No skill points upon leveling?
I’m getting skill points post 80 with each level.
I believe they come every 7 levles now… kittened up, right?
I believe they come every 7 levles now… kittened up, right?
Seriously?? Is this really working as intended?
I should mention: the toon in question is not 80 yet.
I should mention: the toon in question is not 80 yet.
Yeah, that explains it then. You get them in bundles every so many levels. Working as intended.
Skill Point Aquisition
Levelling up:
8 skill points are earned at levels 20, 26 and 32.
7 skill points are earned at levels 38, 44, 50 and 56.
6 skill points are earned at levels 62, 68, 74 and 80.
And, of course, one Skill Point for each level completed after Level 80.
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Calling something stupid doesn’t make it stupid.
It’s fine the way it was. It’s fine the way it is. If it had been this way from launch, no one would question it.
The idea is, and this works for most people I can assure you, is this…if you give someone the same thing every single level, it becomes invisible. It may be a reward but it doesn’t feel as rewarding. By getting a skill point at level 48 when you need 6 points or 10 points or even 30 points for every skill you want, it’s completely pointless. There’s no reason not to give you 6 or 8 points at a time in that number of levels.
It was just as pointless as getting a trait point every level that did almost nothing for you until you have five of them.
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Calling something stupid simply because it’s different from what you’re used to is really childish. As Vayne has said, had this been the way it was from launch, you wouldn’t even bat an eye lash at it.
Also, leveling rewards are more than just skill points. You get actual items now (and ones that you can use and most that you can choose the stats for). So yeah, leveling IS more rewarding now.
I felt more rewarded when I was getting one per level, it meant each level got me a little closer to the thing I was wanting, rather than just being another empty WHOOSH and sitting on my hands for another six levels.
Not to mention the arbitrary numbers awarded at random levels is confusing and counter intuitive. One per level is very simple and easy to know when you’re getting what.
I felt more rewarded when I was getting one per level, it meant each level got me a little closer to the thing I was wanting, rather than just being another empty WHOOSH and sitting on my hands for another six levels.
Not to mention the arbitrary numbers awarded at random levels is confusing and counter intuitive. One per level is very simple and easy to know when you’re getting what.
Well, you can think of it this way: each level brings you closer to the next level wherein you’re awarded a bunch of skill points, but until then you get some other kinds of rewards, be it new gear, food, or whatever.
you get skill points via dailys. Getting skills points is not that difficult unless you are a power leveler
I have 4+ STACKS of scrolls of knowledge and over 150 tomes of knowledge if I were a power leveler. I like taking it slow. I like to be able to stay at a level as long as possible instead of rushing to the cap and having nowhere to go. Being pushed by the design to rush doesn’t suit me. Though I know most people just want to zoom through and hit the finish line ASAP.
The extra rewards given (usually just an icon that says, Hey you can use the LFG menu! Did you know the TP exists?) aren’t comparable to a skill point imo.
But then more and more what I liked best about this game is eroding and I get increasingly discouraged for the future.
The idea is, and this works for most people I can assure you, is this…if you give someone the same thing every single level, it becomes invisible. It may be a reward but it doesn’t feel as rewarding.
Bullkitten. Steadily watching numbers grow is a time-tested, well-loved staple of rpgs. It only becomes invisible if you have no agency in making it grow – i.e. if the raise is automatic. If the distribution is yours to chose and comes with each level, it becomes something to look forward to. Under the new regiment, however, I have no idea what to look forward to in the next few levels, because it may be anything, and follows no discernable patterns. I have no intent to study and memorize the wiki page as an entry level exam to enjoy playing.
This becomes especially jarring considering the skill point daily achievement. Previously, if you made one or two levels and got one or to skill points via map, you could usually get this in a short, after-work burst of play without straining yourself too much.
Now, unless you are close to one of the skill point levels (or have scrolls to spare), you need to explicitly seek out three skill point challenges on the map. This means no more completing an almost complete map, this means no more aiding a friend in a lower-level, already known area.
And so it is, along with the trait crucible, another step in the “One True Path of Playing Guild Wars 2”. You want the skill point daily? Play in a new area, or farm for scrolls.
Which is fine, I suppose, if you like your activities to be structured, if you like someone taking you by the hand and telling you what is wrongbadfun and what is the good and true way to play. But some of us get that in their job aplenty, and GW2 has always been a nice way to unwind, playing the way one feels like for an evening.
Guess we better say goodbye to that liberties.
I have 4+ STACKS of scrolls of knowledge and over 150 tomes of knowledge if I were a power leveler. I like taking it slow. I like to be able to stay at a level as long as possible instead of rushing to the cap and having nowhere to go. Being pushed by the design to rush doesn’t suit me. Though I know most people just want to zoom through and hit the finish line ASAP.
The extra rewards given (usually just an icon that says, Hey you can use the LFG menu! Did you know the TP exists?) aren’t comparable to a skill point imo.
But then more and more what I liked best about this game is eroding and I get increasingly discouraged for the future.
I mean etom. Not pvp farming, I guess
I have 4+ STACKS of scrolls of knowledge and over 150 tomes of knowledge if I were a power leveler. I like taking it slow. I like to be able to stay at a level as long as possible instead of rushing to the cap and having nowhere to go. Being pushed by the design to rush doesn’t suit me. Though I know most people just want to zoom through and hit the finish line ASAP.
The extra rewards given (usually just an icon that says, Hey you can use the LFG menu! Did you know the TP exists?) aren’t comparable to a skill point imo.
But then more and more what I liked best about this game is eroding and I get increasingly discouraged for the future.
What do you mean by pushed by design to rush? The only time it “rushes” you is in the early levels (till level 15) but that is to unlock your weapon skills. Other levels will be just the same, or maybe a bit longer to balance the time it takes to 80.
What you’re stating as rewards is mostly for the lower levels, at the higher levels you get different tangible (at least in the digital sense) rewards.
I don’t get what you mean by your statement; aside from the skill point and trait system rework, there isn’t much that you’ve legitimately complained about.
Bullkitten. Steadily watching numbers grow is a time-tested, well-loved staple of rpgs. It only becomes invisible if you have no agency in making it grow – i.e. if the raise is automatic. If the distribution is yours to chose and comes with each level, it becomes something to look forward to. Under the new regiment, however, I have no idea what to look forward to in the next few levels, because it may be anything, and follows no discernable patterns. I have no intent to study and memorize the wiki page as an entry level exam to enjoy playing.
This becomes especially jarring considering the skill point daily achievement. Previously, if you made one or two levels and got one or to skill points via map, you could usually get this in a short, after-work burst of play without straining yourself too much.
Now, unless you are close to one of the skill point levels (or have scrolls to spare), you need to explicitly seek out three skill point challenges on the map. This means no more completing an almost complete map, this means no more aiding a friend in a lower-level, already known area.
And so it is, along with the trait crucible, another step in the “One True Path of Playing Guild Wars 2”. You want the skill point daily? Play in a new area, or farm for scrolls.
Which is fine, I suppose, if you like your activities to be structured, if you like someone taking you by the hand and telling you what is wrongbadfun and what is the good and true way to play. But some of us get that in their job aplenty, and GW2 has always been a nice way to unwind, playing the way one feels like for an evening.
Guess we better say goodbye to that liberties.
I understand the difficulties with the skill point dailies, but dailies aren’t meant to be all done within a short time frame; sure, there are ways to get them easily, but they don’t have to be. Also, I don’t get how that affects your ability to help a friend in lower level areas.
If you’re feeling like the game is pushing you to one specific play style, then I will suggest you calm down from your anger/rage and just relax and play. I’ve continued to play and level alts just as I have in my 2-3 hour play time every weekday after work and have not found it any more difficult to get dailies done and have enough time to do other stuff with my guild.
Scrolls are relatively easy to come by, and as long as you don’t consume them on the spot and store them in the bank for when you don’t have as much time and want some skill points, then there shouldn’t be a problem. Of course if you choose to use them whenever you get them, that’s your choice, but you can’t complain when your own play style is to not save something that you can use later on for more benefits.
I’m sorry that you’re feeling frustrated, but if you’re frustrated from your personal/work life then maybe that frustration is just spilling over into GW2 simply because you felt like you didn’t like the system changing when it did. Complaining and focusing your anger on the game for making changes is not the answer.
I have 4+ STACKS of scrolls of knowledge and over 150 tomes of knowledge if I were a power leveler. I like taking it slow. I like to be able to stay at a level as long as possible instead of rushing to the cap and having nowhere to go. Being pushed by the design to rush doesn’t suit me. Though I know most people just want to zoom through and hit the finish line ASAP.
The extra rewards given (usually just an icon that says, Hey you can use the LFG menu! Did you know the TP exists?) aren’t comparable to a skill point imo.
But then more and more what I liked best about this game is eroding and I get increasingly discouraged for the future.What do you mean by pushed by design to rush? The only time it “rushes” you is in the early levels (till level 15) but that is to unlock your weapon skills. Other levels will be just the same, or maybe a bit longer to balance the time it takes to 80.
What you’re stating as rewards is mostly for the lower levels, at the higher levels you get different tangible (at least in the digital sense) rewards.
I don’t get what you mean by your statement; aside from the skill point and trait system rework, there isn’t much that you’ve legitimately complained about.
Glad you’re combing through my every word with the “standardized legitimacy handbook”, Els ;p
What i’m saying is that the big emphasis on these design changes is to greater reward each level up, right? While I always felt that time spent playing the game whether leveling or not was the reward, and the cap is a kind of ceiling. After you hit it, it feels less rewarding. So why the pressing desire to make that +1 zazzier, encouraging the player to seek that +1 more than the space between?
As for tangible rewards, I was getting more things like loot/gear at the lower levels (5-17) or so than I’ve been getting since. My fifth underwater skill was bizarrely unlocked at random, long after my fifth weapon skills were unlocked, I was told I could convert gold to gems and that spvp exists. I also got one food item and a wrench item, which is good for teaching newbies but honestly by that level the chance that you haven’t run into food already is slim, and the item itself is no great reward. Things like ring, amulet, backpiece are fantastic. It doesn’t mean a lot of the rest of this system is confusing and superficial rather than meaningful on a design level.
I no longer feel as though i’m in control of my own growth. The game randomly awards me things or I am left waiting for something I can’t do yet. Maybe in a level or two. Maybe in ten levels. I have no idea. That is directly linked to the new intended features.
Awaiting a shining award of legitimacy on my post!
(edited by eyestrain.3056)
I felt more rewarded when I was getting one per level, it meant each level got me a little closer to the thing I was wanting, rather than just being another empty WHOOSH and sitting on my hands for another six levels.
Not to mention the arbitrary numbers awarded at random levels is confusing and counter intuitive. One per level is very simple and easy to know when you’re getting what.
This is exactly the point. Knowing what you’re getting every level means there are no special rewards. No surprises. Nothing exciting, though yes, it’s predictable.
You might think most people want to know exactly what they’re getting every level. I’m pretty sure that’s not true.
Let’s say one year for my birthday, I get a pair of socks. The next year, I get socks. The year after I get socks. I might like socks and need socks, but I’ll never find more socks surprising and I’ll never feel oh yeah that’s cool when I get them.
Unfortunately it’s hard to divorce your previous experience playing the game from those who are new to the game who don’t have the expectation of getting a point a level.
At best, it’s just a matter of opinion, but I think you’d find that given two groups of people starting both games together, this one would be more exciting for more people.
The idea is, and this works for most people I can assure you, is this…if you give someone the same thing every single level, it becomes invisible. It may be a reward but it doesn’t feel as rewarding.
Bullkitten. Steadily watching numbers grow is a time-tested, well-loved staple of rpgs. It only becomes invisible if you have no agency in making it grow – i.e. if the raise is automatic. If the distribution is yours to chose and comes with each level, it becomes something to look forward to. Under the new regiment, however, I have no idea what to look forward to in the next few levels, because it may be anything, and follows no discernable patterns. I have no intent to study and memorize the wiki page as an entry level exam to enjoy playing.
This becomes especially jarring considering the skill point daily achievement. Previously, if you made one or two levels and got one or to skill points via map, you could usually get this in a short, after-work burst of play without straining yourself too much.
Now, unless you are close to one of the skill point levels (or have scrolls to spare), you need to explicitly seek out three skill point challenges on the map. This means no more completing an almost complete map, this means no more aiding a friend in a lower-level, already known area.
And so it is, along with the trait crucible, another step in the “One True Path of Playing Guild Wars 2”. You want the skill point daily? Play in a new area, or farm for scrolls.
Which is fine, I suppose, if you like your activities to be structured, if you like someone taking you by the hand and telling you what is wrongbadfun and what is the good and true way to play. But some of us get that in their job aplenty, and GW2 has always been a nice way to unwind, playing the way one feels like for an evening.
Guess we better say goodbye to that liberties.
But skill points aren’t a number that steadily grows, because presumably as you level you’re spending them. So the number goes up and down. If you need a daily skill point while leveling (after level 13) it’s easy to find one while you’re out in the world without even leveling. They do appear on your map. There’s even an arrow that points you to then now.
It’s now a conscious process of something you can look at and do, instead of thinking, meh, I’ll get it anyway, I don’t have to think about it. I’m not 100% positive your way is better.
I felt more rewarded when I was getting one per level, it meant each level got me a little closer to the thing I was wanting, rather than just being another empty WHOOSH and sitting on my hands for another six levels.
Not to mention the arbitrary numbers awarded at random levels is confusing and counter intuitive. One per level is very simple and easy to know when you’re getting what.This is exactly the point. Knowing what you’re getting every level means there are no special rewards. No surprises. Nothing exciting, though yes, it’s predictable.
You might think most people want to know exactly what they’re getting every level. I’m pretty sure that’s not true.
Let’s say one year for my birthday, I get a pair of socks. The next year, I get socks. The year after I get socks. I might like socks and need socks, but I’ll never find more socks surprising and I’ll never feel oh yeah that’s cool when I get them.
Unfortunately it’s hard to divorce your previous experience playing the game from those who are new to the game who don’t have the expectation of getting a point a level.
At best, it’s just a matter of opinion, but I think you’d find that given two groups of people starting both games together, this one would be more exciting for more people.
Considering I can’t speak for these hypothetical “I want seven years of nothing then eight pairs of socks all at once” people I can only put forward my opinion and how this has negatively affected my experience with the game, and why I felt the previous system was stronger.
Hypothetical raining sock people or no.
I felt more rewarded when I was getting one per level, it meant each level got me a little closer to the thing I was wanting, rather than just being another empty WHOOSH and sitting on my hands for another six levels.
Not to mention the arbitrary numbers awarded at random levels is confusing and counter intuitive. One per level is very simple and easy to know when you’re getting what.This is exactly the point. Knowing what you’re getting every level means there are no special rewards. No surprises. Nothing exciting, though yes, it’s predictable.
You might think most people want to know exactly what they’re getting every level. I’m pretty sure that’s not true.
Let’s say one year for my birthday, I get a pair of socks. The next year, I get socks. The year after I get socks. I might like socks and need socks, but I’ll never find more socks surprising and I’ll never feel oh yeah that’s cool when I get them.
Unfortunately it’s hard to divorce your previous experience playing the game from those who are new to the game who don’t have the expectation of getting a point a level.
At best, it’s just a matter of opinion, but I think you’d find that given two groups of people starting both games together, this one would be more exciting for more people.
Considering I can’t speak for these hypothetical “I want seven years of nothing then eight pairs of socks all at once” people I can only put forward my opinion and how this has negatively affected my experience with the game, and why I felt the previous system was stronger.
Hypothetical raining sock people or no.
It’s not just socks. It’s a bottle of wine. It’s anything. If you get something and know what it will be it takes away the surprise. That’s all. If you don’t want to acknowledge that some people like to be surprised, or feel that’s really cool I didn’t expect that, that’s certainly your prerogative. I just disagree. I think most people, given no expectations of getting the same thing will feel more exciting getting things.
I’ve been leveling characters and I appreciate getting the other stuff, even if I can’t salvage it, like rare and exotic armor while leveling.
I’m not having a problem with the skill points I get just from exploring and then I get that boost of seven or eight and I think, cool I can buy another skill.
You end up with the same number of skill points (though someone told me you get 2 more than you used to while leveling), and you end up with the same number of skills.
I’m still going to say this would be more exciting for a bigger percentage of the population.
Which is fine, I know i’m not the only person in the world. But this game used to fit me like my favorite jeans and with continuous changes they’re being made to fit someone else. I like to think I matter and that whoever had me in mind when making the game is still there, and might think of me still.
If not, oh well. I guess I had my fun and it’s not my turn anymore. Doesn’t mean I don’t want to talk about it.
Which is fine, I know i’m not the only person in the world. But this game used to fit me like my favorite jeans and with continuous changes they’re being made to fit someone else. I like to think I matter and that whoever had me in mind when making the game is still there, and might think of me still.
If not, oh well. I guess I had my fun and it’s not my turn anymore. Doesn’t mean I don’t want to talk about it.
I can appreciate this. But I still believe if you’d started with this system, it wouldn’t have been an issue at all. The issue is the change.
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
It was great reaching 31 and having nowhere near enough sp to purchase my elite.
[TW] Pumped
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
Best analogy ever. After all without the skill points you can’t eat and you’ll starve and die. You won’t be able to pay your rent and you’ll be on the street.
I have a better analogy. How about you can have a spoonful of ice cream every day and that’s it…or you can have a bowl at the end of the week. That’s a whole lot closer.
Edit: You know pay already works like that. Many people get paid by the hour…but they don’t get paid every hour. They get paid once a week. Here in Australia most people get paid once a Fortnight, not when they actually earn the money. Sometimes one pay period won’t pay the entire rent and you have to wait to get paid again to pay it. People do it all the time.
(edited by Vayne.8563)
For those waiting for their elite, if you don’t want to hunt skill points at level 31, you get 8 points at level 32. Here’s the breakdown.
Levelling up:
8 skill points are earned at levels 20, 26 and 32.
7 skill points are earned at levels 38, 44, 50 and 56.
6 skill points are earned at levels 62, 68, 74 and 80.
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Calling something stupid doesn’t make it stupid.
It’s fine the way it was. It’s fine the way it is. If it had been this way from launch, no one would question it.
The idea is, and this works for most people I can assure you, is this…if you give someone the same thing every single level, it becomes invisible. It may be a reward but it doesn’t feel as rewarding. By getting a skill point at level 48 when you need 6 points or 10 points or even 30 points for every skill you want, it’s completely pointless. There’s no reason not to give you 6 or 8 points at a time in that number of levels.
It was just as pointless as getting a trait point every level that did almost nothing for you until you have five of them.
I won’t disagree that how they organized the trait points was good. But it’s silly to make it so you can only get a few skills points every few arbitrary levels. Especially when there are skills that only cost 3 skill points to get.
As someone who comes into this game without any knowledge of it that would just be confusing. Why do I have skills that I can unlock at any time, but only get skill points every 5 or 6 levels?
And yes I know that there are skill challenges but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s still a strange design decision.
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
Best analogy ever. After all without the skill points you can’t eat and you’ll starve and die. You won’t be able to pay your rent and you’ll be on the street.
I have a better analogy. How about you can have a spoonful of ice cream every day and that’s it…or you can have a bowl at the end of the week. That’s a whole lot closer.
Edit: You know pay already works like that. Many people get paid by the hour…but they don’t get paid every hour. They get paid once a week. Here in Australia most people get paid once a Fortnight, not when they actually earn the money. Sometimes one pay period won’t pay the entire rent and you have to wait to get paid again to pay it. People do it all the time.
More like, how bout a bowl of ice cream every day, or 7 bowls on Saturday. See how I did that? Enjoy your 7 bowls, the rest of us do it differently…
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Calling something stupid doesn’t make it stupid.
It’s fine the way it was. It’s fine the way it is. If it had been this way from launch, no one would question it.
The idea is, and this works for most people I can assure you, is this…if you give someone the same thing every single level, it becomes invisible. It may be a reward but it doesn’t feel as rewarding. By getting a skill point at level 48 when you need 6 points or 10 points or even 30 points for every skill you want, it’s completely pointless. There’s no reason not to give you 6 or 8 points at a time in that number of levels.
It was just as pointless as getting a trait point every level that did almost nothing for you until you have five of them.
I won’t disagree that how they organized the trait points was good. But it’s silly to make it so you can only get a few skills points every few arbitrary levels. Especially when there are skills that only cost 3 skill points to get.
As someone who comes into this game without any knowledge of it that would just be confusing. Why do I have skills that I can unlock at any time, but only get skill points every 5 or 6 levels?
And yes I know that there are skill challenges but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s still a strange design decision.
See I really disagree with this, because I’ve never played an MMO that didn’t show skills and gate some of them. Ever. TSW doesn’t even have levels and gates skills. It’s just normal to gate certain skills.
Skills were always gated. Leaving skill point challenges aside, you need give 1 point skills, whether you liked them or not to even try a 3 point skill. You needed five of those to even look at a six point skill.
So you needed 20 skill points just to look at your six point skills. You got them before starting at level 5. So by level 25, without skill point challenges, you could get your first six point skill.
But then, you only had 5 levels before you got your elite. Many people bought six point skills when they unlocked and didn’t have enough points left for their elite. It happened to me a couple of times even.
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
Best analogy ever. After all without the skill points you can’t eat and you’ll starve and die. You won’t be able to pay your rent and you’ll be on the street.
I have a better analogy. How about you can have a spoonful of ice cream every day and that’s it…or you can have a bowl at the end of the week. That’s a whole lot closer.
Edit: You know pay already works like that. Many people get paid by the hour…but they don’t get paid every hour. They get paid once a week. Here in Australia most people get paid once a Fortnight, not when they actually earn the money. Sometimes one pay period won’t pay the entire rent and you have to wait to get paid again to pay it. People do it all the time.
More like, how bout a bowl of ice cream every day, or 7 bowls on Saturday. See how I did that? Enjoy your 7 bowls, the rest of us do it differently…
But the one skill point had limited use, much like a spoon of ice cream. So my analogy more appropriately reflects the actual situation.
You didn’t get a skill point at 67 and buy a skill and then a skill point at 68 and buy another skill. They were just spoons of ice cream. Trying to prove me wrong by making bad analogies isn’t likely to get you very far.
For those waiting for their elite, if you don’t want to hunt skill points at level 31, you get 8 points at level 32. Here’s the breakdown.
Levelling up:
8 skill points are earned at levels 20, 26 and 32.
7 skill points are earned at levels 38, 44, 50 and 56.
6 skill points are earned at levels 62, 68, 74 and 80.
The moment this “thrill of the surprise” thing falls flat is when you make plans. You have plans for what you want to do with those skill points. But you’re left waiting for the SURPRISE YOU FINALLY GET IT instead of being able to take control and be using that skill, learning and growing as it changes your experience.
This game is so much deeper than cookie clicker “You did a level! That means the dispenser gives you a treat pellet and we added a RAAINNBOW to make it more exciting! Keep clicking!”. There’s a really good, complex, satisfying combat system (littered with bugs, glitches, and server instability…), there’s absolutely gorgeous environments, vast explorable landscapes, so much amazingly great stuff that, instead of fixing the serious problems in existing stuff, that they are preoccupied with the most basic, well established, and stable of features shows an issue with priorities.
We’re sitting here arguing about whether excitement is more valuable than reliability while teleports and leaps regularly fail, wvw is hemorrhaging guilds from lack of support for gvgs and boredom due to a flawed matchmaking system (draining the only “end game” this game really has), and the economy is so inflated it naturally increases the need for the kind of grind/farm that this game was never meant to have. I know they can only work on one thing at a time but this cosmetic change seems unnecessarily convoluted and wrought with new issues to pile on the other glaring problems. Instead of meaningful improvement it’s like they’ve been spending their time on putting the same thing in a different wrapper, and that, more than the fact that it’s different than I remember, is what I find frustrating.
(edited by eyestrain.3056)
So many opinions in this topic. The change to leveling IS stupid. I won’t be leveling any more alts, and that is all personal preference. We’ve leveled the same way for two years and suddenly they changed everything. Change is inevitable, yes, but that doesn’t mean we have to like it. A lot of people don’t mind the change, and a lot of people think it’s stupid. Telling them something like calling it stupid doesn’t make it stupid, is pretty stupid.
The new system is like baby mode. Don’t get me wrong, RPG’s generally need tutorials for new players and I’m not altogether against something like this, but it would have been nice if accounts could have been grandfathered and been able to skip the newbie stuff. Characters were grandfathered when they changed the talents. This new system should have been for new accounts, and veteran players who have been around from the beginning should not half to be bothered by it. Of course, simply my opinion.
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
Best analogy ever. After all without the skill points you can’t eat and you’ll starve and die. You won’t be able to pay your rent and you’ll be on the street.
I have a better analogy. How about you can have a spoonful of ice cream every day and that’s it…or you can have a bowl at the end of the week. That’s a whole lot closer.
Edit: You know pay already works like that. Many people get paid by the hour…but they don’t get paid every hour. They get paid once a week. Here in Australia most people get paid once a Fortnight, not when they actually earn the money. Sometimes one pay period won’t pay the entire rent and you have to wait to get paid again to pay it. People do it all the time.
More like, how bout a bowl of ice cream every day, or 7 bowls on Saturday. See how I did that? Enjoy your 7 bowls, the rest of us do it differently…
But the one skill point had limited use, much like a spoon of ice cream. So my analogy more appropriately reflects the actual situation.
You didn’t get a skill point at 67 and buy a skill and then a skill point at 68 and buy another skill. They were just spoons of ice cream. Trying to prove me wrong by making bad analogies isn’t likely to get you very far.
Your analogy only appropriately reflects your own slanted views, nothing else. The rest of the player base can recognize silly game changes when they see them, regardless of the implanted cheerleaders that attempt to prop them up.
For those waiting for their elite, if you don’t want to hunt skill points at level 31, you get 8 points at level 32. Here’s the breakdown.
Levelling up:
8 skill points are earned at levels 20, 26 and 32.
7 skill points are earned at levels 38, 44, 50 and 56.
6 skill points are earned at levels 62, 68, 74 and 80.The moment this “thrill of the surprise” thing falls flat is when you make plans. You have plans for what you want to do with those skill points. But you’re left waiting for the SURPRISE YOU FINALLY GET IT instead of being able to take control and be using that skill, learning and growing as it changes your experience.
This game is so much deeper than cookie clicker “You did a level! That means the dispenser gives you a treat pellet and we added a RAAINNBOW to make it more exciting! Keep clicking!”. There’s a really good, complex, satisfying combat system (littered with bugs, glitches, and server instability…), there’s absolutely gorgeous environments, vast explorable landscapes, so much amazingly great stuff that, instead of fixing the serious problems in existing stuff, that they are preoccupied with the most basic, well established, and stable of features shows an issue with priorities.
We’re sitting here arguing about whether excitement is more valuable than reliability while teleports and leaps regularly fail, wvw is hemorrhaging guilds from lack of support for gvgs and boredom due to a flawed matchmaking system (draining the only “end game” this game really has), and the economy is so inflated it naturally increases the need for the kind of grind/farm that this game was never meant to have. I know they can only work on one thing at a time but this cosmetic change seems unnecessarily convoluted and wrought with new issues to pile on the other glaring problems. Instead of meaningful improvement it’s like they’ve been spending their time on putting the same thing in a different wrapper, and that, more than the fact that it’s different than I remember, is what I find frustrating.
Sure this is a different argument. There are a lot of bugged skills that should be fixed, a lot of traits that are either bugged or useless.
Nothing to do with the current argument and no disagreement from me.
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
Best analogy ever. After all without the skill points you can’t eat and you’ll starve and die. You won’t be able to pay your rent and you’ll be on the street.
I have a better analogy. How about you can have a spoonful of ice cream every day and that’s it…or you can have a bowl at the end of the week. That’s a whole lot closer.
Edit: You know pay already works like that. Many people get paid by the hour…but they don’t get paid every hour. They get paid once a week. Here in Australia most people get paid once a Fortnight, not when they actually earn the money. Sometimes one pay period won’t pay the entire rent and you have to wait to get paid again to pay it. People do it all the time.
More like, how bout a bowl of ice cream every day, or 7 bowls on Saturday. See how I did that? Enjoy your 7 bowls, the rest of us do it differently…
But the one skill point had limited use, much like a spoon of ice cream. So my analogy more appropriately reflects the actual situation.
You didn’t get a skill point at 67 and buy a skill and then a skill point at 68 and buy another skill. They were just spoons of ice cream. Trying to prove me wrong by making bad analogies isn’t likely to get you very far.
Your analogy only appropriately reflects your own slanted views, nothing else. The rest of the player base can recognize silly game changes when they see them, regardless of the implanted cheerleaders that attempt to prop them up.
The rest of the forums can recognize a really bad analogy and a less bad one. Most analogies are flawed, but yours are completely disingenuous. You won’t be winning any arguments using those. They simply don’t reflect the situation well enough to be used.
Anyway not much to argue about. You’re entitled to your opinion, as is everyone else and everyone will make it their own mind.
It’s how it is intended. Since the new leveling experience its all about leveling. Everything is gated behind levels. It looks like the horizontal progression and immersive gameplay is thrown overboard. Skills, traits, basic mechanics and personal story are al gated now. In my opinion a unhealthy situation. It has a very forced flavor over it. Not to speak of the dumbed down beginner areas, they are boring to dead.
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Calling something stupid simply because it’s different from what you’re used to is really childish. As Vayne has said, had this been the way it was from launch, you wouldn’t even bat an eye lash at it.
Also, leveling rewards are more than just skill points. You get actual items now (and ones that you can use and most that you can choose the stats for). So yeah, leveling IS more rewarding now.
Level 21 rewards you with nothing but a level 20 amulet.
The game is being turned into a fancy looking whack-a-mole. Please can either you or Vayne turn the lights off when you finish.
Grind Wars 2; the game that ate my brain.
Yeah it’s intended and it’s stupid.
Leveling up is more rewarding now, didn’t you know?
Calling something stupid simply because it’s different from what you’re used to is really childish. As Vayne has said, had this been the way it was from launch, you wouldn’t even bat an eye lash at it.
Also, leveling rewards are more than just skill points. You get actual items now (and ones that you can use and most that you can choose the stats for). So yeah, leveling IS more rewarding now.
Level 21 rewards you with nothing but a level 20 amulet.
The game is being turned into a fancy looking whack-a-mole. Please can either you or Vayne turn the lights off when you finish.
The game isn’t turning into whack a mole. You just choose to play whack a mole. Big difference.
For those who think it’s great to wait until you gain 7 levels before spending any skill points, let’s see you apply this to real life. From now on you must wait until you’ve acquired 7 paychecks until you can spend any of them! Let’s see how that works out for you, after all it feels like more of a reward right??
That is by far the most drastic and extreme analogy I have ever seen in a while, and that’s in a bad way. If you have to make an analogy that extreme and that does not even work, I’m sorry but you’re just showing how you have no more sensible arguments in you.
The point you’re missing is that instead of a skill point every level, you get them in chunks every 8 levels but that does not mean you get absolutely nothing during the period in between: you get new gear, food, buff items and other stuff, all of which are quite useful to you unless you’ve gone and spent coin or such on better gear (which is not really needed).
As for your analogy, here’s where it really fails: why make the time period by years? Does it really take you a year to gain ONE level? If so, you’re pretty sad, and I am sorry for you, but sad to say the rest of the people aren’t as sad as you.
As for your ice cream bowl analogy: you can get one bowl everyday for seven days and another bowl on the eighth day, I’ll be getting a candy, a cookie, a muffin, a Popsicle, some gelatin, a slice of pie, a slice of cake, and then a bowl of ice cream for the eight days. How’s that sound?
Level 21 rewards you with nothing but a level 20 amulet.
The game is being turned into a fancy looking whack-a-mole. Please can either you or Vayne turn the lights off when you finish.
I like how you focus on one level of rewards and not the whole picture to try to make your point, and you don’t even give the full story for that one level. That’s some argument you have there, misinformation and misdirected. At that level, there’s also information about Amulets and Jumping Puzzles for the new players who might not have heard about them. These may not seem like much to you as people who have been playing for a while, but do remember that leveling to 15 is quite faster now so level 21 isn’t all that high.
If you must argue for why something is bad, please make sensible arguments and not misinforming or misdirecting ones. Those simply make your arguments weaker when people can see through them.
The point you’re missing is that instead of a skill point every level, you get them in chunks every 8 levels but that does not mean you get absolutely nothing during the period in between: you get new gear, food, buff items and other stuff, all of which are quite useful to you unless you’ve gone and spent coin or such on better gear (which is not really needed).
As for your analogy, here’s where it really fails: why make the time period by years? Does it really take you a year to gain ONE level? If so, you’re pretty sad, and I am sorry for you, but sad to say the rest of the people aren’t as sad as you.
As for your ice cream bowl analogy: you can get one bowl everyday for seven days and another bowl on the eighth day, I’ll be getting a candy, a cookie, a muffin, a Popsicle, some gelatin, a slice of pie, a slice of cake, and then a bowl of ice cream for the eight days. How’s that sound?
Brother I think you’ve scrambled analogies, the only time a year was mentioned (and yo, if I want to take a year to level there’s nothing sad about that, it’s hard to play this game and not level up, believe me. One year between leveling while still actively playing is an accomplishment) was in Vayne’s “socks for birthdays” post. Birthdays do only tend to happen once a year.
It’s true that hey a piece of candy each level isn’t a bad thing. But when the shiny candy (or just the empty wrapper, in the case of being told something exists) is being waved in front of your face and the actually useful mechanics have become more confusing or are withheld (skill and trait points, which open up the actual meat of the combat and class system- no analogy intended), it’s sacrificing depth for a shallow flash in the pan. It’d be great if we got a piece of useful gear and hints about the breadth of the game each level without having to sacrifice existing depth. This is a case of “fixing what aint broke”.
Additionally putting such a huge emphasis on leveling up is in my mind a distraction from the reward of seeing a new vista for the first time, opening up a new area, experimenting with what a new skill or trait can do- the things that keep players playing long term. Those things aren’t gone, but this change in the system is pushing toward those things just being a means to an end, the ULTIMATE GOAL of hitting level 80. Some people already feel that way, but unless they’re playing wvw or hardcore achievement hunters, they’re often the ones who end up standing around Lions Arch complaining there’s no content in the game.
The level isn’t really important- it’s what the level means you are able to do within the scope of the rest of the game. If you can feel strong and free at level 30, you don’t have to wait til 80 to feel like the game actually starts.
This change enforces the idea that the game really begins at 80. But it’s always been the pre-80 content that is the most highly applauded, and post 80 that is weak.
I’m sorry that you’re feeling frustrated, but if you’re frustrated from your personal/work life then maybe that frustration is just spilling over into GW2 simply because you felt like you didn’t like the system changing when it did. Complaining and focusing your anger on the game for making changes is not the answer.
:-) I’m not frustrated, I love my work life, taxing as it may be. And GW2 is far from my only means of relaxation, even if only counting games.
But I am sad that options – and thus player agency – were removed from a game that offered a great degree of liberty, which is something I valued.
In the case of skill points and dailies, the loss isn’t THAT great – I get my dailies done regardless, if I want to – but in concert with the much more irritating trait change in April it marks a trend that has me worried.
So if complaining is not the answer – what other option do I have as a customer, in your opinion, to let the company that produces a game I like know how I feel about their changes? Burn a candle in church? Write a letter to the senator of my state? Give the game a 0 stars rating on the retail platform of my choice?
EDIT: Fixed grammatical error.