(edited by Tyrantis.8640)
Nothing Discussed About Condi Dmg Concerns Me
Yes, I’m surprised that condition wasn’t discussed.
Which leads me to believe that the underlying technical challenges are in fact, very challenging to fix.
Fixing condition players requires fixing the whole game
i find this age old debate rather interesting, because people say condi is broken, like it isnt one of the most OP things in the game. Its actually the popular meta in WvW and in SPVP, and it honestly is also pretty powerful in instances, if you have 1 or2 coordinated condition users.
Its biggest issues are in PVE versus single targets when you have a zerg. outside of that instance, its actually fairly powerful and easy, and will only become more so with the nerfs to critical damage.
i honestly want to see conditions become weaker in general, and sure make it more usuable for the zerg instances, but as it is, making it viable in zergs would probably make it the best choice in almost every content
Condi bunkers are rampant in spvp and wvw and giving them more power would be insane. The direct dps nerf will further drive that meta in wvw.
Afterthought? My condition bunker rolls over everyone in wvw and I read technical books while playing.
Condition damage should be nerfed and merged with power and conditions should be made to be a supportive way of dealing damage rather than a primary one. Splitting up damage stats was their greatest mistake here.
I am prety sure everyone complaining about condition damage are refering to PvE, so let’s focus.
In PvE conditions are weak, they can work sure, but except in some very custom tailored events, conditions are always inferior to sheer berserkerness.
Sure condition damage has better base damage but that means nothing when the lower direct damage base begins acumulating damage multipliers, each of them compounding with each other. Meanwhile in condition damage land the only meaningfull “compounding” they can get is condition duration and it’s one of the worst “damage modifiers” since the longer a condition lasts the easier it is overwrititen thus shafting the damage in a very compounding NEGATIVE modifier to damage.
I am prety sure everyone complaining about condition damage are refering to PvE, so let’s focus.
In PvE conditions are weak, they can work sure, but except in some very custom tailored events, conditions are always inferior to sheer berserkerness.
I apologize I wasn’t clear but Briz nailed it on the head. I am speaking for PvE. sPVP and WvW is just fine. Condi hurts other players really well where it seems to me, it takes forever to kill something compared to base crit/power in PvE.
I am prety sure everyone complaining about condition damage are refering to PvE, so let’s focus.
In PvE conditions are weak, they can work sure, but except in some very custom tailored events, conditions are always inferior to sheer berserkerness.
I apologize I wasn’t clear but Briz nailed it on the head. I am speaking for PvE. sPVP and WvW is just fine. Condi hurts other players really well where it seems to me, it takes forever to kill something compared to base crit/power in PvE.
Do you have any novel suggestions for this?
What do you suggest that will make condition viable in dungeon runs that will not make them even more OP in WvW and sPvP?
Condi bunkers are rampant in spvp and wvw and giving them more power would be insane. The direct dps nerf will further drive that meta in wvw.
Apparently only direct damage is suppose to be threatening.
Azreell – Mesmer
Loyalty To None
Loyalty To None
I am prety sure everyone complaining about condition damage are refering to PvE, so let’s focus.
In PvE conditions are weak, they can work sure, but except in some very custom tailored events, conditions are always inferior to sheer berserkerness.
I apologize I wasn’t clear but Briz nailed it on the head. I am speaking for PvE. sPVP and WvW is just fine. Condi hurts other players really well where it seems to me, it takes forever to kill something compared to base crit/power in PvE.
Do you have any novel suggestions for this?
What do you suggest that will make condition viable in dungeon runs that will not make them even more OP in WvW and sPvP?
A good place to start is having conditions affect objects.
Vile Necromancer||Defender of the Beastgate||Slayer of Moa’s
Because they think they are fixing condi damage by nerfing critical damage. Worries me as well. Shallow symptom fixes like this are disheartening.
I am prety sure everyone complaining about condition damage are refering to PvE, so let’s focus.
In PvE conditions are weak, they can work sure, but except in some very custom tailored events, conditions are always inferior to sheer berserkerness.
I apologize I wasn’t clear but Briz nailed it on the head. I am speaking for PvE. sPVP and WvW is just fine. Condi hurts other players really well where it seems to me, it takes forever to kill something compared to base crit/power in PvE.
Do you have any novel suggestions for this?
What do you suggest that will make condition viable in dungeon runs that will not make them even more OP in WvW and sPvP?
Make NPC mobs more vulnerable to condi damage as it seems like it is already fine tuned when it comes to players.
Because they think they are fixing condi damage by nerfing critical damage. Worries me as well. Shallow symptom fixes like this are disheartening.
I do think this is a step towards balancing Crit, but not to bring crit to a level of condi. It’s a crit fix and it is separate to condi in my eyes.
Yeah, they definitely need to address the Condi damage issues.
“If you spent as much time working on [some task] as
you spend complaining about it on the forums, you’d be
done by now.”
you spend complaining about it on the forums, you’d be
done by now.”
For me this is important because I want to run these types of builds. They require more thought than your standard melee builds (in most cases) and I really enjoy the thought of bleeding/poisoning the hell out of something.
I feel a bit off plugging my own thread but I’m pretty sure I address the problems with Condition Damage in PvE without buffing it in WvW or PvP.
check it out if this honestly concerns you and let me know what you think.
Not gonna post it here cause its about 13.5k characters.
(edited by Mondo.5029)
Condition damage, in and of itself, is NOT weak at all. As noted, in PvP scenarios, the ability to deal damage without having to sustain an attack can be devastating. Also, in small group PvE settings, having 1 condition damage build is not a problem at all, and can largely keep up damage wise.
Where condition damage falters is in PvE, large group, open world settings (which has become the bulk of the content). Enemy mobs hit the condition cap so quickly that a lot of condition damage winds up wasted.
Condition damage, in and of itself, is NOT weak at all. As noted, in PvP scenarios, the ability to deal damage without having to sustain an attack can be devastating. Also, in small group PvE settings, having 1 condition damage build is not a problem at all, and can largely keep up damage wise.
Where condition damage falters is in PvE, large group, open world settings (which has become the bulk of the content). Enemy mobs hit the condition cap so quickly that a lot of condition damage winds up wasted.
Yes, but it’s still a problem that needs resolving. Nobody is suggesting just like buffing condi damage or something that would make it OP in sPvP, but they need to make substantive changes to how Condi damage functions that makes it work better in large scale PvE content. They need to 1. Make it work against inanimate “yellow bar” targets, so that Condi specs don’t take twice as long to wear down those objects than Power specs, 2. Make it so that stack overflows in no way reduce damage, such that if one Condi laying ten Bleed stacks would deal a total of X damage to a target, then ten Condis each laying ten Bleed stacks would deal no less than 10X damage to that target, and so that Poison stacks that end up into the several minute range are not just a waste of everyone’s time.
Resolve those, and Condis will be just fine, but so far they haven’t even addressed the issue publicly, much less given an indication that they intend to fix it. They are so focused on sPvP that they never seem to even care whether something works for the content they actually create.
“If you spent as much time working on [some task] as
you spend complaining about it on the forums, you’d be
done by now.”
you spend complaining about it on the forums, you’d be
done by now.”
Yes, THAT’S the problem. It doesn’t need a buff OR a nerf. The problem is entirely a technical one, and there apparently isn’t an easy solution within the limitations of the engine or servers or whatever.
I might be mistaken, but I don’t think it’s a specially hard to overcome technical issue.
Instead of listing every bleed stack and it’s source, they could make condition damage fixed on application and use a time string where they just add the upcoming damage.
The change would makes things slightly mechanically different but should be perfectly viable memory/processor wise and not specially gamechanging, at least for bleeds.
Stacking burning and poison on intensity would make everything A LOT different and probably won’t ever happen.
i find this age old debate rather interesting, because people say condi is broken, like it isnt one of the most OP things in the game. Its actually the popular meta in WvW and in SPVP, and it honestly is also pretty powerful in instances, if you have 1 or2 coordinated condition users.
Its biggest issues are in PVE versus single targets when you have a zerg. outside of that instance, its actually fairly powerful and easy, and will only become more so with the nerfs to critical damage.
i honestly want to see conditions become weaker in general, and sure make it more usuable for the zerg instances, but as it is, making it viable in zergs would probably make it the best choice in almost every content
The problem is that the main focus, as far as Anet is concerned, in PvE is the Living Story, and that’s all about the zerg, so basically gimping condi-users out of the game’s main PvE content.
Yeah, my opinions on the living story isn’t very positive either. But that’s probably here to stay.
I am prety sure everyone complaining about condition damage are refering to PvE, so let’s focus.
In PvE conditions are weak, they can work sure, but except in some very custom tailored events, conditions are always inferior to sheer berserkerness.
I apologize I wasn’t clear but Briz nailed it on the head. I am speaking for PvE. sPVP and WvW is just fine. Condi hurts other players really well where it seems to me, it takes forever to kill something compared to base crit/power in PvE.
It depends on the condition damage you do. Some condition based builds are viable in PvE while others depend on movement and when faced with a standing still npc it becomes useless. With the other part of it condi based builds require a build up for effectiveness by reducing the burst damage of others will allow you to get to a point where you actually see it rather than it got zerked down before your stuff could really hit. So the changes to zerker while in a party do actually have an effect on making condi better.