Guild Wars 2

I was there for the first rollout of Jade Dragon skins in the gemstore, when there was no account wardrobe. Back when you couldn’t “keep skins.” Lo and behold, account wardrobe comes out with very little forewarning, and I find out I permanently lost several expensive weapon skins because I had reskinned my main weapon to preserve my stats.

I was there when my entire collection of RP townclothes was blown up and turned into useless tonics because of the wardrobe overhaul. Town clothes could have easily been added to the wardrobe as armor pieces or even the outfit tab.

I was there for the 1 year of Living Story S1 that ran us on an insane content treadmill that was nearly impossible to complete while having a full time job due to temporary content constantly being removed. As a result I have so many unfinished achievements and missed out on temporary content items.

I was there when the NGE edition of the game came out and introduced a horrible leveling system for alts. I was there to spend hundreds of skillpoints and gold on unlocks for characters when the new system came out and just unlocked everything at 80 for free.

I was there when the horrible fractured update came out and rolled fractal progression backwards to level 30 even though I was already at max level. I was forced to rerun all of the fractals again and deal with those horrible mistlock instabilities for even lower drop rates than before – just to get back where I originally was.

I was there for when the entire skill system was blown up and revamped, losing some of my best PvE/WvW/PvP builds to make room for specializations and a new meta that is even more imbalanced than the old.

I am a veteran, I survived.

Now I wonder, when is the next time that someone decides that an older system is useless and they are just going to remove it and roll back my progression?

When is the next time that one of my characters is going to be rendered useless or I’m going to lose something valuable “for the greater good” of the game?

When are the developers going to finally decide on a stable framework for the game and reliable core systems that I can build progression on without wondering if its going to get nuked in the future?

When I can I ever get a sense of stability or trust for the systems of this game?

When I can be a veteran and not feel punished or lose out for sticking around?

I sold zap for 4 abyss dyes 3 years ago.

Beat that

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

…congrats? If you hate the game so much now how about you find a game your like better?

I get ya, you can love the game and still hate it when it takes a dump on ya, I hope one day, not soon, I’ll have as many war stories to tell as you do

Ah, memories time.

Remember when they censored the heavy Orrian armor because they thought it was too revealing (after tons of people already bought it)? Remember when dyes were account wide, then changed to character only cause Anet thought our palettes should be unique per character, then changed them back to account wide? Remember when they reset all crafting discoveries cause they were too lazy to add new recipes to level to 500 with? Remember the Wizard Hat fiasco? Remember wasting all your skill points on a new healing skill, only to have it removed later?

Yeah I’ve been here since beta as well. But hey, I’ve come to accept one thing. Things change and there is nothing we can do about it.

Funny I’m a vet. Never had any town clothes, because if found them useless, since they could only be worn in cities. I much prefer the outfit system, even if it’s not mix and match, because I can use those outfits anywhere.

I survived four world completes that I had to do WvW on, and I’m so glad I don’t need to complete WvW now to get more of them.

I survived doing dungeons to get armor and weapons, when now I can PvP to get some of them.

I survived playing WvW with culling, where you couldn’t see your opponents until you were pretty much dead. I’m sure glad that was fixed.

I survived having to buy abyss dyes for multiple characters, when now all my better dyes are account bound. I remember getting hundreds and hundreds of unided dyes back. Good times.

I survived the Mad King Tower jumping puzzle, before they made it so the other people jumping with you were glowing orbs. Much better now, thanks Anet.

OP, you seem like a glass is half empty kind of guy.

So yeah, those were things that happened. I remember them.

I lost my blue SAB backpack just before Wardrobe.

I never bought expensive dyes for more than one character because too bad.

I miss my town clothes.

I made an alt specifically to run through the trait revamp. It was not ideal.

I guess I’m glad I’m more casual. Yet, as a casual, with a full time job, I still managed to complete every achievement meta in Season 1. The only one I didn’t complete was the Aetherblade one and that was because I didn’t care and didn’t participate in it at all. If I had wanted it having a full time job and only playing a couple hours a day at most would not have been an imposition.

I did not get affected by Fractured.

Because of how character builds work and the game in general, really, you have never had your character made useless. There has never been a time that you couldn’t respec your build if you really felt the need. It has only gotten easier to do.

I’m a Veteran and I haven’t survived, I lived. Survival isn’t good enough.

Azure.8670:

I sold zap for 4 abyss dyes 3 years ago.

Beat that

I bought monkey kind tonic for 500g a week before it was added to dry top loot tables and dropped to 2g

Kal Spiro.9745:

So yeah, those were things that happened. I remember them.

I lost my blue SAB backpack just before Wardrobe.

I lost the green one -.-, can feel your pain!.

Please give us SAB as LS3, please!!!!!!!!!

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. I didn’t realize he was making his main point about town clothes but more rather being set back with character progression due to an unstable game…. Anyway.

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence, good $80 on dyes alone before account bound dyes ….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. Anyway.

Yes those refunds, I received one for owning multiple commander tags, was given some digital money after using real life money to pay….

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

You paid with gems, you got gems back. In theory that means the next time you buy something you don’t have to pay real money.

To be clear, you did NOT buy an outfit from the gem store with real money. You bought it with gems. If you spent $1000 that means you’re buying gems anyway. You get gems back which means you save money the next time you want to buy.

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. Anyway.

Yes those refunds, I received one for owning multiple commander tags, was given some digital money after using real life money to pay….

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

You paid with gems, you got gems back. In theory that means the next time you buy something you don’t have to pay real money.

To be clear, you did NOT buy an outfit from the gem store with real money. You bought it with gems. If you spent $1000 that means you’re buying gems anyway. You get gems back which means you save money the next time you want to buy.

So you want to argue this? ok.

I went to Timezone, I paid them cash for Timezone Card which would allow me to play their games, shortly after purchasing the card they turned off all the machines which means I can’t play any games, I take the card back to the retailer but he simply states “you bought the card with your money to play games, but we can’t allow you to play games, but atleast you get to keep the card until it is expired at the end of the day, you’re welcome to come back tomorrow to purchase another card after we have updated our systems.”

but again: My point still stands about not leaving the game, Money and Investments. feel free to pick apart another sub-text of what I have written though, for the sake of arguments and internet win points

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. Anyway.

Yes those refunds, I received one for owning multiple commander tags, was given some digital money after using real life money to pay….

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

You paid with gems, you got gems back. In theory that means the next time you buy something you don’t have to pay real money.

To be clear, you did NOT buy an outfit from the gem store with real money. You bought it with gems. If you spent $1000 that means you’re buying gems anyway. You get gems back which means you save money the next time you want to buy.

So you want to argue this? ok.

I went to Timezone, I paid them cash for Timezone Card which would allow me to play their games, shortly after purchasing the card they turned off all the machines which means I can’t play any games, I take the card back to the retailer but he simply states “you bought the card with your money to play games, but we can’t allow you to play games, but atleast you get to keep the card until it is expired at the end of the day, you’re welcome to come back tomorrow to purchase another card after we have updated our systems.”

but again: My point still stands about not leaving the game, Money and Investments. feel free to pick apart another sub-text of what I have written though, for the sake of arguments and internet win points

Terrible analogy is terrible.

You bought gems with cash. That’s what you bought> You spent gems on an outfit. If the outfit changes you are absolutely entitled to your gems back.

The OP did list town clothes and those were refunded. You listed duplicate skins and those were refunded, in gems.

It does change the tone of what the OP is trying to indicate, even if you think I’m just trying to “score internet points”.

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. Anyway.

Yes those refunds, I received one for owning multiple commander tags, was given some digital money after using real life money to pay….

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

You paid with gems, you got gems back. In theory that means the next time you buy something you don’t have to pay real money.

To be clear, you did NOT buy an outfit from the gem store with real money. You bought it with gems. If you spent $1000 that means you’re buying gems anyway. You get gems back which means you save money the next time you want to buy.

So you want to argue this? ok.

I went to Timezone, I paid them cash for Timezone Card which would allow me to play their games, shortly after purchasing the card they turned off all the machines which means I can’t play any games, I take the card back to the retailer but he simply states “you bought the card with your money to play games, but we can’t allow you to play games, but atleast you get to keep the card until it is expired at the end of the day, you’re welcome to come back tomorrow to purchase another card after we have updated our systems.”

but again: My point still stands about not leaving the game, Money and Investments. feel free to pick apart another sub-text of what I have written though, for the sake of arguments and internet win points

Terrible analogy is terrible.

You bought gems with cash. That’s what you bought> You spent gems on an outfit. If the outfit changes you are absolutely entitled to your gems back.

The OP did list town clothes and those were refunded. You listed duplicate skins and those were refunded, in gems.

It does change the tone of what the OP is trying to indicate, even if you think I’m just trying to “score internet points”.

Still going buddy?

Lol

It’s only terrible analogy if you can’t be bothered thinking about it or don’t have above average deductive skills.

But again for the 3rd? 4th time? Money and Investments. you’re derailing a thread completely and nit picking over nothing

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. Anyway.

Yes those refunds, I received one for owning multiple commander tags, was given some digital money after using real life money to pay….

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

You paid with gems, you got gems back. In theory that means the next time you buy something you don’t have to pay real money.

To be clear, you did NOT buy an outfit from the gem store with real money. You bought it with gems. If you spent $1000 that means you’re buying gems anyway. You get gems back which means you save money the next time you want to buy.

So you want to argue this? ok.

I went to Timezone, I paid them cash for Timezone Card which would allow me to play their games, shortly after purchasing the card they turned off all the machines which means I can’t play any games, I take the card back to the retailer but he simply states “you bought the card with your money to play games, but we can’t allow you to play games, but atleast you get to keep the card until it is expired at the end of the day, you’re welcome to come back tomorrow to purchase another card after we have updated our systems.”

but again: My point still stands about not leaving the game, Money and Investments. feel free to pick apart another sub-text of what I have written though, for the sake of arguments and internet win points

Terrible analogy is terrible.

You bought gems with cash. That’s what you bought> You spent gems on an outfit. If the outfit changes you are absolutely entitled to your gems back.

The OP did list town clothes and those were refunded. You listed duplicate skins and those were refunded, in gems.

It does change the tone of what the OP is trying to indicate, even if you think I’m just trying to “score internet points”.

Still going buddy?

Lol

Why is it people who don’t have valid arguments always try to resort to making fun of people? If you have an actual reply I’d love to hear it. If you’re just trying to annoy me you’re likely wasting your time, though I’d point out that your response is off topic and doesn’t further the conversation.

Sure I’m still going. Because I think the arguments presented are flawed.

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

Vayne.8563:

sephiroth.4217:

DelusionsOfGrandeur.9287:

It kinda seems like you hate the game, y’know… if you despise pretty much every change that it’s gone through in the last year or two, then why are you even still playing?

I agree with OP, but my answer to your question is simple: Money and Investments.

I had a lot of issues with changes, from having double skins merged into 1 for wardrobe purposes to owning the same expensive dyes across all 8 characters (at the time) to the constant neglect towards the only game mode I enjoy, WvW. (which were all paid for in cash/gems)

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that. Recent announcements about the expansion prices and further neglect towards WvW should make it easier for me to leave though and I look forward to that day where I can start investing my money on stable products where I know what I purchase with real money isn’t stripped from me without a refund.

It’s actually really insulting, you wouldn’t like to pay for a new PC and all it’s features only to have an update that renders most of what you paid for invalid.

Except they did offer a refund on town clothes.

When did I mention town clothes? Could you be so kind to make it in bold where I said that?

It was in the OP, and obviously a main complaint for the OP. It’s at least one instance in which real world money wasn’t stripped from people. I also remember them refunding double skins, btw, which you did mention.

Oh the OP said it…. Anyway.

Yes those refunds, I received one for owning multiple commander tags, was given some digital money after using real life money to pay….

My issue is mostly about skins, having put $100 into the game to make duel Infinite Light skins, and another $50 to craft a second Foe Fire essence….. I would continue but this is getting off topic for what I’m assuming is for argument sakes. (I don’t know how anyone can argue another persons personal experience, but people find a way somehow)

My point still stands in my first post: Money and Investments.

You paid with gems, you got gems back. In theory that means the next time you buy something you don’t have to pay real money.

To be clear, you did NOT buy an outfit from the gem store with real money. You bought it with gems. If you spent $1000 that means you’re buying gems anyway. You get gems back which means you save money the next time you want to buy.

So you want to argue this? ok.

I went to Timezone, I paid them cash for Timezone Card which would allow me to play their games, shortly after purchasing the card they turned off all the machines which means I can’t play any games, I take the card back to the retailer but he simply states “you bought the card with your money to play games, but we can’t allow you to play games, but atleast you get to keep the card until it is expired at the end of the day, you’re welcome to come back tomorrow to purchase another card after we have updated our systems.”

but again: My point still stands about not leaving the game, Money and Investments. feel free to pick apart another sub-text of what I have written though, for the sake of arguments and internet win points

Terrible analogy is terrible.

You bought gems with cash. That’s what you bought> You spent gems on an outfit. If the outfit changes you are absolutely entitled to your gems back.

The OP did list town clothes and those were refunded. You listed duplicate skins and those were refunded, in gems.

It does change the tone of what the OP is trying to indicate, even if you think I’m just trying to “score internet points”.

Still going buddy?

Lol

Why is it people who don’t have valid arguments always try to resort to making fun of people? If you have an actual reply I’d love to hear it. If you’re just trying to annoy me you’re likely wasting your time, though I’d point out that your response is off topic and doesn’t further the conversation.

Sure I’m still going. Because I think the arguments presented are flawed.

If you’re going to quote me, atleast quote all of it and not take it out of context.

Yawn…

5th time now: Money and Investments.

(just to be clear, I never made fun of you either, I’m sorry you feel that way, but you’ve put me on the defense just for saying my own opinion through my own experience which somehow you made an argument over it while completely ignoring the whole point of the post)

Sorry I had a point by point response but hit the length limit so here’s the short version.

MMOs are not static games. Never were. You can’t expect your awesome build from the first month remain as awesome three years later. Most of the changes you are complaining about were improvements.

The wardrobe let us keep those skins that would have been lost or needed to be purchased for multiple characters.

Town skins were a stupid idea to start with, outfits are much better.

The trait system rehash fixed a horrible mistake that we suffered with for a year. The fixed the personal story and the other vet issues with the NGE are noticeably better.

Yes what they did with fractals is unforgivable and we can only hope they don’t try another phase introduction until they are 100% sure it’s done.

This latest restructuring allows them to expand the game’s professional system in the expansion with specializations. It’s like starting the game all over again to figure out what works and what doesn’t. It’s only an issue if you cling to the past rather than embrace change.

OP doesn’t hate the game, otherwise he wouldn’t be here. Some of us are just tired of Anet’s “We got it now!” moments and want some stability and confidence in the systems put in place. I’m fine with game being constantly in flux, but when it concerns new content, not repeated reimaginings or existing one.

I wonder if the OP played any other games MMORPG or not in his life
If GW2 is the only game you’ve ever played you should take a break

I have enjoyed almost every update and Wardrobe change is the one of the best changes in the game. There have been so many changes to this game but most of them has been realy good changes. We are all different and we like different things, I am not going to say that OP isn’t entitled to complain about these changes but I think most of us players are happy with them and Anet will not have them reverted.

This is an MMO, they change all the time. I am an old SWG player, I know.

@sephiroth.4217: You know that your anology totally missed the point right?
I mean, GW2 and gems: You buy gems to buy somethings with gems then you buy something with gems but you are not happy with your purchase. You get a refund but with gems becouse it was not the gems that you where unhappy with, it was the “product” you bought. In your anology you buy Playtime but the company that handles it gives you no refund on the timecard.

So the difference in these two cases is:
Money → Gems → Product → Refund with Gems
Money → Timecard – No refund.

Also in your scenario you buy a timecard and they turn of all games witch gives you no other options to use your timecard on. While in the topic scenario you get options to use your gems on another purchase.

Also you state that Vayne is going of Topic but you always refer to your old post about money and investment that was just about getting refund and also you state that you do not get any refund. Well you do get refund and I am not sure if it works but have you tried asking for a refund on your bought Gems? I guess it won’t work as it will make the exchangerate wonkers but have you tried? And also those gems you have got refunded, do you still have them? Are they still unused? If not, what are you complaining about?

MMOs evolve over time. Most of the changes that have been implemented as part of GW2’s evolution have been neutral or actively negative for me. Still the base game was sufficiently solid that, despite three years of Anet actively working to ruin it (IMO), it remains a decent game.

As to the gems bit:

If one buys gems because at the time of their purchase they were being marketed as being able to serve a given purpose, for example purchasing mix and match outfits, then the removal of mix and match outfits means that the gems can no longer serve an advertised function. If the merchant strips a product of the advertised functionality which was the impetus for the customer’s purchase, then the customer is entitled to a refund.

The gems no longer serve the advertised purpose for which the customer bought them and so the customer is entitled to a refund.

This is pretty much how I feel, except I didn’t survive. I only log in for 2 minutes a day now to get my laurel in case the NPE etc. are ever reversed. Probably never gonna happen.

I feel the game systems have been overhauled so completely and so many times since launch that this is no longer the Guild Wars 2 I paid for, but something else entirely, with the only similarities being lore and races.

I got 5,000 hours or so out of this game before they destroyed it to the point I no longer wish to actually play it, so I’m not too buthurt over the loss of my time and money investment, but I still think if someone who’s been playing since launch wanted a refund they should be entitled to it, cause this really isn’t what we got when we put down our $60 for the initial box purchase at all.

Do the rest of you actually feel the game is improving with all these changes, or do you simply play because it’s still called Guild Wars 2…?

To the OP and anyone else that feels the same, I say just quit. The only way they’re ever gonna stop kittening around with the game is if they bleed players.

Ashen.2907:

As to the gems bit:

If one buys gems because at the time of their purchase they were being marketed as being able to serve a given purpose, for example purchasing mix and match outfits, then the removal of mix and match outfits means that the gems can no longer serve an advertised function. If the merchant strips a product of the advertised functionality which was the impetus for the customer’s purchase, then the customer is entitled to a refund.

The gems no longer serve the advertised purpose for which the customer bought them and so the customer is entitled to a refund.

Hmm… Very true. Even though out of topic I have to ask again, can you refund bought gems? Since asking for refund on a bought item can only be refunded with the same currency used to buy said item. I mean you can buy Gems with Gold so it would be a wierd way to ask for money refund if you bought gems with gold. So you get a refund on the item you bought, then you have to ask for a refund on the gems you bought as they as you say ‘serves no more the purpose that they where to’.

SKATE.1394:

This is pretty much how I feel, except I didn’t survive. I only log in for 2 minutes a day now to get my laurel in case the NPE etc. are ever reversed. Probably never gonna happen.

I feel the game systems have been overhauled so completely and so many times since launch that this is no longer the Guild Wars 2 I paid for, but something else entirely, with the only similarities being lore and races.

I got 5,000 hours or so out of this game before they destroyed it to the point I no longer wish to actually play it, so I’m not too buthurt over the loss of my time and money investment, but I still think if someone who’s been playing since launch wanted a refund they should be entitled to it, cause this really isn’t what we got when we put down our $60 for the initial box purchase at all.

Do the rest of you actually feel the game is improving with all these changes, or do you simply play because it’s still called Guild Wars 2…?

I feel most of the changes have been positive. Not all, but most. The wardrobe change and the mega server change were game changing for me, in a positive way. The removal of WvW culling was huge for me. The champion bag change I could have lived without but it wasn’t that big a deal. I liked both Dry Top and the Silverwastes. And while I preferred Season 1 of the Living World to Season 2, I understand the reason for the changes.

Vayne.8563:

I feel most of the changes have been positive. Not all, but most. The wardrobe change and the mega server change were game changing for me, in a positive way. The removal of WvW culling was huge for me. The champion bag change I could have lived without but it wasn’t that big a deal. I liked both Dry Top and the Silverwastes. And while I preferred Season 1 of the Living World to Season 2, I understand the reason for the changes.

That’s mostly content, but how do you deal with new skills and traits being dumped in your lap every 6 months? How are you okay with having to learn one method of leveling, unlocking skills and traits, and then it changes entirely with one feature patch, and that ends up being so bad another feature patch changes it entirely again? Doesn’t that tell you that even the developers are so unhappy with what they’ve done, that they can’t just make a change and sit on it?

Aren’t you tired of having to constantly adjust to a new system just as you’re starting to get used to the previous one?

I play a little Street Fighter from time to time, that’s a game that receives several updates in the namesake of balance. Champion Edition, Hyper Fighting, Super Turbo, Arcade Edition, Ultra, etc. etc.

The difference is they come with subtle changes. Damage might be tweaked 5-10% on a move, a few frames may be subtracted or added on startup or block. Maybe someone will receive a couple frames of startup invincibility.

What they don’t do is take away the shoryuken and hadoken from Ken and Ryu and give them Dhalsim stretchy arms…

That’s how I feel ArenaNet makes changes when they release a major patch. I can deal with small changes that don’t affect the actual style of my play, just the potency of it, if that makes sense.

If you’re really unhappy with something take what you’ve learned and apply it to Guild Wars 3, but at least give your players some sense of stability within a single release is all I’m asking.

When a player comes back from a 6 month hiatus in this game, they don’t just need a small period of adjustment. They’re lost.

I just wanna know when enough is gonna be enough for them. I think you’re more happy with the game at any given point in time than they are.

Traits have been changed twice in 3 years. How is that every 6 months? Am I missing a new kind of math?

Are you saying the Developers should not listen to the playerbase, that asked for changes? Geez; when they change things based on (some of the) player’s feedback, they are accused of being inconsistent. When they don’t change things that (some of) the playerbase seems unhappy with, then they are accused of being unconcerned.

I don’t have a problem with most of the changes, though I would much preferred they have continued with LS S1, and all it entailed. I can only hope S3 is much different than S2.

Regardless, I will still play and find much entertainment. =)

lordhelmos.7623:

I was there for the first rollout of Jade Dragon skins in the gemstore

Dragon Jade weapons werent initially rolled out in the gem store but came from jade weapon tickets which came from dragon coffers.

The ability to buy them with regular weapon tickets was introduced much later.

So they changed the traits. The first time was after a number of posts on the forum talking about how they missed capturing skills in Guild Wars 1 and how they wished ever so much this game had something similar. Well, it seems ANet read these posts and tried to do something as similar to that as this game allowed, having people do events to ’"capture" traits.

Didn’t work out. Players were unhappy with it and it seems the people who loved capturing skills were not too much in the majority. Large numbers called for a change.

Months later ANet gave us the current system. All you need are hero points and you can buy the traits. Truthfully, I don’t see much of a learning curve with this system but ymmv.

No doubt ANet should have ignored the first group, and been called unresponsive or ignored the second group and been called unresponsive.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Traits have been changed twice in 3 years. How is that every 6 months? Am I missing a new kind of math?

Are you saying the Developers should not listen to the playerbase, that asked for changes? Geez; when they change things based on (some of the) player’s feedback, they are accused of being inconsistent. When they don’t change things that (some of) the playerbase seems unhappy with, then they are accused of being unconcerned.

I don’t have a problem with most of the changes, though I would much preferred they have continued with LS S1, and all it entailed. I can only hope S3 is much different than S2.

Regardless, I will still play and find much entertainment. =)

Trait unlocking has been completely overhauled twice since the game came out. There have been several more feature/balance patches that completely retooled, combined, and rebalanced several traits and skills for all classes, which is what I’m referring to when I say sweeping changes are made roughly every 6 months.

The playerbase that asked for changes, you mean these supposed “thousands” of usability testers that they interviewed before they released the April New Player Experience? The ones that are so dense they couldn’t even figure out the downed state? Yeah, I’m still waiting for one of those people to come forward and say I was interviewed by ArenaNet. I would love to know these people are actually real, and hear what their gaming habits are like, and what they must have said for such an abomination of a feature patch to have been released.

This game was amazing before they started chasing “new player retention”. As if that isn’t the best thing that can happen for a F2P model game. You just got like $40 from these people who played for a week or two and now they aren’t even taxing your servers. How about the importance of “old player retention”.

How much agony resistance do you have?

So, now you are complaining about balance passes being too often? I thought players usually stated they didn’t come often enough.

It must be truly a herculean job trying to please the playerbase. Poor Devs. =(

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

So, now you are complaining about balance passes being too often? I thought players usually stated they didn’t come often enough.

It must be truly a herculean job trying to please the playerbase. Poor Devs. =(

How many PvP matches have you played? You probably wouldn’t have noticed the sheer number of changes that have been made if you aren’t an avid player of every single class. More of a forum warrior I suppose.

SKATE.1394:

Vayne.8563:

I feel most of the changes have been positive. Not all, but most. The wardrobe change and the mega server change were game changing for me, in a positive way. The removal of WvW culling was huge for me. The champion bag change I could have lived without but it wasn’t that big a deal. I liked both Dry Top and the Silverwastes. And while I preferred Season 1 of the Living World to Season 2, I understand the reason for the changes.

That’s mostly content, but how do you deal with new skills and traits being dumped in your lap every 6 months? How are you okay with having to learn one method of leveling, unlocking skills and traits, and then it changes entirely with one feature patch, and that ends up being so bad another feature patch changes it entirely again? Doesn’t that tell you that even the developers are so unhappy with what they’ve done, that they can’t just make a change and sit on it?

Aren’t you tired of having to constantly adjust to a new system just as you’re starting to get used to the previous one?

I play a little Street Fighter from time to time, that’s a game that receives several updates in the namesake of balance. Champion Edition, Hyper Fighting, Super Turbo, Arcade Edition, Ultra, etc. etc.

The difference is they come with subtle changes. Damage might be tweaked 5-10% on a move, a few frames may be subtracted or added on startup or block. Maybe someone will receive a couple frames of startup invincibility.

What they don’t do is take away the shoryuken and hadoken from Ken and Ryu and give them Dhalsim stretchy arms…

That’s how I feel ArenaNet makes changes when they release a major patch. I can deal with small changes that don’t affect the actual style of my play, just the potency of it, if that makes sense.

If you’re really unhappy with something take what you’ve learned and apply it to Guild Wars 3, but at least give your players some sense of stability within a single release is all I’m asking.

When a player comes back from a 6 month hiatus in this game, they don’t just need a small period of adjustment. They’re lost.

I just wanna know when enough is gonna be enough for them. I think you’re more happy with the game at any given point in time than they are.

I have no idea what you’re talking about. It’s like you’ve never played an MMORPG before. This sort of thing happens quite frequently in many games and most of the ones I’ve played.

But more to the point, I like the NPE. I think most people who don’t like it made up their mind early and ignored more of the fixes to it.

The biggest complaints I saw have been addressed. Most of the stuff you only have to put up with once, because after you unlock it on one character, it’s unlocked on all subsequent characters.

People talk about gating like it didn’t exist before. It always existed. From day one. The biggest change the NPE added was a pointer that tells you were to go which can be completely disabled.

As for the rest of it, the story issues were fixed. The new rewards are quite good, in both the story and leveling, and the speed of leveling isn’t really affected at all.

And while the specialization changes did change the game it made it easier to make builds not harder. How do you deal with all these changes? Adapt. That’s how good MMO players deal with changes.

The they nerfed my build I’m leaving crowd is present in every MMO I’ve ever played and most people just ignore them.

Ah, the old NPE complaint too.

I just finished leveling a char to 80 through events, hearts and map completion. Where was the pain? I didn’t see it.

There was rewards when I leveled. A panel popped up to tell me about upcoming rewards. For new accounts, there are some minor restrictions such as skill points, which lift before the char is out of the noob map. They removed some events/activities from the very low level areas and no doubt they could have placed them in a higher map level. They didn’t and ultimately it doesn’t effect leveling. If there were other points, they didn’t make an impression on me so I’m going to consider them unimportant.

Teehee pop-up windows, weeeee. What a minor thing that old 1,700 reply thread was. Certainly wasn’t one of the most longstanding topics of discussion in the game’s history.

SKATE.1394:

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

So, now you are complaining about balance passes being too often? I thought players usually stated they didn’t come often enough.

It must be truly a herculean job trying to please the playerbase. Poor Devs. =(

How many PvP matches have you played? You probably wouldn’t have noticed the sheer number of changes that have been made if you aren’t an avid player of every single class. More of a forum warrior I suppose.

I’m afraid your slur had little effect. But, I get your point. You are one of those unhappy with changes. I guess you have two choices: adapt, or…find something more static? I really don’t think the Devs are going to revert everything that has been changed since launch, and (IMO) that’s a good thing.

Good luck, though.

SKATE.1394:

Teehee pop-up windows, weeeee. What a minor thing that old 1,700 reply thread was. Certainly wasn’t one of the most longstanding topics of discussion in the game’s history.

Yeah. One of the things I saw being complained about was dancing to cows rather than feeding them. Yep. A few seconds in the first heart in the human area was a frequently repeated complaint. (By the way, there is a heart in a Charr area, from launch, where you bow to cows and sit by cows. Why didn’t people ever complain about that one? Why is the first one a complaint and the second one flavor when they are almost identical?).

Another big complaint, not being able to access skill points on the first char the first time in the account for a few levels. Again, not important to the leveling process as you quickly outlevel that restriction.

SKATE.1394:

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

So, now you are complaining about balance passes being too often? I thought players usually stated they didn’t come often enough.

It must be truly a herculean job trying to please the playerbase. Poor Devs. =(

How many PvP matches have you played? You probably wouldn’t have noticed the sheer number of changes that have been made if you aren’t an avid player of every single class. More of a forum warrior I suppose.

You don’t want balance changes. You’re one of the few.
If anything most pvp-players would like more balance patches. If they’re gonna ‘shave’, ‘shave’ often.

I was there too and I understand your concern. But, It’s because we are veteran that we can have these scars and still keep our heads high.

Still it feel like you missed a campaign where I suffer the megaserver scar. This one still hurt me from time to time.

That’s odd. I’ve been playing since beta, and I haven’t been ripped off. Maybe you guys just aren’t doing it right.

sephiroth.4217:

Having played the game for 6-7 thousand hours and investing over $1000 into gems, it’s hard to walk away from that.

It is things like this that infuriate me. You have no idea what kind of luxury you are in to afford such a disposable income and also afford the ignorance on the nature of investments as a whole. Sit down, grab a pen, and take notes, because I’m about to dump a whole bunch of real world advice on you.

#1: Any transaction places no further requirements on the traders beyond the immediate exchange. What this means is that, should you buy something, unless the product has been explicitly misrepresented or the terms of the trade were not fulfilled, the seller doesn’t owe you anything. For example, if you paid for 800 gems, but only got 600 in the mail, you’d have a case. But, because you bought 800 gems and received 800 gems, you have no legitimate reason to complain. You were not ripped off, you just have buyers remorse from your own bad investments.

#2: The reason why it is legally like this all over the world is because the markets are dynamic, chaotic, and unpredictable in the long term. You can’t place a long term guarantee on a product, unless that long-term guarantee is explicitly part of the product (I.E. a warranty or insurance). There is no gem insurance in this game, and if you feel that there should be gem insurance, then you shouldn’t have bought gems without it.

#3: Virtual economies are even more chaotic than real ones. Because of this, nearly every MMO or heck even multiplayer videogame has a lengthy contract that you sign to play. I’ll give you the brief of this contract: you don’t own jack squat. The game is licensed to you for use. The characters are the game maker’s property, and not yours. You have no entitlements to what happens to these bits and bytes. If Anet wanted to, they could replace each of your toons with a .png of a kitten stain, and there isn’t a thing you could do about it. You signed the agreement when you purchased the game.

#4: Virtual economies are a bad investment overall. Nothing you buy in the game is liquid. It is all immediately perishable, with no returns on investment. Everything will capsize; it is a matter of “when” not “if”.

#5: Any compensation that Anet provides to you for their changes is out of courtesy, and not because they are legally indebted to you. If you make a bad gamble, no one owes you anything for it.

This isn’t just a problem with videogames. All the time, people will complain that their investments are “worth less than they owe” because the market downturned. That is the nature of capital investments: while you can make a killing, there’s no promises. Just be happy that there are players out there who have benefit from the way the market has changed.

I don’t get why people here seem to think that if you’ve played other mmo’s then you cannot possibly think something is off with the trait/skill overhauls, I mean apparently “everyone does it”
I’ve been playing a variety of mmo’s for a good 9-10 years now. Coincidentally my first mmo was GW. The overhauls that have been, and the change of principles of this game is not seen that often. Beta weekends don’t count, because beta. Many games tweak, but they rarely if ever overhaul a system, as someone pointed out Anet have done this a few times now, They haven’t completely overhauled it until just recently. And if history speaks of anything, we’ll have a new system in place in a year or two. Many of the players on the forums ask for tweaks, not completely new skill definitions or traits.

As far as core principles go, maybe there’s only been one, but it was such a big deal, remember character creation, you can make some choices, they will affect personal story and in that story you had to make some moral choices. This system was meant to be expanded, but quickly dropped. Well GW2 being the game it was, and is, cookie cutter no chance for personal customization it wasn’t surprising. But just at launch, many people assumed that those choices would influence events that would start, npc interaction what you can and cannot buy etc. I’m mostly just stating a fact here, they scrapped something that had been widely hyped.

Now we’re getting HoT, because LS didn’t work out that well, I imagine that there were many issues, among others time pressure, which resulted in a lack of zones. However we were also told before LS that future content updates would include new skins, well hello gemstore.

Dungeons, scrapped. I still like dungeons when I’m running it with people who enjoy not exploiting obvious faults. Now ascended gear will be the new maximum armor, rendering dungeons irrelevant, you can get skin and achievements, so not entirely, but one of the purposes of dungeons was that you could get your exotics that way.

Alright I’ve rambled enough. Point is, GW had plenty of skill updates and tweaks, Anet is known for it, At least during the time I played the game, they didn’t do an overhaul the way they did with the last patch. GW despite the skill tweaks was extremely stable. I can’t come up with any mmo that has done as many system changes as GW2, and again betas don’t count.

lordhelmos.7623:

I am a veteran, I survived.

Yet considerably jaded, unfortunately :p

I remember a lot of that too. I missed a lot too because I took frequent breaks. The game is still pretty fun tho.

Didn’t you hear? Fractals are the new Dungeons.

If when the wardrobe hit you “lost” skins, its your own fault.

If you actually cared about keeping the skin, you wouldn’t of reskinned over it.

you lost the skin yourself , don’t blame the wardrobe sysytem, which by the way is possibly the best feature added to an MMO.

SKATE.1394:

Teehee pop-up windows, weeeee. What a minor thing that old 1,700 reply thread was. Certainly wasn’t one of the most longstanding topics of discussion in the game’s history.

Oh my god! A pop up window. I have to click twice each time I level once. Every half an hour to an hour it’s two clicks. Why, over the course of 80 levels that’s 160 clicks. In only 40 hours. Oh the horror. Oh the issues this causes. This is game breaking.

But farming a dungeon and clicking to open half a dozen champ bags in 15 minutes isn’t? lol

Your perspective is way out of whack. If pop up screens are the worst thing about the NPE then I’m pretty sure Anet has nothing to worry about.

Zev.3407:

…the wardrobe sysytem, which by the way is possibly the best feature added to an MMO.

Not even close.