Guild Wars 2

i tried revelation online over the weekend and i came back to gw2 with a renewed fervour.

Unfortunately that does not work for wvw.

And there I was thinking all we needed was a huge wall.

I am currently trying that with FF14, and while I have to say a lot of things Gw2 does spoil me for other MMOs, at the same time I cannot help but think just how much more developer attention is visible in FF14. Probably as a result of having a subscription and hence a lot more money and a more dependable income to work with.

And that’s FF14. A game already criticized for not getting enough attention from their developers.

So yeah, good things and bad things. I feel GW2 should learn more from other MMOs. Much as the unique elements like zone downleveling or freely shared combat participation are awesome, class design and skill/talent balance and design works better in other MMOs, and there’s no shame in copying systems proven to work.

Carighan.6758:

I am currently trying that with FF14, and while I have to say a lot of things Gw2 does spoil me for other MMOs, at the same time I cannot help but think just how much more developer attention is visible in FF14. Probably as a result of having a subscription and hence a lot more money and a more dependable income to work with.

And that’s FF14. A game already criticized for not getting enough attention from their developers.

So yeah, good things and bad things. I feel GW2 should learn more from other MMOs. Much as the unique elements like zone downleveling or freely shared combat participation are awesome, class design and skill/talent balance and design works better in other MMOs, and there’s no shame in copying systems proven to work.

I guess to each their own. I tried FF14 and I really tried to like it… But I just couldn’t. Many things are lacking in that MMO, and the same thing goes for others.
There are no perfect games in this world, no perfect MMOs in either case (*cough). In fact most MMOs are just another Korean grind fest, just like Revelation mentioned by the TS. I wish to have absolutely nothing from that game in Guild Wars 2.

I’ve actually left GW2 a few times for some of the games mentioned already but I do still enjoy many of things GW2 offers. For one, it is very friendly towards the casual player and rewards skill (build creativity) over gear.

Still, and while I still like the game, I think it’s starting to show it’s age a bit when you look at the character creation, graphics, etc in comparison to games like BDO or even Bless.

Either way, GW2 remains one of the best MMOs I’ve ever played. I just wonder what GW3 may be like.

I generally find that after a few years with one game I burn out on it. To avoid that I wanted to add a second game that looked like it would work out as a secondary game. Unfortunately I found a couple of no-go things. I have worked out how to partially mitigate those two issues but have yet to test if the solutions are acceptable compromises.

Iridium.6385:

I wish to have absolutely nothing from that game in Guild Wars 2.

I was not talking about the way their combat or world design works (though frankly the world design has some good elements). Rather all the things GW2 is seriously ailing in, that is overall engine / interface / QoL / convenience:

• That options menu. You can even select which types of sounds still play while tabbed out.
• The chat interface is already a lot better than GW2’s. Although as far as copying that goes, just go for WoW’s where user mods made chat a pretty nice and convenient affair, including reply-bots while you’re in a fight and notifying when the fight ended, and other such niceties. But still, just carbon-copying what FF14 has would be a huge improvement already.
• There’s a “part of this fight”-list at the left. In busy combat (which GW2 has all the time with the amount of spell effects flying around) it helps a lot to realize just what is there to attack. Wish GW2 had something like it.
• An inventory button row which shows how full your bags currently are.
• Separate inventory (and separately limited!) for gear.
• A pop-up window for markers/signs? Instead of having to remember 20 key combinations at all times? Yes please!
• Have you seen their support for deaf/hard-of-hearing players? I was hellishly impressed, you can turn on a mode where it essentially shows a waveform pattern at the screen edges, so loud sounds make the screen “flash”, kinda. Really really good idea, and helps a lot if you have a ton of background noise, too.
• An in-UI countdown timer? Shared by party and raid?
• Linkshells, which are essentially private chatchannels.
• Fully configurable HUD layout.
• The game doesn’t run like dirt on modern hardware.

And that’s just of top of my head. There’s more, like classes with jobs, multiple classes on one character, fishing, gathering being an actual class/job, why not take the good things from other games but not the bad things?

Carighan.6758:

• That options menu. You can even select which types of sounds still play while tabbed out.
• The chat interface is already a lot better than GW2’s. Although as far as copying that goes, just go for WoW’s where user mods made chat a pretty nice and convenient affair, including reply-bots while you’re in a fight and notifying when the fight ended, and other such niceties. But still, just carbon-copying what FF14 has would be a huge improvement already.
• There’s a “part of this fight”-list at the left. In busy combat (which GW2 has all the time with the amount of spell effects flying around) it helps a lot to realize just what is there to attack. Wish GW2 had something like it.
• An inventory button row which shows how full your bags currently are.
• Separate inventory (and separately limited!) for gear.
• A pop-up window for markers/signs? Instead of having to remember 20 key combinations at all times? Yes please!
• Have you seen their support for deaf/hard-of-hearing players? I was hellishly impressed, you can turn on a mode where it essentially shows a waveform pattern at the screen edges, so loud sounds make the screen “flash”, kinda. Really really good idea, and helps a lot if you have a ton of background noise, too.
• An in-UI countdown timer? Shared by party and raid?
• Linkshells, which are essentially private chatchannels.
• Fully configurable HUD layout.
• The game doesn’t run like dirt on modern hardware.

• You need to play the type of sounds outside of the game because FF14 is full of waiting times (for duties) etc. FF14 is designed not to be played. When I was doing a relic quest I literally had to wait 45-90 minutes to wait for a fate to pop up. One of my mates was teaming up with me to spam me with chat soundeffects so I can hear when I have to tab back into the game – have you ever seen a game that wants you to tab out because you wait for everything?

• What is so special with that chat interface. It’s pretty standard.

• You mean the emnity list? The “problem” is that FF14 features a very dull and almost turn-based combat. Of course have have lists. Or you could observe the actual fight on-screen..

• The dots for each inventory slot is interesting, but what does that matter in the end?
  I see when my bag is full (red icon) and that’s all matters. When I want to check my inventory I press (I) and see it’s full or not.

• You need the armour tab because much stuff is simply tied to your account forever. I heard many people saying “Another free item to be put in the armoire” (the cabinet in your room/home instance). It’s more of a workaround.

• We have shacking screens instead which can be toggled on or off to realize when something with “boom” happened. And I really think the majority of the players is not deaf or disabled. (By the way, on the forums they even praise the sound design of GW2 over the dull and weak sounding spells… I rather have it audible than visibile ;-))

• The game ran like dirt when it came out because it was written to be server-sided at almost everything. FF14 has been rewritten from scratch in many departments and was held back by console support. While you are right with the not so great performance on modern hardware, a part of FF14’s initial fail was the clunky and slow (game) engine; something GW2 did not have to improve on in the first palce, so it’s nothing to compare. If GW2 would have had the need to be overhauled in that scale it would probably get better as well.

• The HUD layout, while configurable (when not bugged like mine back then, the chat would not move into the corner^^) is needed becauese it is incredible cluttered. Just check any random screenshot. You have at least 150 buttons on-screen, the already mentioned list of enemies currently having aggro with you/r party etc. It’s full with BS. I would like to have a bar instead of health orb in GW2, but meh. Still better than FF14.

• Linkshells are just a bunch of chats indeed and are not as useful as it may sound. I have been in several at once and it became confusing who from LS wanted something and it’s distracting as heck.

No, FF14 is by far not as great as you claim it to be. If so, I would not be here. Since nobody want to read big posts nowadays anymore and I really mentioned it so much after being disappointed in FF14’s cashgrab mentality (full-price base game, full-price expansion, subscription, cash shop with stuff you should earn ingame, merchandise and in the end that money goes mostly into other Square Enix’ projects and NOT into FF14) what is better in GW2.

Our character design in GW2 is better and more diverse. In FF14, all models are humans with stretched bodies and little details changed like Horns or Cat tails. Having characters with botanical details (like big leaves as hair or branches for the males) is awesome. Cats are actually a threat in GW2 while in FF14 you have some generic loli cat girl in Japanese school uniform fighting a Primal. Geez.. Also, no kids, no elderly people. Everyone is a perfect cardboard cutout with no depth (and voice acting).

For example that I can dodge. Walking behind a wall and not behing hit a by a projectile was awesome, while in FF14 it’s like “Oh, you were in that circle, well, you are dead then”…..(waits)….(animation finally plays)….dead. FF14 is about memorizing, like the SIMON game. If I want to learn choreographies I would play some dance game.

Other details I like is that when I fire a projectile trough bushes, said bushes will move. Or other details like the floppy Asura ears while in FF14 everything’s stiff.

The classes are super cheesy. “Hey, I am a super duper black mage that manipulates the Aether to roast my enemies and I dress in all black because I am such a danger”. (changes job stone) “Oh, now I am a White Mage and hug trees and belive in the power of the Nature” or whatever. Yeeeahh, no.

We have an outstanding voice acting while in FF14, the game with the big funds, let your character just wave the arms around as if we play some drunk party game and you are literally nothing, you do fetch quests and when you do pseudo-epic stuff it’s all for some random guys like the Scions. You are literally just some contract worker instead of a hero. A black mage “Warrior of Light”, haha. No, thanks.

Also, the themes in FF14 are so dull. “Oh no, some kid is sad behind the house in Gridania? Hand her some flower or /dance”. Total Mickey Mouse BS.
In GW2 the first mission was like “The Inquest stole our stuff. Kill the Inquest, destroy their lab, get our hostages back”. Awesome.

I could go on and on but that would exceed the 17 months I wasted in FF14…

Carighan.6758:

I am currently trying that with FF14, and while I have to say a lot of things Gw2 does spoil me for other MMOs, at the same time I cannot help but think just how much more developer attention is visible in FF14. Probably as a result of having a subscription and hence a lot more money and a more dependable income to work with.

And that’s FF14. A game already criticized for not getting enough attention from their developers.

So yeah, good things and bad things. I feel GW2 should learn more from other MMOs. Much as the unique elements like zone downleveling or freely shared combat participation are awesome, class design and skill/talent balance and design works better in other MMOs, and there’s no shame in copying systems proven to work.

Theres alot of polish and attention to features gw2 has which other mmos dont and even in raids features that other mmos have addons for and are not there by default.
But yes gw2 could learn a few things from other mmos but at the end of the day this is the business model anet choose and with what they have they will make what they can.

Zedek.8932:

• The HUD layout, while configurable (when not bugged like mine back then, the chat would not move into the corner^^) is needed becauese it is incredible cluttered. Just check any random screenshot. You have at least 150 buttons on-screen, the already mentioned list of enemies currently having aggro with you/r party etc. It’s full with BS. I would like to have a bar instead of health orb in GW2, but meh. Still better than FF14.

• Linkshells are just a bunch of chats indeed and are not as useful as it may sound. I have been in several at once and it became confusing who from LS wanted something and it’s distracting as heck.

No, FF14 is by far not as great as you claim it to be. If so, I would not be here. Since nobody want to read big posts nowadays anymore and I really mentioned it so much after being disappointed in FF14’s cashgrab mentality (full-price base game, full-price expansion, subscription, cash shop with stuff you should earn ingame, merchandise and in the end that money goes mostly into other Square Enix’ projects and NOT into FF14) what is better in GW2.

Our character design in GW2 is better and more diverse. In FF14, all models are humans with stretched bodies and little details changed like Horns or Cat tails. Having characters with botanical details (like big leaves as hair or branches for the males) is awesome. Cats are actually a threat in GW2 while in FF14 you have some generic loli cat girl in Japanese school uniform fighting a Primal. Geez.. Also, no kids, no elderly people. Everyone is a perfect cardboard cutout with no depth (and voice acting).

For example that I can dodge. Walking behind a wall and not behing hit a by a projectile was awesome, while in FF14 it’s like “Oh, you were in that circle, well, you are dead then”…..(waits)….(animation finally plays)….dead. FF14 is about memorizing, like the SIMON game. If I want to learn choreographies I would play some dance game.

Other details I like is that when I fire a projectile trough bushes, said bushes will move. Or other details like the floppy Asura ears while in FF14 everything’s stiff.

The classes are super cheesy. “Hey, I am a super duper black mage that manipulates the Aether to roast my enemies and I dress in all black because I am such a danger”. (changes job stone) “Oh, now I am a White Mage and hug trees and belive in the power of the Nature” or whatever. Yeeeahh, no.

We have an outstanding voice acting while in FF14, the game with the big funds, let your character just wave the arms around as if we play some drunk party game and you are literally nothing, you do fetch quests and when you do pseudo-epic stuff it’s all for some random guys like the Scions. You are literally just some contract worker instead of a hero. A black mage “Warrior of Light”, haha. No, thanks.

Also, the themes in FF14 are so dull. “Oh no, some kid is sad behind the house in Gridania? Hand her some flower or /dance”. Total Mickey Mouse BS.
In GW2 the first mission was like “The Inquest stole our stuff. Kill the Inquest, destroy their lab, get our hostages back”. Awesome.

I could go on and on but that would exceed the 17 months I wasted in FF14…

ff14 has a better class balance tho and more complex raids and maybe even dungeons but then again kitten the later they have better balance :/

I would have to agree with some of your gripes about the UI in FF14, but the content is much meatier albeit with a completely trashy grind to max level.

My experience with FF14 was that it was a lot less glitchy compared to GW2. Nice forum too.

Carighan.6758:

So yeah, good things and bad things. I feel GW2 should learn more from other MMOs. Much as the unique elements like zone downleveling or freely shared combat participation are awesome, class design and skill/talent balance and design works better in other MMOs, and there’s no shame in copying systems proven to work.

Yeah I have been bouncing between WoW and GW2 for years. WoW has better storytelling, class balance and more interesting class mechanics (so much can be done when you charge a subscription fee). But… GW2 has no monthly subscription or gear treadmill (which is HUGE for me).

I’ve secretly been wishing that GW2 make necromancer like WoW’s priest. Swap life force for the insanity mechanic. Make regular shroud be like Shadowform. Change the blood line traits to make it work like the new Discipline priest. That amount of copying systems that work is ok…. right…..?? I wish :P