Guild Wars 2

Will the Legendary stats ever get pass ascended? I already crafted my 4th Legendary and i feel that it takes too much effort to do so if all it gives is ascended stats with a nice effect. Shouldnt the effort of crafting a Legendary be like increased stats?

Absolutely not. They are intentionally on par with the highest stats, they are purely for skins, animations and changeable stats on the fly. That makes them a luxury, not an essential gain, which they would be if stats increased.

To give them increased stats would go against their design and upset an enormous number of people who came to GW2 to avoid stat treadmills. After the uproar caused by Ascended, the game does not need more treadmills

Randulf.7614:

Absolutely not. They are intentionally on par with the highest stats, they are purely for skins, animations and changeable stats on the fly. That makes them a luxury, not an essential gain, which they would be if stats increased.

To give them increased stats would go against their design and upset an enormous number of people who came to GW2 to avoid stat treadmills. After the uproar caused by Ascended, the game does not need more treadmills

I would hardly call Ascended a treadmill, its one tier gear. I really hate when people use the term “treadmill” out of context.

But on topic, as someone who has crafted more then 4 legendaries, no, the stats do not need to be any higher then ascended gear.

Also speaking as someone who has created more than 4 legendary weapons: Absolutely NO TY, leave stats where they are.

Even if the stats were 1 point higher than ascended, it would lead to the neurotic minmaxers demanding ‘full leg ping gear or kick’. Legendaries are fine as they are.

Some ppl just have to feel better than others.

Erron.8976:

Will the Legendary stats ever get pass ascended? I already crafted my 4th Legendary and i feel that it takes too much effort to do so if all it gives is ascended stats with a nice effect. Shouldnt the effort of crafting a Legendary be like increased stats?

So the fact that you can change the stats of a legendary when out of combat isn’t worth the effort? Doing that with Ascended weapons would require MORE gold and effort than any legendary

They might one day get an increase, but it’s unlikely.

When Anet introduced ascended weapons and upgraded legendaries from exotic to ascended stats they promised that Legendaries would always be equal to the highest tier. So if they ever add anything better than ascended weapons legendaries will get their stats increased to match.

But they haven’t even suggested they would do that. One of the major aims of GW2 (and GW1) is to avoid introducing a gear treadmill where new tiers are regularly introduced and people who previously had top tier equipment have to go and get a whole new set.

They introduced ascended because exotics (the previous top tier) proved to be so easy to get that many people were disappointed with it and wanted something harder to work towards after reaching level 80. But they deliberately made it optional (by balancing everything except high level fractals around exotics) so people who weren’t interested in that wouldn’t need to get it.

Ascended was first introduced in November 2012, became a complete set in December 2013. Since then they’ve not added any new tiers and have explicitly said there will not be any when HoT is released.

The other important point is they also said legendaries will always be equal to the top tier, never better than it. So even if a new tier is introduced there will still be other weapons with the same stats that are (probably) easier to get.

If you like the skin and/or the ability to switch stats you get a legendary. If not then you get ascended (or even just exotics). That’s how it’s intended to work.

As others have already pointed out, Anet has stated that legendaries will always be equal to the top tier, which I feel is exactly how it should be (owner of 5+ legendaries). These are cosmetic rewards with the additional convenience of freely exchangeable stats.

Which is also a good thing cuz u can then just use the legendary skins on several alts that uses the same variant, “only” as ascended weapons.

Having a shiny legendary is enough morale boost in combat, especially for us who play Skin Wars 2

If legendary stats bypasses ascended stats, then the gap between exotic and legendary will be to high like the gap between rare and ascended + then gw2 will look like a p2w model wich is lame.

Talyn.3295:

Randulf.7614:

Absolutely not. They are intentionally on par with the highest stats, they are purely for skins, animations and changeable stats on the fly. That makes them a luxury, not an essential gain, which they would be if stats increased.

To give them increased stats would go against their design and upset an enormous number of people who came to GW2 to avoid stat treadmills. After the uproar caused by Ascended, the game does not need more treadmills

I would hardly call Ascended a treadmill, its one tier gear. I really hate when people use the term “treadmill” out of context.

But on topic, as someone who has crafted more then 4 legendaries, no, the stats do not need to be any higher then ascended gear.

Understand: this game was released with EXOTIC being top tier… the fact most begun with rare armor and slowly adapted to exotic which made everythung faceroll caused some nerfs.. Even legendaries had exotic values as main stats…. no AR no nothing

then people said well exotic is SO EASY to get can’t we farm for an higher tier,

It happened, ascended jewelry was released with fractals…
After the jewelry followed weapons and soon later armor, Legendary stats were improved with the promise they’d always be comparable to the top stat available in the game, which would be ascended

The introduction of ascended made a lot of people happy they could make a ‘end game armor" and made many more people upset as this was to be a game of “horizontal” progression, so |A-net statedf it wouldn’t launch any new tiers with stat values above ascended….

Now legendary backs are coming to us, I’d expect legendary trinkets as well, the stats will be selectable but level comparable to ascended…. why? see bold part

In the future I’d expect:

• ascended & legendary foods ?
• legendary armor (e.g. ascneded level; selectable stats)
• legendary trinkets, ( back has been anounced)

most of this gear is part of a gear treadmill especially if you’ve been playing since head start. Though in no way as bad as most other (MMO)RPG’s

During the first months requirements (gear expected in AC)

was rare armor & weapon with runes, and preferably exotic trinkets.
If you had no runes Ruby orbs were no problem

This changed to Exotic only, and gear checks for exotic, the fact people ran ruby orbs was tolerated less and less.

This changed into gear checks for ZERK ruby orbs were now and obscure part of the playerbase …

This changed into gear checks for “Meta” with ascneded trinkets and weapon preferably and in some cases even asc armor….

As legendary armor and trinkets wil add no stats it will likely shift to the previous step ncluding the armor being mandatory in 1 yr, maybe 18 months.

This requirement is in the end rediculous as armor and stats are being downscaled ANYWAYS leaving you with a cap comparable to rare armor with lvl 80 runes and lvl 80 trinkets downscaled to the correct level values in AC… rendering everything above exotic mostly a waste of time.

Still gear checks are bing performed, mostly to show people are above others.

As it is now
I have 2 characters with full ascneded armor, 1 has 2 full armors
I have 4 characters with 2 or more ascended armor pieces
I have 1 character with 1 ascended armor piece
I have 13 characters with full ascended weapons (all weapons for the main sets) sometimes secondary weapons are stille Exotic
I have 15 characters with 1 or more sets of jewelry and trinkets I also have 15 ascneded back items….
only 14 use their ascened as theirmain treinket sets (I have 1 character with exotic zealot trinkets due to the fact I still cannot buy asnceded ones.)
I expect some trinkets to trinkle down to the unfortunates not having trinkets… or armor…. but I’m not working fanatically to get legendaries as is. maybe in the future…

I do not need mandatory stat change to restart on soon to be 17 alts.

Even ascended is too much, I chose Guild Wars 2 because at the beginning there was no grinding for gear, most of my friends have 1 ascended or nothing and there’s a 10% difference. What was wrong with no gear only skill, what’s so funny about a blacksmith simulator? Crafting legendaries and Mawdrey is for people with auti##, when I saw the crafting list for these items it made me dizzy, I don’t know how people don’t get lost in this.

PaxTheGreatOne.9472:

Talyn.3295:

Randulf.7614:

Absolutely not. They are intentionally on par with the highest stats, they are purely for skins, animations and changeable stats on the fly. That makes them a luxury, not an essential gain, which they would be if stats increased.

To give them increased stats would go against their design and upset an enormous number of people who came to GW2 to avoid stat treadmills. After the uproar caused by Ascended, the game does not need more treadmills

I would hardly call Ascended a treadmill, its one tier gear. I really hate when people use the term “treadmill” out of context.

But on topic, as someone who has crafted more then 4 legendaries, no, the stats do not need to be any higher then ascended gear.

Understand: this game was released with EXOTIC being top tier… the fact most begun with rare armor and slowly adapted to exotic which made everythung faceroll caused some nerfs.. Even legendaries had exotic values as main stats…. no AR no nothing

then people said well exotic is SO EASY to get can’t we farm for an higher tier,

It happened, ascended jewelry was released with fractals…
After the jewelry followed weapons and soon later armor, Legendary stats were improved with the promise they’d always be comparable to the top stat available in the game, which would be ascended

The introduction of ascended made a lot of people happy they could make a ‘end game armor" and made many more people upset as this was to be a game of “horizontal” progression, so |A-net statedf it wouldn’t launch any new tiers with stat values above ascended….

Now legendary backs are coming to us, I’d expect legendary trinkets as well, the stats will be selectable but level comparable to ascended…. why? see bold part

In the future I’d expect:

• ascended & legendary foods ?
• legendary armor (e.g. ascneded level; selectable stats)
• legendary trinkets, ( back has been anounced)

most of this gear is part of a gear treadmill especially if you’ve been playing since head start. Though in no way as bad as most other (MMO)RPG’s

During the first months requirements (gear expected in AC)

was rare armor & weapon with runes, and preferably exotic trinkets.
If you had no runes Ruby orbs were no problem

This changed to Exotic only, and gear checks for exotic, the fact people ran ruby orbs was tolerated less and less.

This changed into gear checks for ZERK ruby orbs were now and obscure part of the playerbase …

This changed into gear checks for “Meta” with ascneded trinkets and weapon preferably and in some cases even asc armor….

As legendary armor and trinkets wil add no stats it will likely shift to the previous step ncluding the armor being mandatory in 1 yr, maybe 18 months.

This requirement is in the end rediculous as armor and stats are being downscaled ANYWAYS leaving you with a cap comparable to rare armor with lvl 80 runes and lvl 80 trinkets downscaled to the correct level values in AC… rendering everything above exotic mostly a waste of time.

Still gear checks are bing performed, mostly to show people are above others.

As it is now
I have 2 characters with full ascneded armor, 1 has 2 full armors
I have 4 characters with 2 or more ascended armor pieces
I have 1 character with 1 ascended armor piece
I have 13 characters with full ascended weapons (all weapons for the main sets) sometimes secondary weapons are stille Exotic
I have 15 characters with 1 or more sets of jewelry and trinkets I also have 15 ascneded back items….
only 14 use their ascened as theirmain treinket sets (I have 1 character with exotic zealot trinkets due to the fact I still cannot buy asnceded ones.)
I expect some trinkets to trinkle down to the unfortunates not having trinkets… or armor…. but I’m not working fanatically to get legendaries as is. maybe in the future…

I do not need mandatory stat change to restart on soon to be 17 alts.

/sigh

I am well aware that when the game released Exotic was the best. However adding one tier of gear to a game does not make it a treadmill.

A treadmill is:

Oh I got rare gear. this is the best in slot

2 months later -> new content. New gear added exotics

Oh boy! I got exotic. Best in slot.

3 months later -> New content. New gear added ascended

Oh boy I got Ascended New gear best in slot!

6 months later -> New Content. New Gear Mystic gear

etc etc etc.

Each time you have to get that new tier of gear as the old set has become obsolete.
This has not happened in GW2. As exotic is still good enough for everything but very high level fractals. As I have heard Ascended was supposed to be in before launch, but didn’t make it so we started with exotic.

Regardless as if this was the case or not. One new Tier is not a gear treadmill.

Every treadmill started with a single step.
“It was always supposed to be there”, why didn’t they tell us?
Why let us believe exotic was the top there would be if they knew ascended was right around the corner? I cannot imagine they didn’t realize how angry people would be to see a new tier of gear so soon for a game they believed was above that.

But for lulz lets say that was true, they’ve still worked smaller treadmills into the game. One of the biggest things was that stats wouldn’t be a grind, that would be the realm of cosmetics.
And yet new stat sets are often added with considerable cost/grind to get them.
Sentinel should not have been dumped behind a limited time material.
Celestial should not have been stuck behind a time gated (and sometimes less available) material.
Sinister, again, behind the same time gated material.

They’ve turned adding new stat sets into lateral treadmills.
And they shouldn’t be, new stat sets should be as readily available as any average set, and the grinding left for new skins
*Crafts stat set A"
They add stat set B
“Oh set B fits my build better than A, so if I want my character to function better I need B”
They add C, which fits even better than B, etc
They “get away with it” because they can argue, well it’s not required.
That does not excuse ridiculous grind placed in front of new stat sets.
None of that is meaningful, its just a cheap way of artificially extending playtime.
Like all good treadmills.

ScribeTheMad.7614:

lulz

A gear tread mill has two key factors

1) New Tiers are continually added. -Hasn’t happened
2) Each new Tier invalidates previous tiers. -Hasn’t happened

Stat choices aside, the fact my warrior is still using the exact same exotic greatsword I purchased for him shortly after hitting 80 almost three years ago now, invalidates your entire argument. It is just as viable today as it was then, despite the ascended introduction to the game.

Peace

Talyn.3295:

ScribeTheMad.7614:

lulz

A gear tread mill has two key factors

1) New Tiers are continually added. -Hasn’t happened
2) Each new Tier invalidates previous tiers. -Hasn’t happened

Stat choices aside, the fact my warrior is still using the exact same exotic greatsword I purchased for him shortly after hitting 80 almost three years ago now, invalidates your entire argument. It is just as viable today as it was then, despite the ascended introduction to the game.

Peace

Don’t confuse incompetence as intentional design. We know for a fact that these stats, when first added, were theoretically better then most existing compositions for at least half the classes in the game.

The incompetence is the fact that these new combo never lived up to their potential, because of the Dev’s reluctance at fixing the underlying mechanics that would make them work. Condition damage was broken for how long? Only now (after Sinister stats were released) had they tried to fix what was holding them back from fulfilling their intended function within the build meta. And yet, despite the intent of the rework, they waffled on several decisions that made condi damage even less scalable then it was before. Any theoretical advantage was then lost, as the combined damage of TWO whole damage vectors couldn’t even come close to the scalability of the one vector that is direct damage, despite that vector having the most counter elements.

When the game launched, Toughness as a stat didn’t even work. I can’t even remember when it was fixed in relation to when the first batch of LS events came out that added new prefixes to the game. There are still SEVERAL prefixes which are exclusive to a handfull of items, many of which aren’t even exotic, or can only be obtained via deprecated prefix items that got stat selection to back fill.

Just because its not vertical, doesn’t mean its not a treadmill. The fact that we’re constantly encouraged to pursue them, putting inordinate amounts of work into obtaining, and then having to repeat the process again in the hopes that the next prefix might do what it theoretically should….. Thats what makes a treadmill.

starlinvf.1358:

Don’t confuse incompetence as intentional design. We know for a fact that these stats, when first added, were theoretically better then most existing compositions for at least half the classes in the game.

For the which profesions was Zealot’s, Sentinel’s, Nomad’s, or Sinister theoretically better for? You can’t mean PVE; the first 2 have defensive stats in them, and Nomad’s is extremely defensive, which has NEVER been considered theoretically better in PVE.

Miku.6297:

starlinvf.1358:

Don’t confuse incompetence as intentional design. We know for a fact that these stats, when first added, were theoretically better then most existing compositions for at least half the classes in the game.

For the which profesions was Zealot’s, Sentinel’s, Nomad’s, or Sinister theoretically better for? You can’t mean PVE; the first 2 have defensive stats in them, and Nomad’s is extremely defensive, which has NEVER been considered theoretically better in PVE.

All 4 of them? Guardian should had been obvious. But like I pointed out, they never lived up to their potential as a useful stat. The reasons Zerks is Meta, and the reason we keep going back to it, is because it actually scales correctly.

On the theoretical side, Zealots and Sentinel’s should had allowed for mixing defensive stats into offensive main builds. But they didn’t add enough defense to make up the power loss from crit scaling. Zealots is arguably the most viable of the 4 for Guardians- But ultimately there was no reason once people realized 550 Healing power (traits + armor) accounted for no more then a 15% boost in actual HP gain from most healing related skills/traits.

Nomads is a mechanically more efficient version of clerics gear, and sinister should had boosted the Guardian’s burn potential by a significant amount without sacrificing direct damage. But even with recent condi change, Sinisters seems to roughly break even against Zerk builds, being lower in short fights, breaking even in medium length fights, and possibly gaining in long fights. But thats assuming you can maintain ideal condi uptime. It should had been perfect for Engineers, since they hybrid condi by design…. but that doesn’t show gains unless you can maintain perfect rotations.

Randulf.7614:

Absolutely not. They are intentionally on par with the highest stats, they are purely for skins, animations and changeable stats on the fly. That makes them a luxury, not an essential gain, which they would be if stats increased.

To give them increased stats would go against their design and upset an enormous number of people who came to GW2 to avoid stat treadmills. After the uproar caused by Ascended, the game does not need more treadmills

They will go pass ascended when ANet decides to add another tier. Whether or not ANet has enough creatively to keep people playing without having to resort to the tried and true gear treadmill remains to be seen.

starlinvf.1358:

All 4 of them? Guardian should had been obvious. But like I pointed out, they never lived up to their potential as a useful stat. The reasons Zerks is Meta, and the reason we keep going back to it, is because it actually scales correctly.

I’m sorry I just don’t understand, even if defense scaled right… Unneeded defense in a game where there is no trinity, and DPS is king is still unneeded. I just don’t see how armor that is geared for defensive use would be better in the PVE environment.

I was under the impression the reason zerker was meta is DPS is king, we don’t need defensive stats in PVE. So if it’s not making you kill faster it’s just slowing you down.

The OP’s question was whether ANet would change the stats on legendaries to surpass that of Ascended. The answer is: no.

• By definition, legendaries will always have the same stats as the best-in-game weapons.
• By proclamation, ascended will remain best-in-game.
• Therefore, legendaries will never have different stats from ascended.

Of course, if something dramatic happened that the game required another tier, legendary stats would be raised to match. However, the community doesn’t want that and ANet doesn’t want it either, so it’s hard to imagine the scenario in which that could be true.

Most of the rest of the thread is a discussion (or argument) about the definition of gear grind and is, in my opinion, off topic to the question. Whether the game has gear grind or not is moot: legendaries will always match best-in-game stats, not exceed them.

Basic 1-80 100%
Fine 1-80 125%
Masterwork 14-80 135%
Rare 30-80 145%
Exotic 62-80 165%
Ascended 80 175%
Legendary 80 175%, (stat change)

Levels do not change, so the gear is never invalidated
But due to nerfs rare gear which was once enough to run most dungeons is now ~10 % weaker compared to the games launch (ferocity nerf, critical chance nerf, scaling nerf…)~effectively lowering all tiers of gear … or intensifying the crafting process, however you look at it..

Basic 1-80 90%
Fine 1-80 115%
Masterwork 14-80 125%
Rare 30-80 135%
Exotic 62-80 155%
Ascended 80 165%
Legendary 80 165%, (stat change)

Is the actual effects from the now compensated values as compared to the stats at launch (as people used then) are the same +30% from the stat compensation from the 23 june patch…(which was a nerf to certain stats as well (healing, and the 2 durations have been affected negatively…)

Ascended made players OP when it was first released, this has been patched…
So it looks the same stats look 30% bettter since launch but almost all their effects have been reduced… due to this having place on all stats you can not say things were invalidated, but you can safely say all tiers have been downscaled 1 level.