Guild Wars 2

I’ll just say it: Cut us a little slack on the down-leveling. I understand you want high level players to group with their lower level friends, and that you want us all to be able to enjoy content as it was designed, but there are a couple of reasons I really don’t like the way it’s currently set up.

1. If I’m level 50 and trying to do an event designed for level 32, give me SOME type of advantage because of my level. Right now, ArenaNet ratchets me down to where all fights are challenging no matter where I am. Sounds great on the face of it, but why did I level if you were just going to kitten me to the point that I’m just as powerful as the lowbie next to me? Again: i’m not looking for easymode, but hell at least let me downscale to lvl 35 or so. Give me SOMETHING for my extra work and levels.

2. Running through a low level zone is hell. This is my primary complaint. If I’m level 80 and I want to cruise through a lvl 30 zone to start exploring, I have to stop and kill monsters because they will actually kill me if I"m not careful. A level 80 has to be “careful” around lvl 30 mobs. The solution to this could be simple: if I’m far too high level for the zone, make it so mobs don’t aggro me. I should not have to die 3 times running through Kessex Hills at level 60 just so I can get to Gendarran Fields.

Lastly, I propose always down-leveling to the max level for a zone. That’s right, if I’m in Gendarran Fields, make me level 35. That way I can still participate in events, but I’m not always double checking my screen to figure out what level you kittened me at. if I’m in a 50-60 zone and I’m level 80, make me level 60 so I can feel I have SOME advantage. Otherwise what’s the point of being powerful if everything is just as difficult?

(This applies to personal story as well. Give me a few levels advantage if I put in the hard work)

It’s the way the game was designed, and it’s not going to change.

I find it’s actually not very effective, at least for the starter zones. Even down-leveled to 3, I still 2 or 3 shot most mobs.

I would love if they would just down-scale that amount of damage we can do. That way there still won’t be kill stealing and I can have a sense of being a God in lower level zones.
As it is of my personal option that down-scaling everything will take away the feel of being God like, which for me on a personal level is part of any role playing game! But to each his own I guess, I just thought I’d make my point of view known.

You do have an advantage when you’re down-leveled. You have all those trait and skill points. If you haven’t completely slacked on your gear, and you gave a couple of seconds of thought to your build, you shouldn’t be having any problem with lower level content.

And no, you shouldn’t be able to run through zones and not have to fight stuff just because you’re level 80. You want to get through a zone quickly, take a waypoint. If you haven’t found the waypoint, then you have to explore the area just like everyone else. It’s much much easier to explore zones when I’m over-leveled, especially because I can solo the veteran mobs guarding some of the skill points, and I can kill normal mobs very quickly.

As an added bonus, I get meaningful XP from them and drops of crafting materials. If I want to kill some stuff to get jute drops because I switched over to a new crafting skill, why shouldn’t I get XP from the mobs I’m killing? I can always use another skill point.

The whole point of downscaling is that you DON’T behave like a God in the starter zones. Furthermore, it keeps all areas of the game fairly relevant, although the rewards will never be as high as the level 80 areas.

If you want to loll about without a challenge in starter areas, you’re in the wrong game.

I like this system it make it so new stuff come out you dont feel your over power and make you help out people more

if you didnt had this system you wont get exp and loot for low level monster

RobertB.8326:

I would love if they would just down-scale that amount of damage we can do. That way there still won’t be kill stealing and I can have a sense of being a God in lower level zones.
As it is of my personal option that down-scaling everything will take away the feel of being God like, which for me on a personal level is part of any role playing game! But to each his own I guess, I just thought I’d make my point of view known.

Just a reminder that tagging mobs and “kill stealing” don’t exist in this game.

You do have an advantage with your traits, skills and gear. And the entire point is that you have to be a bit careful everywhere – that’s what’s so brilliant about it. None of the content is wasted.

As for why did you level to 80, well:
1. Fun
2. Access to higher level areas
3. Access to higher level dungeons
4. The ability to wear level 80 exotics

Well I don’t feel its right that if I’m a level 52 necro and I have to kill stuff while farming for materials in lets say a level 30 zone because if I don’t they will kill me. I should just be able to ignore them and keep farming. Maybe I’m not use to all the changes in this game and it’s a fantastic game minus the down-scaling.

Adjust, adapt or leave. This is a core element of the game. It will not change.

Oh I won’t leave because of one little thing I don’t like lol. This is a forum, I just wanted to say my peace, I’ve done so and I’m done.

RobertB.8326:

Well I don’t feel its right that if I’m a level 52 necro and I have to kill stuff while farming for materials in lets say a level 30 zone because if I don’t they will kill me. I should just be able to ignore them and keep farming. Maybe I’m not use to all the changes in this game and it’s a fantastic game minus the down-scaling.

then you need to figure out what skill you need for that area. for thief i have alot invisible skills so in-case i get stuck in hard area with high level monster i just disapear

RobertB.8326:

Well I don’t feel its right that if I’m a level 52 necro and I have to kill stuff while farming for materials in lets say a level 30 zone because if I don’t they will kill me.

So basically, you want to get the same reward without taking the same risk. All that does is devalue lower tier crafting supplies that new folks harvest on their way up. Why shouldn’t folks new to the game be able to make some money on the stuff they find while they’re leveling?

If you want low tier materials and you don’t want to have to work for them, buy them off the TP.

I’ve said my peace/ point of view on this matter and I’m done. I’m not mad or upset it’s just that I had to say my peace and now that I have I don’t feel the need to talk about it anymore as I know the devs look at the forums and if they understand where I’m coming from and change it great and if not that’s also great because it’s their game not mine!

Jazneo.8213:

I like this system it make it so new stuff come out you dont feel your over power and make you help out people more

if you didnt had this system you wont get exp and loot for low level monster

Wow, 10 EXP for killing a level 3 mob while farming heart EXP (worth it for the achievement though I guess). 10 EXP may as well be nothing.

Agemnon.4608:

Wow, 10 EXP for killing a level 3 mob while farming heart EXP (worth it for the achievement though I guess). 10 EXP may as well be nothing.

You don’t get much XP for killing stuff at any level. You kill mobs because they are in your way, drop crafting materials, part of an event, or you need them to finish your dailies. You also get bonus XP for killing different types of mobs instead of killing the same ones over and over. There are quite a few incentives to keep moving instead of staying in one place and grinding.

Agemnon.4608:

Jazneo.8213:

I like this system it make it so new stuff come out you dont feel your over power and make you help out people more

if you didnt had this system you wont get exp and loot for low level monster

Wow, 10 EXP for killing a level 3 mob while farming heart EXP (worth it for the achievement though I guess). 10 EXP may as well be nothing.

You get get more exp from the world event i dont farm monster i do the world event that appear

Gear isn’t scaled the same way stats are

I think dynamic scaling is one the greatest features of this game, I vote for don’t mess with it.

The problem with every MMO is that you don’t even have to do squat and mobs are very eager and willing to kill you… despite the fact you didn’t even do anything to them (well you could attack first, which counts as “something” but you don’t have to is the point). “Hey, let’s go kill that guy who did absolutely nothing to us!” But that’s just how these games are. Another thing I hate is mobs having snares and slows. If you’re slowed that makes it much harder to get away. You’re basically guaranteed a death if there’s a pack of mobs you could normally outrun and one of them slows you down.

I like the idea of downscaling, but somehow it doesn’t feel right. When I’m doing a low level area on my main I felt weaker than my low level alt.

Pandemoniac.4739:

Agemnon.4608:

Wow, 10 EXP for killing a level 3 mob while farming heart EXP (worth it for the achievement though I guess). 10 EXP may as well be nothing.

You don’t get much XP for killing stuff at any level. You kill mobs because they are in your way, drop crafting materials, part of an event, or you need them to finish your dailies. You also get bonus XP for killing different types of mobs instead of killing the same ones over and over. There are quite a few incentives to keep moving instead of staying in one place and grinding.

I was getting 1k xp per mob last night in unexplored parts of frostgorge. 299 for the mob and 700+ explorable. Your statement is simply wrong.

And at 80, needing 200K xp for a skill point makes the lower level xp INSULTING for the amount of time it takes to kill a mob. Even being 80 and getting deleveled to (let’s just say 73 like I was this morning) and having to a) spend 15-20 seconds to kill each mob, in a pack of four or five, when that same four or five can definitely kill you if you aren’t careful, in order to grab a piece of metal or a vista or whatever, is a disincentive as written.

I love the deleveling. Don’t get me wrong. I love that I get SOMETHING for my time in lowbie zones and that I can’t just insta-nuke everything in my way.

But don’t for a moment pretend that the rewards are worth the psychological impact of never getting truly powerful in the game. I agree with a poster above. I shouldn’t be able to just randomly wipe the entire zone. But at 80, I should be powerful enough to literally go afk in the middle of an event without fear if I choose not to participate. Not that I would generally, but I want to feel like I can.

So how about we add a fun option instead of enforcing one that’s un-fun to some people? “Is it fun?”

Most of the time, yes. But I’d rather have some kind of invisible/stealth mode when I just don’t want to be bothered. At least in areas I’ve already discovered. I can’t kill a mob without dropping my “disguise” but I can run through without being molested every five seconds.

THAT would be fun and imo not game breaking at all. Or at minimum, if I’m more than 10 levels above the mobs (again in an area I’ve already explored), let me have a permanent speed buff and stun proofing that drops as soon as I initiate an attack and can’t be reset until I’m out of combat.

At least I have the OPTION of “resting” for a moment in these zones where my participation is so unrewarding on many levels.

And I’m not sure how you’re doing it, but I don’t one shot mobs, even in noobie zones. Sure it’s only 4-5 seconds to kill one, and I can AoE due to my skills and kill a virtually unlimited number in that same time if I can gather them together in one place, while my AoE skills are up, but it’s still tedious because at my level, spending 4 times that much time for an equal level kill nets 100x the xp reward or more.

It’s a simple matter of time spent. I don’t get enough out of the enforced fighting to desire to do it when I just want to travel or grab a node of copper because I happen to see one while I’m traveling.

So again, there’s no real incentive to JUST be in a lowbie zone. I’m going there to accomplish something else and having to fight as often as I do, for as long as I do isn’t balanced correctly yet.

bunneh.8746:

I like the idea of downscaling, but somehow it doesn’t feel right. When I’m doing a low level area on my main I felt weaker than my low level alt.

Funny you say that. I can’t put my finger on why but I feel the same way.

“the games to hard give me a advantage I’m level 80 boohoo”
stop that being 80 myself,in exotic and rare gear low level zones are still fun.Why? because the creatures of the game still put up a fight and still attack me with full fury sure its easier with my traits and gear but its what makes the game fun and better then other MMOs. I cant just spend 5 mins in a low zone like god and burn out all the events and exploring like I would in another MMO

TL:DR If you want to be a god go play a different game.

What I have found, is that the down ranking works too well in some cases. For example, in level appropriate places, I can handle say 5 mobs at once and grind non-stop. If I need to drop 5-10 levels to grind crafting mats, I find that pulling 2-3 mobs can get hairy and I need recover pauses (though recovery is fast outside of combat) when grinding.

Derpinator.2894:

Pandemoniac.4739:

Agemnon.4608:

Wow, 10 EXP for killing a level 3 mob while farming heart EXP (worth it for the achievement though I guess). 10 EXP may as well be nothing.

You don’t get much XP for killing stuff at any level.

I was getting 1k xp per mob last night in unexplored parts of frostgorge. 299 for the mob and 700+ explorable. Your statement is simply wrong.

You don’t get much XP for just standing around killing the same mobs over and over. You certainly don’t get a lot of XP for killing mobs in areas where you are down-scaled, nor should you, because they’re flipping easy. 300 XP at level 80 is a pittance. The biggest chunk of your XP came from the “explorable” part.

There are a lot of rewards in GW for simply exploring places. If you let folks run through those areas without having to be careful at all, you devalue all of the content. The map completion, the harvestables, the hidden spot achievements, the chests, all of it. Rewards should have some challenge involved, even if it is walking through a drake infested swamp. You don’t want to be bothered after you explored an area? Take a waypoint.

You should not feel powerful just because you made it to 80. You could have sat in town and crafted your way to 80. I feel powerful in lowbie zones because I can stomp everything that crosses my path, not because I can go AFK in the middle of a dangerous spot. You need to go AFK? Stash your character some place safe. There are plenty of places to hop up on terrain and be out of the way. I have never had a problem, even in zones where I’m not down-leveled, finding a place to hang out for a while without getting killed.

There’s a difference between being heroic and being god-like. Heroic is wading into a fight that would have given you pause a few levels ago and winning because of your skill. My ranger doesn’t kite anything any more and the only thing she’s afraid to fight alone are champions or veterans with minion close to her real level. God-like is running around too self absorbed to be bothered with the problems of mere mortals. If you want to feel god-like, go play a single player game where the mere mortals are all NPCs.

daemonlama.5413:

Adjust, adapt or leave. This is a core element of the game. It will not change.

I owe you an apology. I must have given you the impression that I was looking for your advice. I’m here to raise a concern because I don’t like the way a game mechanic plays, not to ask some random dude what he thinks I should do in light of my unhappiness.

Thanks anyway, Dr. Phil.

There’s a recurring opinion here that complaining about de-leveling means I’m some elitest wimp who wants the game handed to me at lvl 80. That’s simply not the case. In fact, I love that I can contribute to events with my friends without killing everything in one hit. I simply don’t think it makes sense that my survivability is also reduced AND that mobs still aggro me. If I’m level 80 (a very powerful elementalist), it makes no sense that three level 15 mobs can swarm and kill me just because im running across a zone to meet a friend. Either make it so that my survivability stays beefed up, make it so mobs dont aggro me, or as I originally proposed, make it so that I’m simply the top level for that particular zone. At least then I have the decision to fight or run. As it stands, I’m forced to stop and fight every lvl 20 I see unless my escape abilities are up. It just seems silly.

Down leveling is fine, you still benefit from better items which makes mobs way easier. I see no problem here.

Th only down leveling grievances that are viable are repair costs and travel costs vs the amount of money rewarded.

Anything else is part of the reason why you are downscaled.

Moonpuncher.7250:

daemonlama.5413:

Adjust, adapt or leave. This is a core element of the game. It will not change.

I owe you an apology. I must have given you the impression that I was looking for your advice. I’m here to raise a concern because I don’t like the way a game mechanic plays, not to ask some random dude what he thinks I should do in light of my unhappiness.

Thanks anyway, Dr. Phil.

First I wasn’t being hostile, regardless of how you chose to read it.

Secondly, you are on a public forum, so you in fact did open yourself/opinion/concern up to be responded to, even those responses that you may not agree with or appreciate.

eww OP, take your terrible suggestions elsewhere.

I am quite happy with the fact that everything in the game poses ‘some’ type of challenge.

Pandemoniac.4739:

Derpinator.2894:

Pandemoniac.4739:

Agemnon.4608:

Wow, 10 EXP for killing a level 3 mob while farming heart EXP (worth it for the achievement though I guess). 10 EXP may as well be nothing.

You don’t get much XP for killing stuff at any level.

I was getting 1k xp per mob last night in unexplored parts of frostgorge. 299 for the mob and 700+ explorable. Your statement is simply wrong.

You don’t get much XP for just standing around killing the same mobs over and over. You certainly don’t get a lot of XP for killing mobs in areas where you are down-scaled, nor should you, because they’re flipping easy. 300 XP at level 80 is a pittance. The biggest chunk of your XP came from the “explorable” part.

There are a lot of rewards in GW for simply exploring places. If you let folks run through those areas without having to be careful at all, you devalue all of the content. The map completion, the harvestables, the hidden spot achievements, the chests, all of it. Rewards should have some challenge involved, even if it is walking through a drake infested swamp. You don’t want to be bothered after you explored an area? Take a waypoint.

You should not feel powerful just because you made it to 80. You could have sat in town and crafted your way to 80. I feel powerful in lowbie zones because I can stomp everything that crosses my path, not because I can go AFK in the middle of a dangerous spot. You need to go AFK? Stash your character some place safe. There are plenty of places to hop up on terrain and be out of the way. I have never had a problem, even in zones where I’m not down-leveled, finding a place to hang out for a while without getting killed.

There’s a difference between being heroic and being god-like. Heroic is wading into a fight that would have given you pause a few levels ago and winning because of your skill. My ranger doesn’t kite anything any more and the only thing she’s afraid to fight alone are champions or veterans with minion close to her real level. God-like is running around too self absorbed to be bothered with the problems of mere mortals. If you want to feel god-like, go play a single player game where the mere mortals are all NPCs.

No, you don’t get good xp for “farming” in one spot, and that wasn’t my point.

My point was that in frostgorge, I kill a level 80 mob. It takes roughly 20-30 seconds (if there’s just one) and for that time I get a MINIMUM of 299xp.

Call it 30 seconds and 300 xp to make the math easy. 10xp per second of fight.

I get delevled. Fight takes 10 seconds now in a noobie zone. Hell, let’s make it 5 seconds. Reward 10 xp.

xp per second: 2

1/5 of the reward per second spent. It’s not that the lvl 80 mob is a “harder” fight. It’s just longer. None of the one on one fights in this game are hard. They just keep getting longer and longer and you keep getting more and more xp for them.

what makes higher level zones more dangerous? Higher spawn rates, higher damage per second from the mobs relative to your health pool and longer fights. You have a much higher chance of getting an add that (proportionally to the lower levels) hits harder because of spawn rates and mob grouping behavior.

That’s it.

So it’s not that I want to feel “like a god” and pwn things and run around willy nilly slaughtering. I just want either my power to truly grow or for the freaking mobs to at least HAVE SOME RESPECT FOR THEIR ELDERS!!!!

Just… leave me alone Mr. Level Eight Grawl Shaman. I just want to chop down that tree over there. If I attack you, the gods should strike me with weakness for having no compassion on the lesser beings and you should have a chance to thrash me silly for my arrogance.

But if I just want to walk thataway for a while and see the lovely mountains, give me a break, m’kay?

I agree…its terrible to want to explore and take in some of the sights or swim around only to be killed by a pig or fish that is in reality 40 levels lower than you. Sometimes I just want to go for a swim without any fight and find it difficult in lower level areas because of the gigantic aggro range.

You have all traits and all the high level weapon as advantage. This is enough to solo huge group of enemies.
I really feel the down-scaling ok. And I like to travel with low lvl friends.

You do get advantages for being higher lvl because gear doesn’t scale in proportion to lvl when down-scaling, as well as I HATE IT in other games when I go around 1 shotting everything in lowbie areas, I’m not an RPer by any means but it kills all immersion when you go in to an area and 3 hit a giant 3 headed dragon because you are a higher lvl than it.

This also creates the ability to lvl with lower lvl friends without having an insane experience hurt to them. Personally I don’t want to create new characters every time a friend starts playing. I like how the scaling works and don’t think they should change it at all.

Cesar.9365:

I agree…its terrible to want to explore and take in some of the sights or swim around only to be killed by a pig or fish that is in reality 40 levels lower than you. Sometimes I just want to go for a swim without any fight and find it difficult in lower level areas because of the gigantic aggro range.

This is exactly my issue. Down-leveling is great for playing with friends, bit it’s just stupid and makes zero sense when you’re trying to AVOID confrontation. Make it so these mobs don’t aggro you. If you attack them, expect a decent fight on your hands. But a level 20 wolf killing me because I didn’t feel like fighting my way through a lowbie zone is really, really stupid.

Downscaling makes content significantly easier than it is at-level. Don’t believe me? Make an alt and go to Caledon Forest. Now take your level 80 to Caledon Forest. Tell me which is easier.

Also, if you don’t want to fight mobs, it’s simple: run by them.

PPson.7042:

You do get advantages for being higher lvl because gear doesn’t scale in proportion to lvl when down-scaling, as well as I HATE IT in other games when I go around 1 shotting everything in lowbie areas, I’m not an RPer by any means but it kills all immersion when you go in to an area and 3 hit a giant 3 headed dragon because you are a higher lvl than it.

This also creates the ability to lvl with lower lvl friends without having an insane experience hurt to them. Personally I don’t want to create new characters every time a friend starts playing. I like how the scaling works and don’t think they should change it at all.

I see exactly what you mean, because it kills MY immersion when a level 3 goat who got attacked from my attunement proc is capable of killing me while I run to the next zone as lvl 60.

Bottom line: You get more powerful as you level up. ArenaNet suspends reality to let us contribute to events and quests with our friends. But there’s an obnoxious downside in that this ARTIFICIAL downleveling results in our death when trying to explore or travel for fun.

I’m level 80, ergo I should not die to a level 5 wolf. Go on, make that sentence sound stupid. I dare you.

Moonpuncher.7250:

I’ll just say it: Cut us a little slack on the down-leveling. I understand you want high level players to group with their lower level friends, and that you want us all to be able to enjoy content as it was designed, but there are a couple of reasons I really don’t like the way it’s currently set up.

1. If I’m level 50 and trying to do an event designed for level 32, give me SOME type of advantage because of my level. Right now, ArenaNet ratchets me down to where all fights are challenging no matter where I am. Sounds great on the face of it, but why did I level if you were just going to kitten me to the point that I’m just as powerful as the lowbie next to me? Again: i’m not looking for easymode, but hell at least let me downscale to lvl 35 or so. Give me SOMETHING for my extra work and levels.

2. Running through a low level zone is hell. This is my primary complaint. If I’m level 80 and I want to cruise through a lvl 30 zone to start exploring, I have to stop and kill monsters because they will actually kill me if I"m not careful. A level 80 has to be “careful” around lvl 30 mobs. The solution to this could be simple: if I’m far too high level for the zone, make it so mobs don’t aggro me. I should not have to die 3 times running through Kessex Hills at level 60 just so I can get to Gendarran Fields.

Lastly, I propose always down-leveling to the max level for a zone. That’s right, if I’m in Gendarran Fields, make me level 35. That way I can still participate in events, but I’m not always double checking my screen to figure out what level you kittened me at. if I’m in a 50-60 zone and I’m level 80, make me level 60 so I can feel I have SOME advantage. Otherwise what’s the point of being powerful if everything is just as difficult?

(This applies to personal story as well. Give me a few levels advantage if I put in the hard work)

I think it is so that you see mobs as dangerous no matter where you are, as you would if levels didn’t exist at all. Level requirements are just a gating mechanism, but you should really never feel safe in a game world.

I just read that this game is too hard.

Mind = blown.

Moonpuncher.7250:

because it kills MY immersion

Really? Immersion? You’re pulling the immersion card?

You know what’s immersion-breaking? Walking up to a bandit, coughing on him, and watching him fall over dead. It makes far more sense (realistically) for content to be relevant at all levels than it does for you to be godlike in power because… numbers.