Its a good deal to use if you rely on master salvage kits, but pales compared to mystic salvage kits. Which Ive a large load to exhaust, before I can start using this new tool.
A lot more expensive in use compared to the copper fed, but the heightened efficiency should yield more on yellow and exotic salvages.
I’ve heard that it’s salvage rate (especially for ectos) is well below that of a master / mystic kit
The salvage rate is identical. It’s the cost per use that falls behind mystic salvage kits. Higher cost per use compared to mystic kits, combined with initial gem cost makes it a no buy for me.
Those armadillos would be a lot cooler if they looked more like real armadillos. mmm armadillos
-BnooMaGoo.5690
I’ve heard that it’s salvage rate (especially for ectos) is well below that of a master / mystic kit
The salvage rate is identical. It’s the cost per use that falls behind mystic salvage kits. Higher cost per use compared to mystic kits, combined with initial gem cost makes it a no buy for me.
That was a while ago, last I saw the costs were pretty close (Silver fed slightly ahead) with Mystics being 63 copper per use and the Silver being 60 copper per use. Unless you have lots of mystic forge stones, which- admittedly- most people do, the silver fed is cheaper to use.
Mystic forge stones can be used in place of exotics – they are worth at least 1 Gold each. This puts the silver ahead by a long way.
But at the end of the day it’s a convenience item. Just bought one (will be watching my salvage rates carefully)
Not really… Mystic forge stones for mystic gambling, are kinda crappy. It makes your end result weapon random. So there’s a good chance if you even get a precursor it will be a crappy one. I rarely bother gambling that way. You can use the cheapest weapons also in that case and those are probably around 50s or so. But mostly that is a waste and you’re better off investing in 4 of the same type of good precursor weapon.
I’ve heard that it’s salvage rate (especially for ectos) is well below that of a master / mystic kit
The salvage rate is identical. It’s the cost per use that falls behind mystic salvage kits. Higher cost per use compared to mystic kits, combined with initial gem cost makes it a no buy for me.
That was a while ago, last I saw the costs were pretty close (Silver fed slightly ahead) with Mystics being 63 copper per use and the Silver being 60 copper per use. Unless you have lots of mystic forge stones, which- admittedly- most people do, the silver fed is cheaper to use.
You’re thinking of the Master’s Salvage Kit there.
Mystic is 10.5 coppers per use, far better than the SFSoM’s 60 coppers per use. It’s only worth getting the SFSoM if you’re one of those people who use Mystic/Master kits on absolutely everything rather than just level 70+ rares and exotics.
I’ve heard that it’s salvage rate (especially for ectos) is well below that of a master / mystic kit
The salvage rate is identical. It’s the cost per use that falls behind mystic salvage kits. Higher cost per use compared to mystic kits, combined with initial gem cost makes it a no buy for me.
That was a while ago, last I saw the costs were pretty close (Silver fed slightly ahead) with Mystics being 63 copper per use and the Silver being 60 copper per use. Unless you have lots of mystic forge stones, which- admittedly- most people do, the silver fed is cheaper to use.
You’re thinking of the Master’s Salvage Kit there.
Mystic is 10.5 coppers per use, far better than the SFSoM’s 60 coppers per use. It’s only worth getting the SFSoM if you’re one of those people who use Mystic/Master kits on absolutely everything rather than just level 70+ rares and exotics.
Your cost calculation is horribly off. You are ignoring the actual cost of the mystic forge stones which are considerable.
(with a price of around 150 gold for 800 Gems…This is 5.33 Gems per gold….
that makes 45 Gems cost around 8.44 gold and you need 3 = 25.3125 Gold)
for a total of = 25g 57s 49c for 250 uses
per use = 1023 and for 25 uses to be equiv = 2g 55s 75c for a Mystic Salvage Kit
~ 2.56 Gold is definitelly not cheaper than a Master’s Salvage kit that costs 15s 36c
Also just for perspective at an average of 150 Gold per 800 Gems that would make the Silver Salvage-o-matic cost ~ 93.75 Gold is you trade gold for Gems that means after making 3.67 mystic salvage kits it would have been the same cost to just get the Silver Salvage-o-matic which takes up much less space.
I’ve heard that it’s salvage rate (especially for ectos) is well below that of a master / mystic kit
The salvage rate is identical. It’s the cost per use that falls behind mystic salvage kits. Higher cost per use compared to mystic kits, combined with initial gem cost makes it a no buy for me.
That was a while ago, last I saw the costs were pretty close (Silver fed slightly ahead) with Mystics being 63 copper per use and the Silver being 60 copper per use. Unless you have lots of mystic forge stones, which- admittedly- most people do, the silver fed is cheaper to use.
You’re thinking of the Master’s Salvage Kit there.
Mystic is 10.5 coppers per use, far better than the SFSoM’s 60 coppers per use. It’s only worth getting the SFSoM if you’re one of those people who use Mystic/Master kits on absolutely everything rather than just level 70+ rares and exotics.
Your cost calculation is horribly off. You are ignoring the actual cost of the mystic forge stones which are considerable.
(with a price of around 150 gold for 800 Gems…This is 5.33 Gems per gold….
that makes 45 Gems cost around 8.44 gold and you need 3 = 25.3125 Gold)
for a total of = 25g 57s 49c for 250 uses
per use = 1023 and for 25 uses to be equiv = 2g 55s 75c for a Mystic Salvage Kit
~ 2.56 Gold is definitelly not cheaper than a Master’s Salvage kit that costs 15s 36c
Also just for perspective at an average of 150 Gold per 800 Gems that would make the Silver Salvage-o-matic cost ~ 93.75 Gold is you trade gold for Gems that means after making 3.67 mystic salvage kits it would have been the same cost to just get the Silver Salvage-o-matic which takes up much less space.
Every mystic forge stone I have came from achievement point chests, login rewards, and black lion keys I got from map/story rewards. After two years of playing (and using mystic kits only for rares and exotics), I still have two stacks of mystic forge stones. The only time I was able to drop below two stacks was back when I was grinding enough to burn through a mystic kit a week, but since I’m not playing as much the stones just are just piling up again.
So cheapest is actually free, not 45 gems.
Of course, it’s a different story if you burn your stones in the mystic forge (which isn’t advisable since they don’t count as a fourth item of the same kind, thus randomize your results) or burn your mystic kits on uncommons and masterworks, but I’ve already said as much.
I would like it if they just fixed the price of Silver fed Salvage o matic to compete with mystic salvage kits. That is why copper fed is so successful.
Granted they’d just have to rename it which is fine. As it stands
Basic Salvage kit = 88 copper, 25 uses. 88/25 = 3.52 copper.
Copper fed salvage o matic = 3 copper.
In order for silver fed to be a much more attractive buy with real money and make it balanced but not broken you would need to make it cost 10 copper per salvage. The cost of Mystic forge stones is negligible mainly because you get them through achievement chests and dalies for free and en-masse. The fact that they give 250 uses compounds this issue making it extremely ineffective to get silver fed compared to copper fed.
This would easily be fixed by 10 copper to use. Regardless of what they do with it I don’t mind. But I think it would be nice to have the gemstore item compete with the most efficient item that does the same thing in the game while also providing convenience. That is exactly why copper fed is so successful.
I would like it if they just fixed the price of Silver fed Salvage o matic to compete with mystic salvage kits. That is why copper fed is so successful.
Granted they’d just have to rename it which is fine. As it stands
Basic Salvage kit = 88 copper, 25 uses. 88/25 = 3.52 copper.
Copper fed salvage o matic = 3 copper.
In order for silver fed to be a much more attractive buy with real money and make it balanced but not broken you would need to make it cost 10 copper per salvage. The cost of Mystic forge stones is negligible mainly because you get them through achievement chests and dalies for free and en-masse. The fact that they give 250 uses compounds this issue making it extremely ineffective to get silver fed compared to copper fed.
This would easily be fixed by 10 copper to use. Regardless of what they do with it I don’t mind. But I think it would be nice to have the gemstore item compete with the most efficient item that does the same thing in the game while also providing convenience. That is exactly why copper fed is so successful.
To be fair, the only reason the Mystic Kit is so much more affordable is because ANet introduced (and continue to introduce) too many mystic forge stones for free. A more likely change would be nerfing the rate at which mystic stones are rewarded to make Mystic Kits harder to get, thereby making Master’s Kits viable again, which would be the only way a Silver-Fed Kit would be worth a purchase.
If they dropped the Silver-Fed Kit down to 10 coppers, they would have to nerf it to have the same stats as the Fine Salvage Kit (which costs around 11 coppers per use), but that would cause an outrage.
I would like it if they just fixed the price of Silver fed Salvage o matic to compete with mystic salvage kits. That is why copper fed is so successful.
Granted they’d just have to rename it which is fine. As it stands
Basic Salvage kit = 88 copper, 25 uses. 88/25 = 3.52 copper.
Copper fed salvage o matic = 3 copper.
In order for silver fed to be a much more attractive buy with real money and make it balanced but not broken you would need to make it cost 10 copper per salvage. The cost of Mystic forge stones is negligible mainly because you get them through achievement chests and dalies for free and en-masse. The fact that they give 250 uses compounds this issue making it extremely ineffective to get silver fed compared to copper fed.
This would easily be fixed by 10 copper to use. Regardless of what they do with it I don’t mind. But I think it would be nice to have the gemstore item compete with the most efficient item that does the same thing in the game while also providing convenience. That is exactly why copper fed is so successful.
To be fair, the only reason the Mystic Kit is so much more affordable is because ANet introduced (and continue to introduce) too many mystic forge stones.
If they dropped the Silver-Fed Kit down to 10 coppers, they would have to nerf it to have the same stats as the Fine Salvage Kit, which would cause an outrage.
I don’t see why they would have to nerf it. It would only be marginally better than a mystic salvage kit and it still functions as about as good a gold sink as mystic salvage kits. Mystic forge stones have become part of the game and honestly I don’t think they should be in short supply as much like black lion salvage kits they are used in special circumstances like making a new salvage kit. Consumables that are useful in those two ways should not be in short supply as it would mess with the playerbase if they had to spend more money and inventory space on Master’s Salvage kits as well as essentially being forced to wait for the silver salvage to be on the BLTC or buy mystic forge stones. Something that is a big nono to a lot of players concerning a cash shop. Cash shop should sell convenience and currently silver salvage has too much of a problem competing in convenience to a mystic salvage kit.
Besides, like the copper salvage kit before it…it would be marginally better than the best option. People use copper because salvaging all those blues and greens is not worth the cost of a mystic or a master’s salvage kit. The extra rare items really don’t matter with blues and greens.
Not to mention you would have to salvage 1.77 million rares to save enough money to make up the cost of its current gem store price of 500 gems. I’d say that is pretty balanced. Or 5.29k rares to make up a total savings of 26.24s which is the cost of making a new mystic salvage kit. You would have to use the equivalent of 21.16 mystic salvage kits fully to get enough savings to cover ONE extra salvage kit.
The reasoning for the nerf is that both infinite kits are balanced around the vendor versions, so if they drop the operation cost to below that of the Fine Kit, it would stand to reason they would also drop the salvaging chances to match. That the Mystic Kit has the same chances as a Master Kit yet costs roughly the same as a Fine Kit per use is clearly an aberration – it’s obvious the Mystic Kit’s advantage over the Masters Kit was the 250 uses, but ANet made the mistake (a happy one for us) of handing out the mystic forge stones like candy, thereby making the gem cost of the stones irrelevant and destroying the value of Master Kits.
So while I wouldn’t want to see Mystic Kits suddenly become more expensive to use, I don’t want to use the product of a mistake to be the standard by which we compare anything to either.
I can’t remember the last time I had less than 100 Mystic Forge Stones. I never buy any, but I also almost never throw rares and exotics in the Forge, so the only thing I use them for is salvage kits.
Even using those kits exclusively on all my permanent characters I’m never short of stones/kits, so this one isn’t really worth getting for me.
Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).
To be fair, the only reason the Mystic Kit is so much more affordable is because ANet introduced (and continue to introduce) too many mystic forge stones for free. A more likely change would be nerfing the rate at which mystic stones are rewarded to make Mystic Kits harder to get, thereby making Master’s Kits viable again, which would be the only way a Silver-Fed Kit would be worth a purchase.
Or they could make the mystic forge stones worth using. Right now you get worse results if you use a stone (because the result is random) which makes them nearly useless. If they make the stones affect the outcome of the forge in a positive way then a sink will be created for them and they won’t be used only for the mystic salvage kits like it is now.
Mystic is cheapest only if you have a load of mystic forge stones. Silver-Fed is slightly cheaper than Master but the selling point of all the infinite use items is never running out in the field or needing to carry several thus stealing space from your inventory.
Now I only use silver-fed on rares and frankly unless I’m farming them on the TP, I’m not getting that many per play session to be concern ever running out away from a vendor that sell master kits. That said I do own one and it along with my royal terrace pass and copper-fed are in my shared inventory slots so no character is never without access.
Gem store items were never meant to be cost effective. If you bought a copper fed salvage kit to save money, you’re probably doing it wrong. That one saves space and the trouble of having to buy more kits as they run out quickly with 25. A few others may buy it because of the silly things it says.
However, I can’t really see the value of the silver one because a mystic kit has 250 uses and rares don’t drop as fast to justify inventory cleaning as the copper one really would.
Maybe someday when I run out of mystic forge stones but that doesn’t seem like anytime in the future.
If only I could salvage those stupid runes that defeat the purpose of salvgaging to save space.
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards,
for there you have been and there you will long to return.
Gem store items were never meant to be cost effective. If you bought a copper fed salvage kit to save money, you’re probably doing it wrong. That one saves space and the trouble of having to buy more kits as they run out quickly with 25. A few others may buy it because of the silly things it says.
But… it is cost effective. The copper-fed’s cheaper per use and plenty of us have salvaged enough that we’ve got our initial investment back. As others have said, using a mystic salvage kit costs 1/6th of what a silver-fed costs per salvage (assuming the player is earning more mystic forge stones than they’re using, which is true for any player without a severe gambling problem) – it’s horrible value, on top of not saving that much space due to mystic salvage kits being a 250 stack. The silly lines are a nice bonus though.
I’ve heard that it’s salvage rate (especially for ectos) is well below that of a master / mystic kit
The salvage rate is identical. It’s the cost per use that falls behind mystic salvage kits. Higher cost per use compared to mystic kits, combined with initial gem cost makes it a no buy for me.
That was a while ago, last I saw the costs were pretty close (Silver fed slightly ahead) with Mystics being 63 copper per use and the Silver being 60 copper per use. Unless you have lots of mystic forge stones, which- admittedly- most people do, the silver fed is cheaper to use.
You’re thinking of the Master’s Salvage Kit there.
Mystic is 10.5 coppers per use, far better than the SFSoM’s 60 coppers per use. It’s only worth getting the SFSoM if you’re one of those people who use Mystic/Master kits on absolutely everything rather than just level 70+ rares and exotics.
Your cost calculation is horribly off. You are ignoring the actual cost of the mystic forge stones which are considerable.
(with a price of around 150 gold for 800 Gems…This is 5.33 Gems per gold….
that makes 45 Gems cost around 8.44 gold and you need 3 = 25.3125 Gold)
for a total of = 25g 57s 49c for 250 uses
per use = 1023 and for 25 uses to be equiv = 2g 55s 75c for a Mystic Salvage Kit
~ 2.56 Gold is definitelly not cheaper than a Master’s Salvage kit that costs 15s 36c
Also just for perspective at an average of 150 Gold per 800 Gems that would make the Silver Salvage-o-matic cost ~ 93.75 Gold is you trade gold for Gems that means after making 3.67 mystic salvage kits it would have been the same cost to just get the Silver Salvage-o-matic which takes up much less space.
I didn’t factor in the gem cost of mystic forge stones because you get them for free, and in large amounts, from achievement points. I have enough to make roughly 83 mystic salvage kits. That’s over 20,000 uses.
Those armadillos would be a lot cooler if they looked more like real armadillos. mmm armadillos
-BnooMaGoo.5690
Gem store items were never meant to be cost effective. If you bought a copper fed salvage kit to save money, you’re probably doing it wrong. That one saves space and the trouble of having to buy more kits as they run out quickly with 25. A few others may buy it because of the silly things it says.
But… it is cost effective. The copper-fed’s cheaper per use and plenty of us have salvaged enough that we’ve got our initial investment back. As others have said, using a mystic salvage kit costs 1/6th of what a silver-fed costs per salvage (assuming the player is earning more mystic forge stones than they’re using, which is true for any player without a severe gambling problem) – it’s horrible value, on top of not saving that much space due to mystic salvage kits being a 250 stack. The silly lines are a nice bonus though.
Copper fed is one of the rare examples where you will see value over time. But it’s still not that big that one should rush to it.
You bascially save 0.52c per salvage: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Copper-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic That would probably take a while to pay for itself and you might have been able to do something else with the gold/gems it took to buy it.
My point though is the benefits are far more pronounced then simply the copper saved per salvage but rather the stuff that’s much harder to calculate, such as space saved, being able to move faster due to save time, and generally playing efficient that probably make up more than its cost in ways one wouldn’t realize unless they used it. In other words, you probably will have gained a lot more than just 52 gold. In general, your time is a lot more valuable.
Edit: I failed at math.
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards,
for there you have been and there you will long to return.
I didn’t factor in the gem cost of mystic forge stones because you get them for free, and in large amounts, from achievement points. I have enough to make roughly 83 mystic salvage kits. That’s over 20,000 uses.
Well it is true that you basically can neglect the costs of forge stones but only for making a proper comparison you really should take it into the calculation.
On paper mystic salvage kits are more expensive than both the silver-fed and rare salvage kit. The only reason they are less expensive in practice than the other two is because there isn’t really any use for the masses of forge stones we get other than mystic salvage kits.
if you get say a conservative 150 mystic stones over the lifetime of your char, that’s 12500 rare or above disenchants or about 5 disenchant every day for nearly 7 years, so the smart money says use up your mystic stones and look to buy the silver fed at about year 6 Would be different ofc if there was other good stuff to buy with the mystic stones,
“Trying to please everyone would not only be challenging
but would also result in a product that might not satisfy anyone”- Roman Pichler, Strategize
I didn’t factor in the gem cost of mystic forge stones because you get them for free, and in large amounts, from achievement points. I have enough to make roughly 83 mystic salvage kits. That’s over 20,000 uses.
Well it is true that you basically can neglect the costs of forge stones but only for making a proper comparison you really should take it into the calculation.
On paper mystic salvage kits are more expensive than both the silver-fed and rare salvage kit. The only reason they are less expensive in practice than the other two is because there isn’t really any use for the masses of forge stones we get other than mystic salvage kits.
Funny thing is if you look at the footnote on the salvage kits page, it points you to the talk page regarding how gem prices can affect the kit’s cost.
These kits are more cost effective than buying 10 single kits, while the price for 100 gems is below 94 Silver coin 34 Copper coin.
The following formulas assume buying a pack of 10 stones.
The result will be the cost in silver. Eg: 0.53021 Silver coin = 53 Copper coin per use.
Short form cost per use = (100 gems cost * 0.0054) + 0.105
Long form cost per use = ((100 gems cost * 4.5 / 10 * 3 [costs for 3 stones, bought at 10 stones price]) + 26.24 [for the 3 salvage kit]) / 250
In order for silver fed to be a much more attractive buy with real money and make it balanced but not broken you would need to make it cost 10 copper per salvage. The cost of Mystic forge stones is negligible mainly because you get them through achievement chests and dalies for free and en-masse. The fact that they give 250 uses compounds this issue making it extremely ineffective to get silver fed compared to copper fed.
To be fair, the only reason the Mystic Kit is so much more affordable is because ANet introduced (and continue to introduce) too many mystic forge stones.
I don’t see why they would have to nerf it.
Cash shop should sell convenience and currently silver salvage has too much of a problem competing in convenience to a mystic salvage kit.
Not to mention you would have to salvage 1.77 million rares to save enough money to make up the cost of its current gem store price of 500 gems.
You can not ignore the set value for the Mystic Forge Stones, at some point they will be harder to come by and/or the uselessness of them will be fixed. People who play infrequently, ignore achievements, and play only one character are going to have significantly less of them. Anet makes their game items with their perceived value in mind. The pricing of the Silver Fed Salvage-o-matic obviously takes the cash shop value of the Mystic Forge Stones in mind. These are priced specifically for profit to Anet through convenience to the player.
My biggest problem with items like these is that they are not accessible by all characters unless you constantly move them around. It makes the person who plays one character more greatly benefited by these types of items, this is the same with the infinite harvesting tools.
Anet, if they perceive them as a problem, will most likely do something like drastically cut the drop rate of them or implement various recipes requiring obscene numbers of them, they tend to over react when solving problems.
I personally find it irresponsible to recommend to others on a public forum that Mystic Salvage kits are cheaper with pointing out that the Mystic Forge Stones are absent for the cost calculation. If a person then wants to consider them as free then that is fine but Anet has set a real world value for them via their cash shop.
You can not ignore the set value for the Mystic Forge Stones, at some point they will be harder to come by and/or the uselessness of them will be fixed.
This is purely speculation, Anet haven’t said anything to suggest they’re going to change the availability or use of Stones. (Especially to ‘fix’ the usefulness, as far as I’m aware they are working exactly as intended so there is nothing to be fixed.)
I could equally say everyone can ignore the price because at some point they will be much easier to get for free.
But I think it would be more accurate to say everyone needs to work out for themselves what a Mystic Kit costs based on their own supply of Mystic Forge Stones and what they use them for.
If you’ve always got more stones than you need without buying them then you can safely ignore the price of them. If you buy them from the gem store, or you find them more valuable when used for gambling in the Forge then you need to factor that cost into the cost of a Mystic Salvage Kit. If at some point in the future the use or availability are changed then both groups will need to reassess.
(There’s also other factors, for example people who spent a lot of time doing things like map meta-events and therefore get a lot of use from a salvage kit and may not want to keep going back to LA might feel that the extra cost of a Silver-fed is outweighed by the convenience of never running out. Especially if they’ve got the shared inventory slots and can use 1 kit on all their characters.)
Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).
I personally find it irresponsible to recommend to others on a public forum that Mystic Salvage kits are cheaper with pointing out that the Mystic Forge Stones are absent for the cost calculation. If a person then wants to consider them as free then that is fine but Anet has set a real world value for them via their cash shop.
I made the mistake of assuming people who read my caveat understood it implied the value of the Silver-Fed Kit was contingent on the rate at which they accumulated free (doesn’t matter what the gem store price is, if something is given to you for free, then it’s free) mystic forge stones. So to rephrase:
“If you’re the type who uses more mystic forge stones than you can get from login rewards and the occasional AP chest, then the Silver-Fed Salvage-o-Matic is worth it, otherwise it simply isn’t.”
In reality, the sliver machine will never pay for itself in coin terms. You have to salvage half a million items for that, which will take several lifetimes if you only use it on rares and exotics.
What it does give you is a small QoL upgrade, and it’s particularly handy if you put it in one of those newfangled shared slot things.
$$$