Guild Wars 2

In the long term the lack of the trinity makes instances and any other group play boring and shallow to say the least.

People aren’t forced to co operate and work together or strategize like in other mmo’s that we’ve all played in the past.

If you want people to continue playing this game for any length of time you need to bring back the trinity Anet.

Yes it does.. But you may want to play a different game if you are looking for the Trinity… GW2 is not designed to be like most MMO..

The other day I joined a Caudecus group on my Engi. The other party members were Ranger, Ele, Necro, and Mesmer. No heavies. Every battle was a struggle and we wiped often. But by the end we had it down – use summons to soak up aggro, and everybody kite like crazy. Strategic analysis of our group’s strengths and weaknesses combined with skillful play led to eventual success. Had GW2 been a trinity game, this would not be possible. Instead:

• I would not have been allowed in the group in the first place.
• The rest of the party would have been sitting in LFG.
• Each party member would have had a predetermined, fixed role to play, as determined by their class. They all work in a vacuum and assume everyone else does their expected job.

diabluz.2860:

In the long term the lack of the trinity makes instances and any other group play boring and shallow to say the least.

People aren’t forced to co operate and work together or strategize like in other mmo’s that we’ve all played in the past.

I don’t think those words mean what you think they mean. I realize casual players outnumber everyone else but can the rest of us please have this one game? You have every other MMO as it is.

I disagree, rather strongly, actually. I think that removing the fixed roles that a Trinity would force onto everyone is one of this this game’s best selling points. You can play your class in a lot of different ways, instead of “Oh, your a healer? Heal. You’re a tank? Sit there and soak up damage.” It allows for more freedom in each class, and makes it so that there’s more than one way of playing it. Bland classes have ruined a lot of MMOs for me, and it’s always because your forced to play every class in one specific way or you die.

While I understand that it sort of makes all the classes “Good at everything; great at nothing” that’s not really a big problem for me. But, I can see why people who like being told exactly what they have to do could be disappointed.

Actually there is a lot more strategy involved without the trinity than there is with it.

With GW2, you have to work together as a group. In all honesty, it requires a lot more coordination than the trinity as well. Working together to drop heals, procs at the right times, switching aggro, knowing when to cast protections and move out of the way of things. It’s a lot more complex and requires more teamwork. Without the trinity, you have to actually know your class and what works well with other classes and know how to play.

Your traditional Holy Trinity is just dull and a cake walk. Tank runs in, healer tosses a few HoTs on them, and he holds aggro. Sitting there, doing nothing but holding aggro. Healer sits there watching health bars and tosses a heal here and there, while DPS just sits there spamming every attack they have to top the charts. Yeah, that’s much more complex and fun.

Well we all have opinions, but I’m bored silly with trinity games and quite enjoying the change of pace and challenge offered in this one.

Sitting there pewpewpewing through a rotation while a tank takes damage and healers fill health bars is just zzzzzzzz to me now.

Not sure if serious, or trolling…

GW2 is not a trinity game. There are well over 100 of those to be found on MMORPG.com. Coming to GW2 and expecting them to change their core dungeon design to mimic those other games and throw out one of the few things left that makes this game unique is a far less realistic expectation than just going out and buying one of those games yourself. >_>

diabluz.2860:

In the long term the lack of the trinity makes instances and any other group play boring and shallow to say the least.

People aren’t forced to co operate and work together or strategize like in other mmo’s that we’ve all played in the past.

If you want people to continue playing this game for any length of time you need to bring back the trinity Anet.

I think we established this back in October.

GW2 has a very limited audience, but the ones that have found it like it. It will never be WoW success, it’s just a niche.

Karizee.8076:

Sitting there pewpewpewing through a rotation while a tank takes damage and healers fill health bars is just zzzzzzzz to me now.

So having everyone do the exact same thing is somehow more interesting?

Hmmm.

Leablo.2651:

The other day I joined a Caudecus group on my Engi. The other party members were Ranger, Ele, Necro, and Mesmer. No heavies. Every battle was a struggle and we wiped often. But by the end we had it down – use summons to soak up aggro, and everybody kite like crazy.

You can eventually dig through a cement wall with a soup spoon also. It doesn’t mean it was fun, or the right tool for the job.

Zeldain.5710:

Karizee.8076:

Sitting there pewpewpewing through a rotation while a tank takes damage and healers fill health bars is just zzzzzzzz to me now.

So having everyone do the exact same thing is somehow more interesting?

Hmmm.

The irony in your post…

I really miss the trinity, i feel it takes away an element in pvp (priority targets) and dungeons.

I would never have said anything before because the game wasn’t designed for the trinity. But it wasn’t designed for a gear treadmill either and they added that, so why not a trinity to.

If you’re feeling nostalgic for thy Trinity – just play as a tank… or a DD-glasscannon…

There is coordination and depth, but not every encounter in the game reveals that these things exist in the game.

I would like to tell every “no trinity ruins the game” person that they’ve been playing trinity based games for many years. When you’ve been playing games based around one set of rules, you get extremely familiar with those rules and can recognize and negotiate an encounter very quickly due to this familiarity. On top of that, many of the MMO games based upon this ruleset have add-ons that tell when to do what, what everyone else is doing, and how to basically play and read the encounter. If that’s not enough, you have detailed websites with boss encounter diagrams and suggestions.

A non-trinity based system is instantly unfamiliar after all of that and everything you are presented with will not parse as quickly through your mind as a trinity-based system and encounter would. However, do not mistake a lack of familiarity with a system for the absence of a system.

diabluz.2860:

In the long term the lack of the trinity makes instances and any other group play boring and shallow to say the least.

People aren’t forced to co operate and work together or strategize like in other mmo’s that we’ve all played in the past.

If you want people to continue playing this game for any length of time you need to bring back the trinity Anet.

In GW2 the outcome of a fight is not decided on a spreadsheet before you even log in.

Wanderer.3248:

In GW2 the outcome of a fight is not decided on a spreadsheet before you even log in.

And with that, all of the depth of Quake.

Grats.

Zeldain.5710:

Wanderer.3248:

In GW2 the outcome of a fight is not decided on a spreadsheet before you even log in.

And with that, all of the depth of Quake.

Grats.

I played WoW for 6 years. Don’t even BEGIN to say the fighting in WoW had depth.

Paladin tanking consists of 8 spells. 3 of which are what you will use 90% of the time.

I like the elimination of the trinity. I played a number of the simpler trinity based games and after a while I realised I wasn’t seeing a complex computer game it was more like playing Angry birds or some of the other games on handheld platforms…you know single button mash games for phones. I got tired of the stare at the health bars of party member game, The wear out my “1” on my number pad game and the Fill my screen with the enemy while tapping 2 buttons and some dude screams in my ear over Vent or Team Speak.

If you enjoy the trinity no one forces you to play a non-trinity game.

/Sort of like many Slackware users LIKE the lack of automatic dependency management(some even see it as a way to filter out annoying folks) I wouldn’t ask P.V. to add dependency management to it, I’d just use OpenSuSE or Fedora or some such.

Zeldain.5710:

Karizee.8076:

Sitting there pewpewpewing through a rotation while a tank takes damage and healers fill health bars is just zzzzzzzz to me now.

So having everyone do the exact same thing is somehow more interesting?

Hmmm.

The irony in your reply is too kitten high! Alright, that aside. Trinity is boring and old school, not to mention it’ll sidelines players based on profession. Not a healthy gameplay IMO. Tank takes agro, healer heals tank and dps just dps. No fun at all. With the old stale trinity gameplay gone it opens more room for strategic gameplay and team planning. In all seriousness, trinity is a thing of the past and it should stay there.

The only thing more boring than the trinity is the amount of times people take the time to try to defend it. But it’s like everything else. It’s had it’s time. it’ll fade as new games come out, and five years from now, only old games will have it. We’ve started moving beyond it, and as time goes on, the new generation of players will learn to hate it as much as I do.

The trinity is a contrived mechanic that lacks imagination. It reduces players to rotation players, who don’t even have to think to get through content. It doesn’t surprise me that some people like it. It’s nice and controlled and everyone knows what they’re supposed to be doing.

It also doesn’t surprise me that people who come from that background think there’s no depth in GW2’s combat. Most people see only what they’re trained to see, and people give up way too easily to learn something new.

But the trinity system is truly appauling. It set the RPG space back ten years. The damage it’s done to the genre will take another five years to recover from.

Zeldain.5710:

Wanderer.3248:

In GW2 the outcome of a fight is not decided on a spreadsheet before you even log in.

And with that, all of the depth of Quake.

Grats.

I don’t think you know enough about competitive FPSes to imply that Quake is a shallow game.

I agree and disagree.

What we have now doesn’t work properly, it’s tiring, repetitious and honestly boring when everyone’s the same class (with just a different look), but i also agree the trinity wont work solely as a fix for what we have now..

They need to start opening the classes more, give more roles and skills to them and stop nerfing everything for the sake of spvp, its killing classes and not helping the game..

holy trinity isnt an issue here , my suggestion? make trash mobs in dungeons not complete ball busters (and FAR TOUGHER then ANY / MAJORITY Boss Fights) and make boss fights more challenging , add some more fights that actually make you think , an example would be finding a way to make the bosses weakness show (ie ingame mechanic you have to watch for) , i see very little / few fights that do require good strategy (there are some , but FAR and FEW and with trash mobs being a pain like in CM Exp mode , noones payed that much attention to the amount of boss fights that do require said strategy). So in summary , more managable trash that doesnt end up meaning more repair bills / horrible loot tables for average groups , and more boss fights that are actually challenging and require strategy other then dont die and kite.

Leablo.2651:

I don’t think those words mean what you think they mean. I realize casual players outnumber everyone else but can the rest of us please have this one game? You have every other MMO as it is.

When I read this, something clicked for me. I have been comparing GW2 to others and finding things to complain about.

I guess the truth is most people who play like the game. There really are many other games out there. This one sets itself apart from them.

Thank you Leablo. I am going to stop picking on this game and just try to enjoy it as it is.

I just want to say that the reason I got tired of other MMOs was mostly because of the trinity. Being forced into a role isn’t fun. I like versatile gameplay that lets me fight how I want. In other MMOs, by end game, you’re normally forced into having a label slapped on you and doing the same thing over and over again just based on your class. I like to change up my play style on the fly, and you just can’t do that with other MMOs like you can in GW2.

Almost every single MMO I’ve ever played got boring because I was stuck in a ‘role’ with little to no chance to change it up. GW2 I can switch out my skills and traits whenever I want, and also, despite nerfs and balance, every class actually looks interesting, and I am determined to try them all rather than just 1-3 classes. Hell, normally I only feel like playing ONE class because apparently my needs are too ‘specific.’ Which is really just a class that can solo a lot of end-game content while still being wanted in a party for dungeons and other challenges. I can even disregard looks, race, and plot if these two conditions are met.

Most of the time it’s the thief/rogue/assassin classes. Assuming the game design does indeed make it so they are wanted in a party.

Do you know how tired I am of having to play the same class EVERY GAME? Some classes will look interesting, but because of their role, I feel like automatically I will get tired of them after a few levels. Tanks kill too slow, healers might not be able to effectively kill on their own, and most of the dps classes I like are squishy. So I get stuck with the evasive class, extra on the evasion. Why not a warrior like class? Because they, most the time, need to be paired with a healer.

Ironically, I love the thief class in this game. But it’s nice to be able to play the mesmer and guardian classes without any of the trinity crap getting in the way. It’s especially nice to not always needing a healer/support char running around with you, since you’re in charge of your own healing/buffs anyway.

Because playing a game where everybody has to fulfill the exact same three positions in the exact same way (two of which take no skill whatsoever) isn’t shallow at all right? That’s why everybody knows football is so much more deep than chess…

Some people’s kids…

Strategy and skill should always be a key focus of GW2 and never which class you are. Just my opinion.

Conncept.7638:

Because playing a game where everybody has to fulfill the exact same three positions in the exact same way (two of which take no skill whatsoever) isn’t shallow at all right? That’s why everybody knows football is so much more deep than chess…

Some people’s kids…

As opposed to one role with no team synergy? Yeah, your parents kids.

Zeldain.5710:

Conncept.7638:

Because playing a game where everybody has to fulfill the exact same three positions in the exact same way (two of which take no skill whatsoever) isn’t shallow at all right? That’s why everybody knows football is so much more deep than chess…

Some people’s kids…

As opposed to one role with no team synergy? Yeah, your parents kids.

Sorry if you lack the ability to play more than one role, but if such is the case I assure you that most players are more creative and capable than you. I can run any number of builds in PvE or dungeons, including support or tank builds, and contribute just as much as anyone else on my team. If you can’t, that’s your failing, not the games.

Zeldain.5710:

Conncept.7638:

Because playing a game where everybody has to fulfill the exact same three positions in the exact same way (two of which take no skill whatsoever) isn’t shallow at all right? That’s why everybody knows football is so much more deep than chess…

Some people’s kids…

As opposed to one role with no team synergy? Yeah, your parents kids.

You must be playing a different game than me, because we have tons of synergy when my guild plays together. We take skills and styles that compliment each other. We do things smart.

This game is probably tougher on pugs than other games are. Which is why you should join a guild. This kind of game requires training as a team to work as a team.

The trinity was great in that anyone could just slot into a role and play that role, because it was always the same. And that is a strength of that system. But considering how stale and contrived that system actually is, I think this is a much much better system.

Imagine how exciting the Lord of the Rings would have been if Blizzard had produced it. No one would ever attack anyone but Boromir, and Gandalf would be back healing him. Very exciting.

(Note to OP: coming here to complain about GW2 isn’t going to get you a lot of kudos and slaps on the back. I disagree with you, but you are allowed your opinion.)

I played SWTOR, a classic trinity game, before coming to GW2. I feel like I played the same class in LOTRO as I did in SWTOR… just the same thing with a different skin.

Coming to GW2 and rolling an Elementalist was such a breath of fresh air compared to the Runekeeper or Jedi Sage. I love that I don’t have to fit into a certain role every time I play. I love that even in a dps build I can provide cc support and healing if necessary. I love that each person is in charge of their own healing, their own dodging, and their own dps. And specifically, I love that I can make a build that can easily switch between melee or ranged without a respec.

I love that, despite being in charge of yourself as an individual player, groups will still fail utterly unless you coordinate.

Don’t say there is no coordination . Have you played in a serious WvW or PvP guild? Done dungeons that aren’t just farm runs?

The coordination is just different now and, in my opinion, better.

I don’t agree with the sentiment that GW2 has synergy. On one hand there are combo fields, and builds that are meant to benefit your team, but in the end it is still an individual game of survival (especially in dungeons).

Sure you can play ‘support’ or ‘tank’ builds ala Altruistic Healing Guardian, but the benefit to your team is still small.

A simpler way to see this is if your ‘tank’ guardian dies. Will you still be able to defeat the boss? Of course. In most other MMOs, if your tank dies, your team wipes. Period. Same for your healer and sometimes DPS.

So I don’t see how anyone can argue that the synergy in GW2 is anything to write home about. Yes the generic 4-warrior-1-mesmer group works together pretty well, same with 3 guardians for permanent projectile reflection, but it’s still kind of iffy compared to other MMO games.

This isn’t necessarily bad, as it means you can just play whatever the heck you want and get away with it, as well as not having to depend on a tank or healer who may or may not suck.

It is just different, and honestly I find it kind of boring. (Disclaimer: this is my own opinion) Sure you can argue that tanks tanking, healers healing, and people doing damage is boring too, but at least you had to work together to do a dungeon. In GW2 it’s just a test of how well you can time dodges and hit the enemy.

Edit: Yes teamwork helps in WvW – nobody is disputing that. However in the end it is still every-man-for-himself. And for serious dungeons – let’s use Giganticus Lupicus as an example. He’s a decently difficult boss, and sure when I’m on a Guardian using teamwide stability to get people out of the bubbles helps a lot, as well as using aegis to safely rez people during his storm of green stuff. However if my team was skilled enough there is absolutely 0 need to do that as we would never get hit. Can you take a team of 5 fire-mages into the Deadmines? The answer is no.

Sunflowers, I respect that you find it boring. That’s your call, right?

But the funny thing is, everyone is calling for innovation and blasting other MMO’s for sticking to the Holy Trinity. It’s a lose-lose for game developers.

What could GW2 to break out of the rut besides what they have done?

And it is true that it is still possible to win if your “tank” dies. But when I join a PUG group, I cringe when I don’t see a guardian or a few warriors. I know it will be a lot harder to win without someone durable in the front lines. So, yes, less class definition, but still some synergy. Not as much as the defined roles of other games and I think that is a fair trade-off for the freedom offered.

That said, if it bores you, it bores you.

Kaiwen.1520:

But the funny thing is, everyone is calling for innovation and blasting other MMO’s for sticking to the Holy Trinity. It’s a lose-lose for game developers.

Sadly this is true (and a good counter-point to my argument).

Sunflowers.1729:

I don’t agree with the sentiment that GW2 has synergy. On one hand there are combo fields, and builds that are meant to benefit your team, but in the end it is still an individual game of survival (especially in dungeons).

Sure you can play ‘support’ or ‘tank’ builds ala Altruistic Healing Guardian, but the benefit to your team is still small.

A simpler way to see this is if your ‘tank’ guardian dies. Will you still be able to defeat the boss? Of course. In most other MMOs, if your tank dies, your team wipes. Period. Same for your healer and sometimes DPS.

So I don’t see how anyone can argue that the synergy in GW2 is anything to write home about. Yes the generic 4-warrior-1-mesmer group works together pretty well, same with 3 guardians for permanent projectile reflection, but it’s still kind of iffy compared to other MMO games.

This isn’t necessarily bad, as it means you can just play whatever the heck you want and get away with it, as well as not having to depend on a tank or healer who may or may not suck.

It is just different, and honestly I find it kind of boring. (Disclaimer: this is my own opinion) Sure you can argue that tanks tanking, healers healing, and people doing damage is boring too, but at least you had to work together to do a dungeon. In GW2 it’s just a test of how well you can time dodges and hit the enemy.

Edit: Yes teamwork helps in WvW – nobody is disputing that. However in the end it is still every-man-for-himself. And for serious dungeons – let’s use Giganticus Lupicus as an example. He’s a decently difficult boss, and sure when I’m on a Guardian using teamwide stability to get people out of the bubbles helps a lot, as well as using aegis to safely rez people during his storm of green stuff. However if my team was skilled enough there is absolutely 0 need to do that as we would never get hit. Can you take a team of 5 fire-mages into the Deadmines? The answer is no.

So what you’re saying is that synergy can only exist where if one guy dies you fail? Cause that sounds like you’re saying that. What does that mean?

A team of navy seals could go out on a mission and they could have great synergy. One of them could die…the rest could finish the mission without him. The mission shouldn’t automatically fail because one guy dies. That’s not synergy anyway.

Ravious of Kill Ten Rats wrote an article about this very topic and he came to the conclusion that the type of synergy you get in Guild Wars 2 is more like the type of synergy you get in Team Fortress 2. You gel with your team (his word not mine). You fall into a role as you learn what other people are doing and you react to it on the fly. You see what needs to happen and you move to fill that role. At least you do if you’re a decent player.

This becomes even more true with a guild that plays together all the time. Synergy with strangers is not the same thing as static roles, because then everyone is just doing something mindless. Synergy, real synergy comes from reacting.

People in trinity games aren’t play WITH each other. They’re doing their own thing while standing next each other. The healer is looking at green bars going up and down, while trying to stay out of red circles. He’s not playing WITH anyone. The tank is holding aggro on the boss. He’s not playing WITH anyone. The the DPS guys are trying to outdo each other. They’re all playing their own game.

In Guild Wars 2, if I lay down a well, other people have to see it and recognize it. But I can’t tell you how many times in mumble, while doing a dungeon, someone will say, look we have three mesmers, let’s stagger our time warps. I’ll use mine first then you go, then Joe will go. Or how many times we come up with cool ways to do things that require voice communication. We do this stuff all the time. We tell each other when we lay down certain types of fields. There’s a ton of synergy when we play together.

But if you don’t train with a team, I don’t know why you’d expect synergy. That’s why pugs aren’t as good as playing with a guild.

Kaiwen.1520:

Sunflowers, I respect that you find it boring. That’s your call, right?

But the funny thing is, everyone is calling for innovation and blasting other MMO’s for sticking to the Holy Trinity. It’s a lose-lose for game developers.

What could GW2 to break out of the rut besides what they have done?

And it is true that it is still possible to win if your “tank” dies. But when I join a PUG group, I cringe when I don’t see a guardian or a few warriors. I know it will be a lot harder to win without someone durable in the front lines. So, yes, less class definition, but still some synergy. Not as much as the defined roles of other games and I think that is a fair trade-off for the freedom offered.

That said, if it bores you, it bores you.

ArenaNet was on the right path, they creative a great world with decent character progression and combat.

But the problem is they neutered the longevity of the game by not making in team oriented. There was nothing for a guild to strive for. There was no challenge in the open world.

Even if you look past the ridiculous legendary grind which is really a front for the cash shop, the game stopped short of delivering any compelling content.

If all you’re into is “in the moment fun” then grats, GW2 is your game… along with Mario Kart an 99 million other games. But an MMORPG has a responsibility to be more than that. ArenaNet has failed in that regard.

diabluz.2860:

In the long term the lack of the trinity makes instances and any other group play boring and shallow to say the least.

People aren’t forced to co operate and work together or strategize like in other mmo’s that we’ve all played in the past.

If you want people to continue playing this game for any length of time you need to bring back the trinity Anet.

Trinity is what makes gameplay shallow. One of my favorite class to play was healer because I only had to play with 1 hand wink.

Don’t mistake absolute dependency for synergy.

Synergy is like the way that a certain healing class synergizes well with a certain melee class in pvp. There’s dependency there, but that’s not what causes the synergy. If you played BC Arenas, then you saw Warlock/Priest a lot or you saw Resto Druid/Warrior a lot, and Disc Priest/War/Shaman a lot in 5 mans. Warlock and Priest synergized because of fears and shadow damage synergy. Resto Druid/War worked because the Druid could help CC and snare enemies for the War to hit.

In GW2 terms, a Hammer Warrior and a Support Ele can synergize well with blast finishers in water and fire fields for both healing and might stacks. Now change the Hammer Warrior to a Hammer Guardian and you have similar synergy, but the Guardian’s light fields may start to overwrite the Eles combo fields and you have more to worry about when trying to work together in synergy. A Phantasm-based Mesmer with a Staff synergizes well with a condition Necro because the Necro’s massive conditions boost the iWarlock’s damage. They are not absolutely dependent upon each other, but their synergy is very good.

I don’t play a staff Guardian while leveling my Guardian, but when I step into WvWvW, I put on Staff and Scepter while changing my utilities because my solo style of all-melee hammerbros doesn’t work as well with large WvWvW group fights. Meanwhile, the poor damage of staff that keeps me away from it while soloing isn’t a problem when I’m running witha group, but all the buffs and control staff provides really comes forward when I have those others around me.

I think the IDEA of removing trinity has potential, but needs alot more skills and unique abilities that synergize together. Like combo fields, but MORE of that (not more combo fields)

Right now….yes, it kinda makes teamwork shallow. You have more freedom in grouping and playing whatever build/class you like, but a hefty price is payed in complexity, balance and…fun.

People who are not forced to cooperate by game mechanics tend to do it less. As result the game feel more like “i do my thing you do yours” and ends up in a dps race against mobs with oneshots and big hp pools, with most of the finesse and survival based on the dodge and “push these buttons at the same time” events.

This make combat, which is more fun and dynamic then traditional MMOs, less based on cooperation and teamwork, hence less fun and engaging – because all mmos, taken as single player games, are very boring at its heart.

The concept is good , props to anet for trying to innovate, but there is alot of work to be done to make it actually just as good as classic trinity based mmos.

Zeldain.5710:

Massive popularity? You mean the plummeting player engagement and empty world?

I don’t know what server you’re on, but my server is stuffed full, I’m always in overflow and the maps from Brisbane Wildlands to Blazeridge Steppes is full of players.

Just because you think there is “plummeting player engagement” and empty world doesn’t make it true.

Try a different server.

Among all the kitten flinging, I’m not sure if anyone has pointed out, there’s sort of a soft trinity.

Bruiser, Dps, Support

One Bruiser, and one support makes a world of difference in ease of the dungeon. Along with proper combo field usage.

I like not having a trinity.

Played several self sufficient/healing characters, several melee types in DDO. I enjoyed it. I fit right in here with self sufficiency and enjoy that aspect of this game.

I don’t care to wait for a specific class just to finish something. Much prefer to take whoever and just get it done.

I have to also disagree with this…as a ranger I don’t have to worry about groups snubbing me out. I was able to get all my Arah gear along with other rangers in different groups in a period of 3 days If the trinity system would of been in place I would of probably never given the chance to join groups in favor of 3-4 ranks no DPS dealers and 1 healer so I applaud GW2 for this. And, like others have said it requires more teamwork and takes a bit longer but that’s how you find out how to play to your strenghths.

I find the no-trinity combat in GW2 much more dynamic. I think the trinity somewhat exists in each character and you are given the freedom to tweak it to whichever bias you desire.

I do PUGs and I do guild runs. I’m also the one who leads newbies through dungeons. I gotta say that once they start understanding group play styles and dynamics the runs get faster and better. YMMV

John Widdin.9618:

Among all the kitten flinging, I’m not sure if anyone has pointed out, there’s sort of a soft trinity.

Bruiser, Dps, Support

One Bruiser, and one support makes a world of difference in ease of the dungeon. Along with proper combo field usage.

This. I admit, I do get a giggle over the whole, “I love/hate the lack of trinity” when it hasn’t really gone anywhere. Even one of the devs referred to bunker builds as tanks at least twice in the last AMA. The only things that make it appear as a lack of trinity, is no outright dedicated healers, and an rng agro table.

whipplerama.3692:

John Widdin.9618:

Among all the kitten flinging, I’m not sure if anyone has pointed out, there’s sort of a soft trinity.

Bruiser, Dps, Support

One Bruiser, and one support makes a world of difference in ease of the dungeon. Along with proper combo field usage.

This. I admit, I do get a giggle over the whole, “I love/hate the lack of trinity” when it hasn’t really gone anywhere. Even one of the devs referred to bunker builds as tanks at least twice in the last AMA. The only things that make it appear as a lack of trinity, is no outright dedicated healers, and an rng agro table.

And the lack of any real mechanics in boss fights.

Although they are trying to rectify that.

diabluz.2860:

In the long term the lack of the trinity makes instances and any other group play boring and shallow to say the least.

People aren’t forced to co operate and work together or strategize like in other mmo’s that we’ve all played in the past.

If you want people to continue playing this game for any length of time you need to bring back the trinity Anet.

You do realize that the vast majority plays GW2 exactly because it allows us to fill all roles instead of limiting us to one?

Boring and shallow is casting a tanking/DPS/healing rotation, to us.
If you find that to be the pinnacle of leet skill then I guess this is the least game you want to look after.

whipplerama.3692:

John Widdin.9618:

Among all the kitten flinging, I’m not sure if anyone has pointed out, there’s sort of a soft trinity.

Bruiser, Dps, Support

One Bruiser, and one support makes a world of difference in ease of the dungeon. Along with proper combo field usage.

This. I admit, I do get a giggle over the whole, “I love/hate the lack of trinity” when it hasn’t really gone anywhere. Even one of the devs referred to bunker builds as tanks at least twice in the last AMA. The only things that make it appear as a lack of trinity, is no outright dedicated healers, and an rng agro table.

It’s easy to slip into the parlance of the trinity (Tank, DPS, Healer) when they’re so fixed in the minds of developers and players as roles. How many of you build “a lil ‘tanky’” warrior? Or a “DPS” thief? I know someone who had a “healer” elementalist with water attunement.

While there is no classic trinity in this game, emulating it can get you far enough to succeed. It’s just not how the encounters are designed, to assume there’s a tank, DPS, and healer. It assumes there’s five players and balances accordingly.

diabluz, if you like the “trinity” so much go play a MMO that has it instead of demanding that GW2 change to it to suit you. There’s plenty of MMOs with the “trinity” out there so good luck and happy hunting.

Personally, I like the method in this game. No waiting forever and a day for a healer, or a tank, just put the group together and go.