Guild Wars 2

I am absolutely new to F2P games, so this is a seriously noob question.

Subscription-based games obviously keep the capital coming in through monthly subscriptions. How does a F2P game like Guild Wars make money to continue development.

I do know they have microtransactions, but do those really make the company enough money? Do the amount of microtransactions available increase?

can’t rmember where i read it, but the money they have made off the purchases off the game alone will pay for 3 years or so, plus all the money they are making off the black lion trading post, i mean i usually dump around 50 dollars a month alone, cant imagine what others do.

I think so. For me was initial cost of $60. Susequently I’ve spent about $200 to buy gems. So far this game has gotten more cash out of me than a traditional sub based MMO.

That’s about managing the shop. If you carefully pick stuff to sell for real money without breaking gameplay for everyone, it can become more profitable than monthly subs.

By making you buy gems. Oh, and by alienating half their subscribers once they have their money and changing the game to cater to a new group who will then buy the game.

well for starters, you are paying 60€ ahead so its not really F2P as that would imply free to play.

So part of the money is obviously got from there, buying gems for account expansions, like expanding the slots in ur char and or ur bank, buying minipets, alot of optional things like townclothes, things like xp boosters or 100% salvage kits, and so on…

Yes its pretty easy to make money with a f2p game, especially when u make the servers split and instanced, that way u can buy alot weaker end servers and spare more money than just buy a beast of 1 server to run it all.

Guild Wars 2 is an attempt to make money, by “marketing” itself as not making money via subscription.

They have to make money via the one-time purchase (plus planned expansions) as well as microtransactions.

To do good in microtransactions: Content management becomes more critical, economy and vanity management (dyes, costumes, models) becomes a tool to sustain revenue.

Subscription based games may lack competencies in such management, but can build upon “loyalty” from subscribers who see themselves as deeply entrenched into the next billing cycle.

Without access to ANet’s financials, we really don’t know for certain, but apparently microtransactions ARE quite a profitable way of funding a game, because while the larger segment of the game’s players may not spend any money, or only a small amount, there is a small segment of the playerbase who will spend a TON of money. This is how Farmville worked, where apparently 90% of players didn’t pay anything, but the last 10% spent MILLIONS on it.

Heck, there’s anecdotes in the BLTC forum already about people who spent over $1000 buying keys during Halloween! Now, obviously these guys are outliers, but if GW2 has a playerbase of over 2 million, and just 10% of that population spend a more modest sum (say, $100), that’s already $20,000,000 for that month alone.

And we’re not even talking about the much larger segment of the population who are willing to throw $10 a month ANet’s way for some extra keys/costumes/etc.

Box sales.

The cash shop just gives them extra spending money.

I had no idea microtransactions made that much money!

costumes and town clothes sell very well.

Box sales and cash shop. Granted, I won’t be spending any more money on this game… cant stand treadmills, er, “gear progression”.

The 60 bucks down payment for one thing. If its anything like GW1, they’ll release an expansion every so often, which brings in more money.
The gem store brings in quite a bit of money. Since players aren’t paying a subscription fee, they’re a bit more friendly towards buying stuff in the cash shop.
Finally, the fees of server maintenance is next to nothing nowadays. If you look at Nexon’s expenses (publishers of Arenanet), their annual fees for servers for ALL of their MMOs is in their smallest expense category, under Other.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ns-IIn-DG-c

Servers used to be really expensive, but not so much nowadays.

The idea is basically that one person paying 100€ a month is more profitable than 5 people paying 15€ a month. In this thread someone claims he pays around 50 a month, that means he effectively pays for 3 other people who’ll never pay a single dime. In the end, this model proves more profitable for every mmo except WoW.

Sirge.8934:

The 60 bucks down payment for one thing. If its anything like GW1, they’ll release an expansion every so often, which brings in more money.

That would make sense.

When you say expansion, what do you mean? A full-on expansion? Or a moderate patch? And how often do they release expansions?

First and most obviously, GW2 makes money from initial sales assuming they exceeded what was needed to make profit. Second, and this is the main draw for F2P games (which GW2 isn’t technically), the cash shop makes a fairly significant amount of money. Between 3% and 11% of gamers will spend a significant amount of money of the cash shop monthly. These people are referred to as “whales” since they outspend the average gamer by a significant margin. It is estimated that the average gamer will spend about $20 on a cash shop throughout the life of game. Whales can spend anywhere from $100-thousands depending on the person. These whales make up for a fairy large ~75% of gamers that will pay nothing to play (like me) and I thank you for it, and I’m sure anet does as well.

Essentially, they are playing off the percentage of the populations impulsive tendencies to make money. Nothing wrong with this business model, and I support it (regardless if I pay or not). Just make sure you set a monthly budget on yourself if you know you are impulsive (like Halloween for instance where I heard people spending $200 on keys wasn’t uncommon) so that you don’t blow your monthly check on GW2.

marnick.4305:

The idea is basically that one person paying 100€ a month is more profitable than 5 people paying 15€ a month. In this thread someone claims he pays around 50 a month, that means he effectively pays for 3 other people who’ll never pay a single dime. In the end, this model proves more profitable for every mmo except WoW.

TF2 is a great example of how insanely profitable microtransactions can be. They made so much money when they released the cash shop that it became more profitable to literally give the game away for free than to charge potential cash shop customers to come through the door.

The initial box cost of GW2 was probably a great way of putting a dent in the initial development costs, but it’s microtransactions that make up the lifeblood of the game post-release, and provide their continued source of income.

All in all, this is why the latest update (and subsequent outcry) is so surprising. If the company is desperate enough to depart from its entire design philosophy to sell more boxes, it must mean that the cash shop isn’t doing as well as they need it to.

Or, more likely, the buildup of hype around GW2 is giving them quotas that a steady cash flow from satisfied players just isn’t enough to reach. Game companies seem to be doing this a lot in the last few years – tossing out a steady long-term income stream in favor of a short spike in profit. It touches on one of the reasons WoW has been so successful – yeah, sure, not everyone likes WoW, but even a skeptic has to admit that they do an admirable job of holding onto their player base over more than one or two fiscal quarters.

By running an efficient business and offering a great product, as well as offering optional premium content that is not gamebreaking. It’s really about efficiency more than anything else. They must have some very talented producers to go along with the rest of the staff.

Edit (for relevance): So, it’s more about using the money they have efficiently than it is about having a steady income.

Nar.8327:

The initial box cost of GW2 was probably a great way of putting a dent in the initial development costs, but it’s microtransactions that make up the lifeblood of the game post-release, and provide their continued source of income.

All in all, this is why the latest update (and subsequent outcry) is so surprising. If the company is desperate enough to depart from its entire design philosophy to sell more boxes, it must mean that the cash shop isn’t doing as well as they need it to.

Or, more likely, the buildup of hype around GW2 is giving them quotas that a steady cash flow from satisfied players just isn’t enough to reach. Game companies seem to be doing this a lot in the last few years – tossing out a steady long-term income stream in favor of a short spike in profit. It touches on one of the reasons WoW has been so successful – yeah, sure, not everyone likes WoW, but even a skeptic has to admit that they do an admirable job of holding onto their player base over more than one or two fiscal quarters.

Well, the longer you have subscribed into something, the more likely you would hold on to it?

GW2 being a B2P (buy to play) game must have given alot of new gamers the impression that this game has no-commitment-fees (e.g. just a buy, play and throw game)

I dare say being a B2P game, GW2 has to try twice as hard as compared to other F2P games in order to sustain its player base.

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

Indoles.1467:

These people are referred to as “whales” since they outspend the average gamer by a significant margin. It is estimated that the average gamer will spend about $20 on a cash shop throughout the life of game. Whales can spend anywhere from $100-thousands depending on the person. These whales make up for a fairy large ~75% of gamers that will pay nothing to play (like me) and I thank you for it, and I’m sure anet does as well.

I take offense at being called a whale, isn’t that being mammalist.

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

You should believe it, people has been throwing money on more “illogical” things.
Games are still fine, they provide entertainment service.

Razamis.1062:

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

Well indrectly there are. The players who are dropping $50+ a month into the gem store are helping the rest of us to play subscription free, so it’s a form of charity. As long as it’s just ‘pay for fluff’ rather than ‘pay to win’ we should all be pleased they are.

Personally I will never spend real money on gems. I have bought some gems with gold, when the exchange rate was more favourable than it is now, to buy an extra bank and character slot, but won’t again unless the exhange rate improves.

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

I don’t spend a lot in the gem store. But i have bought gems. It’s simply a matter of time vs money. I can spend 10 bucks (which is 15 minutes wages) and buy 5 hours worth of farmings gold.

I wouldn’t spend anywhere near 50 bucks a month, but I will spend a little here and there to cut the grind.

Rehashed Jibe Tube.7102:

I can spend 10 bucks (which is 15 minutes wages)

Marry me?

Razamis.1062:

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

Well, if it wasnt for these types of players spending this money, then you wouldnt have a game to play.

Cernow.3974:

Razamis.1062:

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

Well indrectly there are. The players who are dropping $50+ a month into the gem store are helping the rest of us to play subscription free, so it’s a form of charity. As long as it’s just ‘pay for fluff’ rather than ‘pay to win’ we should all be pleased they are.

Personally I will never spend real money on gems. I have bought some gems with gold, when the exchange rate was more favourable than it is now, to buy an extra bank and character slot, but won’t again unless the exhange rate improves.

This is good stuff ^

Conversely, as someone who buys gems with cash, I will never convert gems to gold unless the exchange rate improves. Just wanted to throw that out there.

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

How much money do you spend on dining out per month? Going to movies? Bars? I could go on and on.

What people choose to spend their money on is their business and their right. If someone blows $200 a week eating out when they could just cook meals at home for $50, I’m not going to call them stupid. I’ve spent roughly $300 in the gem store to date primarily to buy expensive dyes for my 12 alts and just whatever else strikes my fancy. This is a large part of where my enjoyment from the game comes from. If it seems like an unwise way to spend money, then don’t follow my example. I guarantee I could find purchases in your life I deem “unnecessary” but I won’t criticize you for it. You should learn just because you don’t agree with something that doesn’t make it stupid before you judge others on where they choose to spend THEIR money.

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

You should be happy ppl buy gems. They pay so you can play.

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

So you like being judgemental and telling others what to do with their money much?

I used my big pile of gems to upgrade to deluxe, buy 8 more char slots, open all bag and bank slots, and enjoy a few costumes. Games are my entertainment. This game in its total expense for me has cost less than a few dinners out at a nice restraunt. Did you buy the most inexpensive used car you could find and give the savings from that purchase to charity? Filling my gas tank these days costs me over $100 (big tank/high cost area). Most of us who live in the western world have expenses that are so frivolous it’s crazy if compared to the needy of the planet.

It is all well within my budget. I don’t smoke, drink booze, drive 500 miles a week burning gas unneeded. I live a very frugal lifestyle except for my fun gaming hobby (is it a vice, that’d be cool I need one) Who’s to say whose bloated budget is sicker?

Do you spend over $100 a month on cable TV? on movies? on ice creams? on anything frivolous (i.e. not food or shelter)? – if so you make me sick for being a hypocrite. If not it’s still none of your business!

Why not post your charitable givings so far this year along with your anual earmings so we can see what % you give to demonstrate to us all how superior you really are? Tell us of your volunteer efforts too while you are at it. Served in yours countries military at all in times of natural disaster or war – tell us. Ever saved someones life – please do tell. To most adults $50 in entertainment expense is chump change and I for one will not allow your sense of outrage at a laughably small expenditure bother me one iota.

For just spending the money needed to buy this game and have a computer and internet service let alone electricity in your dwelling you have allowed dozens of children to starve! (That’s all BS – but the OP has no grounds for complaint at all as they have spent cash on fun not food for the poor as well)

I’m not buying this moral superiority crap at all! Good day sir or mam.

Ferguson.2157:

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

So you like being judgemental and telling others what to do with their money much?

I used my big pile of gems to upgrade to delux, buy 8 more char slots, open all bag and bank slots, and enjoy a few costumes. Games are my entertainment. this game in its total expense for me has cost less than a few dinners out at a nice restraunt. Did you buy the most inexpensive used car you could find and give the saving from that purchase to charity? Filling my gas tank these days costs me over $100 (big tank/high cost area).Most of us who live in the western world have expenses that are so frivolous it’s crazy if compared to the needy of the planet.

It is all well within my budget. I don’t smoke, drink booze, drive 500 miles a week burning gas unneeded. I live a very frugal lifestyle except for my fun gaming hobby (is it a vice, that’d be cool I need one) Whos to say whose bloated budget is sicker?

Do you spend over $100 a month on cable TV? on movies? on ice creams? on anything frivolous (i.e. not food or shelter)? – if so you make me sick for being a hypocrite. if not it’s still none of your business!

Why not post your charitable givings so far this year along with your anual earmings so we can see what % you give to demonstrate to us all how superior you really are? Tell us of your volunteer efforts too while you are at it. Served in yours countries military at all in times of natural disaster or war – tell us. Ever saved someones life – please do tell. To most adults $50 in entertainment expense is chump change and I for one will not allow your sense of outrage at a laughably small expenditure bother me one iota.

I’m not buying this moral superiority crap at all! Good day sir or mam.

Amen! You got my point across much better than what I was able to. lol

I have earned 300 gold from TP , only buy material , craft , sell

I paid $60 for the box of course (and another $60 for a family member who isn’t playing right now) and $40 went to inventory and character slots. So that’s $100 for myself alone and the game isn’t even 3 months old.

That is nothing compared to the amounts some people have spent in the cash shop, either to shortcut the grind by buying gold or for other things.

In the future I’m sure they’ll make plenty of money off expansions, too.

The question is, how much did it cost to develop this game? Are they in the black yet?

1. During launch, they make money from huge advertisement that lures in huge amount of people. F2P + High graphic is the selling point.

2. After that, money comes slowly from seasonal costumes and players who wants to progress in-game faster. (2nd point is ineffective because the launch-state lacks progression. Everything can be achieve in 2 weeks to 1 month even without spending.)

3. Most importantly, the most money comes from players who wants to stand out more from the rest of the players. (Current : Few players quickly gain gold from converting gems to craft for unique skins. – The problem is, once players get their desired skin, they won’t spend again for another look to replace that skin. So it’s a one-time-spend thing. It’s not good for long term. Other kinds of progression is needed to make players constantly feel stand out. In that way, they’ll continously spend to fund the servers.)

They make plenty enough with just the box sales to fund the development and maintain the servers for years.

Other companies are just greedy rip-offs charging monthly fees, it’s really not needed.

Karizee.8076:

They make plenty enough with just the box sales to fund the development and maintain the servers for years.

Other companies are just greedy rip-offs charging monthly fees, it’s really not needed.

I feel this was a trend started (legitimately, I hope) back in the days of dial-up and old-school MMORPGS like Ultima Online. Hosting a game online was a novel idea, and was kind of costly, at the time.

As technology progressed, server maintenance got cheaper and cheaper. Upkeep got easier, but nowadays, the companies have kept the subscription fee because hey, freee money!

Ferguson.2157:

Razamis.1062:

I can’t believe anyone would drop money in this game for gems. You get everything you need just from playing the game, there is absolutely no reason to buy gems.

If you are dropping $50/month into this game when it isn’t needed, perhaps you should give some of that wasted money to charity.

I find it sick how some players can proudly boast how much they spend in the gem store. Like most players, I haven’t spent a dime in the gem store and never intend to.

So you like being judgemental and telling others what to do with their money much?

I used my big pile of gems to upgrade to deluxe, buy 8 more char slots, open all bag and bank slots, and enjoy a few costumes. Games are my entertainment. This game in its total expense for me has cost less than a few dinners out at a nice restraunt. Did you buy the most inexpensive used car you could find and give the savings from that purchase to charity? Filling my gas tank these days costs me over $100 (big tank/high cost area). Most of us who live in the western world have expenses that are so frivolous it’s crazy if compared to the needy of the planet.

It is all well within my budget. I don’t smoke, drink booze, drive 500 miles a week burning gas unneeded. I live a very frugal lifestyle except for my fun gaming hobby (is it a vice, that’d be cool I need one) Who’s to say whose bloated budget is sicker?

Do you spend over $100 a month on cable TV? on movies? on ice creams? on anything frivolous (i.e. not food or shelter)? – if so you make me sick for being a hypocrite. If not it’s still none of your business!

Why not post your charitable givings so far this year along with your anual earmings so we can see what % you give to demonstrate to us all how superior you really are? Tell us of your volunteer efforts too while you are at it. Served in yours countries military at all in times of natural disaster or war – tell us. Ever saved someones life – please do tell. To most adults $50 in entertainment expense is chump change and I for one will not allow your sense of outrage at a laughably small expenditure bother me one iota.

For just spending the money needed to buy this game and have a computer and internet service let alone electricity in your dwelling you have allowed dozens of children to starve! (That’s all BS – but the OP has no grounds for complaint at all as they have spent cash on fun not food for the poor as well)

I’m not buying this moral superiority crap at all! Good day sir or mam.

Well said.

you’re kidding, right?!

(quote humanoids in the game use when you attack them)

Faline.8795:

I am absolutely new to F2P games, so this is a seriously noob question.

F2P isn’t really free, there’s always a catch. Most F2P has classically been more like free to demo and lube up your credit card if you really wanna play. More recent trends are getting away from that since people obviously don’t like it and are getting slicker in coming up with ways to pry away your money.

GW2 isn’t truly F2P since you have to buy the box up front. It’s a hybrid and I think this is a very good approach for high quality games. The F2P aspect of GW2 beyond that box sale is amongst the least lame of the F2P offerings I’ve tried or know of, since there are no restrictions on your playing and the things you can get for “cash” are entirely optional conveniences.

(Compare the micro transaction and restriction heavy F2P implimentation that’s hitting SWTOR today if you wanna see how F2P should NOT be done…oy…what a mess. Sadly, BioWare seems entrenched in 10 years ago – it showed in their UIs and features when SWTOR released and it’s showing now in their F2P implimentation – it’s like they haven’t paid attention to what’s happening in MMORPGs since WoW released or something – they just saw WoW, said, we should do that to KOTOR, and got locked in time stasis.)

Anyways…

One could very easily play everything GW2 has to offer without ever spending an extra penny.

ANet’s goal then is to put stuff in the gem store that are attractive to get you to throw down extra cash, without being pay 2 win or overpowered, and without comprimising the principle of the whole game being available without cash barriers. IMO, they do a very good job of this.

The other thing about GW2’s “store” is that gems can be bought and sold in player economy, adding an interesting wrinkle to player economy, and enabling players to ultimately obtain gem store items via in game currency.

The thing is, you’re not likely to have extra or enough in game currency to do this until you’re at the level cap, or you just may be like many players who aren’t very good at accumulating wealth and that’s the rub. You might want more bank slots, another character slot, or other attractive goodies long before you can afford to translate game gold into store gems, and instead decide to throw down some cash for gem store options.

I’m thinking ANet is doing pretty decently with gem store based on the fact that the gem/currency market seems pretty thriving and the fact that ANet is already cranking quality free content (if you wiki GW1 and their usual way of doing things, one way they’ve intended to make money is by charging for xpacs, although they did do free content for GW1 too).