Guild Wars 2

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

He never claimed that, “they said there would be no grind.” Which is what you attributed as being bull-kitten. Deriding an argument, that was not made by the opposing side in a debate, is the purest example of strawmanning.

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

He never claimed that, “they said there would be no grind.” Which is what you attributed as being bull-kitten. Deriding an argument, that was not made by the opposing side in a debate, is the purest example of strawmanning.

OMFG. First line of his post…

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten.

At least read the posts you’re defending.

Edit: He’s saying Anet is giving us a grind…but Anet said grinds would be in the game. It’s in no way a strawman to point that out.

Here’s how it works:

We have all seen one of those films with an infection outbreak and they have a world map showing the spread of the infection, well Anet has their very own version.

The map shows all the little green dots in the world and when an area is overrun with too many green dots they hit the nerf button.

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

He never claimed that, “they said there would be no grind.” Which is what you attributed as being bull-kitten. Deriding an argument, that was not made by the opposing side in a debate, is the purest example of strawmanning.

OMFG. First line of his post…

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten.

At least read the posts you’re defending.

Edit: He’s saying Anet is giving us a grind…but Anet said grinds would be in the game. It’s in no way a strawman to point that out.

For someone who claims to be an editor you might want to practice what you preach about reading what you are commenting on.

His statement: “Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind…BS”

What you claimed he said: “they said there would be no grind…”

Those two statements are not even close to being the same thing.

He never claimed that they said there would be no grind. He pointed out that they do want us (or at least some of us) to grind. There would be no option to grind in the game if ANet did not want at least some of us to grind. They had/have absolute control over this and chose to not only allow grinding, but to reward it. No big deal. its not mandatory. Doesn’t seriously impact character power level. Doesn’t change the fact that ANet does want people to grind.

I think that it is pretty safe to say that ANet wants people to pursue the rewards that they spent time, effort, and money developing. Some of those rewards are gated behind grinds.

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

He never claimed that, “they said there would be no grind.” Which is what you attributed as being bull-kitten. Deriding an argument, that was not made by the opposing side in a debate, is the purest example of strawmanning.

OMFG. First line of his post…

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten.

At least read the posts you’re defending.

Edit: He’s saying Anet is giving us a grind…but Anet said grinds would be in the game. It’s in no way a strawman to point that out.

For someone who claims to be an editor you might want to practice what you preach about reading what you are commenting on.

His statement: “Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind…”

What you claimed he said: “they said there would be no grind…”

Those two statements are not even close to being the same thing.

He never claimed that they said there would be no grind. He pointed out that they do want us (or at least some of us) to grind. There would be no option to grind in the game if ANet did not want at least some of us to grind. They had/have absolute control over this and chose to not only allow grinding, but to reward it. No big deal. its not mandatory. Doesn’t seriously impact character power level. Doesn’t change the fact that ANet does want people to grind.

I think that it is pretty safe to say that ANet wants people to pursue the rewards that they spent time, effort, and money developing. Some of those rewards are gated behind grinds.

The sentence can be read two says. It can be read as saying Anet doesn’t want us to grind (trying to disprove this) or it could be referring to the many quotes on these forums where Anet says we don’t want people to grind.

Now this is where context comes into play. I don’t believe for a second that the poster hasn’t read those threads or comments. Therefore, I take it to mean the second way the sentence can be intepreted, which is the implication that Anet has said it.

This isn’t in any way unreasonable. Context is everything. No post on a forum stands on it’s own.

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

He never claimed that, “they said there would be no grind.” Which is what you attributed as being bull-kitten. Deriding an argument, that was not made by the opposing side in a debate, is the purest example of strawmanning.

OMFG. First line of his post…

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten.

At least read the posts you’re defending.

Edit: He’s saying Anet is giving us a grind…but Anet said grinds would be in the game. It’s in no way a strawman to point that out.

For someone who claims to be an editor you might want to practice what you preach about reading what you are commenting on.

His statement: “Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind…”

What you claimed he said: “they said there would be no grind…”

Those two statements are not even close to being the same thing.

He never claimed that they said there would be no grind. He pointed out that they do want us (or at least some of us) to grind. There would be no option to grind in the game if ANet did not want at least some of us to grind. They had/have absolute control over this and chose to not only allow grinding, but to reward it. No big deal. its not mandatory. Doesn’t seriously impact character power level. Doesn’t change the fact that ANet does want people to grind.

I think that it is pretty safe to say that ANet wants people to pursue the rewards that they spent time, effort, and money developing. Some of those rewards are gated behind grinds.

The sentence can be read two says. It can be read as saying Anet doesn’t want us to grind (trying to disprove this) or it could be referring to the many quotes on these forums where Anet says we don’t want people to grind.

Now this is where context comes into play. I don’t believe for a second that the poster hasn’t read those threads or comments. Therefore, I take it to mean the second way the sentence can be intepreted, which is the implication that Anet has said it.

This isn’t in any way unreasonable. Context is everything. No post on a forum stands on it’s own.

Your context is irrelevant here because either contextual version is still different than what you claimed he said. You claimed he said that ANet claimed that there would be no grind. He did not. He made a comment about what was desired, not what existed. There is a huge difference (and not just in terms of GW2) between that which is desired and that which is reality.

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Ashen.2907:

Vayne.8563:

Trakarg.2095:

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten. If they didn’t want us to grind, they wouldn’t have implemented gargantuan, mindless grinds (See legendaries for one example).

In fact, let’s examine legendaries more closely. They aren’t difficult to get. They are just time-consuming due to all the mats you must GRIND out. The only thing that’s legendary about legendaries is the length of the grind required to get them.

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Anet has said all along, straight from the beginning, that there would be things to grind for in this game. That’s a direct quote.

What there wouldn’t be was required grind, such as in other games.

So saying that they said there would be no grind is indeed bull-kitten.

Good thing he did not say that. You aren’t attempting to strawman him there are you ?

What are you, his defense attorney? He said straight out Anet said they didn’t want people to grind. It’s not at all a strawman argument to point out they also said there would be stuff to grind for.

It’s a matter of whether that grind is required or not. That makes a huge difference. It’s not a strawman argument in any sense of the word.

He never claimed that, “they said there would be no grind.” Which is what you attributed as being bull-kitten. Deriding an argument, that was not made by the opposing side in a debate, is the purest example of strawmanning.

OMFG. First line of his post…

Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind? That’s bullkitten.

At least read the posts you’re defending.

Edit: He’s saying Anet is giving us a grind…but Anet said grinds would be in the game. It’s in no way a strawman to point that out.

For someone who claims to be an editor you might want to practice what you preach about reading what you are commenting on.

His statement: “Arenanet doesn’t want us to grind…”

What you claimed he said: “they said there would be no grind…”

Those two statements are not even close to being the same thing.

He never claimed that they said there would be no grind. He pointed out that they do want us (or at least some of us) to grind. There would be no option to grind in the game if ANet did not want at least some of us to grind. They had/have absolute control over this and chose to not only allow grinding, but to reward it. No big deal. its not mandatory. Doesn’t seriously impact character power level. Doesn’t change the fact that ANet does want people to grind.

I think that it is pretty safe to say that ANet wants people to pursue the rewards that they spent time, effort, and money developing. Some of those rewards are gated behind grinds.

The sentence can be read two says. It can be read as saying Anet doesn’t want us to grind (trying to disprove this) or it could be referring to the many quotes on these forums where Anet says we don’t want people to grind.

Now this is where context comes into play. I don’t believe for a second that the poster hasn’t read those threads or comments. Therefore, I take it to mean the second way the sentence can be intepreted, which is the implication that Anet has said it.

This isn’t in any way unreasonable. Context is everything. No post on a forum stands on it’s own.

Your context is irrelevant here because either contextual version is still different than what you claimed he said. You claimed he said that ANet claimed that there would be no grind. He did not. He made a comment about what was desired, not what existed. There is a huge difference (and not just in terms of GW2) between that which is desired and that which is reality.

I took it to mean what I said it means and STILL believe it means that. You’re telling me I’m intepreting it wrong…and you could be right. But I don’t believe you are.

I’m not a literalist.

“bugception”

lol we really have heard it all from Anet now

Trakarg.2095:

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Kinda. If you watch the Manifesto, it’s there clear as day – “We don’t want players to grind. No one enjoys it”. The issue is that Legendaries were rushed – a lot of preview articles during Beta had a list of items needed for the Legendaries, and it was significantly less grindy than it is today (the Gift of Fortune did not exist, for example).

There was clearly a moment during the later stages of development when ArenaNet decided to add more grind to the game. The change to Legendaries, turning dyes from account-bound to character-bound, requiring more tokens per armor piece in dungeons… All of those point to a huge philosophy shift from what was stated in the Manifesto, and from what ArenaNet had originally told us what the game would be.

Erasculio.2914:

Trakarg.2095:

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Kinda. If you watch the Manifesto, it’s there clear as day – “We don’t want players to grind. No one enjoys it”. The issue is that Legendaries were rushed – a lot of preview articles during Beta had a list of items needed for the Legendaries, and it was significantly less grindy than it is today (the Gift of Fortune did not exist, for example).

There was clearly a moment during the later stages of development when ArenaNet decided to add more grind to the game. The change to Legendaries, turning dyes from account-bound to character-bound, requiring more tokens per armor piece in dungeons… All of those point to a huge philosophy shift from what was stated in the Manifesto, and from what ArenaNet had originally told us what the game would be.

If you watch the entire manifesto instead of focusing on two lines, you’d see the TYPE of grind being referred to, having nothing to do with legendaries. I keep telling you you’re talking the sentence out of context, but you keep doing it.

Repeating a falsehood over and over doesn’t make it a truth.

The first part of the statement is “In most games there’s this annoying grind that you have to get to to get to the fun stuff”

Nothing to do with gear, nothing to do with legendaries….it’s to do with not being able to do big battles until you get to max level in most games. Not only is it clear from the Manifesto, but Anet’s verified it after the fact quite a few times.

Why spread falsehood with the truth is so obvious?

The simple truth is GW2 has created content/itemization that the only means to achieve is via farming; it is a beast of their own making.

They tell you they do not want you to “grind” and to be able to “play the way you want to play” but then demand for you to achieve certain armor sets to have over 100gold or to achieve a certain weapon you need to acquire X thousands of materials.

People do not wish to wait; years to achieve their goals. The average “churn” on an MMO is only 9 months from NSOFTs own statistics in quarterly reports.

So players go to where they can work towards the goals that ANET has provided.

If you wanted people to spread out in the world you would make the reward less mundane in 90% of the other content.

Hitting 80 multiple times is becoming lackluster since the stories all merge.. for some the only “goal” keeping them around is pursuit of an armor set or legendary.. take that away.. they become part of the churn, looking to go elsewhere and the community as a whole suffers.

Khai.6435:

The simple truth is GW2 has created content/itemization that the only means to achieve is via farming; it is a beast of their own making.

They tell you they do not want you to “grind” and to be able to “play the way you want to play” but then demand for you to achieve certain armor sets to have over 100gold or to achieve a certain weapon you need to acquire X thousands of materials.

It’s amazing how not only there is a lot of grind in the game, but also how so many rewards are given exclusively for grind. I think Legendaries are the perfect example – they could have been a reward for doing something actually legendary, instead they are just a massive grind.

It feels like Guild Wars 2 had two teams. One that believed in the Manifesto, built the very detailed world we have in-game with all its little wonders, and designed the art style of the game… And one team that decided to go 100% against the Manifesto, built Orr, and was in charge of the game’s reward system and Gem Store.

Unfortunatelly, there is zero chance ArenaNet will go back from their broken promises. I hope they can keep the next updates better than most of those we have been receiving, but I think the damage has already been done – the GW2 community is now mostly made by farmers and grinders, who want ArenaNet to give more grind, not more fun content.

Vayne.8563:

Erasculio.2914:

Trakarg.2095:

So, I wonder, why did Arenanet implement legendaries in the way they did? They don’t want us to grind, so why make us grind? Why not make legendaries have legendary, lore-rich quests that involve difficult content? Oh, right, because Anet can’t design such things due to laziness, unwillingness, or simply an inability to design meaningful content in a game without the trinity.

Kinda. If you watch the Manifesto, it’s there clear as day – “We don’t want players to grind. No one enjoys it”. The issue is that Legendaries were rushed – a lot of preview articles during Beta had a list of items needed for the Legendaries, and it was significantly less grindy than it is today (the Gift of Fortune did not exist, for example).

There was clearly a moment during the later stages of development when ArenaNet decided to add more grind to the game. The change to Legendaries, turning dyes from account-bound to character-bound, requiring more tokens per armor piece in dungeons… All of those point to a huge philosophy shift from what was stated in the Manifesto, and from what ArenaNet had originally told us what the game would be.

If you watch the entire manifesto instead of focusing on two lines, you’d see the TYPE of grind being referred to, having nothing to do with legendaries. I keep telling you you’re talking the sentence out of context, but you keep doing it.

Repeating a falsehood over and over doesn’t make it a truth.

The first part of the statement is “In most games there’s this annoying grind that you have to get to to get to the fun stuff”

Nothing to do with gear, nothing to do with legendaries….it’s to do with not being able to do big battles until you get to max level in most games. Not only is it clear from the Manifesto, but Anet’s verified it after the fact quite a few times.

Why spread falsehood with the truth is so obvious?

I have always supported the idea that grind for skins is fine. Skins don’t matter. There’s some statement somewhere by one of the ANet guys that says something like if you want to grind you should get a cosmetic benefit. No problem.

But once Legendaries offer increased functionality (guaranteed BIS, you can change it out of combat from zerkers to PVT to rampagers or rabid, etc…) then I think there’s a reasonable argument that ANet has turned is back on the spirit of the manifesto if not the letter.

One of my biggest criticisms of ANet is they make general statements which they allow us to interpret as we wish. They reap the benefit of that interpretation and then later, when they implement something that looks nothing like what they allowed us to believe, people come on the forums saying “they never said that.”

Maybe they didn’t, but they sure were willing to take money from people who thought they did.

I gave up on my legendary hunt. If I get a precursor or scavenger hunt enables me to continue, Ill slowly work toward it but to be honest..my entire mission for a legendary burnt me out on the game entirely which contributed toward my negativity of the game. However, some criticism and negativity of the game and its design direction is not unjustified. Constant mini games, constant crap in the game that has barely had any impact on the actual world or any of the lore of Guild Wars is kitten poor design. Dungeon updates, scavenger hunt, fix the condition build problems…more skins that arent tied to RNG. These are things people want. More zones. I dont want to spend eternity in these mini games going after achievements.

With that said, my gameplay has been a mixed bag of map completing (in the event I am enabled to go after a legendary again), living story achievements, and some WvW. Its been more enjoyable I must say. But again, these are all “filler” things to enjoy. Not an “end” which is I guess what the game shouldnt have, but would be nice if there were more difficult things to do, that do not require you to group up and rely on other people. I really long for the day of difficult solo dungeons, or 1-2 people dungeons. Or make the dynamic events scale more effectively with the # of people, make them more impactful on the surrounding zone, and worth while. I see people farming champs in queensdale for no other reason than achievements, dailys, and monthlys. Id like to be able to run around in Timberline Falls, one of my favorite zones, and still see a ton of people. But, the beast of the community finds the most efficient route in the game, ala queensdale, and farms that into oblivion.

I propose: Instead of mini games, try making each zone worth playing in. Not just the 3 or 4 champion events in queensdale. Revamp the dungeons to make all paths viable(In the pipe, I know). Make the boss mechancis, open world and dungeon, more interesting. Make ALL builds viable..enough of this zerker party crap. These are things that MUST happen to this game. Im getting so sick of fluff mini games(even though they are somewhat fun). But ultimately, it adds NOTHING to the game. I just finished my last sanctum sprint for the achievement and I will not run that infernal thing again.

More content, less games.

More content, less circus. Less carnival.

I also think that successful completion of a Dynamic Event needs to be reworked. Who the hell cares about karma? Its utterly useless unless you are going after a legendary, which is most likely a small % of the community. If you’re level 80, XP is nearly useless. You get 2-3 silver. Why bother with these events? For the drops..we run them for the drops and when we find a nice drop rate, it gets nerfed.

Fix the reward system for dynamic events. Ive mentioned this a lot lately in these forums…but I look to firefall as a great example…hear me out:

In firefall you have three main important things: XP, Crystite(in game currency) and resources(iron, carbon, methane gas, silicate, toxins, etc..run of the mill crap used for crafting).

These three things are used for character progression, crafting(which is enormously important…its one of the cornerstones of the game), etc. Everything that you gain from completing events is useful. NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING is a waste. Nada. Everything is useful. This makes doing any event in the game worthwhile because you know you are getting ALL useful rewards at the end. Not just one useful reward, everything. You need it all. Am I making the point clear? You need a lot of resources, a lot of crystite, a lot of XP to do anything in the game. So playing any part of the game is rewarding.

In GW2, they seriously need to adjust these reward tables. I dont care if I complete an event or not. I don’t need karma, I dont need XP, and 2 silver means squat to me.

I hate the nerf that has been done to Orr. I love the old Orr, pre Lost Shore patch. After Anet nerfed Orr, I stopped farming.

But I have learned to move on, and find something else to while my time in the game. I decided to build a guild that aims to help members. It is not farming, but fun for me, coz I get to help old and new players reach their goal.

Our guild started with 3 core members back in August. We added 1 more by September, but never really planned on making it huge, except pick a few more ingame friends to have fun with, and grew to 30.

But by Lost Shore patch, the guild withered down to the core 3 players. And it was then that Orr got nerfed to the ground. So it was then that guild-building became our focus.

Now, we have close to 300 members, and one of the oldest active guild in our server. We share our blessings to other players and smaller guild by hosting public Guild Missions every week.

Now, more than ever, we try to recruit those that need help….and make this game better for them

DeathMetal.8264:

I hate the nerf that has been done to Orr. I love the old Orr, pre Lost Shore patch. After Anet nerfed Orr, I stopped farming.

But I have learned to move on, and find something else to while my time in the game. I decided to build a guild that aims to help members. It is not farming, but fun for me, coz I get to help old and new players reach their goal.

I like how they thinned out the mobs, but there isnt a whole lot of reason to go to orr and play the game other than ancient wood and orichalcum…and the ocassional boss chest, but thats it. I stay out of there. Pent/Shelt nerfs left Orr an undesirable place to be for lvl 80s.

Now it is up to the COF farm to get any sort of reward, and quickly.

cesmode.4257:

DeathMetal.8264:

I hate the nerf that has been done to Orr. I love the old Orr, pre Lost Shore patch. After Anet nerfed Orr, I stopped farming.

But I have learned to move on, and find something else to while my time in the game. I decided to build a guild that aims to help members. It is not farming, but fun for me, coz I get to help old and new players reach their goal.

I like how they thinned out the mobs, but there isnt a whole lot of reason to go to orr and play the game other than ancient wood and orichalcum…and the ocassional boss chest, but thats it. I stay out of there. Pent/Shelt nerfs left Orr an undesirable place to be for lvl 80s.

Now it is up to the COF farm to get any sort of reward, and quickly.

Thinning out mobs, it was not really in issue for me. In fact, I like it when there’s lots of mobs. What I don’t like is tons of mobs that don’t even count for event tag (i.e. Mel vet Spider).

2nd week of game (maybe 3rd, I forgot), farming Orr mobs is fun and rewarding. Mobs drops coins!!!! And if you use Omnomberry, they become silver drop. And because not many are doing the events (except later on, they become popular like Plinxx), getting a group of at least 2, yes, only 2, provides ample rewards for a decent time.

Completing Plinxx, as an example, yields you a rare or 2 (if you are in full MF set, with food and guild buff) every 2-3 runs. Since plinxx back then starts every 5min or so, you can be sure to bring home a few gold after 1-2hr run.

And what about Grub farming from Champion giants? Anet nerfed it too, at one time, you get a “This content is disabled” or something similar as error message. People farm those, because it’s fun and rewarding for them. And you won’t see people staying in that are for a whole day, they just play, join and leave afterwards. They know, that due to Orr being difficult to many other players, that the event, and therefore rewards, will always be there.

Some may call it elitism, but it isn’t. It’s a case of L2P, when I got to the event, players are sharing tips: do it this way, to get more lootz and coins. But when Anet nerfed the events, players started getting dispersed, on the lookout for new farming spot, only to get the same nerf and nerf and nerf, and finally, either got driven away, or like me, find other stuff to do.

I don’t really like Anet’s stance on farm nerf, people are different, some find it fun to farm, some to explore, some to experiment, etc. But it is what it is….i can complain, or look for other game, or just enjoy other parts of the game. I chose the latter, how long it will last, I dn’t know, but so far, it’s been a blast.

What I really miss was the Karma train in Orr for the first few weeks. Made it lively.

“Wheres the train”…now that train is in queensdale!

Vayne.8563:

Gasoline.2570:

They probably quit the game. I hope to see the day vayne is alone with the other 10 fanboys in lions arch doing belchers bluff and saying its the greatest thing ever.

Laugh all you want. My guild numbers are up. Not a huge guild but I’m happy with our 115 members….and yes, quite a few of us are very active.

I love people who think they don’t like a game so the game isn’t doing well. Two, three years from now, you’ll still be singing the same song.

And it won’t have any more truth to it then.

You realize your guild numbers are going up is because other guilds are dying right? This game is hemorrhaging dedicated players. It’s not new players joining, it’s old players consolidating.

its legitimate farming i swear!

Envy.1679:

its legitimate farming i swear!

Hahahaha. Shhh..

bravoart.5308:

Vayne.8563:

Gasoline.2570:

They probably quit the game. I hope to see the day vayne is alone with the other 10 fanboys in lions arch doing belchers bluff and saying its the greatest thing ever.

Laugh all you want. My guild numbers are up. Not a huge guild but I’m happy with our 115 members….and yes, quite a few of us are very active.

I love people who think they don’t like a game so the game isn’t doing well. Two, three years from now, you’ll still be singing the same song.

And it won’t have any more truth to it then.

You realize your guild numbers are going up is because other guilds are dying right? This game is hemorrhaging dedicated players. It’s not new players joining, it’s old players consolidating.

I wouldnt necessarily say that… while I do think arenanet needs to focus their development on more core aspects of an MMO, they do have a large active playerbase. Yes, they lost a ton of people so far…a ton. But, if that article in the general forums is any accurate, they have 2.5 mil active players per week. Thats probably #2 mmo in terms of activity and is something to beat your chest to. No mmo will come close to WoW in terms of active players, and once wow falls from greatness, no game will reach those peaks again. Why? So many MMOs and innovative MMOs such as this one, and even the likes of firefall and neverwinter..

Vayne.8563:

If you watch the entire manifesto instead of focusing on two lines, you’d see the TYPE of grind being referred to, having nothing to do with legendaries. I keep telling you you’re talking the sentence out of context, but you keep doing it.

Repeating a falsehood over and over doesn’t make it a truth.

You’re being disingenuous here you very well know there are differing interpretations of the manifesto.