Guild Wars 2

The most difficult JP in the game currently is by far the Not so Secret JP, and from my experience, its present state is causing a lot of pain and trouble for many players.

So my question to you guys, if Anet were to redesign it; What changes would you like to see in order for the puzzle to still be difficult, but more fair to the players?

In my personal opinion, I would really appriciate checkpoints from which you can easily restart your progress no matter if you log out (since a significant amount of time is needed to complete it), or die. A checkpoint system similar to what is already in place in SW could potentially be a solution.

Cheers guys, hope you all have a nice day!

My suggestion would be stop designing absurdly hard things and trying to pass it off as fun.

Honestly I don’t think Not so secret is so bad once you get the hang of it, but then JP’s are one of my favourite things to do in game. The new Lions Arch one, Troll’s Revenge, is awful for the same reasons though. It takes a long time to complete, any falls mean you have to start from the beginning, and it has a lot of bits that require you to land on small platforms or walk across pixel thin ropes.

It just shocks me. If you look at all of the original Jumping Puzzles you see so many examples of great design. I can’t think of any of the JP’s from the base game that required you to walk along stupidly thin things, and most of them have large platforms to jump on and aren’t even that fiddly. They’re still incredibly fun. Arenanet really needs to have a rethink on the whole JP thing. The new ones have a horrible tendency to just rely on very small platforms and ropes to make them “challenging”. It’s poor design.

I’ll second the above notion, prior to Troll’s Revenge I don’t believe I’ve ever had to hug pixels to get through a JP; more than once my character’s feet were literally hanging over empty air because of how tiny and close to the wall the ledge we’re “walking” on was. If we’re really going to be subjected to that, I would prefer proper climbing and shimmying mechanics.

That being said, I wouldn’t change Not So Secret. It’s definitely rage-inducing the first few months you try it, but you get used to it after a while. I loathed whoever designed it when I first tried it, but now I can reliably get to the top with a max-sized Charr.

They won’t re-design it and they shouldn’t either in my opinion. This game is based on adaptability, get a Necro for Spectral Walk or a Mesmer with Portal and that JP is easy. I did it with my Necro and yes, I fell a lot of times but most times I could come back with Spectral Walk. I really enjoyed that JP despite the difficulty, is the Evolved Jungle Wurm of Jumping puzzles. Don’t expect everything to be easy in the game, that’s just dumb. I found Trolls Revenge a lot more annoying because of the lack of space to move, but I just gotta do it with my Asura and I’m sure I won’t have an issue.

BTW What’s the new entrance to Troll’s Revenge in the new LA?

checkpoints, definitely checkpoints.

The whole thing has so many difficult and leathal jumps, combined with it being pretty timeconsuming even if you would get it right in one go, that failures and constantly having to start all over is dishearting.

I don’t mind hard jumps or failures, but the penalty is too harsh. Too many times I had to start over from the wp, like I had not done anything at all. And it’s hard enough that even with a lot of practice you can still slip and fall to your death on many points. Heck many times I don’t even get back to where is was and I quit it in frustration again, without feeling I gained anything for my efford. Next time will still be freaking hard.

Havingit be it cut into smaller bits with checkpoints would be way more fun, even with the rest the same as the challenge is fun in itsef. I would feel I could actually make progress. It’s the only core tyria jp I haven’t finished yet. those pipes launching me upward and having to land on the next. always get me. And a fall from there means starting all over again from waypoint.

As for trolls revenge. It is a complete new jp, all over LA roofs and such. I would suggest googling it as it’s very hard to explain.

malachi.7503:

My suggestion would be stop designing absurdly hard things and trying to pass it off as fun.

my suggestion is not designing only ridiculously easy things and pass it off as fun…

it all depends on personal opinion dude
and without a bit of challenge everything gets boring fast in my opinion

there are many many easy jps you can do … dont try to make the 2-4 harder ones get cakewalk too

i guess 1 or 2 checkpoints would be ok maybe ….
… but definitly not more or it gets too easy if you can just fall down anywhere you want since you got a safety checkpoint anyway….
(LA one could get ~2 checkpoints)

I think they should redesign the playerbase so it doesn’t feel like it has to be able to complete everything in the game. Especially a JP that nets you a green item and a blue. If you don’t find it fun or it’s too hard for you, don’t bother.

The only thing that annoys me is that the trashmobs from the lower level attack you when you jump on the pillars below the ship and thus put you in combat. So you need to kill them and half the time they reset halfway through.

Other than that, Not So Secret does nothing that is inherently ‘unfair’. It’s just a matter of landing your jumps correctly. So I wouldn’t redesign anything except those mobs.

I’d fix the jump pads so that speed boosts (signets, traits, swiftness) don’t affect the launch height, so you don’t need to change your build (or sometimes character) to complete the puzzle. I’d also remove some of the aetherblade spawns. Being stunned mid-jump by an enemy I can’t kill because of it going anti-exploit, but still attacking me, is an annoyance. Maybe also being revived at the start of the puzzle if you die, not having to waypoint and run through those ettins – just a small time saver.

Yes, I’ve completed it… several times thanks to precursor collections coming out; but it’s an unfair puzzle. Yes, there’s some actual difficulty there, but most of it is just being unfair and overly punishing.

One puzzle is always going to be the ‘hardest’ and since most of the JPs are easy (after one gets the hang of jumping), I don’t see why there can’t be a few hard ones.

zeldara.4127:

checkpoints, definitely checkpoints.

The whole thing has so many difficult and leathal jumps, combined with it being pretty timeconsuming even if you would get it right in one go, that failures and constantly having to start all over is dishearting.

I don’t mind hard jumps or failures, but the penalty is too harsh. Too many times I had to start over from the wp, like I had not done anything at all. And it’s hard enough that even with a lot of practice you can still slip and fall to your death on many points. Heck many times I don’t even get back to where is was and I quit it in frustration again, without feeling I gained anything for my efford. Next time will still be freaking hard.

Havingit be it cut into smaller bits with checkpoints would be way more fun, even with the rest the same as the challenge is fun in itsef. I would feel I could actually make progress. It’s the only core tyria jp I haven’t finished yet. those pipes launching me upward and having to land on the next. always get me. And a fall from there means starting all over again from waypoint.

As for trolls revenge. It is a complete new jp, all over LA roofs and such. I would suggest googling it as it’s very hard to explain.

It wouldn’t even need multiple checkpoints. Just one at the “entrance” would be fine. Where is the entrance you might ask? The same place where gliding starts to get turned off.

I agree that this one is hard, but after all, there should be some hard content in the game.

It is an optional content, if you find it hard, just do something else. Most of the JPs are super easy to do.

I like challenges, so I had a lot of fun doing Not So Secret.

Chameleon Dude.1564:

I’d fix the jump pads so that speed boosts (signets, traits, swiftness) don’t affect the launch height, so you don’t need to change your build (or sometimes character) to complete the puzzle. I’d also remove some of the aetherblade spawns. Being stunned mid-jump by an enemy I can’t kill because of it going anti-exploit, but still attacking me, is an annoyance. Maybe also being revived at the start of the puzzle if you die, not having to waypoint and run through those ettins – just a small time saver.

Yes, I’ve completed it… several times thanks to precursor collections coming out; but it’s an unfair puzzle. Yes, there’s some actual difficulty there, but most of it is just being unfair and overly punishing.

I am wondering if that was the issue as my necro can’t even get into the puzzle since the pad just won’t launch her high enough no matter where I stand on the pad. Checkpoints would be nice also since I am incapable of doing a perfect run on this one. I find this puzzle horribly frustrating from just trying to get into the puzzle to the tiny land points that I can never seem to find, just miss or not getting launched high enough to get anywhere at some points. Then to have to start over because I died is just too frustrating. There is little to no leeway for anything less than a perfect run.

I did Troll’s End and the Silverwastes puzzles – a lot of tries but I was able to do them. Early on the Breached Wall was my nemesis and I kept at it until I got it. This one I am not finding any progress with repeated attempts and I have tried since it came out. I got the jp thanks to a kind mesmer who was porting but it is a shame I might have to rely on the kindness of someone or to pay someone to get me up so I can keep trying for the diving achieve. Nothing irritates me more than having to see that Dive Master achieve with one left on my achievement panel since it definitely does not provide me any incentive to try it any more.

I was going to say jumping puzzles like Troll’s Revenge and NSS are the hard endgame content for jumpers, just as Raids are the hard endgame content for fighters, ….. but Attis beat me to it.

Having said that, I don’t mind if shortcuts are added to these or mesmers provide portals – people need encouragement to keep practicing at a jps and the skills will come. I used shortcuts too when I started out but over time, I began to run the full course with no shortcuts and if I feel, I started from the very beginning. There’s nothing like it for training yourself on a jp. I did all the jps on my ele and it’s only now that I’m levelling a Mesmer.. if you see me on a jp, give me a shout and I’d be happy to help with advice or a portal if I can.

The jumping puzzle is fine but please move the diving goggle point to the bottom of it. tks.