Guild Wars 2

Vayne.8563:

Corpus Christi.2057:

It is sad to see how easily satsified the masses are. Truly.

This is a truly judgmental comment. What you’re saying is you’re better than the masses somehow, because you like something and other people like something else.

Indeed.

Im not even going to comment on the rewards part however….

The trailer was lack luster and the story is very stale. This does nothing to further Scarlet as a character and only uses her as a pawn. For a being claimed to be pretty much a super genius she’s done some of the dumbest stuff imaginable. Also, really not impressed by the obvious puppet master of the puppeteer gimmick. It’s been beaten to death numerous times including in guild wars 1. I was looking forward to an interesting story and epic finale, and i’m sorely disappointed in the direction this is headed and can only hope that whatever game-play changes come with this are worth my time as a player.

I think people are missing one point here. This isn’t “the” finale. This is the first of four stories…the finale is yet to come.

Vayne.8563:

I think people are missing one point here. This isn’t “the” finale. This is the first of four stories…the finale is yet to come.

I think someone is sorely lacking in reading comprehension. I never stated this release was the finale. What i said was its using dated story telling that’s so predictable that not even M. Night Shyamalan can make whatever finale they come up with not be as stale as 12 year old bread.

TexZero.7910:

Vayne.8563:

I think people are missing one point here. This isn’t “the” finale. This is the first of four stories…the finale is yet to come.

I think someone is sorely lacking in reading comprehension. I never stated this release was the finale. What i said was its using dated story telling that’s so predictable that not even M. Night Shyamalan can make whatever finale they come up with not be as stale as 12 year old bread.

Ok , so what gonna happen then? If it’s so predictable, what will happen in the next updates. Please be detailed as possible.

TexZero.7910:

Vayne.8563:

I think people are missing one point here. This isn’t “the” finale. This is the first of four stories…the finale is yet to come.

I think someone is sorely lacking in reading comprehension. I never stated this release was the finale. What i said was its using dated story telling that’s so predictable that not even M. Night Shyamalan can make whatever finale they come up with not be as stale as 12 year old bread.

I definitely think we should talk about reading comprehension. Where did you see me quote you? What makes you think I was only talking to you? Did I refer to you by name?

Other people have expressed disappointment, but this isn’t the end. It’s a trailer with a couple of new creatures. There’s no plot shown here, nor should their be in a trailer. It’s like an action movie trailer…they show action…but very little plot and certainly no plot twists.

Feel free to judge an entire update on an action trailer, but some of us prefer to see what’s going to happen.

Medazolam.3058:

TexZero.7910:

Vayne.8563:

I think people are missing one point here. This isn’t “the” finale. This is the first of four stories…the finale is yet to come.

I think someone is sorely lacking in reading comprehension. I never stated this release was the finale. What i said was its using dated story telling that’s so predictable that not even M. Night Shyamalan can make whatever finale they come up with not be as stale as 12 year old bread.

Ok , so what gonna happen then? If it’s so predictable, what will happen isn’t the next updates. Please be detailed as possible.

Let’s just use the obvious that we have from the trailer alone….

Scarlet isn’t working of her own free will, There’s someone pulling her strings to bring about an entity that isn’t able to exist currently in the world of it own power.

If that wasn’t a big enough clue as to what’s going on or what is going to occur then i suggest you go read GW1 lore.

There’s only one current force in the Maguuma region that would require that amount of assistance and it doesn’t take a genius to figure it out.

Granted Anet isn’t grand on having an entire region being blown up, especially in a living world event it’s highly unlikely for Scarlet or her “masters” plans to succeed which leads up to 4 parts of a event update where in scarlet prepares, we defend, we push out and inevitably win. There’s not going to be any catastrophic world morphing event, no searing and no new land masses. At best an old “friend” returns in Caith and a “new” race joins in the battle that being most likely the Tengu.

But hey that would all coincide with the May 4th feature release that’s planned …shock horror been done before.

Any link where I can read up, or watch a stream about this new up coming content?
EU player here so always miss out!

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

This is exactly the problem with the living story’s layout. I probably would have been excited to play it as well, except the content doesn’t last, it’s only there for a month max and then there’s still nothing after that. It’s gone. What are we left with? A backpiece and no sense of closure?

It really puts a foul taste in my mouth when I’m trying to introduce someone into the game that I myself put so much stock into back in 2012, and then they ask about certain things that my character has, like weapons and backpieces, etc. and why certain achievements can’t be done anymore. I have to tell them it’s all temporary and that they can no longer do it. Meanwhile they have the /sadface on and I scratch around for some positive spin on that situation, when in reality there is none. I just can’t get them excited about holes/gaps in the story that they’ve missed so far, and why when they take on the next bit of the LS, that after it’s all said and done, it’ll be gone again too. For me personally it doesn’t instill a sense of continuity that new players can refer back to.

Bad mark for GW2, and more bad marks for ANet.

JoxerNL.3752:

Any link where I can read up, or watch a stream about this new up coming content?
EU player here so always miss out!

There’s a hilariously over dramatic fan video quality promo on the main site.

It hints at a giant watchwork puppet walking around and the jungle wurm with a yellow color pallet. The obvious stack and spam combat in it did not make me optimistic.

Wait until you get to play it before you say you’re disappointed.. >_>

I’m just waiting to see how they nerf the Elementalist in this release.

ChaosKirin.1328:

Why is it poor writing, though?

And why grind at all? You can actually play the content without getting all the achievements. And even if you want the carrot at the end, it’s so very easy to just acquire a lot of them through doing the dailies.

I get the feeling sometimes that a lot of people think this is poor writing because the main villain is NOT a dragon, and is a female character. I don’t think I’d see half the griping if everyone knew right now whether or not the villain was Primordus.

Pretty grand assumptions to think that people reject a villain because its a woman.
It’s also acceptable to think she falls short of the dragons since they are supposed to be immortal forces of destruction that have completely reshaped the land in the last 250 years.

Scarlet is a cackling Saturday morning cartoon villain that has caused less death and devastation than your average hurricane or earthquake.

Creating a whole set of very threatening and acceptable villains and then casting them to the side for some other villain who’s every move is an asspull* IS bad writing because it’s not interesting or engaging. It’d be like if Tolkien completely forgot about Sauron the second he revealed Saruman was an evil kitten and just had him go around monologueing and maybe burning down people’s houses and ruining festivals.

*http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AssPull

Valandil Dragonhart.2371:

It really puts a foul taste in my mouth when I’m trying to introduce someone into the game that I myself put so much stock into back in 2012, and then they ask about certain things that my character has, like weapons and backpieces, etc. and why certain achievements can’t be done anymore. I have to tell them it’s all temporary and that they can no longer do it. Meanwhile they have the /sadface on and I scratch around for some positive spin on that situation, when in reality there is none. I just can’t get them excited about holes/gaps in the story that they’ve missed so far, and why when they take on the next bit of the LS, that after it’s all said and done, it’ll be gone again too. For me personally it doesn’t instill a sense of continuity that new players can refer back to.

Bad mark for GW2, and more bad marks for ANet.

If I want to give low marks to something about the Living Story, it’s this. I understand that they want a changing world that you can’t look back from. But there really is NO reason why players (especially newer players) shouldn’t be able to experience at least the salient points of what has already come and gone.

Substance E.4852:

JoxerNL.3752:

Any link where I can read up, or watch a stream about this new up coming content?
EU player here so always miss out!

There’s a hilariously over dramatic fan video quality promo on the main site.

It hints at a giant watchwork puppet walking around and the jungle wurm with a yellow color pallet. The obvious stack and spam combat in it did not make me optimistic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhrVVkHmwt4

Thank you, was extremely confused!

Substance E.4852:

ChaosKirin.1328:

Why is it poor writing, though?

And why grind at all? You can actually play the content without getting all the achievements. And even if you want the carrot at the end, it’s so very easy to just acquire a lot of them through doing the dailies.

I get the feeling sometimes that a lot of people think this is poor writing because the main villain is NOT a dragon, and is a female character. I don’t think I’d see half the griping if everyone knew right now whether or not the villain was Primordus.

Pretty grand assumptions to think that people reject a villain because its a woman.
It’s also acceptable to think she falls short of the dragons since they are supposed to be immortal forces of destruction that have completely reshaped the land in the last 250 years.

Scarlet is a cackling Saturday morning cartoon villain that has caused less death and devastation than your average hurricane or earthquake.

Creating a whole set of very threatening and acceptable villains and then casting them to the side for some other villain who’s every move is an asspull* IS bad writing because it’s not interesting or engaging. It’d be like if Tolkien completely forgot about Sauron the second he revealed Saruman was an evil kitten and just had him go around monologueing and maybe burning down people’s houses and ruining festivals.

*http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AssPull

You’d be right if Anet had cast the elder dragons aside, but that’s not the case. The idea of the Living Story wasn’t to continue the personal story, but was to have some side stuff to do while Anet works on bigger projects. They can’t pull dragons out of thin air, that development takes time. If you don’t think they’re working on dragons, I’m pretty sure you’d be wrong.

But with the amount of time it’s taking, they needed something to fill the void. They didn’t want permanent content, because this isn’t the “main course”. It’s a side dish.

So for a side dish this is the kind of villain that makes the most sense.

If the only villains in the world are dragons, the world is going to be a boring place for me.

With such a time brake, I really expect lots of bug fixes, nerfs/buffs and MF recipes for ascended items and dusts/ores. Which definitely isn’t something that could be shown in a promo video:)

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

For one, I played Ragnarok Online. We have this thing called “War of the Emperium” where your guild does a siege on a castle controlled by another guild (or guild alliance…) and this happens 1x a day for an hour. Once the time ends, whoever is occupying the castle owns it. Overnight, it has a chance to generate items needed to craft Legendary items or release items that are rare in nature (as in few players owns the items). And mind you, Legendary items here are truly Legendary. Not more than 10% of the people have them. And they have legendary backgrounds (Mjolnir, Sleipneir, Megingard….)

Another is Cabal Online – where we have this thing called “Mission War” – the more kills you have, the more “War Exp” you gain – your rank determines your reward. It happens 6x a day in a 3 hour interval. Your War Exp can also be traded for items/exp/skill points – items which would randomly generate an “Upgrade Core” which could be used to enhance items. There are 4 types of those cores, each catering to a specific item tier. You also gain a “Title” upon reaching specific War Exp – which gives you minor but noticable bonuses – such as + 500 HP, +10% resist critical hit, +30% resist critical damage – very helpful on PvP and dungeon runs.
If you are consistently on the top for 1 week, you also gain the chance to become a “Bringer” – a commander equivalent – with added bonus stat points, effects and shout – which everyone across the world can read. It’s usually used inside the Mission War for “commanding”
Oh and dungeons here have specific drops – meaning say Item A only drops on Dungeon A, and item A is needed to upgrade/craft certain item – which encourages players to actually run the dungeon – not just specific dungeons.

Another game – Rising Force Online – I’ve not played this long, but there are 3 factions which competes for a specific area on where players could “mine” resources to upgrade their gear.

As you may have noticed, those are “minor” impacts, but it builds over time – thus creating an environment where players would actually want to participate to gain advantage over others. They are actually encouraged to participate. Note: Encouraged, not required.

One thing that should be addressed is the ‘rumor’ that there will be a big ‘feature’ update on March 4th, or early March. I don’t think that will be the case, since they clearly stated they are taking a break after the final 4 Living Story updates for LS Season/Year One. I can see the moaning and grousing already…sigh.

I am not so sure that all the gameplay and content for this upcoming patch can be ascertained from a few seconds of video. Those that can are more astute than I. It just seems more fair to actually play the release, or at least wait for the patch notes before judging, but that’s just my opinion.

I don’t know where the ‘fact’ that Scarlet is a puppet came from. She may well be, but I didn’t get that from the video. I saw a construct….I have no reason to believe (or not believe) that Scarlet isn’t controlling that giant clockwork monstrosity. Maybe I missed something….. Lol, would not be the first time.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

One thing that should be addressed is the ‘rumor’ that there will be a big ‘feature’ update on March 4th, or early March. I don’t think that will be the case, since they clearly stated they are taking a break after the final 4 Living Story updates for LS Season/Year One. I can see the moaning and grousing already…sigh.

I am not so sure that all the gameplay and content for this upcoming patch can be ascertained from a few seconds of video. Those that can are more astute than I. It just seems more fair to actually play the release, or at least wait for the patch notes before judging, but that’s just my opinion.

I don’t know where the ‘fact’ that Scarlet is a puppet came from. She may well be, but I didn’t get that from the video. I saw a construct….I have no reason to believe (or not believe) that Scarlet isn’t controlling that giant clockwork monstrosity. Maybe I missed something….. Lol, would not be the first time.

I think the implication is that it’s foreshadowing that she has become or will become a puppet, not that she is. It’s a metaphor…at least that’s what I think is being said.

knives.6345:

Oh and dungeons here have specific drops – meaning say Item A only drops on Dungeon A, and item A is needed to upgrade/craft certain item – which encourages players to actually run the dungeon – not just specific dungeons.

GW2 has exclusive dungeon gear, weapons and armor that you can only get by running that particular dungeon. So. Yeah.

As a bonus, it’s not some absurd RNG drop. Enough tokens gets you what you want free and clear.

knives.6345:

As you may have noticed, those are “minor” impacts, but it builds over time – thus creating an environment where players would actually want to participate to gain advantage over others. They are actually encouraged to participate. Note: Encouraged, not required.

Nothing in this game “requires” you to do anything. Nothing in this game will give you a clear advantage over another player that they can’t also reasonably work for.

One of the reasons I like GW2 so much is because of this. In my opinion, that kind of thing in traditional MMOs is really stupid.

From the sound of it, you must hate this game because it runs counter to that standard.

I mean there’s legendaries and ascended gear, but that’s the last tier of the time sink in this game and even these aren’t WoW or RO level in time needed.

Maybe you want more of a traditional MMO where you can work to be a degree better than the average player based on the time you put in.

You know what though? That’s okay. People have different tastes and likes. GW2 is an MMO that caters to a starved audience that wants something a little more accessible.

If you want to be able to put in lots of time to be objectively superior stat wise and gear wise to someone else who can’t play as often as you might be able to…

That’s okay. There is an endless stream of these kinds of MMOs for you to try out. But GW2 won’t be that kind of MMO.

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Only living story and nothing else till after 4th March sounds terrible to me!

Does this mean nothing at all for WvW and PvP till then?

I hope not, giving nothing to WvW or PvP till then will see the number of players decline considerably in 3 months.

It would mean, nothing new in WvW for 4 months+. Especially disappointing, considering they promised us a new map, which would mean no more queues and account bound wxp.

Love some clarification on this?

Does it mean absolutely nothing new till 4th March other than pure living story, including WvW and PvP?

DeWolfe.2174:

Reads more like people are bored with their real life and expecting WAY too much from a video game. Get out of the house and get some sun! Come back to the game if you feel like it. This isn’t a replacement for real life enjoyment and passion.

Sun? What’s that again? It’s January and I live in Britain: there is no “sun”. But I get out the house plenty. My job entails working in forests, woodlands and workshops, being in nature. I’m not expecting a second life here, but I am expecting there to be something that I want to do.

Cush.4063:

You’re argument doesn’t make sense

No, this sentence doesn’t make sense. “I am argument doesn’t make sense?” What kind of sentence is that?

Cush.4063:

because the content isn’t even out yet so you can’t even criticize it.

I didn’t. My posts here have said absolutely nothing on the content of this upcoming update. My criticisms have actually all been on anything other than updates, the things in between the updates, perhaps you didn’t read the post where I said how great some of the previous updates have been. That or you just have selected reading to try and back up your false claims.

Cush.4063:

Now if the content was out and you made a thread about what you didn’t like and about Anet disappointing you then it would completely make sense

But would probably still be preachily challenged by your “glass half full” philosophy.

Cush.4063:

but the fact that he and you is saying that whatever they come out with is kitten when you don’t even know what it is makes no contribution at all and doesn’t affect anything but other people’s optimism which just isn’t good for anything. Make sense? Thanks.

Where did I say this? Can you quote me on it please? If you can’t, I’ll assume you’re delusional. Thanks.

Cush.4063:

Cush….again OH, and my username is on the left of the screen too except it has some numbers after it

Yes, that’s why you don’t need to sign your name at the end of your posts, I can see who you are already. Makes you seem a bit self-centred.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Isn’t it interesting, then, that Anet’s major focus here is on telling a story? And, not just a story, but a living story. They clearly believe that a story can be told within the genre.

I would agree with you generally that story has not been a major element of games. I loved the statement by the creator of Diablo that they kinda tacked on the story at the end. While they didn’t achieve greatness in storytelling, they did manage to create a mood and general ambiance that served the game well. I do believe that storytelling can succeed to a larger degree than it has here. Consider a normal expansion in a game. A lot has happened, maybe even a cataclysm. Why would it not be possible to have the events of that cataclysm take place over time? Sure, you are not going to achieve the results of great literature as the medium won’t support it. But, I believe a lot more can be achieved than we’ve seen to date.

Raine.1394:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Isn’t it interesting, then, that Anet’s major focus here is on telling a story? And, not just a story, but a living story. They clearly believe that a story can be told within the genre.

I would agree with you generally that story has not been a major element of games. I loved the statement by the creator of Diablo that they kinda tacked on the story at the end. While they didn’t achieve greatness in storytelling, they did manage to create a mood and general ambiance. I do believe that storytelling can succeed to a larger degree than it has here. Consider a normal expansion in a game. A lot has happened, maybe even a cataclysm. Why would it not be possible to have the events of that cataclysm take place over time? Sure, you are not going to achieve the results of great literature as the medium won’t support it. But, I believe a lot more can be achieved than we’ve seen to date.

The living story has been changed to the living world to better reflect what it is, and it is living. It certainly changed Kessex Hills, and even the zones surrounding it.

If you look in the achievements section of the hero screen it says living world, not living story.

Anet said all along they want a living breathing world. That’s what they’ve been working toward. The word story, even though they used it themselves, is a red herring.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

There was a lot of excitement and positive chatter on the new boss while waiting on Tequatl to spawn, so there are definitely a lot of people that disagree with the OP.

Vayne.8563:

Raine.1394:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Isn’t it interesting, then, that Anet’s major focus here is on telling a story? And, not just a story, but a living story. They clearly believe that a story can be told within the genre.

I would agree with you generally that story has not been a major element of games. I loved the statement by the creator of Diablo that they kinda tacked on the story at the end. While they didn’t achieve greatness in storytelling, they did manage to create a mood and general ambiance. I do believe that storytelling can succeed to a larger degree than it has here. Consider a normal expansion in a game. A lot has happened, maybe even a cataclysm. Why would it not be possible to have the events of that cataclysm take place over time? Sure, you are not going to achieve the results of great literature as the medium won’t support it. But, I believe a lot more can be achieved than we’ve seen to date.

The living story has been changed to the living world to better reflect what it is, and it is living. It certainly changed Kessex Hills, and even the zones surrounding it.

If you look in the achievements section of the hero screen it says living world, not living story.

Anet said all along they want a living breathing world. That’s what they’ve been working toward. The word story, even though they used it themselves, is a red herring.

Sorry, Vayne, but I’ve been here since beta and know that the central focus of everything they’ve done to the present has been around story. Just look at the release titles; they all take place in the context of a story told. Sheesh, even the subtitle of the 7-Jan news item on the front page reads “Prepare for the epic finale to this story arc!”. How many times have you read the words “story arc” in the last year? “They said all along”, as though we haven’t been talking about story incessantly for the last year. Your history is a bit skewed.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

You must have pretty low standards, because the story in Guild Wars 1 was cliche too. Whether you liked it or not, if you can’t admit it’s cliche there’s not much else to talk about.

Like when you got to Kryta, you didn’t know the White Mantle where bad guys? You didn’t know the Shining Blade was good? You trusted Vizier Kilbron?

I find that hard to believe.

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

You can add content that actually changes the world? Not just a pile of rubbish in a trashed new player Zone.

In Everquest2 there was a world event to unlock a race. World events to provide travel to new continents, world events to build and rebuild transportation systems. Events that provided a lore background for introduced new classes. World events to unlock Guild halls and other desired content. Etc Etc. While later players did not experience the “Event” they were able to enjoy the perks the events heralded.. because the outcome of the Events were permanent content.

Another example of “Living World” would have been both Pre and Post NGE SWG.. in Pre NGE a lot of content was player created. Events were. Shops, vendors.. all player. World PvP depended on player created fortresses that could be destroyed by other players. Things changed daily.. totally based on players. Post NGE.. the GCW period, your factional control and score changed hourly.. solely driven by players changing the worlds. No reset. Nothing changed unless players made it change.

These things are not happening here. This world isn’t “living” save WVW, and that resets.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

You must have pretty low standards, because the story in Guild Wars 1 was cliche too. Whether you liked it or not, if you can’t admit it’s cliche there’s not much else to talk about.

Like when you got to Kryta, you didn’t know the White Mantle where bad guys? You didn’t know the Shining Blade was good? You trusted Vizier Kilbron?

I find that hard to believe.

I have a differing opinion than you, therefore I have “pretty low standards”. Amusing and predictable. Done.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

You must have pretty low standards, because the story in Guild Wars 1 was cliche too. Whether you liked it or not, if you can’t admit it’s cliche there’s not much else to talk about.

Like when you got to Kryta, you didn’t know the White Mantle where bad guys? You didn’t know the Shining Blade was good? You trusted Vizier Kilbron?

I find that hard to believe.

I have a differing opinion than you, therefore I have “pretty low standards”. Amusing and predictable. Done.

Edited to avoid an infraction….

Maybe you’re right. Maybe I’m wrong and it wasn’t cliche. I apologize.

I mean who’d ever have thought that giving religous zealots the accent of the Spanish Inquisition was cliche.

My mistake.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

You must have pretty low standards, because the story in Guild Wars 1 was cliche too. Whether you liked it or not, if you can’t admit it’s cliche there’s not much else to talk about.

Like when you got to Kryta, you didn’t know the White Mantle where bad guys? You didn’t know the Shining Blade was good? You trusted Vizier Kilbron?

I find that hard to believe.

I have a differing opinion than you, therefore I have “pretty low standards”. Amusing and predictable. Done.

No, you have low standards, if you can’t see that something cliche is cliche, having nothing to do with different opinons. It’s pretty much a fact it’s cliche down to the bad guys in that having the accents of the spanish inquisition.

It’s not his fault. Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition.

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

Blizzard managed it with great success, the places you saved stayed saved…wait that sounds familiar, and the world changed for you and any who helped forever. (Argent Vanguard, Shadow Vault) as example.

We all have an idea what to expect with the living story now, 12 step to chest, zerg zerg zerg.

mesme.5028:

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

Blizzard managed it with great success, the places you saved stayed saved…wait that sounds familiar, and the world changed for you and any who helped forever. (Argent Vanguard, Shadow Vault) as example.

We all have an idea what to expect with the living story now, 12 step to chest, zerg zerg zerg.

I don’t think this is true. That is to say it wasn’t true during the first year and a half. What they did later they did later.

I thoroughly expect changes in the world to change the world for everyone.

Because if you’re talking about phasing that came with an entire host of problems that people complained about for years.

Vayne.8563:

mesme.5028:

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

Blizzard managed it with great success, the places you saved stayed saved…wait that sounds familiar, and the world changed for you and any who helped forever. (Argent Vanguard, Shadow Vault) as example.

We all have an idea what to expect with the living story now, 12 step to chest, zerg zerg zerg.

I don’t think this is true. That is to say it wasn’t true during the first year and a half. What they did later they did later.

I thoroughly expect changes in the world to change the world for everyone.

Because if you’re talking about phasing that came with an entire host of problems that people complained about for years.

Yeh some peeps who didn’t open the game up complained about being phased, when all they had to do was the content.

Spiuk.8421:

NewTrain.7549:

If the purpose was to have fun, why aren’t those things fun?

(Preempting the “fun is subjective” argument)

They are to plenty of people.

If you keep playing a game you don’t have fun with that means you have a problem.

IMO after several years of playing MMOs, this is the core issue behind a big chunk of what you see on MMO forums. Players start a game all excited, they play it to death, and then expect the developers to keep pumping out gobs of content to help them maintain their “honeymoon period” indefinitely. It never happens to their satisfaction, but rather than recognize that maybe they’ve gotten all they can for their $50 and moving on, they spend the next N years on the forums complaining about how the “game isn’t fun”.

Even worse are those who never enjoyed the game because it wasn’t a good fit for them, but they hang around like zombies anyway, constantly griping about it.

Always amazing that people ask “what the point is” of doing things in a game.

mesme.5028:

Vayne.8563:

mesme.5028:

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

Blizzard managed it with great success, the places you saved stayed saved…wait that sounds familiar, and the world changed for you and any who helped forever. (Argent Vanguard, Shadow Vault) as example.

We all have an idea what to expect with the living story now, 12 step to chest, zerg zerg zerg.

I don’t think this is true. That is to say it wasn’t true during the first year and a half. What they did later they did later.

I thoroughly expect changes in the world to change the world for everyone.

Because if you’re talking about phasing that came with an entire host of problems that people complained about for years.

Yeh some peeps who didn’t open the game up complained about being phased, when all they had to do was the content.

From what I understood, phasing made it hard to group with friends and do stuff together. Different people were at different points in the same quest chain and it became inconvenient for some people. It was like people who didn’t want to go back to earlier zones to level with friends, so they created alts they only played when those friends were on. It was inconvenient.

The people that I know who were complaining were playing at the time.

mesme.5028:

Vayne.8563:

mesme.5028:

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

Blizzard managed it with great success, the places you saved stayed saved…wait that sounds familiar, and the world changed for you and any who helped forever. (Argent Vanguard, Shadow Vault) as example.

We all have an idea what to expect with the living story now, 12 step to chest, zerg zerg zerg.

I don’t think this is true. That is to say it wasn’t true during the first year and a half. What they did later they did later.

I thoroughly expect changes in the world to change the world for everyone.

Because if you’re talking about phasing that came with an entire host of problems that people complained about for years.

Yeh some peeps who didn’t open the game up complained about being phased, when all they had to do was the content.

I remember having party members disappear because we were at different phases. Run across a line, they reappear. Run back, disappear. Definitely not something I’d call a good system.

Qaelyn.7612:

Spiuk.8421:

NewTrain.7549:

If the purpose was to have fun, why aren’t those things fun?

(Preempting the “fun is subjective” argument)

They are to plenty of people.

If you keep playing a game you don’t have fun with that means you have a problem.

IMO after several years of playing MMOs, this is the core issue behind a big chunk of what you see on MMO forums. Players start a game all excited, they play it to death, and then expect the developers to keep pumping out gobs of content to help them maintain their “honeymoon period” indefinitely. It never happens to their satisfaction, but rather than recognize that maybe they’ve gotten all they can for their $50 and moving on, they spend the next N years on the forums complaining about how the “game isn’t fun”.

Even worse are those who never enjoyed the game because it wasn’t a good fit for them, but they hang around like zombies anyway, constantly griping about it.

Always amazing that people ask “what the point is” of doing things in a game.

I agree with some of what you say, but i think most do have fun in the things they want to do, i know i have lots of fun in fracts for example, but aspects of the game frustrate peeps and its that most talk about, things that matter to them, as example i can mine mithril in fracts but i can’t mine dragonite which i need for ascended gear to progress in fracts, so i have to do trash zerg content i don’t enjoy to obtain said ore.

mesme.5028:

Qaelyn.7612:

Spiuk.8421:

NewTrain.7549:

If the purpose was to have fun, why aren’t those things fun?

(Preempting the “fun is subjective” argument)

They are to plenty of people.

If you keep playing a game you don’t have fun with that means you have a problem.

IMO after several years of playing MMOs, this is the core issue behind a big chunk of what you see on MMO forums. Players start a game all excited, they play it to death, and then expect the developers to keep pumping out gobs of content to help them maintain their “honeymoon period” indefinitely. It never happens to their satisfaction, but rather than recognize that maybe they’ve gotten all they can for their $50 and moving on, they spend the next N years on the forums complaining about how the “game isn’t fun”.

Even worse are those who never enjoyed the game because it wasn’t a good fit for them, but they hang around like zombies anyway, constantly griping about it.

Always amazing that people ask “what the point is” of doing things in a game.

I agree with some of what you say, but i think most do have fun in the things they want to do, i know i have lots of fun in fracts for example, but aspects of the game frustrate peeps and its that most talk about, things that matter to them, as example i can mine mithril in fracts but i can’t mine dragonite which i need for ascended gear to progress in fracts, so i have to do trash zerg content i don’t enjoy to obtain said ore.

I know it seems logical to players that you should be able to get everything in the game by doing one thing in the game that you like most. But that’s actually not good game design…especially for an MMO.

A lot of the complaints of MMOs that are older is that the world is dead, because people sit around and wait for their instances to pop. You hear this all the time. That’s because those MMOs don’t do enough to get people into the world.

Anet is proactively trying to do this, solving a problem most other MMOs experience.

I understand this isn’t your preference, but that doesn’t make it bad design. There are people who will be annoyed at having to do stuff and they’ll either do it, or they won’t do it. They’ll either leave or stay.

But if the majority of people like seeing people at events, and this gets people to do those events, because they need those mats, then Anet is actually solving a problem…even if the solution is one you’d rather not deal with.

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

how about for fun? yes i know a real phenomenon playing a game to have fun.

Vayne.8563:

mesme.5028:

Qaelyn.7612:

Spiuk.8421:

NewTrain.7549:

If the purpose was to have fun, why aren’t those things fun?

(Preempting the “fun is subjective” argument)

They are to plenty of people.

If you keep playing a game you don’t have fun with that means you have a problem.

IMO after several years of playing MMOs, this is the core issue behind a big chunk of what you see on MMO forums. Players start a game all excited, they play it to death, and then expect the developers to keep pumping out gobs of content to help them maintain their “honeymoon period” indefinitely. It never happens to their satisfaction, but rather than recognize that maybe they’ve gotten all they can for their $50 and moving on, they spend the next N years on the forums complaining about how the “game isn’t fun”.

Even worse are those who never enjoyed the game because it wasn’t a good fit for them, but they hang around like zombies anyway, constantly griping about it.

Always amazing that people ask “what the point is” of doing things in a game.

I agree with some of what you say, but i think most do have fun in the things they want to do, i know i have lots of fun in fracts for example, but aspects of the game frustrate peeps and its that most talk about, things that matter to them, as example i can mine mithril in fracts but i can’t mine dragonite which i need for ascended gear to progress in fracts, so i have to do trash zerg content i don’t enjoy to obtain said ore.

I know it seems logical to players that you should be able to get everything in the game by doing one thing in the game that you like most. But that’s actually not good game design…especially for an MMO.

A lot of the complaints of MMOs that are older is that the world is dead, because people sit around and wait for their instances to pop. You hear this all the time. That’s because those MMOs don’t do enough to get people into the world.

Anet is proactively trying to do this, solving a problem most other MMOs experience.

I understand this isn’t your preference, but that doesn’t make it bad design. There are people who will be annoyed at having to do stuff and they’ll either do it, or they won’t do it. They’ll either leave or stay.

But if the majority of people like seeing people at events, and this gets people to do those events, because they need those mats, then Anet is actually solving a problem…even if the solution is one you’d rather not deal with.

I was using said ore as an example of why someone may complain but be happy enough playing, but i understand your view point.

knives.6345:

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

For one, I played Ragnarok Online. We have this thing called “War of the Emperium” where your guild does a siege on a castle controlled by another guild (or guild alliance…) and this happens 1x a day for an hour. Once the time ends, whoever is occupying the castle owns it. Overnight, it has a chance to generate items needed to craft Legendary items or release items that are rare in nature (as in few players owns the items). And mind you, Legendary items here are truly Legendary. Not more than 10% of the people have them. And they have legendary backgrounds (Mjolnir, Sleipneir, Megingard….)

Another is Cabal Online – where we have this thing called “Mission War” – the more kills you have, the more “War Exp” you gain – your rank determines your reward. It happens 6x a day in a 3 hour interval. Your War Exp can also be traded for items/exp/skill points – items which would randomly generate an “Upgrade Core” which could be used to enhance items. There are 4 types of those cores, each catering to a specific item tier. You also gain a “Title” upon reaching specific War Exp – which gives you minor but noticable bonuses – such as + 500 HP, +10% resist critical hit, +30% resist critical damage – very helpful on PvP and dungeon runs.
If you are consistently on the top for 1 week, you also gain the chance to become a “Bringer” – a commander equivalent – with added bonus stat points, effects and shout – which everyone across the world can read. It’s usually used inside the Mission War for “commanding”
Oh and dungeons here have specific drops – meaning say Item A only drops on Dungeon A, and item A is needed to upgrade/craft certain item – which encourages players to actually run the dungeon – not just specific dungeons.

Another game – Rising Force Online – I’ve not played this long, but there are 3 factions which competes for a specific area on where players could “mine” resources to upgrade their gear.

As you may have noticed, those are “minor” impacts, but it builds over time – thus creating an environment where players would actually want to participate to gain advantage over others. They are actually encouraged to participate. Note: Encouraged, not required.

Nice work, quoting games that you’ve clearly stopped playing despite how “cool” these features were. Two of which I’ve never even heard of, so I doubt they were even mainstream at one time.

ArrDee.2573:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

how about for fun? yes i know a real phenomenon playing a game to have fun.

What’s especially funny is that he only put “lol” for champ trains, when indeed, many people do those for fun. The one in Queensdale in particular is very slow and it’s obvious many people do it because they get loot, but can do it at a leisurely pace.

I’m on TC and there are tons of people who hang around in Queensdale or Divinity’s Reach or Lion’s Arch doing RP. They get no “reward” for this, I wonder why they do it?!

Vayne.8563:

Well, seems to me on patch does someone must like the content, because I keep getting put into overflows. I mean consistently.

Sometimes I’m on overflows for days and days after a patch hits.

Again, you’re on the most populated server of the entire game, if you didn’t get any overflow in patch day, i’d be worried…
But have you ever tried to guest into the less crowded servers, the ones people open threads about on daily basis, asking for merge because they are empty? I’m sure you’ll not have any overflow there, even on patch days.

Vayne.8563:

You must have pretty low standards, because the story in Guild Wars 1 was cliche too. Whether you liked it or not, if you can’t admit it’s cliche there’s not much else to talk about..

Since you praised the Living Story in more threads than i care to remember (yep, calling it Story, but now i see it’s more convenient to call it World), and how much a good character Scarlet is, and now in this very topic you said that games like TSW, AoC and The Old Republic don’t have a good story… Well, i wouldn’t be sure who’s the one with pretty low standards…

But anyway, it’s your opinion, and it’s as good as his, no less and no more.