Guild Wars 2

This is not another “Thoughts about Ascended Q&A or Pros vs. Cons”.

This is just the mere idea of “Gear Score”. I am sure you are aware of this Arenanet, as well as half of the community player base that is familiar with this, no thanks to Blizzard with their “World of Warcraft” and their abusement of this idea which in the end, caused alot of Drama and a large Gap for Casuals and Hard Core players.

Link: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

However after reading that articled, provided by the link above; I see bad clues that is bound to cause a large gap in the player base.

Quote: "… we have found that our most dedicated players were achieving their set of Exotic gear and hitting “the Legendary wall.” We designed the process of getting Legendary gear to be a long term goal, but players were ready to start on that path much sooner than we expected and were becoming frustrated … " – Linsey Murdock

Comment: You do realize that using Hard Core Players, the very few 1% that owns Legendarys, as a idea player base for judgement and conclusions about gear progress, does not make up for the casual base and thus, hint #1 Player gap.

Quote: " We have always worked hard to create a sense of satisfying progression rather than gear grind … " – Linsey Murdock

Comment: A lot of players will disagree about this since you just admitted in the quote above about “long term goal”, thus again you are leaning towards people that are grinding “Guild Wars 2” rather than enjoying it. Also the people that has these Legendarys, by no means obtained them by normal means.

Alot of them have publicly announced in documentary, screen shots, videos, forums, and personal websites using alot of real life money for purchasing gems to convert to gold, to having 20 – 75 people in their own guild, helping them obtain their Legendary in less than 2 months.

Which by your website, you posted that obtaining the Legendary was mostly to be on your part with the help of some people, however you over looked on how many people could help out and over looked how much money people were willing to spend on purchasing Gems to convert to Gold.

Alot of Casuals, are still obtaining the Legendary the old fashion way. So you are by default, ignoring the rest of the player base.

Quote: " You’ll also see more Legendary items in the future and an update to our existing Legendary weapons. Legendary items were always intended to be on par with other “best-in-slot” items. " – Linsey Murdock

Comment: Okay after reading this, you kinda defeat the purpose of first quote above, about players progressing or “grinding” as casuals call it. So already the “Grinding” player 1% base. Already and still at, “the wall”, so to speak.

Not to mention, you said the nightmare words and I quote “best-in-slot”. Meaning that this will cause a player gap by allowing people asking for “Gear Score” to participate in anything.

Note: Something that Blizzard Fan-boys love to cause drama with.

Also this will cause WvWvW, to be even more nightmare for PvP player base, and will cause those players to be “forced” too get Legendarys themselves, if they ever wanted to be on fair competition.

Conclusion of my Point: You are letting these Hardcore players, push you around to make rash judgements in solutions for future gear content.

Gear is only needed for the new dungeon when you get into the harder parts. /topic

Or you’re just exaggerating a bit too much.

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

piitb.7635:

Or you’re just exaggerating a bit too much.

I do not believe so and I believe I have a good strong case here. I do not mind new gear, but I do not favor the “Gear Score” being implemented, so highly hinted and suggested by that article.

Also alot of the article is showing that “Hard Core” player base, is a major influence in her judgement.

I’m ultra hardcore, but this mod will only bring ruin to the whole community.

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

lower levels of the new dungeon to be exact

karma.8763:

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

And it affects the rest of the game. Thus it becomes needed in all aspects of the game.

Deggon.8152:

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

I can name alot MMOs that had “Gear Score” implemented, it is only Blizzard’s MMOs that created bad communities based on this. I do not want to remind you how a single piece of item for two major patches during Lich King, trinkets, that was only used for a group of classes and had a super low drop chance?

castlemanic.3198:

karma.8763:

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

And it affects the rest of the game. Thus it becomes needed in all aspects of the game.

Other dungeons don’t use the new agony mechanic
which is what ascended gear mitigates

so no. its not needed for all aspects of the game

karma.8763:

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

But it will be useful everywhere in game. It will be best in slot, as per ArenaNet’s own words. So if you do any other dungeon in Exotics, your gear is sub par and people with Ascended will tear through it faster than you can. If you hop into WvWvW and your opponent has Ascended gear, he’s going to perform better than you – kill your team faster, take down your forts faster, and be harder to kill. Imagine if a whole group of enemies in WvWvW are in Ascended and your team isn’t. If you go to Orr to do DE’s, the guys with Ascended gear are going to tag more mobs, get more drops/gold/karma, and survive longer.

See the pattern? It’s going to affect the entire rest of the game. Don’t be so naive to think it’s not a big deal.

It’s such a bad idea to design a game around the 1% that will be super hardcore that are going to eat through your content in a week and then get bored, every kitten time. Blizzard and Trion have already run into this problem – why does ANet feel the need to alienate their core playerbase for a few hardcore players that aren’t going to change their habits no matter what you do?

Deggon.8152:

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

What madness there was no such thing as muds or even mmorpgs before WoW also there was no earth before WoW too!

This is all fear reaction its the worst way to deal with ANYTHING in life.

Shadowlancer.7102:

Deggon.8152:

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

I can name alot MMOs that had “Gear Score” implemented, it is only Blizzard’s MMOs that created bad communities based on this.

Sorry you can say WoW started whatever but it did not, there was bad blood, forum wars etc over gear and upgrades.

There is a bigger jump in power levels from a newly minted level 80 and an 80 in full exotics than there is from full exotic to 2 pieces of ascended gear…..

Yet no one right now checks gear scores.

It’s all conjecture and exaggeration that is fueling these complaints.

Deggon.8152:

Shadowlancer.7102:

Deggon.8152:

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

I can name alot MMOs that had “Gear Score” implemented, it is only Blizzard’s MMOs that created bad communities based on this.

Sorry you can say WoW started whatever but it did not, there was bad blood, forum wars etc over gear and upgrades.

Yes but it was Blizzard’s ideology for “World of Warcraft” that to progress further into Raid Zone or Open up “Hard Mode” you had to have that gear, this was the thing that create drama. Not to mention the major part of the play was the “RNG” if that “Item Name” dropped from “Boss Name”.

Also you cannot deny, the people that sucked at their classes or how to play the game, would just get over powered gear, that was easily obtained after “X amount of time”, only to plow threw the lower content zones without actually learning anything. aka “carried”.

piitb.7635:

There is a bigger jump in power levels from a newly minted level 80 and an 80 in full exotics than there is from full exotic to 2 pieces of ascended gear…..

Yet no one right now checks gear scores.

It’s all conjecture and exaggeration that is fueling these complaints.

Because a)it’s easy to get a full set of exotics and after that you’re supposed to be done gearing up so everyone is all on the same level at 80 in this game and thus there’s no need to ask about gear, and b)more importantly, this creates the gear treadmill we all were promised we wouldn’t see in this game. We were told this game at it’s core was different from other MMO’s.

Leiloni.7951:

piitb.7635:

There is a bigger jump in power levels from a newly minted level 80 and an 80 in full exotics than there is from full exotic to 2 pieces of ascended gear…..

Yet no one right now checks gear scores.

It’s all conjecture and exaggeration that is fueling these complaints.

Because a)it’s easy to get a full set of exotics, and b)more importantly, this creates the gear treadmill we all were promised we wouldn’t see in this game. We were told this game at it’s core was different from other MMO’s.

It will probably be just as easy to get the new ascended gear assuming you spend a lot of time in the new dungeon.

Again, conjecture and exaggeration.

Guitarzero.8316:

castlemanic.3198:

karma.8763:

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

And it affects the rest of the game. Thus it becomes needed in all aspects of the game.

Other dungeons don’t use the new agony mechanic
which is what ascended gear mitigates

so no. its not needed for all aspects of the game

increased stats affect the rest of the game. thus making it needed for all aspects of the game.

And i doubt infusion is going to just be against the agony condition. They’ve already hinted at it.

piitb.7635:

Leiloni.7951:

piitb.7635:

There is a bigger jump in power levels from a newly minted level 80 and an 80 in full exotics than there is from full exotic to 2 pieces of ascended gear…..

Yet no one right now checks gear scores.

It’s all conjecture and exaggeration that is fueling these complaints.

Because a)it’s easy to get a full set of exotics, and b)more importantly, this creates the gear treadmill we all were promised we wouldn’t see in this game. We were told this game at it’s core was different from other MMO’s.

It will probably be just as easy to get the new ascended gear assuming you spend a lot of time in the new dungeon.

Again, conjecture and exaggeration.

It’s created for the hardcore/elite crowd, as per Anet’s own words. Those players ate through the Legendary gear too fast and ANet wanted to give them something else to do so they keep playing GW2. Why would it be an easy, quick path? It’s designed to keep those types of players busy and give them something to make them feel like they’re progressing. If they can earn it in a day, they’ll earn it in an hour and leave this game yet again.

Leiloni.7951:

piitb.7635:

Leiloni.7951:

piitb.7635:

There is a bigger jump in power levels from a newly minted level 80 and an 80 in full exotics than there is from full exotic to 2 pieces of ascended gear…..

Yet no one right now checks gear scores.

It’s all conjecture and exaggeration that is fueling these complaints.

Because a)it’s easy to get a full set of exotics, and b)more importantly, this creates the gear treadmill we all were promised we wouldn’t see in this game. We were told this game at it’s core was different from other MMO’s.

It will probably be just as easy to get the new ascended gear assuming you spend a lot of time in the new dungeon.

Again, conjecture and exaggeration.

It’s created for the hardcore/elite crowd, as per Anet’s own words. Why would it be an easy, quick path? It’s designed to keep those types of players busy and give them something to make them feel like they’re progressing. If they can earn it in a day, they’ll earn it in an hour and leave this game yet again.

The highest level of difficulty is designed for hardcore players.

The content can be seen with or without ascended gear.

OK this is true but instead of repeating myself, I’ll just refer you to my previous post in this thread on the topic of how Ascended gear is going to affect the rest of the playerbase.

Here I’ll copy/paste myself for you:

But it will be useful everywhere in game. It will be best in slot, as per ArenaNet’s own words. So if you do any other dungeon in Exotics, your gear is sub par and people with Ascended will tear through it faster than you can. If you hop into WvWvW and your opponent has Ascended gear, he’s going to perform better than you – kill your team faster, take down your forts faster, and be harder to kill. Imagine if a whole group of enemies in WvWvW are in Ascended and your team isn’t. If you go to Orr to do DE’s, the guys with Ascended gear are going to tag more mobs, get more drops/gold/karma, and survive longer.

See the pattern? It’s going to affect the entire rest of the game. Don’t be so naive to think it’s not a big deal.

It’s such a bad idea to design a game around the 1% that will be super hardcore that are going to eat through your content in a week and then get bored, every kitten time. Blizzard and Trion have already run into this problem – why does ANet feel the need to alienate their core playerbase for a few hardcore players that aren’t going to change their habits no matter what you do?

Shadowlancer.7102:

Quote: "… we have found that our most dedicated players were achieving their set of Exotic gear and hitting “the Legendary wall.” We designed the process of getting Legendary gear to be a long term goal, but players were ready to start on that path much sooner than we expected and were becoming frustrated … " – Linsey Murdock

Comment: You do realize that using Hard Core Players, the very few 1% that owns Legendarys, as a idea player base for judgement and conclusions about gear progress, does not make up for the casual base and thus, hint #1 Player gap.

I don’t really see what your point is there.

This “Legendary Wall” is a player getting to level 80, obtaining exotics after several more hours, and finding that he has nothing to do except a very long, dull farm for legendaries with no other goal on the horizon. That gets boring, and for many (like myself) unappealing. The ascended gear is supposed to be an intermediate goal for 1) People who don’t want to invest the time to get a legendary 2) Make the grind for legendaries less painful by adding intermediate goals.

@ lacrimstein.5603

However you miss understand the situation, once those players has those “Legendary” weapons, no matter what future content there is, in the later years, the Legendary’s will always be up to par to be above the damage of future weapon content.

This isn’t about the “Armor” per say, we all know the armor is for the dungeon, its the Legendarys that are not part of the dungeon that can be used in WvWvW and PvE Tyria content.

Edit: Alot of people do have alot of good points in this thread, if… “The new Armor obtained” can be used outside of the New Dungeon in Tyria.

Until we get a clear answer from Arenanet, we are still arguing over speculation mode.

lacrimstein.5603:

2) Make the grind for legendaries less painful by adding intermediate goals.

This is where you and ArenaNet fail. This game was NOT built around the idea of progressing your character via gear progression. This game was designed around the idea of progressing in other ways.

So why now are they and you deciding to go against the game’s core values? I understand the desire to progress your character and have goals to achieve. Personally I have plenty of goals to achieve without the desire for better gear, but I understand it. ArenaNet originally designed this game to have other methods of progression, so why can’t we continue along that path? Why introduce gear progression into a game that was never supposed to have it?

The sad thing is the hardcore have left the building. They were the streamers ect. They were the level 80’s at the 4th day. They are gone and arent coming back. Anet needs to worry about US that are left but as it seems many will be vacating the premises soon as well. You were meant to progress in other ways other than gear and achievements but that has been tossed aside for appeasing the 1% that are gone and no longer log into the game. Info from my friends are they aint coming back. They saw what you had and left.
I shake my head at the promo videos of what was to be and what it has become and a shame. Do I care not really I got my moneys worth but what does get me was this was to be different and it is the same old thing different developer.

What they need to do for full exotic/legendary item owning level 80’s is give them something good to do. WvW for me is great, that’s me sorted. Improve WvW. More maps, different stuff in general. There’s plenty WvW could do with.

Then make some seriously challenging dungeons that only the elite dudes can really pull off. However don’t give said dungeons some reward that cannot be obtained elsewhere, and make sure it’s no better than anything else currently existing. That way you have some of the game for people to aspire to completing, without pissing off casuals who don’t want to invest the time to be so good.

Just not a gear treadmill. Frankly I love WvW and would rather just stay in that near all the time i’m online, with a gear treadmill I have to leave to grind money to stay with competitive gear.

Guitarzero.8316:

castlemanic.3198:

karma.8763:

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

And it affects the rest of the game. Thus it becomes needed in all aspects of the game.

Other dungeons don’t use the new agony mechanic
which is what ascended gear mitigates

so no. its not needed for all aspects of the game

So increased stats will not provide a competative advantage to an equal skilled player?

Level 80 non-Infused LFG …. <crickets>

karma.8763:

Gear is only needed for the new dungeon when you get into the harder parts. /topic

and you don’t think this is just the tip of the iceberg? really? are some people on this forum that clueless. I mean they are already adding a new tier of gear within 3 month, so whats going to happen in the next 3 month? another tier of gear? “mythical” with some other stat to “gate” content?

Deggon.8152:

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

Actually, the movements starts from Japanese mmorpgs that was never publicised to western and other asian countries. They started first while WoW/EQ took the elements from there and became successful. It became successful because those elements touches alot in human nature. Implanting human nature into mmo is crucial because players nature behaviour in virtual world is a reflection of the real world.

Leiloni.7951:

karma.8763:

people dont read lol, the gear will only be needed “in the new dungeon”

But it will be useful everywhere in game. It will be best in slot, as per ArenaNet’s own words. So if you do any other dungeon in Exotics, your gear is sub par and people with Ascended will tear through it faster than you can. If you hop into WvWvW and your opponent has Ascended gear, he’s going to perform better than you – kill your team faster, take down your forts faster, and be harder to kill. Imagine if a whole group of enemies in WvWvW are in Ascended and your team isn’t. If you go to Orr to do DE’s, the guys with Ascended gear are going to tag more mobs, get more drops/gold/karma, and survive longer.

See the pattern? It’s going to affect the entire rest of the game. Don’t be so naive to think it’s not a big deal.

It’s such a bad idea to design a game around the 1% that will be super hardcore that are going to eat through your content in a week and then get bored, every kitten time. Blizzard and Trion have already run into this problem – why does ANet feel the need to alienate their core playerbase for a few hardcore players that aren’t going to change their habits no matter what you do?

Your use of words " tearing through" is very much exaggerated.

Khallis.5708:

karma.8763:

Gear is only needed for the new dungeon when you get into the harder parts. /topic

and you don’t think this is just the tip of the iceberg? really? are some people on this forum that clueless. I mean they are already adding a new tier of gear within 3 month, so whats going to happen in the next 3 month? another tier of gear? “mythical” with some other stat to “gate” content?

if so shrug, it will actually give me reason to breath life back into my warrior

I keep seeing people says. “New gear is needed only for the new dungeon” ect. You guys also are forgetting, the gear will also be needed for “Future” dungeons.

I don’t see many new dungeons after this one going back to the standard way. In other words it is my opinion that Ascended gear will be needed for future expansions and content updates.

The OP has good points, not many people have a legendary weapon, also there are lots of people who still just starting the dungeons that are already in the game.

I think what really is throwing people off is that the game hasn’t been out nearly “long” enough for a new “tier” of items.

Shadowlancer.7102:

Deggon.8152:

Shadowlancer.7102:

Deggon.8152:

Hate to break to the OP but WoW did not start the gear score/endgame/elitist/etc movement, it was in EQ looooong before WoW.

I can name alot MMOs that had “Gear Score” implemented, it is only Blizzard’s MMOs that created bad communities based on this.

Sorry you can say WoW started whatever but it did not, there was bad blood, forum wars etc over gear and upgrades.

Yes but it was Blizzard’s ideology for “World of Warcraft” that to progress further into Raid Zone or Open up “Hard Mode” you had to have that gear, this was the thing that create drama. Not to mention the major part of the play was the “RNG” if that “Item Name” dropped from “Boss Name”.
.

Sorry but you had to do the same thing in EQ, you had to get better gear/flags/etc in order to progress in raids.

The real problem here in my opinion is that now that they’ve done it once, nothing can prevent them from continuing to add new gear tiers with other updates and expansions.
They can always make promises, say “ok, we just realized we needed a max tier that’d be a bit higher, but now that it’s settled we won’t add anything after that.” but you know how easy it is to break promises.
The current addition of ascended gear isn’t necesarily going to create a gear treadmill, but the fact that they now have an excuse to add other more powerful items in the future can definitely create.

I have no problem with the concept of infusion, since it only affects a specific kind of content that was precisely designed for this. Ascended gear however affects the whole game which I believe was designed with only exotics in mind. You can already see how easy and trivial lower level areas become when you level up even without a full set of exotics and even with level scaling (which is not powerful enough it must be said). Adding stats will only trivialize this content even more, becoming an uninteresting experience for fully geared players and a painful experience for low lvl players if hl players are given more tools to exterminate any content before they can even start doing sufficient damage (it already happens in some places).
In short, not really a good idea for a game that promoted its replayability :/

@ karma.8763
@ Khallis.5708

What we do not know is… Does the “New Gear” stay with the dungeon area, or can the “New Gear” be used outside of the dungeon?

If it can be used “outside” the dungeon, then the points of concern of this gear score thread matters.

If it “cant” be used outside of the dungeon, then half of the points in this thread become voided and the main concerns will be the Legendaries only.

We cannot sit here and bicker at each other to the point we are frothing at the mouth and strangling ourselves until Arenanet makes a clear statement.

karma.8763:

Gear is only needed for the new dungeon when you get into the harder parts. /topic

Which is a terrible idea.

Shadowlancer.7102:

@ karma.8763
@ Khallis.5708

What we do not know is… Does the “New Gear” stay with the dungeon area, or can the “New Gear” be used outside of the dungeon?

If it can be used “outside” the dungeon, then the points of concern of this gear score thread matters.

If it “cant” be used outside of the dungeon, then half of the points in this thread become voided and the main concerns will be the Legendaries only.

We cannot sit here a bicker at each other to the point we are frothing at the mouth and strangling ourselves until Arenanet makes a clear statement.

It CAN be used outside the dungeon. They already stated that when they eventually release Ascended weapons, all current Legendary weapons will be upgraded to be on par stat wise so they can continue to be best in slot. So that means all Ascended items will be usable outside of the dungeon, otherwise they wouldn’t upgrade those Legendaries.

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

Leiloni.7951:

Shadowlancer.7102:

@ karma.8763
@ Khallis.5708

What we do not know is… Does the “New Gear” stay with the dungeon area, or can the “New Gear” be used outside of the dungeon?

If it can be used “outside” the dungeon, then the points of concern of this gear score thread matters.

If it “cant” be used outside of the dungeon, then half of the points in this thread become voided and the main concerns will be the Legendaries only.

We cannot sit here a bicker at each other to the point we are frothing at the mouth and strangling ourselves until Arenanet makes a clear statement.

It CAN be used outside the dungeon. They already stated that when they eventually release Ascended weapons, all current Legendary weapons will be upgraded to be on par stat wise so they can continue to be best in slot. So that means all Ascended items will be usable outside of the dungeon, otherwise they wouldn’t upgrade those Legendaries.

If this is true, then the people that are arguing about this are right and so am I.

This will cause a gap in the player base, pvp issues, and will make older content, a breeze threw when higher levels go into lower areas and this will cause new players with gear issues, have issues with mob content as the mobs will be updated to reflect the new gear changes.

You cannot argue against the fact, that higher gear score is better, its not.

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

No, imagination is what will carry this game forward. Imagination to create new and interesting ways to progress your character without gating content from other players or creating gear treadmills.

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

Or more fun content. Because gear stats, in the end, are just numbers and nothing else. I don’t know of many people who have a love for numbers… All people I know, however, appreciate fun content

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

No you are wrong, you can add more content, meaning more PvP, more PvE, more Lore, more Events, without ever touching gear stats.

Increasing gear stats makes older content easier which they said, they are against because players complained of being bored.

That’s why down leveling exist to keep challenge and allowing you die still.

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

For PvE maybe. They could easily ditch the extra stats and just put everything that is specific to a dungeon in the special upgrade slot, and then disable that slot when you’re in WvW or not in the dungeon.

Many people play this game purely for WvW and have no desire to continuously grind for new gear. A full set of ascended gear will give people an advantage over those who do not have it, so it’s not just a matter of not grinding for it if you don’t care. Most WvW players are just as hardcore about that side of the game as any PvE player. An additional 55 points to 2 stats plus another huge boost to a percentage stat is pretty significant.

GW2 is a pvp-oriented game at it’s core, yet they are giving into a smaller group of PvE players and doing exactly what they promised not to do before the game was launched.

Shadowlancer.7102:

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

No you are wrong, you can add more content, meaning more PvP, more PvE, more Lore, more Events, without ever touching gear stats.

Agreed! Add more content for people to enjoy, but leave out the gear and stats out of the equation. There’s really no need for it.

Leiloni.7951:

Shadowlancer.7102:

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

No you are wrong, you can add more content, meaning more PvP, more PvE, more Lore, more Events, without ever touching gear stats.

Agreed! Add more content for people to enjoy, but leave out the gear and stats out of the equation. There’s really no need for it.

DO people actually enjoy the current dungeon content?

@ wookie slayer.4259

This isn’t about Dungeon content, this is about gear score.

If you are trying to implement an argument by suggesting that since a few people complained about how hard a certain dungeon is, that by allowing higher gear stats aka “Gear Score” to make that dungeon content easier, you just proven my point on how bad “Gear Score” is in ruining content.

wookie slayer.4259:

Leiloni.7951:

Shadowlancer.7102:

Natural.7013:

More gear progression is the only way this game will last.

No you are wrong, you can add more content, meaning more PvP, more PvE, more Lore, more Events, without ever touching gear stats.

Agreed! Add more content for people to enjoy, but leave out the gear and stats out of the equation. There’s really no need for it.

DO people actually enjoy the current dungeon content?

Well ArenaNet seems to think so otherwise they wouldn’t be adding Ascended gear into the new dungeon for those people to “progress” with.

I think I broke the thread with my last post… O.o It’s all gone now.