Guild Wars 2

I’ve gotten some good advice from players in Heart of the Mists, before, though. As a former WoW player, I expected to be immediately shamed and ridiculed, but there’s always people willing to answer your questions, there (at least in my experience).

Vayne.8563:

I’ve tried play PvP in other games and this games. There are annoying people in both arenas but frankly, I prefer the Guild Wars 2 crowd to most of the other games I’ve played.

I should mention hot join is actually worse than solo queue, if you haven’t tried it. Many of the trolls end up in hot join.

Yup, there are some real charmers in hot join pvp…..lol. I always seem to encounter the worst people just after school lets out during the day. Seems like the really insecure youngsters are on in the largest numbers between the hours of 1-4pm, west coast time.

That being said, I find the GW2 community, overall, to be very friendly, for the most part. Certainly better than a lot of other mmos that I have played.

It is very, very, very easy to make a PvP match absolutely miserable for everyone involved, because of how insanely inconsequential it is to break the Terms of Use in Guild Wars 2.

Since April 2014, the PvP community has been getting worse daily. That’s what happens when you reward players for disrupting the game.

I have no idea where all these toxic PvPers are. I never did PvP all that often until recently with the Dailies change. I’ll go into Unranked Arena often with a build completely unsuited for PvP, and I’ll see maybe one jerk every 3-4 days. Map and Say chat is pretty silent for the most part. As it is, this is the only online RPG I’ve been part of where I can PvP with any regularity and have a good time.

xDudisx.5914:

I used to run speed runs with 2 friends when I was farming for the second legendary. We would kick people for not pinging right gear or going to wrong stack. Yes puging speed runs makes you become a toxic player.

That’s why I don’t speedrun.

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Conaywea.5062:

just block

/15 charrs

I shouldn’t have to, that’s what I’ve been telling several people in this entire discussion.

the block option is not an excuse for bad behaviour.
Nor is the chat filter.
Nor is mute.

There’s nothing you are going to do about it, though. All you can do is set your expectations lower about people. There’s always going to be someone with a bad day or someone who is frustrated, or whatever the reason may be. That is not saying that it’s allright, but it is the way people work.

It’s a bit of a long stretch to expect an utopian world where everyone is nice and jolly and good at all times. There’s some lines you can draw though, but that’s qll very subjective.

So to summarize, it’s toxic when you are expected to carry your own weight.

Wethospu.6437:

So to summarize, it’s toxic when you are expected to carry your own weight.

yes, now carry those cleric wearing ranged warriors, you evil elitist!

“PvP-ers” “PvE-ers” “RP-ers” “PvE Scrubs” “Elistists” “Completionists” “Achievementists” etc….

What will make the community even better is if we all stop labelling each other as if we’re different players – We are all Guild Wars 2 players at the end of the day, and labels segregate the player base, creating pockets of discontent.

Sane.5072:

Elegy.2159:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

How do you teach a dog that what it does is wrong? you punish it.

Negative reinforcement is the least effective way to train a dog. I’ve been training dogs professionally for years, believe me. As far as people go though, punishment might work? I’m no human psychologist, but I’m interested in how effective negative reinforcement actually is. I could see it going either way.

Just want to clarify here a few things about reinforcement… First off, I agree with you completely, I think scolding, screaming and punishing generally to be one of the worst ways to train a dog. However, all of these actually fall under the term of positive reinforcement. A goo dway to look at it is positive = presentation of a stimulus in response to a behaviour and negative = removal of stimulus in response to a behavious.

Here’s a resource on this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforcement and hopefully it will help keep us all on the same page.

Also, punishment is different from negative reinforcement. The first has the purpose to end or minimize a behavior while the second is about maintaining one.

Wetpaw.3487:

It’s not a label, but generalization of a segment of the community that holds true through personal experience, forum posts, and the meta that drives it.

So when someone says the dungeon segment of the community is not much better, it doesn’t mean every player of that segment. Out of the game modes Spvp & dungeons do receive the most complaints because they’re a meta driven content in a play how you want game.

Odd this has to be explained in the first place, if I read your post right.

Oddly, the last time I was doing the breach, I went to the cooper and was met with extreme hostility because I was using AoE. For me, open world pvers are the most toxic players.

And no, pvp and dungeons don’t get the most complaints because they are meta driven but because people that weigh too much cannot be carried.

Wethospu.6437:

So to summarize, it’s toxic when you are expected to carry your own weight.

^
In game modes where you can be a unique snowflake it doesn’t matter how heavy you are and even if it does, who could notice that?

There’s no “nice community” in competitive scene because everyone wants to win.
Go play something like LoL and you’d see lots of angry players too.

I’ve played a large variety of multiplayer games.
You find flaming, name-calling and this kind of stuff in every single one of them.
As with other games, you’ll find some of the worst scum the internet has to offer, right here in GW2. I’ve had my fair share of these stereotypes in dungeon-groups when I played with friends, we needed a random and had the “luck” of finding one who thought every dungeon-group should be a zerker-only group, even if not advertised as such, flaming at each of us 4 when his kick-votes didn’t work.

However, one thing really makes this community(at least in PvE) shine: The high likelyness of finding a player who is not only helping you via chat, but also takes his/her own free time to help you directly. Personally I found it to be contagious…the times I taught players how to get through the Rhendak Mini Dungeon instead if spamming the map-chat for a mesmer-portal, are really piling up.

It’s not that there are no ugly sides to this community, but there are some extraordinarily shiny ones as well.

In my opinion the mechanics of the game helped a lot to make it a better community. No fighting over harvesting nodes, no loot drama, and no monster tagging. All positive points.

Its almost as good as City of Heroes. Though that game came out years before and did community stuff a great deal better. That game had an awesome community behind it (and that community is still fighting the good fight to get their game or some game like it back to life!). Yes, even better then this one (no disrespect to GW2 community or A-Net, I still play and like it in this game as well). It had all those positive points and more.

I think A-Net is on the right track in mechanics that help build a better community, but I know they have the talents to make it so much more and I hope to see more of it in the future.

Having played PvP in several games I can tell you flat out this is why a great many PvE players don’t want anything to do with PvP in general. You know I see so many people try and defend PvP as not being abusive and complain that it’s a stereotype thrust upon them or a stigma that was attached in another game following PvP communities and isn’t deserved, well that’s utter BS! PvP communities got this stereotype by being exactly what they are so it makes me laugh when I see players trying to defend it as unjust or not that way here.
PvP in any game is a fairly toxic community and this isn’t a stigma in fact it has become a dogma and that is the underlying reason many PvE players avoid it like the plague.

OtakuDFifty.2965:

I have no idea where all these toxic PvPers are. I never did PvP all that often until recently with the Dailies change. I’ll go into Unranked Arena often with a build completely unsuited for PvP, and I’ll see maybe one jerk every 3-4 days. Map and Say chat is pretty silent for the most part. As it is, this is the only online RPG I’ve been part of where I can PvP with any regularity and have a good time.

Most of my bad experiences with pvp hotjoin players was before the dailies change. Since the dailies change, I have noticed a far better attitude in pvp hotjoin. I think it is mainly due to the fact that a lot of those hotjoin people now are just regular players(like me) trying to get their dailies quickly and with a minimal of fuss. Not to say that there still aren’t jerks, but they have been in lesser numbers lately. I notice most of the jerks now in the pvp lobby on map chat.

TheMagickDoll.7594:

In my opinion the mechanics of the game helped a lot to make it a better community. No fighting over harvesting nodes, no loot drama, and no monster tagging. All positive points.

Its almost as good as City of Heroes. Though that game came out years before and did community stuff a great deal better. That game had an awesome community behind it (and that community is still fighting the good fight to get their game or some game like it back to life!). Yes, even better then this one (no disrespect to GW2 community or A-Net, I still play and like it in this game as well). It had all those positive points and more.

I think A-Net is on the right track in mechanics that help build a better community, but I know they have the talents to make it so much more and I hope to see more of it in the future.

Agreed. The fact that there is no kill stealing or camp squatting, etc., makes for a much friendlier community in general. When you can come into an encounter after it has started, help the other player(s) kill the npc, and everyone still gets the same experience/drops for it is a huge thing in encouraging friendly cooperation and play.

When I played DaoC back in the day, things could get very toxic in that game, as kill stealing and camps happened with great regularity and encouraged a cut throat sort of attitude among the community.

Fortunately, GW2 takes a different tact that works quite well, imo.

Vlad Morbius.1759:

Having played PvP in several games I can tell you flat out this is why a great many PvE players don’t want anything to do with PvP in general. You know I see so many people try and defend PvP as not being abusive and complain that it’s a stereotype thrust upon them or a stigma that was attached in another game following PvP communities and isn’t deserved, well that’s utter BS! PvP communities got this stereotype by being exactly what they are so it makes me laugh when I see players trying to defend it as unjust or not that way here.
PvP in any game is a fairly toxic community and this isn’t a stigma in fact it has become a dogma and that is the underlying reason many PvE players avoid it like the plague.

I avoid it like a plague for pretty much this reason – is always the same rancid brew no matter where I go, because people do not differ much even if the games do.

It seems pretty standard that those most eager to PvP in MMOs are also typically the most confrontational, short tempered and immature players I ever meet.

Some aren’t, but most I’ve ever had anything to do with were like that guy that justifies every racist, misogynistic and feebleminded ego-serving opinion he had by saying ’I’m just being honest’.

It’s a game mode that persistently attracts those most eager for violent conflict with other people, so there no shortage of those with titanic chips on their shoulders over politics, religion, national ‘pride’; you name it, someone is out there right now trash talking as fast as their ragefingers can type about it.

There really are people that enjoy nothing so much as making others as unhappy as they themselves are, and PvP is where you’ll find most of them where they occur in these games.

Ergo, I’ve learned by experience to regard PvP as that part of town one never goes unless one absolutely must. It’s a ghetto of human decency where anarchy is king and looking for anything good there is wasted time.

I don’t live in a slum. I don’t surround myself with vicious animals typically seeking little more than momentary gratification of base urges to feel powerful.

So why would I PvP when a casually observable vast majority of pvpers are vicious animals typically seeking nothing so much as their next fix of cheap adrenaline and psychological ’I’m powerful’ euphoria?

Some would instantly cry that they’re not like that. Probably most that do so the most quickly are exactly like that and are merely offended at being correctly summarized.

Some will try to distance themselves from association with the negative connotations, adding that they are different and help everyone and never ever see anyone being mean except very rarely, but you can just ignore that and it’s your fault if you don’t have thicker skin.

Yet others will try to attack something or someone else in a toddler-grade attempt to deflect criticism, then maunder around in poorly thought out rationalizations and justifications, usually to do with how arrogant anyone that disagrees with them is.

These diversions have already happened. These ‘conversations’ are almost twenty years old.

And PvP remains the anarchists toilet to go looking for very many friendly, socially and emotionally stable people behaving as such in.

PvP is where everyone that wants to feel superior to and more powerful than others can go to fight about it.

Nobody ever actually wins because nobody ever really can, except the devs and their studios that have wisely figure it how to monetize those eager to be vicious animals about something at someone.

PvP should never not be included in these games, I conclude. It’s a wonderful cesspit for those that like rolling around in vitriol, and keeps them more often out of everyone else’s hair.

Sane.5072:

Elegy.2159:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

How do you teach a dog that what it does is wrong? you punish it.

Negative reinforcement is the least effective way to train a dog. I’ve been training dogs professionally for years, believe me. As far as people go though, punishment might work? I’m no human psychologist, but I’m interested in how effective negative reinforcement actually is. I could see it going either way.

Just want to clarify here a few things about reinforcement… First off, I agree with you completely, I think scolding, screaming and punishing generally to be one of the worst ways to train a dog. However, all of these actually fall under the term of positive reinforcement. A goo dway to look at it is positive = presentation of a stimulus in response to a behaviour and negative = removal of stimulus in response to a behavious.

Here’s a resource on this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforcement and hopefully it will help keep us all on the same page.

if you think I hurt my baby girl you are wrong, I could never hurt her.

Guhracie.3419:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Guhracie.3419:

It’s not about accepting it or excusing the behavior. It’s about acknowledging that it’s going to happen and using personal coping mechanisms as well as functions in the game to handle it.

You literally cannot change another person. All you can do is change your response.

How do you teach a dog that what it does is wrong? you punish it.

That’s why I right click and report for verbal abuse. In order to punish, one must have the authority to do so, and you and I have no such authority in GW2. The staff are the only people who have that authority. Other PvP players aren’t your dog, or your children, or your patients, or your minions. Punishing them is simply not an option.

if you think I meant it in that sense you haven’t been reading all my 10+ points, I’m sorry, but nowhere did I claim to have any such authority, the post you quoted was me stating how you can correct someones behavior not me giving myself the privilege to do so.

Read before you post please.

xDudisx.5914:

Open world pve is probably the best community. Followed by wvw. The 2 most toxic communities are spvp and dungeon.

Where skill and individual performance actually matter and you can’t just blob together with 109238129083 other players and be carried to victory by said numbers.

Also for people who don’t really get why verbal violence is a thing in PvP – it might be an adapted way for old-time pvp players to try to push out newer players they don’t want on their teams/in their games.

New players are less used to the “pvp verbal violence” that older players might be accustomed to. By berating them and insulting them there’s a higher chance they’ll feel offended, hurt and be pushed away from pvp in general.

This also means there’s a lower chance they’ll end up on your team next time.

Just a theory.

Harper.4173:

xDudisx.5914:

Open world pve is probably the best community. Followed by wvw. The 2 most toxic communities are spvp and dungeon.

Where skill and individual performance actually matter and you can’t just blob together with 109238129083 other players and be carried to victory by said numbers.

Pve is 90% about bring the right gear+comp and 1 or 2 dodges sometimes. Most dmg is bypassed with reflect+block+ kill the mob to fast before I die.

Even wvw require more skill because you are agaist a player not an npc that does the same skill rotation every time.

naiasonod.9265:

PvP should never not be included in these games, I conclude. It’s a wonderful cesspit for those that like rolling around in vitriol, and keeps them more often out of everyone else’s hair.

If only for that reason, pvp should be included in these games. It gives the bratty kids a place to hang out, rather than coming out to wvw or pve and annoying others there.

That being said, I have met some decent people in pvp….but they rarely ever are people who just play all the time in pvp. I only go to pvp for dailies…..period. When I first started doing some pvp, I was interested in some of the reward lines…..but after having to deal with a very large number of insecure, misogynist, horny, racist little children(that would only behave like that when they have an anonymous character and computer screen to bravely hide behind)……I pretty much avoid pvp, too. Just a quick trip for my daily, and then back to pve/wvw.

Lately though, and I think it is because of the daily change, the people in hotjoin pvp seem to be nicer on average……as they are there for similar reasons as myself…..getting a daily or two and getting out.

However, I find that the pvp lobby chat is still just as caustic/vile on the whole.

Seems like you haven’t played enough games to realize how bad communities are out there.

Teon.5168:

naiasonod.9265:

PvP should never not be included in these games, I conclude. It’s a wonderful cesspit for those that like rolling around in vitriol, and keeps them more often out of everyone else’s hair.

If only for that reason, pvp should be included in these games. It gives the bratty kids a place to hang out, rather than coming out to wvw or pve and annoying others there.

That being said, I have met some decent people in pvp….but they rarely ever are people who just play all the time in pvp. I only go to pvp for dailies…..period. When I first started doing some pvp, I was interested in some of the reward lines…..but after having to deal with a very large number of insecure, misogynist, horny, racist little children(that would only behave like that when they have an anonymous character and computer screen to bravely hide behind)……I pretty much avoid pvp, too. Just a quick trip for my daily, and then back to pve/wvw.

Lately though, and I think it is because of the daily change, the people in hotjoin pvp seem to be nicer on average……as they are there for similar reasons as myself…..getting a daily or two and getting out.

However, I find that the pvp lobby chat is still just as caustic/vile on the whole.

I absolutely agree, particular with the bolded part. There’s no game mode in which everyone’s all-wonderful all the time, though pvp tends to attract and encourage the worst sorts to be worse still.

I’m all for it being a game mode all the same, as said. People like that should have their place to go. They’d be frustrated and out amongst everyone else if it weren’t there for them to be vicious to eachother in, and that, I suspect, would not go well nowadays.

Fuji.6284:

Seems like you haven’t played enough games to realize how bad communities are out there.

You’re absolutely correct on that for people who think that the GW2 community is not very nice.

A lot of the earlier mmorpgs that I played had truly, truly vile communities. I remember doing some trials of atlantis runs in DaoC with this ‘leader’ who was very good at getting the runs done….but man, was he a rough, abusive sort of guy. Felt like the only way to run the group was by screaming at everyone……and that was just one in a vast multitude of those sorts of experiences I have had in all sorts of other, older mmorpgs.

GW2 has, by far, at least in my experience over the last couple years…….the friendliest/most helpful community that I have ever experienced in any mmorpg.

Teon.5168:

naiasonod.9265:

PvP should never not be included in these games, I conclude. It’s a wonderful cesspit for those that like rolling around in vitriol, and keeps them more often out of everyone else’s hair.

If only for that reason, pvp should be included in these games. It gives the bratty kids a place to hang out, rather than coming out to wvw or pve and annoying others there.

That being said, I have met some decent people in pvp….but they rarely ever are people who just play all the time in pvp. I only go to pvp for dailies…..period. When I first started doing some pvp, I was interested in some of the reward lines…..but after having to deal with a very large number of insecure, misogynist, horny, racist little children(that would only behave like that when they have an anonymous character and computer screen to bravely hide behind)……I pretty much avoid pvp, too. Just a quick trip for my daily, and then back to pve/wvw.

Lately though, and I think it is because of the daily change, the people in hotjoin pvp seem to be nicer on average……as they are there for similar reasons as myself…..getting a daily or two and getting out.

However, I find that the pvp lobby chat is still just as caustic/vile on the whole.

They’re not any “nicer”.
They just don’t care, that’s why they’re not angry.
This type of attitude is actually even worse than people who gets mad or sad when they lose. They just simply don’t care about pvp in general, that improvement and regret is not necessary at all.

If you put those people in a world boss that’d fail if the people are not coordinate, and the reward is precursor, they’d suddenly become hostile when they fail. That’s the true nature of human being, simple as that.

Stop imposing those hypocritical theories on other people.

Aomine.5012:

They’re not any “nicer”.
They just don’t care, that’s why they’re not angry.
This type of attitude is actually even worse than people who gets mad or sad when they lose. They just simply don’t care about pvp in general, that improvement and regret is not necessary at all.

If you put those people in a world boss that’d fail if the people are not coordinate, and the reward is precursor, they’d suddenly become hostile when they fail. That’s the true nature of human being, simple as that.

Stop imposing those hypocritical theories on other people.

You’re comparing the conclusion of a 5-minute match to… an item worth hundreds of gold, hours of play time, and excessive rarity.

Those rewards don’t even compare, so it’s not even hypocritical. Please don’t try to bring flimsy logic just so you can vilify this otherwise wonderful community.

Aomine.5012:

They’re not any “nicer”.
They just don’t care, that’s why they’re not angry.
This type of attitude is actually even worse than people who gets mad or sad when they lose. They just simply don’t care about pvp in general, that improvement and regret is not necessary at all.

If you put those people in a world boss that’d fail if the people are not coordinate, and the reward is precursor, they’d suddenly become hostile when they fail. That’s the true nature of human being, simple as that.

Stop imposing those hypocritical theories on other people.

Aren’t you doing exactly the same thing that you’re accusing me of with your above post? ‘Imposing your hypocritical theories on other people’?

But hey, I gotta love good irony.

Fernling.1729:

PvE side is probably what they meant. People are fantastic in PvE areas.
PvP is just as bad as any other game with PvP.

Agreed except for dungeons. The fact that speed running them is the easiest way to farm gold, fragments etc. can really bring out the worst in some people there.

Caeledh.5437:

Fernling.1729:

PvE side is probably what they meant. People are fantastic in PvE areas.
PvP is just as bad as any other game with PvP.

Agreed except for dungeons. The fact that speed running them is the easiest way to farm gold, fragments etc. can really bring out the worst in some people there.

I do a fair amount of dungeons rather regularly, and while I can confirm that my experiences have very infrequently been awful while pugging courtesy of jerks obsessing over turning casual runs into speed runs and troll-kicking others when at the final bosses, that’s been rather infrequent.

I pug pretty often just ‘cause I can, and I don’t usually have much trouble. Then again, I’m usually the one putting the listing up and specifically calling for newbs, necros and casuals looking to learn a path.

That doesn’t usually attract that ‘80-only ping zerker 7000+ AP or kick’ crowd, and those seem to typically be the ones that don’t play well with others.

naiasonod.9265:

Caeledh.5437:

Fernling.1729:

PvE side is probably what they meant. People are fantastic in PvE areas.
PvP is just as bad as any other game with PvP.

Agreed except for dungeons. The fact that speed running them is the easiest way to farm gold, fragments etc. can really bring out the worst in some people there.

I do a fair amount of dungeons rather regularly, and while I can confirm that my experiences have very infrequently been awful while pugging courtesy of jerks obsessing over turning casual runs into speed runs and troll-kicking others when at the final bosses, that’s been rather infrequent.

I pug pretty often just ‘cause I can, and I don’t usually have much trouble. Then again, I’m usually the one putting the listing up and specifically calling for newbs, necros and casuals looking to learn a path.

That doesn’t usually attract that ‘80-only ping zerker 7000+ AP or kick’ crowd, and those seem to typically be the ones that don’t play well with others.

Caeledh did say bring out the worst in some. Some doesn’t mean all or a majority.

Being an environment that requires coordination and cooperation between 5 players, except for the very skilled, is a set up for drama and fights if two play styles clash or the run isn’t going smoothly. And it’s an environment where it’s bad to ignore chat. Teq and Wurm as long as you know the gist of the fight, ignoring the chat isn’t going to destroy the chances of you getting rewarded. Ignoring chat in a dungeon could lead you to being kicked.

Seera.5916:

naiasonod.9265:

Caeledh.5437:

Fernling.1729:

PvE side is probably what they meant. People are fantastic in PvE areas.
PvP is just as bad as any other game with PvP.

Agreed except for dungeons. The fact that speed running them is the easiest way to farm gold, fragments etc. can really bring out the worst in some people there.

I do a fair amount of dungeons rather regularly, and while I can confirm that my experiences have very infrequently been awful while pugging courtesy of jerks obsessing over turning casual runs into speed runs and troll-kicking others when at the final bosses, that’s been rather infrequent.

I pug pretty often just ‘cause I can, and I don’t usually have much trouble. Then again, I’m usually the one putting the listing up and specifically calling for newbs, necros and casuals looking to learn a path.

That doesn’t usually attract that ‘80-only ping zerker 7000+ AP or kick’ crowd, and those seem to typically be the ones that don’t play well with others.

Caeledh did say bring out the worst in some. Some doesn’t mean all or a majority.

Being an environment that requires coordination and cooperation between 5 players, except for the very skilled, is a set up for drama and fights if two play styles clash or the run isn’t going smoothly. And it’s an environment where it’s bad to ignore chat. Teq and Wurm as long as you know the gist of the fight, ignoring the chat isn’t going to destroy the chances of you getting rewarded. Ignoring chat in a dungeon could lead you to being kicked.

9/10 times players like these are bad anyways. In the skill aspect. Anyone who was relatively skilled would realize gear and ap mean jack kitten when it comes to knowing a fight, or performing well itself.

I’d love to see these kids in real mmos that take effort and coordination from more than 5 player’s while competing against entire servers for achievements.

Hardcore in a casual mmo.

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Sane.5072:

Elegy.2159:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

How do you teach a dog that what it does is wrong? you punish it.

Negative reinforcement is the least effective way to train a dog. I’ve been training dogs professionally for years, believe me. As far as people go though, punishment might work? I’m no human psychologist, but I’m interested in how effective negative reinforcement actually is. I could see it going either way.

Just want to clarify here a few things about reinforcement… First off, I agree with you completely, I think scolding, screaming and punishing generally to be one of the worst ways to train a dog. However, all of these actually fall under the term of positive reinforcement. A goo dway to look at it is positive = presentation of a stimulus in response to a behaviour and negative = removal of stimulus in response to a behavious.

Here’s a resource on this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforcement and hopefully it will help keep us all on the same page.

if you think I hurt my baby girl you are wrong, I could never hurt her.

Guhracie.3419:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Guhracie.3419:

It’s not about accepting it or excusing the behavior. It’s about acknowledging that it’s going to happen and using personal coping mechanisms as well as functions in the game to handle it.

You literally cannot change another person. All you can do is change your response.

How do you teach a dog that what it does is wrong? you punish it.

That’s why I right click and report for verbal abuse. In order to punish, one must have the authority to do so, and you and I have no such authority in GW2. The staff are the only people who have that authority. Other PvP players aren’t your dog, or your children, or your patients, or your minions. Punishing them is simply not an option.

if you think I meant it in that sense you haven’t been reading all my 10+ points, I’m sorry, but nowhere did I claim to have any such authority, the post you quoted was me stating how you can correct someones behavior not me giving myself the privilege to do so.

Read before you post please.

You talked about doling out punishment to your dog in a thread in which you stated that PvPers should be punished for their actions. Am I not supposed to link the two? As far as I know, nobody in this thread has suggested that it’s acceptable to be verbally abusive, so what is the point of talking about yelling at your dog, when there is no corollary in game? Because I have to tell you, yelling at rude PvPers is a little like peeing on your carpet to convince your dog not to.

I don’t understand the point. There are tools given to us in-game to help deal with these people. Saying that you shouldn’t have to use those tools is not a solution. What, exactly, are you hoping will happen, here? Because if your hope is that people will just stop being mean because you say so, that is painfully naive.

There is literally no other advice/input people can give here. So why are you acting offended that people have suggested you block and move on? This is not a problem that can be fixed, and you’re acting like it can be.

naiasonod.9265:

I do a fair amount of dungeons rather regularly, and while I can confirm that my experiences have very infrequently been awful while pugging courtesy of jerks obsessing over turning casual runs into speed runs and troll-kicking others when at the final bosses, that’s been rather infrequent.

Yeah it’s definitely not all, which is why I said some.

What I was disagreeing with was the distinction between PvE and PvP on this issue. For the most part GW2’s community is amongst the best and I tip my hat to the designers on that score. The PvE game has generally been designed to encourage players to help each other and rewards for them for it. It’s fantastic.

The stark exception is dungeons where it can get very nasty, and in a way I haven’t seen in other MMOs. It’s a shame.

Sticks and stones may break my bones
But words will never hurt me.

The best I’ve encountered in online gaming. PvP is probably another matter, but go try APB Reloaded for a toxic community. You’ll have 25 stacks of poison on you in an instant. :p

Guhracie.3419:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Guhracie.3419:

It’s not about accepting it or excusing the behavior. It’s about acknowledging that it’s going to happen and using personal coping mechanisms as well as functions in the game to handle it.

You literally cannot change another person. All you can do is change your response.

How do you teach a dog that what it does is wrong? you punish it.

That’s why I right click and report for verbal abuse. In order to punish, one must have the authority to do so, and you and I have no such authority in GW2. The staff are the only people who have that authority. Other PvP players aren’t your dog, or your children, or your patients, or your minions. Punishing them is simply not an option.

if you think I meant it in that sense you haven’t been reading all my 10+ points, I’m sorry, but nowhere did I claim to have any such authority, the post you quoted was me stating how you can correct someones behavior not me giving myself the privilege to do so.

Read before you post please.[/quote]

You talked about doling out punishment to your dog in a thread in which you stated that PvPers should be punished for their actions. Am I not supposed to link the two? As far as I know, nobody in this thread has suggested that it’s acceptable to be verbally abusive, so what is the point of talking about yelling at your dog, when there is no corollary in game? Because I have to tell you, yelling at rude PvPers is a little like peeing on your carpet to convince your dog not to.

I don’t understand the point. There are tools given to us in-game to help deal with these people. Saying that you shouldn’t have to use those tools is not a solution. What, exactly, are you hoping will happen, here? Because if your hope is that people will just stop being mean because you say so, that is painfully naive.

There is literally no other advice/input people can give here. So why are you acting offended that people have suggested you block and move on? This is not a problem that can be fixed, and you’re acting like it can be.[/quote]

there’s a big difference between linking, and using unspoken words, my friend. I will simply repeat my previous statement NOWHERE did I claim I have the authority to punish others, ADDING to that I will say; I am putting myself to report someone in hopes justice will be met by the authorities, in this case Anet.

same thing with calling the police, you call them, yet you do not take justice in your own hands. But you do CALL them in hopes that the person for which you call them gets punished for their deeds.

what I hoped to do here? voice my opinion, see those of others and have a healthy and mature discussion on their (and my own) experiences, not somesort of your right I’m wrong game. fairly sure that’s allowed. Also, acting offended… that response alone proves you’ve not read anything I’ve said, nowhere have I been offended, I am not as weak willed as you may like to believe judging from my post based on my dislike of the pvp community, some people just also stand up for others, less mentally strong ya know? its kind of why I took my job in the first place, to not only help myself but help others, not saying I enjoy being cussed at by some random 12 year old.

Also, might I add that Anet themselves said that the filer, report option and block option are in no way an excuse for cussing?

I’m not acting like it can be fixed, I’m acting like more can be done to counteract it. Again, you put words in my mouth. You connect dots that aren’t there.

needless to say, I feel we’ve reached a mute point. You are constantly taking what I say out of the prospect and you’ll simply do the same with any counter answer I give you, nothing useful will come from this discussion with you, feel free to reply, but I don’t feel like continuing these shenanigans.

Fuji.6284:

Seems like you haven’t played enough games to realize how bad communities are out there.

seems like you have trouble with reading, I’m on the GW2 forum to discuss GW2’s issues, not APB’s, LoL’s, battlefields, Call of Duty’s, Sims, My little pony’s or hello kitty online, sorry.

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Fuji.6284:

Seems like you haven’t played enough games to realize how bad communities are out there.

seems like you have trouble with reading, I’m on the GW2 forum to discuss GW2’s issues, not APB’s, LoL’s, battlefields, Call of Duty’s, Sims, My little pony’s or hello kitty online, sorry.

But “nicest” infers a comparison. Which means comparing GW2’s PvP scene to those of other MMO’s is on topic.

There could be three bullies in a school and you could say: “Billy is the nicest of the school bullies.” and not be lying. Billy isn’t nice, but he’s the nicest of the bullies. “Nicest” is a comparative term.

Seera.5916:

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

Fuji.6284:

Seems like you haven’t played enough games to realize how bad communities are out there.

seems like you have trouble with reading, I’m on the GW2 forum to discuss GW2’s issues, not APB’s, LoL’s, battlefields, Call of Duty’s, Sims, My little pony’s or hello kitty online, sorry.

But “nicest” infers a comparison. Which means comparing GW2’s PvP scene to those of other MMO’s is on topic.

There could be three bullies in a school and you could say: “Billy is the nicest of the school bullies.” and not be lying. Billy isn’t nice, but he’s the nicest of the bullies. “Nicest” is a comparative term.

Pretty much stole my line right there lol

The hypocrisy and irony coming from OP is hilarious. Telling others to re-read while unable or unwilling to do self reflection…

inb4 we get called toxic for oppressing his views

sinfulechoes.9503:

… go try APB Reloaded for a toxic community. You’ll have 25 stacks of poison on you in an instant. :p

I was totally about to post this. APB: R’s community is THE WORST. Ever.

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

You aren’t exactly telling me anything I’ve haven’t heard, seen or read of before.

A point I’d like to point out though; I don’t care about those games, I don’t play them. The only Fps’s I play are Planetside 2 and Battlefield, both of which I have had almost no toxic experiences with.

you might enjoy general rudeness, and I guess that speaks pages about what sort of person you are, but most of us infact.. do not.

You haven’t experienced any rage from Planetside 2? A multiplayer shooter with 100% friendly-fire and vehicles? You must not have played it for very long… the rage in that game makes GW2 look like a kindergarten playground.

xDudisx.5914:

Harper.4173:

xDudisx.5914:

Open world pve is probably the best community. Followed by wvw. The 2 most toxic communities are spvp and dungeon.

Where skill and individual performance actually matter and you can’t just blob together with 109238129083 other players and be carried to victory by said numbers.

Pve is 90% about bring the right gear+comp and 1 or 2 dodges sometimes. Most dmg is bypassed with reflect+block+ kill the mob to fast before I die.

Even wvw require more skill because you are agaist a player not an npc that does the same skill rotation every time.

Have you ever gotten out of the AC/CoF1/SE1 rotation? I mean, if you do the easiest quick dungeons then, yeah…

Personally I’ve found the Open world PVE community far more insulting than the dungeon one, but of course that may just be because I see more of them so it gets spammed across my screen, where dungeons are generally one guy being a jerk and either I leave or someone else kicks him so… yeah.

Kuro Zetsumei.1397:

there’s a big difference between linking, and using unspoken words, my friend. I will simply repeat my previous statement NOWHERE did I claim I have the authority to punish others, ADDING to that I will say; I am putting myself to report someone in hopes justice will be met by the authorities, in this case Anet.

same thing with calling the police, you call them, yet you do not take justice in your own hands. But you do CALL them in hopes that the person for which you call them gets punished for their deeds.

what I hoped to do here? voice my opinion, see those of others and have a healthy and mature discussion on their (and my own) experiences, not somesort of your right I’m wrong game. fairly sure that’s allowed. Also, acting offended… that response alone proves you’ve not read anything I’ve said, nowhere have I been offended, I am not as weak willed as you may like to believe judging from my post based on my dislike of the pvp community, some people just also stand up for others, less mentally strong ya know? its kind of why I took my job in the first place, to not only help myself but help others, not saying I enjoy being cussed at by some random 12 year old.

Also, might I add that Anet themselves said that the filer, report option and block option are in no way an excuse for cussing?

I’m not acting like it can be fixed, I’m acting like more can be done to counteract it. Again, you put words in my mouth. You connect dots that aren’t there.

needless to say, I feel we’ve reached a mute point. You are constantly taking what I say out of the prospect and you’ll simply do the same with any counter answer I give you, nothing useful will come from this discussion with you, feel free to reply, but I don’t feel like continuing these shenanigans.

And I have never even implied that the block option or the profanity filter or even the reporting tool excuse that sort of behavior. I’m saying that those are the methods you have at your disposal to counteract them, but that is the beginning and end of what we, the forum; the players, can do about it. Shenanigans, indeed.

If you just want to vent, that’s one thing, but your title literally calls into question an overarching perspective (one shared by a lot of people, but is obviously subjective) on the game’s community, and then you repeatedly scoff at people who suggest you block and move on, by saying that it’s no excuse. You’re right. It’s not. So explain what more you think can be done to counteract that by me, random Joe player.

I just hope that, as more people block them, their queue times take longer and they eventually give up and go away.

Jerus.4350:

xDudisx.5914:

Harper.4173:

xDudisx.5914:

Open world pve is probably the best community. Followed by wvw. The 2 most toxic communities are spvp and dungeon.

Where skill and individual performance actually matter and you can’t just blob together with 109238129083 other players and be carried to victory by said numbers.

Pve is 90% about bring the right gear+comp and 1 or 2 dodges sometimes. Most dmg is bypassed with reflect+block+ kill the mob to fast before I die.

Even wvw require more skill because you are agaist a player not an npc that does the same skill rotation every time.

Have you ever gotten out of the AC/CoF1/SE1 rotation? I mean, if you do the easiest quick dungeons then, yeah…

Personally I’ve found the Open world PVE community far more insulting than the dungeon one, but of course that may just be because I see more of them so it gets spammed across my screen, where dungeons are generally one guy being a jerk and either I leave or someone else kicks him so… yeah.

Quick list of super easy dungeon that anyone can run in zerker gear even without paying much attention:

ac 1,2 and 3
cm 1,2 and 3
ta up and fw
se 1 and 3
cof 1 and 2
coe 1,2 and 3

I just listed around 75% of the dungeon paths available. Did you just notice that the huge majority of the pve takes no skill? Compare pve dungeons with wvw or spvp is a joke. Do you really think a boss programed to do always the same skill rotation is harder to fight than a real player?

OtakuDFifty.2965:

I have no idea where all these toxic PvPers are. I never did PvP all that often until recently with the Dailies change. I’ll go into Unranked Arena often with a build completely unsuited for PvP, and I’ll see maybe one jerk every 3-4 days. Map and Say chat is pretty silent for the most part. As it is, this is the only online RPG I’ve been part of where I can PvP with any regularity and have a good time.

This is my experience in pvp as well. People who don’t even play the game mode like to spew off how toxic and miserable it is. Having finished 5 or 6 reward track now, wolf rank, 100+ games played… I can only remember two instances that were a negative experience because of our opponents’ behavior. I can remember quite a few more instances where we just had a good time talking to the other team, but mostly the chat is silent.

I have found people in PvE to be extremely friendly and helpful, and again the trolls bring few and far in between. And in wvw, I have actually only encountered friendly whispers from an enemy. My server mates are always nice and helpful, and thankful when others come to help.

Dungeons get their own special place. I have met some of the most impatient players here, even though I almost always make my lfg an “all welcome” or “x level+” description. I simply tell these people that they are welcome to leave and are easily replaced.

So yeah, that’s my experience and I think we have many really awesome players.

Considering PvE, the dungeon runners are the worst. But it isn’t tragic, perhaps one group out of 20 is truly toxic (sometimes it’s enough, though, as negative experience is remembered for pretty long time).
Personally I would preffer to rework dungeon rules a bit, current setup is kinda troll-friendly.

Otherwise it looks like GW2 does have very nice community. I seen many helpful players in many open world maps. Just …that…dungeons are sometimes on par with WoW community style.

I have encountered very few people in game who would qualify for the term toxic. Oddly enough most of those have been in open world PvE, specifically doing daily events where the frustration of trying to get to events before they are completed seems to have pushed them over the edge.

Of the various games Ive played, this community has been the best.