New players are being encouraged to rush

New players are being encouraged to rush

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Posted by: Dawnbreaker.6215

Dawnbreaker.6215

I’ve made an alt recently and have been levelling it the good old way with map completion. While in Queensdale I saw mentors helping out new players many times, but I found their way of helping kind of wrong.

Basically what they are suggesting new people to do is to use the “exploits” that get you to level 80 asap and then farm the hell out of masteries in HoT areas. And I’ve experienced the result from this in dungeons later on, you have people with level 80 characters, who claim to have started less than a few days ago, who don’t even know how to play properly.

I see two reasons for this, either the game’s idea of encouraging exploration and questing has failed, or new players believe in what these mentors say way too much. Why would you encourage new people to ignore 99% of the content of the game? I get the whole idea that when you have 50 alts you’re too bored to do mapping and quests all over again, but what’s the point in trying to convert new players into grinding machines? Is it a crime for people to take their time and enjoy the game?

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Posted by: Sky.7610

Sky.7610

Is it a crime for people to take their time and enjoy the game?

Light and dark must coexist. In that sense, is it a crime for new people to grind to their hearts content and achieve max level or w/e in the most efficient means possible?

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Posted by: Boysenberry.1869

Boysenberry.1869

This seems to be a thing in every online game I’ve ever played and it only gets worse the longer the game is out because new players will feel even further “behind”. It certainly doesn’t help when vets actively encourage new players to skip content but a lot of new players will (and want to) do so anyways. I’m not sure there’s anything that can be done.

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Posted by: Inculpatus cedo.9234

Inculpatus cedo.9234

What are these ‘exploits’ new players are encouraged to do? Why aren’t they being reported? Why aren’t the Dungeon runners either refusing the new players in their group, or teaching them what they need to know?

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Posted by: Zedek.8932

Zedek.8932

Excelsior.

I arrived 1.5 years ago and have two characters. Each of them are levelled only by wandering around Tyria and killing everything that causes beef with me. Enjoy it that way much more than anything – not even map completition.

It takes roughly 6-8 months to get my characters to Level 80 and then I do the same in Maguuma Jungle. And guess what – that is probably the reason why I am that one special snowflake not crying about being burnt out, about how stale the game is etc. I’ve accidently used one level-up thing once and since then trashed all the 100+ I’ve received.

I know now what I can fight and what not. Because I do not have someone support me. I do not have Mesmers around me “taxi” me around, I do it myself. I am a lone wolf and that’s what I enjoy. I also would never let me get a mentor in a video game – What is that all about?

People smoke a cigar in 1 minute and then wonder where the enjoyment is supposed to be; you only get a headache and complain about the cigar manufacturer.

But this is the world of today: People rush, rush, rush and are actually sad inside, but they’ve got shiny stuff (Cellphones, cars, Segways, Legendary weapons) but do not enjoy it the slightest…

Greetings and Excelsior,
a special snowflake of genuine leveling like it’s 1998.

Zedexx, sly Asura Thief/Assassin
and politically highly incorrect. (#Asuracist)
“We [Asura] are the concentrated magnificence!”

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Posted by: Dragon.8762

Dragon.8762

I agree, I see this happen all the time. It usually leads to people burning out of the game really fast due to the fact that they have no idea what to do or want to aim for once they reach lvl 80.

I had a friend who only wanted to pvp because he heard pvp gives you “tomes of knowledge” which he heard could level you up from 1 to 80 the “fastest.” He barely ever played gw2, but usually pvped in most of the other MMO’s he played in the past. To help him get prepared we went into an empty hot join map. I told him about conditions and boons, told him about the importance of dodge and how he could go about countering different classes. I even held his hand in making a build he could play around with. He was so unbelievably confused about even the most basic of functions. When I told him hes better off just playing the game regularly from lvl 1 to 80 so he could have a better time understanding the game, he agreed and never played again lol.

This whole rush mentality is different in this game, because if you rush you will fail not because of your gear, but because of your skill. I did a few unranked matches with a friend the other day and we faced off against some people who were so faceroll easy. We could tell they had very little understanding of how to actually play. I think Anet really needs to provide a better more obvious tutorial for players without making them look dumb for both WvW and spvp. As well as teach people about boons and conditions. Because people are still getting daze and stun confused with immobilization.

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Posted by: Dawnbreaker.6215

Dawnbreaker.6215

What are these ‘exploits’ new players are encouraged to do? Why aren’t they being reported? Why aren’t the Dungeon runners either refusing the new players in their group, or teaching them what they need to know?

I used the word exploits because I couldn’t find a better one, that’s why I put it in quotation marks. What I mean by exploits are the tricks that help you speedrun the game, all of which are perfectly legit but not suitable for someone who is discovering the game.

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Posted by: Zedek.8932

Zedek.8932

I agree, I see this happen all the time. It usually leads to people burning out of the game really fast due to the fact that they have no idea what to do or want to aim for once they reach lvl 80.

Exactly my words. So at least some people are really aware. All the other things you said: I can fully agree.

Excelsior.

Zedexx, sly Asura Thief/Assassin
and politically highly incorrect. (#Asuracist)
“We [Asura] are the concentrated magnificence!”

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Posted by: LanfearShadowflame.3189

LanfearShadowflame.3189

I see a lot of this as well. The “get to 80 as fast as possible” mentality, and I actually blame other games for it. They encourage it, breed it. The whole thought process that the “fun” doesn’t start until after the leveling is done. The “hurry up and wait” game, so to speak.

So people rush, and then we see lots of people asking “ok, I’m 80, now what?” We’ve seen it on the forums. I see it in LA a lot. I see a lot of people asking really basic questions in LA too, because they “fast forwarded” through the leveling and don’t understand class mechanics or game mechanics and are confused.

Anytime I see people asking for leveling advice, I always inquire if its their first character and encourage the ‘slow path’ when I can. After all, life’s a journey, not a destination, right?

Don’t look at me like that. Whatever you’ve heard, it’s probably not true.

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

People come from other games where getting to max level is critical to enjoying the ‘real’ game; this includes people who are mentors.

However, isn’t it everyone’s choice to make their own mistakes? There are plenty of posts here & on Reddit reminding people to take their time, especially from some of the folks who rushed their first toon and wished later that they hadn’t.

I don’t really see a problem with people rushing: it doesn’t mean that ANet’s design has failed, only that people are in a rush.

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

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Posted by: Inculpatus cedo.9234

Inculpatus cedo.9234

What are these ‘exploits’ new players are encouraged to do? Why aren’t they being reported? Why aren’t the Dungeon runners either refusing the new players in their group, or teaching them what they need to know?

I used the word exploits because I couldn’t find a better one, that’s why I put it in quotation marks. What I mean by exploits are the tricks that help you speedrun the game, all of which are perfectly legit but not suitable for someone who is discovering the game.

I realize, and also used quotation marks. Again, what are these ‘exploits/speed runs’ that new players are encouraged to use? EotM? I heard the XP was reduced there. Where are new players allowed to skip things? It’s not like they have ToKs. The only thing, and this is from ArenaNet itself, is the L80 Booster. Is that what Mentors are suggesting? That new players use the Booster?

Most of the time I’ve only seen new players ask what to do with their newly created and boosted L80. And never in the Starting Zones. So, I’m curious what these new players are being suggested to do. They must be Play4Free players, or they would have access to the L80 Boost, and they can’t access WvW…so what is it that levels them so fast?

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Posted by: ChanxThexMan.1078

ChanxThexMan.1078

Let people do as they please Rushing isn’t always bad. I’ve been rushing about finishing this, that and the other for a 1.5 years in this game and never get burnt out. There’s always something to do and if you can’t find something, usually you can make somethign to do. To each their own.

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Posted by: Dawnbreaker.6215

Dawnbreaker.6215

I realize, and also used quotation marks. Again, what are these ‘exploits/speed runs’ that new players are encouraged to use? EotM? I heard the XP was reduced there. Where are new players allowed to skip things? It’s not like they have ToKs. The only thing, and this is from ArenaNet itself, is the L80 Booster. Is that what Mentors are suggesting? That new players use the Booster?

Most of the time I’ve only seen new players ask what to do with their newly created and boosted L80. And never in the Starting Zones. So, I’m curious what these new players are being suggested to do. They must be Play4Free players, or they would have access to the L80 Boost, and they can’t access WvW…so what is it that levels them so fast?

I’m not an expert at speedrunning, I’ve never done it, but the general idea seems to be to go for the tomes of knowledge and exp boosts you can get from several activities, like PvP dailies. If you follow any guide that tells you exactly how to do this you should get lvl 80 in a breeze. I’ve also heard of leveling cheap crafting skills like cooking because those can level your character very quickly.

Also, I still see EotM being suggested regardless.

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Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

It’s not even just MMOs. I know people who will do their best to rush to the maximum level in single-player games too, and/or finish the main storyline as fast as possible because they want it out the way so they can focus on other stuff.

It frequently does have negative consequences but trying to convince people of that, or persuade them that it’s worse than taking it slow is often futile. In the best cases they know what they want from the game and see everything else as annoying fluff that’s in the way of achieving those goals. In the worse cases they don’t understand the game at all, but have been told by someone they trust that this is the best way to play it so they’re going to stick with it.

I’ve made similar mistakes myself, taking advice from someone I trusted to know what they were talking about which later proved to be…not exactly wrong but not at all the best advice for me.

I think there’s no harm in offering an alternative viewpoint, and especially letting them know that the game doesn’t really change at level 80 so there’s no need to rush. But I don’t think you can prevent people telling them the opposite or stop people believing them.

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

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Posted by: DeanBB.4268

DeanBB.4268

I think if you’re focused on getting to 80 as fast as you can, it’ll always be a breeze. I don’t see doing some PvP and WvW as speeding that up terribly, and a new account won’t have the materials to craft with — unless they whip out their credit card, I suppose.

I agree with a previous poster — if that’s what someone wants to do, let them. In this game, there’s no penalty for it, since you can go to any zone and still enjoy it at max level. More so, I’d say, since you have gear and traits to play with.

And there’s no guarantee someone taking a slow route to 80 will be any more skilled than an insta-80. I would hope that an insta-80 having trouble would find a “slower” zone to build up some skills in, but in an instant gratification culture, who knows?

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Posted by: Inculpatus cedo.9234

Inculpatus cedo.9234

I realize, and also used quotation marks. Again, what are these ‘exploits/speed runs’ that new players are encouraged to use? EotM? I heard the XP was reduced there. Where are new players allowed to skip things? It’s not like they have ToKs. The only thing, and this is from ArenaNet itself, is the L80 Booster. Is that what Mentors are suggesting? That new players use the Booster?

Most of the time I’ve only seen new players ask what to do with their newly created and boosted L80. And never in the Starting Zones. So, I’m curious what these new players are being suggested to do. They must be Play4Free players, or they would have access to the L80 Boost, and they can’t access WvW…so what is it that levels them so fast?

I’m not an expert at speedrunning, I’ve never done it, but the general idea seems to be to go for the tomes of knowledge and exp boosts you can get from several activities, like PvP dailies. If you follow any guide that tells you exactly how to do this you should get lvl 80 in a breeze. I’ve also heard of leveling cheap crafting skills like cooking because those can level your character very quickly.

Also, I still see EotM being suggested regardless.

Hmm. That just sounds like playing the game. Some players enjoy WvW, some enjoy PvP, etc. I’m pretty sure the only ‘right’ way isn’t leveling in PvE. Tomes of Knowledge were added to those other game modes specifically so one could level up characters in the game mode of choice. I’d hardly call it an ‘exploit/speedrun’. Crafting is also an alternative that was placed in the game to assist with leveling. It’s hardly the ‘speedy’ way it used to be at release.

I always suggest new players save the L80 Boost until after they’ve leveled a character normally, but all the things mentioned here are normal ways to level. /shrug

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Posted by: Neox.3497

Neox.3497

Maybe the leveling you see as “normal” is boring for some? Killing mobs that are easy to kill and pressing F is maybe not something someone wants to do for several hours.

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Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

Maybe the leveling you see as “normal” is boring for some? Killing mobs that are easy to kill and pressing F is maybe not something someone wants to do for several hours.

I can completely understand how it would be boring if you think of it that way.

But when I’m levelling I don’t think about killing the mobs and pressing F. I’m focused on exploring the map (which yes I have done several times now, I still enjoy seeing it), watching and participating in the events and speaking to the NPCs, and of course playing alongside other people and talking with them and my guilds. I don’t even think of it as levelling up, I’m just getting on with playing the game and every so often I’m told I’ve gained a level.

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

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Posted by: Galtrix.7369

Galtrix.7369

Any veteran MMO player that is new to GW2 will instantly recognize that the game is actually worth taking at a slow pace instead of the fast pace that the mentors encourage.

However, it’s those who are new to MMOs that will most likely fall into the trap of farming, speed-running, and grinding. Otherwise, they are veteran MMO players that want to farm, speed-run, and grind.

To me, the quests in this game are really, really boring. I can’t really explain why. Maybe it’s the lack of NPC/Player interaction when starting a quest. Maybe it’s the lack of a decent reward for doing them. As a veteran MMO player myself, I’m used to receiving armor, gold, and other shinies from quests, but all I receive in GW2 is a measly amount of coins. Therefore, I find grinding more enjoyable than quests because the rewards are infinitely better. That’s just my opinion though.

[~Galtrix~] [~Level 80 Elementalist~] [~GoM~]

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Posted by: Linken.6345

Linken.6345

Any veteran MMO player that is new to GW2 will instantly recognize that the game is actually worth taking at a slow pace instead of the fast pace that the mentors encourage.

However, it’s those who are new to MMOs that will most likely fall into the trap of farming, speed-running, and grinding. Otherwise, they are veteran MMO players that want to farm, speed-run, and grind.

To me, the quests in this game are really, really boring. I can’t really explain why. Maybe it’s the lack of NPC/Player interaction when starting a quest. Maybe it’s the lack of a decent reward for doing them. As a veteran MMO player myself, I’m used to receiving armor, gold, and other shinies from quests, but all I receive in GW2 is a measly amount of coins. Therefore, I find grinding more enjoyable than quests because the rewards are infinitely better. That’s just my opinion though.

There are no quests in gw2 so thats understandable that you find them boring since you have nothing to do.

There are however heart task that sole purpose is to hold you to an area were it should spawn a event or three that you can do to fill the hearts faster.

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Posted by: Cerby.1069

Cerby.1069

Any veteran MMO player that is new to GW2 will instantly recognize that the game is actually worth taking at a slow pace instead of the fast pace that the mentors encourage.

However, it’s those who are new to MMOs that will most likely fall into the trap of farming, speed-running, and grinding. Otherwise, they are veteran MMO players that want to farm, speed-run, and grind.

To me, the quests in this game are really, really boring. I can’t really explain why. Maybe it’s the lack of NPC/Player interaction when starting a quest. Maybe it’s the lack of a decent reward for doing them. As a veteran MMO player myself, I’m used to receiving armor, gold, and other shinies from quests, but all I receive in GW2 is a measly amount of coins. Therefore, I find grinding more enjoyable than quests because the rewards are infinitely better. That’s just my opinion though.

THIS.

take ur time and enjoy the game with ur first character. Ur gona have 0 connection to anything, and everyhting is just gonna be a slogfest grind if you auto level to 80 right off the bat. There is so much content to do before you hit 80. Its a real travesty to not play the game the way you were intended to play it. I mean when you get a new game do you activate the cheat codes as soon as you start ur first game? lol, cause thats what ur doing.

was like playing rise of nations and every game just spawning nukes on the enemy and 1000 or whatever unit you can think of on a specific spot….no challenege….no connection…..no playing of the actual real game lol.

I kill you in one gunflame, or I kill you in two.
The Tiny Yuno Sniper of Ebay [EBAY]

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Posted by: LouWolfskin.3492

LouWolfskin.3492

Seen this myself a lot.

That and the idea that everyone has to deal max damage everywhere at everytime is really exhausting to see.
For example, i always hear how hard it is to play as a mesmer, he’s slow, he deals no damage and whatnot.
I don’t see it, played through the core game 3 years ago with him, played through HoT solo.. and i had fun, in HoT even more than in the core game since interrupts etc seem to be more important.

But that leads to another point in this whole debacle.
In HoT a lot of people don’t know what CC is, don’t know how to support others because in the core game it’s never needed or at least not to that much.

Ah well, i would love for the core game to get harder anyway so people would have an incentive to actually learn it all.

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Posted by: Justine.6351

Justine.6351

This has always been present in MMOs. GW2 is not an exception and never has been. When I played early access I escorted yaks from SW Camp to Bay in the alpine borderlands for like 15 lvls. And I was not the only one there, we had a zerg doing it for lvling up lol.

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Posted by: fourhim.3584

fourhim.3584

If I’m working on my 6th or 7th level 1-80, I’m going to “speed level” as fast as possible.

But I agree that it is a BAD BAD BAD idea for a new player to either want to do this them self, or or be encouraged to do it by other players. Core Tyria is a beautiful, amazing world, and I still like to take a break from HOT content and go back there from time to time. I still find things there I’ve never seen before, and this after 2+ years of playing!

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Posted by: Khisanth.2948

Khisanth.2948

I agree, I see this happen all the time. It usually leads to people burning out of the game really fast due to the fact that they have no idea what to do or want to aim for once they reach lvl 80.

I had a friend who only wanted to pvp because he heard pvp gives you “tomes of knowledge” which he heard could level you up from 1 to 80 the “fastest.” He barely ever played gw2, but usually pvped in most of the other MMO’s he played in the past. To help him get prepared we went into an empty hot join map. I told him about conditions and boons, told him about the importance of dodge and how he could go about countering different classes. I even held his hand in making a build he could play around with. He was so unbelievably confused about even the most basic of functions. When I told him hes better off just playing the game regularly from lvl 1 to 80 so he could have a better time understanding the game, he agreed and never played again lol.

This whole rush mentality is different in this game, because if you rush you will fail not because of your gear, but because of your skill. I did a few unranked matches with a friend the other day and we faced off against some people who were so faceroll easy. We could tell they had very little understanding of how to actually play. I think Anet really needs to provide a better more obvious tutorial for players without making them look dumb for both WvW and spvp. As well as teach people about boons and conditions. Because people are still getting daze and stun confused with immobilization.

Learning is a process not an instantaneous event. The desire to learn also has to come from within. No matter how much they teach it will never cover everything. For a person who is willing to observe and learn it doesn’t matter if they use a boost, tomes or level the old fashion way.

If ANet somehow knows of a surefire way to get people to want to learn I am sure various educational institutions around the world will be interested.

The best thing they could do is direct people to the wiki since that has both broad coverage and will stay mostly up to date but many if not most will scoff at this “homework”.

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Posted by: Sephrye.1628

Sephrye.1628

One of the main reasons for this now, is because of elite masteries/weapons being locked behind level 80.
Normally, I’m someone who like to take it slow when I level a new character (exploring everything etc),
but I also found myself wanting to level up faster too, to use the mastery weapons.
It makes people want to rush, in order to use the new weapons.

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Posted by: Rukia.9860

Rukia.9860

Mastery encourage you to grind to 80 so you can get the new spec, gliding, and loot options asap, and then it takes forever to get it all unlocked. It’s ANets own design… very grindy if you focus on the end game. And to be fair, GW2 has pretty much turned into an end game MMO instead of what it was released as.

You will want ascended equipment and all your mastery in order to raid, for example.

The way they gate things behind mastery is extremely annoying and sucks the fun out of the maps that I’m trying to enjoy so of course I farm and grind to get it over with.

(edited by Rukia.9860)

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Posted by: Blion King.3481

Blion King.3481

Well, before elite spec came about, you really did not have too much incentive to get to level 80 fast. With elites being so much more superior, you begin to feel like getting to 80 is a chore to get to the elite specs. I am leveling my revenant and I’m just dragging my feet along because it’s so slow without Glint perma-swift. So tempted to just use my level 80 boost and be done with it. People will stop rushing to level 80 if they don’t see the need to get to level 80 fast. With elite spec being so overpowered right now, I don’t see that happening.

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Posted by: Tiger Ashante.1792

Tiger Ashante.1792

Personally, i was shocked Anet gave new players lvl 80 boost and allowed them to use it right away. What they should have done is give one to them, but not allow them to use it until they lvled up at least one character the normal way to max lvl. Once they’ve done that, they unlock their lvl 80 boost to use on an alt.

Giving them the boost to use right away, is a terrible decision as most are not able to resist it. It encourages them to skip all the core game content and so you have these max lvl players who have no idea how to play their class. And even if they go back and do the core content from start, it simply won’t feel the same and often time get bored very quickly and leave the game.

Really, really bad decision imo.

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Posted by: Khisanth.2948

Khisanth.2948

Pretty sure they gave people the boost because of too much kittening about how HoT is lv80 only content and they bought the game but couldn’t play NOW.

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Posted by: Menadena.7482

Menadena.7482

Way too much is locked behind 80 now to tell new players to take it slow. When did they last release any major permanent content that did not require an 80? LS2? Core Tyria? Even those had level 80 areas. Just for something most people almost take for granted now, basic gliding and autoloot, you need an 80. Before HOT you could legitimately advise newbies to take it slow for the first character or two but now …

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Posted by: vesica tempestas.1563

vesica tempestas.1563

nothing is locked behind 80, what you have is a lot of content before and after 80. This is what you want, its not mutually exclusive.

People wanting to rush to the end game are people who have learned the wrong behavior in other games to be quite honest. To use the old analogy they want to skim read the book to get to the last chapters. It id not the fault of the book that the reader doesnt care about the characters they read about at the end of the book..


“Trying to please everyone would not only be challenging
but would also result in a product that might not satisfy anyone”- Roman Pichler, Strategize

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Posted by: Behellagh.1468

Behellagh.1468

People will always believe the “best” content is at max level due to how other MMOs are designed and the old outleveling of zones. While raids and LWS3 are level 80 content, if you are starting at level 1 and own HoT, there is no rush.

The other is that there are so many games out there that to play them all you need to rush to the end and move onto the next. Burn through any new content and swap. It’s the nature of gaming now.

We are heroes. This is what we do!

RIP City of Heroes

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Posted by: Gryphon.2875

Gryphon.2875

Excelsior.

I arrived 1.5 years ago and have two characters. Each of them are levelled only by wandering around Tyria and killing everything that causes beef with me. Enjoy it that way much more than anything – not even map completition.

It takes roughly 6-8 months to get my characters to Level 80 and then I do the same in Maguuma Jungle. And guess what – that is probably the reason why I am that one special snowflake not crying about being burnt out, about how stale the game is etc. I’ve accidently used one level-up thing once and since then trashed all the 100+ I’ve received.

I know now what I can fight and what not. Because I do not have someone support me. I do not have Mesmers around me “taxi” me around, I do it myself. I am a lone wolf and that’s what I enjoy. I also would never let me get a mentor in a video game – What is that all about?

People smoke a cigar in 1 minute and then wonder where the enjoyment is supposed to be; you only get a headache and complain about the cigar manufacturer.

But this is the world of today: People rush, rush, rush and are actually sad inside, but they’ve got shiny stuff (Cellphones, cars, Segways, Legendary weapons) but do not enjoy it the slightest…

Greetings and Excelsior,
a special snowflake of genuine leveling like it’s 1998.

I salute you. Excelsior!

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Posted by: Bobby.3721

Bobby.3721

To be fair…well in my opinion anyways, this game offers you nothing until you hit 80. Then the real grind begins.