Guild Wars 2

These last few days have been hard on me. I, like many other self proclaimed White Knights, love this game and constantly defending Anet decisions because there’s always been a logical rhyme and reason. On controversial topics like RNG, I defend the system because it’s a necessary evil to help balance rewards. On the Trading Post, I support John Smith in his never ending quest to balance a dynamic economy to avoid out of control inflation. Gem Store monetization of item skin? I support Anet’s microtransaction focus to keep this game subscription free. Been playing Guild Wars since August 2005 as my first and only MMO franchise up to today.

So what’s going on that frustrates hardcore fans like me? The direction of this game, and the decisions that are being made behind the scenes. So many players feel like Heart of Thorns is incomplete as a “proper” expansion. Mike O’Brien took offense to this because, and I will agree, that HoT did have a lot of content and updates. The problem here is the perception of what an expansion should be. When comparing it to GW1, our expansions were an entire game in and of itself. Cantha and Elona were so large, that it could have been played by itself without the core GW1. I mapped every single pixel on every corner of Tyria, and I can attest that size matters. It had it’s own starter areas, own classes, and specific storylines that fit into the whole GW Universe lore. HoT, even with all the updates, bells, and whistles, “felt” smaller because there’s only a few new maps added. Technically they were big maps because of the Z-axis allowing for height in the game, but players’s perception will still be biased towards how much of the Tyria world was added. People like that_shaman could correct me if I’m wrong here, but the areas opened up by HoT in the world would have been like GW1 offering an expansion that opened up the Ring of Fire area.

With Colin at the helm, GW2 Hype Train felt like it was still going in a good direction, albeit a slow chug up the mountain. With change of leadership comes change of style. That’s not to say MO is bad at this job. He was one of the creators of ArenaNet, and a game designer by trade. I still love the guy for what he’s done for the MMO industry. But in terms of management, there’s one thing you don’t want to do, no matter what industry you’re in. You don’t want to make decisions that you know will upset a large portion of your loyal customer base. Don’t make promises, then walk back on them in order to refocus and redirect goals. As a manager myself (non-game industry), it’s really hard to grasp how 6 extra devs will make that much of a difference in the overall direction of Living World releases. I’ve heard there’s at least 200 others constantly working on other projects.

My opinion is that Colin should be brought back on a part-time basis. Allow him to consult from home so he can not only focus on his family, but provide direction that all us players have come to respect. I’m not saying I don’t respect MO, but as a matter of style, we prefer Colin. Either way, I’ll still play this game. How happy I’ll be is yet to be seen.

I lost a LOT of respect for Mike O’brien when he posted and specifically named people in order to humiliate, embarrass, and shame them for their opinions. There are a lot of valid, demonstrable reasons why players see HoT as incomplete.

But for a professional to name and shame when Anet’s policy for their own players is not to allow this is just pathetic. And totally unprofessional. He needs to get a grip on his emotions and step back and look at all points of view objectively, politely, and professionally.

God no, in the realm of GW2 hype train was all there was with Colin.

Celtic Lady.3729:

I lost a LOT of respect for Mike O’brien when he posted and specifically named people in order to humiliate, embarrass, and shame them for their opinions. There are a lot of valid, demonstrable reasons why players see HoT as incomplete.

But for a professional to name and shame when Anet’s policy for their own players is not to allow this is just pathetic. And totally unprofessional. He needs to get a grip on his emotions and step back and look at all points of view objectively, politely, and professionally.

But he wasn’t naming and shaming he was making a direct response to those people :x

Saying he was naming and shaming them is like if you were to say I’m naming and shaming you right now by quoting you directly.

Celtic Lady.3729:

I lost a LOT of respect for Mike O’brien when he posted and specifically named people in order to humiliate, embarrass, and shame them for their opinions. There are a lot of valid, demonstrable reasons why players see HoT as incomplete.

But for a professional to name and shame when Anet’s policy for their own players is not to allow this is just pathetic. And totally unprofessional. He needs to get a grip on his emotions and step back and look at all points of view objectively, politely, and professionally.

I think you should go back and read his post. In no way was he shaming anyone, he was addressing a few peoples specific criticisms. You may have just mis-read it.

I as well do not think Colin will serve to help things at all, it is under his helm that HoT launched low on content. I say give Mike O’Brien an honest chance.

I honestly think it’s less about the difference those 6 people will make to the LS and more about the fact they’re so unproductive when it comes to making the legendary weapons.

If those people rly only can make 1 weapon every 4-5 months you could hardly call that a sustainable situation. They’re probably a lot more productive when put on other projects.

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m as unhappy with this decision as anyone, but that does sound the most logical to me, especially when MO was talking about “sustainability”.

I know 1 thing though. I don’t want colin’s ‘failure to deliver’ hype train back. If they hadn’t made these promises in the first place there wouldn’t be this kind of drama right now.

Getting rid of Colin was the right thing to do: he was doing a terrible job. But let’s not be so foolish to make him into a scapegoat. Anet’s problem is still there.

Mo could have simply kept quiet. He didn’t need to inform players that legendaries were put on hold. They were never promised to be released anytime soon, only that they would eventually release 16 of them. It doesn’t matter that Colin left, the same thing would have likely happened, except they probably would have kept quiet.

The problem is, with no new content for the majority of players, the numbers are likely sliding hard and HoT’s numbers were likely not good to begin with due to the nature of HoT. What could those 6 devs possibly do? Live events in the past were created by smaller teams. SAB for example was primarily done by Josh Foreman. Assuming those 6 are actually capable of that kind of work, they should either be able to fix up one of the older events or make something more basic within a month. With season 3 being 5+ months away, they need anything to pass the time. They could even start with a basic season 1 style build up for season 3, with I’m guessing Chak starting to invade, or leaking out of the jungle to wreak low levels. Bring back the season 1 style as intermissions imo.

@OP:

You are crazy. So, Colin created a complete mess that we are in. MO communicates that mess, and you then blame MO for the mess. You really think the lack of content started in the last few weeks?

Use some logic before posting.

Celtic Lady.3729:

I lost a LOT of respect for Mike O’brien when he posted and specifically named people in order to humiliate, embarrass, and shame them for their opinions. There are a lot of valid, demonstrable reasons why players see HoT as incomplete.

But for a professional to name and shame when Anet’s policy for their own players is not to allow this is just pathetic. And totally unprofessional. He needs to get a grip on his emotions and step back and look at all points of view objectively, politely, and professionally.

MO did not name and shame anyone. Stop being silly.

And no. Colin won’t change anything if he comes back now.

MO was just the bearer of bad news, because this was probably already decided far back. He just let us know, which is a respectful thing to do, despite the current circumstances.

Yes, I am disappointed in the direction it’s going, but the transparency done by MO is appreciated nonetheless.

Farzo.8410:

MO did not name and shame anyone. Stop being silly.

This has already been addressed repeatedly. Guess you just like being a parrot?

No, just no. Far as I can tell Colin was part of the problem anyway. My sympathy for ANET as a whole has run out though, as it’s clear they never had or planned a clear direction after HoT, jumping from PvP, to PvE, to WvW hype over the last few months. I loved HoT when it released, but now I hardly even play because there is hardly anyone on those maps. The balance was still in bad shape before the elite specs, and now it’s even worse in PvP. WvW….great ideas, horrible execution, and again, they left core system problems unaddressed.

I’ll say this for Mike, least he had the balls to come out and tell us they are scrapping legendaries rather than just say soon or try and spin it into something positive. No hope is better than false hope.

Celtic Lady.3729:

This has already been addressed repeatedly. Guess you just like being a parrot?

We like it when people tell the truth. We don’t like it when people lie or mischaracterize like you have.

Directing a response to an individual is not naming and shaming.

Sarrs.4831:

Celtic Lady.3729:

This has already been addressed repeatedly. Guess you just like being a parrot?

We like it when people tell the truth. We don’t like it when people lie or mischaracterize like you have.

Directing a response to an individual is not naming and shaming.

I didn’t lie. I misunderstood the post and when I read it, it looked exactly like calling out names for the purpose of shaming. As several players pointed out I was wrong, I went back and re-read the post and saw what they were saying. I made a simple mistake. What’s your excuse for accusing me of something you have no evidence of?

With the retraction of the leg weapons I can see this being the first step in the down fall of my favorite game in a lng time GW1 was great I still not the biggest fan of the way GW2 plays but I have gotten over it for the most part. Just a few idea that could and should help the game get back on track and yes some are easy and some will take awhile.

First: Cross profession, yes I understand ppl will say this will make things or some build totally OP but here is the catch it is for PVE only no cross profession in pvp or wvw.

Second: We have been calling for the Tengu to be a playable race for so long now give us what a lot of us want. This will open a new area which you can tie into the hOT updates and give players a look at the race they have wanted forever.

Third: This one is out there because this is a MMO but here goes, give the option to close the world to players an have heroes, yes you read that correct, it would be along the lines of GW1. Reason for this I when doing mapping you can not always have ppl around you to assist in what you are doing this will give us that it.

Four: Leader control in tuff like fractals, ppl will kick he leader the one that started the group if they do not like something he says, that is not right if they do not like it then they should leave.

Five: Open up Cantha for the love of god, the content that came with HOT is so small it really should have been just a update and not an expansion. I feel robbed of my money. Cantha is a huge area in GW1 and it was fantastic for the game.

Six: Bring back the underworld, there is always a fun times to be had in the underworld.

Seven: New stat trinkets, you can only get some of these from raid and that is nothing but crap because some of u do not do raids and we want the new trinkets.

Eight: Drop rates for everything, increase the drop rates by 2-5% since everything is random there is no need to worry about some getting something to power full all the time.

Nine: Have ectos drop, this can be tied into with the underworld

Ten: Tis is the final one but is the hardest, LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYERS, yes you can not make everyone happy we all know this but when we call for something and there is a lot of us calling for it then do it. If you make most of the ppl happy and only kitten off the smaller set then you are golden. kittening off a large set of ppl will do only one thing, cause GW2 and anet to go belly up. and right now we all do not want that to happen so please listen to us and take our advice, if you have to put votes out there to see what ppl want first and so on.

style.6173:

@OP:

You are crazy. So, Colin created a complete mess that we are in. MO communicates that mess, and you then blame MO for the mess. You really think the lack of content started in the last few weeks?

Use some logic before posting.

Why do people keep blaming Colin alone for everything?

O’Brien knew what was being done, and communicated to the players shoulder to shoulder with Colin. Get off that hype train. See the video in my sig.

Look at all these armchair business theorists, thinking they know what they’re talking about. . .

Celtic Lady.3729:

Sarrs.4831:

Celtic Lady.3729:

This has already been addressed repeatedly. Guess you just like being a parrot?

We like it when people tell the truth. We don’t like it when people lie or mischaracterize like you have.

Directing a response to an individual is not naming and shaming.

I didn’t lie. I misunderstood the post and when I read it, it looked exactly like calling out names for the purpose of shaming. As several players pointed out I was wrong, I went back and re-read the post and saw what they were saying. I made a simple mistake. What’s your excuse for accusing me of something you have no evidence of?

This is why I constantly tell people that calling out people for lying without knowing their intent, whether it another poster on the forum or Anet is simply wrong to do.

On topic: Colin isn’t coming back, and I believe Mike is up to the task of getting this game back on track.

style.6173:

@OP:

You are crazy. So, Colin created a complete mess that we are in. MO communicates that mess, and you then blame MO for the mess. You really think the lack of content started in the last few weeks?

Use some logic before posting.

While I wouldn’t go as far as blaming it just on individuals, the essence of this still holds true: The mess – as you call it – is a result of the past months, no point to blame this on MO now. As far as I’m concerned, so far his decisions make perfect sense to me and I appreciate the way they are being communicated.

As such, speak for yourself OP. As a veteran player, I neither wish Colin back nor did I feel particularly happy over the direction the game (aka HoT) took while he was still in charge.

Celtic Lady.3729:

I didn’t lie. I misunderstood the post and when I read it, it looked exactly like calling out names for the purpose of shaming. As several players pointed out I was wrong, I went back and re-read the post and saw what they were saying. I made a simple mistake. What’s your excuse for accusing me of something you have no evidence of?

I’m sorry if that’s the case. It’s difficult to read that from your messages when you’re writing with an aggressive tone.

So yeah.
Someone took over for a few days now.
Starts to do exactly what players wanted (communication).
Tries to please the playerbase (even with questionable decisions).
And still gets hate?

What is wrong here? Please tell me?

The development process is a mess and players were critizing it for a long time.
The lack of events and content is one major problem, as it was the case before HoT and now six month after.

He tries to adress that problem by pulling back people, he knows that can handle that, but are not as good elswhere (appearently the legendary team, which for some reason didn`t worked as fast as it should, thus will be re-evaluated and continued at a later state.)
There is appearently no good deccision to make here.
If he goes as far, as to pull back on legendarys to support a constant content flow, than it means he has not much of a choice.

We are not the devs. We don’t know the reccources. We don’t know the mess.

Even if there are systems in place for easy legendary deployment. It appears that the current team just wasn’t good enough for the task and can be utilized better elsewhere.

I mean, seriously. I am by no means a white knight, I take my jabs at the game enough, but I can undertstand someone who is taking over chaos, trying to sort it out.

That is what happened here.

If Mike has to cut like this, to entertain us and Collin at the helm of the so called hype train was just riding the hot air that his leadership has produced, than i rather take the cold iron grip of reality instead of the comfy clouds that only lead to a freefall as there is no ground to stand upon.

I mean come on. We loose legendarys for some time. However if what he says is true, we will end up with new things to do ingame instead.
Things that are not restricted to legendary-hunter and richer playerbase but for all players.

Sure these weapons would be nice, but if they finaly get things into game that people were begging for, I am all for it.
Maybe an event-chain that allows us to get the tribal outfit finaly?

Jaken.6801:

So yeah.
Someone took over for a few days now.
Starts to do exactly what players wanted (communication).
Tries to please the playerbase (even with questionable decisions).
And still gets hate?

What is wrong here? Please tell me?

The development process is a mess and players were critizing it for a long time.
The lack of events and content is one major problem, as it was the case before HoT and now six month after.

He tries to adress that problem by pulling back people, he knows that can handle that, but are not as good elswhere (appearently the legendary team, which for some reason didn`t worked as fast as it should, thus will be re-evaluated and continued at a later state.)
There is appearently no good deccision to make here.
If he goes as far, as to pull back on legendarys to support a constant content flow, than it means he has not much of a choice.

We are not the devs. We don’t know the reccources. We don’t know the mess.

Even if there are systems in place for easy legendary deployment. It appears that the current team just wasn’t good enough for the task and can be utilized better elsewhere.

I mean, seriously. I am by no means a white knight, I take my jabs at the game enough, but I can undertstand someone who is taking over chaos, trying to sort it out.

That is what happened here.

If Mike has to cut like this, to entertain us and Collin at the helm of the so called hype train was just riding the hot air that his leadership has produced, than i rather take the cold iron grip of reality instead of the comfy clouds that only lead to a freefall as there is no ground to stand upon.

I mean come on. We loose legendarys for some time. However if what he says is true, we will end up with new things to do ingame instead.
Things that are not restricted to legendary-hunter and richer playerbase but for all players.

Sure these weapons would be nice, but if they finaly get things into game that people were begging for, I am all for it.
Maybe an event-chain that allows us to get the tribal outfit finaly?

Lol, communicating he might be doing, but it smells entirely like a PR handling approach, kittening obnoxious with no apology in sight. I’m sure thats the communication everyone wanted.

Jaken.6801:

What is wrong here? Please tell me?

The way I see it, the problem is that the decision was made to go back on their word regarding new legendary weapons, which was something players paid for when they bought HoT. He made this decision instead of another one – like adding more people to the legendary team so they could finish the weapons in a timely manner and give the players content they paid for. Or reassessing the timeline for the weapons and announcing that.

It’s hard to believe that the only possible solution was to scrap everything. I would think they’d be concerned about that new expansion they’re already working on and whether people are going to trust that they’ll get what is going to be promised for the next one.

I mean, why do I want to buy another expansion with promised content that may or may not get scrapped after I pay for it?

Lol, colins seat is probably still warm, nothing has happened, game adding features etc that Colin would not have had a hand in. We will probably have to wait till next year before we see what’s what with out Colin. Asking for him back over one thing mike has said will not change what has happened OP. Mike was his boss, and would be again if Colin came back. What has happened now would still happen if Colin was here.

Maybe a little perspective here on Mike’s “communication”… Yes, it’s better than we’ve had in the past, but can we just take a minute to remember that ANet just cancelled a major feature of paid content and people are grateful to them for telling us.

What Mike did isn’t some brave and heroic deed, its an absolute minimum of basic courtesy to paying customers. The idea that he could have simply not told us isn’t something we would even be considering a possibility if we hadn’t had three years of ANet pulling this sort of thing.

I don’t necessarily think this but playing devil’s advocate for a moment: What if it’s Colin’s fault that we’re in this position?

What if he was the one who stretched the development team too thin, had them working on dozens of different projects which then end up unfinished, rushed or dragging on indefinitely and whilst what Mike is doing looks bad to us in the short term (especially through the lens of “you’re taking away the thing I wanted!”) in the long run it will be better.

Maybe after Mike is done rearranging people and priorities we’ll end up with a better team making a better and more consistent game and Anet will be able to announce what they’re working on early enough that we always know what’s coming, with reasonable certainty that it’ll happen so they don’t have to live in fear of every idea becoming a promise written in stone that people have somehow already paid for and they will never be forgiven if they don’t deliver it exactly as every individual player imagined it.

Ok that last bit is ridiculous idealism, I think at this point the forum has proven that no matter what Anet do someone will be angry with them for it. If they mailed every player free cake we’d probably see complaints that it’s the wrong kind of cake and devaluing cooking or something.

But the rest of it still stands. You can’t change how things are done without…changing how they’re done. So anyone who wants improvements can’t seriously imagine that it will happen whilst everything stays the same.

nah.

15 length

Jaken.6801:

If Mike has to cut like this, to entertain us and Collin at the helm of the so called hype train was just riding the hot air that his leadership has produced, than i rather take the cold iron grip of reality instead of the comfy clouds that only lead to a freefall as there is no ground to stand upon.

Mike was on Colin’s orifice smoke blowing hype train too. Lordie, why are people missing that fact? Mike was at the head of it… he was the freakin’ co-conductor!

It’s late, but I’ve got pics to put the whole slew of em’ on a hype train tomorrow like I did for Colin’s Gem and Gold Coin banner, if that’d make everyone happy.

Point is, they were a team, for years. One was made a scapegoat from how it’s looking in hindsight, and simply put and he’s not here to share his side. Let it go.

Wish Mr. O’Brien luck and carry on. Hope it nets you the advances you’re hoping to see.

We dont know why hes not working in arenanet anymore.
My guess however is incompitence.
SO now can we have Cantha? can you nerf condi mesmer and buff power?
can we have fun in the game ? please
can you make 1 dessert border 1 alpine 1 eotm 1 eb in mu rotations?
we dont need 5 borders 4 is plenty

Extreme.8350:

We dont know why hes not working in arenanet anymore.
My guess however is incompitence.
SO now can we have Cantha? can you nerf condi mesmer and buff power?
can we have fun in the game ? please
can you make 1 dessert border 1 alpine 1 eotm 1 eb in mu rotations?
we dont need 5 borders 4 is plenty

EOTM as a regular map? That’d be interesting.

Ramoth.9064:

Lol, communicating he might be doing, but it smells entirely like a PR handling approach, kittening obnoxious with no apology in sight. I’m sure thats the communication everyone wanted.

Well, that is something he has to show by delivering.
If we call him a liar before he was able to prove he is able to deliver anything in his new position, than it is just unfair.

Sure he was harsh in his explanations, but I do not believe the position he is in is easy.
Remember the internet is an unthankful place.
Everything you try to do good, someone somewhere will break it.

Celtic Lady.3729:

The way I see it, the problem is that the decision was made to go back on their word regarding new legendary weapons, which was something players paid for when they bought HoT. He made this decision instead of another one – like adding more people to the legendary team so they could finish the weapons in a timely manner and give the players content they paid for. Or reassessing the timeline for the weapons and announcing that.

It’s hard to believe that the only possible solution was to scrap everything. I would think they’d be concerned about that new expansion they’re already working on and whether people are going to trust that they’ll get what is going to be promised for the next one.

I mean, why do I want to buy another expansion with promised content that may or may not get scrapped after I pay for it?

I think we simply have not enough information here to say anything about it.
There might be other ways, but right now they think that this is the best decission, hard as it might be (and yeah, people tend to forget that just because he is the Lead now, Mike isn’t the only one holding the reins. Same goes for Colin)

Siobhan.5273:

Mike was on Colin’s orifice smoke blowing hype train too. Lordie, why are people missing that fact? Mike was at the head of it… he was the freakin’ co-conductor!

It’s late, but I’ve got pics to put the whole slew of em’ on a hype train tomorrow like I did for Colin’s Gem and Gold Coin banner, if that’d make everyone happy.

Point is, they were a team, for years. One was made a scapegoat from how it’s looking in hindsight, and simply put and he’s not here to share his side. Let it go.

Wish Mr. O’Brien luck and carry on. Hope it nets you the advances you’re hoping to see.

Sure thing. We can only wait and see. He was there as well and might be the change some are waiting for.
Legendarys are certainly a downer, though we have to see we get instead.

And right now no one makes someone a scapegoat. However if people praise Colin, just because Mike comes out and flat out says: Sorry we can’t deliver what was said under Colin. Then is it is kinda weird, isn’kitten
There are enough PR rules out there that would hinder something like this.

Again missing too many information here sadly.

Bottom line is. We should all calm down and see what happens before we start roasting anyone.
I mean, if things are really so dire, the new leas starts off with a big handicap anyway.

Lord Kuru.3685:

Getting rid of Colin was the right thing to do: he was doing a terrible job. But let’s not be so foolish to make him into a scapegoat. Anet’s problem is still there.

^ This.

Colin was game director since launch. What ever problems are going on with this game he is not only responsible for it but must have been aware of it as well. He left before this announcement had to be made and let Mo take the fall for it.

He did well with GW1 but failed big time with GW2 HoT.

People tend to overestimate the role of single persons. A game director will take the final decisions on what is being worked on or not but this guy is not someone in an ivory tower ! It takes a lot of discussions with the designers, with community managers, with players …. to decide in which direction a project in general is going or what are the priorities at any given time. I can’t really imagine that when Colin took a decision it was totally against MO’s opinions or against all the devs in the building. In a similar manner Mike’s decisions won’t be only his own but it will be a sum of discussion about feasibility, player’s feedback, artists’ offer… I don’t think any game director is foolish enough to think that only him knows what the game will be and decide every single details.
And about the cut of legendary weapons, no one will ever know if Colin wouldn’t have taken the same decision so I’m not sure it’s worth to speculate about the people themselves.

Ranael.6423:

It takes a lot of discussions with players … player’s feedback

April fools is in a few days, you are to early.

[A thread for this discussion already exists. Thank you!]