Guild Wars 2

Dear Arenanet!

When I bought this game you were all over around the grind topic:

-No grinding!
-Anti-grind game!
-Fun > Grind!

Yet what we got? A typical GRIND game. I’m not mad.. I think its a fun single player game 1-80, but after that… Well yeah!

Where is the content everywhere thing? Where is the epic Orr you promised? Orr is just a place with bugged events and fastly spawning risens.

• What did I expect from Orr?
  -Epic events.
  -Good story.
  -Epic fights.

• What did I got from Orr?
  -Bugged events.
  -Sometimes a story.
  -Herpkittenmass spawn fights.

• What did I expect from lvl80?
  -Going around the world, enjoying the game with my friends!
  -Clearing dungeons, getting all sets having fun.
  -Crafting cool stuffs.
  -Trying to get legendary weapon.
  -PvP and WWW with friends.

• What did I got from lvl80?
  -Grinding around the world. After 30min, you are not even allowed to grind.
  -Killing the 3 dragon all over and over again.
  -Clearing dungeons once -> Looking at set prices -> Giving up on all sets. Not having fun.
  -Crafting the same stuffs…or not. Its not even worthy! Selling the mats is just more worthy.
  -PvP alone because there is no join as a team options.
  -WWW with friends if we are lucky to get in together.

I’m just curious because why not… Shall we expect some changes about these subjects? Will you make this game more fun than game oriented, or you just leave this as it is?

Honestly, I did enjoy the game 1-80, but after that, my western style sweet dream mmo goes into a korean style nightmare mmo!

Oh and this is not a QQ, it worth every cent I spent on this game, because that was fun. So just tell me… Is there any chance that I will have fun in this game in the future instead of grinding?

Athem.7321:

Dear Arenanet!
snip

What exactly are you grinding for?

Alice.8694:

Athem.7321:

Dear Arenanet!
snip

What exactly are you grinding for?

Exactly for everything?

Want to craft -> Grind mats for 30min. (Need to change location after that.)

Want to get awesome armor from karma -> Grind karma.

Want awesome armor from dungeons? -> Grind tokens

Want a legendary weapon? -> Grind for the mats.

I know that we shouldnt get these for free or going herpkittenaround the world but man. How about making this funny?

Example like: Kill X boss here -> Get event item->Do that event there -> Explore that there -> Speak with that smith in that town -> Get the recipe which contains something which is not inhuman like 300 AC run + 250 from every item + 1.5million karma and so on…

And:
Going dungeon -> getting 1 piece from the set. Honestly, if I want to respec and do something else than a crit build, I have to get 3 pieces from the same set.

Grind…grind everywhere. ^^

What you call “grind” is actually called “playing the game”.

Have you noticed that?

The reason it is a “grind” to you is because you are reward-focused from years of playing MMOs that have distilled boring activities into loot pinatas — you go out and do “this” activity to get “that” loot or you cannot do anything else because of “gear checks”.

GW2 is not that kind of game. Upgrades are extremely minor and you can do whatever you feel like doing at the moment and typically work towards multiple ends at the same time.

Of course, if you aren’t enjoying the game you can just take a break. It’s not like it has a subscription, after all. You should not expect any single game to consume every single waking minute of your life.

Perhaps you and I are playing seperate games?

I am through, two areas of orr and I have my exotics already through crafting. You don’t even need to grind all the materials since most of them are very cheap on the marketplace. And you acquire money simply by playing the game.

Armor from karma is no different, karma is gotten through playing the game. You don’t need to grind that one event in cursed shore meaninglessly for optimal karma. You could see the world and all it’s content while gradually building up your karma. At the end of it you’d have enough for most of the set and two gifts for a legendary.

There are many options to getting Exotic gear and grind is just one of them. Ironically the worst one at that.

Now lets assess the other two claims.

Dungeon armor is prestige armor.
If you want to understand the meaning of this I suggest you go visit the guild wars 1 wiki for the material costs for obsidian armor.
This armor is not meant to be an easy affair, it is meant for people who enjoy playing through dungeons. Not as the reward for playing through them. There is an on going theme through out guild wars 2. Do things you enjoy, because you enjoy them not because you feel you have too.

Legendary weapons are prestige weaponry, I suggest looking up the initial requirements for the tormentor weaponry in guild wars 1. You will find them equally harsh, if not more so for some.
These weapons are for people who want to show off their prestige in playing.

I dare say you are needlessly self inflicting grind on yourself. Play the game and rewards will come over time. If you absolutely have to rush the process then yes, you will have to grind.

Tiresias.6473:

What you call “grind” is actually called “playing the game”.

Have you noticed that?

The reason it is a “grind” to you is because you are reward-focused from years of playing MMOs that have distilled boring activities into loot pinatas — you go out and do “this” activity to get “that” loot or you cannot do anything else because of “gear checks”.

GW2 is not that kind of game. Upgrades are extremely minor and you can do whatever you feel like doing at the moment and typically work towards multiple ends at the same time.

Of course, if you aren’t enjoying the game you can just take a break. It’s not like it has a subscription, after all. You should not expect any single game to consume every single waking minute of your life.

GW2 is that kind of game as long as upgrading to exotic gear results in a 33% damage increase. It’s just another carrot on a stick.

A lot of people cry about the dungeon grind. But tell me what would be the point of a dungeon set if it wasn’t a grind?

You’d do the dungeon once, get the set, never set foot in it again because you have no incentive. It’s very rare for people to do dungeons for fun nowadays, people need a reward. Dungeons sets are prestigious, not something to be earned within a day, if you do an explorable a week, you’ll eventually get there. If you think of it as like a checklist and go “Okay, I need to do 100 runs of AC explorable to get this set and I need to get it now” of course you’re going to feel a grind.

But tell me, what MMORPG doesn’t revolve a grind. It’s impossible to make a MMORPG that isn’t grindy and keeps players for a long time. That would require new content being pumped out than players completing, which is physically impossible unless the content is a 2 minute job and has no thought or effort put into it. Grind is put there to keep players busy. Anything can be considered a grind, it’s just subjective to the person.

Cerise.9045:

GW2 is that kind of game as long as upgrading to exotic gear results in a 33% damage increase. It’s just another carrot on a stick.

Actually it’s 13%
Source: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/46603-faq-equipment-attributes-and-you-updated/

Nothing of those grinds are mandatory tho.
I cleared Arah explo and CoF with greens on two chars.

+13% stats prolly equal to something like 5% damage and 2% damage reduction for instance.
If you think these will give you any real benefit you haven’t learned to play yet.

Tiresias.6473:

What you call “grind” is actually called “playing the game”.

Have you noticed that?

The reason it is a “grind” to you is because you are reward-focused from years of playing MMOs that have distilled boring activities into loot pinatas — you go out and do “this” activity to get “that” loot or you cannot do anything else because of “gear checks”.

GW2 is not that kind of game. Upgrades are extremely minor and you can do whatever you feel like doing at the moment and typically work towards multiple ends at the same time.

Of course, if you aren’t enjoying the game you can just take a break. It’s not like it has a subscription, after all. You should not expect any single game to consume every single waking minute of your life.

Yea, umm have you even seen the cost of dungeon exotics? A dungeon exotic set (just the armor) costs 1380 “dungeon tokens”. Considering you get roughly 30 tokens a run, that would net out to 46 dungeon runs.

Wait, what? 46 dungeon runs? I must’ve done that math wrong…

1380 / 30 = … Holy crap, that’s 46.

Riddle me this, in what universe does doing anything 46 times not seem insanely tedious? (Except making whoopy or eating jelly beans of course).

Alice.8694:

Cerise.9045:

GW2 is that kind of game as long as upgrading to exotic gear results in a 33% damage increase. It’s just another carrot on a stick.

Actually it’s 13%
Source: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/46603-faq-equipment-attributes-and-you-updated/

That doesn’t take scaling into consideration, the overall benefit is a lot higher because stats like crit and crit damage synergize with each other, and crit chance also synergizes with procs, giving you more value per point the more you have.

Cerise.9045:

Alice.8694:

Cerise.9045:

GW2 is that kind of game as long as upgrading to exotic gear results in a 33% damage increase. It’s just another carrot on a stick.

Actually it’s 13%
Source: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/46603-faq-equipment-attributes-and-you-updated/

That doesn’t take scaling into consideration, the overall benefit is a lot higher because stats like crit and crit damage synergize with each other, and crit chance also synergizes with procs, giving you more value per point the more you have.

shhhh…. Forget the numbers and remember – gear does not matter
yes, i am sarcastic

Lance Coolee.9480:

Tiresias.6473:

What you call “grind” is actually called “playing the game”.

Have you noticed that?

The reason it is a “grind” to you is because you are reward-focused from years of playing MMOs that have distilled boring activities into loot pinatas — you go out and do “this” activity to get “that” loot or you cannot do anything else because of “gear checks”.

GW2 is not that kind of game. Upgrades are extremely minor and you can do whatever you feel like doing at the moment and typically work towards multiple ends at the same time.

Of course, if you aren’t enjoying the game you can just take a break. It’s not like it has a subscription, after all. You should not expect any single game to consume every single waking minute of your life.

Yea, umm have you even seen the cost of dungeon exotics? A dungeon exotic set (just the armor) costs 1380 “dungeon tokens”. Considering you get roughly 30 tokens a run, that would net out to 46 dungeon runs.

Wait, what? 46 dungeon runs? I must’ve done that math wrong…

1380 / 30 = … Holy crap, that’s 46.

Riddle me this, in what universe does doing anything 46 times not seem insanely tedious? (Except making whoopy or eating jelly beans of course).

46 times isn’t much compared to how long it took to get obsidian armor.

The way it is set up now, dungeon armor is mainly for the looks.

There’s only a grind if you choose to play it that way. Anything and everything can be seen as a grind if you choose to do so.

When I hit level 80, I was half way through the level 60 zone, 30% map completion and had around 100k karma. Once I finished Orr, I had 220k karma (around 900 events completed) and 50% map completion. Without grinding, I could buy the karma sets.

I then went to Frostgorge and participated in the dragon event a few times. 2 days later, I fully crafted an entire exotic explorer’s of the pirate set and all accessories.

I then decided to make a healing/toughness set and temporarily made a rare one. After grinding grawl for about 4 hours over 4 days, I had 30 totems to fully make the exotic set. After the 2nd day, none dropped and I was only getting them from loot bags. The first 2 days I actually found around 25. 3rd day was like 1, the rest was day 3.

By this point, I have so much crafting materials, that I can make rare pieces to break down into ectos over a 100 times.

For dungeons, you’re not supposed to obtain the gear for the stats. This isn’t your typical WoW-styled MMO. Dungeon gear is supposed to be rare, meaning not every single person is supposed to be wearing it, though they are still going to make it easier to obtain. They probably should have just made the token dailies. Likewise, Legendaries are supposed to be even rarer and only the extremely dedicated should have one near the start of the game. A year in, they’ll be more common.

Lance Coolee.9480:

Tiresias.6473:

What you call “grind” is actually called “playing the game”.

Have you noticed that?

The reason it is a “grind” to you is because you are reward-focused from years of playing MMOs that have distilled boring activities into loot pinatas — you go out and do “this” activity to get “that” loot or you cannot do anything else because of “gear checks”.

GW2 is not that kind of game. Upgrades are extremely minor and you can do whatever you feel like doing at the moment and typically work towards multiple ends at the same time.

Of course, if you aren’t enjoying the game you can just take a break. It’s not like it has a subscription, after all. You should not expect any single game to consume every single waking minute of your life.

Yea, umm have you even seen the cost of dungeon exotics? A dungeon exotic set (just the armor) costs 1380 “dungeon tokens”. Considering you get roughly 30 tokens a run, that would net out to 46 dungeon runs.

Wait, what? 46 dungeon runs? I must’ve done that math wrong…

1380 / 30 = … Holy crap, that’s 46.

Riddle me this, in what universe does doing anything 46 times not seem insanely tedious? (Except making whoopy or eating jelly beans of course).

You’re playing the wrong genre of game. I think you want a single player fantasy game like Skyrim, Darksiders, Borderlands, really anything other than a MMO. These games are designed to be semi-never ending. You want an end to the game so go play games that have them.

I see the fanboys are trying to defend the game that there is no grind. Yeah, that would be my answer too to anybody if they ask me about Foo Fighters. Even if they have some crapy songs, I think Dave Grohl is just awesome.

What we are doing here is GRIND, this mmo is turning into a korean grindfest. Throw me the rocks, but WoW doesnt have that kind of system. You dont have to grind for anything. (Well, if you have to grind, you dont have to do that much.)

My character is in full exotic 101% magic find gear…however its nothing amazing. Yeah, I went and GRINDED around the dragon events for mats.

You guys mostly believe that this is a fun system and not a reward system. I can tell from that you are probably young, or just insanly addicted to Arenanet.

Why am I saying that?

You are saying that this game is about fun, not rewards → That would be true if you wouldnt have to do the same events over and over again.

You are saying that this game is about fun, not rewards → Then why should I care about rewards? If I want a cool skin, why should I grind 46k karma/piece or do 46 run in the same instance?

You are talking about fun, because Arenanet sais that this is fun. This is grind, and they have the same REWARD system as other mmos. NOT FUN SYSTEM. If that would be about fun, you could get these item skins with NORMAL effort which would be STILL FUN.

Currently → Play more → Get awesome skins → Grind mats → Get awesome legendary skins.

Welcome to the SAME rewarding system which is in every korean mmo. Feel free to deny it.

Fun system would be:

Do events → Realise that you can get new skins! Yay!

Do dungeons → Get 1 armor piece / run. Get new skin after 6 run. Need effort? Yeah! Can be fun? Yeah!

This is the system you are talking about. Where you dont have to grind, you are not forced to play 24/7 , . You are just going with the flow…

Deal with it.

They said grind was not necessary and it isn´t. But as you resort to using the lingo of 16 year old basement dwellers like “fanboy” when confronted with other opinions, I think you just took away your entitlement of being taken seriously.

Level 80 exotics all have the same stats, what you’re grinding for is the prestige of owning a hard to get set. None of it is necessary, but it’s cool to own things that not many people have. If you don’t want to do a dungeon or karma grind, there’s other stuff to do.

Eathanskies.3817:

Level 80 exotics all have the same stats, what you’re grinding for is the prestige of owning a hard to get set. None of it is necessary, but it’s cool to own things that not many people have. If you don’t want to do a dungeon or karma grind, there’s other stuff to do.

Exactly. And I did like how one of the earlier posters said WoW wasn’t a grind. You can do the same raid month after month after month and never get the drop you were after.

If you think that there is a thing which is “necessary” in a game, you are wrong. Everything in an mmo is for prestige, nothing else.

Its the same here and same in the WoW example. A full epic gear compared to a full Tier XX set is just small upgrade. You are going for it because of “prestige”.

The same thing goes here…if you want a cool set you have to grind.

You guys are just trying to defend this game in every way you can. Failing to realise its flawes because you want this game to be the best, the awesome, the great one.

However, if the part of the community which is using these forums (which are mostly the fans) are failing to realise the problems, this will turn out bad.

You are gently patting Arenanet’s head for everything they do, you even try to explain the grind in this game. But we all know:

You are playing this game because you want to have fun, achieve things, play with friends, get a cool looking character and etc.

So basicly you said grind is not necesssary but it is. Why is that? Because in this game, your progress in the end is GETTING SKINS. Getting skins needs grinding, and its not fun.

That grind wouldnt be necessary if you would be able to do SOMETHING ELSE than that. (And please, dont try to defend the lack of content with the : Go WWW ; GO PVP usual answer. Its just not legit.)

Until the community which is using the forums are failing to realise that, and “cry” for changes, this game is going to be “bad”.

When I say bad, I mean it will only keep the fans to itself, and slowly chasing away other players.
—-

You dont like what I say? You think this game is fine as it is? Please do, but dont be surprised if you will slowly realise that servers are going to be less populated.

Yeah I know.. → Less people → Better community.

Every fail mmo (like Swtor) tried to go behind this, but in the end, it was only because the fans couldnt handle their favorite game being bad.

turning into a korean grindfest

heh you never played Ragnarok Online

WoW doesnt have that kind of system

heh you never played wow either i see

It sounds like you’re dead set on your opinion, which is fine, so am I. There are other things to do, and many people have fun doing them. I’m not saying you’re wrong, people enjoy different things, but I don’t see the point in coming onto the forums to try and convince people that your opinion is fact.

Sub-based mmorpgs have this thang.
The goal is to commit the player as much as possible to the game as that increases revenue.
In that system the most efficient way to use content is an appeal to the ego.
Make it so that if you kill all 170 ogres on candy mountain it spawns a bunny token.
123k bunny tokens gives an avatar some angel wings that every player will notice. The ego will be motivated to do it even if it takes months. Cha-ching. Money in the bank.

If the ego isn’t in charge, or the game isn’t sub-based then a player just has to sit there and wonder what they can possibly do in a game like that and is stuff that is fun for THEM. I personally like to chat nonsense in towns, but it’s not really playing the game. Another ting I like to do is play cupid with skills. Collect them and pair them up into mates that can do things neither one of them could do on their own. GW1 was awesome for that. I loved it so much. But GW2 is going in a direction inspired by sub-based mmorpg design when it doesn’t even have to. ;_;

Athem.7321:

Fun system would be:

Do events -> Realise that you can get new skins! Yay!

Do dungeons -> Get 1 armor piece / run. Get new skin after 6 run. Need effort? Yeah! Can be fun? Yeah!

This is the system you are talking about. Where you dont have to grind, you are not forced to play 24/7 , . You are just going with the flow…

Deal with it.

Disregarding your childish insults for a minute the system you want would have you back here in a week complaining about a lack of content…

If there was no grind, ppl instead of complaining there was nothing to do after 2 weeks, would have complained after 2 days. Heck even the casuals would run out of things to do by now.

Athem.7321:

If you think that there is a thing which is “necessary” in a game, you are wrong. Everything in an mmo is for prestige, nothing else.

Its the same here and same in the WoW example. A full epic gear compared to a full Tier XX set is just small upgrade. You are going for it because of “prestige”.

The same thing goes here…if you want a cool set you have to grind.

You guys are just trying to defend this game in every way you can. Failing to realise its flawes because you want this game to be the best, the awesome, the great one.

Wait… let me get this straight. You agree with us when we say stuff like Dungeon Sets/Culture Sets aren’t necessary and are there for prestige. You know that you can get a full set of exotic level gear very easily/quickly buy purchasing it off the TC. The stats are no different from TC Exotics to Dungeon Exotics to Karma Exotics to WvW Exotics.

The only difference is the skin you want. If you want that certain skin the earn it. If you don’t want that skin then no one is forcing you to go after it. No one is forcing you to grind dungeons over and over again. The way this game was designed was so top tier gear was easy to achieve but the prestigious looks were hard to get and took time.

This is no different than GW1 where you could get the level 20 armor in a matter of hours after you started playing, I think it takes like 2 hours to hit 20 if you know what you’re doing, yet the end game armors took a lot of time. This was because of “prestige” as they had no statistical difference over any other level 20 armor.

If you don’t like that then you are free to go to another game. I’m sure there are several people that don’t and will leave for other games. Hopefully they find one they like but expecting the core aspects of a game to be changed when those aspects have been in place for the better part of a decade is ludicrous. Sure, GW1 and GW2 are different games but they are designed by the same company and have the same basic beliefs built in.

Game don’t need grind to increase it’s longevity.
It especially don’t need grind in ways that sub-based games do it, when sub-based games do it for a very specific reason.

Sigh…let me tell you again. In this game, the content IS THE SKINS and COSMETICS.

You are just failed to realise that there is ALWAYS something which is motivating players : This is content.

However, when this content (getting cool skins) is just a big GRIND fest, its called a GRIND game.

This wouldnt be the case if there would be anything else to do. OR if you could do this like I said: without grind.

That would be easy. Instead of the karma grind they could do that way:

For the helmet example you need to do certain dynamic events, and get items from each → combine in mystic forge → get head token.

Nothing has changed, expect that I dont have to FARM the same dynamic events all around the world for insane amount of karma.

Dungeon runs → 1 run / piece → still a challenge but I dont have to grind all over and over again.

—

Thats it example.

People, as a whole, need a carrot to chase after. With no carrot they get bored, go plop down on the couch, then turn the TV on. Without a “grind”, which is generally only a grind if you make it such, there really is no longevity. There is no way a game company can create a game with an unlimited amount of content to please everyone. If there isn’t anything to chase after, even in a sandbox MMO, you will eventually get bored and move on.

Athem.7321:

Sigh…let me tell you again. In this game, the content IS THE SKINS and COSMETICS.

You are just failed to realise that there is ALWAYS something which is motivating players : This is content.

However, when this content (getting cool skins) is just a big GRIND fest, its called a GRIND game.

This wouldnt be the case if there would be anything else to do. OR if you could do this like I said: without grind.

That would be easy. Instead of the karma grind they could do that way:

For the helmet example you need to do certain dynamic events, and get items from each -> combine in mystic forge -> get head token.

Nothing has changed, expect that I dont have to FARM the same dynamic events all around the world for insane amount of karma.

---

Dungeon runs -> 1 run / piece -> still a challenge but I dont have to grind all over and over again.

—

Thats it example.

Once again you’d be back in a week complaining about lack of content if you got 1 piece/run

You DON’T have to grind for that armor, it’s not in any way needed to experience the game. Yes, it’s a grind. Don’t like it? Don’t do it

Athem.7321:

Sigh…let me tell you again. In this game, the content IS THE SKINS and COSMETICS.

You are just failed to realise that there is ALWAYS something which is motivating players : This is content.

However, when this content (getting cool skins) is just a big GRIND fest, its called a GRIND game.

This wouldnt be the case if there would be anything else to do. OR if you could do this like I said: without grind.

That would be easy. Instead of the karma grind they could do that way:

For the helmet example you need to do certain dynamic events, and get items from each -> combine in mystic forge -> get head token.

Nothing has changed, expect that I dont have to FARM the same dynamic events all around the world for insane amount of karma.

---

Dungeon runs -> 1 run / piece -> still a challenge but I dont have to grind all over and over again.

—

Thats it example.

There is only a grind if you make it one. Let’s say they do make it your way with 1 run – 1 piece of gear, that alone shows you want everything with little to no effort but we will skip that for now. 5 runs and you now have the gear you wanted, can be done in half a days work. Now what are you going to do? You’re not going to help anyone else go through that dungeon to get their set because you consider that to be a “grind”. Since it only takes 5 runs everyone else in the game will have that same look in a matter of days, which means it is no longer prestigious. You are now bored and quit.

If you want a game like that then DON’T play a MMO. If you think the amount of time it takes to get anything in this game, short of a Legendary, is anything close to a Korean grind fest game then you have NEVER played a grind fest game! It’s that simple.

You can get exotic gear quickly without huge grinds — I had enough gold to buy a set when I hit 80 (not through gem selling), and many other people crafted their sets (there are many people crafting and selling them, too, getting a tidy profit in the process). That’s your baseline effectiveness there.

If you want a certain look, then yes you’re going to grind for it. It will time-consuming. That’s the point. Arena never said that there wouldn’t be grinding for prestige looks. They said that there wouldn’t be grinding for the baseline level 80 power set, and that’s accurate. It’s the same approach as with GW1. If, however, you are grinding for dungeon sets as your baseline level 80 power set, you are simply doing it wrong.

Athem.7321:

Dear Arenanet!

When I bought this game you were all over around the grind topic:

-No grinding!
-Anti-grind game!
-Fun > Grind!

Yet what we got? A typical GRIND game. I’m not mad.. I think its a fun single player game 1-80, but after that… Well yeah!

Where is the content everywhere thing? Where is the epic Orr you promised? Orr is just a place with bugged events and fastly spawning risens.

• What did I expect from Orr?
  -Epic events.
  -Good story.
  -Epic fights.

• What did I got from Orr?
  -Bugged events.
  -Sometimes a story.
  -Herpkittenmass spawn fights.

• What did I expect from lvl80?
  -Going around the world, enjoying the game with my friends!
  -Clearing dungeons, getting all sets having fun.
  -Crafting cool stuffs.
  -Trying to get legendary weapon.
  -PvP and WWW with friends.

• What did I got from lvl80?
  -Grinding around the world. After 30min, you are not even allowed to grind.
  -Killing the 3 dragon all over and over again.
  -Clearing dungeons once -> Looking at set prices -> Giving up on all sets. Not having fun.
  -Crafting the same stuffs…or not. Its not even worthy! Selling the mats is just more worthy.
  -PvP alone because there is no join as a team options.
  -WWW with friends if we are lucky to get in together.

I’m just curious because why not… Shall we expect some changes about these subjects? Will you make this game more fun than game oriented, or you just leave this as it is?

Honestly, I did enjoy the game 1-80, but after that, my western style sweet dream mmo goes into a korean style nightmare mmo!

Oh and this is not a QQ, it worth every cent I spent on this game, because that was fun. So just tell me… Is there any chance that I will have fun in this game in the future instead of grinding?

If you’re GRINDING at lvl 80 it’s because you CHOOSE to grind since it is NOT REQUIRED. Anet stated there would be no grind and from 1 to 80 and the max gear there IS NO GRIND. What you call a GRIND is an OPTION not a REQUIREMENT thus you CHOOSE to GRIND and COMPLAIN about it. What did you think they would do? Hand you EVERYTHING in the game in a few weeks time? LMAO hahaha Sorry but if you want EXOTICS and other ELITE GEAR you WILL GRIND for that but of course IT IS OPTIONAL NOT REQUIRED.

Well, adressing OP concerns:

PVP in teams.

Add your friends to your friend list. Hit “y” to call the said friend list. Have a friend join a Conquest Map (BG) that has room for you and whoelse you want to play with.
Right click his name and choose “join him in pvp or something along the side of it”.

Alternativally, WvWvW or tournaments.

PVE:
Dont grind. Go explore, go see new events, go watch new stories. You’ll earn karma and what not, I promisse.

Of course I would be back in a week if the ONLY THING in this game would be farm out dungeon set, but at least: I COULD DO THAT!

That would be still more fun than not able to EVEN that. So basicly, you are saying, if there would be tons of content, that would be pointless. Why? Because I would be back in 3 months to complain that there is not content?

No content last forever.

Thats why they have to do these first. Example: 1piece/gear dungeons = 1 week of content.

DE + quest gear tokens → 1 week of content. That would mean that they have 2 week with full of content!

Better than the one right now? YUP! Will they have to work to implement more content? SURE!

Once again…content wont make itself, and GRIND IS NOT CONTENT.

Redfeather.6401:

Game don’t need grind to increase it’s longevity.
It especially don’t need grind in ways that sub-based games do it, when sub-based games do it for a very specific reason.

??? Yeh PvP content keeps on giving, but PvE will run dry and all of these ppl will go back to WoW, which would be bad for the cash shop since nearly all the cash shop items are targeted and PvE’rs.

Reihert.1509:

Well, adressing OP concerns:

PVP in teams.

Add your friends to your friend list. Hit “y” to call the said friend list. Have a friend join a Conquest Map (BG) that has room for you and whoelse you want to play with.
Right click his name and choose “join him in pvp or something along the side of it”.

Alternativally, WvWvW or tournaments.

PVE:
Dont grind. Go explore, go see new events, go watch new stories. You’ll earn karma and what not, I promisse.

I listened to ppl like you and had NO FUN, the games stories are really bland and all the content is extremely easy and not challenging. This game is not Skyrim, it is meant to be played at a brisk pace or you will see the same freaking “world shattering” DE spawn 30 times within an hour.

Athem.7321:

Of course I would be back in a week if the ONLY THING in this game would be farm out dungeon set, but at least: I COULD DO THAT!

That would be still more fun than not able to EVEN that. So basicly, you are saying, if there would be tons of content, that would be pointless. Why? Because I would be back in 3 months to complain that there is not content?

No content last forever.

Thats why they have to do these first. Example: 1piece/gear dungeons = 1 week of content.

DE + quest gear tokens -> 1 week of content. That would mean that they have 2 week with full of content!

Better than the one right now? YUP! Will they have to work to implement more content? SURE!

Once again…content wont make itself, and GRIND IS NOT CONTENT.

1. I never said such a thing – I said your suggested model would have you running back here and complaining in a week. It’s a bad idea

2. You don’t need that armor so don’t farm it if it’s a grind to you

3. Longterm goals like grinding a set of armor is content and some people enjoy having something like that to strive for

ravinhood.3981:

If you’re GRINDING at lvl 80 it’s because you CHOOSE to grind since it is NOT REQUIRED. Anet stated there would be no grind and from 1 to 80 and the max gear there IS NO GRIND. What you call a GRIND is an OPTION not a REQUIREMENT thus you CHOOSE to GRIND and COMPLAIN about it. What did you think they would do? Hand you EVERYTHING in the game in a few weeks time? LMAO hahaha Sorry but if you want EXOTICS and other ELITE GEAR you WILL GRIND for that but of course IT IS OPTIONAL NOT REQUIRED.

This is the typical fanboy answer. If that game would be Aion.

Do you forced to get new gear to play the game after lvl 55 (or 60?) ? No..you are not! Are you forced to grind? Yeah, if you want to do something in the game, YOU HAVE TO GRIND.

Wanna play Gw2 after lvl80? You are forced to grind. Is that a fact? Yup it is.

About pvp:

Try to join as a group in sPvP if you just want to have fun, and not going tournament. Gl
———
About dynamic events around the world:

I already see most of Tyria. I’m walking in a lvl80 crafted exotic gear seeking challanges. However, when you see that every event in the lower areas are:

• Stop the kentaurs
• Take back camps
• Protect that camp

It will be boring. Honestly, there are fun events in this game, but after you done that 3-4 times it lost its magic. Believe me, even dragon slaying is boring after the 3rd time, even if the Claw Of Jormag fight is pretty awesome.

Athem.7321:

ravinhood.3981:

If you’re GRINDING at lvl 80 it’s because you CHOOSE to grind since it is NOT REQUIRED. Anet stated there would be no grind and from 1 to 80 and the max gear there IS NO GRIND. What you call a GRIND is an OPTION not a REQUIREMENT thus you CHOOSE to GRIND and COMPLAIN about it. What did you think they would do? Hand you EVERYTHING in the game in a few weeks time? LMAO hahaha Sorry but if you want EXOTICS and other ELITE GEAR you WILL GRIND for that but of course IT IS OPTIONAL NOT REQUIRED.

This is the typical fanboy answer. If that game would be Aion.

Do you forced to get new gear to play the game after lvl 55 (or 60?) ? No..you are not! Are you forced to grind? Yeah, if you want to do something in the game, YOU HAVE TO GRIND.

Wanna play Gw2 after lvl80? You are forced to grind. Is that a fact? Yup it is.

---

About pvp:

Try to join as a group in sPvP if you just want to have fun, and not going tournament. Gl

If you’re incapable of arguing your point of view without resorting to insults like fanboy (which you’ve used several times now in this thread) you really shouldn’t post because it does nothing to get your points across

Hehe if not a QQ’er or noob, you are a fanboi.. :/
But I might be a fanboi, but I find the game funny.. Guilty, not explored stuff 100% or reached lvl 80 yet… I take my time to get there.. And I think this game might have been build around casual players like me:) the stuff of legend and dungeons for more hardcore players, sPvP for players who likes a fair pvp-battle (to those who cries about warriors or thieves, go reroll-__-) and WvW to dedicated guilds:)

I was once told, if something is boring you are not looking e right place.. i find it to be true.. Sure you might get banned:D but you can always find a way to make the game funnier without it has to be official implamented:)
Though that might be others things ere are funnier.. Then go do those things for the love of gods xD work-out, party (not encouraging drinking here), run with your friends, read a book, draw something (not the app.. Or maybe), drool on facebook.. Anything:)

Cause I don’t think your problem is wether or not the is grinding, but you just not seeing the fun aspect in the game:/ So you might go back to wow (thibk it is just another side of the coin imo) or do something else:D

And a side note- what did you expect? Ofc fanbois or girls gonna disagree, ofc you will find noobs and QQ’ers.. This is the forums of a game after all^^

i use way too much time here:0

My opinion on the whole dungeon finder / dungeon grind topic:

A. Re-tool the LFG system; We don’t want to “look for a group”, we want to “look for something fun to do”. Let the groups just naturally organize around the event.

1. Let the players subscribe to notifications of server-wide PVE events. Let us know when the centaurs are acting up in Hirathi Highlands, or when the Splintered Coast is seeing increased activity and that Tequatl’s approach is imminent. Let us know if the Citadel of Flame is under Flame Legion control or that Zojja needs our help at the Crusible of Eternity.

2. Incentivise revisiting certain lowly populated maps. Perhaps in the new “LFG” tool, we can show a priority call for action letting us know when the Durmand Priory’s forces are low (there are too few players on the map), or when (and where) the forces of Tyria are planning an attack on Zhaitan’s forces on Orr and need our help. Increase the magic item drop rate for these troubled zones.

3. Let the user queue up for dungeons that we want to queue up for. I have read that the development staff have no intentions on doing this, but I just cannot see how this would have any negative impact on the gameplay or the user experience.

B. Poop-Can the need to run a dungeon 46 times for one set of gear. This is just ridiculous and I don’t even know how this made the cut. I have a couple of ideas on how to fix this:

1. Dungeon vendors only become available after a player has completed at least 2 explorable modes. At that point, those vendors accept karma (poop-can the dungeon tokens).

2. Make dungeon tokens universal across all the different dungeons, and set it so that when a player completes a majority of the explorable dungeons, they have been rewarded with enough “dungeon currency” to purchase a single armor set.

Athem.7321:

What we are doing here is GRIND, this mmo is turning into a korean grindfest. Throw me the rocks, but WoW doesnt have that kind of system. You dont have to grind for anything. (Well, if you have to grind, you dont have to do that much.)

HAHAHAAHAH
So in WoW u dont have to beat the raid once and then farm it 30 times for gear upgrade , cause u need any tiny dps increase to move to the next tier – raid ?
While in GW2 , cosmetic grind u think is a <<must>> to enjoy the game ?
Hahahahahaahahah !
I wish the 25 september could come faster :P

Edit: there might be 13% increase in stats , but do they scale 100% ? :P

Killthehealersffs.8940:

HAHAHAAHAH
So in WoW u dont have to beat the raid once and then farm it 30 times for gear upgrade , cause u need any tiny dps increase to move to the next tier – raid ?
While in GW2 , cosmetic grind u think is a <<must>> to enjoy the game ?
Hahahahahaahahah !
I wish the 25 september could come faster :P

I dont understand your arguement. I’m talking about running 46 times the SAME dungeon is INSANE. Yeah even WoW is more "rewarding " comparing to that.

Please do wait for MoP release, because you will be happy if only the small group of very happy ppl will stay here right? So no one will complain, everybody will be happy and kiss Arenanet.

Athem.7321:

I dont understand your arguement. I’m talking about running 46 times the SAME dungeon is INSANE. Yeah even WoW is more "rewarding " comparing to that.

The dungeon set is going anywhere ?
Does it matter if u get the set in 10 days or 2 years ?

Athem.7321:

Killthehealersffs.8940:

HAHAHAAHAH
So in WoW u dont have to beat the raid once and then farm it 30 times for gear upgrade , cause u need any tiny dps increase to move to the next tier – raid ?
While in GW2 , cosmetic grind u think is a <<must>> to enjoy the game ?
Hahahahahaahahah !
I wish the 25 september could come faster :P

I dont understand your arguement. I’m talking about running 46 times the SAME dungeon is INSANE. Yeah even WoW is more "rewarding " comparing to that.

The number is being reduced, you’re aware of that, right? More tokens are going to be rewarded so the grind will be faster. But it won’t be “run it twice and get the most prestige armor in the game” either. That would be silly.

Artorous.8573:

People, as a whole, need a carrot to chase after. With no carrot they get bored, go plop down on the couch, then turn the TV on. Without a “grind”, which is generally only a grind if you make it such, there really is no longevity. There is no way a game company can create a game with an unlimited amount of content to please everyone. If there isn’t anything to chase after, even in a sandbox MMO, you will eventually get bored and move on.

the only way would have been to have a player led endgame content.
something inspired by EVE.
the top players “define” the game by battling it out at top, and hiring lower players to do their chores.
like; hunt this and bring it back, go kill that many soldiers from that guys army etc

GW2 is amazing in its own right as a spectacular action mmorpg.
but it isnt a revolution in the genre.
still 9/10 for GW2 as its a hell of a fun and make skyrim look small!

at one point, just pvp or wvwvw or whatever you feel like doing, youll get reward with time.
but if feel like youre getting addicted to grinding, youre not helping yourself.

Avatar.1923:

at one point, just pvp or wvwvw or whatever you feel like doing, youll get reward with time.
but if feel like youre getting addicted to grinding, youre not helping yourself.

And if you don’t like this thing you keep referring to as “grinding” then you are playing the wrong genre of games. If you want instant rewards then go play a single player game. MMO’s are designed with “grind” as there is a finite amount of content yet the game is persistent.