Guild Wars 2

I was a bit dissapointed that Anet decided to go the way of longer cooldown “I Win” abilities instead of being stronger utilities essentially.

I only played GW1 during late Prophecies/early Factions or somewhere around there, but one of the things I really liked about Elites was that didn’t have to be super long powerful skills but rather a strong ability you can build around. Though I’m not sure how much it changed since I last played that game. =p

I’m guessing they decided it would be easier to balance with elites being more of an after-thought instead of something to actually consider when creating builds? Or they figured people like that style of long super strong cooldown. Hopefully in the future if they get around to adding more they can throw us a few more short cd elites as I find myself using those for the most part.

Anyway I just wanted to see everyone’s opinions.

Which specific “I win” abilities are you referring to?

What I meant by “I Win” abilities, I was just referring to long cooldown elites that are really strong and can easily win you a fight. Such as Thieves Guild, or Guardian Book, etc.

I’m not complaining or calling them OP or anything.

Alright, personally I think that they are fine. There are plenty of very strong non-elite abilities as well, but this is a good thing since it adds complexity to a fight and reward players who understand other classes as well as their own.

This is especially since almost every single ability has a counter that is directly available to every other class in the game. There are rare exceptions, but in a lot of cases those exceptions exist on abilities that are so niche that they balance themselves out by not being generally useful but better applied in very specific situations or strategies (a good example of this would be the Mesmer’s “Portal” ability).

Poison Arrow. My favorite elite.

3rd Flora Artillery Unit reporting in. They are great support for my rescue ranger squad team.

Tiresias.6473:

Alright, personally I think that they are fine. There are plenty of very strong non-elite abilities as well, but this is a good thing since it adds complexity to a fight and reward players who understand other classes as well as their own.

This is especially since almost every single ability has a counter that is directly available to every other class in the game. There are rare exceptions, but in a lot of cases those exceptions exist on abilities that are so niche that they balance themselves out by not being generally useful but better applied in very specific situations or strategies (a good example of this would be the Mesmer’s “Portal” ability).

Just to be clear, I’m not talking about the strength or “Overpoweredness” of current elites. I’m referring to the style of elites : Long cooldown, super strong, versus, Shorter cooldown, quite strong like those of gw1 elites.

Say, Thieves Guild vs. Basilisk Venom (although I know the venom is just trash atm but beside that). What’s your opinion on that?

Basilisk Venom is one of the best elites in the game. You just have to trait for it. (Make it last 2 hits, make it recharge 20% faster, and make it apply to allies)
Then you’ve got a 38 (I think?) second cooldown skill that completely shuts down an opposing team for about 2 seconds. That’s a long time to not be kiting, dodging, or attacking.

I’m sure new skills and utilities are on the cards – for now they’ve opted for something that is easier to balance; long cooldown but strong skills.

What are you actually complaining about? The fact that some have longer cooldowns then others?

The elite skills often require some synergy to get the most out of them, some do.. some don’t.. it’s called Variety.

Basilisk venom can be extremely potent if you make a build around it.. granting allies this venom is freaking lethal :P Meanwhile Thieves guild can be slotted into many types of builds.. but it is easily avoidable at the same time.

I don’t mind elites having long cooldowns.. they are not really that important unless you have built your entire build around it, which tends to work best with the lower CD elites.

Well it’s apparent this thread utterly fails then. Sorry. =/

Please check out that thread, as you commented in something myself and others are stressing to address:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Improved-Combat-Skill-system

Ruggy.7819:

What are you actually complaining about? The fact that some have longer cooldowns then others?

The elite skills often require some synergy to get the most out of them, some do.. some don’t.. it’s called Variety.

Basilisk venom can be extremely potent if you make a build around it.. granting allies this venom is freaking lethal :P Meanwhile Thieves guild can be slotted into many types of builds.. but it is easily avoidable at the same time.

I don’t mind elites having long cooldowns.. they are not really that important unless you have built your entire build around it, which tends to work best with the lower CD elites.

If you don’t know what this thread is about, you obviously never played GW1, and are not fit to comment in this thread by virtue of the fact you don’t have the knowledge and understanding on the issues involved.

So children such as yourself should go quietly sit in their corner and not interfere in the matters of adults.

Back on topic, I prefer GW1’s short CD elites over GW2’s long CD elites.

I have to say that I too miss the GW1 style elites. In other games that I’ve played in the past, there’re always those few skills that are OP but are balanced by a ridiculously long CD. That’s what they did in GW2 with elites and that’s fine. But I liked the idea behind elites in GW1 better. Not necessarily that they were so strong, but that they were so unique and build-defining. However, it seems Anet is doing that now with traits, something we didn’t have in GW1. Create a build that synergizes traits, weapons, and utilities…and then pick your favorite elite for “face-crushing-time” or “o-no-we’re-all-gonna-die-time.”

Seras.5702:

I have to say that I too miss the GW1 style elites. In other games that I’ve played in the past, there’re always those few skills that are OP but are balanced by a ridiculously long CD. That’s what they did in GW2 with elites and that’s fine. But I liked the idea behind elites in GW1 better. Not necessarily that they were so strong, but that they were so unique and build-defining. However, it seems Anet is doing that now with traits, something we didn’t have in GW1.

EXACTLY! Perfectly said! Except, the thing is, the trait system is just a glorified attributes. Attributes affected weapon damage, skill damage, defense(sheild), energy, energy gain on death(necro), energy discount(Expertise), how long your knockdown was, your critical rate, the length and effectiveness of conditions, how often you double strike, how much you healed for, etc. The list goes on for a long time. Traits in Guild Wars 2 are about as important as having a bystander monk in PvP give you +5 damage Strength of honor and Judge’s insight. Sure, it helps a tiny bit, but it is really nothing more than slightly increasing the build you already have, which is directly chosen for you based on what weapon you are currently using.

In the link I posted:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Improved-Combat-Skill-system/

I go over these differences and the impact they had, compared to the insignificance of traits and skills now. I keep hearing people say that Guild Wars 1 didn’t have traits… And for the most past, it seems to be coming from people who never played the first game, and do not realize how many fields of play Attributes truly affected. The Backbreaker Sin is a perfect example of spreading your attributes to completely change the purpose of the build. Same goes for Crit Scythe Sins. Traits to not do this. Not in any way, not in any form. Not even close. Traits now, are about as important as putting on 1 Superior rune. Sure, it increases you effectiveness… Does it define you? Eff no. Can you function without it? By all means, YES.

For those of you who have no played Guild Wars 1: Play it. Read my thread, get better knowledge about the previous skill system and please review the things you post before you post them.

I know for rangers specifically, you really only have 3 Elites in PvP. And they take FOREVER to recharge. Where is my Poison Arrow? Cripshot? Burning Arrow? Poison arrow was what, a 2 second recharge? (Sorry, don’t have a chance to look atm) It wasn’t Op, but it was affected based on you build. Guild Wars 2 does not have this. It is bland, it is stale.

@LanceHavenBay, et al -

well said Lance. The customization in GW2 is supposed to be coming from the traits, and there are a lot of them with the nice ability to swap them out when out of combat. BUT, they don’t offer nearly the flavor and variety that the extensive library of skills in GW1 did, let alone the attribute point system (which was very simple and mainly just affected the strength/duration of skills).

I am really hoping Anet adds many more skill options for weapons and utilities, as well as the rather limited elites. More options = more build variety.

I completely agree, I liked the GW1 elites better, good strong skills that formed a staple to your skill bar rather than massive hit skills that I only use when I face a Vet or Champ. I do miss the GW1 skill sets…

But that’s really the direction they went with every skill in this game. I have to spend more time thinking, do I want to use the skill or shall I just auto attack it to death…They seem to want us to pick the right time to use the skill, knowing we won’t have it back for a while. Frivolous use of skills just doesn’t cut it.

the longest cd is 4 mins that is not long at all. That is a use once per boss fight… Obviously you never played wow when the big hitters for warriors were 30 mins… 4 mins is nothing…