Not at all. The problems are not with the game, but with the players. There’s this new breed of players these days, who seem unable to challenge themselves and then complain about something being too easy. Like someone who can’t be bothered to change weights in the fitness studio, and complains about it. I don’t know where they come from, but they are often trying to ruin good games.

Fenes.6013:

Gohlar.3671:

Fenes.6013:

@ Gohlar:

So you can’t wear weaker or no armor, and use weaker weapons to challenge yourself? Your game must be bugged then, I can easily scale up the challegne by using weaker gear, or – while leveling – try on harder stuff.

That suggestion shows a pretty massive problem with the game don’t you think?

I could play Super Mario bros with my feet and it’s like a whole new game! lol no.

Not at all. The problems are not with the game, but with the players. There’s this new breed of players these days, who seem unable to challenge themselves and then complain about something being too easy. Like someone who can’t be bothered to change weights in the fitness studio, and complains about it. I don’t know where they come from, but they are often trying to ruin good games.

The irony of this post is overwhelming.

GW2 is easy because of people who are afraid of a challenge. You guys demand the bar be placed at the lowest possible level and you have the nerve to blame decent players for not liking it?

That’s just ridiculous. Seriously, this is one of the worst arguments I’ve ever seen on the internet. It’s the players fault for not enjoying handicapping themselves in a stupidly easy game? Now I’ve seen it all.

SneakyErvin.3056:

I see alot of people calling it a grindfest. What grinding is actually needed to get anywhere?

Leveling? Nope, dynamic events, hearts, dungeons, WvW, crafting etc. It’s all up to the player.

At 80? Nope, not really, unless you really want that shiny gear, otherwise all you need to do is spend 3 hours and have full exotic gear and do what you feel like.

Leveling with crafting and forms of PvP is nothing new to mmo’s, personally I find leveling repetitive and pointless in this game among others.

At 80 I think a sentiment is that many of the supposed things to do at 80 are in fact grinding eg getting legendarily, gear skins, heart’s. There is a lack of what most people perceive to be fun activities/goals and problems with core mechanics (mainly combat). I think this could be alleviated by giving more sandbox type options to players.

I have to say, yes, its an understood game.

1.- Many of us think about a lot of things we hate about MMO will be gone, like grind, and limited content AND easy, unrewarding and unchalleging content. And this do not happen, GW2 is as it is now, for level 80, a grindfest for whatever you want to do. If not gettin exotic level 80 items.

2.- Many of us think about a lot of things we would love to see in MMO being here, like DE, fun gameplay mechanics, interesting story line, a dinamic world, a lovely art desing and soundtrack, a game that keeps eye in the little yet heartwarming details and turn the already outdated routine of —→ level cap --→ raid —→ equipment upgrade --—> fun. Into everything mixed at the same time, in a game where whatever you are doing, you are not losing time nor rewards. What i think is great.

Wheres the problem, both sides are right and wrong, but for 60 bucks and 3 years of waiting, haters and fanboys are here, in a religious war bashing Anet/NCsoft claiming this is the bigest letdown in the history of mankind, and in the other side of the wall, the fanboys are in a last stand claiming this game is all groundbreaking and is the new paragon of evolution for our species, it will bring peace, love and even the cure for cancer… Let me tell you all, you are wrong.

This game is just 2 months old, most haters compare it to +7 years old games. This game isn`t groundbreaking, many of it`s features are in other games and better done in those (DE in warhammer by the name of public quest for example). What not many here understand, is, that this game needs time. Time is what developers need to have to study and realize how the game can be improved, in they way THEY WANT not the way you or me want, cause… They are the developers duh, is their work, their art, their paint… We buy it yes, but because we like it, or we heard they would do something we would like, if not, is not artist fault… No one put a handgun on our heads to buy the game.

This game needs time, to improve and update the mechanics and game itself, in 2 years from now, it would be a lot different, maybe with a more depth combat, maybe with more challenge in the boss fight. Even they would implemente my “jumping puzzle boss” idea (shadow of the colossus like bosses lol) how knows… But now, is a just born child, and many here are asking him to do mathematics of philosphy that he cant do, and many here are saying he can do things like that while he can`t.

This game undoubtly has raised the bar for MMO genre, but a little bit only, not even close to revolutionary, to be a revolutionary game it needs to pass a lot of test, and one of those is the test of time…

But the mayor problem, is that most ppl buy this game for hype and hype alone, thinking it would be their new drug… I dont think Anet has make this great game just to feed adicts… They have done all this work for people to enjoy, if you dont enjoy dont play it… I seriusly find hard to understand people who like to do thing they dont like to do, is terrible…

Mitlandir.8306:

I’d like to add that today’s gamers care too much about “being rewarded for their efforts” – something I’ve seen in more than one post.

I actually feel that today’s gamers “want rewards WITHOUT the effort”, and this game caters for that audience to some extent.

I agree whole heartedly with the OP. If you listen to the bickering and chatter between NPCs(which is often funny and interesting), youll realize an event is coming and for what reason. You follow them, complete the event, and follow them back to listen to the results. Another event might insue, and before long you understand the dynamics of that area, and learn a little bit about the NPCs and their history.

With regard to the OP about renown hearts feeding off of the events of DEs..interesting, I never noticed it. That makes the world that much more interesting.

With that said, I will say that I wish Arenanet would take the “living breathing world” concept a step further, and adopt what Rift has done with “invasions”. Hordes of centaurs raiding key points on the map…not necessarily DEs, where they invade a small town and kill some NPCs, but maybe attack way points as well, and wander the entire map destroying everything…give us incentive to band together as a server and as a zone community to take back those waypoints so we can travel around the map, so we have our vendors standing up right, etc.

cesmode.4257:

I agree whole heartedly with the OP. If you listen to the bickering and chatter between NPCs(which is often funny and interesting), youll realize an event is coming and for what reason. You follow them, complete the event, and follow them back to listen to the results. Another event might insue, and before long you understand the dynamics of that area, and learn a little bit about the NPCs and their history.

Yep. Look, follow, listen.

Many times the NPCs spell out quite clearly what they’re up to “hmm … maybe if I build an Ettin destroying suit?” This isn’t idle chatter. A suit will be built, something will come from this. Likely, an attempt to destroy Ettin with said suit. Your assistance may be required.

Never mind…its all been said before

I think even the Public quest events in EQ2 were better than the DE’s in GW2, although EQ2 only had a few of these events they required quite a bit of strategy and could not be zerged down unless you had a ton of raid equipped players.

I do love the DE’s for flavor, the scripts, the NPC’s, all that stuff is quite awesome. But the fights themselves are simple zergs. Even the dragon events, the ones which are supposed to be among the harder events, are just zerg fests with no strategy whatsoever.