Guild Wars 2

First off this isnt a ‘Im going to quit….wahhh wahhh wahh’ thread. Just me venting a little. Feel free to click the back button at any time.

Ive spent a long time hoping GW2 would bring a challenge. Two years of playing and the main reason im still here isnt that im having the time of my life, no. Its that im keeping the story fresh in my mind, participating in events that ANET throws at me in the hope that sometime in the not so distant future ANET will bring content that isnt just handed to us on a plate, with a side order of gem store.

Today I realised that this will never happen

So whats different about today I hear you ask? Not a huge amount if im honest. Its just ive had that moment where it has all slotted into place. The horrible truth. What was the final piece of the puzzle? Being able to buy past Living Story skins using festival currency.

What is the point in completing content for skins anymore? I mean give it 6 months and it’ll be back for you to buy. My backpiece, the Fervid Censor, took a lot of time and effort to acquire. A year or so later and its available for a few hours work because someone moaned that they wanted all of the stuff. Why complete WvW Season 2? I mean give it until Xmas and I can pick the skins up for a few hundred Magical Fairy Tokens.

This set my mind racing and the horrible truth reared its ugly little face. ANET want to give all of the people all of the stuff. It makes great business sense right? People ask for something, they give it and said people play said game for as long as they keep getting the stuff. Content will get easier because people cant deal with failing and will moan at ANET to reduce the difficulty. Gradually GW2 is going to be reduced to the MMO family’s immature cousin and forced to sit at the kiddies table with the likes of [insert Facebook game names here].

Ive defended the game to friends, guildies, strangers and my family dog (he was more interested in licking his crotch though). I cant do it anymore. Ive seen the future of GW2….and im not in it.

I’m sorry, but getting those LS skins wasn’t hard. At best it was time consuming, but most LS skins that were awarded by completing the achievements were not challenging.

But you are right about the rest : Anet is settling to handing most things on a plate and putting the rest on the gem store. They are aiming for a playerbase that doesn’t want to think too much when playing a game (and with all the QQ threads whenever a new LS used to come out, it’s no wonder they think their playerbase is generally bad).

I think it possible you may be mistaken, this is not a “casuals” game either.

I’m about as casual as they come, often playing for a distraction when really quite ill (which is why I tend to keep myself to myself, it’s not fair to other gamers to expect them to accommodate) and expect pretty much nothing from this game. I don’t care about playing dress up, really just want to slowly plunk away in my own time and achieve something of some meaning, however minor it may be. Skins etc are totally meaningless frippery, and most gem items are QoL convenience at best – are these aspirations that people have, that keep them playing? Perhaps. Does it discriminate between casual or hardcore? Only in terms of gold earning speed potential if you choose to not break out real cash.

The time will inevitably come where fuzzy hats and mini pets are the brick wall that will be struck for you, and for me. There is nowhere much to go from this point. I know I lack whatever is required to get top of the range gear – I don’t need it, and the game will never just give it to me, whatever you may think of me as a “casual”.

So why do we (and many others) play? Habit? Boredom? The motivation/reward cycle that is really no more sophisticated than pigeon pecks button, pigeon gets peanut? I have my reasons. Do you have yours? And if they’re not good enough then don’t stay (amuses me that players will respond to comments like this with “OMG quit”, as if they think it somehow benefits the game to have players leaving).

But don’t think this game offers casual players Tyria, it really doesn’t. We are not the enemy. The enemy is a dearth of truly meaningful content, which can be played at whatever speed/proficiency the player can bring to the table. If something new should come along, you may well do it quickly and easily – or at a higher and eventually more rewarding level – while I dawdle at the back. Does that make me, as a casual, the problem? Is it not the case that hardcore players will inevitably munch content far faster than the gamerunners can ever hope to deliver it?

I think that what you are talking about has nothing to do with hardcore v casual, and everything to do with the lifecycle of the game and whatever content brick wall you have hit. To that end you must decide if it is worthwhile your even being here. As a casual, at a similar (if less proficient) position, I’m thinking much the same. What is there here to actually do. And if the answer is – nothing much (I’m thinking this after 15 mins into new patch and messing around with aspects I don’t care about) then there really is only one option left and it is neither my fault nor yours at either end of the casual/hardcore spectrum.

The issue is one of content: Meaningless fluff is not content. Fuzzy hats is not content. Neverending collections of junk for some mini pet reward is not content. But if people are willing to spend their time doing this, it’s up to them. But it’s neither casual nor hardcore.

I feel you on that part. If you weren’t there for the event, you shouldn’t be able to get the skins. However a large base of people whined and complained about how they weren’t able to do the content again, thus missing the skins. While I’m glad that they didn’t re-release the content, I’m a little miffed about the skins being available again. But that was the majority of the population on the forums, so they got it, despite all those same threads of people saying “Anet sucks and they never listen.”

I also enjoy playing the game. Been recently gettiing more into the lore and story and am amazed at how rich and deep it actually is. Plus, been working on getting a full set of ascended trinkets (already have my armor) and a legendary. There is lots of stuff to still do, thats why I keep playing. I find it fun. But yes, I agree the game is moving more and more casual. I guess for those looking for something less casual, this game may not be for them. One game can’t cater to everybody, and nowdays casual is where the gaming market is heading. Thats why you don’t see games like FF7, or Command and Conquer any more.

One thing I hope to convey is that I dont directly blame ANET. They, as a company, are doing what they think is right for the business. Maybe I am wrong to make a thread with my opinion because nothing good can come from this thread. I firmly believe ANET have made a decision and they made it long ago, that decision being to concentrate on what I call casual gamers.

By casual I dont necessarily mean those that cannot play often, although ANET has made things easier for those kinds of players. By casuals im referring to those that maybe have the time but refuse to spend it. Those that want ‘all of the things’ as fast as possible. Those that wont mind spending a few quid in the gem store.

GW2 hasnt been able to offer me the experience I want in an MMO for a long time but ive carried on playing because every now and then theyve beckoned me over and have said “Look, Dan, this is a good bit of story right? Play this and maybe later we’ll give you want you want. Some challenge!”. Well ive been listening for a while now and very little has come of it. Maybe its time to face facts- GW2 will never be the MMO I want it to be.

EDIT: Just to make clear, the issue of skins being available has annoyed me but its not about how hard it was to get the skins before. Its about the principle of the thing. Giving skins to people because they didnt log in at the time. Making it easier to acquire items in game because certain people moan on the forums. Its this ease that I have an issue with, and the reason my eyes are now open.

Valksy.9327:

I think it possible you may be mistaken, this is not a “casuals” game either.

I’m about as casual as they come, often playing for a distraction when really quite ill (which is why I tend to keep myself to myself, it’s not fair to other gamers to expect them to accommodate) and expect pretty much nothing from this game.

But don’t think this game offers casual players Tyria, it really doesn’t. We are not the enemy.

I think that what you are talking about has nothing to do with hardcore v casual, and everything to do with the lifecycle of the game and whatever content brick wall you have hit.

The issue is one of content: Meaningless fluff is not content. Fuzzy hats is not content. Neverending collections of junk for some mini pet reward is not content. But if people are willing to spend their time doing this, it’s up to them. But it’s neither casual nor hardcore.

This. ^^

So all these people who keep misusing the casual term tell me exactly where in this game is fishing with props, a proper housing system, vehicles, taming of animals (real taming) for both combat and minis, where are the gobs of craftable sellable for in game currency only clothing, where are the serious mainline story where it continues in the open world and where you can progress in that personal mainline story without end, because all of the things I’ve listed here are all casual expectations, decorative Guild Halls, if you’re answer to ANY of these items is “they don’t exist in this game” than you can stop using the casual word now because this game isn’kitten

Valksy is right, all we’ve gotten so far is fluff and grind. (I added the grind) These things are not what this game was supposed to be, the STORE is the problem not other players. D3 is most famous for having this same issue and that’s why they changed it finally because the game became all about grinding out everything buying things from the store in order to make anything, and worrying about gold constantly.

I think tho OP that by your description you might be looking for a sandbox game.

Edit: forgot one.

Thereon.3495:

Ive spent a long time hoping GW2 would bring a challenge. Two years of playing and the main reason im still here isnt that im having the time of my life, no. Its that im keeping the story fresh in my mind, participating in events that ANET throws at me in the hope that sometime in the not so distant future ANET will bring content that isnt just handed to us on a plate, with a side order of gem store.

I disagree. While the reward is great, I think the Crown Pavillion stuff is TOO much effort. You have to learn the individual tactics of approx 8 bosses, then grind some zerker gear and make a DPS spec to beat the timer. While certainly challenging, this isn’t my idea of fun.

I imagine that it is true to say that the majority of players would abandon ship in a hot minute if play to win ever came to Tyria – so are we really just talking about cosmetic gem shop (or gem/gold trading) items in terms of casual or hardcore?

OK. But there really is nothing hardcore about happening to log in at the right time as you seem to be describing (correct me if wrong, please) – Is it hardcore to log in at 3am on November 6th? No. Is it hardcore to log in for a period of time every day for a week? No.

Hardcore is a playstyle and a hardcore player as is widely understood could achieve more in an hour of play once a week than someone like me might manage in 5 times that (For example – I’ve never done a fractal, nor finished the story, as am simply not willing to inconvenience others because I’m compromised by ill health).

I’m not sure how reasonable it is to demand exclusivity simply for being able to log in on a specific schedule.

As for those willing to pay extra cash for frippery – I doubt this strictly counts as casual either, as it constitutes a real life investment (that I concede makes little sense to me). What’s more, this is exactly the kind of investment ANet courts and relies on and has from the start. If your objection is for people paying cash for cosmetics then this is outside the realm of casual/hardcore and is a feature from the start and also makes any assumption of expectation of exclusivity a suspect one.

It would appear, though, that we are talking at cross-purposes. Casual/hardcore are surely gameplay styles – controlled by both time and general proficiency. I don’t know either has anything to do with playing with the wardrobe options. I do think your blame is mistargeted, or at least mislabelled.

well thats probly why this game was the fastest selling mmo at one point and became pretty much irrelevant soon after. there is literally nothing that gives you a sense of accomplishment in this game cause everything is just handed to you on a silver platter. there is pretty much nothing prestigious to strive for in this game.

if you’re a hardcore mmo player then this game isn’t for you as you can try as hard as you can to stand out, but all your efforts are only going to achieve you mediocrity because you will realize that everyone else can accomplish what you can with little to no effort. if you got a particular skin during a “one-time” event, it’s nothing special everyone can have a chance to get them again a couple months later. maybe pvp can get you exclusive rewards, nope you can reach rank 0-80 in a month or two playing casually cause they wanted to hand everyone maxed rank.

i mean it’s cool if you want to cater to casuals but if you want to keep an mmo alive then you’re gonna need to have an incentive to keep people playing.

But Barret, the issue still isn’t one of casual v hardcore in terms of measuring accomplishment, it is one of content.

Imagine content that you complete in a week as a hardcore player, but I am still trudging through after three months because I’m casual. I can play my way and reach eventual accomplishment, while you have already done it, enjoyed your reward for 3 months and gone on to bigger and better.

Except….oh dear…there IS no bigger and better. You’ve hit the brick wall, and eventually I will too. But how is that a hardcore/casual issue instead of an empty content one?

This game was announced as a casual game before release. Everybody who bought the game knows it. If you want something hardcore you either have to create the challenge yourself or move on. As long as zerging is possible , this game will keep the casual status. Spam 11111 to win ftw!

Considering anyone can simply buy Dungeon Master title by simply paying (Way too often) a dude who used out of map exploits to reach the end boss skipping everything, this is truly the last thing I would be arguing about really… ._.

Silvia.9130:

Considering anyone can simply buy Dungeon Master title by simply paying (Way too often) a dude who used out of map exploits to reach the end boss skipping everything, this is truly the last thing I would be arguing about really… ._.

this is honestly not new to any game, and usually its easier to carry people in other MMOs. Any time an MMO has something you cant buy directly, some people will pay someone to get the drop. It doesnt really illustrate anything other than people who can will sell to people who cant. and people who cant will buy from people who can.

As far as the topic, hmmm guild wars 2, seems to be getting more casual, but is it that casual at its base? i dont really think so.
I also think GW2 will have to create a lot more high end content. hard modes, something of that nature, they dont really have anything that pushes you to achieve, or makes you feel like you need to get every last bit of stat available.

Now this doesnt need to be for everybody, but it can be for some.
I think SAB probably got it best, where they had a hard mode that gave a different color skin.

other options are giving greater rewards, much like domain of anguish hardmode gave you 4 times the amount of margonite on hard mode.

regardless, it needs some more difficult content, with greater risks, AND greater rewards.

I’m sorry you aren’t exclusive anymore…. Oh wait, you never were, Fervid Censors are everywhere. Been to Vigil Keep lately (before todays patch)?

Wait can I go back and get a gas mask now?! Awesome!

I don’t mind. The extra effort I put in to get my skin early is no different from early adopters paying a premium price to get the latest Apple gadget before everyone else. I had my fun with it, and if ANet now wants to make it easier for the masses to get, go right ahead. I see no reason to prevent latecomers from enjoying the same stuff I’ve enjoyed; it doesn’t make a whit of difference to the enjoyment I got out of it.

This isn’t about being casual, this is about an individuals desire to be special. To do so, they wants to deny others.

a t s e.9614:

If you want something hardcore you either have to create the challenge yourself or move on. As long as zerging is possible , this game will keep the casual status. Spam 11111 to win ftw!

Dunno.. conflicting thoughts about this. What can one do in this game imo, is setting personal goals. Like.. learn how to play a new class, solo a boss, solo a dungeon, solo a dungeon without dying, do speed runs with your guild, break someone else record etc you get my point. “Problem” is most people set their personal goals in skins or stats and whenever they aquire that skin or legendary they complain they have nothing left to do. Well you got tons of things to do. Game lacks content yes, but there’s tons of challenges in it. Most get bored with yet so many things left to do.

And on the other hand, game seems full of gimmicks and bad mechanics like.. stacking for the win, bosses killed in a few seconds from fgs or feedback, instances completed in under 10 minutes and so on.. and it just doesnt seem to be the kind of game worth taking seriously

Dont know what to say.. its enjoyable but sad in the same time

havellian.4073:

I’m sorry you aren’t exclusive anymore…. Oh wait, you never were, Fervid Censors are everywhere. Been to Vigil Keep lately (before todays patch)?

Yeah, I lol’d when I read fervid censors. That 10 sample collection took 30 minutes to do. If they’re rare, its cause most people just had the sense to trash them when they got an ascended/exotic backpack.

If you were talking fully upgraded fractal back or ascended spine-blades being sold in the bazaar you might have a point.

Actions speak louder than words people.

ArenaNet is telling you to NOT complete any Living Story Season 2 content because several months after season 2 is over, they will re-release all the skins, minipets, tonics, etc to festivals like this one for a few tokens, literally, for an hour of your time.

Oh you thought you had something unique for actually sticking around to play these 2 week long updates? You thought completing 20 “kill this garbage 200 times” and “play peekaboo with hidden garbage and find 10 of them” per piece was worth your time for the aesthetic at the end?

Nope. The people who missed those updates were off playing other games they actually had fun with while YOU were playing standard MMORPG grindfest garbage for these. With enough whining there is a whole festival filled with LS rewards AND holiday rewards (candy corn elemental and exclusive halloween hat).

Learn. You don’t have to grind now, look at the bright side. You don’t have to kill 250 annoying mobs throughout the whole world for a fraction of the progress for some backpack now. You don’t have to waste your time zerging garbage events until you complete an achievement. All the achievements were casual anyways and will remain so, the 2nd season of the LS will not have anything hard, no challenging achievements, because if there were difficult tasks tied to the rewards in season 2 (if there are any to begin with) it will be easier to ignore them and just wait until the season is over and grab the goodies by doing events at this festival and buying boxes with crafting mats, lol.

Just poke in, play a bit, then get out and you will be able to grab the same reward for much less grinding than those who stayed and earned them. You no longer have to push through this annoyance for the same reward.

I’m sure season 2 rewards and holiday rewards from now on will be available as rewards for a little bit of grinding in some festival, judging from today’s update, take a vacation.

I find it interesting that there are two threads on the front page at the same time, one claiming that the game is catering too much to casuals, the other claiming that complaints about casual farms resulted in the nerf of said farm – -all at the behest of “raiders” — and that ANet is catering to that demographic at the expense of casuals. I guess the game is not catering to anyone.

I don’t see any problems at all.

Doing the content means you get the skins/rewards first, allowing you to enjoy them for longer, and don’t have to spend an in-game currency on them, which often takes more time to earn than it takes to earn the item in the first place. And don’t say “But it requires more skill to earn them!” – It doesn’t cost any more for a skilled player to struggle through designed-to-be challenging content than an unskilled player to fumble through a cakewalk. The only thing that is limited across all walks of life, from the most illiterate casual and incomprehensible PUGbait and elite master hardcore player is Time – there are only so many hours in a day for everyone, and the servers will not live forever (Neither will we).

People capable of dedicating themselves to doing harder and more challenging content are rewarded with the ability to earn rewards faster, cheaper, and earlier than those that can’t.

Im sorry but in a game where the sole purpose of end-game is character customisation, why give everyone the ability to get everything?

For those talking about ‘getting months of enjoyment first’ this is besides the point. I played certain content to EARN that skin. Certain skins were easy to acquire yes but again thats besides the point. I participated in certain events in order to use that skin and others should kitten well have to also. Hell, I think its laughable you can get dungeon skins from PvP now…. because dungeons are so hard and time consuming to complete (sarcasm BTW). Players should be forced to EARN rewards, not be given them for not playing the game.

Ive played this game since headstart. Over 4000k hours spent playing and i’ll admit ive had fun. But to see this sickens me… its a cheap way of saying “Stay with us and we’ll give you things for free”. The game is far too easy and I can only see it getting worse.

As ive said before, maybe im asking too much from GW2. All I know is that after 4000hrs of playing its not the content/story thats driving me away, its the design decisions made by ANET to make this game so ridiculously easy to play that my nan could give it a go. Still, its good for short-term business though. I just worry in the long run.

Thereon.3495:

Im sorry but in a game where the sole purpose of end-game is character customisation, why give everyone the ability to get everything?

For those talking about ‘getting months of enjoyment first’ this is besides the point. I played certain content to EARN that skin. Certain skins were easy to acquire yes but again thats besides the point. I participated in certain events in order to use that skin and others should kitten well have to also. Hell, I think its laughable you can get dungeon skins from PvP now…. because dungeons are so hard and time consuming to complete (sarcasm BTW). Players should be forced to EARN rewards, not be given them for not playing the game.

Ive played this game since headstart. Over 4000k hours spent playing and i’ll admit ive had fun. But to see this sickens me… its a cheap way of saying “Stay with us and we’ll give you things for free”. If this is a sign of whats to come from ANET… no fuss, i’ll just wish them luck and be on my merry way.

the main problem with your theory, is far as i have seen, it doesnt appear to be any easier to get them now than it was before. Many people are saying it is actually harder, So if you wanted less casual content and rewards, wouldnt this be in line with what you wanted?

now if i am mistaken and it is easier to get them now then sure, but from what i hear its not.

also note, progression is not competition, sometimes they are connected, but not always.
how hard something is has nothing to do with how competitive it is.

First person to scream bingo in a a room of 1000 people is very competitive, but its not very difficult, and has no progression tied to it

being able to shoot 30 3 pointers in a row, is fairly difficult, and has 30 degrees of progression, but it isnt very competitive, you can do it alone, with no opponents, and everyone can win eventually.

If you think getting the LS skins was difficult or anything even close to prestige status, you have no business throwing stones at ‘casuals’. If you’re proud of the ‘hard work’ you put towards your Fervid Censor, then you are about as casual as casuals get.

Let new players have a shot at the shiny things. Don’t worry….everyone will still respect the triumph of skill you had to display to get your Molten Gloves….

phys.7689:

the main problem with your theory, is far as i have seen, it doesnt appear to be any easier to get them now than it was before. Many people are saying it is actually harder, So if you wanted less casual content and rewards, wouldnt this be in line with what you wanted?

now if i am mistaken and it is easier to get them now then sure, but from what i hear its not.

also note, progression is not competition, sometimes they are connected, but not always.
how hard something is has nothing to do with how competitive it is.

First person to scream bingo in a a room of 1000 people is very competitive, but its not very difficult, and has no progression tied to it

being able to shoot 30 3 pointers in a row, is fairly difficult, and has 30 degrees of progression, but it isnt very competitive, you can do it alone, with no opponents, and everyone can win eventually.

All right, let me put it another way. Why should someone be able to acquire a previously ‘unique’ skin (in the sense that it was available during a LS update only) that was themed to a particular LS update, in the festival update? Why have ANET made this possible? Its because people have moaned on the forums saying that they didnt have a chance at getting said skin at that given time. If you dont complete content you are not entitled to that contents reward, whether its time based or a permanent feature in the game (dungeon armour for instance).

As for the topic of progression…. is that something I spoke about previously? I dont think so but in reply youre right. Sometimes its linked to competition, sometimes not. In the case of skins I feel like my progression has been lost because more players have the things that I have. Staying loyal to GW2 for this long and participating in all the LS story events has got me where? To the same place as those that logged in a few weeks ago. End-game is based around character customisation and so for the case of skins progression is definitely involved.

Intuneric.7652:

a t s e.9614:

If you want something hardcore you either have to create the challenge yourself or move on. As long as zerging is possible , this game will keep the casual status. Spam 11111 to win ftw!

Dunno.. conflicting thoughts about this. What can one do in this game imo, is setting personal goals. Like.. learn how to play a new class, solo a boss, solo a dungeon, solo a dungeon without dying, do speed runs with your guild, break someone else record etc you get my point. “Problem” is most people set their personal goals in skins or stats and whenever they aquire that skin or legendary they complain they have nothing left to do. Well you got tons of things to do. Game lacks content yes, but there’s tons of challenges in it. Most get bored with yet so many things left to do.

And on the other hand, game seems full of gimmicks and bad mechanics like.. stacking for the win, bosses killed in a few seconds from fgs or feedback, instances completed in under 10 minutes and so on.. and it just doesnt seem to be the kind of game worth taking seriously

Dont know what to say.. its enjoyable but sad in the same time

So you say that the challenge is Soloing the content ? Even if it’s hard it’s pretty boring in my opinion. Anyway nobody asks for stuff to be harder, this game is grindy enough, if it was hard it would be a real pain.

The only thing that is fun doing solo it’s PvP 1v1.

Having something now is worth more than having the same thing some time in the future:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_value_of_money

Thereon.3495:

phys.7689:

the main problem with your theory, is far as i have seen, it doesnt appear to be any easier to get them now than it was before. Many people are saying it is actually harder, So if you wanted less casual content and rewards, wouldnt this be in line with what you wanted?

now if i am mistaken and it is easier to get them now then sure, but from what i hear its not.

also note, progression is not competition, sometimes they are connected, but not always.
how hard something is has nothing to do with how competitive it is.

First person to scream bingo in a a room of 1000 people is very competitive, but its not very difficult, and has no progression tied to it

being able to shoot 30 3 pointers in a row, is fairly difficult, and has 30 degrees of progression, but it isnt very competitive, you can do it alone, with no opponents, and everyone can win eventually.

All right, let me put it another way. Why should someone be able to acquire a previously ‘unique’ skin (in the sense that it was available during a LS update only) that was themed to a particular LS update, in the festival update? Why have ANET made this possible? Its because people have moaned on the forums saying that they didnt have a chance at getting said skin at that given time. If you dont complete content you are not entitled to that contents reward, whether its time based or a permanent feature in the game (dungeon armour for instance).

As for the topic of progression…. is that something I spoke about previously? I dont think so but in reply youre right. Sometimes its linked to competition, sometimes not. In the case of skins I feel like my progression has been lost because more players have the things that I have. Staying loyal to GW2 for this long and participating in all the LS story events has got me where? To the same place as those that logged in a few weeks ago. End-game is based around character customisation and so for the case of skins progression is definitely involved.

You got the skins first. You got them earlier than others. You got them easier than others. Your sour, because your idea of “Fun” is one that comes at the expense of fun for others.

Skins are for everyone. Titles are your “I saved Lion’s Arch and all I got was this lousy T-Shirt” reward.

Guild Wars 2 is ultimately about “Play how you want”. Yes, some content is easier and faster to get by playing the way the content is designed for, but it’s also a design philosophy that anyone can get anything by playing how they want, even if it takes longer.

However, they didn’t take anything from you, unless they opened up your account and took those skins you earned. The only thing they ‘injured’ is your overdeveloped sense of spite and arrogance.

Thereon.3495:

phys.7689:

the main problem with your theory, is far as i have seen, it doesnt appear to be any easier to get them now than it was before. Many people are saying it is actually harder, So if you wanted less casual content and rewards, wouldnt this be in line with what you wanted?

now if i am mistaken and it is easier to get them now then sure, but from what i hear its not.

also note, progression is not competition, sometimes they are connected, but not always.
how hard something is has nothing to do with how competitive it is.

First person to scream bingo in a a room of 1000 people is very competitive, but its not very difficult, and has no progression tied to it

being able to shoot 30 3 pointers in a row, is fairly difficult, and has 30 degrees of progression, but it isnt very competitive, you can do it alone, with no opponents, and everyone can win eventually.

All right, let me put it another way. Why should someone be able to acquire a previously ‘unique’ skin (in the sense that it was available during a LS update only) that was themed to a particular LS update, in the festival update? Why have ANET made this possible? Its because people have moaned on the forums saying that they didnt have a chance at getting said skin at that given time. If you dont complete content you are not entitled to that contents reward, whether its time based or a permanent feature in the game (dungeon armour for instance).

As for the topic of progression…. is that something I spoke about previously? I dont think so but in reply youre right. Sometimes its linked to competition, sometimes not. In the case of skins I feel like my progression has been lost because more players have the things that I have. Staying loyal to GW2 for this long and participating in all the LS story events has got me where? To the same place as those that logged in a few weeks ago. End-game is based around character customisation and so for the case of skins progression is definitely involved.

my fault, you said the sole goal of the game is to get more cosmetic options. and what you are saying is that the key deciding factor should be how consistently you have played?
Well i suppose that makes some sort of sense, much like many hobbyist like limited edition limited time items. Hmmm its an interesting perspective, but my assumption is this is the last hurrah for season one items release. Much like in hobbies when they say this is the last chance to get X item.

Overall though, for me, i dont think the hobby angle is something they should base too much of their item/reward structure on. But i see what your angle is, its something to think about

Sartharina.3542:

However, they didn’t take anything from you, unless they opened up your account and took those skins you earned. The only thing they ‘injured’ is your overdeveloped sense of spite and arrogance.

Whats been taken ‘from me’ (and a lot of others btw) isnt the item, but the items value. What it represents…its exclusivity. The reward for completing certain content…..for staying loyal to the game at certain points (not logging in continuously each and every day for two years). Skins outside of the gem store are more than just shiny pixels… theyre trophies. Its this thats being taken away.

BTW my original post uses this issue with skins as one example of ANETs phylosophy of ‘giving people all of the things’…. feel free to discuss other examples. My main gripe isnt the skins being available, its the general feeling of ANET catering to the ‘casual’ going forward and my fears for the future of the game should this be the case.

Thereon.3495:

Sartharina.3542:

However, they didn’t take anything from you, unless they opened up your account and took those skins you earned. The only thing they ‘injured’ is your overdeveloped sense of spite and arrogance.

Whats been taken ‘from me’ (and a lot of others btw) isnt the item, but the items value. What it represents…its exclusivity. The reward for completing certain content…..for staying loyal to the game at certain points (not logging in continuously each and every day for two years). Skins outside of the gem store are more than just shiny pixels… theyre trophies. Its this thats being taken away.

BTW my original post uses this issue with skins as one example of ANETs phylosophy of ‘giving people all of the things’…. feel free to discuss other examples. My main gripe isnt the skins being available, its the general feeling of ANET catering to the ‘casual’ going forward and my fears for the future of the game should this be the case.

No offense meant, but your responses have me really scratching my head……

I find it hard to believe, but you’re actually being serious, aren’t you?

You’re actually saying that the ‘value’ of an item that you got in a certain way is now less because someone else can get it in a different way?

You do realize that GW2 is just a video game, yes?

The personal ‘value’ of an in game item only changes if you let it. You know what it took you to get it, you know how much time and effort you put into it……THAT is the personal value of the item, imo.

Saying that it is devalued and/or has been ‘taken’ from you because another player can get it in some other way than you did has the sounds of sour grapes at best and narcissism at worst.

jmo, of course.

I’ve never understood such attachment to bits and pixels where someone doesn’t want someone else to have those bits and pixels.

L2P is good goal. Most of players never learn.

phys.7689:

Silvia.9130:

Considering anyone can simply buy Dungeon Master title by simply paying (Way too often) a dude who used out of map exploits to reach the end boss skipping everything, this is truly the last thing I would be arguing about really… ._.

this is honestly not new to any game, and usually its easier to carry people in other MMOs. Any time an MMO has something you cant buy directly, some people will pay someone to get the drop. It doesnt really illustrate anything other than people who can will sell to people who cant. and people who cant will buy from people who can.

I know that, what I meant was that it annoys me more that the only one in-game armor set that back back back back to the beginning was the only one actual “prestige” set since it was the hardest to get, is now owned by any single random player…while these LS skins were uber easy to obtain…run around, jump here and there, there you go! So I really don’t care, everyone had them before, a few more people will have them now on, what will even change? But it kinda dreads me to see people who never set a foot into Arah running around all smug into their full sets, behaving as if they were pro…and same goes for the title, it’s not like the random titles one got from LSs, everyone got them, from the worst to the best player, but I personally “spit my blood” while running Arah 1-2-4 the first time, with no experienced player with me, with few guides and bad builds…now instead I see people who can’t even do a skill point in Plains of Ashford running around with that title they simply bought for a few golds… this is what is wrong of this game. People’s efforts are completely useless, they mean nothing. Why should I jump jumping puzzles when I can pay a mesmer to portal me on the end of it? Laziness wins in this game…which is bitter.