I doubt the change will actually do anything. Surely there’ll be plenty of safe spots. I also wouldn’t be surprised if it screw over everyone else, since ArenaNet has habit of doing it.
The thing is, they could easily stop AFKers by simply requiring actual input every 10 seconds or so, otherwise loot is disabled, but that wouldn’t acually stop real bots. A generic solution would be crowd sourcing it, where you report the player and they have to solve a captcha within 3 minutes, otherwise loot is disabled until it is. This would also stop actual bots and could also be automated in cases of simple AFKing, but something like this would require development, so a proper solution is unlikely to happen.
And what about those of us that actually, honestly like to use turrets? Or necro minions? Should we simply never go into this area, because there’s now a mechanic that targets those specific skills? Can we get something that targets Greatsword users next, maybe?
I mean, they just finished nerfing my turrets. Now this? You know this is going to happen again in other places, how soon before I have to just give up using them at all?
(PS: I would have just put a new event there. If there were a bunch of people there AFK, the event would scale up and quickly wipe them out. If there were a bunch of NOT-AFK people there, then they would get to play out the event. Win/win.)
Sarcasm, delivered with a
delicate, brick-like subtlety.
I doubt the change will actually do anything. Surely there’ll be plenty of safe spots. I also wouldn’t be surprised if it screw over everyone else, since ArenaNet has habit of doing it.
The thing is, they could easily stop AFKers by simply requiring actual input every 10 seconds or so, otherwise loot is disabled, but that wouldn’t acually stop real bots. A generic solution would be crowd sourcing it, where you report the player and they have to solve a captcha within 3 minutes, otherwise loot is disabled until it is. This would also stop actual bots and could also be automated in cases of simple AFKing, but something like this would require development, so a proper solution is unlikely to happen.
Depends on whether it’s random fire or targeted. Also depends on where those safe spots are relative to where the centaurs spawn. Not much of an AFK farm if you have to pull centaurs to the turrets all the time.
As for bots, GMs already whisper players they suspect are bots and ban them if they don’t respond (botting being a ToS violation.) I haven’t ever done anything to make them question me, but I’m pretty sure they don’t have any trouble distinguishing a stock response from a bot from real people.
As to the OP, as far as I’ve noticed, while that sort of farming in BFF is a thing, I’ve never seen it go the the level of Lake Doric’s glue factory with 20-30 people standing all in the same exact area disrupting what other people are wanting to do in the area.
So much for the “But its intended to be farmed” argument.
I still have no intention to run around like a chicken for the Dev’s amusement. If I want stand in place and kill respawns, I’ll do just that.
Except, the leather farm isn’t down in the camp, it’s when you go up the hill and kill the centaurs there. So yes, it’s intended to be farmed, just the camp where all the engineers and their turrets are is not the place where the centaurs go who drop the leather. That engineer farm is just a regular loot farm, not a leather farm.
And i think A-net miss-diagnosed this. we’re not actually afk. We’re just not moving.
You can’t actually be afk there. You need to replace turrets fairly often.
I personally feel like they went the wrong way with how to handle this. But we’ll see how this will go.
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And i think A-net miss-diagnosed this. we’re not actually afk. We’re just not moving.
You can’t actually be afk there. You need to replace turrets fairly often.
I personally feel like they went the wrong way with how to handle this. But we’ll see how this will go.
Nevertheless, it’s a silly and boring gameplay which should be nuked from orbit.
The thing is, they could easily stop AFKers by simply requiring actual input every 10 seconds or so, otherwise loot is disabled, but that wouldn’t acually stop real bots. A generic solution would be crowd sourcing it, where you report the player and they have to solve a captcha within 3 minutes, otherwise loot is disabled until it is. This would also stop actual bots and could also be automated in cases of simple AFKing, but something like this would require development, so a proper solution is unlikely to happen.
I honestly still don’t get the problem with turret farm.
It’s… using your class skills? As intended? You drop a turret. Turrets are skills which happen to then attack on their own, but the damage is sourced from you. That’s… how they are supposed to work.
Basically I’m trying to say: Don’t add class skills which are specifically fire&entirely-forget-for-a-while if you then in turn don’t want players to, well, fire and forget about them. Or at least infract the developer who added them because if anything they’re responsible. Give them a temp ban or something.
The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.
So much for the “But its intended to be farmed” argument.
I still have no intention to run around like a chicken for the Dev’s amusement. If I want stand in place and kill respawns, I’ll do just that.
Well if that’s still possible, sure. If that’s amusement for you you’re free to do so. But still within the rules of the game. The devs already limited you in how high you jump how fast you walk and how much loot you get.
I just meant that half AFKing with turrets obviously wasn’t intended to be a thing.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
And i think A-net miss-diagnosed this. we’re not actually afk. We’re just not moving.
You can’t actually be afk there. You need to replace turrets fairly often.
I personally feel like they went the wrong way with how to handle this. But we’ll see how this will go.
Nevertheless, it’s a silly and boring gameplay which should be nuked from orbit.
To be honest, that is a really good description of the whole area, including the path up to the tower.
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
My two cents: BFF situation is worse than Doric farm (which is actually supposed to be a farm) and I’m surprised they took care of the latter before the former.
I’m sure something is going to be done to stop BFF as well. For now I just make the point of reporting every single AFK farmer on my daily berry run.
You can’t actually be afk there. You need to replace turrets fairly often.
This. Again, we’re getting this silly trebuchet thing because of the whiners who don’t even understand how this farm works. The ignorance is strong with this one.
My two cents: BFF situation is worse than Doric farm (which is actually supposed to be a farm) and I’m surprised they took care of the latter before the former.
I’m sure something is going to be done to stop BFF as well. For now I just make the point of reporting every single AFK farmer on my daily berry run.
Also, none of these zones have any value to the game beyond their story and maybe the odd item someone wants, if not for these farms.
If they’re not supposed to have that, why even have the zone be permanent? :s
The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.
My two cents: BFF situation is worse than Doric farm (which is actually supposed to be a farm) and I’m surprised they took care of the latter before the former.
I’m sure something is going to be done to stop BFF as well. For now I just make the point of reporting every single AFK farmer on my daily berry run.
Also, none of these zones have any value to the game beyond their story and maybe the odd item someone wants, if not for these farms.
If they’re not supposed to have that, why even have the zone be permanent? :s
The problem isn’t the farm. The farm is intended, in either case. The problem is the way it is farmed.
On the question of why these areas exist – as an easy way to get ascended trinkets.
My two cents: BFF situation is worse than Doric farm (which is actually supposed to be a farm) and I’m surprised they took care of the latter before the former.
I’m sure something is going to be done to stop BFF as well. For now I just make the point of reporting every single AFK farmer on my daily berry run.
Also, none of these zones have any value to the game beyond their story and maybe the odd item someone wants, if not for these farms.
If they’re not supposed to have that, why even have the zone be permanent? :s
MAYBE the odd item? Have you actually looked at the vendors? I will be going back there for quite awhile to outfit all of my alts with ascended trinkets.
I hate the change, rather than punishing the stationary farmers, it also punishes the legit or willing farmers (the ones that actually play). instead of punishing EVERYONE, they should have based their punishment on a trait that is specific for the problem: standing still in one spot for a long time. This could’ve been solved by arrow rains which kill people. a constant rain of small, random AoEs would filter out bots and people who stand still in one spot too long
“The farm was designed to be braindead and boring, so I made sure to figure out an even easier and more boring way of farming it. It is also something I can and quite often do, even on multiple accounts and simultaniously. People don’t understand how this works. They need to stop their whining and let me do it!”
There was seriously nothing wrong with that?
Anything that people can do on multiple accounts, at the same time and with very little effort on their part shouldn’t be allowed. Neither should they be able to “play” their partner’s or friend’s account in there while they take part in any other content with their own account. ArenaNet shouldn’t allow anything that might lead to multiboxing and eventual botting in due time.
Please don’t act as if this farm was nothing more than a few people who liked to be semi-afk with one character while they did some work or watched a movie. You might have limited it to that, others certainly did not.
You know, as someone with an engineering mind and approach to problems, reading the patch note, the first thought I had was “challenge accepted!”, the second was “bring it on!”
I’m not playing an Engineer and I wouldn’t waste my precious time there, but I’m curious how they will counter this. Those people play engineers for a reason, and trying to overcome the barrier ArenaNet will set up is fun.
As for bots, GMs already whisper players they suspect are bots and ban them if they don’t respond (botting being a ToS violation.) I haven’t ever done anything to make them question me, but I’m pretty sure they don’t have any trouble distinguishing a stock response from a bot from real people.
I’m not sure, have talked with many engineers, and quite often, I cannot tell if they are bots or humans.
Hypothermia: Not moving for long periods of time, maybe 1 minute each stack, will cause your damage and conditions to do 25% less and you’ll also take 25% more (This would also affect all minions and pets). They should also (and this is a fix I wanted for a long time anyway) make it so that minions cannot attack anything until you actively attack. They could also put in roaming champ enemies that use a long knockback AoE skill to either kill botters or knock them away from where they’re at.
I hate the change, rather than punishing the stationary farmers, it also punishes the legit or willing farmers (the ones that actually play). instead of punishing EVERYONE, they should have based their punishment on a trait that is specific for the problem: standing still in one spot for a long time. This could’ve been solved by arrow rains which kill people. a constant rain of small, random AoEs would filter out bots and people who stand still in one spot too long
Yeah, stupid centaurs and their trebuchets, why punish all their enemies. xD
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
I hate the change, rather than punishing the stationary farmers, it also punishes the legit or willing farmers (the ones that actually play). instead of punishing EVERYONE, they should have based their punishment on a trait that is specific for the problem: standing still in one spot for a long time. This could’ve been solved by arrow rains which kill people. a constant rain of small, random AoEs would filter out bots and people who stand still in one spot too long
Yeah, stupid centaurs and their trebuchets, why punish all their enemies. xD
yea, I just read the patch note (after this) turns out the increased respawn rate was a temporary fix until the new fix. The new fix sounds a lot better. So you can dismiss my rant, as it was for the first fix which will be changed now
Can we get something that targets Greatsword users next, maybe?
As funny as it would be to have a raid boss that does increased damage for every stack of Might on a player . . Still wouldn’t kill the FG/PS meta. :P
Meanwhile, I laughed at the “solution” to Lake Doric. Innovative, but mean.
The more I think about it, though, the less I feel that this was a solution built with good design entirely in mind.
Many alts; handle it!
“I’m finding companies should sell access to forums,
it seems many like them better than the games they comment on.” -Horrorscope.7632
They actually did end up banning people in the pirate karma vendor case. And for the most part only the players that got banned were angry.
Not that these cases are equivalent – that one was a clear exploit of a dev mistake, while BFF is just a case of creative use of class mechanics (like the turret farm was).
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
So, I got the patch and logged in and ran over to watch the fireworks, and OMG was it lovely. No turret is safe in the camp, up the hill, at the top… but those pesky AFKer’s are working their lazy little heads to come up with a solution. Great job ANET!
14 level 80s All races/professions
Server-Blackgate, are there others?
Some must fight, so that all may be free. —Amora Soulkeeper.
Anything that people can do on multiple accounts, at the same time and with very little effort on their part shouldn’t be allowed. Neither should they be able to “play” their partner’s or friend’s account in there while they take part in any other content with their own account. ArenaNet shouldn’t allow anything that might lead to multiboxing and eventual botting in due time.
Second, as for your “Anything that can be done on multiple accounts at the same time…” comment, you mean like the Troll Runestone HP in Tangled Depths? I happened to be “multiboxing” last night in TD – I’d left toons from both accounts at the flax farm the night before, when someone popped up in map chat and asked for help. Since my alt didn’t have that point, I went and helped, and managed to get both accounts there in time. Then, after it was done and everyone took off, I hung out and did a little inventory management. On both accounts. And a necro showed up and needed the point. So I dropped a banner, popped my stone spirit, and told him to kick it off. And proceeded to help him take the troll down pretty quickly. Actively using BOTH accounts to do it. AND NO, I didn’t use any special macros or key binds that let me do actions on both accounts simultaneously – all my clicks and key presses were specific to each account’s game window at the time they were executed.
The fact is, multiboxing allows me to gather the resources to build up my guild hall – which I’m doing nearly solo for a guild with about 10 active accounts – and lets me play professions and try out ideas that I wouldn’t otherwise have the resources to do. Just look at the quartz crystals needed for a guild hall. It’s north of 15,000. Just for the ley-line infused tools. You go do that on one account.
Anything that people can do on multiple accounts, at the same time and with very little effort on their part shouldn’t be allowed. Neither should they be able to “play” their partner’s or friend’s account in there while they take part in any other content with their own account. ArenaNet shouldn’t allow anything that might lead to multiboxing and eventual botting in due time.
Second, as for your “Anything that can be done on multiple accounts at the same time…” comment, you mean like the Troll Runestone HP in Tangled Depths? I happened to be “multiboxing” last night in TD – I’d left toons from both accounts at the flax farm the night before, when someone popped up in map chat and asked for help. Since my alt didn’t have that point, I went and helped, and managed to get both accounts there in time. Then, after it was done and everyone took off, I hung out and did a little inventory management. On both accounts. And a necro showed up and needed the point. So I dropped a banner, popped my stone spirit, and told him to kick it off. And proceeded to help him take the troll down pretty quickly. Actively using BOTH accounts to do it. AND NO, I didn’t use any special macros or key binds that let me do actions on both accounts simultaneously – all my clicks and key presses were specific to each account’s game window at the time they were executed.
I think the key factor in this case is the “very little effort” part of Henry’s statement. Juggle two accounts that require steady interaction is very different than playing one account while others passively collect loot during long periods of inactivity, broken up by a few keypresses every 5 minutes. The latter is functionally very similar to botting, while your example is a feat of multitasking that takes considerably more effort than normal play. Even using multiple accounts to gather nodes doesn’t give you loot while those accounts are not being interacted with.
Footsteps Of War [FoW] | Yak’s Bend
Seer Of The Divine | Sarina Starlight | Tireasa | Caedyra
This change made me happy. It is nice to see Anet trying to prevent game mechanic abuses atlast.
My question is… What will you do about Bitter Frost Frontier Necro AFK Farming ?
Also many other minor zones.
I noticed the same, in the same spot, when I went there this morning, it now looks even more stupid having a tonne of them stacked on the top of the gate! I hope Anet notice and extend the treb range.
Yes, and why do you care? There is NOTHING against the rules about doing this. Stepping away from your computer for a little bit at a time is okay. While farming often people need to use restroom, check dinner, he a parent, etc. Sometimes those just involve a quick ark of one or two minutes, or even longer. There has been a LOT of discussion in the past about that and it has been determined to be okay per A Net.
Going afk is not bannable unless it becomes chronic.
“He shall make whole that which was torn asunder.
Restore that which was lost. And all shall be as one.”
“Going afk is not bannable unless it becomes chronic.”
Chronic: (of an illness) persisting for a long time or constantly recurring.
That is EXACTLY the description of the engi farm. I mean, aside from the illness part I guess. I think the anti-farm side might disagree with me, but it’s not an actual illness like a cold or something. But the point is, there are a lot of people doing literally nothing but occupying a map 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Literally “persisting for a long time or constantly recurring”.
You might want to re-word your argument.
Leader and sole member of the “Bring Penguins to Tyria” movement.
Right, and thats not okay. I was referring mostly to those that do it for an hour or two. They will never be banned since again ANet has said that there is nothing wrong with going afk to check dinner or be a parent.
Besides, people occupying maps aren’t afk 24hours a day since the afk timer logs people out. So I’m still not convinced anyone doing it is breaking any rules. If A GM whispers someone they even allow a few minutes before taking action for the reason listed above. At least that’s what I’ve learned from reading about these experiences.
“He shall make whole that which was torn asunder.
Restore that which was lost. And all shall be as one.”
I don’t think banning them was ever really part of the equation. They just wanted a fix to the farm so it isn’t exploited. The rules are intentionally very vague, and it’s true that no rules were technically violated, but a huge number of people were concerned about this very legal exploit and demanded a fix. It was fixed. No one was banned, just no longer able to exploit a design.
Leader and sole member of the “Bring Penguins to Tyria” movement.
I see nothing wrong with what was done. The loot gain is slow, compared to groups that run up the mountain, so it’s very low risk for low reward compared to that alternative. The only problem would be if it was more profitable, or even equal.
“He shall make whole that which was torn asunder.
Restore that which was lost. And all shall be as one.”
It’s time for the centaurs to go: The cannons have been adjusted. This time, we’ll bring them down…for good! and Time to see who’s really king of the hill.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Yes, and why do you care? There is NOTHING against the rules about doing this. Stepping away from your computer for a little bit at a time is okay. While farming often people need to use restroom, check dinner, he a parent, etc. Sometimes those just involve a quick ark of one or two minutes, or even longer. There has been a LOT of discussion in the past about that and it has been determined to be okay per A Net.
Going afk is not bannable unless it becomes chronic.
Oh come on.
Yes, RL interruptions happen all the time. Get to a safe space quickly if you can. If you have time to deploy turrets you do not have that excuse though.
Yes, and why do you care? There is NOTHING against the rules about doing this. Stepping away from your computer for a little bit at a time is okay. While farming often people need to use restroom, check dinner, he a parent, etc. Sometimes those just involve a quick ark of one or two minutes, or even longer. There has been a LOT of discussion in the past about that and it has been determined to be okay per A Net.
Going afk is not bannable unless it becomes chronic.
I don’t think people stepping AFK for a restroom break typically meet up with 30 other bathroom go’ers, who all happen to play engis, and drop a army of turrets. This is not, and is not comparable to, an incidental AFK break that players happen to occasionally need. It’s exploiting the turret’s duration and ability independently target/attack to gain loot without actively playing the game, and there is no point in pretending it’s anything but that. And Anet has already decided it is not acceptable, and are actively combating it.
Maybe the rest of us should have asked Anet to add in a ‘5 minute auto-play’ button so we can all keep on collecting loot while we’re not playing the game. I’m sure you’ll see nothing wrong with that, as it’s not any different than what was/is happening in Lake Doric
Footsteps Of War [FoW] | Yak’s Bend
Seer Of The Divine | Sarina Starlight | Tireasa | Caedyra
Yes, and why do you care? There is NOTHING against the rules about doing this. Stepping away from your computer for a little bit at a time is okay. While farming often people need to use restroom, check dinner, he a parent, etc. Sometimes those just involve a quick ark of one or two minutes, or even longer. There has been a LOT of discussion in the past about that and it has been determined to be okay per A Net.
Going afk is not bannable unless it becomes chronic.
Oh come on.
Yes, RL interruptions happen all the time. Get to a safe space quickly if you can. If you have time to deploy turrets you do not have that excuse though.
In this case, nothing safer than being surrounded by turrets and people. If my child is in screaming pain I’m not gonna run to a safe spot I’m gonna bolt from my computer asap.
“He shall make whole that which was torn asunder.
Restore that which was lost. And all shall be as one.”
In this case, nothing safer than being surrounded by turrets and people. If my child is in screaming pain I’m not gonna run to a safe spot I’m gonna bolt from my computer asap.
You mean, You’re going to bolt from your PC, return after 5 minutes, bolt back run to your child again, return after another 5 minutes etc.
At least, that given that your child is in screaming pain every 5 minutes or other chores arise, you might want to just turn your computer off and take care of your child or other business.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Anything that people can do on multiple accounts, at the same time and with very little effort on their part shouldn’t be allowed. Neither should they be able to “play” their partner’s or friend’s account in there while they take part in any other content with their own account. ArenaNet shouldn’t allow anything that might lead to multiboxing and eventual botting in due time.
Second, as for your “Anything that can be done on multiple accounts at the same time…” comment, you mean like the Troll Runestone HP in Tangled Depths? I happened to be “multiboxing” last night in TD – I’d left toons from both accounts at the flax farm the night before, when someone popped up in map chat and asked for help. Since my alt didn’t have that point, I went and helped, and managed to get both accounts there in time. Then, after it was done and everyone took off, I hung out and did a little inventory management. On both accounts. And a necro showed up and needed the point. So I dropped a banner, popped my stone spirit, and told him to kick it off. And proceeded to help him take the troll down pretty quickly. Actively using BOTH accounts to do it. AND NO, I didn’t use any special macros or key binds that let me do actions on both accounts simultaneously – all my clicks and key presses were specific to each account’s game window at the time they were executed.
The fact is, multiboxing allows me to gather the resources to build up my guild hall – which I’m doing nearly solo for a guild with about 10 active accounts – and lets me play professions and try out ideas that I wouldn’t otherwise have the resources to do. Just look at the quartz crystals needed for a guild hall. It’s north of 15,000. Just for the ley-line infused tools. You go do that on one account.
People who are against legitimate multiboxing either don’t understand, or are jealous because you can do something they can’t.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
