Guild Wars 2

With the new druid announcement people are screaming “healer class yay!” Keep in mind that if you are healing you aren’t doing damage and therefore dragging on a fight and cooldowns are still lengthy. You are doing instanced content and people want to complete that instance as fast as possible.

A player using heals instead of being a fifth dmg output is going to make the run slower and the players who are better skilled can hold their own will not want you in their party. The core dungeons will never change. Anet said they weren’t working on new ones and are working on raids.

Healers in GW2 still cannot do direct target heals for any party member its all AoE and weak. Heals to other party members will always be too weak unless they are burst and have high cooldowns.

Moving on to tanks…. No aggro meter in GW2 so lets just stop right there.

What I saw from the druid was great support, not heals. Healing is just the secondary to the damage mitigation. GW2 as far as protecting allies has always been about damage mitigation, not healing…. mitigation in the way of blocks, reflects, blinds, protection boon, and weakness.

In conclusion, raids and dungeons will never need a dedicated healer or tank… just good damage mitigation. All content currently out on GW2 doesn’t require either. Players die because they don’t know how to play their profession.

I don’t ever want to have to stare at my UI and millions of skills and health bars, I want to play the game.

Keep in mind that most of the healing skills were dealing damage at the same time. To me, this is the worst thing that could happen to Guild Wars 2. I see no reason to bring anything but Druids. Why do we honestly need anything else? From what I heard, this sounds like a mandatory profession to bring to x game mode. I highly dislike that there is one profession that is a must, meaning it takes up a spot that otherwise another profession could fill. I am annoyed at this announcement, and how they have allowed this profession specialization to be designed. It has seemingly no drawbacks.

The only Trinity being added is Ranger is getting Trinity’s Link from Warframe.

Holy Trinity isn’t a thing still, and shouldn’t be. Not even in other MMOs. It’s a crappy limiting mechanic that ruins online play.

I’ve never been a fan of the trinity and it’s what drew me to GW2. Now I won’t say the sky is falling yet, but I am VERY worried that we’ll devolve into Tank/DPS/Heal specs.

I mean if that system is confined to just Raids, then so be it. I won’t raid. But I got the feeling this will trickle down to all aspects of play.

So right now, not a fan. But we’ll see. Maybe they’ll find a way to make healing big but so that healing comes as you naturally DPS? Something like that. Or make it so all professions can heal.

Maybe the devs think rangers aren’t getting kicked from groups often enough yet. :p

Yes trinity is the future of gw2. Unavoidable damage is the key.

That said they improved ele heals and gave revenant ventari stance for this healing purpose

Moving on to tanks…. No aggro meter in GW2 so lets just stop right there.

the example encounter they talked about in raids is in the trailer.

the raid team needs to break a wall, while also stopping a boss from killing them.

tanky and healy players concentrate on tanking the boss, while dpszerkers concentrate on breaking the wall.

that is how tanky can be rewarded in raids.

The funny thing is healing/tanking were always supposed to be at least semi-viable in GW2. The zerker meta got way out of hand.

I for one prefer to have more healing and tankiness in groups, especially if it means less glass cannon builds become the meta.

phys.7689:

Yes trinity is the future of gw2. Unavoidable damage is the key.

That said they improved ele heals and gave revenant ventari stance for this healing purpose

On the other hand, water is only one of four attunements on a class that’s encouraged to cycle between all their major cooldown abilities, and revenants are encouraged to switch legends often.

I’m already running celestial fire/water/arcane, and feel that I do enough damage as it is. Passive water healing applies while using an ice bow while simultaniously boosting the damage of conjured weapons incredibly vs vulnerable targets, casting the major cooldown heals in water attunement takes all of a couple of seconds, and, if using a staff, encourages you to either switch from, or to earth to blast the field that it provides (Either with Earth Staff 2, or earth evasive arcana).

and despite celestial stats, I still do more damage than my berserker mesmer.

What I don’t understand is that people complain about Druid being a dedicated healer when I have played my Guardian as a semi-healer since start. She heals with all symbols, she heals with 3rd auto-attack with mace, she heals with all 3 Utility skills, she heals when she dodge and more. The Revenant with Ventari could more or less spamheal all the time and with staff it makes for really good healing. Druid do have more healing but the question is, will it be better to go for full healing or try to find a build for a mix. I am going to try a Condition Shortbow/Staff Druid next BWE and see how that works. I am not going to complain until I tried it and I am happy as long as we don’t have to stand around waiting for a druid to join.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

With the new druid announcement people are screaming “healer class yay!” Keep in mind that if you are healing you aren’t doing damage and therefore dragging on a fight and cooldowns are still lengthy. You are doing instanced content and people want to complete that instance as fast as possible.

No… YOU want to finish it as fast as possible.
Don’t speak for other people.
I always enjoy the lore and the whole experience and couldn’t care less about rewards or loot.

You guys will have to adapt to a lot….

Sonickeyblade.8415:

I’ve never been a fan of the trinity and it’s what drew me to GW2. Now I won’t say the sky is falling yet, but I am VERY worried that we’ll devolve into Tank/DPS/Heal specs.

Nothing wrong with that. I can tell you tons of people were just waiting to get fun back into the game.

Anyone wonder whats going to happen to boss scaling in open world content? If there are so many people happy to have a healing spec, we might just see too many support players scaling bosses too much and not seeing enough damage to kill it. Funny, it sounds a lot like old conditions before the buff….

Sonickeyblade.8415:

I’ve never been a fan of the trinity and it’s what drew me to GW2. Now I won’t say the sky is falling yet, but I am VERY worried that we’ll devolve into Tank/DPS/Heal specs.

I mean if that system is confined to just Raids, then so be it. I won’t raid. But I got the feeling this will trickle down to all aspects of play.

So right now, not a fan. But we’ll see. Maybe they’ll find a way to make healing big but so that healing comes as you naturally DPS? Something like that. Or make it so all professions can heal.

You can’t tank because there’s no way to hold aggro.

Vayne.8563:

Sonickeyblade.8415:

I’ve never been a fan of the trinity and it’s what drew me to GW2. Now I won’t say the sky is falling yet, but I am VERY worried that we’ll devolve into Tank/DPS/Heal specs.

I mean if that system is confined to just Raids, then so be it. I won’t raid. But I got the feeling this will trickle down to all aspects of play.

So right now, not a fan. But we’ll see. Maybe they’ll find a way to make healing big but so that healing comes as you naturally DPS? Something like that. Or make it so all professions can heal.

You can’t tank because there’s no way to hold aggro.

Revnant’s taunt, pop it a soon as it is off cool down. and have this Improved Aggression trait: Taunted foes deal less damage to you. Taunt has an increased duration when applied to nonplayer characters. Taunt is a control effect that forces the affected target to run towards the source of taunt with all skills except stun breakers disabled while using their auto-attack skill.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

Moving on to tanks…. No aggro meter in GW2 so lets just stop right there.

Revenant, Taunt. Forces mob to attack them. there’s your threat and aggro management.

Healer/Support : Full Nomad/Cleric/… Druid Ranger, Staff Ele, Shout Guardian,…
Tank : Celestial Ele, Full Nomad Regen Warrior, Bunker Guardian,…
DPS : Whatever the heck Zerk/Dire build you’re going.

THE BARRIER IS BROKEN

In other news I heard the sky was falling ….
Can anyone confirm ?

Darsch.1705:

Vayne.8563:

Sonickeyblade.8415:

I’ve never been a fan of the trinity and it’s what drew me to GW2. Now I won’t say the sky is falling yet, but I am VERY worried that we’ll devolve into Tank/DPS/Heal specs.

I mean if that system is confined to just Raids, then so be it. I won’t raid. But I got the feeling this will trickle down to all aspects of play.

So right now, not a fan. But we’ll see. Maybe they’ll find a way to make healing big but so that healing comes as you naturally DPS? Something like that. Or make it so all professions can heal.

You can’t tank because there’s no way to hold aggro.

Revnant’s taunt, pop it a soon as it is off cool down. and have this Improved Aggression trait: Taunted foes deal less damage to you. Taunt has an increased duration when applied to nonplayer characters. Taunt is a control effect that forces the affected target to run towards the source of taunt with all skills except stun breakers disabled while using their auto-attack skill.

How is this any different from an elementalist or guardian just putting up a wall that stops enemies from getting to you in the first place, or a mesmer with master of fragmentations, mantra of distraction, a staff and a focus daze chaining a group?

We’ve seen how taunt works in the ranger pet. It’s no different from any other form of hard CC, it’s stopped by defiance/stability.

It’s just one among many crowd control abilities, and taking less damage < taking no damage.

Yes finally they come to their senses and give strict roles rather than everyone running around DPS’ing like it’s whack a mole

Esonver.8470:

Healer/Support : Full Nomad/Cleric/… Druid Ranger, Staff Ele, Shout Guardian,…
Tank : Celestial Ele, Full Nomad Regen Warrior, Bunker Guardian,…
DPS : Whatever the heck Zerk/Dire build you’re going.

THE BARRIER IS BROKEN

Why full nomad as a healer? If you’re healing berserkers, and they’re no getting bursted down, you’re probably fine running low defenses yourself. Wouldn’t it make more sense to run say, apothecary’s or zealot stats?

Alternatively, where you place full cavalier stat reapers? They have very close to berserker like power/crit chance/ferocity against vulnerability stacked enemies (2800 power, 61% crit chance before banners of discipline/spotter/fury, and 225% critical damage), while still being ridiculously tough to kill and sustaining through lifesteal, and the heal when applying a boon while reducing damage with over 3850 armor in death shroud, jagged horrors absorbing damage, three sources of condition removal, and -20% condition damage while still retaining the spite trait line’s +5% damage to targets with no boons and 20% extra damage to targets below 50%hp

I would like that especially when you can do content as a hybrid.

Let’s say the “meta” would be something like:

• 2 healers, 2 tanks and 6 dds

I think it would be nice if you can also go in as one of these and still beat the content in a decent time:

• 1 healer, 2 tanks, 5 dds and 2 healer/dd hybrids

• 2 healers, 1 tank, 5 dds and 2 tank/dd hybrids

• 0 healers, 2 tanks, 4 dds and 4 healer/dd hybrids

• 0 healers, 0 tanks, 2 dds and 4 healer/dd hybrids and 4 tank/dd hybrids

and so on!

If this is added to teh game then i am leaving it. A lot of people are playing this game because is no like others mmos and don’t have the stupid holy trinity.

XPilo.5862:

If this is added to teh game then i am leaving it. A lot of people are playing this game because is no like others mmos and don’t have the stupid holy trinity.

in before the “can i have your stuff”

Serious… if you are leaving because the fun is coming back nobody will miss you

Kirschsahne.2081:

XPilo.5862:

If this is added to teh game then i am leaving it. A lot of people are playing this game because is no like others mmos and don’t have the stupid holy trinity.

in before the “can i have your stuff”

Serious… if you are leaving because the fun is coming back nobody will miss you

We’ve yet to see if the fun will come back.

I’ve been promoting build diversity for a long time, and seriously dislike the current only berserker/assassin/sinister meta, but I’m worried that it’ll end up being replaced by an equally toxic meta that demands that everyone fill even more specific team compositions instead.

As it is, the main issue with the berserker meta is the perception people have that they must have this specific perfect team composition that can finish the content 40 seconds faster than the one they already have, and then are willing to kick and cycle applicants for the next 10 minutes when they’d finish it overall faster, and probably have more fun taking sub-optimal builds. I can usually just make my own “All welcome, not a speedrun” parties and bring along whomever applies and do fine.

Enforced necessary roles to complete the content at all runs the risk of being even more toxic than the berserker meta.

The other big issue with the berserker meta isn’t really the berserker meta, it’s the stacking meta, and given that most healing seems to be small radius AoEs… the stacking meta doesn’t look like it’s going anywhere.

XPilo.5862:

If this is added to teh game then i am leaving it. A lot of people are playing this game because is no like others mmos and don’t have the stupid holy trinity.

It’s not a trinity if a tank can’t hold aggro. There’s always been a trinity in this game, it’s called the soft trinity.

I can tell you all that healing and toughness is definitely needed in HoT. Hence the changes (esp with Druid). If you’re gunna zerk in HoT you might as well be standing in the very back of a crowd cuz the enemies are going to 1-shot you.

Ykfox.3825:

The funny thing is healing/tanking were always supposed to be at least semi-viable in GW2. The zerker meta got way out of hand.

I for one prefer to have more healing and tankiness in groups, especially if it means less glass cannon builds become the meta.

No they weren’t.

Or did you forget the actual, we don’t want to be a traditional trinity with tanks healers and dps speech that they kept saying over and over… and even repeated on stream today ?

The game is meant to have a very soft trinity of damage, control, and support. All of which exist. Adding specs that have over the top healing to fill the niche of people coming from other trinity based games isn’t the right way to uphold their design philosophy.

The Green Bar/Red Bar isn’t something any raid or hard content should be based around, but rather tactical and skillful use of abilities to negate damage, regroup (boons/heal), and positioning should matter far more than healbots.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

With the new druid announcement people are screaming “healer class yay!” Keep in mind that if you are healing you aren’t doing damage and therefore dragging on a fight and cooldowns are still lengthy. You are doing instanced content and people want to complete that instance as fast as possible.

A player using heals instead of being a fifth dmg output is going to make the run slower and the players who are better skilled can hold their own will not want you in their party. The core dungeons will never change. Anet said they weren’t working on new ones and are working on raids.

Healers in GW2 still cannot do direct target heals for any party member its all AoE and weak. Heals to other party members will always be too weak unless they are burst and have high cooldowns.

Moving on to tanks…. No aggro meter in GW2 so lets just stop right there.

What I saw from the druid was great support, not heals. Healing is just the secondary to the damage mitigation. GW2 as far as protecting allies has always been about damage mitigation, not healing…. mitigation in the way of blocks, reflects, blinds, protection boon, and weakness.

In conclusion, raids and dungeons will never need a dedicated healer or tank… just good damage mitigation. All content currently out on GW2 doesn’t require either. Players die because they don’t know how to play their profession.

I don’t ever want to have to stare at my UI and millions of skills and health bars, I want to play the game.

What?! just stop… please stop… Have you played any RAIDS YET? DID you hear what IRENIO said about the ZERK META? Clearly you havent, and you decided to type out a long post about BS.

RAIDS arent about DPS, DPS, DPS like everything GW2 has been for 3 years. DPS DPS DPS. Its BS and borderline boring!

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Purecura.1795:

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Remind me what’s unique about the Green Bar / Red Bar playstyle again ?
From what i can recall it’s been in every game since well….pong.

Not a very unique playstyle.

Opening up the game to more people i have no problem with, so long as they stop shifting the goalpost on what this game was designed to be.

This game was not designed to be a traditional trinity system….and so far we are coming ever closer to it. For what purpose ? Hard content, Incorporating more players ? Take your pick its as good as anyone else. However if it truly is the later, then these people need to do the proper research into a product before expecting it to be yet another Traditional MMO clone.

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Remind me what’s unique about the Green Bar / Red Bar playstyle again ?
From what i can recall it’s been in every game since well….pong.

Not a very unique playstyle.

Opening up the game to more people i have no problem with, so long as they stop shifting the goalpost on what this game was designed to be.

This game was not designed to be a traditional trinity system….and so far we are coming ever closer to it. For what purpose ? Hard content, Incorporating more players ? Take your pick its as good as anyone else. However if it truly is the later, then these people need to do the proper research into a product before expecting it to be yet another Traditional MMO clone.

See, this is the thing. Guild Wars 2 wanted to get rid of the TRINITY, which resulted in the BIRTH of the super boring, uninspiring, BESERKER META. Which imo is less exciting than the age old TRINITY SYSTEM. There is a huge reason why ANET said that ELITE SPECS, are going to offer unique roles to combat in GW2. If they were fine, and the player base was fine with the ZERK META, then I believe these class changes would not be happening.

But clearly ANET and many others realize they missed their mark on letting the trinity go and incorporating something NEW. Iam not saying you need a TRINITY, but you need to offer something more than just DPS DPS DPS, STACK STACK STACK.

With the elite specs including druid’s healing role, it adds more variety to many unique players who dont want to be forced into ZERK GEAR ONLY PLS.

Purecura.1795:

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Remind me what’s unique about the Green Bar / Red Bar playstyle again ?
From what i can recall it’s been in every game since well….pong.

Not a very unique playstyle.

Opening up the game to more people i have no problem with, so long as they stop shifting the goalpost on what this game was designed to be.

This game was not designed to be a traditional trinity system….and so far we are coming ever closer to it. For what purpose ? Hard content, Incorporating more players ? Take your pick its as good as anyone else. However if it truly is the later, then these people need to do the proper research into a product before expecting it to be yet another Traditional MMO clone.

See, this is the thing. Guild Wars 2 wanted to get rid of the TRINITY, which resulted in the BIRTH of the super boring, uninspiring, BESERKER META. Which imo is less exciting than the age old TRINITY SYSTEM. There is a huge reason why ANET said that ELITE SPECS, are going to offer unique roles to combat in GW2. If they were fine, and the player base was fine with the ZERK META, then I believe these class changes would not be happening.

But clearly ANET and many others realize they missed their mark on letting the trinity go and incorporating something NEW. Iam not saying you need a TRINITY, but you need to offer something more than just DPS DPS DPS, STACK STACK STACK.

With the elite specs including druid’s healing role, it adds more variety to many unique players who dont want to be forced into ZERK GEAR ONLY PLS.

There was already plenty of variety to begin with.

Tell me how adding a trope of a spec is adding more ? I must surely be missing it.

Also, per forcing players into “Zerk Meta” im sorry, but no one has ever forced you to do anything of the sort. That choice is solely in the hands of players. It was your choice as a person to either conform or reject said meta. Unfortunately too many players are blind to the fact that the “Zerk Meta” is only relevant in speed clearing content and thus adopted it without understanding or knowing why its done.

So sure you may find the current “Zerk Meta” boring, but who are you to force your ideal onto others ? This is the underlying problem with the whole concept of this change. Not once was i asked if i found the Green Bar/Red Bar meta or traditional trinity boring … do i not get an equal voice ?

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Remind me what’s unique about the Green Bar / Red Bar playstyle again ?
From what i can recall it’s been in every game since well….pong.

Not a very unique playstyle.

Opening up the game to more people i have no problem with, so long as they stop shifting the goalpost on what this game was designed to be.

This game was not designed to be a traditional trinity system….and so far we are coming ever closer to it. For what purpose ? Hard content, Incorporating more players ? Take your pick its as good as anyone else. However if it truly is the later, then these people need to do the proper research into a product before expecting it to be yet another Traditional MMO clone.

See, this is the thing. Guild Wars 2 wanted to get rid of the TRINITY, which resulted in the BIRTH of the super boring, uninspiring, BESERKER META. Which imo is less exciting than the age old TRINITY SYSTEM. There is a huge reason why ANET said that ELITE SPECS, are going to offer unique roles to combat in GW2. If they were fine, and the player base was fine with the ZERK META, then I believe these class changes would not be happening.

But clearly ANET and many others realize they missed their mark on letting the trinity go and incorporating something NEW. Iam not saying you need a TRINITY, but you need to offer something more than just DPS DPS DPS, STACK STACK STACK.

With the elite specs including druid’s healing role, it adds more variety to many unique players who dont want to be forced into ZERK GEAR ONLY PLS.

There was already plenty of variety to begin with.

Tell me how adding a trope of a spec is adding more ? I must surely be missing it.

Also, per forcing players into “Zerk Meta” im sorry, but no one has ever forced you to do anything of the sort. That choice is solely in the hands of players. It was your choice as a person to either conform or reject said meta. Unfortunately too many players are blind to the fact that the “Zerk Meta” is only relevant in speed clearing content and thus adopted it without understanding or knowing why its done.

So sure you may find the current “Zerk Meta” boring, but who are you to force your ideal onto others ? This is the underlying problem with the whole concept of this change. Not once was i asked if i found the Green Bar/Red Bar meta or traditional trinity boring … do i not get an equal voice ?

The thing that everyone misses is that ANET wasn’t intending to fully abandon the Trinity it intended to make a game where you don’t have to wait for a healer or tank or DPS player to be around for you to do missions. Thus in Dungeons any team of 5 can work with either a team with a Trinity style build, a pure Zerker team or an imaginative new team dynamic. Letting players change their roles with the same characters gave them flexibility. The Trinity was supposed to still happen in a way but organically not forced.

Never got the hate for trinity. From a design standpoint its better to have something like a trinity to create encounters around, which can make fights much more interesting. Without its more of just an orgy hoping the dps output can outmatch the dmg received.

What would have been interesting is if they kept a trinity like structure, but allow any class to fill the roles in one way or another. This would require some creativity obviously.

Right now its just jack of all trades, master of none.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

Keep in mind that if you are healing you aren’t doing damage and therefore dragging on a fight and cooldowns are still lengthy. You are doing instanced content and people want to complete that instance as fast as possible.

Keep in mind having such an option allows other DPS focussed classes to drop healing skills and damage mitigation gear-sets altogether in order to focus on more DPS.

This may result in completing said content faster.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

Moving on to tanks…. No aggro meter in GW2 so lets just stop right there.

EQ2 didn’t had an aggrometer for 5 years .. it was much more fun than having a
built in easymode .. oh and no bossmods that do all the work for you .. and no
healbots and whatever.

Kirschsahne.2081:

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

With the new druid announcement people are screaming “healer class yay!” Keep in mind that if you are healing you aren’t doing damage and therefore dragging on a fight and cooldowns are still lengthy. You are doing instanced content and people want to complete that instance as fast as possible.

No… YOU want to finish it as fast as possible.
Don’t speak for other people.
I always enjoy the lore and the whole experience and couldn’t care less about rewards or loot.

You guys will have to adapt to a lot….

So let’s make a deal – send me the loot you make and don’t care about and I’ll tell you wonderful lore things that you never even knew existed.

BrooksP.4318:

Never got the hate for trinity. From a design standpoint its better to have something like a trinity to create encounters around, which can make fights much more interesting. Without its more of just an orgy hoping the dps output can outmatch the dmg received.

What would have been interesting is if they kept a trinity like structure, but allow any class to fill the roles in one way or another. This would require some creativity obviously.

Right now its just jack of all trades, master of none.

The problem with no “trinity” or ROLES is balancing. The professions aren’t balanced around any roles and because of that they are completly unbalanced for certain encounters.

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Remind me what’s unique about the Green Bar / Red Bar playstyle again ?
From what i can recall it’s been in every game since well….pong.

Not a very unique playstyle.

Opening up the game to more people i have no problem with, so long as they stop shifting the goalpost on what this game was designed to be.

This game was not designed to be a traditional trinity system….and so far we are coming ever closer to it. For what purpose ? Hard content, Incorporating more players ? Take your pick its as good as anyone else. However if it truly is the later, then these people need to do the proper research into a product before expecting it to be yet another Traditional MMO clone.

The problem with mixing “incorporate more players” and “hard content:” is that these goals are mutually exclusive.

BrooksP.4318:

Never got the hate for trinity. From a design standpoint its better to have something like a trinity to create encounters around, which can make fights much more interesting. Without its more of just an orgy hoping the dps output can outmatch the dmg received.

What would have been interesting is if they kept a trinity like structure, but allow any class to fill the roles in one way or another. This would require some creativity obviously.

Right now its just jack of all trades, master of none.

That was my point. That’s exactly what they were trying to do but the encounters they came up with were what killed the trinity and gave birth to the zerker meta. The PvE was way too easy for a speed zerk team to get through and with everyone self healing and dodging enough to survive even with the lowest defenses then there is no need for a healer or tank. With creative missions maybe a main tank or healer will be needed to overcome some missions and players will just have to adjust to it. More than likely they will make missions where everyone will have to switch to tank mode to win, or healer mode to get through and it still won’t be a trinity just DPS mission, Tank missions and Healer missions. Well I guess thats a different type of trinity.

Ykfox.3825:

The funny thing is healing/tanking were always supposed to be at least semi-viable in GW2. The zerker meta got way out of hand.

I for one prefer to have more healing and tankiness in groups, especially if it means less glass cannon builds become the meta.

Well a litle bit of everything does not hurt and gives more space for further builds to apear , and roles does no mean holy trinity, reason they are giving more ways to fit those.
zerker being the gear out damage everything no matter what other non zerker player do isnt a nice mechanic either.

This way we will have damage, support and control, instead of caring only about tunning every char just for best ouput damage.

roles =/= holy trinity

Like WP said, put down a water field, blast it, and you’re at 100% HP. Druid has no place in meta currently. We have to see how raids are.

Akrasia.5469:

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

TexZero.7910:

Purecura.1795:

Now that we have ROLES and harder content in HoT. We need to open up more to the playerbase. Why should every class focus on DPS? That Boring and so not creative in terms of gameplay.

Druid offers a unique approach to gameplay during raids. See it as something new, breaking the old. jesus you ppl whine and complain about stupid kitten

Remind me what’s unique about the Green Bar / Red Bar playstyle again ?
From what i can recall it’s been in every game since well….pong.

Not a very unique playstyle.

Opening up the game to more people i have no problem with, so long as they stop shifting the goalpost on what this game was designed to be.

This game was not designed to be a traditional trinity system….and so far we are coming ever closer to it. For what purpose ? Hard content, Incorporating more players ? Take your pick its as good as anyone else. However if it truly is the later, then these people need to do the proper research into a product before expecting it to be yet another Traditional MMO clone.

See, this is the thing. Guild Wars 2 wanted to get rid of the TRINITY, which resulted in the BIRTH of the super boring, uninspiring, BESERKER META. Which imo is less exciting than the age old TRINITY SYSTEM. There is a huge reason why ANET said that ELITE SPECS, are going to offer unique roles to combat in GW2. If they were fine, and the player base was fine with the ZERK META, then I believe these class changes would not be happening.

But clearly ANET and many others realize they missed their mark on letting the trinity go and incorporating something NEW. Iam not saying you need a TRINITY, but you need to offer something more than just DPS DPS DPS, STACK STACK STACK.

With the elite specs including druid’s healing role, it adds more variety to many unique players who dont want to be forced into ZERK GEAR ONLY PLS.

There was already plenty of variety to begin with.

Tell me how adding a trope of a spec is adding more ? I must surely be missing it.

Also, per forcing players into “Zerk Meta” im sorry, but no one has ever forced you to do anything of the sort. That choice is solely in the hands of players. It was your choice as a person to either conform or reject said meta. Unfortunately too many players are blind to the fact that the “Zerk Meta” is only relevant in speed clearing content and thus adopted it without understanding or knowing why its done.

So sure you may find the current “Zerk Meta” boring, but who are you to force your ideal onto others ? This is the underlying problem with the whole concept of this change. Not once was i asked if i found the Green Bar/Red Bar meta or traditional trinity boring … do i not get an equal voice ?

The thing that everyone misses is that ANET wasn’t intending to fully abandon the Trinity it intended to make a game where you don’t have to wait for a healer or tank or DPS player to be around for you to do missions. Thus in Dungeons any team of 5 can work with either a team with a Trinity style build, a pure Zerker team or an imaginative new team dynamic. Letting players change their roles with the same characters gave them flexibility. The Trinity was supposed to still happen in a way but organically not forced.

They did intend to fully abandon the trinity. Just because they say all that now as if they never said otherwise, well the internet still exist.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:N62RwpegAHcJ:www.teamquitter.com/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D55%26t%3D27568%26start%3D0%26view%3Dprint+&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/17973-getting-rid-of-holy-trinity-my-thoughts-on-it/

http://www.gamewatcher.com/news/2012-30-03-arenanet-guild-wars-2-class-system-inspired-by-team-fortress-2

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/25765-arenanet-play-your-way-%E2%80%93-jon-peters-on-traits-and-attributes/

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/22836-interview-guild-wars-2-pvp-roundtable-with-arenanet-guild-wars-insider/

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/23473-why-will-gw2-combat-be-different-trinity-discussion/

in every single mention of GW2’s trinity, they always mention “damage/support/control”

guess what? those are just abstractions on top of DPS/Heal/Tank

Damage is obvious, so I won’t go into it

Support is boons, debilitating conditions, and HEALING

Control is more subtle, the whole point of control is “make sure the enemy isn’t killing people” how to do that? well, either by DPSing them down ASAP (as has been done the past three years), kiting, locking them down with CC, or TANKING (after all, what is tanking but a form of control? the enemy is attacking the person least likely to die)

they are not adding the Holy Trinity, they are adding more options to their Soft Trinity, want to tank? now you can, want to heal? now you can. want to go in and kite instead of dodging? nobody is stopping you. want to forgo heals and tanking for more DPS? don’t let me stop you.

they have added options, they are NOT enforcing those options.