Guild Wars 2

I know that guild wars two doesn’t have the holy trinity and instead they have damage, support, and control, but i was wondering which each one specifically is and some example classes for each? Thanks.

well all classes do all three, some just have a different flavor or emphasis over others…

damage is usually direct or condition (via bleeds, burns, poison, confusion). There’s supposed to be pros/cons to the two, but sofar direct > condition in most people’s view.

support can be a whole variety of stuff like providing boons, putting certain conditions on an enemy (like blind, daze, weaken, etc.), or utilities like reflect walls and condition removals and such.

control is what it means, CC…. slows, immobilizes, and knockdowns/interrupts.

Here’s an example:

My guardian using a hammer.

I put down a field (say the #5 skill). It stops foes from moving (when it works). I do damage. If I crit, I give a boon to nearby allies. Giving the boon to them heals me.

So one button press and I do damage support control as well as tank/heal.

Like Bruno says, all the classes can do all three, to some extent. But here’s some basic examples:

Damage – Elementalists can be great at Area of Effect damage, whereas many Thief builds excel at single-target damage spikes.

Support – Guardians have some healing, and provide Aegis to block attacks. Thieves can block attacks with Blind and projectiles with Smokescreen. Engineers are great at stacking lots of Might (damage increase) on people, etc.

Control – I don’t know a lot of great examples of lots this all in one place, but if you run an Engineer with a rifle and a net turret they can get 4 immobilizes before you have to wait for any cooldowns. (Shoot net gun, toolbelt net, place net turret, overcharge net turret.)

Just about every profession is capable of performing any of those roles. That being said, some are better than others at certain things.

IMO, building a character with a nice mix of all three (as fits your playstyle) seems to work quite well.

For example, Guardians are generally looked at as the ultimate support class, and it’s hard to argue with that. They have so many abilities that heal, give boons, etc., that they can be pigeonholed into a support role, but Guardian damage isn’t exactly bad, either.

Warriors (since there aren’t “tanks”) tend to be looked at as straight damage dealers, but they have many support-y abilities as well (shouts & banners come to mind)

What worked for me was to choose a class (Elementalist here), and then to choose a weapon that fit my playstyle (dagger/dagger is the kittens’ kitten), then choose traits & gear that work well with that weapon set, then pick utility skills that shored up some of the weaknesses the character had, both in design and in my style of play.

Long story short, I don’t really concern myself with what “role” I’m filling, but more with how I want to play.

Hope this helps.

Theif-Guardian-Mesmer. With ele being an honorary 4th. Frankly, those three classes can all do fantastic things in world PvE, dungeons, Spvp, Tpvp and WvW. Other classes do other things, sure, but none match the power and evasiveness of theif. The durability and support of Guardian. And the just plain wtfbbq aoe stealth and aoe haste and aoe teleport and 3 clone army of mesmer.

I think yall are missing the point. A well-built character isn’t one or the other.

My guardian, once per every foe (except that the auto-refresh is often bugged), trigger Virtue of Justice. This gives a big burn on the next hit of all allies. It also inflicts blind on opponents in the area.

So one button press, not even on the global cooldown, and I do all 3 functions (damage, support, control) at the same time.

Engineer bombs that heal — all three functions at once. Etcetera.

If you’re doing it right, you’re doing it all.

Here is how the game currently runs.
Support: Heals you barely feel, abilities that barely help you.
Control: Pointless.
Damage: Melee gets one shot, dodging still doesn’t work. Ranged is actually mandatory
Arenanet should just implement healers already, getting one shot isn’t fun, nor is laying on the ground throwing trash at your target then hopelessly dying like a fragile child ripe for slaughter. Dying on your feet is the way to go, fight to survive mechanic is inconvenient. Also do not say “L2play” it’s the bitter truth, the combat in this game is flawed and do not get me wrong I love the hell out of this game, played over 850 hours, savouring the greatness this game has to offer.

Nightarch.2943:

Here is how the game currently runs.
Support: Heals you barely feel, abilities that barely help you.
Control: Pointless.
Damage: Melee gets one shot, dodging still doesn’t work. Ranged is actually mandatory
Arenanet should just implement healers already, getting one shot isn’t fun, nor is laying on the ground throwing trash at your target then hopelessly dying like a fragile child ripe for slaughter. Dying on your feet is the way to go, fight to survive mechanic is inconvenient. Also do not say “L2play” it’s the bitter truth, the combat in this game is flawed and do not get me wrong I love the hell out of this game, played over 850 hours, savouring the greatness this game has to offer.

I honestly have no idea what you are talking about! Combat works like a charm, its dynamic and action-like, not like in other MMOs where you just sit in place and spam buttons.
Haters gonna hate i guess…

Antitheist.5306:

Long story short, I don’t really concern myself with what “role” I’m filling, but more with how I want to play.

My approach as well-and probably more in tune with the game’s combat design.
I have no issue with people wanting to play however they want-if they want to do “maximum damage”, so be it-if they want to heal/support while attacking, that’s perfectly awesome as well, as long as it fits their playstyle, because when we have fun, we tend to play at our best too.

You can make each profession into any role, but they way they go about doing so is totally different.

Take a ranger for example. If they wanted to go party support, they could use spirits that (when traited) run after them buffing all allies in the vicinity. On the other hand, an elementalist could use something like the Elemental Attunement trait to buff nearby allies whenever they switch attunements. then again, a warrior could do so by shouting at his allies and placing banners.

The professions are just different way of being able to perfom the various roles.

Nightarch.2943:

Control: Pointless.

sPvP 1v1.
Your best character vs. my thief.

My “lol mad immobilizes yo” build will show you just how ‘pointless’ control is. (When you can’t ever move because you’re always immobilized, I mean.)

Nightarch.2943:

Here is how the game currently runs.
Support: Heals you barely feel, abilities that barely help you.
Control: Pointless.
Damage: Melee gets one shot, dodging still doesn’t work. Ranged is actually mandatory
Arenanet should just implement healers already, getting one shot isn’t fun, nor is laying on the ground throwing trash at your target then hopelessly dying like a fragile child ripe for slaughter. Dying on your feet is the way to go, fight to survive mechanic is inconvenient. Also do not say “L2play” it’s the bitter truth, the combat in this game is flawed and do not get me wrong I love the hell out of this game, played over 850 hours, savouring the greatness this game has to offer.

I offer you hope. Do you remember when Anet didn’t make grindy games and then three months in they say “GW2 can have gradual stat progression without being a gear treadmill game”? Right, vertical progression is just another way of saying a gear grind. I would not be surprised, at all, if we see professions (or builds within professions) become more specialized in terms of tanking and healing over time. I would even bet that we see movement in this direction in the Jan/Feb timeframe. It will probably start with a taunt and a significant direct heal.

Edit: There will probably be no change in the nomenclature. They will say that we can have taunts without having tanks, and significant healing without having healers.

DaMunky.6302:

Nightarch.2943:

Control: Pointless.

sPvP 1v1.
Your best character vs. my thief.

My “lol mad immobilizes yo” build will show you just how ‘pointless’ control is. (When you can’t ever move because you’re always immobilized, I mean.)

That is one thing to keep in mind, the game is balanced with a focus on sPVP rather than PVE/WVW. End result is that things that looks pointless in PVE can be very effective in sPVP.

This in part because sPVP is focused on short intense battles, while PVE usually end up with lengthy grinding battles (in large part thanks to bigger mobs having scaling health pools and innate resistance to controls). As such, heals are weak, damage is abundant, and controls are short duration with long cooldown.

Bruno Sardine.2907:

well all classes do all three, some just have a different flavor or emphasis over others…

damage is usually direct or condition (via bleeds, burns, poison, confusion). There’s supposed to be pros/cons to the two, but sofar direct > condition in most people’s view.

support can be a whole variety of stuff like providing boons, putting certain conditions on an enemy (like blind, daze, weaken, etc.), or utilities like reflect walls and condition removals and such.

control is what it means, CC…. slows, immobilizes, and knockdowns/interrupts.

Control also often means “Getting aggro” while also “staying alive.” That’s how I built my guardian, and he does a pretty decent job of it. I just finished the gear conversion from support, and I’m still learning the new playstyle.

Basically it’s a combination of booning yourself, stacking vitality, toughness, and power, and learning to avoid incoming damage while still dealing enough to keep the enemies chasing you. It seems VERY easy to get aggro, but I’m still learning how to not get downed at least once or twice per dungeon. Getting better though! Only been at it for like three days.

http://www.noxxic.com/gw2/guardian/control/pve

Another note: I was full healing/support before, and I’ve already found that control is a better way to keep people alive. If you can keep the enemies off our teammates, they have a much better chance of surviving than if you threw out a few heals.

The nice thing about a control guardian build is also that you still get some decent AOE healing abilities. Any time I use a signet or virtue, everyone around me gets healed. If I hit all 6 (3 virtues, 3 signets) rapidly, everyone’s health goes up by about 50%, including my own.

Best i can tell, damage done is very far down the ladder of reasons for a mob to target you over someone else. Heavy toughness, proximity, just being a certain profession (guardians mostly) and carrying a a shield seems to all take priority over damage dealt. For instance, i have yet to see a mob get pulled off someone in downed state by doing damage on said mob.

digiowl.9620:

Best i can tell, damage done is very far down the latter of reasons for a mob to target you over someone else. Heavy toughness, proximity, just being a certain profession (guardians mostly) and carrying a a shield seems to all take priority over damage dealt. For instance, i have yet to see a mob get pulled off someone in downed state by doing damage on said mob.

Totally agreed. We don’t know the exact math on it, but I know when I converted everything to toughness and vitality, the mobs stick to me like glue now. When I stacked healing power and vitality, they weren’t even interested in me. My power level stayed pretty much constant in the conversion.

That “screams” that toughness is a huge booster of threat. A lot of people in-game pretty much sell toughness as “the thing” when it comes to threat generation, and I’m surprised I’ve seen so little forum talk on the subject.

I’ve had a couple times in the past couple days where I was AFK for a second in a dungeon, my group engaged some enemies, and the enemies ran AWAY from them, and attacked ME…who wasn’t even playing at the moment.

I’ve also heard that wielding a shield increases threat, but my GS and I haven’t had any trouble on that topic.

I’m running 1860 toughness right now, btw. I’m thinking of losing my signets of the pack (i have them on all 6 gear pieces) and replacing them with something that boosts toughness and/or vitality.

digiowl.9620:

Best i can tell, damage done is very far down the ladder of reasons for a mob to target you over someone else. Heavy toughness, proximity, just being a certain profession (guardians mostly) and carrying a a shield seems to all take priority over damage dealt. For instance, i have yet to see a mob get pulled off someone in downed state by doing damage on said mob.

Yes, it’s a bit of a mystery at present and hate/aggro would have to be refined to move to a more trinitarian form. Damage usually functions as a ‘taunt’ (highest on the threat meter) and doesn’t in GW2.

It also seems that mobs often bypass a ranger pet or mesmer clone even tho they where what initiated the fight, and the ranger or mesmer has their auto attack disabled (meaning no damage done by them on the mob).

Hickeroar.9734:

I’ve also heard that wielding a shield increases threat, but my GS and I haven’t had any trouble on that topic.

Had this weird episode with a champion devourer while playing an engineer with shield.

I came late to the fight and stuck as far back as i could, but even so the devourer started lobbing rocks my way fairly soon. Had it not dawned on me that i could use one of the shield skills to send those rocks back i would have spent a whole lot of that fight dodging circles.

Nightarch.2943:

Here is how the game currently runs.
Support: Heals you barely feel, abilities that barely help you.
Control: Pointless.
Damage: Melee gets one shot, dodging still doesn’t work. Ranged is actually mandatory
Arenanet should just implement healers already, getting one shot isn’t fun, nor is laying on the ground throwing trash at your target then hopelessly dying like a fragile child ripe for slaughter. Dying on your feet is the way to go, fight to survive mechanic is inconvenient. Also do not say “L2play” it’s the bitter truth, the combat in this game is flawed and do not get me wrong I love the hell out of this game, played over 850 hours, savouring the greatness this game has to offer.

^ Lol.
My guardian is all support and I can happily say that my group can feel my heals, considering they don’t die, though sometimes come close.
Got a warrior in the group who does the ‘tanking’ (I know there is no specific role, but it’s the same kind of thing), and control, and allows the rest of us to do our thang.
As for damage, my warrior can run in and melee with crits proc’ing frequently between 12 and 24k. If you know your class (that includes core skills, traits etc) and pay attention to the animations, then it’s fairly easy to see when a boss is going to do something and be able to react accordingly.

If you’re getting one shot, then perhaps there is a problem with the group(s) you’re running with, your gear or skills of your character.

Bah… Am I the only one that sees the lack of a “holy trinity” as the freedom to play however you want? You don’t need a certain build or profession to complete a dungeon.

As for “threat”:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Aggro

EDIT: This is much better in explaining the diversity in the mechanics:
http://gw2ita.wordpress.com/review/interview-with-colin-johanson-by-mmorpgitalia-and-gw2-italian-blog/

Nightarch.2943:

Here is how the game currently runs.
Support: Heals you barely feel, abilities that barely help you.
Control: Pointless.
Damage: Melee gets one shot, dodging still doesn’t work. Ranged is actually mandatory
Arenanet should just implement healers already, getting one shot isn’t fun, nor is laying on the ground throwing trash at your target then hopelessly dying like a fragile child ripe for slaughter. Dying on your feet is the way to go, fight to survive mechanic is inconvenient. Also do not say “L2play” it’s the bitter truth, the combat in this game is flawed and do not get me wrong I love the hell out of this game, played over 850 hours, savouring the greatness this game has to offer.

Oddly, in PuGs everybody is in a mess, playing mostly ranged weapons (by my experience). It’s hard for me as a Guardian to buff my team up.
Whereas with my usual mates, we all tend to stay at melee range. I mean even ranger/GS mesmer/necro/staff ele.
And guess where fights are the easiest? The answer is when everybody is packed-up and all your team stacks 20-25 times might, 30sec of fury, protection 100% uptime etc.

So I feel sorry for you if you get OS but you probably handle the game wrongly and you should learn the game you play to fully enjoy it.

The only point I agree with is the “control”. Usually you just go DPS until the things die. But I feel quite ok with it because of the annoying 1 sec + casting time on CC spells.

Currently I love GW2 combat system because it’s dynamic and everyone has the same role. But TBH it’s not balanced and that makes the game easy : go with 2 Guardians and 3 Warriors and you’ll spank hard.

I don’t know what is with all you peopel calling GW2 combat “dynamic” because it really isn’t it’s a simple multi-target comabt system where you attack things infront of you rather than a single target.

This is dynamic : http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=y0b1V3eapZc#t=119s

People need to stop fouling themselves into thinking GW2 combat is so revoluntionary.