downed state is bad for PVP
Guild wars 1 during its second anniversary
GW1 was a successful experiment that should have been continued, GW2 was a promising experiment at first that had great potential, but failed and ended up like every other generic mmo.
(1) GW1 combat played out much more tactically because of the dual-profession balancing act and the wide variety of skills to mix and match. GW1 put the emphasis on careful skill choice and thoughtful building. GW2 is a button-mashing, cooldown spamming, dodge-rolling, bump-and-grind that plays about as deep as a pizza pan.
(2) Anet wasn’t afraid of split balancing in GW1. fun, unbalanced skills for pve and more carefully refined skills for pvp. the “one size fits all” balancing philosophy of GW2 ends up butchering both pvp and pve and forces everyone into meta builds.
(3) GW1 eliminated the concept of “gear” by capping stats and item upgrades and strictly defining the roles of each profession. GW2’s poorly delineated profession roles allow every class to have a good heal and support role, which forces everyone into a zerker gear set to compete on DPS. in GW2, DPS is king, bottom line. they eliminated the “trinity” of mmos, and replaced it with a unity: all DPS, all the time.
(4) I don’t think I even need to mention how superior the writing and content in GW1 was compared to GW2. it simply goes without saying. in order to make another “me too” MMO, they had to throw in additional races, and instead of making one race with one solid, compelling story (GW1), they made five races with mediocre, forgettable stories.
(5) Cash shop business model. ’Nuff said. Quantity over quality (of cash shop items), and as long as that brings in the dough, real content (continents, professions, storylines) can go to hell. China is the perfect market for this type of business, and we can see that philosophy infecting the original (American/European) version of the game. NCsoft is just following the money here, and Anet pretty much has to oblige.
GW1 stands tall as a memorable game that did something different from the stagnant mmo market and succeeded. GW2 might make more money, but it will not be remembered because it succumbed to the same dumbed-down trends as every other modern mmo.
I’m glad more people are coming to realize how stale GW2 has become. ANet seriously needs to reconsider the Living Story idea because it’s not panning out. Now if that means hiring more people (yes we know your resources ate strained) then do it. NCSoft is posting huge profits so ask daddy for a loan if you need it.
(4) I don’t think I even need to mention how superior the writing and content in GW1 was compared to GW2. it simply goes without saying. in order to make another “me too” MMO, they had to throw in additional races, and instead of making one race with one solid, compelling story (GW1), they made five races with mediocre, forgettable stories.
The Nightfall campaign inspired me to become a writer. One published book and two more manuscripts in the works I’d say it’s been a very positive change. GW2’s writing is anything but. It feels commercial, overly simplified and not well thought out. Story drove the missions in GW1. You were immersed in the world, and you cared about your character. In GW2 you run kitten-boy errands for Trahearne. Your character means nothing in the personal story nor the Living Story. Now if you can’t connect with your character are you going to care about the world?
I’m glad more people are coming to realize how stale GW2 has become. ANet seriously needs to reconsider the Living Story idea because it’s not panning out. Now if that means hiring more people (yes we know your resources ate strained) then do it. NCSoft is posting huge profits so ask daddy for a loan if you need it.
(4) I don’t think I even need to mention how superior the writing and content in GW1 was compared to GW2. it simply goes without saying. in order to make another “me too” MMO, they had to throw in additional races, and instead of making one race with one solid, compelling story (GW1), they made five races with mediocre, forgettable stories.
The Nightfall campaign inspired me to become a writer. One published book and two more manuscripts in the works I’d say it’s been a very positive change. GW2’s writing is anything but. It feels commercial, overly simplified and not well thought out. Story drove the missions in GW1. You were immersed in the world, and you cared about your character. In GW2 you run kitten-boy errands for Trahearne. Your character means nothing in the personal story nor the Living Story. Now if you can’t connect with your character are you going to care about the world?
For a professional writer, I question your judgement. Saying that the story in Guild Wars 1 was some great story is more than just a little stretch. Most of the writing was okay. Many of the characters were completely cliche cardboard cutouts, and the plots really weren’t anything to write home about. I don’t know where this great writing came from, but through all of Guild Wars 1, all I remember is running around doing what someone else told me to do.
In the beginning it was Rurik, then the White Mantle, then the Shining Blade. Did I want to give the Scepter of Orr to the cheesy bad guy with the foreign accent. Or course not. He was the stereotypical bad guy with the Spanish accent. The stereotype made me laugh. Of course, at the time I was actually a writer, and saw these things. When you go back and look at that writing, you won’t find “great” writing. You’ll find enough writing there to drive the story forward.
Guild Wars 2’s writing is larger the same. In games like this, the writing always serves the story. The story doesn’t server the writing.
In Nightfall, first Sunspears told us what to do, then the Order of Whispers told me what to do, and in the end it wasn’t much different, don’t to following Komir around the Realm of Torment. We did all the work, she becomes a god. I’m thinking, wait a second, isn’t she the one that started this whole ball of wax. What’s so special about her?
In Factions we followed Togo around for the entire game and every step of it he told is what to do.
Maybe you’re not remembering that story as clearly as you think you are.
In GW1 we were a strong follower of very strong people. In GW2, we are the boss and killer of Zhaitan. I am a Mesmer and I can barely keep 3 clones/phantasms alive. Kasmeer and Anise can create 10 clones. I’m supposed to be the most powerful person around yet I feel underpowered. Also I’m supposed to be the boss and I keep following my gang around…
I don’t feel like the hero nor a pawn. I just happen to be there at the right time to witness the events.
Also as I stated on another topic, the fact that we barely have access to full customization of our characters does not make the game more interesting at all.
Guild leader of The Nephilim of Elysium.
Son of Elonia.
Son of Elonia.
There’s no such thing as making the game “right” the first time. Because different people have different rights. You’re so vested in your disappointment you can’t see that some people are disappointed and some aren’t, even even those who are, aren’t necessarily disappointed by the same thing. What percent of the playerbase was affected, do you think, by the Fractal reset?
Have you ever even looked at another MMORPG forum. They all look just like this one, unless the company deletes all negative posts.
It’s not the reset itself. It’s the lies. It’s the “we need to do this reset in order to implement leaderboards” which implied they had a system thought out and ready to implement.
It’s the fact that our progress was reset for nothing and leaderboards were just an excuse. That’s what I’m disappointed about.It’s the fact that they promise and don’t even bother to say " we won’t be able to do it, stuff has come up".
It’s the fact that they have good ideas in the past which they magically forget about only to add them back 2 years later after much player demand and act like they’ve reinvented the wheel.
Was it a lie or did the leaderboard get scrapped for a reason we don’t know about, or did it get put on the back burner? When it was said, was that the reason? Everyone always wants to say lie, but you know, sometimes situations change.
Either way, Anet should make a direct statement about it.
Yes – the reset was due to the leaderboards. That’s what they claimed.
Announcing Fractals of the Mists Leaderboards
Soon you can earn the envy and adulation of your friends and total strangers through our new leaderboards, which show off the players with the highest fractal levels! As part of the introduction of leaderboards, everyone whose current personal reward level for the Fractals of the Mists is above 30 will be reset to 30 so the competition can begin in earnest.
Source : https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/releases/november-26-2013/
So – they reset our levels in order to “start an earnest competition” that never started. And they never said why.
So either:
1)They lied from the get-go – knowing full well this wouldn’t happen.
2)They didn’t lie – but something came up with the leaderboards idea – which is not unheard of but then this begs the question : why didn’t we hear anything about it? Why didn’t they tell us anything?
I understand at one point they said they were finding it difficult to find criteria for the leaderboards – which means they reset our progress first and thought about it later. That’s sloppy. They didn’t have a working solution for a leaderboards but still used it as an excuse to reset our levels. And then didn’t bother with it anymore.
And didn’t say anything either.
Now you tell me which one is worse.
If here they fall they shall live on when ever you cry “For Ascalon!”
There’s no such thing as making the game “right” the first time. Because different people have different rights. You’re so vested in your disappointment you can’t see that some people are disappointed and some aren’t, even even those who are, aren’t necessarily disappointed by the same thing. What percent of the playerbase was affected, do you think, by the Fractal reset?
Have you ever even looked at another MMORPG forum. They all look just like this one, unless the company deletes all negative posts.
It’s not the reset itself. It’s the lies. It’s the “we need to do this reset in order to implement leaderboards” which implied they had a system thought out and ready to implement.
It’s the fact that our progress was reset for nothing and leaderboards were just an excuse. That’s what I’m disappointed about.It’s the fact that they promise and don’t even bother to say " we won’t be able to do it, stuff has come up".
It’s the fact that they have good ideas in the past which they magically forget about only to add them back 2 years later after much player demand and act like they’ve reinvented the wheel.
Was it a lie or did the leaderboard get scrapped for a reason we don’t know about, or did it get put on the back burner? When it was said, was that the reason? Everyone always wants to say lie, but you know, sometimes situations change.
Either way, Anet should make a direct statement about it.
Yes – the reset was due to the leaderboards. That’s what they claimed.
Announcing Fractals of the Mists Leaderboards
Soon you can earn the envy and adulation of your friends and total strangers through our new leaderboards, which show off the players with the highest fractal levels! As part of the introduction of leaderboards, everyone whose current personal reward level for the Fractals of the Mists is above 30 will be reset to 30 so the competition can begin in earnest.Source : https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/releases/november-26-2013/
So – they reset our levels in order to “start an earnest competition” that never started. And they never said why.
So either:
1)They lied from the get-go – knowing full well this wouldn’t happen.
2)They didn’t lie – but something came up with the leaderboards idea – which is not unheard of but then this begs the question : why didn’t we hear anything about it? Why didn’t they tell us anything?I understand at one point they said they were finding it difficult to find criteria for the leaderboards – which means they reset our progress first and thought about it later. That’s sloppy. They didn’t have a working solution for a leaderboards but still used it as an excuse to reset our levels. And then didn’t bother with it anymore.
And didn’t say anything either.Now you tell me which one is worse.
I seem to remember other threads and comments from Anet, but I can’t be certain of them and it’s not an important issue to me personally. Among what I remember is someone from Anet saying that from level 30-50 the experience of doing the Fractals has completely changed and that it wouldn’t be appropriate all things considered to allow people to just have the entire new experience unlocked. Something along those lines anyway…it was a while ago and I wasn’t particularly tuned into it, since it only affected one person in my guild (who didn’t care by the way).
(edited by Vayne.8563)
So – they reset our levels in order to “start an earnest competition” that never started. And they never said why.
Unfortunately only 50 levels isn’t a high enough number for a proper leaderboard. Top 1000 players on the leaderboard will all be at Fractal level 50 so what’s the point?
So – they reset our levels in order to “start an earnest competition” that never started. And they never said why.
Unfortunately only 50 levels isn’t a high enough number for a proper leaderboard. Top 1000 players on the leaderboard will all be at Fractal level 50 so what’s the point?
What they should do is have a fractal leaderboard for each fractal, with a best time on it. So you’d have the best time for your team on the Swamp Fractal, etc.
The way I’d compare them;
Guild Wars started with 6 classes and grew to 10 classes within 2 years, but Guild Wars 2 started off with 8 classes straight away.
First of all you had 2 classes to cross in any way you liked and wanted.
So GW1 started with 36 classes and ended with 100, GW2 still has 8……….Did all of the combinations made sense ??? Of course.
But this was one of the best features…. and made GW1 such a success.
The freedom to pick from millions of skills and mix them with others.GW2 took lots of these features out that made A-Net what they are.. or onced were, better said.
GW2 looks unfinished and so incredible uncreative like someone forced someone to program it. No love for the game no love for deatails and even worse completely
ignoring why people love GW1 so muchThe double professions and large amount of skills in GW1 is what also kept the game really unbalanced and the double professions and the large number of skills that came with it is also what made a lot players shy away from the game because it was to overwhelming for them (hints* why Anet dumb down GW2).
With the countless nerfs from Anet destroying entire professions and entire skill lines, 90% of the skills went unused because of nerfs or the skill effect was basically worthless. With the use of henchmen and heros many players just went for the very overpowered builds and did the game solo killing the player interaction part of the game.
Don’t forget many of the skills where just copy and paste skills meaning the base game and each expansion had skills that where the same when it came to doing the same effect just called by a different name.
That’s why Anet did away with the second profession concept to help new players not feel overwhelmed and focus on the quality of the skills rather than the quantity of skills. This also help prevent overpowered builds from creating chaos in-game and help keep the player interaction alive that was killed off early on in GW1.
problem is, the experiment failed, the game isnt really more engaging than gw1 was when it comes to pvp, or entertainment gained via using skills. Checking on the spvp forums, the game isnt any more balanced than gw1 was.
I would rather have tons of skills, the meta sees no use for, rather than a few skills the meta sees no use for.
and lets be really honest here, which skill is it that you feel is of great quality in this game? I mean i like some skills in this game, but they are not any better designed than skills in gw1.
In fact i would usually say its the combat mechanics that shine in this game, the majority of skills are usually pretty lackluster.
GW1 had the business design of “releasing an expansion every 6 months”. It was nice, but it also had insane drawbacks. It took ArenaNet way longer than planned to release their first expansion, and then after the second expansion it was already clear that this constant overload of new mechanics was absolutely not maintainable.
What they’re doing in GW2 is much better, in my opinion. They’re not adding mechanics at GW1’s crazy speed, but they are adding much more content. All those Living Story episodes, the extra story packs (which I paid 600 gems for yesterday, and was not disappointed by), new areas such as Southsun Cove and Dry Top… It keeps the game refreshing and interesting, without overloading it with nifty and fancy features that nobody was asking for in the first place.
Viona (Thief); Abbygael (Ranger); Rovaniemi (Mesmer); Laxxne (Guardian);
Zyyghe (Warrior); Mrs Mustard (Engineer); Kharektera (Necromancer); Lee White (Elementalist)
Zyyghe (Warrior); Mrs Mustard (Engineer); Kharektera (Necromancer); Lee White (Elementalist)
GW1 had the business design of “releasing an expansion every 6 months”. It was nice, but it also had insane drawbacks. It took ArenaNet way longer than planned to release their first expansion, and then after the second expansion it was already clear that this constant overload of new mechanics was absolutely not maintainable.
What they’re doing in GW2 is much better, in my opinion. They’re not adding mechanics at GW1’s crazy speed, but they are adding much more content. All those Living Story episodes, the extra story packs (which I paid 600 gems for yesterday, and was not disappointed by), new areas such as Southsun Cove and Dry Top… It keeps the game refreshing and interesting, without overloading it with nifty and fancy features that nobody was asking for in the first place.
If you’ve been away, it seems like they’re adding a lot of stuff. But the amount of stuff is less than it immediately appears unless you’ve been away.
For those people here two years without that break, there’s not much new content…at least partially because a lot of the content has been removed.
One of the most valid criticisms of the game, in my opinion, is that the Living Story season one gamble failed and we have had the best part of a year with relatively few updates.
I think over time that will be compensated for (I’m cautiously optimistic) but people who are complaining definitely have a point.
and lets be really honest here, which skill is it that you feel is of great quality in this game? I mean i like some skills in this game, but they are not any better designed than skills in gw1.
In fact i would usually say its the combat mechanics that shine in this game, the majority of skills are usually pretty lackluster.
To me, at least 60% of skills are useless just because they are not effective. GW1 was maybe a balance nightmare, but it’s stabilized somehow now. What don’t they take some skills from GW1 and transpose them in GW2? I mean, the effect might be the same (for example Meteor Shower).
The fact the builds are very limited enhances the impression the game does not advance… And counting useless skills, what do we end up with?
GW1 skillbar: 8 fully customizable slots to choose from 1315 skills + an auto-attack.
GW2 skillbar: 5 skills forced by the weapon, 1 “less useless” healing skills, 1 “not so bad” elite, and 3 utilities to choose from 20 skills (most of which are useless to be effective). In all, we only end up choosing 3 utilities that are effective, not because they suit our tastes…
Guild leader of The Nephilim of Elysium.
Son of Elonia.
Son of Elonia.
So – they reset our levels in order to “start an earnest competition” that never started. And they never said why.
Unfortunately only 50 levels isn’t a high enough number for a proper leaderboard. Top 1000 players on the leaderboard will all be at Fractal level 50 so what’s the point?
and how is it that within 2 minutes of announcing a leaderboard, people saw this flaw, yet in months of development, and making a huge descion like resetting level progress, no one at anet saw this. Even after weeks of people telling them it served little to no purpose, they still ignored everyone and did it anyway.
And the sad part, is even with numerous design failures that have occured due to this type of we only tell you what we are doing when we wont change it for another 12 months development, they continue to believe its a good strategy for development.
they either need more player feedback, or they need to master developing better solutions, that have less obvious and annoying flaws built in.
*disclaimer, i am not speaking in absolutes here, there are of course times when they make changes fast, and i applaud that, but overall, if something comes down the dev pipe, and you dont like it, chances are it will not be changed for 8 months to a year. And that is only if there is a truely large outcry, if it is simply not as good, or a general downgrade, it will probably stay in.
GW1 had the business design of “releasing an expansion every 6 months”. It was nice, but it also had insane drawbacks. It took ArenaNet way longer than planned to release their first expansion, and then after the second expansion it was already clear that this constant overload of new mechanics was absolutely not maintainable.
What they’re doing in GW2 is much better, in my opinion. They’re not adding mechanics at GW1’s crazy speed, but they are adding much more content. All those Living Story episodes, the extra story packs (which I paid 600 gems for yesterday, and was not disappointed by), new areas such as Southsun Cove and Dry Top… It keeps the game refreshing and interesting, without overloading it with nifty and fancy features that nobody was asking for in the first place.
If you’ve been away, it seems like they’re adding a lot of stuff. But the amount of stuff is less than it immediately appears unless you’ve been away.
For those people here two years without that break, there’s not much new content…at least partially because a lot of the content has been removed.
One of the most valid criticisms of the game, in my opinion, is that the Living Story season one gamble failed and we have had the best part of a year with relatively few updates.
I think over time that will be compensated for (I’m cautiously optimistic) but people who are complaining definitely have a point.
The living story at its best — with new content every two weeks — was definitely a high amount of new stuff at a steady pace. Unless you play 16 hours a day and play through everything at lightning speed of course, but I do like to think that those people ruin the game for themselves by doing that.
Viona (Thief); Abbygael (Ranger); Rovaniemi (Mesmer); Laxxne (Guardian);
Zyyghe (Warrior); Mrs Mustard (Engineer); Kharektera (Necromancer); Lee White (Elementalist)
Zyyghe (Warrior); Mrs Mustard (Engineer); Kharektera (Necromancer); Lee White (Elementalist)
GW1 had the business design of “releasing an expansion every 6 months”. It was nice, but it also had insane drawbacks. It took ArenaNet way longer than planned to release their first expansion, and then after the second expansion it was already clear that this constant overload of new mechanics was absolutely not maintainable.
What they’re doing in GW2 is much better, in my opinion. They’re not adding mechanics at GW1’s crazy speed, but they are adding much more content. All those Living Story episodes, the extra story packs (which I paid 600 gems for yesterday, and was not disappointed by), new areas such as Southsun Cove and Dry Top… It keeps the game refreshing and interesting, without overloading it with nifty and fancy features that nobody was asking for in the first place.
If you’ve been away, it seems like they’re adding a lot of stuff. But the amount of stuff is less than it immediately appears unless you’ve been away.
For those people here two years without that break, there’s not much new content…at least partially because a lot of the content has been removed.
One of the most valid criticisms of the game, in my opinion, is that the Living Story season one gamble failed and we have had the best part of a year with relatively few updates.
I think over time that will be compensated for (I’m cautiously optimistic) but people who are complaining definitely have a point.
The living story at its best — with new content every two weeks — was definitely a high amount of new stuff at a steady pace. Unless you play 16 hours a day and play through everything at lightning speed of course, but I do like to think that those people ruin the game for themselves by doing that.
Look, some of my favorite content is no longer in the game, and if you weren’t here, you didn’t get to experience at all.
So the new story, at this point, it’s fine. It’s great for what it is. But it’s not, and I don’t see it ever becoming, The Nightmare Tower.
It’s just a very different type of content. Content you can no longer play.
GW1 had the business design of “releasing an expansion every 6 months”. It was nice, but it also had insane drawbacks. It took ArenaNet way longer than planned to release their first expansion, and then after the second expansion it was already clear that this constant overload of new mechanics was absolutely not maintainable.
What they’re doing in GW2 is much better, in my opinion. They’re not adding mechanics at GW1’s crazy speed, but they are adding much more content. All those Living Story episodes, the extra story packs (which I paid 600 gems for yesterday, and was not disappointed by), new areas such as Southsun Cove and Dry Top… It keeps the game refreshing and interesting, without overloading it with nifty and fancy features that nobody was asking for in the first place.
If you’ve been away, it seems like they’re adding a lot of stuff. But the amount of stuff is less than it immediately appears unless you’ve been away.
For those people here two years without that break, there’s not much new content…at least partially because a lot of the content has been removed.
One of the most valid criticisms of the game, in my opinion, is that the Living Story season one gamble failed and we have had the best part of a year with relatively few updates.
I think over time that will be compensated for (I’m cautiously optimistic) but people who are complaining definitely have a point.
The living story at its best — with new content every two weeks — was definitely a high amount of new stuff at a steady pace. Unless you play 16 hours a day and play through everything at lightning speed of course, but I do like to think that those people ruin the game for themselves by doing that.
The two week pace was not sustainable internally. And generally it only took 2-3 hours per cycle to see the bulk of what is offered. Not that there is anything wrong with that. But is a fallacy to say you need to play a lot fully experience LS, or that it was a lot of new content.
fact is, in the year 2014 we have had 7 releases so far, and likely there will be around 3-4 more by the end of the year, so
10-11 releases, each which generally had 1-2 hours of new content (aside from grinding achievements/items)
so even the most casual player can get the full experience fairly easily, with about 24 hours of playtime in a year.
not horrible, but not really a shining display either. oh yeah the best parts of the first 3 releases, are basically gone
One thing I really miss from GW1 was personal individual maps where stuff you killed stayed dead. Felt more satisfying killing a hard boss and not having it re-spawn again every 10 mins or so.
What I don’t miss, Anet completely ignoring the game while working on a new expansion then continuing ignoring it once it came out. Then ignoring both the games when they were working on the 3rd expansion. Then ignoring all 3 games when working on Eye of the North, then ignoring the game all together when they started working on GW2 just to pop in once in a blue moon scolding the players for using over powered builds and running the in-game economy into the ground and act surprised with all the bots running around.
Kill stuff to unlock weapons skills, most confusing thing I ever heard of. (sarcasm)
GW1 had the business design of “releasing an expansion every 6 months”. It was nice, but it also had insane drawbacks. It took ArenaNet way longer than planned to release their first expansion, and then after the second expansion it was already clear that this constant overload of new mechanics was absolutely not maintainable.
What they’re doing in GW2 is much better, in my opinion. They’re not adding mechanics at GW1’s crazy speed, but they are adding much more content. All those Living Story episodes, the extra story packs (which I paid 600 gems for yesterday, and was not disappointed by), new areas such as Southsun Cove and Dry Top… It keeps the game refreshing and interesting, without overloading it with nifty and fancy features that nobody was asking for in the first place.
If you’ve been away, it seems like they’re adding a lot of stuff. But the amount of stuff is less than it immediately appears unless you’ve been away.
For those people here two years without that break, there’s not much new content…at least partially because a lot of the content has been removed.
One of the most valid criticisms of the game, in my opinion, is that the Living Story season one gamble failed and we have had the best part of a year with relatively few updates.
I think over time that will be compensated for (I’m cautiously optimistic) but people who are complaining definitely have a point.
The living story at its best — with new content every two weeks — was definitely a high amount of new stuff at a steady pace. Unless you play 16 hours a day and play through everything at lightning speed of course, but I do like to think that those people ruin the game for themselves by doing that.
Look, some of my favorite content is no longer in the game, and if you weren’t here, you didn’t get to experience at all.
So the new story, at this point, it’s fine. It’s great for what it is. But it’s not, and I don’t see it ever becoming, The Nightmare Tower.
It’s just a very different type of content. Content you can no longer play.
That is very true.
I think that ArenaNet will need to change the way the Living Story is implemented. In a way, it’s awesome if a story event impacts the world so that it changes, but it’s sad that this always has to mean that previous content is replaced by new content. Additionally, a lot of content was only available for two weeks, which is not so nice as well. It works well for people who play actively at all times, but if you regularly take extended breaks, you’re missing out on a lot of stuff.
Viona (Thief); Abbygael (Ranger); Rovaniemi (Mesmer); Laxxne (Guardian);
Zyyghe (Warrior); Mrs Mustard (Engineer); Kharektera (Necromancer); Lee White (Elementalist)
Zyyghe (Warrior); Mrs Mustard (Engineer); Kharektera (Necromancer); Lee White (Elementalist)
So – they reset our levels in order to “start an earnest competition” that never started. And they never said why.
Unfortunately only 50 levels isn’t a high enough number for a proper leaderboard. Top 1000 players on the leaderboard will all be at Fractal level 50 so what’s the point?
The point is don’t use it as a reason to reset our level then.
If you want to reset our level just because – at least be up front about it. They pushed the leaderboards as a reason and it turned up they didn’t even have a good idea of how to make said leaderboards.
That’s the problem. The way things were handled.
If here they fall they shall live on when ever you cry “For Ascalon!”
I seem to remember other threads and comments from Anet, but I can’t be certain of them and it’s not an important issue to me personally. Among what I remember is someone from Anet saying that from level 30-50 the experience of doing the Fractals has completely changed and that it wouldn’t be appropriate all things considered to allow people to just have the entire new experience unlocked. Something along those lines anyway…it was a while ago and I wasn’t particularly tuned into it, since it only affected one person in my guild (who didn’t care by the way).
People from Anet failed to realize they could have simply made 50-70 unlocked with the new “experience” and not taken away what we had already earned.
The issue might not be one that you care about – but it mattered to those who put in the work and effort and then had to do it all again because of arbitrary reasons.
How would you like your traits to be reset – just because a “new trait unlock experience” was in effect and it wouldn’t be fair to just have your traits now.
Or what about a “new legendary experience” which would of course mean people’s legendary weapons would be taken away until they make them again. Because it wouldn’t be fair.
The point is it sets a dangerous precedent when they can simply declare hours of work and progress null and void just because they feel like it.
FOTM max level back them was 49. It was the official maximum you could get to without breaking any rules or glitching.
It was fair to get to level 49. It was in the game. And suddenly it wasn’t. It was taken away just because.
I wouldn’t have minded the “new experience” but it could have started at 50+.
It was handled poorly. Very poorly. From reasons to execution.
Just because it doesn’t matter to you personally it doesn’t mean it’s not a big deal. Because it is – as a concept they did something very unfair. That’s why many FOTM players left then.
I’m not usually this kind of person but honestly I do wish they’d do it to some area of the game you care dearly for and have invested a lot of time into. Just to see if you’d have the same " meh – i don’t do it so I don’t care – handle it" attitude which you’re using as a front to avoid agreeing that Anet was wrong.
If here they fall they shall live on when ever you cry “For Ascalon!”
Anyway, if anyone played GW from start must remember there aren’t any title system from start and it had several change, and with EotN (aug 2007) until GW2 release (aug 2012) there was years of nothing (just beyond release).
5 years of nothing.
I prefer a well-time-distribute expansion (‘cause i’m sure every dragon have an own expansion) instead a all-in-2-years-than-nothing GW1.
Have you ever even looked at another MMORPG forum. They all look just like this one, unless the company deletes all negative posts.
Well, look at GW1 facebook page for example.
Facebook page ain’t a forum. lol Guild Wars 1 had no official forum and many of the types of people who post on forums never look at facebook.
Guild Wars 1 isn’t an MMO and even if it was, at this point, I’m sure most of the population isn’t posting about negative stuff, because the game is in stasis. Nothing happens there TO post about.
It’s like saying look at the forums for any older game that hasn’t been updated in a couple of years. What is there to post about?
I said Facebook page because if you look at the GW2 facebook page you often see the general attitude towards GW2.
And sure, it didn’t have an official forum, but there were plenty of non-official, and even devs posted there. Look at this for example:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/domain-anguish-t10083002.html
This thread was created when anet announced the release of DoA,meaning it’s a valid comparison to GW2 forums since it was created during active development.
Anyway, if anyone played GW from start must remember there aren’t any title system from start and it had several change, and with EotN (aug 2007) until GW2 release (aug 2012) there was years of nothing (just beyond release).
5 years of nothing.I prefer a well-time-distribute expansion (‘cause i’m sure every dragon have an own expansion) instead a all-in-2-years-than-nothing GW1.
“Just beyond release”… Actually Beyond was far longer than LS1, and far more lore-centered…
Every dragon their expansion? I want to know the whole story yet waiting 15 years to complete a game is a bit… Too much, is it not?
Guild leader of The Nephilim of Elysium.
Son of Elonia.
Son of Elonia.
Anyway, if anyone played GW from start must remember there aren’t any title system from start and it had several change, and with EotN (aug 2007) until GW2 release (aug 2012) there was years of nothing (just beyond release).
5 years of nothing.I prefer a well-time-distribute expansion (‘cause i’m sure every dragon have an own expansion) instead a all-in-2-years-than-nothing GW1.
Have we forgotten the Guild Wars beyond content they started but gave up on that was going to help bridge the link between GW1 and GW2?
The did release War in Kryta which showed the White Mantle being overthrown and Queen Salma (Queen Jennah great-great grandmother) take the thrown and they did make Wind of Change based in Cantha. Then they gave up and focus all their attention on GW2. all this happened 2 years-ish or so before GW2 came out.
Kill stuff to unlock weapons skills, most confusing thing I ever heard of. (sarcasm)
Have you ever even looked at another MMORPG forum. They all look just like this one, unless the company deletes all negative posts.
Well, look at GW1 facebook page for example.
Facebook page ain’t a forum. lol Guild Wars 1 had no official forum and many of the types of people who post on forums never look at facebook.
Guild Wars 1 isn’t an MMO and even if it was, at this point, I’m sure most of the population isn’t posting about negative stuff, because the game is in stasis. Nothing happens there TO post about.
It’s like saying look at the forums for any older game that hasn’t been updated in a couple of years. What is there to post about?
I said Facebook page because if you look at the GW2 facebook page you often see the general attitude towards GW2.
And sure, it didn’t have an official forum, but there were plenty of non-official, and even devs posted there. Look at this for example:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/domain-anguish-t10083002.html
This thread was created when anet announced the release of DoA,meaning it’s a valid comparison to GW2 forums since it was created during active development.
I don’t know what is a valid comparison or not a valid comparison. My comment was about forums for MMORPGs. I should have said official forums, though because that’s what I’m talking about.
If you look at any major MMORPG (and Guild Wars 1 wasn’t), you’ll see almost the exact same threads you’ll see here. The more popular the MMORPG the more of these threads you’ll see.
You won’t necessarily see them on dying or dead games, though or games that aren’t MMORPGs, or in fan forums, because those tend to be moderated differently. For example, Reddit, which is fan moderated tends to be far more positive than the official forums. People have even complained about it.
My comment was meant to compare MMORPG official forums with this official forum, since people seem to think that this sort of hostility toward the publisher is something other than normal.
WoW, Rift, AoC, Lotro, DDO, SWToR, Archeage, Wildstar, ESO, Warhammer Online all have the same types of comments on their forums. That’s what I’m saying.
It’s easy to pick apart a game. It’s not so easy to make one.
my 2 cents: gw1 had more of what made a “game” and gw2 is way more flash….
gw1 was Return of the Jedi, gw2 is The Phantom Menace…
anet screwed themselves real good by dropping almost all of gw1’s most innovative features, trashing the lore of the game as much as possible, making gw2 into just another run of the mill mmo, going nuts with their gem store (I honestly thought..or was delusional enough to think.. that money would make tons of content possible), and in all this their biggest sin was to name it “Guild Wars 2” and thus make a point of instant comparison. If you can bring yourself to forget the “guild wars” part of the name you will find yourself better able to enjoy the rather smooth combat…in 2 week farming bursts followed by the same old content over and over and over…
TL;DR nice game, but naming it “guild wars 2” draws an instant comparison to a far better game and they did themselves a disservice there.
I’m glad more people are coming to realize how stale GW2 has become. ANet seriously needs to reconsider the Living Story idea because it’s not panning out. Now if that means hiring more people (yes we know your resources ate strained) then do it. NCSoft is posting huge profits so ask daddy for a loan if you need it.
(4) I don’t think I even need to mention how superior the writing and content in GW1 was compared to GW2. it simply goes without saying. in order to make another “me too” MMO, they had to throw in additional races, and instead of making one race with one solid, compelling story (GW1), they made five races with mediocre, forgettable stories.
The Nightfall campaign inspired me to become a writer. One published book and two more manuscripts in the works I’d say it’s been a very positive change. GW2’s writing is anything but. It feels commercial, overly simplified and not well thought out. Story drove the missions in GW1. You were immersed in the world, and you cared about your character. In GW2 you run kitten-boy errands for Trahearne. Your character means nothing in the personal story nor the Living Story. Now if you can’t connect with your character are you going to care about the world?
For a professional writer, I question your judgement. Saying that the story in Guild Wars 1 was some great story is more than just a little stretch. Most of the writing was okay. Many of the characters were completely cliche cardboard cutouts, and the plots really weren’t anything to write home about. I don’t know where this great writing came from, but through all of Guild Wars 1, all I remember is running around doing what someone else told me to do.
In the beginning it was Rurik, then the White Mantle, then the Shining Blade. Did I want to give the Scepter of Orr to the cheesy bad guy with the foreign accent. Or course not. He was the stereotypical bad guy with the Spanish accent. The stereotype made me laugh. Of course, at the time I was actually a writer, and saw these things. When you go back and look at that writing, you won’t find “great” writing. You’ll find enough writing there to drive the story forward.
Guild Wars 2’s writing is larger the same. In games like this, the writing always serves the story. The story doesn’t server the writing.
In Nightfall, first Sunspears told us what to do, then the Order of Whispers told me what to do, and in the end it wasn’t much different, don’t to following Komir around the Realm of Torment. We did all the work, she becomes a god. I’m thinking, wait a second, isn’t she the one that started this whole ball of wax. What’s so special about her?
In Factions we followed Togo around for the entire game and every step of it he told is what to do.
Maybe you’re not remembering that story as clearly as you think you are.
Well, Guild Wars wasn’t Finnegan’s Wake, of course, but it was light years beyond GW2 (and, of course, a much better love story than Twilight) because it had heart and it had soul and while it had its moments of whimsy it never collapsed under the weight of its own silliness.
GW2, on the other hand, has this bizarre theme running through the early portions of the game that’s all about mistreating cows. We ‘entertain’ them instead of feeding them. There’s that silly rancher in Queensdale who in one breath exhorts the cows to fight the bandits, and in the next extolls the joys of brisket. Mm-mm. Meanwhile, over in Ascalon, we stand by and do nothing as cow after cow is hurled from a catapult. Oh, moooooooo – splat. Crunch. We dress up in cow costumes and train cows to fight. That’s sane.
I sure do hope LS3 is about a cow revolution. To heck with the elder dragons. The cows are mad as heck and they’re not gonna take it anymore. Mooooving on.
Compare: Vekk and Ceera. I felt Vekk’s pain. Ceera, on the other hand, got a ‘Oh, come on. Really?’
The table is a fable.
my 2 cents: gw1 had more of what made a “game” and gw2 is way more flash….
gw1 was Return of the Jedi, gw2 is The Phantom Menace…anet screwed themselves real good by dropping almost all of gw1’s most innovative features, trashing the lore of the game as much as possible, making gw2 into just another run of the mill mmo, going nuts with their gem store (I honestly thought..or was delusional enough to think.. that money would make tons of content possible), and in all this their biggest sin was to name it “Guild Wars 2” and thus make a point of instant comparison. If you can bring yourself to forget the “guild wars” part of the name you will find yourself better able to enjoy the rather smooth combat…in 2 week farming bursts followed by the same old content over and over and over…
TL;DR nice game, but naming it “guild wars 2” draws an instant comparison to a far better game and they did themselves a disservice there.
The story in GW1 was a bit boring and in Prophecy it jump around to much but over all I give it points for being at least “original” and loved how in Nightfall it links the first 2 games and you find out Abbadon was behind the events from the first game and Factions.
GW2 story, “Dragons have returned and we must stop them”. A bit unoriginal but at least they gave the Elder Dragons different personalities in the way they corrupt and the way their minions look.
Gw1 like the story in Prophecy at least had a start and finish. You kill the Undead Lich and had a sub story after the main story line about stopping the Titans that were released. GW2 you kill Zhaitan but never get anything in the way of retaking Orr and clearing out the destruction it caused. Oh there are other Dragons around but they are going to take their time to get to them. Wait they did start to introduce a new one but won’t continue it until November and it probably won’t be until the end of season 3 of Living Story before we come face to face with Mordremoth.
Kill stuff to unlock weapons skills, most confusing thing I ever heard of. (sarcasm)
“Just beyond release”… Actually Beyond was far longer than LS1, and far more lore-centered…
Every dragon their expansion? I want to know the whole story yet waiting 15 years to complete a game is a bit… Too much, is it not?
Yes, Beyond was more lore centered, but i’m not sure for “longer”.
I’ve complete both in few days in a whole run and few hours to complete every release, like LS1 & 2 after all.
Anyway WoW has 10 years and still alive and destiny devs said game will live for 10 years… Only ArenaNet Devs knows when we will have whole story in own hands. It’s a “problem” of every online game.
Have we forgotten the Guild Wars beyond content they started but gave up on that was going to help bridge the link between GW1 and GW2?
The did release War in Kryta which showed the White Mantle being overthrown and Queen Salma (Queen Jennah great-great grandmother) take the thrown and they did make Wind of Change based in Cantha. Then they gave up and focus all their attention on GW2. all this happened 2 years-ish or so before GW2 came out.
LS have same role of “beyond” in gw1, after all.
There wasn’t any Utopia after EotN. So 5 years of nothing.
I enjoyed beyond contents (I’ve loved war), but you must read significant contents like an expansion.
Like i said before, i prefer an expansion every 1.5/2 years that all in 2 years and than nothing for years and years.
Yes, Beyond was more lore centered, but i’m not sure for “longer”.
I’ve complete both in few days in a whole run and few hours to complete every release, like LS1 & 2 after all.Anyway WoW has 10 years and still alive and destiny devs said game will live for 10 years… Only ArenaNet Devs knows when we will have whole story in own hands. It’s a “problem” of every online game.
I do agree my point of view is biased: I played 3 times less in GW1 than in GW2 yet the story was more complete in GW1 than GW2…
However, PvE content in GW1 was longer to me: I remember missions that lasted for at least an hour. In PS/LS, each instance barely last more than 15 minutes… and does not bring much lore.
I do wish GW2 to thrive for many years, unfortunately for those who care about the game, it might be without them: we can’t spend most of our time killing critters… So far, most updates hit next to the core of what most IG people want, not bull’s eye… There have been fixes of things that were fine, of things that do needed some attention, but barely any fix regarding broken things. At that rate, most veterans (more importantly players since GW1) will leave the game, and newcomers will come and go. Actually that’s how gaming industry works nowadays: profit before loyalty.
Guild leader of The Nephilim of Elysium.
Son of Elonia.
Son of Elonia.
“Just beyond release”… Actually Beyond was far longer than LS1, and far more lore-centered…
Every dragon their expansion? I want to know the whole story yet waiting 15 years to complete a game is a bit… Too much, is it not?Yes, Beyond was more lore centered, but i’m not sure for “longer”.
I’ve complete both in few days in a whole run and few hours to complete every release, like LS1 & 2 after all.Anyway WoW has 10 years and still alive and destiny devs said game will live for 10 years… Only ArenaNet Devs knows when we will have whole story in own hands. It’s a “problem” of every online game.
Have we forgotten the Guild Wars beyond content they started but gave up on that was going to help bridge the link between GW1 and GW2?
The did release War in Kryta which showed the White Mantle being overthrown and Queen Salma (Queen Jennah great-great grandmother) take the thrown and they did make Wind of Change based in Cantha. Then they gave up and focus all their attention on GW2. all this happened 2 years-ish or so before GW2 came out.
LS have same role of “beyond” in gw1, after all.
There wasn’t any Utopia after EotN. So 5 years of nothing.
I enjoyed beyond contents (I’ve loved war), but you must read significant contents like an expansion.Like i said before, i prefer an expansion every 1.5/2 years that all in 2 years and than nothing for years and years.
Eye of the North was Utopia in a way. After Nightfall they started working on Utopia but decided to do Eye of the North instead of another stand alone game like Factions and Nightfall.
Sure the beyond content wasn’t a full expansion except Winds of Change was like a mini expansion.
5 years of nothing until GW2 came out? Eye of the North came out August 31st, 2007 and the first GW Beyond content War in Kryta came out April 8th, 2010 and finished on July 8, 2010 and Winds of Change came out July 7, 2011 and finished on February 9, 2012 and GW2 was released on August 28, 2012.
So the time between Eye of the North and the new GW1 Beyond content was around 3 years not 5 years of nothing until GW2 was released and the time between the beyond content finishing up and GW2 was like 6 months of nothing new.
Kill stuff to unlock weapons skills, most confusing thing I ever heard of. (sarcasm)
(edited by joshc.3129)
I’m glad more people are coming to realize how stale GW2 has become. ANet seriously needs to reconsider the Living Story idea because it’s not panning out. Now if that means hiring more people (yes we know your resources ate strained) then do it. NCSoft is posting huge profits so ask daddy for a loan if you need it.
(4) I don’t think I even need to mention how superior the writing and content in GW1 was compared to GW2. it simply goes without saying. in order to make another “me too” MMO, they had to throw in additional races, and instead of making one race with one solid, compelling story (GW1), they made five races with mediocre, forgettable stories.
The Nightfall campaign inspired me to become a writer. One published book and two more manuscripts in the works I’d say it’s been a very positive change. GW2’s writing is anything but. It feels commercial, overly simplified and not well thought out. Story drove the missions in GW1. You were immersed in the world, and you cared about your character. In GW2 you run kitten-boy errands for Trahearne. Your character means nothing in the personal story nor the Living Story. Now if you can’t connect with your character are you going to care about the world?
For a professional writer, I question your judgement. Saying that the story in Guild Wars 1 was some great story is more than just a little stretch. Most of the writing was okay. Many of the characters were completely cliche cardboard cutouts, and the plots really weren’t anything to write home about. I don’t know where this great writing came from, but through all of Guild Wars 1, all I remember is running around doing what someone else told me to do.
In the beginning it was Rurik, then the White Mantle, then the Shining Blade. Did I want to give the Scepter of Orr to the cheesy bad guy with the foreign accent. Or course not. He was the stereotypical bad guy with the Spanish accent. The stereotype made me laugh. Of course, at the time I was actually a writer, and saw these things. When you go back and look at that writing, you won’t find “great” writing. You’ll find enough writing there to drive the story forward.
Guild Wars 2’s writing is larger the same. In games like this, the writing always serves the story. The story doesn’t server the writing.
In Nightfall, first Sunspears told us what to do, then the Order of Whispers told me what to do, and in the end it wasn’t much different, don’t to following Komir around the Realm of Torment. We did all the work, she becomes a god. I’m thinking, wait a second, isn’t she the one that started this whole ball of wax. What’s so special about her?
In Factions we followed Togo around for the entire game and every step of it he told is what to do.
Maybe you’re not remembering that story as clearly as you think you are.
Well, Guild Wars wasn’t Finnegan’s Wake, of course, but it was light years beyond GW2 (and, of course, a much better love story than Twilight) because it had heart and it had soul and while it had its moments of whimsy it never collapsed under the weight of its own silliness.
GW2, on the other hand, has this bizarre theme running through the early portions of the game that’s all about mistreating cows. We ‘entertain’ them instead of feeding them. There’s that silly rancher in Queensdale who in one breath exhorts the cows to fight the bandits, and in the next extolls the joys of brisket. Mm-mm. Meanwhile, over in Ascalon, we stand by and do nothing as cow after cow is hurled from a catapult. Oh, moooooooo – splat. Crunch. We dress up in cow costumes and train cows to fight. That’s sane.
I sure do hope LS3 is about a cow revolution. To heck with the elder dragons. The cows are mad as heck and they’re not gonna take it anymore. Mooooving on.
Compare: Vekk and Ceera. I felt Vekk’s pain. Ceera, on the other hand, got a ‘Oh, come on. Really?’
Sorry I liked Ceera. Moreover a whole lot of people like Tybalt, and I really like Forgal. For every good character in Guild Wars 1, there was one that you wanted to kill. Rurik was absolutely a cardboard cutout. People complained about Komir incessantly. Most people didn’t seem to like Koss much (though I did).
There is plenty wrong with the stories in both games, but it’s not as dismal as it’s made out to be. There’s certainly not the depth of difference that people are implying.
Sorry I liked Ceera.
Well, don’t be sorry that you liked her. People like all sorts of things.
Moreover a whole lot of people like Tybalt, and I really like Forgal. For every good character in Guild Wars 1, there was one that you wanted to kill. Rurik was absolutely a cardboard cutout. People complained about Komir incessantly. Most people didn’t seem to like Koss much (though I did).
HERE THERE BE SPOILERS for anyone who has not yet been to Claw Island.
The Claw Island dramatic last stand stuff was bad, mm-kay. I mean, what’s the point of shutting the big doors and making a dramatic last stand there when there are already risen on both sides and mass quantities of risen loitering around in the vicinity of the ship the dramatic shutting of the big doors is supposed to give us time to escape to?
Besides, the whole danged assault was just plain wrong. Zhaitan knows what his risen minions know, right? Well, were there no naval officers in his band of merry risen? No pirates? Surely, if even a mere guitarist like myself knows that when assaulting an island, one of the primary objectives should be to lock down the docks, then an elder dragon with the brains of countless risen at his disposal should have known that as well. There should have been no handy dandy ship there for us to escape to, or in.
A lifeboat, maybe, in which we cast off from some other point not quite as overrun with risen. That would have been a good place for a dramatic last stand.
“Fly, you fools! Er, I mean, row! Row!”
One last desperate battle at sea, perhaps, and then…
“Ah, thank the writers, a ship approaches! We’re saved!”
There is plenty wrong with the stories in both games, but it’s not as dismal as it’s made out to be. There’s certainly not the depth of difference that people are implying.
There sure is.
The table is a fable.
Sorry I liked Ceera.
Well, don’t be sorry that you liked her. People like all sorts of things.
Moreover a whole lot of people like Tybalt, and I really like Forgal. For every good character in Guild Wars 1, there was one that you wanted to kill. Rurik was absolutely a cardboard cutout. People complained about Komir incessantly. Most people didn’t seem to like Koss much (though I did).
HERE THERE BE SPOILERS for anyone who has not yet been to Claw Island.
The Claw Island dramatic last stand stuff was bad, mm-kay. I mean, what’s the point of shutting the big doors and making a dramatic last stand there when there are already risen on both sides and mass quantities of risen loitering around in the vicinity of the ship the dramatic shutting of the big doors is supposed to give us time to escape to?
Besides, the whole danged assault was just plain wrong. Zhaitan knows what his risen minions know, right? Well, were there no naval officers in his band of merry risen? No pirates? Surely, if even a mere guitarist like myself knows that when assaulting an island, one of the primary objectives should be to lock down the docks, then an elder dragon with the brains of countless risen at his disposal should have known that as well. There should have been no handy dandy ship there for us to escape to, or in.
A lifeboat, maybe, in which we cast off from some other point not quite as overrun with risen. That would have been a good place for a dramatic last stand.
“Fly, you fools! Er, I mean, row! Row!”
One last desperate battle at sea, perhaps, and then…
“Ah, thank the writers, a ship approaches! We’re saved!”
There is plenty wrong with the stories in both games, but it’s not as dismal as it’s made out to be. There’s certainly not the depth of difference that people are implying.
There sure is.
You don’t think you can pick apart Guild Wars 1 the same way? How about the stupid Black Tide Den mission, where your character, for no reason whatsoever, is suddenly looking for Rinkhail monitors for the bonus, running away from the guy you’re supposed to be follow (which is an important plot point) to do something that you’re never given any reason at all to do.
I never go into any MMO expecting “great writing”. Therefore I’m never disappointed.
Guild Wars 1 could have been a lot better. Guild Wars 2 could be a lot better. But there are some pretty cool things in Guild Wars 2, as there were in Guild Wars 1. If you want to ignore those things, go right ahead.
They’re still in the game.
I love when I read the posts now claiming GW1 stories across all 4 games were a masterpiece work of art compared to GW2 story (in some ways GW1 story was better) when good chance they were the same people complaining about how the GW1 stories where dull and boring across all 4 games.
Kill stuff to unlock weapons skills, most confusing thing I ever heard of. (sarcasm)
I love when I read the posts now claiming GW1 stories across all 4 games were a masterpiece work of art compared to GW2 story (in some ways GW1 story was better) when good chance they were the same people complaining about how the GW1 stories where dull and boring across all 4 games.
Eye of the North, by far, had the best characters for me in Guild Wars 1. I really resonated with Pyre. But I didn’t particularly care much for Jora or Livia. I liked Vekk quite a lot. Hayda and Anton, not so much. Not sure if I ever really connected with Ogden either.
I hated how all the dwarves moved like Christmas elves though, and how everyone’s breathing was massively exaggerated throughout the game.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Guild-Wars-2-Years/first#post4360502
This was posted about a month ago by a good friend of mine. It’s totally relevant to this discussion.
O_O
Wow. That is very eye opening. Great post.
I love when I read the posts now claiming GW1 stories across all 4 games were a masterpiece work of art compared to GW2 story (in some ways GW1 story was better) when good chance they were the same people complaining about how the GW1 stories where dull and boring across all 4 games.
Eye of the North, by far, had the best characters for me in Guild Wars 1. I really resonated with Pyre. But I didn’t particularly care much for Jora or Livia. I liked Vekk quite a lot. Hayda and Anton, not so much. Not sure if I ever really connected with Ogden either.
I hated how all the dwarves moved like Christmas elves though, and how everyone’s breathing was massively exaggerated throughout the game.
True. Eye of the North in my mind had the best story out of all the games. Unlike the other games Eye of the North had characters that actually had personality.
Nightfall to me was the worse. The story wasn’t bad but the characters were dull and lifeless. When Kormir got attack and thought to have gotten killed I really didn’t care less. Nightfall was the only GW1 game that took me the longest to beat, not because it was hard, it wasen’t (the final boss fight was so easy it was a joke) but because I got so bored with the story.
Kill stuff to unlock weapons skills, most confusing thing I ever heard of. (sarcasm)
You don’t think you can pick apart Guild Wars 1 the same way? How about the stupid Black Tide Den mission, where your character, for no reason whatsoever, is suddenly looking for Rinkhail monitors for the bonus, running away from the guy you’re supposed to be follow (which is an important plot point) to do something that you’re never given any reason at all to do.
I never go into any MMO expecting “great writing”. Therefore I’m never disappointed.
Guild Wars 1 could have been a lot better. Guild Wars 2 could be a lot better. But there are some pretty cool things in Guild Wars 2, as there were in Guild Wars 1. If you want to ignore those things, go right ahead.
They’re still in the game.
How is that any better with living story achievements? Why would you let Duke Barradin’s ghost to get stronger normally? I don’t see any difference.
Also GW1 had his fair share of cool things as well, if not more than GW2.
Vayne, all your logic aside, but for the past two years you’ve made so many assumptions about how ANet thinks that someone might think you are actually working for them.
Eye of the North, by far, had the best characters for me in Guild Wars 1. I really resonated with Pyre. But I didn’t particularly care much for Jora or Livia. I liked Vekk quite a lot. Hayda and Anton, not so much. Not sure if I ever really connected with Ogden either.
Vekk, Pyre, and Gwen were the ones that I favored in EotN, although I didn’t always use them as heroes. The guy who did Vekk’s voice – had to look him up: Maurice LaMarche – really did a great job bringing that character to life, especially considering the limited animation back then. I wish there was more Vekk in the GW2 asura.
I liked Zhed Shadowhoof from Nightfall, too.
The table is a fable.
You don’t think you can pick apart Guild Wars 1 the same way? How about the stupid Black Tide Den mission, where your character, for no reason whatsoever, is suddenly looking for Rinkhail monitors for the bonus, running away from the guy you’re supposed to be follow (which is an important plot point) to do something that you’re never given any reason at all to do.
I never go into any MMO expecting “great writing”. Therefore I’m never disappointed.
Guild Wars 1 could have been a lot better. Guild Wars 2 could be a lot better. But there are some pretty cool things in Guild Wars 2, as there were in Guild Wars 1. If you want to ignore those things, go right ahead.
They’re still in the game.
How is that any better with living story achievements? Why would you let Duke Barradin’s ghost to get stronger normally? I don’t see any difference.
Also GW1 had his fair share of cool things as well, if not more than GW2.
I’m not saying, nor did I ever say Guild Wars 2 was better. If you can find where I did say that, by all means produce some evidence. I’d love to see it.
All I said, again and again, was that people are overestimating Guild Wars 1. Both games have strong and weak points. Particularly with regard to writing, both games are roughly equivalent. Both of the games are the same. That WAS my point.
I was responding to people who keep claiming the Guild Wars 1 writing was so much better.
Vayne, all your logic aside, but for the past two years you’ve made so many assumptions about how ANet thinks that someone might think you are actually working for them.
I make some assumptions. I make a lot of educated guesses, which aren’t assumptions, they’re educated guesses. It’s not illogical to think that businesses don’t make decisions willy nilly. So while some people say, there’s no possible reason for them to do this, I think of the possible reasons. But I also don’t out of hand dismiss what devs say. Take the NPE.
Colin came straight out and said why it exists. People choose not to listen or not to believe. Listening to what someone says (and seeing that it’s probably reasonable) isn’t making assumptions. It’s believing something someone is saying.
Group 1: They dumbed down the game because they think we’re idiots.
Group 2: They altered the game based on tests that they ran that said it kept people playing longer.
I’m having trouble picturing a meeting where devs say to each other, you know, our players are idiots, let’s make the game dumber. It’s not likely to have happened. People who are offended by the NPE are simply taking offense at something that was a logical business decision.
You don’t need to work for a developer to believe what they say.
Eye of the North, by far, had the best characters for me in Guild Wars 1. I really resonated with Pyre. But I didn’t particularly care much for Jora or Livia. I liked Vekk quite a lot. Hayda and Anton, not so much. Not sure if I ever really connected with Ogden either.
Vekk, Pyre, and Gwen were the ones that I favored in EotN, although I didn’t always use them as heroes. The guy who did Vekk’s voice – had to look him up: Maurice LaMarche – really did a great job bringing that character to life, especially considering the limited animation back then. I wish there was more Vekk in the GW2 asura.
I liked Zhed Shadowhoof from Nightfall, too.
Don’t know how I could forget Zhad and Gwen. Two of my favorite characters.
But you see, in Guild Wars 1 those characters traveled with you all the time. Constantly. You not only did missions with them, but you could take them with you if you wanted. In Guild Wars 2, you do a five minute story and don’t see them again for an hour.
So I don’t know how anyone could be expected to be as attached.
I mean you run through Factions and Menhlo and or Togo are with you almost 100% of the time.
I think what some people may equate with superior writing in Guild Wars 1 was a degree of focus on one particular narrative. This has been touched on earlier but it is worth repeating. Anet took on a daunting task with GW2, I think, that hasn’t faired too well with GW1 vets. They shifted from an “on-rails” storyline focusing on the human race in GW1 to a larger narrative featuring 5 different cultures in a game that gives you the freedom to experience the narrative at your own pace or even to avoid critical narratives completely.
Supplementing a linear narrative with Dynamic events in the open world does add sufficient color and context to the struggles of the different races. I thought that some of the Heart tasks like Asura testing the intelligence of the Skritt were very thought provoking. But even with the personal story added to that, the races felt too homogenized in terms of storytelling beyond a certain point. As others have said before, the racial storylines might have benefited from being longer or tying into the fight with the Dragons in a more organic way. This perspective may actually differ greatly for someone who hasn’t played the first game, but for me it was a stark contrast to GW1 which was a very different storytelling experience.
I suppose I am still asking myself if the story truly benefits from having multiple perspectives? I’m not quite sure that’s true yet. The Scarlet narrative was the beginning of moving us towards this ideal by weaving the Sylvari into the larger narrative in an organic way but it was handled in a truly awkward manner. GW2 is an experiment in many respects in terms of content delivery which includes storytelling. They’ve doubled back on how the story is going to be delivered from here on out. I can only hope they improve.
Or are you saying that Anet compares them as a matter of course now, or even since launch?
Every day.
Guild Wars 2 has two less professions now than Guild Wars 1 did it it’s whole life. That’s 20% less professions for those counting.
Guild Wars 2 has five times the races Guild Wars 1 has ever had. That’s 500% more races.
Guild Wars 2 has more variety in this manner than Guild Wars 1…and did so from launch.
Holy crap I want to smack you for even trying to make this seem legit lmao.
Everything you just said you should be ashamed of XD
GW1 is by far the most adaptable game when compared to GW2. You can’t compete with every class being able to combine with another class AND their weapons. If your idea was to say races actually matter then you flopped. Race skills are a joke and have no merit to them at all.
Guild Wars 2 has two less professions now than Guild Wars 1 did it it’s whole life. That’s 20% less professions for those counting.
Guild Wars 2 has five times the races Guild Wars 1 has ever had. That’s 500% more races.
Guild Wars 2 has more variety in this manner than Guild Wars 1…and did so from launch.
Holy crap I want to smack you for even trying to make this seem legit lmao.
Everything you just said you should be ashamed of XD
GW1 is by far the most adaptable game when compared to GW2. You can’t compete with every class being able to combine with another class AND their weapons. If your idea was to say races actually matter then you flopped. Race skills are a joke and have no merit to them at all.
I guess you think more people played Guld Wars 1 than Guild Wars 2. You’d probably be wrong about that.
See the kind of experience Guild Wars 1 offered was very different. Of course it had more build variety and more skills. And?
It had less quests and missions. That’s a fact. You can debate it all you want, but you’d be wrong. Demonstrably wrong.
I’m not ashamed of my opinion ever. And you saying I should be isn’t going to make me ashamed.
Guild Wars 2 has two less professions now than Guild Wars 1 did it it’s whole life. That’s 20% less professions for those counting.
Guild Wars 2 has five times the races Guild Wars 1 has ever had. That’s 500% more races.
Guild Wars 2 has more variety in this manner than Guild Wars 1…and did so from launch.
Holy crap I want to smack you for even trying to make this seem legit lmao.
Everything you just said you should be ashamed of XD
GW1 is by far the most adaptable game when compared to GW2. You can’t compete with every class being able to combine with another class AND their weapons. If your idea was to say races actually matter then you flopped. Race skills are a joke and have no merit to them at all.
I think he was just trying to say that GW2 has more playable races. If that’s the case, it’s relevant because it’s true. Racial skills are intentionally weak if you can remember the logic behind that. As for GW1 being the most “adaptable”? The secondary class system had balance challenges, strengths and weaknesses. For some players the complexity was a boon, for others it was off putting. Today, the reactions are largely the same for GW2 combat. There are difficulties balancing the class skills, some like the simplicity of the GW2 combat system and others find it off putting. GW2 combat is simply different than GW1 combat with different challenges. You are welcome to compare them as has been done in many threads.
The fact remains that the amount and type of content available now is different than what was available in GW1. I still don’t find comparing them relevant. What we know is that GW1 was not extremely experimental in terms of combat mechanics and content delivery. GW2 is all of those things. Development times for content is different and the development process internally appears to be very different. It’s clear to anyone who has been paying attention that Anet has gone back to the drawing board on content delivery and that has slowed delivery of new content down. GW1 wasn’t delivering the type of content found in GW2 at all. So, what are we really comparing?