Guild Wars 2

Last week i was thinking About buying Some gems With real Monney but then i saw it costs 19,49€ for Just 2000 gems this means i can buy 2 armor (skin) sets and a hat or something for 20€ I believe this To be a bit high for these things ?

More people Will buy this if iT was Cheaper

But would enough “more people” be willing to buy them for it to break even?

You have to keep in mind that gems is basically the only real income ArenaNet have at this point.

Or you can just buy gems with gold. The price is what it is. I also find it expensive, but seeing as I can eventually buy whatever I want with gold I really have no reason to object. Meanwhile, some people have easily spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on gems. Different people have different budgets.

Ralanost.8913:

Or you can just buy gems with gold. The price is what it is. I also find it expensive, but seeing as I can eventually buy whatever I want with gold I really have no reason to object. Meanwhile, some people have easily spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on gems. Different people have different budgets.

So you wouldn’t spend real money on gems of you got 2000 for 10€ ( fair price to me) about 4€ for a armor set considdering most people would have to spend days of grinding for it. The only reason i don’t buy gems ( and never did ) is that i Just feel cheated paying that much for them. Just thinking more people would buy gems on a more regular basis of they were like 30% off or so

It’s a business question, so I have to ask myself: Who knows better where that balance point is, me or the employee(s) at Anet who actually make that decision?

I’ve always purchased outfits I want with gold, rather than real money, and only spent money when I wanted to expand my character slots, so from that perspective, maybe it is too expensive. I might be more willing to buy, say, the shoulder scarf if instead of $5, it cost $1. Probably wouldn’t pay $3.50 if I’m not willing to pay $5, though.

You can see how I’m just operating from my own situation and experience. Meanwhile, Anet has the benefit of seeing how many people actually buy a given item at a given price, which is a lot more valuable that my anecdotal information.

I’m not saying the pricing is perfect, but it’s worth considering that the people deciding what is most profitable have more data to make that decision with.

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

So you prefer being forced to pay in order to even login over being able to CHOOSE to pay for something?

It is of course also worth pointing out that every single thing in the gem store can be obtained 100% free by converting in-game gold to gems.

Yeah, I think it’s a little high.

I understand that this is their only income, at this point, but it still feels slightly on the high side.

By that, I mean that I think they might make slightly more money by charging slightly less.

After all, I assume each transaction costs them virtually nothing – so, it’s all about the initial design cost and then selling as many units as possible.

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

Yeah, I’ve found the same.

If you’re really careful, it could be cheaper (or even free!); but, if not, you lose.

You then also realise you’re financially subsidising people, some of whom pay nothing but still think they’re superior.

That is not a good feeling.

Whereas, in a sub game, everyone pays the same.

Yes, there are still some people who think they’re superior and may try to exclude others from content, but at least you’re not effectively paying for them to act that way.

lordkrall.7241:

So you prefer being forced to pay in order to even login over being able to CHOOSE to pay for something?

Yep.

Far prefer that, personally.

Of course, if people paid a sub, they would probably be even more annoyed if the game didn’t reach and maintain certain levels of quality.

…and I suspect that is why Anet chose to not do it that way.

Kind of seems to let them off the hook, in many ways.

Initially, people probably felt they could complain about the game they had bought.

But, at this point, I suspect that all many people feel they can really complain about is the items they buy with real money.

That’s not good.

It’s 80 gems per $1€/£0.85 and has been that since launch. And as others pointed out it’s ANet’s primary source of continuing income. It’s comparable to other game proxy currency available on consoles and in other MMOs.

Your issue is that items cost too much in your opinion in terms of real money. $10€/800 gems for an armor set. As others have said, you are saving from no subscription or being charged for the littlest of things that you would find in F2P.

You also have to remember that a fair number of purchases at the Gem Shop is done with gold bought gems. Lowering the price of items will simply mean it’ll be easier to buy items with gold bought gems which may mean less cash bought gems bought and that means less income for ANet. Given a way to get something for “free” (no cash cost), people will pursue that route rather than open up their wallets more to actually buy gems.

To those stating that they prefer a sub based game overvone with a cash shop:

The reality is that, in general, the choice is between a no subscription game with a cash shop and a game with a cash shop and a sub.

Behellagh.1468:

It’s 80 gems per $1€/£0.85 and has been that since launch. And as others pointed out it’s ANet’s primary source of continuing income. It’s comparable to other game proxy currency available on consoles and in other MMOs.

Your issue is that items cost too much in your opinion in terms of real money. $10€/800 gems for an armor set. As others have said, you are saving from no subscription or being charged for the littlest of things that you would find in F2P.

You also have to remember that a fair number of purchases at the Gem Shop is done with gold bought gems. Lowering the price of items will simply mean it’ll be easier to buy items with gold bought gems which may mean less cash bought gems bought and that means less income for ANet. Given a way to get something for “free” (no cash cost), people will pursue that route rather than open up their wallets more to actually buy gems.

That’s probably why he’s not asking them to lower the price of the items; but just the real money cost of gems.

If they did that, more people would (almost certainly) buy gems with real money, rather than waiting to buy them with gold.

Ashen.2907:

To those stating that they prefer a sub based game overvone with a cash shop:

The reality is that, in general, the choice is between a no subscription game with a cash shop and a game with a cash shop and a sub.

None of the stuff in the WoW cash shop feels necessary.

There is (or was) virtually no armour (apart from a couple of helms, more recently) in the store and there is plenty of armour in-game.

I’ve only ever bought a couple of non-combat pets, because there are tons easily available in-game.

Same with mounts.

They recently introduced instant 90s, which was slightly controversial, but for anyone who has played for more than 5 mins, they already have a stable full of high level chars, anyway.

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

And I prefer buy to play games like GW2. Because I can budget out and justify an initial payment. Depending on sub price I may not be able to budget it. And I can’t justify it for myself. I sometimes take breaks from games and paying a sub would make me feel guilty for taking a break, even if the break would cause me to play the game for longer than if I hadn’t taken the break. And I can’t afford a sub unless it’s like $3 a month.

And I wonder how many GW2 players are in the same boat as me. Playing this game because it doesn’t have a sub and would be forced to stop playing it if they added a sub. Even those players who would be willing to pay a sub if they could afford it.

And would a sub bring in the money that those who leave the game due to it being a sub or reduce their gem purchases drastically?

I think the cost of gems is about right. What isn’t right (IMO) is the amount of gems for each item. Like the gathering tools @ 1000 gems each for instance.

Seera.5916:

And I prefer buy to play games like GW2. Because I can budget out and justify an initial payment. Depending on sub price I may not be able to budget it. And I can’t justify it for myself. I sometimes take breaks from games and paying a sub would make me feel guilty for taking a break, even if the break would cause me to play the game for longer than if I hadn’t taken the break. And I can’t afford a sub unless it’s like $3 a month.

And I wonder how many GW2 players are in the same boat as me. Playing this game because it doesn’t have a sub and would be forced to stop playing it if they added a sub. Even those players who would be willing to pay a sub if they could afford it.

And would a sub bring in the money that those who leave the game due to it being a sub or reduce their gem purchases drastically?

I am in the same boat as you. If this game ever got a sub i would stop playing. because i take long breaks between play times, sometimes up to six months. But when i play i buy stuff because i like supporting the game when im playing.

Tigaseye.2047:

Ashen.2907:

To those stating that they prefer a sub based game overvone with a cash shop:

The reality is that, in general, the choice is between a no subscription game with a cash shop and a game with a cash shop and a sub.

None of the stuff in the WoW cash shop feels necessary.

There is (or was) virtually no armour (apart from a couple of helms, more recently) in the store and there is plenty of armour in-game.

I’ve only ever bought a couple of non-combat pets, because there are tons easily available in-game.

Same with mounts.

They recently introduced instant 90s, which was slightly controversial, but for anyone who has played for more than 5 mins, they already have a stable full of high level chars, anyway.

None of the stuff in the GW2 cash shop feels necessary.

It is all attainable through the game.

Seera.5916:

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

And I prefer buy to play games like GW2. Because I can budget out and justify an initial payment. Depending on sub price I may not be able to budget it. And I can’t justify it for myself. I sometimes take breaks from games and paying a sub would make me feel guilty for taking a break, even if the break would cause me to play the game for longer than if I hadn’t taken the break. And I can’t afford a sub unless it’s like $3 a month.

And I wonder how many GW2 players are in the same boat as me. Playing this game because it doesn’t have a sub and would be forced to stop playing it if they added a sub. Even those players who would be willing to pay a sub if they could afford it.

And would a sub bring in the money that those who leave the game due to it being a sub or reduce their gem purchases drastically?

The sub is irrelevant though. Millions of players are willing to pay for one. Just look at WoW and FFXIV:ARR, then look at B2P & F2P games, and you’ll see that their numbers are struggling. Just look at Wildstar, a game that was subscription but is now going to F2P. It had nothing to do with the sub model, but the quality of the game. Look at GW1 too, a B2P game which never had the success of GW2, and it was always lowly populated compared to other subscription games at that time.

Treating this game too casual takes it’s toll on a healthy playerbase and economy. If there’s too few people playing, events become much harder and dungeon groups take longer to find. WvW gets imbalanced, and so on. When people are paying a subscription, they are going to try to get the most out of their money before their time is up. You might not have enough time, but plenty of others do.

Ashen.2907:

Tigaseye.2047:

Ashen.2907:

To those stating that they prefer a sub based game overvone with a cash shop:

The reality is that, in general, the choice is between a no subscription game with a cash shop and a game with a cash shop and a sub.

None of the stuff in the WoW cash shop feels necessary.

There is (or was) virtually no armour (apart from a couple of helms, more recently) in the store and there is plenty of armour in-game.

I’ve only ever bought a couple of non-combat pets, because there are tons easily available in-game.

Same with mounts.

They recently introduced instant 90s, which was slightly controversial, but for anyone who has played for more than 5 mins, they already have a stable full of high level chars, anyway.

None of the stuff in the GW2 cash shop feels necessary.

It is all attainable through the game.

Um, you can’t obtain outfits, directly from the game, at all and the armour available easily, from playing the game, is pretty few and far between, from what I can see.

Most of the minis that are available in-game are not for me.

I like regular-sized baby animals, not weird miniature versions of npcs following me about.

Whereas, in WoW, I can tame endless baby animal comps (WoW version of minis) via pet battles and easily solo tons of low level content, whenever I like, to get armour for transmog.

I know I can subject myself to a skip>permastack>melee group PVE nightmare of a life to farm gold to (eventually) convert gold to gems, but I can’t solo anything (easily) and prefer to play WvW.

It’s just not the same, trust me.

^ Actually there are multiple minis that can ONLY be obtained in-game and at least 1 outfit (back during Halloween).

lordkrall.7241:

But would enough “more people” be willing to buy them for it to break even?

I think so. I’ve spent several hundred dollars on another game (and money I consider well spent.) Because I kept spending here and there over months and months on things I considered affordable and worth my purchase. A weapon skin costs a few bucks (tho there are also much more expensive ones) and if you trade for it right you can get some even cheaper (50 cents for the least desirable ones.)

Know anything in the BL store cosmetic that costs less than a buck and is permanent…..?

Guess how much I’ve spent on GW2 gem store? 0. None. Its too expensive. Anything worthwhile is at least 10 bucks and, especially the unlocks, are often not account wide which just leaves a bad taste in my mouth, and want to support them even less. Even though I’ve spent over 1,000 days playing gw2, hundreds of hours (prob over a thousand now) in game. (just as much as the other game I spent 200 bucks in)

lordkrall.7241:

^ Actually there are multiple minis that can ONLY be obtained in-game and at least 1 outfit (back during Halloween).

Yeah, I know there are some and most of them are pretty horrible (IMO).

Most of them I wouldn’t take for free.

Not only that, but as I really only do WvW and don’t do group PVE content, in this game, it’s unlikely I could get most of them from anywhere but the TP anyway.

…and then we’re back to spending gold (which equals either time, or real life money) again.

Look, I understand this is a free game (after the initial payment) and I have said myself that it has to make money somehow.

It’s just that, personally, for what I like, it is really bad financially, compared to a sub game like WoW.

lordkrall.7241:

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

So you prefer being forced to pay in order to even login over being able to CHOOSE to pay for something?

It is of course also worth pointing out that every single thing in the gem store can be obtained 100% free by converting in-game gold to gems.

From a fundamentally selfish point of view, of course he would. Having made the decision to spend, for example, $20 on gems each month, of course he would prefer to spend $15.99 a month on a subscription instead. He’d be saving $4.

Of course, this ignores the fact that there are some people who choose not to spend $20 a month, or who choose to spend less than $15.99 per month. Those people prefer to have a choice.

Personally, I see the changes in prices for skins (Lord Faren’s Rapier for 500, Caithe’s Bloom Dagger for 600) as being indicative of ArenaNet working to determine the optimal price for these items.

Edit: But I think it’s perfectly valid for someone to come to the forums and tell ANet that, for them, the prices of the skins is too much.

Tigaseye.2047:

…and then we’re back to spending gold (which equals either time, or real life money) again.

In GW2 you can choose to spend either time or real life money to get what you want. In WoW you must spend both.

A lot of you make the assumption that “if they lowered the gem price, more people would buy, therefore they would profit more”.

May I remind you that this conclusion is, unless you’re an exception, completely baseless except for your intuition. Nothing wrong with that. But know that ArenaNet, as a company, has people dedicated to data analysis and advanced statistics that demonstrate inequivocally that a certain price is better. If they run the prices they run, it’s probably because that’s where the profit is. And we can’t legitimately blame them for that.

After almost 3 years of selling gems to players that number in the millions, they can now run very accurate linear regressions that predict the most profitable prices. That is more evidence than any of us can provide to back up our opinions.

While the price might be too high for your budget, Anet sells for a whole community. It’s irrelevant whether you, as an individual, can afford it or not. Profit is predicted based on the behaviour of the population.

Ashen.2907:

Tigaseye.2047:

…and then we’re back to spending gold (which equals either time, or real life money) again.

In GW2 you can choose to spend either time or real life money to get what you want. In WoW you must spend both.

Doing a few pet battles and soloing old content to get armour and weaps, for transmog, takes very little time.

Ultimately, you want to spend a certain amount of time playing, anyway – that is the point of playing games.

It’s not just supposed to be a means to an end.

ATM, I am basically paying real money, to avoid having to play certain badly designed areas of the game.

That’s insane, when you think about it.

nexxe.7081:

Seera.5916:

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

And I prefer buy to play games like GW2. Because I can budget out and justify an initial payment. Depending on sub price I may not be able to budget it. And I can’t justify it for myself. I sometimes take breaks from games and paying a sub would make me feel guilty for taking a break, even if the break would cause me to play the game for longer than if I hadn’t taken the break. And I can’t afford a sub unless it’s like $3 a month.

And I wonder how many GW2 players are in the same boat as me. Playing this game because it doesn’t have a sub and would be forced to stop playing it if they added a sub. Even those players who would be willing to pay a sub if they could afford it.

And would a sub bring in the money that those who leave the game due to it being a sub or reduce their gem purchases drastically?

The sub is irrelevant though. Millions of players are willing to pay for one. Just look at WoW and FFXIV:ARR, then look at B2P & F2P games, and you’ll see that their numbers are struggling. Just look at Wildstar, a game that was subscription but is now going to F2P. It had nothing to do with the sub model, but the quality of the game. Look at GW1 too, a B2P game which never had the success of GW2, and it was always lowly populated compared to other subscription games at that time.

Treating this game too casual takes it’s toll on a healthy playerbase and economy. If there’s too few people playing, events become much harder and dungeon groups take longer to find. WvW gets imbalanced, and so on. When people are paying a subscription, they are going to try to get the most out of their money before their time is up. You might not have enough time, but plenty of others do.

I never said that no one would pay or that there would be too many who couldn’t play. But I also didn’t say that everyone would pay or that enough people would pay.

And being a sub or not is not irrelevant.

No sub + cash shop brings in X money. Sub + cash shop (they’d still have one) brings in Y money. No one here on the forums know which would be higher in GW2’s sake between X and Y. So claiming going sub would be better for the game is unfounded. Conversely claiming it would hurt the game is also unfounded.

It’s not even off topic. Having a sub would affect gem prices.

OK, so slightly crazy idea possibly, but what about this:

They carry on sub-free and charging what they currently do for gems and items, but at some point you hit a real-money ceiling and then, after that, everything cosmetic, that is buyable with gems, is freely obtainable (for personal use only) for the rest of that year.

So, for example, the ceiling amount could be twice what they need to make from each player, per year, to be comfortably profitable.

So, going by WoW subs, that would be about £240 (or about £$360).

This would assume that some people would still spend nothing, or next to nothing (in terms of real money), but other people (i.e. pretty much anyone who could afford it) would strive to reach that ceiling as soon as possible.

That way, they would (presumably) have a more guaranteed income, without bleeding half their (paying) customers dry, or making people who genuinely can’t afford it have to find money for a sub.

Tigaseye.2047:

That way, they would (presumably) have a more guaranteed income, without bleeding half their (paying) customers dry, or making people who genuinely can’t afford it have to find money for a sub.

1) What makes you think they don’t have a more than enough income as it is?
2) The fact that there’s someone who can’t afford something isn’t an argument for a change of business plan. Their plan works – otherwise they’d change it. If someone can’t afford something they just won’t buy it. I don’t expect a change of business plan in the real estate market just because I can’t afford a better house. I’ll just live in the house I have.

zoejo.2317:

Tigaseye.2047:

That way, they would (presumably) have a more guaranteed income, without bleeding half their (paying) customers dry, or making people who genuinely can’t afford it have to find money for a sub.

1) What makes you think they don’t have a more than enough income as it is?
2) The fact that there’s someone who can’t afford something isn’t an argument for a change of business plan. Their plan works – otherwise they’d change it. If someone can’t afford something they just won’t buy it. I don’t expect a change of business plan in the real estate market just because I can’t afford a better house. I’ll just live in the house I have.

Well, I don’t really know if it works, or not?

I know they haven’t gone out of business, but I don’t know whether it is working optimally, or not.

Do you?

Personally, I don’t really feel it is working for me, one way and another.

I have spent quite a lot, but I don’t really feel like the money is going where it ought to be going and as such, I am becoming reluctant to spend more.

Clearly people do have various issues with the current system – you can see that from the threads that keep cropping up.

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

My experience has been the opposite.

I’ve been playing since launch and at most I spend £8.50 a month on gems. There have been rare months when I’ve spent more than that, but far more months when I’ve spent nothing at all. And I would have thought I buy things from the gem store more often than most people because I collect minis pets so I always get the new ones when they’re released.

Whereas in a sub-based game I have to pay a fixed amount every month, whether I feel like it or not, simply to be allowed to log in.

To be honest for me having the choice is more important than the actual cost. I could easily afford to pay a sub, but I’d hate feeling like I have to pay, or that because I’d paid that month I have to make sure I play enough to justify it. Especially since it’s often out of my control, between travelling for work and my friends living all over the country I often can’t make time for the game, and I don’t always know at the start of the month what the situation is going to be.

So I’d much rather be able to play as and when I want, regardless of how much I’ve paid recently, and then pay money if I feel like getting something extra like an outfit or a mini.

Well I also think it is a bit expensive. Would be better 1 euro for 100 gems. They should also make it possible to buy only 400 gems for 5 euros !

I’m mostly bothered by the decline in quality to cost in the gemstore.

800 gems used to buy you a an armor set, 6 individual pieces of fairly good quality (imo) that you could individually mix and match with other armor sets and dye seperately.

Now everything is Outfit. 700gems, and you dont get to mix and match individual pieces or dye each slot seperately anymore.

On the topic of sub verus f2p, we cannot say which model is the best financially for the companies involved. However, in my experience with both types, I’ve found that the upkeep/patches/balancing/new content is VASTLY better in a sub game than in a f2p game.

The f2p companies, right or wrong, give me the vibe that its just ‘maintaining to shut up their character base, and lure then into cash transactions’. Whereas the sub companies have to pump out the content/updates to keep the subs (and money) rolling in…

Terrahero.9358:

I’m mostly bothered by the decline in quality to cost in the gemstore.

800 gems used to buy you a an armor set, 6 individual pieces of fairly good quality (imo) that you could individually mix and match with other armor sets and dye seperately.

Now everything is Outfit. 700gems, and you dont get to mix and match individual pieces or dye each slot seperately anymore.

I agree. I did buy one outfit (the noble count one), but in that case I think it would only have worked as a single piece. All of the others I’ve liked bits of, but not the entire thing and since I can’t mix and match I have no interest in buying them. (I also got a refund on my pirate costume, which I bought back when it was town clothes because if I have to use the whole thing together it’s useless to me.)

However, to me things like this are actually where GW2 not having a sub is an advantage. It means if you don’t like what they’ve made you simply don’t buy it. If you’re paying a sub then you pay up front at the start of the month and if you don’t like what they do that month, or they don’t bring out anything new then you just have to hope next month is better.

DJRiful.3749:

I find that GW2 is a much more expensive game than a sub base game. That money can get you 2 months sub and game items are not limited to real life money even if it is not pay 2 win items.

I prefer sub base game because I can get all the items I wanted without paying $20 for one piece and $20 for another piece. That is equivalent to 4 mths of sub.

I’m afraid I can’t agree with you on this. I’ve played quite solidly since release and have spent in total around $120 on the game (including game cost at release)… WoW would have cost me $15×36 = $540 on subscription alone… factor in biannual expansions at $40 each, plus initial game cost, you’re looking at close to $700.

The reason Gems are so expensive… is because ArenaNet can charge that much for them, and people will still buy them. It’s as simple as that. There are many people out there who will buy every outfit, weapon skin, and significant Quality of Life improvement that ANet release, and that proportion alone will make up a large quantity of the microtransaction revenue.

However, with paid expansions now being introduced, I would too appreciate not feeling like I’m paying through the kitten for gems – I would definitely buy a lot more of them. I mean… paying around £7 for an outfit is just ridiculous… you can get entire games for that amount of money.

Tigaseye.2047:

zoejo.2317:

Tigaseye.2047:

That way, they would (presumably) have a more guaranteed income, without bleeding half their (paying) customers dry, or making people who genuinely can’t afford it have to find money for a sub.

1) What makes you think they don’t have a more than enough income as it is?
2) The fact that there’s someone who can’t afford something isn’t an argument for a change of business plan. Their plan works – otherwise they’d change it. If someone can’t afford something they just won’t buy it. I don’t expect a change of business plan in the real estate market just because I can’t afford a better house. I’ll just live in the house I have.

Well, I don’t really know if it works, or not?

I know they haven’t gone out of business, but I don’t know whether it is working optimally, or not.

Do you?

Personally, I don’t really feel it is working for me, one way and another.

I have spent quite a lot, but I don’t really feel like the money is going where it ought to be going and as such, I am becoming reluctant to spend more.

Clearly people do have various issues with the current system – you can see that from the threads that keep cropping up.

I can’t be sure that the model’s working for them, as much as anyone else can’t be sure that it isn’t. However, companies are made to profit and if they’re not changing their business model, the safest conclusion is that it’s working. The gem store vs. subscription option they took has lasted three years – it points towards the current model being sustainable.

You said one right thing – “Personally”. As you can imagine, the formula for profit takes into account the behavior of the population as a whole, not of each individual.

You seem to be unhappy with the trade. The solution is to stop consuming. You don’t expect every other company you make transactions with to change their model and offering to tailor your personal liking – why do you feel entitled to demand it from ArenaNet?

Yes there’s been threads with the same complaint. Out of all the threads posted here, however, it’s not a significant percentage of the player base. Out of all the player base, it’s possibly negligible.

Again, ArenaNet has statistics to power their decisions. We don’t. Our personal opinions matter little.

That’s why i only convert gold to gems. No gold=no gems for me, no regrets later on i spent my irl money on in game vanity items that don’t effect my preformance ingame whatsoever.

Oxidia.8103:

That’s why i only convert gold to gems. No gold=no gems for me, no regrets later on i spent my irl money on in game vanity items that don’t effect my preformance ingame whatsoever.

But do you regret spending all that time grinding for gold? That’s the real issue here. A subscription would let you do multiple tasks to achieve your gear and items, but in GW2, there is only one way to get the gem store items, and that is grinding for gold. to exchange it for gems. People value their time more than their money/gold.

nexxe.7081:

Oxidia.8103:

That’s why i only convert gold to gems. No gold=no gems for me, no regrets later on i spent my irl money on in game vanity items that don’t effect my preformance ingame whatsoever.

But do you regret spending all that time grinding for gold? That’s the real issue here. A subscription would let you do multiple tasks to achieve your gear and items, but in GW2, there is only one way to get the gem store items, and that is grinding for gold. to exchange it for gems. People value their time more than their money/gold.

I don’t understand this, but then I’ve not played a subscription MMO in years.

But it’s not as if there’s only 1 way to make gold in GW2, even if you’re not willing to wait and want to do it as quickly as possible there’s multiple different options like doing dungeons, doing the event chain in Silverwastes, doing world bosses, flipping items on the TP….

What kind of additional options to subscription games give you that you don’t have for making gold in this game?

World of Warcrafts $15 sub AND cash-shop would like to have a word with the complaining going on here.

Hell you’re paying 15 bucks a month and the mini pets from WoW’s cash shop are still $10 each, for one pet.

Tigaseye.2047:

Ashen.2907:

Tigaseye.2047:

…and then we’re back to spending gold (which equals either time, or real life money) again.

In GW2 you can choose to spend either time or real life money to get what you want. In WoW you must spend both.

Doing a few pet battles and soloing old content to get armour and weaps, for transmog, takes very little time.

Ultimately, you want to spend a certain amount of time playing, anyway – that is the point of playing games.

It’s not just supposed to be a means to an end.

ATM, I am basically paying real money, to avoid having to play certain badly designed areas of the game.

That’s insane, when you think about it.

I am not sure which badly designed areas of the game you are refering to. I earn my gold doing whatever I feel like at any given time. Mostly running around solo in the open world. I have yet to find an in game activity that doesnt generate resources. I do agree that you should avoid content that you dislike.

What I found in my time playing WoW was that they required me to pay every month just to access the game and then wanted me to buy things from the cash shop. If I didnt pay the monthly fee I would be locked out of anything I had bought and paid for in the cash shop.

nexxe.7081:

Oxidia.8103:

That’s why i only convert gold to gems. No gold=no gems for me, no regrets later on i spent my irl money on in game vanity items that don’t effect my preformance ingame whatsoever.

But do you regret spending all that time grinding for gold? That’s the real issue here. A subscription would let you do multiple tasks to achieve your gear and items, but in GW2, there is only one way to get the gem store items, and that is grinding for gold. to exchange it for gems. People value their time more than their money/gold.

Indeed.

Its really a matter of judging effort.

So I can get 4000 gems the rich snob way… Or I can spend 4 kitten months of 3 hours grinding everyday so that I can convert gold to gems.

Uh, no.

I’d rather spend those 4 months doing what I enjoy in the game. Sometimes that gets me gold, sometimes it dont. I can lazily play WvW for hours just scouting or I can fill my inventory in a Silverwaste round. I do what I find fun at the time. There are some people that claim they get 500g a day from farming and that’s fine! Good for them! They can convert gold to gems all they want for with little time spent. But for normal players that sometimes doesnt even see an exotic drop for a week, opening the wallet can actually make sense. Even if it seem expensive. Of course Anet has priced items high. They want you to spend lots of cash. That’s what keep GW2 running.

understatement! gems are ridiculously over priced!

Just to put another slant on this – I wonder if the people who run the shop for Anet would ever consider allowing more national currencies. I had no problems purchasing gems a year ago but with exchange rates the way they are its a bit silly for me now.

yakuza snowdragon.4639:

understatement! gems are ridiculously over priced!

And yet people still buy them, so that must mean they are not that overpriced.

For someone who has a job, 10-20$ is nothing. For the same amount of gems in gold you would need to farm the game for hours.

At the end of the day, you have to ask yourself: Do I prefer to spend an hour of my work time on that outfit or 6-8 hours farming the gold?

I often thought of buying gems. I just don’t want to spend that much money on little perks like permanent harvesters and pickaxes, or keys.

I’d love to buy it, but it’s really too expensive for what it offers.

Tigaseye.2047:

Behellagh.1468:

It’s 80 gems per $1€/£0.85 and has been that since launch. And as others pointed out it’s ANet’s primary source of continuing income. It’s comparable to other game proxy currency available on consoles and in other MMOs.

Your issue is that items cost too much in your opinion in terms of real money. $10€/800 gems for an armor set. As others have said, you are saving from no subscription or being charged for the littlest of things that you would find in F2P.

You also have to remember that a fair number of purchases at the Gem Shop is done with gold bought gems. Lowering the price of items will simply mean it’ll be easier to buy items with gold bought gems which may mean less cash bought gems bought and that means less income for ANet. Given a way to get something for “free” (no cash cost), people will pursue that route rather than open up their wallets more to actually buy gems.

That’s probably why he’s not asking them to lower the price of the items; but just the real money cost of gems.

If they did that, more people would (almost certainly) buy gems with real money, rather than waiting to buy them with gold.

But in the end it’s the same thing. $10€ for a full armor skin is $10€ if it’s 800 gems or 2000 gems. Since I doubt that’s what he’s suggesting, altering the cash cost per gem then he is asking them to lower the cash cost of items on the gem shop by reducing the gem cost or increasing the amount of gems you can get with cash. It’s the same result either way.

Or is this a complaint about the equivalency of $1 is 1€ even though that’s been addressed (UK VAT, exchange rate at launch and any other fees involved with currency exchange).

But it sounds like he’s asking ANet to lower their income by discounting the price of gems, something that will never happen. You want to pay less for an item, wait for the sale.

Given the account wide unlock nature of most of the gem store items, I honestly feel like their prices are bloody generous. most games would have you paying the amount Anet do (or more) for a temporary costume or costume that can only be used on a single character, ANet give you account wide unlocks available any time after you’ve bought them on any one of the characters on your account

I prefer sub-based games for the simple fact that the content and updates are much better.

The biggest flaw in the B2P model is that once they get your money, they have no incentive to keep you playing, they just need to keep the cash shop turning over. Whereas a sub-based game has to earn your loyalty every month.

Eg balance update frequency in GW2 is appalling.

mulzi.8273:

On the topic of sub verus f2p, we cannot say which model is the best financially for the companies involved. However, in my experience with both types, I’ve found that the upkeep/patches/balancing/new content is VASTLY better in a sub game than in a f2p game.

The f2p companies, right or wrong, give me the vibe that its just ‘maintaining to shut up their character base, and lure then into cash transactions’. Whereas the sub companies have to pump out the content/updates to keep the subs (and money) rolling in…

Yeah, this is my feeling, as well.

Behellagh.1468:

Tigaseye.2047:

Behellagh.1468:

It’s 80 gems per $1€/£0.85 and has been that since launch. And as others pointed out it’s ANet’s primary source of continuing income. It’s comparable to other game proxy currency available on consoles and in other MMOs.

Your issue is that items cost too much in your opinion in terms of real money. $10€/800 gems for an armor set. As others have said, you are saving from no subscription or being charged for the littlest of things that you would find in F2P.

You also have to remember that a fair number of purchases at the Gem Shop is done with gold bought gems. Lowering the price of items will simply mean it’ll be easier to buy items with gold bought gems which may mean less cash bought gems bought and that means less income for ANet. Given a way to get something for “free” (no cash cost), people will pursue that route rather than open up their wallets more to actually buy gems.

That’s probably why he’s not asking them to lower the price of the items; but just the real money cost of gems.

If they did that, more people would (almost certainly) buy gems with real money, rather than waiting to buy them with gold.

But in the end it’s the same thing. $10€ for a full armor skin is $10€ if it’s 800 gems or 2000 gems. Since I doubt that’s what he’s suggesting, altering the cash cost per gem then he is asking them to lower the cash cost of items on the gem shop by reducing the gem cost or increasing the amount of gems you can get with cash. It’s the same result either way.

Or is this a complaint about the equivalency of $1 is 1€ even though that’s been addressed (UK VAT, exchange rate at launch and any other fees involved with currency exchange).

But it sounds like he’s asking ANet to lower their income by discounting the price of gems, something that will never happen. You want to pay less for an item, wait for the sale.

No, he is very clearly asking them to lower the real money price per gem.

Look at the title.

That is exactly what he is asking (and he said nothing about Dollar to Euro conversion).

…and yes, it amounts to the same thing, for the customer, if they are only using real cash to buy gems.

But, as you rightly pointed out, if you lowered the item price, but left the gold to gem conversion the same, people would be less likely to use real money and more likely to save up gold, instead.

Which would be less good for Anet’s bank balance.

Whereas, if they made it slightly cheaper to buy gems with real money, but left them costing the same amount of gold (and the items costing the same number of gems), it would (presumably) have the opposite effect.

Which would, quite possibly, be good for Anet’s bank balance (overall).

Your entire original point was, effectively, that lowering the gem price of items is, in fact, different from lowering the real money gem price, from that point of view and you are correct; it is.

WereDragon.6083:

World of Warcrafts $15 sub AND cash-shop would like to have a word with the complaining going on here.

Hell you’re paying 15 bucks a month and the mini pets from WoW’s cash shop are still $10 each, for one pet.

As I say, they feel completely unnecessary, though, as you can tame (literally) hundreds of pets, really easily, out in the wild.

Starting right from minute 1, of day 1 and at level 1.

So, you would never, ever, need to be in a situation where you felt devoid of pets, or even devoid of a certain kind of pet, as you can in this game.

You would have to just really, really, like that particular WoW cash store pet to even bother and there aren’t even a lot of cash store pets to choose from.