Guild Wars 2

Am I the only one who is REALLY disappointed in Guild Wars 2 mechanic wise? Don’t get me wrong, i still enjoy the game, just not even remotely close the fun i got out of the original. When they released the skill/weapon sets for the game it broke my heart.:(

P.S. Have they(ANet) mentioned why the didn’t make the skill bar at least similar to the original?

It’s more of because they advertised it as a Guild Wars sequel, that’s where they went wrong. They wanted to create a different game, which is fine, but when you set up the wrong expectations for players to hope for, then disappointment soon follows.

It’s really a continuation of lore, everything else design wise is completely different

It’s a generic fantasy grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

EDIT: I have removed the word “Korean”, as being owned by NCSoft and having the sequel largely dictated by them has absolutely Not Changed the direction of the game.

At All.

Nope.

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

LMAO! Really?

Because I’ve played some Korean grinders…they’re nothing like that at all.

Vayne.8563:

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

LMAO! Really?

Because I’ve played some Korean grinders…they’re nothing like that at all.

Ah yes, in comes Vayne, and The People Shall Start Singing Patriotic ArenaNET Songs.

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

LMAO! Really?

Because I’ve played some Korean grinders…they’re nothing like that at all.

Ah yes, in comes Vayne, and The People Shall Start Singing Patriotic ArenaNET Songs.

I can be right and still be a Guild Wars 2 fan. How long does it take to hit max level in a korean grinder. Because that’s what people are usually talking about when they use the term korean grinder. There’s no way to level in a day through crafting, for example, in a Korean grinder. Perhaps you’ve never actually played one. Leveling takes forever.

And making fun of me, just because your argument has little merit, doesn’t make you right.

Vayne.8563:

And making fun of me, just because your argument has little merit, doesn’t make you right.

You mentioned to everyone yesterday that you don’t care what we all think of you.

However, you’ll need to press F 150 times before any of us actually pay attention to you beyond laughing.

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

And making fun of me, just because your argument has little merit, doesn’t make you right.

You mentioned to everyone yesterday that you don’t care what we all think of you.

However, you’ll need to press F 150 times before any of us actually pay attention to you beyond laughing.

I don’t care what you think. I don’t post on the forums to talk to you. I post on the forums, mostly, to talk to those who lurk on the forums. I said that too.

I’m never going to change your mind about anything. I wouldn’t even try. But to allow you to say something that is completely inaccurate without rebutting it, might lead someone to believe that you’re right, when your’e quite demonstrably wrong.

Vayne.8563:

when your’e quite demonstrably wrong.

300 holos (spam 1)

150 pinatas (spam F)

250 candies (spam doubleclick)

50 effigies (Spam F then esc)

and that’s just the current “event”.

And as usual, there’s no backstory to any of this. Why the hell are pinatas around? They don’t even remotely fit the lore. Why Holograms?

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

when your’e quite demonstrably wrong.

300 holos (spam 1)

150 pinatas (spam F)

250 candies (spam doubleclick)

50 effigies (Spam F then esc)

and that’s just the current “event”.

And as usual, there’s no backstory to any of this. Why the hell are pinatas around? They don’t even remotely fit the lore. Why Holograms?

And you’re comparing this to a korean grinder? You should compare it instead to the titles in Guild Wars 1, like the lucky title, the luxon title, the treasure hunter title, then come back and talk to me.

Take the Treasure Hunter title as an example. For the treasure hunter title, you had to open 10,000 chests, which could only be opened with a lockpick that either dropped rarely or cost 1.5 plat. (Sometimes you could buy them cheaper from players at 1.2 plat).

Lockpicks would break quite frequently, depending on your lucky title bonus. In fact, you had more than a 2/3rds chance to break a lockpick when you were first starting out.

10,000 chests.

And the two grindiest bits of this you don’t have to do to get the holo wings. You don’t have to do say the 250 creatures, or the 50 effigies and you can still get the wings. I got the wings without doing the effigies.

So yeah, calling this a korean grinder based on those numbers isn’t correct.

Some one never reads or listens to anything NPCs have to say in-game, I fear.

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

when your’e quite demonstrably wrong.

300 holos (spam 1)

150 pinatas (spam F)

250 candies (spam doubleclick)

50 effigies (Spam F then esc)

and that’s just the current “event”.

And as usual, there’s no backstory to any of this. Why the hell are pinatas around? They don’t even remotely fit the lore. Why Holograms?

Dragon Bash…. Dragon pinatas that you bash…. are you even trying?

Sinoran.9140:

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

when your’e quite demonstrably wrong.

300 holos (spam 1)

150 pinatas (spam F)

250 candies (spam doubleclick)

50 effigies (Spam F then esc)

and that’s just the current “event”.

And as usual, there’s no backstory to any of this. Why the hell are pinatas around? They don’t even remotely fit the lore. Why Holograms?

Dragon Bash…. Dragon pinatas that you bash…. are you even trying?

Nah, Resonance isn’t trying. We all know there’s some story behind having a celebration to thumb our noses at the dragons, except him, apparently.

It’s clear that if the story isn’t spoodfed, some players won’t take the time to see what’s up. I blame the internet. lol

Vayne.8563:

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

LMAO! Really?

Because I’ve played some Korean grinders…they’re nothing like that at all.

IDK ANET sure had me fooled into thinking it was when i checked the Dragon Bash achievements (Must just be a 1 time deal when they went overboard right?).

Zepidel.5349:

Vayne.8563:

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

LMAO! Really?

Because I’ve played some Korean grinders…they’re nothing like that at all.

IDK ANET sure had me fooled into thinking it was when i checked the Dragon Bash achievements (Must just be a 1 time deal when they went overboard right?).

In a Korean grinder, it takes ages to level. Are you saying that due to this new content it takes ages to level?

Did you see my post about the treasure hunter title in Guild Wars 1?

/thread.

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

And making fun of me, just because your argument has little merit, doesn’t make you right.

You mentioned to everyone yesterday that you don’t care what we all think of you.

However, you’ll need to press F 150 times before any of us actually pay attention to you beyond laughing.

Whoa, personally attacking someone because they disagree with you? Since when did we take to personally attacking people who disagree with us?

I forum creep, ALOT, so I am aware of the view of Vayne by people like you, for him to keep stating his view despite you guys talking down to him, well, him be right or wrong he still seems to be the better guy.

We can have a proper discussion about that in a different topic/forum though.

Ontopic : If GW2 was to be like GW1 with more, then it would had just been an expansion, hell the title “The Dragons Awaken!” would had been fitting. Time skip or not. However, it was advertised as a sequel, not an expansion. Games change, GW1 was running for what? almost 10 years? I kinda figure even with a new expansion it would get stale after that amount of time (This is coming from a GW1 Vet).

Having a game with 3 different Camps, and an expansion that is that old, then releasing a new expansion ontop of it would NOT had been good, GW1 had been off of the market for way too long for it to ever be put back on, the only reason its still gaining profit anymore is because GW2 offers items if you go back and play GW1.

To the OP – what do you mean the skill bar similar to GW1? Just saying similar isn’t enough to warrant an “OK I understand what you mean” from my atleast.

As for the skills, while the discovery of them was fun and great, knowing what to use and be efficient was a NIGHTMARE for me as a new player. I knew what was cool, but then attempting to min/max that was a nightmare. Just because you had more opinions didn’t mean you had more Meta. Does it help for personality? Of course!

As for anyone claiming this to be a Korean Grinder…go play RO or GunZ and tell me that GW2 and those two games are equal in any way. Go, now. I dare you.

Back @ Res – So the whole Arah P4 was what? Walk through everything? So the Molten Dungeon was what?

Yes, you are right, the latest release was Fighting/Mech lite. But if you want to look at the worst of this situation, try looking at the best. We have a monthly updates, hell, it isn’t monthly at this point, they are releasing new “arcs” (if you will) daily right now. Each day I log into the game a new part for me to play. Isn’t that a “Mechanic” of its own? They showed us what they can do with cinematics.

I figured the whole switch from Dragon Fes → Bash was kinda given…the NPCs even explain it. Why celebrate dragons when they are killing everyone? So lets BASH them!Hince all the breakable things and all the burning/killing.

Vayne.8563:

Zepidel.5349:

Vayne.8563:

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

LMAO! Really?

Because I’ve played some Korean grinders…they’re nothing like that at all.

IDK ANET sure had me fooled into thinking it was when i checked the Dragon Bash achievements (Must just be a 1 time deal when they went overboard right?).

In a Korean grinder, it takes ages to level. Are you saying that due to this new content it takes ages to level?

Did you see my post about the treasure hunter title in Guild Wars 1?

/thread.

And how long did you have to get the TH title? Oh yeah, 7 years.

Truffles.4362:

Am I the only one who is REALLY disappointed in Guild Wars 2 mechanic wise? Don’t get me wrong, i still enjoy the game, just not even remotely close the fun i got out of the original. When they released the skill/weapon sets for the game it broke my heart.:(

P.S. Have they(ANet) mentioned why the didn’t make the skill bar at least similar to the original?

I agree with every word you said with the addition of why did they try to fix what wasn’t broken and just improved what was already used. +1 to ya.

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

when your’e quite demonstrably wrong.

300 holos (spam 1)

150 pinatas (spam F)

250 candies (spam doubleclick)

50 effigies (Spam F then esc)

and that’s just the current “event”.

Someone obviously hasn’t played a hardcore korean grindy game. For some oldschool reference, 1 week in guild wars 2 = max level. 1 week in Ragnarok Online (before they added all of the different classes, levels, back when highest level is 99, first gen maybe) = you’ll be lucky to hit second class change.

And the idea behind the term korean grinder? None of what you do has any value or point to it, you grind “just because”. The same applies here. Why do we need to kill 300 holograms? JUST CAUSE! Why break hundreds of pinatas? JUST CAUSE! (2)!.

Truffles.4362:

Am I the only one who is REALLY disappointed in Guild Wars 2 mechanic wise? Don’t get me wrong, i still enjoy the game, just not even remotely close the fun i got out of the original. When they released the skill/weapon sets for the game it broke my heart.:(

P.S. Have they(ANet) mentioned why the didn’t make the skill bar at least similar to the original?

This has been discussed a lot. The main thing that players seem to have concluded is that Anet attempted to appeal to a larger audience. The non mmo player audience by making the game a bit simplistic.

I think now and as time progresses they’ll see why this is kind of a big no no for MMOs. Appealing to casual audiences is more profitable in the opening weekend with the right amount of marketing, its a death to MMOs in the long run. I think as time progresses well see more and more players leave the game. We’ve been lucky and haven’t had major MMO releases since launch (MoP for WoW). I fear that if a new game comes around, all those casual players who haven’t already left/dont really play will leave to start a new adventure on another game. This is fine of course. Sadly, Anet has supplied enough content to keep hardcore players with the game. There are many problems with this game currently that is causing it to lose hardcore players (ones who play video games a lot). I fear that by the end of this year, if we dont see any improvements there will problem be a population spike for each living story addition, it will die off in a couple of days and return to a bit of a dead state. I think Anet is finally working on ways to get those hardcore players back into the game with the TC Lead Producer interview, but we’ll see how this does. Game was/is fun. I got my moneys worth as with many. I just fear for its longevitiy survival and ability to stand up against other MMOs that will be released into the market in the coming year/2years.

Resonance.4216:

And the idea behind the term korean grinder? None of what you do has any value or point to it, you grind “just because”. The same applies here. Why do we need to kill 300 holograms? JUST CAUSE! Why break hundreds of pinatas? JUST CAUSE! (2)!.

We have to kill 300 holograms, because if it gets people who want the achievement to log in. Pretty simple really. It’s part of a celebration. Breaking isn’t an achievement. Actually breaking 10,000 of them isn’t really an achievement either, except it shows some degree of dedication or at least stubbornness.

There are achievements of attrition on almost every MMO. Titles that are so hard to do only the craziest people will tackle them. They existed in Guild Wars 1, they exist in other games.

The question is, is killing 250 holos in a couple of weeks, or roughly 20 a day (when you get four from each dispenser…is it really that hard? Of course it isn’t. And of course you get increased chest drop rates which at least gives you a chance of something decent.

And the candy you get can be turned into a food that’s the equivalent of the very popular omonom berry bar, so it’s not like you can’t make some dragon cupcakes for yourself and maybe get some better drops while you’re farming if you use them.

I’m not sure breaking 250 of something over two weeks can be compared to a korean grinder. And if you want the holowings, you don’t even have to do the two grindiest achievements, because you can get the wings with 8 achievements instead of 10 now.

I think people don’t really know what grind is.

Guild Wars was superior mechanic wise to GW2. I’m not going to debate the skills, etc, because most of that has been gone over exhaustively already. Why is GW2 inferior? Stats on gear. This mechanic was a bone thrown towards the mainstream MMO crowd who have gotten used to the idea.

Many of the imbalances between builds and the discrepancy in PvE difficulty (or lack thereof ) for different players can be traced to the egregious damage done by berserker builds coupled with invulnerability mechanics. GW had very few stats on gear, and there was not a lot of variation in builds because of gear. ANet talked about the nightmare of balancing hundreds of skills in GW. In GW2 there is little PvE balance between builds/gear — and that problem did not exist in GW.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Guild Wars was superior mechanic wise to GW2. I’m not going to debate the skills, etc, because most of that has been gone over exhaustively already. Why is GW2 inferior? Stats on gear. This mechanic was a bone thrown towards the mainstream MMO crowd who have gotten used to the idea.

Many of the imbalances between builds and the discrepancy in PvE difficulty (or lack thereof ) for different players can be traced to the egregious damage done by berserker builds coupled with invulnerability mechanics. GW had very few stats on gear, and there was not a lot of variation in builds because of gear. ANet talked about the nightmare of balancing hundreds of skills in GW. In GW2 there is little PvE balance between builds/gear — and that problem did not exist in GW.

Sure, but other problems of a similar nature did, because of the number of skills and this was particularly compounded in PvE by the PvE only skills.

I mean there’s NOTHING in Guild Wars 2 like a permasin. There’s nothing like a party of level 8 ursans (though probably zerker warriors come pretty close). There’s nothing like dual 600 monks. There’s nothing like Sabway. There’s nothing like a dual discord build.

So yes, the problems that exist in Guild Wars 2 due to stats didn’t exist in Guild Wars 1, but the problems that existed in Guild Wars 1 due to dual classing and skills available were every bit as “bad”.

Vayne.8563:

I mean there’s NOTHING in Guild Wars 2 like a permasin. There’s nothing like a party of level 8 ursans (though probably zerker warriors come pretty close). There’s nothing like dual 600 monks. There’s nothing like Sabway. There’s nothing like a dual discord build.

I would dearly like to watch the current playerbase try to get their heads around 600/Smite, Permasins, or any of the more hilarious HA builds.

Resonance.4216:

It’s a generic fantasy korean grinder MMO that just happens to be set in Tyria.

Guild Wars 2 is neither generic nor korean and most certainly not a grinder. You’re trolling.

Must….stop…no….temptation…too…great…..

“Bashing the pinatas, singin my little song….skip skip skipping to the next pinata, Aieeeeeeeee!!!!! Holograms!!! But wait, they can’t be holograms because theyre hitting me! Aieeeee!!! I better kill exactly three hundred of these quickly for some reason. Great…now I can ignore those weid strangely physically tangible holograms that spawn exactly every five minutes in the same place and weren’t really bothering anyone. Back to the pinatas…..wait! Whats that? You want me to be part of an investigation? Well sure I will, I was busting these pinatas, because I LOVE candy…but I got a spare couple of minutes to investigate a crime. Aieeeeeee!!!!!!! SNECKIN SKY PIRATES!!!!!!!! Where the sneckery sneck did they come from! Ah well they’re all dead now”

etc etc etc

As for the skill system, it really makes sense in terms of balancing and learning curve. In Guild Wars prophecies, before factions, there were already so many skills that most people lost the overview, and this didn’t become better with factions and nightfall. By Eye of the North, 60% of the skills were so underpowered they might as well not exist. 20% was so overpowered they were the de facto standard build for every profession, with about 20% that was up for choice, if you could recognize them.

A.net successfully avoided that in Guild Wars 2. I strongly believe they should at least double the amount of utility and triple the elites in this game, but the basic system just works fine.

GW2 is nothing like a Korean grinder MMO, and I mean nothing. The term “grind” actually has a fairly wide definition in MMO’s and usually refers to killing things over and over, which is the term Anet seem to be going by when they say “no grinding”. However though, hitting things over and over, doing the same content over and over can also be a grind. GW2 grind compared to Korean mmo grind – GW2 is incredibly easy and short, it is a grind but not a difficult one. Pointless, not difficult. Standard Korean mmo grinds have a point but are difficult, usually involve grinding for months and months just to level, let alone endgame content.

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

I mean there’s NOTHING in Guild Wars 2 like a permasin. There’s nothing like a party of level 8 ursans (though probably zerker warriors come pretty close). There’s nothing like dual 600 monks. There’s nothing like Sabway. There’s nothing like a dual discord build.

I would dearly like to watch the current playerbase try to get their heads around 600/Smite, Permasins, or any of the more hilarious HA builds.

This is probably a valid comment. There’s certainly more skill involved in learning some of the Guild Wars 1 builds….HOWEVER…

You don’t have to learn anything to take a party of three heroes for the sabway build, for example, or some of the other builds. This is in the past when you could only have three heroes with you, of course, when now you can have 7.

But even when you could have three heroes with you and 4 henchies, I found that I didn’t even need to play in order to clear hard mode content. In other words, there was no skill involved in looking up team builds on PvX wiki for PvE and just playing like crap, because your heroes could kill for you.

lol i have to admit i almost thought i was grinding again with the new event, i guess i got so use to it that this game is non grinding mostly rewarding game constantly :P

I used to play korean grinding game fly for fun, took me in non experience event on the really higher level 1 hour to get maybe lol 2.5-5% of a level. However i was not Aoe but 1vs1 . Hitting the same kind of mob over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

Hillarious how stupid that was to play i guess big part of the motivation in game like that is not fun but reaching goals and put your mind to it completely like a zooooombieee

Truffles.4362:

Am I the only one who is REALLY disappointed in Guild Wars 2 mechanic wise? Don’t get me wrong, i still enjoy the game, just not even remotely close the fun i got out of the original. When they released the skill/weapon sets for the game it broke my heart.:(

P.S. Have they(ANet) mentioned why the didn’t make the skill bar at least similar to the original?

The potentional to completely build my own skillbar as in GW1 was indeed a huge letdown and personally I think the GW2 mesmer is a pretty poor followup to what the GW1 mesmer was.

And aside from all the ranting in the previous comments, there are grinds in this, huge ones, but they’re not obligatory to reach level 80, doesn’t mean they don’t exist tho.

Lue.6538:

Truffles.4362:

Am I the only one who is REALLY disappointed in Guild Wars 2 mechanic wise? Don’t get me wrong, i still enjoy the game, just not even remotely close the fun i got out of the original. When they released the skill/weapon sets for the game it broke my heart.:(

P.S. Have they(ANet) mentioned why the didn’t make the skill bar at least similar to the original?

The potentional to completely build my own skillbar as in GW1 was indeed a huge letdown and personally I think the GW2 mesmer is a pretty poor followup to what the GW1 mesmer was.

And aside from all the ranting in the previous comments, there are grinds in this, huge ones, but they’re not obligatory to reach level 80, doesn’t mean they don’t exist tho.

So are you saying there weren’t huge grinds in Guild Wars 1, because that seems to be the comparison.

I seem to remember a lot of FFF runs when I was there, People really did grind to get max Lightbringer, max Luxon, max Kurzick…people even ground (grinded) the Eye of the North titles.

Resonance.4216:

And the idea behind the term korean grinder? None of what you do has any value or point to it, you grind “just because”. The same applies here. Why do we need to kill 300 holograms? JUST CAUSE! Why break hundreds of pinatas? JUST CAUSE! (2)!.

Because you want an achievement. You can easily live without it, but you want it.

Vayne.8563:

Resonance.4216:

Vayne.8563:

I mean there’s NOTHING in Guild Wars 2 like a permasin. There’s nothing like a party of level 8 ursans (though probably zerker warriors come pretty close). There’s nothing like dual 600 monks. There’s nothing like Sabway. There’s nothing like a dual discord build.

I would dearly like to watch the current playerbase try to get their heads around 600/Smite, Permasins, or any of the more hilarious HA builds.

This is probably a valid comment. There’s certainly more skill involved in learning some of the Guild Wars 1 builds….HOWEVER…

Did I mention Sabway? No. And besides, after Discord came in, nobody ran Sabway.

Hello,

Since this thread has derailed with off-topic and inflammatory comments, it is now closed.

Thank you for your understanding.