Guild Wars 2

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

That people are angry, I do get that but what makes me sad is that there are so many rude people who are cursing and blaming Anet for being all kind of monsters without any facts and to little information.

That’s because Anet hasn’t provided any facts or information. People want accountability when promises aren’t kept. What was the real allocation of resources on the legendary weapons project? How many of the weapons have been worked on and what percentage of ready are they? There is NO WAY a team has taken 5+ months to only have 1 weapon to show for it. If so the management of that team is way off kilter because to finish the rest of the weapons would take another 4 and a half years!!! At some point someone managing them would have had to step up and say – ‘What in the world are you guys doing?! You need help or what?!’

What information we do have is that Anet have allocated the majority of their resources to working on the next expansion without fulfilling the promises they made for the current one; which isn’t even cold in the ground yet before they are starting to lop off features bit by bit. So yeah you could say people are a little mad and for good reason.

Pretty much everyone loves this game. But that doesn’t mean people enjoy being lied to or sold a pig in a poke. Be sure though that many players who are feeling burned on this and other issues with HOT will be inspecting Anet’s next pig very carefully before buying.

Well a new thread for this post was indeed not needed but it is a rather good post in my opinion. You state why it bothers you and you are not rude in anyway.

Though what I see the community is expressing is mostly that they have been lied to, not that Legendaries will be shut down indefinitely .

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

I too can’t understand why some are so angry for this but what I do understand is that alot of people are angry becouse they backed down on a promise. It could have been the raid, it could have been the LW it could have been any content that Anet has promised to deliver as a part of the Expac and everyone would have been angry with them. Legendaries is probably the least hard hitting promise that they could have terminated, but there are some people who like this kind of content and bought HoT mostly for the sake of Legendary weapons.

That people are angry, I do get that but what makes me sad is that there are so many rude people who are cursing and blaming Anet for being all kind of monsters without any facts and to little information.

I’m not angry. I had high hopes for and had already started gathering materials for the new legendary dagger and longbow, since I don’t like the gen1 ones. New legendaries was a big part of why I bought the expansion. Now they’re scrapping advertised content while a majority of devs are working on the NEXT expansion.
For me this is about trust. After this, I don’t trust this company any more. I’ll still play the game since I love it, but from here on I won’t believe anything they say.

White Hunter.3416:

You’ll get another LS episode. It is a good compensation.
Cmon, does the another useless gold sink more important than story?

We’ll get the living story at least in july lol, what are you going to do untill then, replay the same 4 maps again and again and again?

I really applaud that this tough decision has been made public. As I’ve said many times on these forums, I’d rather have new, playable content than skins any time.

Though it’s cynical, I still feel that folks who believed all the hype leading up to HoT either hadn’t played the game since launch, had never played GW1 or simply were oblivious to how the game had been progressing before HoT. I’d love to say I believed the expansion would deliver a wealth of new, playable content; but, I can’t truthfully say that.

I can say that I hope Mo & Co. deliver more fun than we’ve seen in the past 6-12 months, as Mo appears to be interested in doing. The amount of grind and “waiting to start having fun” that’s been introduced into the game of late has me casting about for other things to do with my time.

What I find most interesting about all this is how a company with over 300 employees can become more productive by reassigning 6 employees. I think that’s a form of Mesmer magic, perhaps Ethereal Burden: “Target player progresses 50% slower. End effect—6 Anet employees gain energy.” (May have the skill description off a bit since the last time I used it).

Sinzaku.2980:

Werdx.2059:

I need to say something which bothers me a lot in past weeks

I crafted Nevermoore.I had no last 2 mastery lines in Legendary crafting.That’s 15 Tyria mastery points.

I had no HoT maps completed,nor i had any of ascanded materials map rewards as Sparks,Crstal ores,Airship Parts…

I did not have 2500 gold,i had 1400,after almost 20 days of farming.

But let me tell you something,not counting those 20 days of gold farming,i managed to craft legendary item,and to complete all 4 maps with 4x 250x ascended materials in 10 days and farmed 16 mastery points.Played 3 hours each day.

Now when we cleared that out,do not dare to tell me its not possible to get legendary items,do not dare…Before i started 250 ascended mats collection,i was looking at some topics where people complain how hard is to get those,i was afraid AF…I understood those materials are not impossible to get…When i started collection,i was getting 20-40 ascended materials per meta,and i could not believe how many lazy people there are…

Everyone wants everything without effort…It comes down to simple thing,if you want it,you can get it.If you want it,but sitting in LA whole day,and linking items you “got” (ye sure…)and talking about pointless things,you will never get anything.

I spent good chunk of my “life” in sw,and i saw people dying to poison at amber,as soon as poison phase start,and they waiting for other to ress them for over 4 minutes,while nearest wp is 20 sec away,then i realized,those are people who complain how game is hard,and how raids are impossible…Ofc it is impossible when you standing in damage circle and losing 5 k hp each second…

What the hell are you talking about dude, u feel pro managed to get ur stuff while u got carried by others peoples, u wouldnt be able to get anything without players and since hot maps were adds mainly for the legendary collection, based on past, we all know the current new means they canceled weapons from their futur plans so less and less players gonna do maguuma events.

Also they are bugged pretty often so it wont give people the feel to do them, you should be less selfish before write there next time, because you managed to get something u think can be rude with the community -.-

Your reply carried told me everything i need to know about you.

Mad person,who cant get anything.

Guess what?Welcome to mmo games where team works is everything…And no one for me opened those chests with ascended materials,no one for me did all story achivs,no one for me did all mini games(challenges) gold medals,and most important thing,no one gave me single gold.

Your way of thinking is sad and hardcore butt pain,not hurt…So,all you got in game is thanks to me and other people?You are digging yourself a nice hole with all those sentences…So what are you saying,people with 10 legendary items and 30 k achi points got everything thanks to you and me?Ha ha

Everything can be solo,and you need no single person besides you,to farm all you need.There’s plenty of chests with ascended materials in them,no meta related,just sitting in random places of the maps.

Every single champion can be solo killed and every event can be solo done,and most important thing,every single gold you earn,you can do it yourself.

Its not my fault because you cant farm for legendary item,so frustrated because of that,you coming here,and telling me i could not what i got on my own?

Since i started,i farmed every single gold on my own.I have skins worth over 7 k gold and 2 legendary items bought off TP + crafted nevermoore,and i got not even 1 gold from someone else.

I wish you really good luck when comes to legendary item farming…

..No,not really,i don’t know you.

Btw,me saying “legendary item is not hard to get” is not rude,its a sad fact..people want everything,but with one condition…They all would like to sit in LA and getting tons of gold per every letter they write.

See that tiny speck in the distance? That’s the WvW overhaul!

Oh, wait, it’s just another mini-game they’ll call an “achievement”.

Either way, legendary or otherwise, this game has truly become Grind Wars 2. The last thing I care about is some shiny ‘legendary’ that requires days of mind-numbing grind. I came here for the WvW combat, and if that’s ever fixed I’ll start playing (and spending) again.

Yunielesca.2850:

White Hunter.3416:

You’ll get another LS episode. It is a good compensation.
Cmon, does the another useless gold sink more important than story?

We’ll get the living story at least in july lol, what are you going to do untill then, replay the same 4 maps again and again and again?

Isn’t that what most PvE players have been doing since October? What’s a few more months?

I doubt the Legendaries are gone for good. I suspect Anet will start working on them again when they have more time.

playable content is more important, legendaries is just fluff for the tiny 1%, they have to think of the masses.

Daddar.5971:

See that tiny speck in the distance? That’s the WvW overhaul!

Oh, wait, it’s just another mini-game they’ll call an “achievement”.

Either way, legendary or otherwise, this game has truly become Grind Wars 2. The last thing I care about is some shiny ‘legendary’ that requires days of mind-numbing grind. I came here for the WvW combat, and if that’s ever fixed I’ll start playing (and spending) again.

But when Mike talks about a WvW overhaul, doesnt he actually mean PvE?
No? okay, i will be in the corner then…

Honestly, some people dont seem to understand that the issue isnt that they are scraping the new legendaries in particular.

The Problem is that they pull workforce from a project that was a selling point for the current expansion and relocate them to another project, instead of pulling workforce from the next expansion, so that they can deliver what they already had us pay for.

Instead, they remain just as focused on the next potential cash grab, instead of giving what they already took money for.

You dont need to have a business major to see that this is bad, very bad project management.

I honestly don’t get why so many people pat them on the back for coming out and making such a “tough” decision, when in reality, they could have made a much better decision. A better decision for us, that is. The One they took only benefits themselves.

Some of you would probably congratulate MO for having him have his dog drop a dookie on your doorstep, by the look of it, and that, as a long time fan of the guild wars fan, really, really worries me.

Meanwhile in ArenaNet’s board room.

Alecu.4786:

I know there might be more than a dozen more threads on this topic right now, but I just want to express my deep feelings of regret and disappointment when I heard the news. In my opinion, Legedaries have always been part of GW2’s endgame and halting the development of new ones sounds really discouraging. I am aware that there might be stuff that’s more important, like the living world, but this game is all about cosmetics!!

Once again, please, just please don’t halt their development! The reasons are obvious and the whole community have expressed them!

Sorry dude, unless they scrap the journey they are gone, conceivably for a long time.

AysonCurrax.3254:

I honestly don’t get why so many people pat them on the back for coming out and making such a “tough” decision, when in reality, they could have made a much better decision. A better decision for us, that is. The One they took only benefits themselves.

What better decision? The game is greatly lacking new content at the moment. New patches usually bring a lot of new features, a lot of new shinies, but little to no content. Are legendaries so important to the point that most players should be forced to replay old content over and over just so a small niche is happy?

I understand the frustration, but content should always have higher priority than 12 skins.

Yep , gonna plus one OP. For those thinking it’s just fluff , that’s YOUR opinion. 20+ pages of the original MO post will tell you that for MANY it was long term goal, something to work on whilst you play all parts of the game, and once you were finished it culminated in an epic prestigious reward. LS can be played through pretty fast , and whilst I do adore it , right now there is NOTHING indicating that it won’t be postponed in July for uknown reasons. And if you think that you will get LS3 before July (at best!) you haven’t been following things.
TLDR please don’t scrap work on legenderies , for many it’s as big of a feature as LW – just work on 1 at a time and release it once it’s done, not together with a quarterly update, for the love of God , it’s not that hard.

Also what happens in the long-term? The way I see it there are the following options :
1. No more legendaries, ever. Cause clearly it’s too much work to get done lol.
2. They get their kitten together and deliver on the promised content ASAP ( <- best case scenario)
3. They decide to add the rest of the weps with the infamous expac#2 (so far seems to be the most likely option, and to me that basically screams ’Do NOT buy this , you will NOT get what you are promised )

Are legendaries so important to the point that most players should be forced to replay old content over and over just so a small niche is happy?

I understand the frustration, but content should always have higher priority than 12 skins.[/quote]

How do you know it’s small niche of people? Every 6th person I have met have a legendary weapon or is working on one. Unless anet realease how many player actually have legendary weapon or working for one u can’t say it’s small or big grp of people. So stop saying it’s small niche. And also if someone is not interested in legendary weapon doesn’t mean they won’t be intrigued in future but now thanks to it’s cancellation we never know.

DiogoSilva.7089:

AysonCurrax.3254:

I honestly don’t get why so many people pat them on the back for coming out and making such a “tough” decision, when in reality, they could have made a much better decision. A better decision for us, that is. The One they took only benefits themselves.

What better decision? The game is greatly lacking new content at the moment. New patches usually bring a lot of new features, a lot of new shinies, but little to no content. Are legendaries so important to the point that most players should be forced to replay old content over and over just so a small niche is happy?

I understand the frustration, but content should always have higher priority than 12 skins.

How do you know it’s small niche of people? Every 6th person I have met have a legendary weapon or is working on one. Unless anet realease how many player actually have legendary weapon or working for one u can’t say it’s small or big grp of people. So stop saying it’s small niche. And also if someone is not interested in legendary weapon doesn’t mean they won’t be intrigued in future but now thanks to it’s cancellation we never know.

I think everyone is forgetting what was said about expansions before gw2 was even released.
Besides hyping up WvW as a selling point and then completely ignoring WvW even now 3 1/2 yrs later.
They also said that there would be no expansions to buy or have to buy like other games. That all new content would be delivered as living story updates so there would be no need for expansions and now we have one they released and they’re already working on another one? And the first one isn’t even complete? One they said we’d never have to buy?
Something seems wrong with this picture. But hey I guess as long as the guys profiting from all this (NcSoft) is getting paid why should they care?

They have 70 employees working on a NEW expansion. This is why they are “stretched too thin” and can’t deliver on the selling points of the current expansion. Instead of taking the 5 or 6 employees away from the legendary journey, they should have reassigned some of these 70 employees who are working on the new expansion.

I think the living story is fluff. I can play through Anet’s story stuff in a day. Meanwhile I can spend a month or two making a legendary and carry it around with me everyday and enjoy it.

DiogoSilva.7089:

AysonCurrax.3254:

I honestly don’t get why so many people pat them on the back for coming out and making such a “tough” decision, when in reality, they could have made a much better decision. A better decision for us, that is. The One they took only benefits themselves.

What better decision? The game is greatly lacking new content at the moment. New patches usually bring a lot of new features, a lot of new shinies, but little to no content. Are legendaries so important to the point that most players should be forced to replay old content over and over just so a small niche is happy?

I understand the frustration, but content should always have higher priority than 12 skins.

Better Decision, as in: have less staff work on the next expansion, and instead have them work on the current one to deliver what was promised. There was literally no need to put legendaries on hold to improve work on Living World and whatever else.
They could have pulled those resources from somewhere else. Focus shouldnt be on the next thing when you havent even finished the current one.
Which is exactly what i said in that post you quoted partly. I also said that this isnt an issue with WHAT they put on hold, but the FACT that they put something on hold that was a selling point of the current expansion.

If that still doesnt hit home, imagine what it would be like if they only gave you 2-3 new elite specs, and put the others on hold till the gods return to tyria.

The uproar would be exactly the same. this isnt about the legendaries.
This is about shady business practices.

Xenesis.6389:

Mike O Brien.4613:

We have a team of six developers working on that, who could work on it for years to come.

So, after shipping Chuka and Champawat, I’ve asked that we indefinitely suspend work on new legendary weapons.

P.S Think about this, this isn’t any different than if say they said the recent raid wing is the last one for now, the 5 man team will suspend work on the last wing and go work on the living story instead. How well do you think that would go over?

Actually, it would more than fine with me and I would hazard a guess many more would be ok with it as well.
As for legendary, no big deal for me, I wouldn’t be grinding those out anyway.
That being said the announcement (brave and honest as it was)will bring into question any future announcements about game content.

DiogoSilva.7089:

AysonCurrax.3254:

I honestly don’t get why so many people pat them on the back for coming out and making such a “tough” decision, when in reality, they could have made a much better decision. A better decision for us, that is. The One they took only benefits themselves.

What better decision? The game is greatly lacking new content at the moment. New patches usually bring a lot of new features, a lot of new shinies, but little to no content. Are legendaries so important to the point that most players should be forced to replay old content over and over just so a small niche is happy?

I understand the frustration, but content should always have higher priority than 12 skins.

Legendary weapons provide months of content with the journey, living story in the past has only lasted 2/3 days.

Werdx.2059:

Sinzaku.2980:

Werdx.2059:

I need to say something which bothers me a lot in past weeks

I crafted Nevermoore.I had no last 2 mastery lines in Legendary crafting.That’s 15 Tyria mastery points.

I had no HoT maps completed,nor i had any of ascanded materials map rewards as Sparks,Crstal ores,Airship Parts…

I did not have 2500 gold,i had 1400,after almost 20 days of farming.

But let me tell you something,not counting those 20 days of gold farming,i managed to craft legendary item,and to complete all 4 maps with 4x 250x ascended materials in 10 days and farmed 16 mastery points.Played 3 hours each day.

Now when we cleared that out,do not dare to tell me its not possible to get legendary items,do not dare…Before i started 250 ascended mats collection,i was looking at some topics where people complain how hard is to get those,i was afraid AF…I understood those materials are not impossible to get…When i started collection,i was getting 20-40 ascended materials per meta,and i could not believe how many lazy people there are…

Everyone wants everything without effort…It comes down to simple thing,if you want it,you can get it.If you want it,but sitting in LA whole day,and linking items you “got” (ye sure…)and talking about pointless things,you will never get anything.

I spent good chunk of my “life” in sw,and i saw people dying to poison at amber,as soon as poison phase start,and they waiting for other to ress them for over 4 minutes,while nearest wp is 20 sec away,then i realized,those are people who complain how game is hard,and how raids are impossible…Ofc it is impossible when you standing in damage circle and losing 5 k hp each second…

What the hell are you talking about dude, u feel pro managed to get ur stuff while u got carried by others peoples, u wouldnt be able to get anything without players and since hot maps were adds mainly for the legendary collection, based on past, we all know the current new means they canceled weapons from their futur plans so less and less players gonna do maguuma events.

Also they are bugged pretty often so it wont give people the feel to do them, you should be less selfish before write there next time, because you managed to get something u think can be rude with the community -.-

Your reply carried told me everything i need to know about you.

Mad person,who cant get anything.

Guess what?Welcome to mmo games where team works is everything…And no one for me opened those chests with ascended materials,no one for me did all story achivs,no one for me did all mini games(challenges) gold medals,and most important thing,no one gave me single gold.

Your way of thinking is sad and hardcore butt pain,not hurt…So,all you got in game is thanks to me and other people?You are digging yourself a nice hole with all those sentences…So what are you saying,people with 10 legendary items and 30 k achi points got everything thanks to you and me?Ha ha

Everything can be solo,and you need no single person besides you,to farm all you need.There’s plenty of chests with ascended materials in them,no meta related,just sitting in random places of the maps.

Every single champion can be solo killed and every event can be solo done,and most important thing,every single gold you earn,you can do it yourself.

Its not my fault because you cant farm for legendary item,so frustrated because of that,you coming here,and telling me i could not what i got on my own?

Since i started,i farmed every single gold on my own.I have skins worth over 7 k gold and 2 legendary items bought off TP + crafted nevermoore,and i got not even 1 gold from someone else.

I wish you really good luck when comes to legendary item farming…

..No,not really,i don’t know you.

Btw,me saying “legendary item is not hard to get” is not rude,its a sad fact..people want everything,but with one condition…They all would like to sit in LA and getting tons of gold per every letter they write.

And what does either of your posts have to do with the topic of this thread?

This thread is about ANet indefinitely cancelling the release of the remaining 12 legendaries by moving the team that was working on them to LS3. When there are 70 people working on the NEXT expansion pack.

We’re not angry because we can’t have our legendaries yesterday. We’re angry because ANet decided to not move some people from the largest team in their company but instead move all of the people from a team developing content that was supposed to be part of the FIRST expansion pack.

Without any good explanation as to why they chose the people they chose.

AysonCurrax.3254:

Better Decision, as in: have less staff work on the next expansion, and instead have them work on the current one to deliver what was promised.

Isn’t that what they are doing with the april patch and the 3rd raid wing?

There was literally no need to put legendaries on hold to improve work on Living World and whatever else.

If there was no need, they wouldn’t have done so. Why go for an extremely unpopular decision, unless it were absolutely necessary? I don’t think they’d want to go this way if they had a better solution.

They could have pulled those resources from somewhere else.

I imagine that they also did that, but we’ll never know as it would relate to projects that are not of public knowledge.

If that still doesnt hit home, imagine what it would be like if they only gave you 2-3 new elite specs, and put the others on hold till the gods return to tyria.

I think the difference between elite specs and legendaries is gameplay. Elite specs bring a lot more gameplay variation than collections, it affects all players and is not gated behind huge money sinks, giving it broader appeal. Those things set both features apart.

Blude.6812:

Xenesis.6389:

Mike O Brien.4613:

We have a team of six developers working on that, who could work on it for years to come.

So, after shipping Chuka and Champawat, I’ve asked that we indefinitely suspend work on new legendary weapons.

P.S Think about this, this isn’t any different than if say they said the recent raid wing is the last one for now, the 5 man team will suspend work on the last wing and go work on the living story instead. How well do you think that would go over?

Actually, it would more than fine with me and I would hazard a guess many more would be ok with it as well.
As for legendary, no big deal for me, I wouldn’t be grinding those out anyway.
That being said the announcement (brave and honest as it was)will bring into question any future announcements about game content.

What’s your favorite content? What if the team working on that content got moved to something else and your content put on indefinite hold? Would you be singing the same tune?

It would also be different if we didn’t know that they had more than 50% of their company working on the next expansion pack. Yet chose to take resources from a team working on content that was supposed to be part of the first expansion pack.

Seera.5916:

Blude.6812:

Xenesis.6389:

Mike O Brien.4613:

We have a team of six developers working on that, who could work on it for years to come.

So, after shipping Chuka and Champawat, I’ve asked that we indefinitely suspend work on new legendary weapons.

P.S Think about this, this isn’t any different than if say they said the recent raid wing is the last one for now, the 5 man team will suspend work on the last wing and go work on the living story instead. How well do you think that would go over?

Actually, it would more than fine with me and I would hazard a guess many more would be ok with it as well.
As for legendary, no big deal for me, I wouldn’t be grinding those out anyway.
That being said the announcement (brave and honest as it was)will bring into question any future announcements about game content.

What’s your favorite content? What if the team working on that content got moved to something else and your content put on indefinite hold? Would you be singing the same tune?

It would also be different if we didn’t know that they had more than 50% of their company working on the next expansion pack. Yet chose to take resources from a team working on content that was supposed to be part of the first expansion pack.

My fav has been on hold for quite some time, LS and PvE SP content. So I am glad to see then changes. However, those were just side comments.
The main point the issue of credibility.

I know I said I felt I’d already said my piece, but I’ve been thinking about this a little more, and I have more to say.

Mike O Brien.4613:

Obviously I go into this knowing that some players will be very upset. That’s why it’s such a tough decision.

Ankdarkwolf, Darkmikau, Ballads, Spira, Caerbannog, Cysgod, you each posted a variant of an accusation I’ve seen many times over the past few months on the forums, something along the lines of, “AN shipped half an expansion with HoT.” I take issue with that. We shipped a new region full of content, a new mastery system, gliding, guild halls, a new profession, nine new elite specializations for existing professions, and more. Then we shipped precursor journeys for existing legendaries, and said, “We’ve been working hard on new legendary weapons, the first handful of which will be introduced in Heart of Thorns, with more to come in subsequent updates.” While I fully get that you’re disappointed today, this is not about us shipping half an expansion pack.

Mo

Quite frankly, I’m inclined to agree with you. For the people complaining that this was “half an expansion” to be right, the net amount of content contributed to the world by Heart of Thorns would need to be positive.

But not only were whole swathes of the game’s content killed off or made irrelevant by the expansion, but now NCSoft are killing off their other (admittedly, themselves troubled) properties so as to conserve resources to bail ANet out of their balls-up. You’d have trouble putting together a positive balance equalling “half an expansion” in content if you included all of the remaining core content as well.

The controversy over this particular change is actually overblown — EXCEPT that it’s symptomatic of everything going wrong with the game right now. The correct analogy to use here is going to a restaurant, ordering toad-in-the-hole, and after three hours of waiting, a waiter comes out and tells us that the kittentails won’t come with umbrellas because the chef lost his arm in the meat grinder. Nobody should really give a crap about the umbrellas, the big worry is how the hell anyone screwed up so badly that someone figuratively lost their figurative arm in a figurative meat grinder. Also, you know, why did we end up waiting three hours for anything resembling any sign of our food?

I’m well aware that software development is hard, and MMO development is even harder — except that it isn’t. To me, or some other layperson? kitten yes, it’s hard. To you? It should be like a kittening walk in the kittening park. Maybe a bit harder than that. But still not especially difficult, given that we gave ANet our money under the assumption that they would be kittening equal to the kittening task. There is only so much that can be excused by the realities of software development.

I’m still willing to believe that you aren’t guilty of any particularly underhanded or shady business practices. But even that is not good enough. As a consumer, I do not expect you to merely refrain from unfair and unethical business practices, I expect you to conduct yourselves so as to be above all sane suspicion. And even in that, you have monumentally failed.

You need to show that you have gotten your kitten together, you need to offer compensation to your players — for the crap that this incident is a symptom of, not just the legendaries themselves — and you need to offer easy refunds to any players who still aren’t satisfied after you’ve done all of this. And you need to specifically reach out via the launcher, in-game messages, and registered e-mail accounts so that those who don’t read the forums or Reddit know that you know you kittened up and want to make it right.

Then, maybe, we might accept that you’re halfway kittening sorry for this whole mess.

PS: You’re welcome to continue work on the next expansion — I’m well aware that the realities of software development mean that those people wouldn’t be useful anywhere else, and while the realities of software development don’t excuse much, your prior balls-up is what it is. Don’t even think of charging HoT purchasers for it when it lands, though.

EDIT: ‘kittentails’. Really not something I’d like to be served in a restaurant, with or without an umbrella.

Bait = 3 new legendary weapons and will be releasing the remaining weapons in small groups at regular intervals until the full set of 16 is added to the game

Switch = We are “stretched too thin” and will have to put legendary weapons on indefinite hold. We do this so we can bring you living, breathing world that everyone can enjoy.

They are paying 70 employees to work on a future expansion. Why is Anet hiring 70 people to work on a future expansion when this one isn’t finished??? They don’t feel the need to make good on the selling points of their CURRENT expansion but they are quite content to leave the 70 employees of the NEW expansion untouched.

Why hasn’t the new expansion been indefinitely put on hold?

Dashingsteel.3410:

Bait = 3 new legendary weapons and will be releasing the remaining weapons in small groups at regular intervals until the full set of 16 is added to the game

Switch = We are “stretched too thin” and will have to put legendary weapons on indefinite hold. We do this so we can bring you living, breathing world that everyone can enjoy.

They are paying 70 employees to work on a future expansion. Why is Anet hiring 70 people to work on a future expansion when this one isn’t finished??? They don’t feel the need to make good on the selling points of their CURRENT expansion but they are quite content to leave the 70 employees of the NEW expansion untouched.

Why hasn’t the new expansion been indefinitely put on hold?

Bait and switch involves advertising one product and switching someone to a more expensive different product. That’s the legal definition.

I know what bait means and I know what switch means, but bait and switch as a term has a very specific legal definition, which I guess you’re happy to ignore.

That’s okay be me. But it doesn’t make the rest of your arguments look any stronger.

What’s wrong with say false advertising which is what you’re actually claiming.

Bait – something you put on a hook to catch fish.
Switch – Something you flick to turn on a light.

Bait and Switch – Something you click to turn on a worm.

Terms aren’t necessarily meant to be taken literally.

They don’t have to “give” you anything. It’s a game, not a charity.

No doubt, it’s a shame that they had to cut legendary weapons.

But if they had to make the business decision to do so, I would imagine that it was pretty necessary- maybe a decision between having a full set of new legendary weapons and having the next Living World Season appear “on time” (aka sometime this year).

So few people are actually affected by each individual legendary collection it makes sense. The amount of work required for designing each collection is colossal, perhaps it makes sense to put the same amount of time/money/effort into a feature that affects more of the community comparatively.

evilunderling.9265:

I know I said I felt I’d already said my piece, but I’ve been thinking about this a little more, and I have more to say.

Mike O Brien.4613:

Obviously I go into this knowing that some players will be very upset. That’s why it’s such a tough decision.

Ankdarkwolf, Darkmikau, Ballads, Spira, Caerbannog, Cysgod, you each posted a variant of an accusation I’ve seen many times over the past few months on the forums, something along the lines of, “AN shipped half an expansion with HoT.” I take issue with that. We shipped a new region full of content, a new mastery system, gliding, guild halls, a new profession, nine new elite specializations for existing professions, and more. Then we shipped precursor journeys for existing legendaries, and said, “We’ve been working hard on new legendary weapons, the first handful of which will be introduced in Heart of Thorns, with more to come in subsequent updates.” While I fully get that you’re disappointed today, this is not about us shipping half an expansion pack.

Mo

Quite frankly, I’m inclined to agree with you. For the people complaining that this was “half an expansion” to be right, the net amount of content contributed to the world by Heart of Thorns would need to be positive.

But not only were whole swathes of the game’s content killed off or made irrelevant by the expansion, but now NCSoft are killing off their other (admittedly, themselves troubled) properties so as to conserve resources to bail ANet out of their balls-up. You’d have trouble putting together a positive balance equalling “half an expansion” in content if you included all of the remaining core content as well.

The controversy over this particular change is actually overblown — EXCEPT that it’s symptomatic of everything going wrong with the game right now. The correct analogy to use here is going to a restaurant, ordering toad-in-the-hole, and after three hours of waiting, a waiter comes out and tells us that the kittentails won’t come with umbrellas because the chef lost his arm in the meat grinder. Nobody should really give a crap about the umbrellas, the big worry is how the hell anyone screwed up so badly that someone figuratively lost their figurative arm in a figurative meat grinder. Also, you know, why did we end up waiting three hours for anything resembling any sign of our food?

I’m well aware that software development is hard, and MMO development is even harder — except that it isn’t. To me, or some other layperson? kitten yes, it’s hard. To you? It should be like a kittening walk in the kittening park. Maybe a bit harder than that. But still not especially difficult, given that we gave ANet our money under the assumption that they would be kittening equal to the kittening task. There is only so much that can be excused by the realities of software development.

I’m still willing to believe that you aren’t guilty of any particularly underhanded or shady business practices. But even that is not good enough. As a consumer, I do not expect you to merely refrain from unfair and unethical business practices, I expect you to conduct yourselves so as to be above all sane suspicion. And even in that, you have monumentally failed.

You need to show that you have gotten your kitten together, you need to offer compensation to your players — for the crap that this incident is a symptom of, not just the legendaries themselves — and you need to offer easy refunds to any players who still aren’t satisfied after you’ve done all of this. And you need to specifically reach out via the launcher, in-game messages, and registered e-mail accounts so that those who don’t read the forums or Reddit know that you know you kittened up and want to make it right.

Then, maybe, we might accept that you’re halfway kittening sorry for this whole mess.

Heck, if they could for once, just one single time, admit that they messed up, and aknowledge it, perhaps then people would be willing to trust them again eventually.

So far, it has always been avoided with some sort of excuse, or promises that never came to fruition either.

Also, if there is an issue with the “half an expansion” expression; given that dungeons, which were a fairly big part of the core content, were shafted, and thus core content was put in a bad spot in favor of the expansion, even though it was said time and time again that said expansion would NOT hurt core content in any way, one could label this more of a Substitution instead of an Expansion. then again, that would be even harsher, since it would imply that core content has been downright removed and replaced with something else.

When you buy a product and parts of it are missing that makes the parts that you actually received more expensive. Since the product is missing the parts you thought you were buying that makes it a different product.

UnitedChaos.8364:

They don’t have to “give” you anything. It’s a game, not a charity.

If that is how you feel, I would like to sell you a computer, Let me tell you about all of the components, but then I’ll ship you a case with a dvd burner and if I am feeling in the mood a PSU, but I might not give you the PSU because I can spend that time putting together the next computer. Let me know if you’re interested.

…We got your money guys…. we’re out… but before you leave…. buy more from the gem store!!! Give me back my SAB!

Not final but latest. The development of legendaries is on hold until decided otherwise. Doesn’t mean we’ll never see a new legendary ever in this game.

Altoricus.3251:

…We got your money guys…. we’re out… but before you leave…. buy more from the gem store!!! Give me back my SAB!

April Fools Joke 2016: Make a Legit Looking Announcement that SAB is returning on April First

Then, on April First, proceed to tell everyone that “it’s just a prank, bro.”, mentioning that no one has seen or heard of that SAB thing since 2013.

Coincidentally, April First would also be a friday, so it would be ideal to once again ignore the resulting kittenstorm over the weekend.

On second thought, i shouldnt give them any ideas…

Bait and switch also has to do with the substituting of inferior goods than the one you bought. When parts are missing I would say that that makes the product inferior to the one advertised.

Sird.4536:

Legendary weapons provide months of content with the journey, living story in the past has only lasted 2/3 days.

A few days getting the new collections and months and months repeating old content to farm for materials is not exactly more new content than living world or anything else.

Look, I like the legendary journey, although I think it could have been even better, but it’s still mostly made up of huge money sinking tactics and has a relatively small amount of new content. I would like to see new legendaries too, but the number one reason why I stopped playing GW2 is because the game either needs new content or old stuff fixed. What’s the point of getting new skins if all you’re going to use them for is to go back to SW and farm?

I’m just astonished I still haven’t heard anyone give a single apology. I would honestly feel, not much, but a tad better knowing that they acknowledged that they f’d up.

BTW, for those like myself waiting on SAB…. I started a clone a while back and am getting back into working on it. If there’s anyone good with level design please let me know. We know SAB is NOT a priority for MO since he’s backpedaled on promises for what you get with your HoT purchase (false advertising if they don’t postpone instead of cancel content). He wants his LS content… wonder if Colin left due to this or was fired (maybe for speaking out?). hit me up if you are interested in SAB and can do some design work.

Dashingsteel.3410:

Bait and switch also has to do with the substituting of inferior goods than the one you bought. When parts are missing I would say that that makes the product inferior to the one advertised.

Dude I dealt with this as part of my livlihood. This isn’t some random comment. bait and switch always refers to two different products. You advertise one and try to SWITCH to a different product.

If someone says you’re going to get something and they give it to you with parts removed from it it’s NOT bait and switch. You repeating it doesn’t make it so. The legal dictionary is a far better judge of what bait and switch is than you are.

If they advertise a specific Sony TV and that TV doesnt’ come with something they said it would, that’s false advertising. If a retailer offers a Sony TV and when you come in they just have Samsung and they try to make you buy that and refuse to sell you the Sony, that’s bait and switch.

CommandoTNT.2350:

I’m just astonished I still haven’t heard anyone give a single apology. I would honestly feel, not much, but a tad better knowing that they acknowledged that they f’d up.

No compensation, either. HoT is looking increasingly worse and was never worth the $60 price tag in the first place. People spent that money based on their promises, which have now been found to be entirely empty.

CommandoTNT.2350:

I’m just astonished I still haven’t heard anyone give a single apology. I would honestly feel, not much, but a tad better knowing that they acknowledged that they f’d up.

Why do you expect an apology? If you read MOs posts it is quite clear that he doesn’t feel he’s done anything wrong. In fact, he clearly says that we should be happy with what they release instead of hoping that they’ll release what they promise to.

I bow to your expertise Vayne.

Everyone ignore my bait and switch comment and please substitute false advertising in its place.

Virtutis.8614:

CommandoTNT.2350:

I’m just astonished I still haven’t heard anyone give a single apology. I would honestly feel, not much, but a tad better knowing that they acknowledged that they f’d up.

No compensation, either. HoT is looking increasingly worse and was never worth the $60 price tag in the first place. People spent that money based on their promises, which have now been found to be entirely empty.

HoT has been 60$ because they threw in the base game to make it easier for those who would be new to the game, while subsequently flipping off all those who have been loyal players for the 2 years before that. I dont really want to revive that topic, though.

That was just another example of telling their community to “deal with it”, without apology or anything of the sort aswell.

As a curiosity question could you guys take some people off of a different team to work on the legendary weapons? Like maybe the fractal/dungeon team or something like that? I ask mainly because I get the feeling people would rather see new legendary weapons over new fractals. I do realize that part of the reason why it is so difficult to put out the legendary weapons is because of the legendary journey & I feel like people are completely missing the point, its not just the weapon it is also the whooooole story that goes into it. I don’t know if you guys will read this or not but I feel like reminding people of the whole story that goes into it might help some people calm down.

& for all those people complaining they are looking to hire a LOT of people https://www.arena.net/ so if there were people to fill these spots it would probably lead to them having the resources needed to actually work on the legendary weapons.

Dashingsteel.3410:

I bow to your expertise Vayne.

Everyone ignore my bait and switch comment and please substitute false advertising in its place.

Well if your’e going to complain, you might as well use the right complaint. It’s not like false advertising is noble, right?

There’s a lot wrong with this game right now. Even a white knight like me can see that. The decision to indefinitely delay something to get everything else working is always a crappy decision. But it’s a decision.

It’s the kind of thing that managers have to do from time to time. It’s not great for them and it’s not great for us, that’s my take on it.

I really want to see what the April and July updates bring , before I actually go running for my pitchfork.