Guild Wars 2

I am curious – anyone else besides me thinks that „no forced grouping” is poor design choice?

Personally, I think that while it’s casual-friendly, it also prevents developers from implementing some variety to the campaign. I just remembered first GW – specifically Cantha and missions like Vizunah Square & Unwaking Waters. Its specific seemed like perfect patent for the final quests of GW 2 – since Priory, Vigil and Whispers would have different roles on the battlefield, the end part of the story would be ideal for those type of „joint missions”. And IMHO it would be awesome if one of the missions were e.g. battle for the three parties, where the Vigil characters would try to defend some stagnant objective whilst Whispers would assassinate commanders & Priory would fire some artillery. Or sth else along this lines.

And yeah, I know it’s too late for it now – but would like to see it in some expansion. And I’d prefer fun personal story over the personal story I could do all by myself

I wish they’d done more along those lines, too.

Perhaps they could add some group story content later/expansions.

In particular something that’s bothered me on all the lines (I did one for each of the Orders) – Almost all of the quests you have to escort some NPC. The bugs that have plagued me in the quests almost all have to do with the kitty-like behavior of the NPC AIs. And to top it off, the most hated type of quest in MMOs is escort mission. Yet every single one, we’re stuck herding kittens. Stupid AI kittens. Gawd I would so totally douse Trahearne in Round-Up™ if I could.

Would be so much nicer if we could replace those imaginary friend NPCs (who don’t ever even learn my name) with actual real life friends.

I’ve never understood the “forced grouping” thing. If you want to group, make some friends and group. Group up to do your personal stories.

Now if you’re talking about having more group content . . . then sure. Harder content in which you need to group would be great.

But . . . a lot of people don’t respond to being “forced to group.” They’ll just ignore that content.

Even in games in which you “had” to group, I’ve found ways to solo from 1 – whatever the cap was just due to the fact I don’t like being told I “have” to do something.

The term forced grouping- for me at least has negative connotations. I will say this though, in other games I’ve played recently a button merely pops up when you get in the vicinity of an “event” that says “join public group?” This leaves the player the option to ignore the button or join. This was quite successful. There was literally no downside to it. If an event pops nearby I’m all too happy to join a group for the sake of the event. There’s no guilt or obligation whatsoever… simply people working together while helping themselves. When the event ends people drop the group- but often people will stay in the group and it works very well for meeting people. I thought of it as a built-in icebreaker of sorts.

Yeah, forced grouping is a negative buzz-word.

Should call it “team-based content” or something like that.

I personally really like playing in a party. I really like content that challenges a party. I guess in a game like GW2 it shouldn’t ever be forced on you, but they certainly could have more content that requires it.

The story quests kept (and keep) having me think “This could have been really cool, ’cept they nerfed it to be soloable.” Stuff like the beach-landing going into Orr, or the invasion of Claw Island.

Instead we get watered-down story quests where we’re still forced to group, except it’s forced to group with dumb NPC to escort.

It’s how people play these days. Grouping isn’t what people do any more unless it’s accidental (doing boss/objective at same time so people group for it to save hassle) or they want to chat to friend without having to pm them (use party chat to talk across maps). This is partly because people would rather play at their own pace than either rush through areas or be slowed down by strangers, and partly because other people are often annoying.

Forced grouping is terrible design.

Most groups want to plow through content, what if you want to stop by a NPC to listen to him or go on that hill to take a screenshot?
The team will just force you to follow them or kick you.
In dungeons I had people ask me to skip cinematics, which says a lot of what would happen if there was forced grouping.

I also don’t like to be forced to do anything honestly.

While grouping can be fun, like the two posters above me have noted, it does have it’s downsides. If you want to play a certain way and they don’t, it gets annoying. Heck even my friend I play MMO’s with I can’t level with because he goes way faster than I do and skips stories and things. So we do dungeons and stuff together, but not quests because it’s just not fun for me to speed through things.

Also some of us play more casually and just want to log in and be able to hop into some quests, finish them, and move on. I in the past have spent a lot more time in games and played them more hardcore and have in past games argued for more “forced grouping”, but I’m tired of that now and just enjoy hopping between two of three games and playing for a few casual hours a night.

Edit: I agree with Red Falcon on his last line as well – I don’t like being forced to do anything. I don’t like things being required. This even goes into discussions about gear in other games, and dungeon pre-reqs and other such things. If I want to do content it’s fine, but if I don’t then it’s just annoying being forced into it. Thankfully I can do whatever the heck I want in GW2 – Thanks Anet!

Ummm I group to do zone completions and stuff like that, and know a bunch of people who like to do it as well (in my guild).

And I’ve never ever seen anyone suggest not to watch the cinematics, and I see people trying to stay off VoIP until the people are out of their cut-scenes.

So again, I think there really are a lot of different types of player out there. The social types tend to group together, and embrace content designed for groups. We don’t think of it as “forced grouping” but rather “the good stuff”

The only gripe I have with grouping is the speed of which to complete a quest or dungeon. There are those types that like to “rush” it and others, like me, that just want to lay back and enjoy it (depending if there’s a timer set or not).

Story time! (skip if you prefer)

Back in another game, I decided to take part in a dungeon for the first time. I was holding off on dungeons because (1) didn’t have anyone to do it with at the time or (2) I just didn’t feel like it. Anyways, the group I was with have been through it countless times so they know the ins and outs of a 4-wheel clown car. There weren’t many cut scenes but plenty of audible instructions I wanted to listen to, just to make sure I wasn’t missing out on anything. The leader of the party was all like, “wat r u doin jus skip it n follow”. So I did just that, not wanting to make others feel like I dragged them behind. In the end, I got through it but it left me with an incomplete feeling.

I’m in complete agreement with Ming’s suggestion on his/her “join public group” idea.

Forced grouping blows.

I’m glad it’s not here. Instead we have a system where buffs affect an area instead of a group and 3 people who are not grouped can all attack the same mob and all get loot.

We have all the advantages of teaming (outside of personal quests) without actually needing to group.

Thing is, forced anything sucks.

Forced grouping sucks and forced soloing sucks (a huge reason why I don’t play Secret World)

You can absolutely group through your personal storylines. Mechnically, there’s nothing stopping you, and that’s how I usually do mine. Get a bunch of friends together and do them. It’s much more fun.

Solo content does not preclude you teaming up to group for it (except in the case of the aforementioned Secret World)

Dungeons Story mode are part of the campaign and require grouping.

Day late and a dollar short OP. Anet has already stated that challenging content and more scalability is on the way. As was put out before the game went live.

Also OP, you might want to see to your use of labels for Gamers, it takes away from your post and is pure folly. A Gamer is a person that enjoys games, not something we called each other in grade school before we all gained wisdom.

it is a great design choice as it does not force me to team with strangers than turn out to be not so pleasant. Also, you are wrong as dungeons require teams. If you like to play in a group, look for a group, it is as easy as that. Instead you demand people having to play with you – I ask you, does that really qualify for the label “social”?

So there’s this big scary guy called Tyrone who is forcing you people to join a group? Stop making excuses for being anti-social. If you don’t want to play with other people then you don’t have to but the people who do want to play with a certain group of people are the ones losing out.

Pilusilm.5682:

So there’s this big scary guy called Tyrone who is forcing you people to join a group? Stop making excuses for being anti-social. If you don’t want to play with other people then you don’t have to but the people who do want to play with a certain group of people are the ones losing out.

Who is stopping you from playing in a group?

no, they are not “losing out” because they CAN team with anyone they like to if they care to invest the time finding those people – as I do myself when I feel to.

Cancer.9065:

Pilusilm.5682:

So there’s this big scary guy called Tyrone who is forcing you people to join a group? Stop making excuses for being anti-social. If you don’t want to play with other people then you don’t have to but the people who do want to play with a certain group of people are the ones losing out.

Who is stopping you from playing in a group?

You lose exp if you don’t deal enough damage. That goes for trash mobs. Doesn’t seem like much but it stacks up.

i see people asking for groups etc but theres no point other than reaping the rewards of someone elses effort.

The point is all the content except for dungeons is so easy that you don’t need a group. Especially the story-quests, which are supposed to have this grand epic save-the-world heroic destiny feel to them, but are easy even for one person, let alone a party.

You can bring a group to personal story, and I frequently have grouped for them. But it’d be really cool to have some more very optional content that actually requires a party. Cuz that’s where other game developers come up with stuff that’s truly interesting and engaging.

Right now I think the only benefit of grouping is a little bit more influence for your guild, no loot, no xp, no nothing bonus. I’m ok with that. Just want something more interesting in the game for people who do like party play.

I’d like to correct some misunderstandings. I don’t think ‘forced grouping’ is good thing. I only used this wording because it seems like it’s used here quite a time. I don’t also consider myself a gamer in the ‘elitarist’ sense of the world. I am just the one that could enjoy the game slightly more.

But my point is that ‘noone has to group’ paradigmat is atricious to the value of teamwork & the attractiveness of missions. The point is that:

• material has to be solo-able. Therefore, you can’t e.g. implement the challenge that would require actually someone else to distract the boss while some glass cannons hit it. Much less – anything more complicated.
• it has to be compatibile with every one playstyle. Mission should be compatibile with kittening HS thief with no vitality as much as the toughness / vit warrior who isn’t exactly the DPS.

This two features are a good thing… except they force you to abandom a whole lot a good ideas. Like e.g. missions requiring some splitting, fights like lover from AC. Oh, and teamwork while in party suffers too. Let’s take a look at e.g. boss A. While I’m alone, he’s just boss A. When I’m in two players party, he’s eventually still boss A. Just two times his health and two times his DPS. But what’s the matter? Statistically, we now have 2 times kur DPS and the boss attention is divided between us, so we still take the same amount of DPS → we still pass him just by playing by ourselves, like the second one never existed. That denies (at least for me) entire point of actually being into party. And for that matter – no, I don’t consider scaling any good answer. At least in unsophisticated shape I’ve seen to date. So no, I don’t feel like being one day late.

And I’m perfectly aware of the existence  dungeons. Now, I wouldn’t have any problem if missions were just interesting. Sadly, I don’t feel like Orrian part of story has any replayability value. Just butchering through waves of enemies designed specifically not to mess with any specific playstyle. And IMHO at least part of the reason tor this state of things is that they had to comply with ‘everyone can solo it, no forced grouping’ doctrine.

I don’t think that ‘grouping needed’ is good thing. I like being in party but don’t like feel being forced. It’s just the side effects on game design I’m concerned with.

And seriously, I think that original GW heroes gave me much better ‘no forced grouping’ experience than GW 2 scaling had.