Guild Wars 2

I soloed a level 80 character and completed 80% of the maps but, now I’m finding more and more non-solo friendly content.

- Forced grouping for last of the Personal story missions

- Fractals & monthly achievements can’t be done solo.

- Non solo maps (Lost Shores crap)

- Faster and faster re-spawns, that make solo impossible, my character can no longer even recharge skills between re-spawns in places due to character nerfs.

As long as I can complete all of the maps and ability to get all crafting material solo, I’d be a happy camper but sadly, it seems that this is no longer the case.

How about

- Solo monthly achievements?
- Re-spawn times and numbers based on the number of players in an area (Solo friendly).
- Make all maps Solo friendly.

How is Lost shores (and cursed shores) and Personal Story not solo-able? (Excepting killing Zhaitan)

If you can’t, it might be time to examine your playstyle or build.

I agree with Ahlen, you should be able to do all be the final story solo.

Started leveling an alt… was able to get to level 21 in 16 hours of play. Completed 2 cities and Queensdale, and no crafting (personal story was only done up to level 16 mission). Used to take me near 25 hours and complete every starter zone to reach that level…

Compared to launch they beefed up XP gain in lower level zones making them much more solo-friendly… since they can’t be bothered to make lower level zones more interesting for players who are playing on their level 80s.

Instead they want to force people into dungeons and PvP… why make content solo friendly for an MMO when you can make all of it aside from a few aspects a moot point?

Anyone who isn’t 80 and doing dungeon runs they’ve made it easier for now – once you’re there you either conform, or loose interest in the game. Seems to be Anet’s policy at least.

I think you can do everything but the final mission solo, though some are more challenging than others. I’ve leveled chars into the 50s easily completely solo (claw island at level 50 though solo can be a pita).

i dont have much problems soloing most of the stuff, however the respawn times for a lot of areas is definitely a problem. having the timers based off of the number of players would make things a lot easier and less frustrating.

also, i do agree that having to do the fractals dungeon for the monthly is pretty absurd. i havent even set foot in there since it came out, so i guess no monthly for me.

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO? Pick something like skyrim instead, there you have all the fun of a big pretty explorable world without the need to group

Veldan.4637:

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO? Pick something like skyrim instead, there you have all the fun of a big pretty explorable world without the need to group

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Sola.7250:

Veldan.4637:

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO? Pick something like skyrim instead, there you have all the fun of a big pretty explorable world without the need to group

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Because it’s an MMO.
To be honest this one is a bit of everything.
- you can solo almost every map and most of your story.
- dungeons and fractals is extra content. You don’t have to do it. Me as a solo player I chose to group up with different people for dungeons numerous times. Because dungeons are fun for me.
- you can always WvW and PvP instead of dungeons.

No opinion one way or the other, but in regards to the personal story, either it can be soloed or it can’t. If you can’t complete it solo, then it’s not solo-friendly. And you can’t.

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Because it’s an MMO is not an excuse!

Sola.7250:

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Because it’s an MMO is not an excuse!

it kind of is. Ever watched anime Sword Art online? The main dude talks about the minuses of soloing everything a lot.
Secondly, do you know a single MMO which you CAN solo 100%?

Vortex.5146:

No opinion one way or the other, but in regards to the personal story, either it can be soloed or it can’t. If you can’t complete it solo, then it’s not solo-friendly. And you can’t.

So because 1% of the story quest can’t be completed solo (Killing Zhaitan) and you have to actually spend 20-30 minutes in a group of 5 people, it’s the end of the world? And it’s not solo-friendly? I don’t buy that.

If you want a 100% solo game, don’t play an MMO.

The way you start this game is misleading, as you are prone to believe that it’s totally OK to play solo ALL the time. However, it isn’t just harder in the long run, but also less fun to play that way throughout the game (Orr comes to mind.) Even some storyline missions’ difficulty encourage you to find allies to help you out, depending on your profession, etc. While I am not saying that playing solo is bad (don’t most of us play that way most of the time on the PvE map?), I believe encouraging party/group play is part of the classic GW lore and playstyle (GW1 used to be even more team-centered until the advent of full Hero parties-back then, many considered Heroes a sad departure from the game’s original “team up” vibe, though they had their good sides when you couldn’t find people to play with.)

In short, whether you like to play solo or not, I feel this game encourages people to group up and play together as one, and we are rewarded for doing so even on the less difficult PvE maps.

Veldan.4637:

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO?

The social experience of an MMO is not limited to the idea of teaming.

- Sometimes I want to solo, sometimes I want to team. A good MMO provides both options, as well as easy transition between the two. That way, a player can remain vested, regardless of mood.

- I generally enjoy chatting with folks, no matter how I’m playing.

- As an immersionist, having other players running around can add a great deal to the play experience, even if I’m not interacting with them directly. It contributes to the feeling of a living world.

Now you can understand threads like this one. You’re welcome.

How dose something like “- Forced grouping for last of the Personal story missions” only now makes it become a less solo friendly game when it was there to start with?

Veldan.4637:

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO? Pick something like skyrim instead, there you have all the fun of a big pretty explorable world without the need to group

Then perhaps you are unfamiliar with MMO’s. In every MMO I’ve played you were able to solo all content minus instances very easily. Not only solo in terms of leveling, but more importantly solo in terms of farming. The farming aspect is very important in an MMO as that is how you maintain yourself in the game. GW2, in terms of stated objectives supports the solo player as well as those who like to group with others. The problem is that as you cross the straits of devastation you find the content less and less solo-friendly. Karma farming depends on whole areas becoming non-contested; good luck doing this without a group of players. See, the problem is there aren’t always players around and the content was developed presupposing there would be other players around. This is an area GW2 needs work and it doesn’t have anything to do with the fact that it is an MMO. It needs work around being more solo-friendly because it is an MMO.

Sola.7250:

I soloed a level 80 character and completed 80% of the maps but, now I’m finding more and more non-solo friendly content.

- Forced grouping for last of the Personal story missions

- Fractals & monthly achievements can’t be done solo.

- Non solo maps (Lost Shores crap)

- Faster and faster re-spawns, that make solo impossible, my character can no longer even recharge skills between re-spawns in places due to character nerfs.

As long as I can complete all of the maps and ability to get all crafting material solo, I’d be a happy camper but sadly, it seems that this is no longer the case.

How about

- Solo monthly achievements?
- Re-spawn times and numbers based on the number of players in an area (Solo friendly).
- Make all maps Solo friendly.

First of all, you can solo most of the game. Yes, the Orr regions are a pain in the butt. You can’t even stand around in an outpost and read a map without getting attacked. That’s a nuisance. It would be nice to have a couple of safe spots.

You can solo almost all the zones. The only one that gave me serious trouble was the Cursed Shore, but I’m sure there are people who have soloed that zone. However, you only need to get one person to help you get through, so it’s not much of a problem.

You do die a lot in the Orr zones, though, if you go out solo, especially if you’re still leveling and don’t have exotic gear. This is a bit upsetting, particularly if you come from other MMOs where outposts and roads are safezones, and you can solo pretty much anything outside a dungeon.

I think the issue is really one of what you’re used to. Guild Wars 2 isn’t brutally hard, but it’s not exactly easy either and, yes, some things like the fast respawns and lack of safe spots are a bit aggravating. (BTW, Frostgorge, another 70-80 zone, is totally different.)

The final stage of the story, Kill Zhaitan, requires you to group up. I agree with you here: I think they should’ve made the storyline completely soloable. There are a few problems with killing Zhaitan, problems that seem to be getting worse as the game ages:

1) You need a large group of people to clear the chain events to get into Arah.
2) It’s bugged a lot.
3) People don’t want to run Arah story after they’ve done it, so it’s getting harder to find a group. A good guild will help with this, but not always. Just depends on the people.
4) More people are running fractals, so there are fewer people to run the events to clear the way or to help you run Arah story.
5) The daily karma jugs have made karma easy to get, so people don’t run events as much, sucking away more players from Arah events and events everywhere.

Monthly achievements have had soloable elements in the past. For instance, the first month had a requirement to salvage X number of items.

I think it’s a good idea for ArenaNet to encourage people to do WvW or run dungeons and fractals, so I’m okay with this as a monthly requirement. However, the monthly last month was to run 7 fractals – been there, done that. Having it as the requirement, again, this month is redundant.

Having said that, I think a monthly with strictly soloable achievements would be a nice way to mix things up. Maybe you have kill X number of sharks, salvage 25 rares or stuff like that.

Sola.7250:

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Because it’s an MMO is not an excuse!

Because you can’t please 100% of your playerbase 100% of the time.

Requiring that absolutely everything be solo-able would limit what content ANet can provide to their other players who don’t mind grouping up for some things. It doesn’t make sense to completely ignore those players and limit the content they can make just so solo-only people don’t have a single thing in the game that doesn’t please them.

I play solo most of the time myself, for the record.

I just think if 80% of a game is adaptable to my preferred play style, that’s actually pretty good odds – I can branch out if I want to, and if I don’t, I can still play the majority of the game the way I normally do.

The game has to accommodate many people’s needs and can’t cater fully to any single preference to the exclusion of others.

Hydrophidian.4319:

A good MMO provides both options, as well as easy transition between the two.

Just curious, which MMOs are good which provide both options as described?

Raine.1394:

Veldan.4637:

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO? Pick something like skyrim instead, there you have all the fun of a big pretty explorable world without the need to group

Then perhaps you are unfamiliar with MMO’s. In every MMO I’ve played you were able to solo all content minus instances very easily. Not only solo in terms of leveling, but more importantly solo in terms of farming. The farming aspect is very important in an MMO as that is how you maintain yourself in the game. GW2, in terms of stated objectives supports the solo player as well as those who like to group with others. The problem is that as you cross the straits of devastation you find the content less and less solo-friendly. Karma farming depends on whole areas becoming non-contested; good luck doing this without a group of players. See, the problem is there aren’t always players around and the content was developed presupposing there would be other players around. This is an area GW2 needs work and it doesn’t have anything to do with the fact that it is an MMO. It needs work around being more solo-friendly because it is an MMO.

Solo is supported in GW2 more than almost any MMO I have ever seen or played. To the point of insanity. Seriously, the VAST majority of the game can be solo’d.

Whilst the majority of the game can be soloed it is definitely getting less solo friendly especially with loot tables for FOTM and I think other dungeons being clearly different and yielding significantly more high yield loot than in the open world or in WvW.

This makes it look like anet is favouring dungeon runners. Why?

Then perhaps you are unfamiliar with MMO’s. In every MMO I’ve played you were able to solo all content minus instances very easily.

Sorry to pick this very sentence, but there are several mmo’s that has had world content that was not doable solo. Heck in some mmo’s you are forced to group to get anywhere apart from the low level areas. Solo friendly mmo’s is something that started becoming more common when wow released and there are still mmo’s that dont cater much to the solo crowd.

morrolan.9608:

Whilst the majority of the game can be soloed it is definitely getting less solo friendly especially with loot tables for FOTM and I think other dungeons being clearly different and yielding significantly more high yield loot than in the open world or in WvW.

This makes it look like anet is favouring dungeon runners. Why?

It’s not getting less solo friendly, it’s getting more group friendly.

This returns to the original point of “If you’re going to play an MMO, why are you trying to play it like a single player game”

More people = more reward for coordination (Dungeon runs)
Less people = more reward for dedication (Farming)

Aside from ascended gear, you can get the exact same statistical gear playing solo as you can from running dungeons or fractals.

They have also stated they will be adding more ways to get ascended gear, further reinforcing their support of solo players.

Veldan.4637:

I never understand these sort of threads…

if you don’t enjoy playing with others, why play an MMO? Pick something like skyrim instead, there you have all the fun of a big pretty explorable world without the need to group

It’s not that people don’t want to group with other people, it’s that there’s a time for grouping, and times that you have to be able to solo.

To put it into perspective: Pretend there’s a quest that takes 2 people to do. You and me are the only 2 people online on the entire server. You’re level 80, and you need to be 80 to do that quest, and I’m 40…. How do you do that quest that takes 2 people?

There is no such thing as an infinite stream of players going through every part of the game 24/7… You’re going to run out. That’s why literally every relatively new MMORPG puts so much focus onto endgame and not leveling. There’s always going to be more level 80s than level 40s.

GW2 is not becoming less solo-friendly. Everything that could be done solo at launch can still be done solo. There are aspects of GW2 that always required a group. Those aspects still exist, and another one was added in November.

Also, as the game gets older (ha, 3.25 months) the population tends to congregate in certain areas. This may create the illusion that there are less things that can be done solo. What’s really happening, though, is that they were never doable solo. Players who participated in group events (temple clears, for example) may have “felt” they were soloing because there was no “LFG” going on, but they were not in fact, soloing.

Achievements went from requiring one group/solo activity, Wv3, to Wv3 plus dungeons in November, to Wv3 plus FotM plus ? ? in December. This particular feature is being slanted more towards group play in comparison to what it was at launch.

Mirta.5029:

Sola.7250:

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Because it’s an MMO is not an excuse!

it kind of is. Ever watched anime Sword Art online? The main dude talks about the minuses of soloing everything a lot.
Secondly, do you know a single MMO which you CAN solo 100%?

Play a guardian and faceroll everything or play Atlantica, i solod everything in atlantica all the way up to lvl130 and ironically the new shiny skins tactic to buy from gem store (keys) was originally done in atlantica, it’s called gambling.

just like the Personal Story aspect has already died since a lot can’t get to finish it as those funneled to FotM are being unsociable towards the open world

chasingfuries.9635:

if everything was soloable for you antisocial newbs that apparently wandered into gw2 thinking it was a 1player game, then why would anyone group up for anything? if theres no incentive to team for things, then there’ll be no reason to do it and that aspect of the game will die, which will cause the community as a whole to suffer because the game wont be as social…

Well, we wandered into GW2 thinking it was a game, not Facebook. I admit I was very confused about that.

Aside from my mistake, though, group content is just a nice way of saying that the game is easy for people who can’t play to save their lives, and impossible for those who would like to.

Personally, I look at it the opposite way. If what you want to do is hang out with people, why are you playing a video game by yourself in front of a computer?

As a most solo player, I also don’t like the last personal story force you to group. But I think the other group-need contents are fine.
For group event and WvW you can just join people but no need to directly team with them.

For dungeons i just ignore them for now.

For Lost Shores I think this map is incomplete, so just give Anet more time to finish it.

Re-spawn time is a problem. After you develop or find a combat tactic suit yourself and some good gear, you will be fine.

But still, I really miss GW1, i can get a full team of my own to enjoy the game.

Leablo.2651:

chasingfuries.9635:

if everything was soloable for you antisocial newbs that apparently wandered into gw2 thinking it was a 1player game, then why would anyone group up for anything? if theres no incentive to team for things, then there’ll be no reason to do it and that aspect of the game will die, which will cause the community as a whole to suffer because the game wont be as social…

Well, we wandered into GW2 thinking it was a game, not Facebook. I admit I was very confused about that.

Aside from my mistake, though, group content is just a nice way of saying that the game is easy for people who can’t play to save their lives, and impossible for those who would like to.

Personally, I look at it the opposite way. If what you want to do is hang out with people, why are you playing a video game by yourself in front of a computer?

wow. this is some of the stupidest crap ive ever read lol

and to answer your question, ever consider the possibility that some people cant go out to hang with people? if mmos arent all about being social then please explain what they actually are

and lastly, yeah sure group content is all for bad gamers – totally that makes sense, because teamwork takes no skill, right. got it.

“Because it is a MMO” is not really an answer.
“MMO” means Massively Multiplayer Online and in no place it includes that you have to team with the other players to play. You are playing with them in many other ways than going to a dungeon or grouping in a zone.

The “forced grouping” comes from early development of MMOs (and before that of MUDs) but it is changing since each time more people wants/needs solo play inside a MMO.

Most games cater to the “solo play experience” (as GW2) during gameplay and then forget about it at end game. Doing this causes many people stop playing a game they like (or even Love) and change to a different game.

Many intelligent developers realize that they are losing customers and develop additional interesting things to do at level cap for “solo play” or non committed grouping (so that you can enter or leave as you need). GW2 is one of these games and people rightly demand ANet to keep it the same way for future development.

Why do people play solo or do not want to commit to long groups?

There are many reasons and some are temporary while others are permanent, for example:

. Lack of time investment. (Many people needs to leave without notice, try to do this while a dungeon run).

. Desire to experience content at their own speed. (Tried to follow story in a dungeon run while other people are rushing it).

. Desire to avoid playing with rude people. (Have anytime played with a know-it-all player that tries to force other players to play as he sees fit).

Refusing to cater for the “solo play experience” only reduces the number of people playing while developers want to increase the numbers.

My perfect MMO would have a solo player copy of each dungeon (with lower rewards to incentive group play) and dedicated repeteable content for solo players at end game with different selectable difficulties.
Also there would be comparable rewards for solo play and gorup play, with solo ones being slightly lower (between 5% and 10% maximum) or different (for example oriented more to survivavility than damage) and taking longer to attain.

chasingfuries.9635:

if everything was soloable for you antisocial newbs that apparently wandered into gw2 thinking it was a 1player game, then why would anyone group up for anything? if theres no incentive to team for things, then there’ll be no reason to do it and that aspect of the game will die, which will cause the community as a whole to suffer because the game wont be as social…

GW 1 was great for us “antisocial newbs”. Maybe since this was the sequel we were expecting that same kind of freedom. I could run dungeons with my heroes and pass up people looking for their next bromance. The MMO genre is changing thank God. Casuals will win because we will put more money into the game.

Once the Dungeon finder is in (which it will be), I will probably never talk to anyone in PVE again, unless it is just friendly passer by comments or going over a quick strat once we are in the dungeon.

i dont understand your point o.o you’re against having to team up but your preferred playstyle is teaming up with your good friends all the time? thats the type of social im talking about lol even if you’re not talking to them the whole time

or are heroes like mercenaries? lol idk i never played gw1, would make more sense tho

and idk bout casuals “winning cause they spend more money” lol cause im pretty sure they dont spend more, unless im wrong but people spend thousands on mmos and i wouldnt call them casual, also it appears like gw2 is already going in the opposite direction with their introduction to ascended gear so idk

GW2 offers a lot of solo-able content. Even Cursed Shore can be done “solo”. The quotes are there because you will probably run into a few players that do the same skill quest or event, making you play together. I have seen someone doing Cursed Shore solo. That person is now my “guide” when it comes to Orr areas.

What changes since the last update was that there was one group activity (fractals) more than before. That doesn’t make any of the soloable content less soloable.

As for Arah story. You go slay an Elder Dragon. Recall ypu last encounters with dragons… There was one on Claw Island where you and an ENTIRE ARMY of NPCs fougth. Not sure if you did the Champs that spawn all 3 hours. But there is always an ENTIRE ARMY of players there. The Dragons are like the ultimate enemy. Beeing able to slay Zhaitan solo would just not fit. Especially not in a world that’s filled to the brimm with heroes.

If you can do the story solo and explore the map solo and do dungeons solo and do everything else solo, why bother even adding a party feature? heck, why bother making it an MMO?

Heroes in GW 1 were fully customizable bots.

I like group content and I am cool with people in groups I just want it all automated and no obligation. I will try to finish a dungeon, even if it is a horrible pug, but the beauty of dungeon finders is I can leave any time I want if something RL comes up. If someone knocks on my door, I don’t have to invite them in then tell them to wait because I HAVE to play this video game for another 30 minutes.

I used to have my work schedule adjusted for Raiding and Arena years ago….. Never again……

chasingfuries.9635:

Leablo.2651:

chasingfuries.9635:

if everything was soloable for you antisocial newbs that apparently wandered into gw2 thinking it was a 1player game, then why would anyone group up for anything? if theres no incentive to team for things, then there’ll be no reason to do it and that aspect of the game will die, which will cause the community as a whole to suffer because the game wont be as social…

Well, we wandered into GW2 thinking it was a game, not Facebook. I admit I was very confused about that.

Aside from my mistake, though, group content is just a nice way of saying that the game is easy for people who can’t play to save their lives, and impossible for those who would like to.

Personally, I look at it the opposite way. If what you want to do is hang out with people, why are you playing a video game by yourself in front of a computer?

wow. this is some of the stupidest crap ive ever read lol

and to answer your question, ever consider the possibility that some people cant go out to hang with people? if mmos arent all about being social then please explain what they actually are

and lastly, yeah sure group content is all for bad gamers – totally that makes sense, because teamwork takes no skill, right. got it.

where is this teamwork you speak of? all i ever seen was me babysitting casuals all day long shrug

Zombie.2310:

GW2 offers a lot of solo-able content. Even Cursed Shore can be done “solo”. The quotes are there because you will probably run into a few players that do the same skill quest or event, making you play together. I have seen someone doing Cursed Shore solo. That person is now my “guide” when it comes to Orr areas.

What changes since the last update was that there was one group activity (fractals) more than before. That doesn’t make any of the soloable content less soloable.

As for Arah story. You go slay an Elder Dragon. Recall ypu last encounters with dragons… There was one on Claw Island where you and an ENTIRE ARMY of NPCs fougth. Not sure if you did the Champs that spawn all 3 hours. But there is always an ENTIRE ARMY of players there. The Dragons are like the ultimate enemy. Beeing able to slay Zhaitan solo would just not fit. Especially not in a world that’s filled to the brimm with heroes.

If you can do the story solo and explore the map solo and do dungeons solo and do everything else solo, why bother even adding a party feature? heck, why bother making it an MMO?

For personal story, i must say i fight through the whole line with the NPCs and the pact army, i really enjoy it. I’m not against the group content, group with NPCs is still group for me. I just don’t want do my Personal Story Line with other Person. Especially the others may argued the whole way to the elder dragon, they may accuse each other doing wrong all the time, they may try a couple of times and failed and someone got angry then leave the others. I really don’t want these in my personal story.

For the other part I think Mordecai has explained everything pretty well.

Sola.7250:

Why would anyone design a game where 80% can be completed solo but, not the last 20%?

Could turn this around too… why not? Seems fine to me.

Hydrophidian.4319:

The social experience of an MMO is not limited to the idea of teaming.

- Sometimes I want to solo, sometimes I want to team. A good MMO provides both options, as well as easy transition between the two. That way, a player can remain vested, regardless of mood.

Does GW2 not do this? You have both options and the easy transition, as far as I can see.

- I generally enjoy chatting with folks, no matter how I’m playing.

But would the chat be enough reason to make a game online instead of offline? I thought not….

As an immersionist, having other players running around can add a great deal to the play experience, even if I’m not interacting with them directly. It contributes to the feeling of a living world.

funny, I found other players are actually one of the first things to destroy immersion, since they never behave as they would in reality (RP server may be an exception), where NPCs are usually a lot more “real” in that regard

Raine.1394:

Then perhaps you are unfamiliar with MMO’s. In every MMO I’ve played you were able to solo all content minus instances very easily. Not only solo in terms of leveling, but more importantly solo in terms of farming. The farming aspect is very important in an MMO as that is how you maintain yourself in the game. GW2, in terms of stated objectives supports the solo player as well as those who like to group with others. The problem is that as you cross the straits of devastation you find the content less and less solo-friendly. Karma farming depends on whole areas becoming non-contested; good luck doing this without a group of players. See, the problem is there aren’t always players around and the content was developed presupposing there would be other players around. This is an area GW2 needs work and it doesn’t have anything to do with the fact that it is an MMO. It needs work around being more solo-friendly because it is an MMO.

I still don’t see a problem. For example: why is there a need for the straits to be solo friendly? A few days ago, the whole straits were contested on my server. So what I did is invite a friend, then go to cursed shore and invite 3 random people. We told them to follow us to the straits, and they did. We then had fun doing the advance and camp capture event chains. This was definitely more fun together than solo. So why does it need to be soloable? Isn’t it fine if there are also a few areas where a group is required? Solo farming can still be done in zones like Frostgorge or Malchor’s.

TL;DR
1. grouping and/or playing with others is the most important part of MMOs and no MMO will be made without it
2. GW2 has solo friendly and non-solo friendly areas. You always have a choice. There is no need for 100% of the content to be solo friendly.

For zones, they’re not becoming less solo friendly, they’re just requiring a higher amount of player skill. I’ll assume GW2 is supposed to be a skill based game and as such, Orr and now Southsun Cove are just the beginning on the difficulty scale. The next zone should be even harder.

In truly difficult zones, you know that the random guy over there is probably not a bad player. Other players choose to zerg the content to remove the skill requirement. Unfortunately, GW2 rewards zerging much more than someone who puts in the effort and they can never change this, since the reason for it was one of their features.

For the personal story, I can only guess that they chose to make it a group to simulate the pact joining forces, since chances are, the people in your group are of different orders. For something that’s supposed to be your personal story however, it should not require grouping. Depending on how they handle personal story expansions, Zhaitan may become a locked gate, though probably, the next personal story will start from step 1 and not be a continuation.

Zombie.2310:

As for Arah story. You go slay an Elder Dragon. Recall ypu last encounters with dragons… There was one on Claw Island where you and an ENTIRE ARMY of NPCs fougth. Not sure if you did the Champs that spawn all 3 hours. But there is always an ENTIRE ARMY of players there. The Dragons are like the ultimate enemy. Beeing able to slay Zhaitan solo would just not fit. Especially not in a world that’s filled to the brimm with heroes.

Those aren’t the only options, though – either making it into a multiplayer dungeon or having the single player solo Zhaitan.

That army of NPCs? Could make a reappearance. It would be impossible to show everyone who is fighting the battle simultaneously anyway (it’s a lot more than five,) so you’re always going to have to imagine lots of other people are participating too.

Personally, I didn’t mind the last mission being a dungeon because I was with a nice group of people, but it did bother me that my character wasn’t in the cutscenes. It made it feel less like the culmination of my personal story that someone I’d never met before was doing all the talking.

That particular issue could have been fixed by splitting the dialog between us, though, so that everyone got at least one line and no one’s character was monopolizing it all. I really wish they’d done that at least, even if it was going to be a dungeon.

chasingfuries.9635:

and to answer your question, ever consider the possibility that some people cant go out to hang with people? if mmos arent all about being social then please explain what they actually are

That doesn’t answer my question. If people can go out, why would you expect them to stay home to socialize? You’re the one criticizing the way we play. If you have some limitation that prevents you from going out, don’t force it on the rest of us.

To answer your question, social games are supposed to be social. GW2 isn’t a social game, it’s an MMO, and you keep leaving out the last part – RPG. MMO is the adjective, RPG is the noun.

and lastly, yeah sure group content is all for bad gamers – totally that makes sense, because teamwork takes no skill, right. got it.

You can call teamwork a type of skill, along the lines that communication is a skill. It is not, however, gameplay skill, which is the skill I was referring to. So yes, when you design content for teamwork rather than skill, it tends to promote bad players, who often rely on teamwork instead of skill. Are you…. understanding any of this yet?

It’s mainly an issue for dungeons (depending on your class and skill I suppose). At this stage, allowing henchmen for instances would seem an idea to consider. When you can’t find a group, even Alesia is welcome. And it would allow us anti-social types to actually explore a dungeon instead of rushing it (since the other anti-social types don’t like us running off into side passages :P).

I can understand the choice against it and wouldn’t want henchmen in general PvE… but the case for it is getting stronger. Not because soloing is worse, but because grouping up gets worse.

Leablo.2651:

chasingfuries.9635:

and to answer your question, ever consider the possibility that some people cant go out to hang with people? if mmos arent all about being social then please explain what they actually are

That doesn’t answer my question. If people can go out, why would you expect them to stay home to socialize? You’re the one criticizing the way we play. If you have some limitation that prevents you from going out, don’t force it on the rest of us.

To answer your question, social games are supposed to be social. GW2 isn’t a social game, it’s an MMO, and you keep leaving out the last part – RPG. MMO is the adjective, RPG is the noun.

and lastly, yeah sure group content is all for bad gamers – totally that makes sense, because teamwork takes no skill, right. got it.

You can call teamwork a type of skill, along the lines that communication is a skill. It is not, however, gameplay skill, which is the skill I was referring to. So yes, when you design content for teamwork rather than skill, it tends to promote bad players, who often rely on teamwork instead of skill. Are you…. understanding any of this yet?

Holy kitten lol. I have no idea what games you played but you definitely have the most accepted idea of mmorpg wrong. Technically you are right, mmorpgs can be made without social aspects, but I highly doubt that’s what most mmo players prefer. You obviously missed out on the various experiences of meeting really great people and guilds. Otherwise, I doubt you’d be spilling this nonsense. Seriously, teamwork is gameplay skill. To make the game soloable is to make it easier for you, it doesn’t test your skill any better than group content. Ever heard of combo fields? Having teammates gives you access to more types thus allowing you to create diverse combos affecting gameplay. Crowd control timings, aegis proc, battle standard ressing, etc. huge amazing teamwork is there. What I know though is that most people do not use these skills or improve on them so yes, being in a team sometimes or most of the times feels like babysitting, but being in a dungeon guild, I don’t get those bad experiences anymore. MMO allows it so other players can be your resources to beat the game; they are indefinitely a part of the game, if you fail to use them to your advantage; you do not know how to play the game.

Veldan.4637:

Hydrophidian.4319:

The social experience of an MMO is not limited to the idea of teaming.

- Sometimes I want to solo, sometimes I want to team. A good MMO provides both options, as well as easy transition between the two. That way, a player can remain vested, regardless of mood.

Does GW2 not do this? You have both options and the easy transition, as far as I can see.

Yah, GW2 does it, sure. It could do it much better, though. On both sides of the equation.

- I generally enjoy chatting with folks, no matter how I’m playing.

But would the chat be enough reason to make a game online instead of offline? I thought not….

In my case, you’d be wrong. So your attempt to answer for me has failed. If you’d avoid that kinda thing in the future, I’d appreciate it.

You’re also getting close to false dichotomy territory here. Most people are after some sort of mix of solo and team play. It’s not either/or. This potential for mix is, for many, a big part of the attraction of an MMO.

As an immersionist, having other players running around can add a great deal to the play experience, even if I’m not interacting with them directly. It contributes to the feeling of a living world.

funny, I found other players are actually one of the first things to destroy immersion, since they never behave as they would in reality (RP server may be an exception), where NPCs are usually a lot more “real” in that regard

Except, we’re not talking about you? You expressed an inability to understand why people who don’t want to (always) team would play an MMO. You were given multiple reasons. Your own standards are irrelevant to them.

For myself, in this game, I usually don’t have map chat on. I find that alone does wonders for mitigating immersion-breaking behavior. And yes, I also play on an RP-focused server, which also helps.

1. grouping and/or playing with others is the most important part of MMOs and no MMO will be made without it

I don’t find it to be the most important part of an MMO. I think the most important part of the MMO is catering to a broad enough audience for it to remain an MMO. This means facilitating both team play and solo play. Too much emphasis on either will cause problems.

2. GW2 has solo friendly and non-solo friendly areas. You always have a choice. There is no need for 100% of the content to be solo friendly.

I’d be okay with 100% solo-friendly as long as the content scaled for # of participants.

That’s hard to do, though. So having some team-only stuff is okay by me.

I’ll throw my opinion in here, just because I can

The only thing I have any issue with, really, is that your PERSONAL story requires you to group up at the end. If it’s MY personal story, why do I need OTHERS to be there? (At the same time, I must admit that the personal story is something that I do when I need a break for other stuff, not a main point of playing.)

For everything else, I actually prefer to run around with friends, be it working on leveling my own characters or helping someone else do so. The social aspect of the game is why I and my friends migrated here from another game. Even when we are all doing different things, we can chat about whatever. Yeah, it kinda annoys me that I gotta go do WvW for map completion, but that isn’t my focus in this game….my focus is in having fun.

I have found that some professions have an easier time of soloing than others, but it could also be that I have no clues how to play those other professions. (That is also one of the reasons that I die a lot in PVP, I think.)

The TL:DR version? Make the personal story fully solo, leave the rest as is…it’s good to go.

Leablo.2651:

To answer your question, social games are supposed to be social. GW2 isn’t a social game, it’s an MMO, and you keep leaving out the last part – RPG. MMO is the adjective, RPG is the noun.

An MMO, regardless of what you tack on the end of it, is, by definition, a social experience. There has to be a persistent world, which is a shared space. “Social” is implicit in that.

An mmo is only as social as you, the player makes it. Well, not one person, but the entire community of a server.

Blackwolfe.5649:

An mmo is only as social as you, the player makes it. Well, not one person, but the entire community of a server.

True, but there are many tools an MMO designer can include that foster socializing. I can think of a few things that would help Guilds:

- Integrated message board
- Integrated events calendar
- Custom event generation with rewards
- Extended experience app

This extra credits video also had some novel ideas:

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/transgaming

Roll a thief , doesn’t help the last part of story mode but you can do every other zone in this game pretty easily with your arsenal of evasions and stealths.
Currently I’m at 99% map complete just waiting for 5 POIs and 2 vistas in WvW.