I was going to buy some gems and convert them to gold since the gold > gems rate is so high and I’ve got a little extra cash. I hadn’t looked at the ratio of gold>gems/gems>gold recently and was mildly surprised when I realized it wasn’t 70% like it was last time I payed attention to it. Back at the beginning of the year it was 65% and now it’s 56% difference. Can anyone explain the economic reason why the gold>gems is rising so much faster than gems>gold? Looking at the graphs on spidy, its obvious they are linked but the relationship is steady widening between them the more expensive gems get for in game gold the gems>gold is starting to stagnate.
It seems to me (not being a MMO economist or working in the game industry) that you’d want the rate to be fixed between them so if it gets really high it encourages people to pull out a credit card and buy gems to convert to gold. Or would the preference be that you would want Gold>Gems to get high enough that it becomes unfeasible for anyone but those that are really good at farming gold to be able to afford Gold>Gems it so everyone else ends up pulling out a credit card if they want a quick influx of gold or to buy and item in the gemstore?
The problem I see with the 2nd reason is that it needs to stay low enough that the new players coming in feel like they aren’t late to the party and can’t afford the occasional item converting gold>gems and they feel like only the veteran players are catered to. (though I know many longtime players are fairly short on gold as well)
I always figured it was there way of stopping in game farmers from getting any real quantity of gems and buying all the BL store stuff for free. By separating them, Anet can increase the price of gems via gold as much as they want without causing people who buy gems and convert to gold suddenly becoming filthy rich overnight.
tl;dr- this way they can modify one without the other.
As I understand it the rate is not set by ANet but by how many people spend cash on gems to then turn into gold. The supply of gems comes from that. If less gems are bought by cash and converted to gold (as opposed to simply buying gem store items), there are less available even as the demand goes up when people want to buy popular items.
Veteran players have lots of in-game gold sources. They generally don’t need to buy gold with gems. That’s the extent of the “catering,” again, as I understand the system. I am not an economist or a TP player!
Weird. It should be around 70% (~73% actually) but it does seem to change. The only explanation i can see is that Anet increased the hidden tax on both transactions (73% is for 15% tax, while the level it is now suggest the tax at nearly double that value).
Actions, not words.
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The rate is not set by anet but by the players. There is a finite pool of gems and the rate is set by how many people are converting their gold to gems and the other way around.
Don’t look at GW2Spidy for the data on the exchange. It’s been wrong since last August when the API of the exchange was changed ahead of the new exchange interface.
Regardless of whether spidy is up-to-date, the data from the API shows clearly that, at any given moment, there’s the equivalent of a 15% fee/tax in both directions. Start with 1,000 gold, convert to gems, and convert back. Unless the rate changes while you do that (which it will), you’ll end up with 722.5 gold.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Except spidy’s ratio between the two rates is currently at 56.4% and not relatively close to 72.25%. And it’s because the gold to gem is above and the gem to gold is below the actual API rates (as long as the input value to the API is large enough).
That decrease in the ratio started back last August and it’s rather obvious when because the two ratios should always track each other and suddenly one day they started to diverge (starting with one went up and the other down) and the ratio has been shrinking ever since.
I always figured it was there way of stopping in game farmers from getting any real quantity of gems and buying all the BL store stuff for free. By separating them, Anet can increase the price of gems via gold as much as they want without causing people who buy gems and convert to gold suddenly becoming filthy rich overnight.
tl;dr- this way they can modify one without the other.
Well I can imagine that if they didn’t separate them, it would be a heavy load on the server with people (or bots) constantly buying and selling them to make a few copper or silver with each trade. So it needs to move significantly enough for people to be able to make gold/gems by playing the exchange. Other games impose a tax/fee as well, even in purely player driven economies.
I always figured it was there way of stopping in game farmers from getting any real quantity of gems and buying all the BL store stuff for free. By separating them, Anet can increase the price of gems via gold as much as they want without causing people who buy gems and convert to gold suddenly becoming filthy rich overnight.
tl;dr- this way they can modify one without the other.
Except that’s not what sets the rates. ANet doesn’t directly set the rate, it’s entirely automatic and is based solely on player actions, selling either gold or gems to the exchange. If more players buy gems than sell them, both rates go up. If more players sell gems than buy them, both rates go down. The gems to gold rate is approximately 72.25% of the gold to gems rate as it appears the exchange sinks 15% of gold for each transaction.
ANet’s only means of affecting the exchange rate is by adding or announce they will soon remove a popular item or announcing a sale on a popular item. Players will then rush to the exchange to convert their gold and we see a spike in the rate. If ANet doesn’t have sales or interesting items being introduced, the rate decrease as those with cash decide to buy gems and convert to gold.
The gap the OP is seeing is not real but a problem with GW2Spidy.
Don’t look at GW2Spidy for the data on the exchange. It’s been wrong since last August when the API of the exchange was changed ahead of the new exchange interface.
The gems to gold rate is approximately 72.25% of the gold to gems rate as it appears the exchange sinks 15% of gold for each transaction.
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My confusion is that it doesn’t seem to be 72%, the difference between gold>gems and Gems>gold is slowly widening. It was 64% at the beginning of the year, and is now 56% or was last night. Even if they were fixed percentages, 72% and a 15% transaction fee, you’d expect them to be a fixed percentage apart at all times. Instead the Gems>Gold is plateauing while the Gold>Gems is moving away from it. That’s what I’m wondering about.
My confusion is that it doesn’t seem to be 72%, the difference between gold>gems and Gems>gold is slowly widening. It was 64% at the beginning of the year, and is now 56% or was last night. Even if they were fixed percentages, 72% and a 15% transaction fee, you’d expect them to be a fixed percentage apart at all times. Instead the Gems>Gold is plateauing while the Gold>Gems is moving away from it. That’s what I’m wondering about.
The reason it looks like the gap is widening is that the absolute difference is going to increase between high and low. 72/100 (18) is a lot different from 720/1000 (180).
Many alts; handle it!
“I’m finding companies should sell access to forums,
it seems many like them better than the games they comment on.” -Horrorscope.7632
Where’s the data coming from, Frosty?
Ensign pointed out above that the ratio is running proper, and that the usual online sources have a code error due to some recent changes.
Also, the gem→gold exchange has an obnoxious rounding error that aims to cheat paying players out of remaining silver. (Seems to me, if you want to reward cash-paying players, you put the rounding error on the gold→gem converts…)
Many alts; handle it!
“I’m finding companies should sell access to forums,
it seems many like them better than the games they comment on.” -Horrorscope.7632
Spidy’s chart. Everyone got off on gold>gems so I may have misinterpreted what they were saying as my interest is the gems to gold exchange at the moment.
If my understanding is correct then, spidy’s chart is way off on the gems to gold exchange and does not accurately reflect the in game exchange? If so then I apologize for wasting everyone’s time with my question as it seems it was based on bad information.
Spidy’s chart. Everyone got off on gold>gems so I may have misinterpreted what they were saying as my interest is the gems to gold exchange at the moment.
If my understanding is correct then, spidy’s chart is way off on the gems to gold exchange and does not accurately reflect the in game exchange? If so then I apologize for wasting everyone’s time with my question as it seems it was based on bad information.
Good that you brought it up, though. If the online tool isn’t reliable at the moment, the market watchers should know.
Many alts; handle it!
“I’m finding companies should sell access to forums,
it seems many like them better than the games they comment on.” -Horrorscope.7632
Spidy’s chart. Everyone got off on gold>gems so I may have misinterpreted what they were saying as my interest is the gems to gold exchange at the moment.
If my understanding is correct then, spidy’s chart is way off on the gems to gold exchange and does not accurately reflect the in game exchange? If so then I apologize for wasting everyone’s time with my question as it seems it was based on bad information.
And yet again, GW2Spidy’s gem exchange numbers and chart are wrong and have been since Aug 2014. If out of the game and curious about the exact amount, use the API
Note that they are bass ackwards in terms of what’s used as input on the actual Gem Exchange where we now ask how many gems for selling X gold and the cost in coin to buy Y number of gems.
If you want a more accurate chart, GW2TP graphs the Gold to Gem rate sampling at 1/2 hour intervals.
