Guild Wars 2

Seems like everyone has an opinion on this subject, and I’m curious to know if anyone has any solid factual evidence either which way…

Some people say that GW2 is losing money, that 400,000 active players at any given time is considered “low” for the industry… and that GW2 doesn’t have the cashflow to produce the kind of expansion-pack level content that people are asking for. (and by expansion-pack grade content, I mean new zones, new classes/races, new storylines – not just mini-events)

Other people seem to think that A-net is doing just fine, and has plenty of money coming in from the gemstore and box sales. I read an interview by one of the big buys at A-net and he basically said that the “market was healthy” and that they had no cashflow problems. He also said something to the effect that the Black Lion Trading Post was profitable and that “players were doing their duty” as far as microtransactions go.

Anyway – I’m curious to know what people think about this…. The disconnect for me is that if A-net has the money to produce large-scale content for GW2 and isn’t … why? If they don’t have the money, or willingness to re-invest in GW2 in a meaningful way… what’s the future of GW2?

People often hold up GW2’s free2play model as one of the best/fairest in the industry… is the model working? If so, when can we expect actual meaningful content, such as Guild Halls, new gameplay mechanics, new classes/races?

The Quarterly report from NcSoft, which is a publicly held company, shows that Guild Wars 2 is doing fine.

Your comments about an expansion don’t make much sense from a business perspective.

Right now, Anet is giving away content every 2 weeks. They’d sell an expansion. MMOs often come out with expansions when there’s less interest in their game to bring people back to the game and to get some more money to fund future development. The fact that Anet isn’t doing an expansion is evidence of the fact that they’re doing okay.

I suspect a good percentage of their profits are from the cash shop.

theyre billing themselves as the fastest selling mmo so unless they have some sever cognitive dissonance im assuming that means money

There was an interview 1-2 months ago from one of the game devs (Mike Z I believe) who said that the current revenue model for the game is more than enough to sustain itself that they don’t need to resort to expansions.

So it is doing well. And they are producing enough content. Why do you think they can afford to have 4 teams working on Living Story to push out 2-week content intervals? While it may not seem large-scale for you, in the grand scheme of things, the # and quality of content produced since release IMO would equal to that of a game that had no content releases for a year, and then suddenly released an expansion.

I know everyone wants a new map, class and new dungeon every 2 weeks but it’s not going to happen.

If ArenaNet wants to make more money or wants to fund “large scale development”, they can do so in the form of an expansion. Get extra funding via pre-order.

The future of Guild Wars 2 =) I think currently it lies within China. If I were ArenaNet, I would be working my behind off to get the game launch and launch right in China. If this game takes off in China… well 3 mil sales is nothing for a country with like… 1.4billion people?

Smashing success. Take that 460k peak concurrency number and compare it to WoW’s peak concurrency of 1 million after MoP launched with 10 million subs. And GW2 has not launched in China yet.

I’m actually a bit ‘worried’ about China. Just look at the trailer they had and the # of views – they only have 44K in a month. That’s a really, really low number.

But then again, I don’t even know if the Chinese use youtube as their main video site. They don’t even use twitter or google.

Well, it’s been a year and the game is pretty much the same game it was a year ago… I’m curious to know why that is, if not for financial reasons.

It’s been a year and I still sometimes see my character chop down trees with his pickaxe. Hell, there are bugs in this game that are still there from the beta.

If GW2 is making money, when are they going to start investing in this game? Temporary events every 2 weeks is great and all, and I’ve enjoyed all of them – but that’s not content.

Let’s put it this way: I’d trade 5 living story events or festivals for 1 new class. I’d trade 10 living story events for 1 new playable race.

1/ there’s only 10 MMOs in the west with more than 100,000 subscribers let alone online users, including the mastodont. 400,000 at any time would be extremely good.

2/ all reports point towards the apparent fact that Guild Wars 2 and Arena.net are doing extremely well financially. They’re still growing as a company and there’s a lot of job opportunities on their website.

3/ Several hints about behind the scenes projects, and that the living world is actually one of the smaller teams. Something big is going to happen eventually, but no one knows when or what.

4/ the current b2p model and cash shop without p2win seems to be a very solid financial strategy.

Read through massively’s GW2 section to find a lot of good sources.

As long as RNG boxes are sold in the gemstore, Guild Wars 2 will survive. In all honesty though, I’m beginning to doubt that Anet will actually implement a meaningful patch in the future. I’m getting tired of these bore-fests every two weeks. That being said, the game hasn’t changed much at all since beta, and for a game that boasts “World Changing Events”, that’s sure sad. I don’t feel like the world has been changed at all. I feel like there’s the main state of the game in which nothing of importance ever happens, and then on patch days something of no importance happens, and then it goes back to the main state of the boring game. Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

@darkdomino Most of us would prefer new things to do content wise every few weeks as we get and put up with a few minor bugs every now and again. A brand new class or race means a lot more time and money investment and a lot of headaches to boot. I think they will release these eventually along with opening up new zones, an increased level cap etc etc, but in time and with another purchased expansion pack, not just as F2P d/l content.

I think the running costs for a major MMO look to be sustainable on around 200k subscriptions, for 440k players this should be fine, however the F2P system doesn’t lend itself to a steady income or guaranteed financial input, they can’t develop content as large scale as races, zones and classes without this guaranteed income which either means expansion pack to buy or a subscription based service.

darkdomino.9578:

Well, it’s been a year and the game is pretty much the same game it was a year ago… I’m curious to know why that is, if not for financial reasons.

It’s been a year and I still sometimes see my character chop down trees with his pickaxe. Hell, there are bugs in this game that are still there from the beta.

If GW2 is making money, when are they going to start investing in this game? Temporary events every 2 weeks is great and all, and I’ve enjoyed all of them – but that’s not content.

Let’s put it this way: I’d trade 5 living story events or festivals for 1 new class. I’d trade 10 living story events for 1 new playable race.

The game is still the same as it was a year ago? Really?

Aside from the myriad bug fixes (there have been pages and pages of them, many not even documented), there were quality of life upgrades (the account wallet, aoe looting, the end of culling, previewing in the market place), the addition of the Fractals, WxP in WvW, a revamp of AC, new jumping puzzles, new dynamic events, new minigames.

Maybe you’re just not paying attention.

Galtrix.7369:

Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

Well you could ignore the landscape changes in Southsun, the lighthouse being obliterated in LA, the Lion statue being destroyed by the Mad King..

Vol.5241:

I’m actually a bit ‘worried’ about China. Just look at the trailer they had and the # of views – they only have 44K in a month. That’s a really, really low number.

But then again, I don’t even know if the Chinese use youtube as their main video site. They don’t even use twitter or google.

No, I dont think they can view YouTube in China.

In China they use www.tudou.com. The game is still in close beta there I think and according to tudou.com, the GW2 chinese trailer has about 150,000 view in 2 weeks.

We’ll see

A non WoW mmo with over 500k active users is considered a success (of course, I mean non WoW and non TOR budget level MMOs). 400k concurrent users is HUGE in MMO standards these days (note that it doesn’t say just active accounts, it says “online at one time”).

Vayne.8563:

darkdomino.9578:

Well, it’s been a year and the game is pretty much the same game it was a year ago… I’m curious to know why that is, if not for financial reasons.

It’s been a year and I still sometimes see my character chop down trees with his pickaxe. Hell, there are bugs in this game that are still there from the beta.

If GW2 is making money, when are they going to start investing in this game? Temporary events every 2 weeks is great and all, and I’ve enjoyed all of them – but that’s not content.

Let’s put it this way: I’d trade 5 living story events or festivals for 1 new class. I’d trade 10 living story events for 1 new playable race.

The game is still the same as it was a year ago? Really?

Aside from the myriad bug fixes (there have been pages and pages of them, many not even documented), there were quality of life upgrades (the account wallet, aoe looting, the end of culling, previewing in the market place), the addition of the Fractals, WxP in WvW, a revamp of AC, new jumping puzzles, new dynamic events, new minigames.

Maybe you’re just not paying attention.

Again, I guess our definitions are different… I don’t consider jump puzzles and living story events to be significant improvements to the game. They’re fun to do, yeah… but it’s not the same as adding a new race, or giving people something truly “new” to do in-game.

As far as things like the wallet – yeah that’s useful. I’m not gonna sit here and deny that. But do you honestly look at the new improved wallet, and then at the game world and go “Yeah, this is different.”

Vol.5241:

Galtrix.7369:

Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

Well you could ignore the landscape changes in Southsun, the lighthouse being obliterated in LA, the Lion statue being destroyed by the Mad King..

Were those permanent changes?

Would be doing much better if they worked on expansions and made the unique weapon sets direct purchases.

Vayne.8563:

The Quarterly report from NcSoft, which is a publicly held company, shows that Guild Wars 2 is doing fine.

“Fine” is an understatement:)

If their reports are even close to accurate then GW2 is bailing out the rest of the company right not. NCSOFT without GW2 would be losing money otherwise.

Which is good for us at least…

Indeed it is so…

Galtrix.7369:

Vol.5241:

Galtrix.7369:

Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

Well you could ignore the landscape changes in Southsun, the lighthouse being obliterated in LA, the Lion statue being destroyed by the Mad King..

Were those permanent changes?

Yes other than the statue in LA that has been rebuilt after a few months.

The most recent NCSoft investor report describes Guild Wars 2 as “stable” and credits it, along with a large spike in Lineage 1 sales in Eastern markets, as a very large source of earnings.

So yeah, pretty sure GW2’s doing pretty well.

Galtrix.7369:

Vol.5241:

Galtrix.7369:

Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

Well you could ignore the landscape changes in Southsun, the lighthouse being obliterated in LA, the Lion statue being destroyed by the Mad King..

Were those permanent changes?

Well Southsun is still there. the villages / outposts build by the refugess in the secrets of southsun are still there too. The lighthouse is still broken, cragstead (not mentioned before) is still there. The rebuilding that went in cragstead right after secret of south sun are still there too. The grawl refugees are still in LA. The refuges that where “created” in flame and frost still exist and are currently residing in cragstead (rebuilding it). The vents caused by the molten alliance structures are still there. The not so secret sky pirate base is still there. So yeah I think they’re pretty permanent.

Wolfheart.1938:

Galtrix.7369:

Vol.5241:

Galtrix.7369:

Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

Well you could ignore the landscape changes in Southsun, the lighthouse being obliterated in LA, the Lion statue being destroyed by the Mad King..

Were those permanent changes?

Yes other than the statue in LA that has been rebuilt after a few months.

I don’t even understand what they have in that spot right now. If I recall it looked like some wierd asuran structure.

Well the lighthouse and landscape changes to Southsun were.

Anyway, besides that, I don’t know how recent that 460 000+ players at one time is. I assume that’s the highest they achieved in year 1.

They’d have to provide us with an actual count of ‘active’ players, and set their own parameter for ‘active’, e.g. logged on in the last month, week, whatever for us to get a good picture. Still, even 100 000 users playing at one time is good.

I can only guess they’re doing good financially, though. We know they have 4 active teams that have 4 months to do content for just the living world now, and we’ve been told there are other projects they are working on in the background they haven’t told us about yet.

Vol.5241:

Wolfheart.1938:

Galtrix.7369:

Vol.5241:

Galtrix.7369:

Even WoW had more world-changing events in it when a dragon landed in a field and put fissures in the ground forever. I’ll continue to wait for better content, but I won’t hold my breath.

Well you could ignore the landscape changes in Southsun, the lighthouse being obliterated in LA, the Lion statue being destroyed by the Mad King..

Were those permanent changes?

Yes other than the statue in LA that has been rebuilt after a few months.

I don’t even understand what they have in that spot right now. If I recall it looked like some wierd asuran structure.

It’s a holographic projector, it was used during Dragon Bash to project a holographic dragon in the sky and then a holographic version of Kiel after she won. Wonder if mad king will destroy it as well when halloween comes back, or whether they’ll put the old fointain in place before that..

The Master.2893:

Vayne.8563:

The Quarterly report from NcSoft, which is a publicly held company, shows that Guild Wars 2 is doing fine.

“Fine” is an understatement:)

If their reports are even close to accurate then GW2 is bailing out the rest of the company right not. NCSOFT without GW2 would be losing money otherwise.

Which is good for us at least…

Indeed it is so…

I don’t want to overstate things. I think it’s doing well personally, but in reality, sales of the box have slowed. So I say it’s doing fine.

In reality I think that as time progresses, this game is going to pick up a lot of speed. When it releases in China it’ll be doing a lot better than fine. lol

Enough money from the store to delay any expansion? Atleast from that supposed leaked converence call it was.

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Vol.5241:

I’m actually a bit ‘worried’ about China. Just look at the trailer they had and the # of views – they only have 44K in a month. That’s a really, really low number.

But then again, I don’t even know if the Chinese use youtube as their main video site. They don’t even use twitter or google.

youtube is an illegal site in china. None of those views come from their chinese playerbase.

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Does the sales figure account for the gem store?

(Post Edited*)

Okay I got the numbers to end this debate (Q2 2013):

Q2 2013 PDF File (use download link) page 4-5

(Numbers in Million Korean Won)

All Operating Profit: 62,248
All Game Sales: 192,014
GW2 Sales: 28,899, down from 36,382 last Quarter

Costs of GW2 are not directly provided in this presentation.

Indeed it is so…

Vol.5241:

I’m actually a bit ‘worried’ about China. Just look at the trailer they had and the # of views – they only have 44K in a month. That’s a really, really low number.

But then again, I don’t even know if the Chinese use youtube as their main video site. They don’t even use twitter or google.

Except that google and china don’t get along well. Aka Youtube is blocked. You have to go to the sites relevant to chinese players and not assume youtube=world.

With that said who knows.

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Except that game sales aren’t what the game is supporting itself on and NcSoft hasn’t said how much the cash shop has made.

I suspect the cash shop more than compensates for game sales.

Pacifica.9576:

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Does the sales figure account for the gem store?

YES!

The Master.2893:

Pacifica.9576:

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Does the sales figure account for the gem store?

YES!

Very interesting, thanks for the post

GW2 is doing good financially.

The active users is highest at one moment in time, so more people play GW2 than the 400,000+ figure.

Gem sales continue to provide all the funding GW2 needs, enough to support 4 teams churning out content, enough that they don’t even need extra money from making a expansion and selling it.

Also, the Asia release will sell lots more, it will be interesting to see if GW2 sells more or less then in the west. Those players will start buying gems too…

So alls good…

3.5 millions times $60

They paid for development, a nice profit, and sever fees for the next 100 years. They dont need revenue, they’ve already been paid. Anything more is just pure greed, and by the looks of it, sacrificed a good IP for extra bucks. They’ve blew it with this game, Im not touching another product thats associated with any of these companies.

bigtime.7410:

3.5 millions times $60

They paid for development, a nice profit, and sever fees for the next 100 years. They dont need revenue, they’ve already been paid. Anything more is just pure greed, and by the looks of it, sacrificed a good IP for extra bucks. They’ve blew it with this game, Im not touching another product thats associated with any of these companies.

Well due to retailer’s cost (if you buy game or gems at GameStop for example) its hard to say how much of the retail price ArenaNet gets.

But in theory your point is somewhat vaild: Right now GW2 is bailing out NCSOFT’s other “failed” projects… currently Wildstar who’s “Pay to Play” model recently announced will destroy that game.

If ArenaNet had 100% of sales of game to fund the game then there wouldn’t be any problems as you stated. But this is not so.

No matter…

bigtime.7410:

3.5 millions times $60

They paid for development, a nice profit, and sever fees for the next 100 years. They dont need revenue, they’ve already been paid. Anything more is just pure greed, and by the looks of it, sacrificed a good IP for extra bucks. They’ve blew it with this game, Im not touching another product thats associated with any of these companies.

lol, you’re funny. Aside from the fact that Anet doesn’t get that 60 bucks because of intermediaries and taxes, you clearly have no idea how much it costs to build and maintain an MMO. If they closed the gemstore today I don’t think the game would last very long at all before they had to pull the plug on it.

Gehenna.3625:

bigtime.7410:

3.5 millions times $60

They paid for development, a nice profit, and sever fees for the next 100 years. They dont need revenue, they’ve already been paid. Anything more is just pure greed, and by the looks of it, sacrificed a good IP for extra bucks. They’ve blew it with this game, Im not touching another product thats associated with any of these companies.

lol, you’re funny. Aside from the fact that Anet doesn’t get that 60 bucks because of intermediaries and taxes, you clearly have no idea how much it costs to build and maintain an MMO. If they closed the gemstore today I don’t think the game would last very long at all before they had to pull the plug on it.

you dont think is right

Gehenna.3625:

lol, you’re funny. Aside from the fact that Anet doesn’t get that 60 bucks because of intermediaries and taxes, you clearly have no idea how much it costs to build and maintain an MMO. If they closed the gemstore today I don’t think the game would last very long at all before they had to pull the plug on it.

Well to be fair to “bigtime”… if 100% of profits were going back to ArenaNet this game would have far more content in it then it does now. How much content that would be is undefined.

The Master.2893:

Vayne.8563:

The Master.2893:

Vayne.8563:

The Quarterly report from NcSoft, which is a publicly held company, shows that Guild Wars 2 is doing fine.

“Fine” is an understatement:)

If their reports are even close to accurate then GW2 is bailing out the rest of the company right not. NCSOFT without GW2 would be losing money otherwise.

Which is good for us at least…

Indeed it is so…

I don’t want to overstate things. I think it’s doing well personally, but in reality, sales of the box have slowed. So I say it’s doing fine.

In reality I think that as time progresses, this game is going to pick up a lot of speed. When it releases in China it’ll be doing a lot better than fine. lol

Okay I got the numbers to end this debate (Q2 2013):

Q2 2013 PDF File (use download link) page 4-5

(Numbers in Million Korean Won)

Operating Profit: 62,248
All Game Sales: 192,014
GW2 Sales: 84,791, up from 66,038 last Quarter

Costs of GW2 are not directly provided in this presentation.

…No matter: Which means without GW2 NCSOFT would be going bankrupt right now. Yes this game is here to stay Blizzard!

Indeed it is so…

Reading is a skill. So is knowing the difference between light and dark blue….You actually quoted the numbers for LINEAGE 1 and not GW2….GW2 is barely bigger than Aion at the moment.

The actual numbers for GW2 are 36,382 and then 28,899 so they are going down and nowhere near the Lineage 1 numbers.

Vayne.8563:

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Except that game sales aren’t what the game is supporting itself on and NcSoft hasn’t said how much the cash shop has made.

I suspect the cash shop more than compensates for game sales.

Sales are sales, not just box sales. There is no point in them to do these reports for their investors if they exclude cash shop sales. It’s rather odd that you keep insisting cash shop sales are excluded from this. That makes absolutely no sense.

It’s called an earnings report by the way and for comparison Lineage 2 is in there as well and that’s free to play. How would you account for those sale numbers then?

Gehenna.3625

Reading is a skill. So is knowing the difference between light and dark blue….You actually quoted the numbers for LINEAGE 1 and not GW2….GW2 is barely bigger than Aion at the moment.

The actual numbers for GW2 are 36,382 and then 28,899 so they are going down and nowhere near the Lineage 1 numbers.

… I stand corrected. Looks like I messed up the different color’s of blue on my screen to assume the inverted situation. This does change the logical conclusions therefore that can be made.

Thank you for your post.

Gehenna.3625:

Vayne.8563:

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Except that game sales aren’t what the game is supporting itself on and NcSoft hasn’t said how much the cash shop has made.

I suspect the cash shop more than compensates for game sales.

Sales are sales, not just box sales. There is no point in them to do these reports for their investors if they exclude cash shop sales. It’s rather odd that you keep insisting cash shop sales are excluded from this. That makes absolutely no sense.

It’s called an earnings report by the way and for comparison Lineage 2 is in there as well and that’s free to play. How would you account for those sale numbers then?

Okay I’m not sure. I remember reading something…but it may have been that they didn’t separate out the cash shop from sales. It’s entirely possible I’m misremembering what I read.

Vayne.8563:

Gehenna.3625:

Vayne.8563:

Gehenna.3625:

The financial reports shows that Last year GW2 made a lot of money and in the first two quarters of 2013 sales are down dramatically, like 70% down…Also the second quarter was down from the first quarter again. So the financial reports actually show that the game is going down financially in the first half of this year. In that sense GW2 has followed the same trend as other MMOs.

Anet/NcSoft have also said that by now the game is stabilising and slowly growing again. So the game is not dying but financially I don’t think they’re exactly sitting on roses either.

So my assessment is that it’s doing ok. Not great, not horrible, but ok.

Except that game sales aren’t what the game is supporting itself on and NcSoft hasn’t said how much the cash shop has made.

I suspect the cash shop more than compensates for game sales.

Sales are sales, not just box sales. There is no point in them to do these reports for their investors if they exclude cash shop sales. It’s rather odd that you keep insisting cash shop sales are excluded from this. That makes absolutely no sense.

It’s called an earnings report by the way and for comparison Lineage 2 is in there as well and that’s free to play. How would you account for those sale numbers then?

Okay I’m not sure. I remember reading something…but it may have been that they didn’t separate out the cash shop from sales. It’s entirely possible I’m misremembering what I read.

No problem. Mind you, with all of that I am not saying GW2 is dying. They still make sales and every MMO goes through this cycle. They have slow player growth again and that’s always a good sign. As long as the game does well enough to keep it going, I am sure a good number of people will be happy and I am not so bitter that I want GW2 to die. I am happy for the people who like it if keeps going for a long time.

aspirine.6852:

Enough money from the store to delay any expansion? Atleast from that supposed leaked converence call it was.

The conference call was a hoax.

What are you talking about they are doing great financially they rake in money from the no so smart people who are buying there legendarys and are giving us chump change events in a map that was created 12 months ago…. They are rolling the dough ripping the players off and making bank like farmville does in facebook!

Really, in summary, the earnings statement referenced by Vayne and Gehenna are readily available for different time periods. For those interested in such things, check them out.

For more in depth analysis, financial institution associations publish key metrics by industry such as profit margins, earnings per share, etc. These are also helpful in determining how well or poorly a company is doing compared to its competition and the industry at large.

One thing that we are not likely to see on the financial statements are numbers related to actual players. Others more knowledgeable than I in this area likely can comment better on how the game is doing in terms of players.

Zero.6082:

What are you talking about they are doing great financially they rake in money from the no so smart people who are buying there legendarys and are giving us chump change events in a map that was created 12 months ago…. They are rolling the dough ripping the players off and making bank like farmville does in facebook!

They make money for their shareholders, which is what they are supposed to do. What they do with that money is really the business of shareholders and management. If you are unhappy with the game, that is another matter. It is reasonable to complain that the product, service, etc. does not meet expectations or can be improved. And those discussions, I expect, are very important to Arenanet if they hope to maintain their player base. I am not certain that framing that game assessment discussion in terms of how they manage their money will accomplish much.