Guild Wars 2

tigirius.9014:

posts a thread about all the ways that GW2 is not casual….

gets this reaction.

Casual and proud of it. This is a game, and I treat it as such.

It’s not a job, or an obligation, nothing terrible is going to happen if I walk away from it for a few days, or a few months. I’ve done both.

Your attitude towards the game is… not so casual.

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

tigirius.9014:

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

Saying casual means “relaxed and unconcerned” and then immediately saying he feels obligated to farm dungeons seems pretty hypocritical if he’s claiming to be casual.

tigirius.9014:

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

But if they’re adding stuff every month and you have a month to do it and the next month they do more , that is stuff for casuals. Arguably, casuals would need less permanent stuff than people that play constantly, since it’s unlikely they’ll burn through all the content in the first place. It’s the content locusts who need more permanent content.

And again, dailies are primary done the way they are for the casuals.

Vayne.8563:

tigirius.9014:

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

But if they’re adding stuff every month and you have a month to do it and the next month they do more , that is stuff for casuals. Arguably, casuals would need less permanent stuff than people that play constantly, since it’s unlikely they’ll burn through all the content in the first place. It’s the content locusts who need more permanent content.

And again, dailies are primary done the way they are for the casuals.

However they would still remain inequal. Because it would only take 7 runs for you to gather the amount of dungeon currency to get the full set of gear you need as opposed to his 30 days for 1 piece. See the difference there?

Biohazard.4196:

tigirius.9014:

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

Saying casual means “relaxed and unconcerned” and then immediately saying he feels obligated to farm dungeons seems pretty hypocritical if he’s claiming to be casual.

Not if he means he feels obligated to run dungeons because that’s the only means given him to achieve his goals end game, thus limiting choice, thus not being casual because running dungeons is usually a stressfilled experience, I know it is for me. All choices for gameplay style leading to the same end game experience.

Dungeon running is not a casual activity even in WoW it wasn’t it was forced upon the populous until even the devs at WoW understood what was happening and why people left their game en masse just like they did recently, because there wasn’t enough things to do in PVE to fill the spaces between the guild/dungeon runs/raids so they added solo dungeons and multiple other mini games (other then the longest lasting one fishing), the same goes for Rift, the same goes for SWTOR they all one by one realized.

That’s all this thread was about really is it’s not casual because it doesn’t cater to the gather/farmer/RP style players enough, they’ve been so focused on PVP WVW and Dungeons that they have completely forgotten a very large bulk of their playerbase and I think with their recent change in patches separating the PVE PVP WVW coded behaviors they’ve gotten the message, the question is where will they go from here.

tigirius.9014:

posts a thread about all the ways that GW2 is not casual….

gets this reaction.

I don’t think anyone responded that way; you’ve been the most hostile person in this thread so far.

tigirius.9014:

Not if he means he feels obligated to run dungeons because that’s the only means given him to achieve his goals end game, thus limiting choice, thus not being casual because running dungeons is usually a stressfilled experience, I know it is for me. All choices for gameplay style leading to the same end game experience.

…

That’s all this thread was about really is it’s not casual because it doesn’t cater to the gather/farmer/RP style players enough

I assume you mean that he feels obligated to run dungeons because he wants money. There are other ways in the game to earn money, even if they aren’t as quick. Thus, his choice is not limited by gameplay style. There’s a time imbalance, which is another issue, and one that I am not going to defend.

What I will say is that correlating farming with casual play seems odd to me. That seems to be the crux of your problem: that the casual player can’t farm quickly enough. I suppose I just don’t understand the need of a “casual player” to farm quickly for money. It seems paradoxical. Perhaps we have different versions of the term “casual.”

tigirius.9014:

However they would still remain inequal. Because it would only take 7 runs for you to gather the amount of dungeon currency to get the full set of gear you need as opposed to his 30 days for 1 piece. See the difference there?

and casuals tend to play for fun and enjoyment. What difference does it make how long it will take to out gear a character? If you’re having fun doing 1 path of a dungeon a day I doubt that you’re very stressed about not having the full gear right now. “I want it right now” is not a casual attitude, however they are not excluded from activities such as dungeons just because they’re casual.

Mirta.5029:

and casuals tend to play for fun and enjoyment. What difference does it make how long it will take to out gear a character? If you’re having fun doing 1 path of a dungeon a day I doubt that you’re very stressed about not having the full gear right now. “I want it right now” is not a casual attitude, however they are not excluded from activities such as dungeons just because they’re casual.

Agreed. If the OP is now trying to suggest that casual players should be able to earn xp and equipment at the same rate as someone who plays 6 hours a day, that’s just silly. If I’m playing 2 days a week I don’t expect to be competing with hardcore players for the most expensive stuff in the game … and as a casual player, that’s not what motivates me to play anyway.

The way the game is set up that hardcore gal is gonna have a full set of armor, sure, but the stats are going to be almost the same as the elite set I buy off the trading post with the couple gold I make a week. So the only reason I need to run those dungeons is if I want an armor skin I can’t buy from Black Lion; that’s it.

I’m more worried about coloring my armor and buying different outfits for different zones than I am over a difference of a couple stat points.

Biohazard.4196:

What I will say is that correlating farming with casual play seems odd to me. That seems to be the crux of your problem: that the casual player can’t farm quickly enough. I suppose I just don’t understand the need of a “casual player” to farm quickly for money. It seems paradoxical. Perhaps we have different versions of the term “casual.”

Personally, I’d say a casual player is more of a gardener than a farmer. If you’re into farming, that ain’t casual.

I came into this thread bracing for another whine-fest about gated content, or precursor drop rate, or ascended items, etc.

It turns out to be a list of 9 things I personally think are awesome and want.
Especially housing. Badly.

In all fairness, some of these things are (vaguely) stated to be in the works. Still, they are not here, unfortunately

+1.

I’m hoping, when housing does eventually come along, that they make good use of the cities and districts so they fill back up. I also have a thing for Ebonhawke so I hope stuff some housing in there as well.

tigirius.9014:

Biohazard.4196:

tigirius.9014:

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

Saying casual means “relaxed and unconcerned” and then immediately saying he feels obligated to farm dungeons seems pretty hypocritical if he’s claiming to be casual.

Not if he means he feels obligated to run dungeons because that’s the only means given him to achieve his goals end game, thus limiting choice, thus not being casual because running dungeons is usually a stressfilled experience, I know it is for me. All choices for gameplay style leading to the same end game experience.

Dungeon running is not a casual activity even in WoW it wasn’t it was forced upon the populous until even the devs at WoW understood what was happening and why people left their game en masse just like they did recently, because there wasn’t enough things to do in PVE to fill the spaces between the guild/dungeon runs/raids so they added solo dungeons and multiple other mini games (other then the longest lasting one fishing), the same goes for Rift, the same goes for SWTOR they all one by one realized.

That’s all this thread was about really is it’s not casual because it doesn’t cater to the gather/farmer/RP style players enough, they’ve been so focused on PVP WVW and Dungeons that they have completely forgotten a very large bulk of their playerbase and I think with their recent change in patches separating the PVE PVP WVW coded behaviors they’ve gotten the message, the question is where will they go from here.

Casuals do not care how long it takes to get the end game.
Casuals play when they can, if they can – which on this game and any other MMO will net you only what you put in effort to.

You keep repeating you are “forced” to do dungeons. Who “forced” you to do them? I may have missed ANet’s announcement instructing me to do a dungeon run…

Question is, why do you feel “obliged”? It only means you are competing with people and time – which defeats the meaning of the casual player – “Relaxed and unconcerned”.

These threads get nowhere, because there will literally never be any middleground to determine what casual really is…ever. Subjective, to state the obvious. Casual by definition means infrequent. Put that into context and you have a casual person=someone who doesn’t have a lot of fixed time to play the game, period.

But what a lot of you plebs have to get through your skull, is that how this game does have a status ladder. And yes you do have to be a frequent player to stay the top of this ladder. It’s not in the form of getting from gate 1 to gate 2 in progression through gear stat increases. It’s in the visuals. Think about it. You see a guy in full T3 and a couple legendaries….you’re going to say “Hey I wanna be like that guy…but I’m a pleb and have no time….oh well.” It’s the same thing. That person put in just as much time if not more to become a status symbol, just like the guy in the #1 guild in WoW raiding ladders. This game isn’t any more or less casual than other MMOs. Just stop fooling yourselves and saying it is.

Borked.6824:

Think about it. You see a guy in full T3 and a couple legendaries….you’re going to say “Hey I wanna be like that guy…but I’m a pleb and have no time….oh well.” It’s the same thing. That person put in just as much time if not more to become a status symbol, just like the guy in the #1 guild in WoW raiding ladders. This game isn’t any more or less casual than other MMOs. Just stop fooling yourselves and saying it is.

I thought that way when I first played Rift. Seeing max-level toons strutting around in raid gear or such, while my toon wears a bathrobe with a hood… but when I realized that to get that gear I would have to do a lot of things that didn’t really seem fun to me, I decided that it wasn’t such a big deal if I never got the cool stuff. So I looked for cool stuff that was within reach of my abilities and where I wanted to go within the game.

I felt the same way when I first read about Legendary Weapons, they’re cool and all, but seeing how obsessive people get about them, and the investment of time, in-game and real money, and frustration they involve… it’s not worth it just to be like the other dozen or so toons standing around Lion’s Arch looking cool.

But I’m like that in RL too, I’ve never cared about making people jealous or status among my peers… I just do my own thing and hang out with others who will accept a person for who he is.

tolunart.2095:

Borked.6824:

Think about it. You see a guy in full T3 and a couple legendaries….you’re going to say “Hey I wanna be like that guy…but I’m a pleb and have no time….oh well.” It’s the same thing. That person put in just as much time if not more to become a status symbol, just like the guy in the #1 guild in WoW raiding ladders. This game isn’t any more or less casual than other MMOs. Just stop fooling yourselves and saying it is.

I thought that way when I first played Rift. Seeing max-level toons strutting around in raid gear or such, while my toon wears a bathrobe with a hood… but when I realized that to get that gear I would have to do a lot of things that didn’t really seem fun to me, I decided that it wasn’t such a big deal if I never got the cool stuff. So I looked for cool stuff that was within reach of my abilities and where I wanted to go within the game.

I felt the same way when I first read about Legendary Weapons, they’re cool and all, but seeing how obsessive people get about them, and the investment of time, in-game and real money, and frustration they involve… it’s not worth it just to be like the other dozen or so toons standing around Lion’s Arch looking cool.

But I’m like that in RL too, I’ve never cared about making people jealous or status among my peers… I just do my own thing and hang out with others who will accept a person for who he is.

I’ve regressed into that as well. And most people would make a generalization and label you/me as a casual. But you understand what I’m saying at least… and confirm my point. There are many things in this game that cannot be obtained through a casual play style…which makes this game no more casual than any other MMO.

Borked.6824:

These threads get nowhere, because there will literally never be any middleground to determine what casual really is…ever. Subjective, to state the obvious. Casual by definition means infrequent. Put that into context and you have a casual person=someone who doesn’t have a lot of fixed time to play the game, period.

But what a lot of you plebs have to get through your skull, is that how this game does have a status ladder. And yes you do have to be a frequent player to stay the top of this ladder. It’s not in the form of getting from gate 1 to gate 2 in progression through gear stat increases. It’s in the visuals. Think about it. You see a guy in full T3 and a couple legendaries….you’re going to say “Hey I wanna be like that guy…but I’m a pleb and have no time….oh well.” It’s the same thing. That person put in just as much time if not more to become a status symbol, just like the guy in the #1 guild in WoW raiding ladders. This game isn’t any more or less casual than other MMOs. Just stop fooling yourselves and saying it is.

The difference is – you have the same stats as the guy with a legendary – only your weapon’s skin – sucks compared to his.

All games MMO needs time and effort – the difference is, on GW2, you can still compete using rares/common exotics to the players who got that shiny legendary. There is no pressure from the community to get that legendary because it’s powerful. The pressure comes from the player because he wants it.

Want < Need.

Players are the ones making this non-casual due to their thinking. “Ohhhh I want a legendary but I don’t wanna work on it for more than 30 minutes. I need to have it in less than 30 minutes” – seriously, some guys sounds like that.

Borked.6824:

I’ve regressed into that as well. And most people would make a generalization and label you/me as a casual. But you understand what I’m saying at least… and confirm my point. There are many things in this game that cannot be obtained through a casual play style…which makes this game no more casual than any other MMO.

the difference is that with other games you would fall behind a player if you didn’t get the right gear. Here some of the highest tier gear (ascended amulets and rings) can be gotten by just logging in and doing your daily. Plus the difference between gear tiers is minimal. So while one will be running around in rares a person in full exotics will not one shot them if they entered combat.
So yes, some skins would not be achievable or would take a long while to achieve (let’s say every day you earn 50 silver and bank it, don’t use it, just bank it – in a year you will have your cultural Tier 3 shinny gear. Other people might have achieved a legendary in that time, but the most expensive skin for armor is not out of your reach if you set it as your goal), but at least you wouldn’t perform worse than a hardcore player because of not having those skins.

Borked.6824:

I’ve regressed into that as well. And most people would make a generalization and label you/me as a casual. But you understand what I’m saying at least… and confirm my point. There are many things in this game that cannot be obtained through a casual play style…which makes this game no more casual than any other MMO.

Hm, I’m not sure how refusing to grind until my eyes bleed for a fancy weapon skin proves your point… I AM a casual player, I play the game on my own terms and walk away from it when I have had enough. If I was any more casual about the game I’d only log in when I’m at my buddy’s house and he gets tired of playing the game so I log into a toon I created on his account, chat in LA for an hour and log out.

There’s nothing wrong with the OP asking for things he’d like to see introduced into the game. However, it was inaccurate to couch the post in terms of, “These things would make the game more casual-friendly.” I’m about as casual as it gets, and I have no interest in any of his suggestions.

Sorry to derail the derailment by talking about the original post. Carry on.

knives.6345:

Borked.6824:

These threads get nowhere, because there will literally never be any middleground to determine what casual really is…ever. Subjective, to state the obvious. Casual by definition means infrequent. Put that into context and you have a casual person=someone who doesn’t have a lot of fixed time to play the game, period.

But what a lot of you plebs have to get through your skull, is that how this game does have a status ladder. And yes you do have to be a frequent player to stay the top of this ladder. It’s not in the form of getting from gate 1 to gate 2 in progression through gear stat increases. It’s in the visuals. Think about it. You see a guy in full T3 and a couple legendaries….you’re going to say “Hey I wanna be like that guy…but I’m a pleb and have no time….oh well.” It’s the same thing. That person put in just as much time if not more to become a status symbol, just like the guy in the #1 guild in WoW raiding ladders. This game isn’t any more or less casual than other MMOs. Just stop fooling yourselves and saying it is.

The difference is – you have the same stats as the guy with a legendary – only your weapon’s skin – sucks compared to his.

All games MMO needs time and effort – the difference is, on GW2, you can still compete using rares/common exotics to the players who got that shiny legendary. There is no pressure from the community to get that legendary because it’s powerful. The pressure comes from the player because he wants it.

Want < Need.

Players are the ones making this non-casual due to their thinking. “Ohhhh I want a legendary but I don’t wanna work on it for more than 30 minutes. I need to have it in less than 30 minutes” – seriously, some guys sounds like that.

That exact notion is what I’m refuting. What difference is there in stats vs. looks? You see a guy with 100 more power than you…you say “ooh he’s gonna hit like a truck!” You see a guy with a shiny legendary…you say “ooh this guy’s got experience he must be prosauce!” Same thing! You can’t deny human psychology though. In the face of social heirarchy there will be jealousy, and there will be ostracism…which is why we make labels such as hardcore and casual.

IndigoSundown.5419:

There’s nothing wrong with the OP asking for things he’d like to see introduced into the game. However, it was inaccurate to couch the post in terms of, “These things would make the game more casual-friendly.” I’m about as casual as it gets, and I have no interest in any of his suggestions.

Sorry to derail the derailment by talking about the original post. Carry on.

No, there is absolutely nothing wrong. But saying Gw2 is not casual because those things are listed… well…

Borked.6824:

That exact notion is what I’m refuting. What difference is there in stats vs. looks? You see a guy with 100 more power than you…you say “ooh he’s gonna hit like a truck!” You see a guy with a shiny legendary…you say “ooh this guy’s got experience he must be prosauce!” Same thing! You can’t deny human psychology though. In the face of social heirarchy there will be jealousy, and there will be ostracism…which is why we make labels such as hardcore and casual.

Actually I feel sorry for the guy who spent 1000 hours doing things that are incredibly not-fun just to stand around the city looking cool. Because one day he’ll wake up and realize that he wasted his life doing things he hates just so that other people will like him. I’d much rather spend my time doing things I enjoy, and like myself more in the process.

Borked.6824:

knives.6345:

Borked.6824:

These threads get nowhere, because there will literally never be any middleground to determine what casual really is…ever. Subjective, to state the obvious. Casual by definition means infrequent. Put that into context and you have a casual person=someone who doesn’t have a lot of fixed time to play the game, period.

But what a lot of you plebs have to get through your skull, is that how this game does have a status ladder. And yes you do have to be a frequent player to stay the top of this ladder. It’s not in the form of getting from gate 1 to gate 2 in progression through gear stat increases. It’s in the visuals. Think about it. You see a guy in full T3 and a couple legendaries….you’re going to say “Hey I wanna be like that guy…but I’m a pleb and have no time….oh well.” It’s the same thing. That person put in just as much time if not more to become a status symbol, just like the guy in the #1 guild in WoW raiding ladders. This game isn’t any more or less casual than other MMOs. Just stop fooling yourselves and saying it is.

The difference is – you have the same stats as the guy with a legendary – only your weapon’s skin – sucks compared to his.

All games MMO needs time and effort – the difference is, on GW2, you can still compete using rares/common exotics to the players who got that shiny legendary. There is no pressure from the community to get that legendary because it’s powerful. The pressure comes from the player because he wants it.

Want < Need.

Players are the ones making this non-casual due to their thinking. “Ohhhh I want a legendary but I don’t wanna work on it for more than 30 minutes. I need to have it in less than 30 minutes” – seriously, some guys sounds like that.

That exact notion is what I’m refuting. What difference is there in stats vs. looks? You see a guy with 100 more power than you…you say “ooh he’s gonna hit like a truck!” You see a guy with a shiny legendary…you say “ooh this guy’s got experience he must be prosauce!” Same thing! You can’t deny human psychology though. In the face of social heirarchy there will be jealousy, and there will be ostracism…which is why we make labels such as hardcore and casual.

But then again, the notion that says GW2 is not for casual is wrong – since here, you could do content with your crappy looking gear the way players with shiny gears do the content.

Sure, Legendary items are drool magnets – but the main point is – you are still equal with that guy, compared to other MMO’s that with your crappy items = won’t take you further into content unless you replace them with less crappy items until you get those high-end-gears.

Shiny things = players preference. If you don’t have the time for it/patience to do it – deal with it – welcome to reality. Atleast you can still compete with others. You are on equal footing.

Borked.6824:

That exact notion is what I’m refuting. What difference is there in stats vs. looks? You see a guy with 100 more power than you…you say “ooh he’s gonna hit like a truck!” You see a guy with a shiny legendary…you say “ooh this guy’s got experience he must be prosauce!” Same thing! You can’t deny human psychology though. In the face of social heirarchy there will be jealousy, and there will be ostracism…which is why we make labels such as hardcore and casual.

The difference is being able to participate in PvP of any kind and still being invited to run some dungeons if you feel like it years after the game was released.
I very much remember that sad feeling in WoW of entering Battlegrounds, loving them, but not really be of any help or be able to do much because I was getting one hit killed by the guy in better gear. All you can do is be a meat shield on a point. When you get killed and the point will start to be taken you can then tell your team that that point will be contested soon. Other than that you just stand there wishing that you could join in on the action on equal grounds. That’s why some people chose to cap their level at 20 and only do battlegrounds at that level range.
The same is with dungeons. You take a huge break, sign in and feel like doing a dungeon that you remember and miss. Suddenly you’re not good enough, because 3 other gear tiers were out and because you would do close to nothing to the boss you’re not allowed to come.
The difference is seeing shinny items and getting left behind while the game and its hardcore players move on.

Well, I just wrote this huge response about some other options and points of argument and ideas and the stupid arssed forums just swallowed it right up.

So the tl;dr version: What I would love to see is secondary classes like the Dancer, Musician, Tailor and Image Designer from the old Star Wars Galaxies games. People would still grind those classes like anything else and we’d see the same threads (Polka Music takes too long to grind! Dancer is OP!) but it would give us more non-combat options.

lol, it’s casual to a lot of people including me so yeah. You may think it’s not casual but that’s just your own opinion (in which I disagree upon) and so is it our own opinion.

devs said that obtaining a legendary is for casual players,
saw it in a video somewhere , i think a state of the game vid, if i’ll find it again i’ll post it

If he did I can’t image he meant in one lifetime.

So some post say guild wars 2 is too casual. Others like this imply that it is not casual enough.
Is this not funny to anyone else?

Didn’t read the whole thread, but to the OP:

so your idea of casual is to add a ton of stuff to do, so the game requires even more time investment to keep up with it all?

Veldan.4637:

Didn’t read the whole thread, but to the OP:

so your idea of casual is to add a ton of stuff to do, so the game requires even more time investment to keep up with it all?

This soooo much this.

I think it’s all a matter of the definition of “casual,” isn’t it? I think of myself as “casual” because I’m “relaxed and unconcerned,” but I play a lot of hours a day, and I have Zero interest in the activities the OP desires. I just do what I like, which is kill MOBs in PvE and take their stuff. Since I am free to do that, this game is ideally casual… for ME.

tl/dr:Once again, casual is highly subjective and arguments that casual players will fall behind can be somewhat true, but if someone feels they don’t want to fall behind then they can play less casually. As for me, a casual player, I’m not concerned with PvP, WvWvW, dungeons and fractals at this time. I feel that there is plenty for me to do right now. At some point, in the distant future I may have played enough to have gear and stats to participate in those events. However, since I have chosen to play casually I am not in a hurry to get to end game level. Part of this has to do with limited expendable time and the fact that I need and like breaks from playing games. With my expendable time I like doing other things as well. That doesn’t mean that people that spend more time playing are doing anything wrong, they have simply chosen to use their expendable time to play more aggressively.

I think this post got derailed from the OPs opinion. I can see the point where players would like other fun or interesting non-combat/grind activities. At this time I don’t feel the need to do things like fishing but I can see where players that have been playing for a long time might enjoy such things. With a little creativity and a good guild/friendly players it can make for some interesting activities as well. For example my guild played ‘darts’ the other day. The guild leader jumped off a high point and died. The rest had to jump and try to land as close to him as possible. There are lots of possibilities outside of what has been developed for the game to spend some ‘casual’ time. Again that doesn’t mean more things shouldn’t be developed it just means there are other, yet limited, means to do casual things. Underwear races to distant map points and so forth. Level 2 escort missions can be fun. We used to do lobwie races a lot in WoW.

But here is the ‘definition’ of casual from Merriam-Webster dictionary and as you can see, while still subjective to some degree it covers many of the ideas on casual that people have mentioned here:

1: subject to, resulting from, or occurring by chance <a casual meeting>
2
a : occurring without regularity : occasional</b> <casual employment>
b : employed for irregular periods <a casual worker>
c : met with on occasion and known only superficially <a casual friend>
3
a (1) : feeling or showing little concern : nonchalant <a casual approach to cooking> (2) :lacking a high degree of interest or devotion <casual sports fans> <casual readers> (3) : done without serious intent or commitment
b (1) : informal, natural <a casual conversation> (2) : designed for informal use <casual clothing>

As you can see even by definition the term is subjective. I know that some might be triggered by ‘feeling or showing little concern’ when they read the definition. While most have a standard idea what concern means, it is not truly measurable as it is a state of mind and other’s opinions based on their ideas of what concern means. Concern can’t be objectively measured by time, weight, height/width, distance, volume and so forth.

Regarding concern, I would say that to some degree I have a lack of it for certain aspects of the game. While one goal is to eventually have cooler armor/weapons, be able to contribute in WvW from time to time I am in no hurry, hence I have a lack of concern for those things. That doesn’t mean I don’t take the limited time I do play seriously. I do have concern for my personal goals at this time, which will change as I accomplish more things, and when I play I pursue them. I do have one aspect of the game I have a high level of concern for an that is enjoying the game when I play. So far I feel I’m doing a very good job with that.

Simply put, enjoy the game the way you like to and don’t worry how others like to enjoy the game. Just like when we were kids on the playground, you don’t have to play with me and I don’t have to play with you.

Mirta.5029:

The difference is seeing shinny items and getting left behind while the game and its hardcore players move on.

It isn’t prevalent throughout the game yet, but you guys understand that a small fraction of the game is already like this, eh?

It’s news to me-and frankly, a myth-that players “need” to do dungeons repeatedly to make in-game money. First, we don’t “need” as much gold anyway, and second, there are other ways to hoard it. You don’t need to emulate the CoF 1 farming community pocket to increase your gold (also, vs GW1, I have way easier time getting money in this game without necessarily farming for it.)

tigirius.9014:

*
Things I miss from other games that made them casual friendly:

1. taming/care and feeding of pet companions – WoW/ AoC – In AoC and WoW they had certain animals that were babies when tamed and had special quests to help them grow up turning them into mounts. (now I know they don’t want to add mounts but what if this were used for Rangers instead of the instatame system it would be miles more fun). There was also an unspoken competition amongst hunters in WoW where players sought out and tamed rare pets with rare pet skins. That was the fun part of being a hunter in WoW! For a time there were pet buff foods that cooks could make to help give pets boons during combat, I miss pet food.

Things that are casual but that I didn’t participate in:

1. guild halls – Age of Conan – I was in guilds who had them but never made things or gathered resources to make the guild halls because they already had it and didn’t ask anything of me. Occasionally we had to defend the keeps from enemy guilds in a WvW style setting.

These are things that make a game casual friendly, it’s not simply the aspect of being able to put down a game and come back without having to regrind gear to continue playing where you left off, it’s the activities the fill the spaces between playing PVE PVP WVW or major evens like in the living story or meta boss fights.

Feel free to add anything I missed.

Ok GW2 might be a bit grindy for your tastes, but for you to mention AoC as a casual game just implys that you have no idea what you are talking about. The guild cities that were built required thousands of mats and each building had 3 stages to go through. It is a ridiculous grind to build one. Took guilds months to get a full city built and alot stopped at just upgrading their keeps. The pets that you could raise to be mounts required an insane amount of rep grind to get to the max reputation before you could purchase the cub and then grind some more to raise it up. If memory serves(and I could be wrong), that rep grind required you to grind dungeons otherwise you wouldn’t get there. Sounds waaaaaaaaaaaay more casual then GW2 to me. PvP in AoC is another grind, that they seem to finally(4 years after they made the grind happen) starting to fix, at the moment if you as a fresh 80 were to log in a PvP you would be destroyed until you grinded your tier 1 pvp set or purchased it with money from their cash shop, but if you purchase the armor you would still have to grind your alternate advancement points to have an even playing field. Please, I beg you never try to make GW2 like AoC.

gfox.6501:

Mirta.5029:

The difference is seeing shinny items and getting left behind while the game and its hardcore players move on.

It isn’t prevalent throughout the game yet, but you guys understand that a small fraction of the game is already like this, eh?

You said so: a small fraction. Nothing you can do about it, it’s a player’s choice, and they are entitled to that playstyle whether we like it or not (I recommend to ignore them, because there’s no “hardcore-ness” required to enjoy this game.)

The Merriam-Webster definition of ‘casual’ are thus:

“occurring without regularity”
“feeling or showing little concern”
“lacking a high degree of interest or devotion”
" done without serious intent or commitment"
“informal, ie designed for informal use”

as such, none of the listed items in the original post have anything to do with what makes the game casual or not. they are activities that a casual player may take part in, may even enjoy. however, having (or not having) them does not make casual or not casual as you seem to think.

a ‘casual’ player is going to pick up the game for a few hours, do a little bit here, a little bit there and then log out. they may not come back for a few days, a few weeks, possibly a few months, but when they do, they will be right where they left off, which is very casual friendly.

if they were to try to do this is other mmos (which shall remained unnamed) they would be behind and would then need to catch up….requiring dedication, which is the opposite of casual.

Casual players enjoy games where they don’t have to play ‘with regularity.’ That don’t require a ‘high degree of devotion’ and don’t require a ‘serious commitment’ unless they really want to. At which point they become more than a casual player, simply by the definition of the word ‘casual’

The game has casual parts and hardcore parts, the issue is it’s lopsided the casual part awards very little while the hard core part awards it all..

The rewards need to be in both aspects of the game even if it upsets one faction or another, that’s the main issue i see..

@OP: all of your examples were of non-GW2 related things.

To me, casual refers to how much time & dedication one needs to pour into the game to achieve game-related milestones. This would include high level armor, weapons, dungeons, achievements, leveling, etc. These are core aspects of the game that, in GW2, don’t require 1000hrs to achieve. You can hit max level fast, easily, solo or in groups, run dungeons, & amass currencies (karma, tokens) for armor.

What you, the OP, are asking for are other things to do; mini-games to waste your time on while not playing the game. Fishing…why? You want to fish, go outside & fish. Or play a fishing game. This is not bass hunters. This is not big game hunters. You want to hunt an animal? Go to Queensdale and kill the Boar for the group DE.

Taming/raising/feeding pets: You can tame. Feeding was annoying and WoW eventually got rid of it cuz they realized it too. Raising: with a single pet sure. But with access to so many raising would overwhelm rangers and not let them actually use their pets for actual gameplay.

Lottery: Play the game, RNG will determine your drops. Congrats. There’s your lottery.

Housing: Why? Play The Sims. There’s your housing. I don’t want to decorate a house…I want to play GW2 and ya know…run dungeons, kill stuff, explore…

If you want to play the game caually, do it. If you want to play mini-games, buy an xbox & play Fusion Fenzy with your friends.

The thing about GW2 that is fantastic is that you choose if it is casual or not.

Want to explore for 10 minutes? fine.
Want to do a few dungeons? fine.
Want to do some story? fine.

Dungeons been the only real hardcore part of the game, the rest you can do when you want, how you want, as fast as you want.

knives.6345:

tigirius.9014:

Biohazard.4196:

tigirius.9014:

Vayne.8563:

Galtrix.7369:

People forget what the definition of casual actually is. Relaxed and unconcerned. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I feel obligated to participate in dungeons to earn as much money as people that play for 10 hours a day and I DO NOT get the “relaxed” feeling when I have to play for 3 hours or more to actually accomplish something. I have not seen Anet implement a single casual activity to do since the game was released. FoTM, Guild Missions, Ascended gear, all of those things are for hardcore players. And, if you disagree, think about the ways to get ascended gear. 30 laurels, which is 30 days of playing. 30 days is a ridiculous amount of time for a “casual” player. Guild Missions, which require massive amounts of time to organize, again, not a casual activity. Fractals, is the longest dungeon in GW2 and requires the most time. Tell me again how GW2 is made for casual players.

Dailies are for casuals, they take 20 minutes. Most of the living story was for casuals too. Did you even do the instances that happened in the month before the end dungeon was released. Each instance takes less than half an hour and can be soloed. SAB could certainly be enjoyed by casuals. The christmas jumping puzzle and music game, enjoyed by casuals too. The halloween minidungeon, easy to enjoy for casuals.

I’m not sure why you think nothing has been released for casuals, when so much of it has been.

He’s most likely talking about what I’m talking about permanent new open world content. all of that other stuff is not permanent. the living story is not permanent, the holidays are not permanent.

What the world is wrong with folks, can’t see the forest…

Galtrix you’re right. but don’t expect people to understand. All play styles leading to the same end game results equally.

Saying casual means “relaxed and unconcerned” and then immediately saying he feels obligated to farm dungeons seems pretty hypocritical if he’s claiming to be casual.

Not if he means he feels obligated to run dungeons because that’s the only means given him to achieve his goals end game, thus limiting choice, thus not being casual because running dungeons is usually a stressfilled experience, I know it is for me. All choices for gameplay style leading to the same end game experience.

Dungeon running is not a casual activity even in WoW it wasn’t it was forced upon the populous until even the devs at WoW understood what was happening and why people left their game en masse just like they did recently, because there wasn’t enough things to do in PVE to fill the spaces between the guild/dungeon runs/raids so they added solo dungeons and multiple other mini games (other then the longest lasting one fishing), the same goes for Rift, the same goes for SWTOR they all one by one realized.

That’s all this thread was about really is it’s not casual because it doesn’t cater to the gather/farmer/RP style players enough, they’ve been so focused on PVP WVW and Dungeons that they have completely forgotten a very large bulk of their playerbase and I think with their recent change in patches separating the PVE PVP WVW coded behaviors they’ve gotten the message, the question is where will they go from here.

Casuals do not care how long it takes to get the end game.
Casuals play when they can, if they can – which on this game and any other MMO will net you only what you put in effort to.

You keep repeating you are “forced” to do dungeons. Who “forced” you to do them? I may have missed ANet’s announcement instructing me to do a dungeon run…

Question is, why do you feel “obliged”? It only means you are competing with people and time – which defeats the meaning of the casual player – “Relaxed and unconcerned”.

no we don’t I didn’t and the experience for crafting was high enough to carry me over the edge in the first two weeks, but that’s not what this threads about either.

there’s an underlying loot issue still present that’s probably why he’s feeling obligated add to that a serious lack of new open world content every month and you see the issue.

Dante.1508:

The game has casual parts and hardcore parts, the issue is it’s lopsided the casual part awards very little while the hard core part awards it all..

The rewards need to be in both aspects of the game even if it upsets one faction or another, that’s the main issue i see..

That’s definitely part of the problem. Clearly marked in the statement “It’s extremely important that we stay true to our philosophy that you should be able to play Guild Wars 2 the way you want to play the game in order to reach the most powerful rewards.”

There’s also not enough casual to match the amount of hardcore in balance. We were told there would be but it’s not happened yet and the living story I’m sorry to say just doesn’t cut it. Throwing something out there that seemed like a last minute ditch effort to test an experimental PVE experience because there wasn’t a PTR just shows how little concern there is for the casual style player imo.

Farzo.8410:

You can leave Guild Wars 2 for months without getting behind anywhere, that is what makes the game very casual.

Mostly. With the notable exception of ascended gear. It’s that gear (and how it’ll be handled in the future) that will eventually decide whether this game stays casual or moves away from it.

Who actually cares if it’s casual? Casual isn’t a dirty word, I have seen people devote ten to twelve hours a day to GW2, and I have seen people play a half hour or so a week, as long as you’re having fun who cares?

tigirius.9014:

Recently people have made the false claim that GW2 is casual. This is a post to show just how wrong they are about that. My purpose for this is not only to inform the players of this game what casual means, it’s also to give the devs some pointers on what makes a game casual so that they might in the future consider adding these things to improve the game.

1. fishing – WoW/torchlight II – complete with nets, spears, poles, chairs, umbrellas, with the ability to fish up valuable vendorfish, gear, hard to find crafting materials (lodestones is an idea ahem cough), minipets, and mounts (if this game had mounts), crafting recipes in all crafts (they even had oils for engineering/alchemy not just cooking).
2. hunting games – The Hunter MMO – in other mmo’s it might be that you need to capture or kill an animal for a hunting contest which would bring prizes and gear. A real hunting contest for the Norn perhaps?
3. farming – farmville/lotro – self explanatory. Might bring in the chance to find the materials usually difficult to get to like vanilla beans.
4. lotteries – RIFT/LOTRO – LOTRO had a daily lottery to get prizes and currency from similar to the dungeon badges, laurels, and karma we see in GW2. Rift had an hourly or bihourly scratchoff which allowed for the winning of rare crafting materials and currencies too (altho it was in a mobile app that they still have to this day).
5. housing – LOTRO/RIFT – Rift is hands down the best example of housing I can think of. The decorations and ability to customize are the best I’ve seen anywhere, however they both had the ability to pickup items from the experiences of the players (quests) where they’ve been what they were doing, and who they’ve defeated to place in the homes of the players.
6. collecting artifacts – RIFT/AoC – filled with lore that can combine to make items or for prizes. Items were usually end game gear or special items that created rare materials or were valuable to be sold for gold.
7. collecting mini pets – WoW – minipets has always been fun in any game but WoW to me had the best ways of doing such, buying them from dungeon only vendors, finding them in rare exotic places. They have a good start in this game, I’m just not seeing the taming of level 1 critters tho.
8. taming/care and feeding of pet companions – WoW/ AoC – In AoC and WoW they had certain animals that were babies when tamed and had special quests to help them grow up turning them into mounts. (now I know they don’t want to add mounts but what if this were used for Rangers instead of the instatame system it would be miles more fun). There was also an unspoken competition amongst hunters in WoW where players sought out and tamed rare pets with rare pet skins. That was the fun part of being a hunter in WoW! For a time there were pet buff foods that cooks could make to help give pets boons during combat, I miss pet food.
9. gambling – Star Trek Online – Dabo is a great time waster, and you can buy things with the gold pressed latinum you get from gambling on the table in Quark’s.

Things that are casual but that I didn’t participate in:

1. mini pet battles – WoW – never really played this since Cata but it looks like pokemon.
2. guild halls – Age of Conan – I was in guilds who had them but never made things or gathered resources to make the guild halls because they already had it and didn’t ask anything of me. Occasionally we had to defend the keeps from enemy guilds in a WvW style setting.

These are things that make a game casual friendly, it’s not simply the aspect of being able to put down a game and come back without having to regrind gear to continue playing where you left off, it’s the activities the fill the spaces between playing PVE PVP WVW or major evens like in the living story or meta boss fights.

Feel free to add anything I missed.

Nothing in this list can be defined as “casual” content. I played LoTRO for years, was part of the Hardcore raid team. Belonged to one of the biggest…if not the biggest guilds on the server and everyone, from the Hardcore raiders to the casual alters/crafters/explores enjoyed all of those activities.

Seems like the problem most people are having is having that content labeled as “casual”. I don’t think that is the case…like someone else noted…its more like extracurricular activities.

You said it yourself…“things to do between PvE, PvP, WvW etc…”

This is very casual friendly…new players can lvl to 80, buy exotics/ascended items with the gold/laurels they have earned and be on par with everyone else in the game…might not be as shinny, but equal in every way.

I would have to agree…would love to see those added to the game sometime in the near future. Especially Guild/Personal Houses.